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CNN Sunday Morning
Episcopal Church to Vote on Openly Gay Bishop; Gay Marriage Debate Continues
Aired August 03, 2003 - 10:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SEAN CALLEBS, CNN ANCHOR: The Episcopal Church in the U.S. is moving closer to an historic decision that could have a major impact on its future. A second key vote on whether an openly gay bishop should be allowed to serve is coming up in a short time.
Susan -- CNN's Susan Candiotti is keeping track of developments in Minneapolis, where the church is holding its national convention, as she now joins us with all the latest information -- Susan.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Sean.
We're standing outside the Episcopal cathedral in Minneapolis, and by the end of this day Reverend Gene Robinson will know whether he will cross another hurdle in his attempt to become the first openly gay bishop in the Episcopal Church.
This afternoon delegates in the first of two houses will be voting on the issue. Approval of both is required two ratify Robinson's election by his own diocese in New Hampshire.
Now, opponents say in part his elevation to bishop would cause a split in the church, and might have a negative impact worldwide that the Episcopal Church might be trying to force its views on other members of the Anglican Communion.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sometimes you lose members, but that's -- our calling is not to be successful or bigger than anybody else. It's to be faithful to the words of Jesus.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CANDIOTTI: Now, those who favor Robinson say that fear of that should not intimidate people from taking what they call a very important step.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REV. GENE ROBINSON, OPENLY GAY BISHOP: I really don't. God has been so good to me in issuing this call to me, which I feel so strongly, and I feel that he's very near me at this time. That's why I feel sort of calm about the whole thing. So no, I really don't. I have some concerns about those who might leave over this but I believe God is calling me to do this thing and I intend to follow it through. (END VIDEO CLIP)
CANDIOTTI: Now, that was Reverend Gene Robinson, saying that he has no second thoughts about moving through this controversial area.
A lot of people finally, Sean, are comparing this to the great debate back in the 1970s over whether women should be ordained as Episcopal priests. Those who favor Robinson say we got through that and we can also overcome this.
Sean, back to you.
CALLEBS: OK, Susan Candiotti. We will stay tuned for that vote later on today.
As the Episcopal Church deals with the controversy over gays in the pulpit, the country as a whole is also confronting a number of gay related issues, including marriage. That issue in particular is stirring a lot of debate in the political arena.
Here's CNN senior analyst Jeff Greenfield.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN ANALYST: It's front-page news. A gay couple from Queens, New York, was married last Sunday in Toronto.
It's front-page news, the president is seeking ways to ensure such marriages do not happen and are not sanctioned in the United States.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I believe in the sanctity of marriage. I believe a marriage is between a man and a woman, and I think we ought to codify that one way or the other. And we've got lawyers looking at the best way to do that.
GREENFIELD: And Thursday the Vatican made more news by launching a global campaign against gay marriages.
It's front-page news, shows with gay themes are gaining more and more of a foothold on television. From the prime time hit "Will & Grace"...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Am I interrupting anything? Are you fellows having sex?
GREENFIELD: To the more explicit "Queer as Folk" on pay cable.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You wanted me and I wanted you.
GREENFIELD: To the light-hearted "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" on basic cable.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's take a look at your couture.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My what? UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just can't wait any longer.
GREENFIELD: All images light years away from the stereotypes of a few decades.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: White, white, white is the color of our carpet.
GREENFIELD: And this is front-page news.
After years of steadily increasing acceptance of or at least tolerance for homosexuality, the latest CNN/"USA Today" poll shows a sharp spike in disapproval.
Last May, 60 percent said homosexual relations between consenting adults should be legal. Now only 48 percent say so. Fifty-four percent said it was an acceptable lifestyle. Now it's 46 percent.
The country was split in May of the idea of civil unions for gays. Now a clear majority says no.
(on camera) So what's changed? Well, almost assuredly it was last June's Supreme Court decision that struck down state sodomy laws, whether aimed at gay or straight couples. Friend and foe alike of that decision agreed it made the possibility of gay marriage a lot more real.
(voice-over) In fact, it was Justice Antonin Scalia, in a blistering dissent from the court's sodomy decision, who raised doubts about whether states could now forbid gay marriages.
And that, says scholar Stanley Kurtz, tests the limits of public tolerance.
STANLEY KURTZ, HOOVER INSTITUTION: I think the public in general hasn't thought through the gay marriage issue carefully. It's more of a feeling, a queasy feeling in the gut, that the institution of marriage has already been under a lot of change, it's weakened. If we do something big to change marriage, people wonder what might happen.
GREENFIELD: It's a concern that Barney Frank, the first openly gay congressman, recognizes but finds utterly puzzling.
REP. BARNEY FRANK (D), MASSACHUSETTS: You're a heterosexual. You want to get married. You are married. How can it possibly have any impact on you what two other people do who aren't in any way affecting your life?
GREENFIELD: Maggie Gallagher, a conservative writer whose MarriageDebate.com Web site focuses on this issue says the argument highlights the country's fundamental ambiguity.
MAGGIE GALLAGHER, MARRIAGEDEBATE.COM: Yes, we want to live in a country where people can disagree about sexual affects and sexual practices, but a big chunk of Americans do not believe that homosexuality is morally acceptable. GREENFIELD (on camera): The major Democratic candidates for president all favor civil unions for gays though they oppose gay marriage. The president may find himself backing a constitutional amendment to forbid the idea.
So this debate is likely to spill over into next year's presidential election.
Jeff Greenfield, CNN, New York.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Marriage Debate Continues>
Aired August 3, 2003 - 10:14 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SEAN CALLEBS, CNN ANCHOR: The Episcopal Church in the U.S. is moving closer to an historic decision that could have a major impact on its future. A second key vote on whether an openly gay bishop should be allowed to serve is coming up in a short time.
Susan -- CNN's Susan Candiotti is keeping track of developments in Minneapolis, where the church is holding its national convention, as she now joins us with all the latest information -- Susan.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Sean.
We're standing outside the Episcopal cathedral in Minneapolis, and by the end of this day Reverend Gene Robinson will know whether he will cross another hurdle in his attempt to become the first openly gay bishop in the Episcopal Church.
This afternoon delegates in the first of two houses will be voting on the issue. Approval of both is required two ratify Robinson's election by his own diocese in New Hampshire.
Now, opponents say in part his elevation to bishop would cause a split in the church, and might have a negative impact worldwide that the Episcopal Church might be trying to force its views on other members of the Anglican Communion.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sometimes you lose members, but that's -- our calling is not to be successful or bigger than anybody else. It's to be faithful to the words of Jesus.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CANDIOTTI: Now, those who favor Robinson say that fear of that should not intimidate people from taking what they call a very important step.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REV. GENE ROBINSON, OPENLY GAY BISHOP: I really don't. God has been so good to me in issuing this call to me, which I feel so strongly, and I feel that he's very near me at this time. That's why I feel sort of calm about the whole thing. So no, I really don't. I have some concerns about those who might leave over this but I believe God is calling me to do this thing and I intend to follow it through. (END VIDEO CLIP)
CANDIOTTI: Now, that was Reverend Gene Robinson, saying that he has no second thoughts about moving through this controversial area.
A lot of people finally, Sean, are comparing this to the great debate back in the 1970s over whether women should be ordained as Episcopal priests. Those who favor Robinson say we got through that and we can also overcome this.
Sean, back to you.
CALLEBS: OK, Susan Candiotti. We will stay tuned for that vote later on today.
As the Episcopal Church deals with the controversy over gays in the pulpit, the country as a whole is also confronting a number of gay related issues, including marriage. That issue in particular is stirring a lot of debate in the political arena.
Here's CNN senior analyst Jeff Greenfield.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN ANALYST: It's front-page news. A gay couple from Queens, New York, was married last Sunday in Toronto.
It's front-page news, the president is seeking ways to ensure such marriages do not happen and are not sanctioned in the United States.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I believe in the sanctity of marriage. I believe a marriage is between a man and a woman, and I think we ought to codify that one way or the other. And we've got lawyers looking at the best way to do that.
GREENFIELD: And Thursday the Vatican made more news by launching a global campaign against gay marriages.
It's front-page news, shows with gay themes are gaining more and more of a foothold on television. From the prime time hit "Will & Grace"...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Am I interrupting anything? Are you fellows having sex?
GREENFIELD: To the more explicit "Queer as Folk" on pay cable.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You wanted me and I wanted you.
GREENFIELD: To the light-hearted "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" on basic cable.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's take a look at your couture.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My what? UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just can't wait any longer.
GREENFIELD: All images light years away from the stereotypes of a few decades.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: White, white, white is the color of our carpet.
GREENFIELD: And this is front-page news.
After years of steadily increasing acceptance of or at least tolerance for homosexuality, the latest CNN/"USA Today" poll shows a sharp spike in disapproval.
Last May, 60 percent said homosexual relations between consenting adults should be legal. Now only 48 percent say so. Fifty-four percent said it was an acceptable lifestyle. Now it's 46 percent.
The country was split in May of the idea of civil unions for gays. Now a clear majority says no.
(on camera) So what's changed? Well, almost assuredly it was last June's Supreme Court decision that struck down state sodomy laws, whether aimed at gay or straight couples. Friend and foe alike of that decision agreed it made the possibility of gay marriage a lot more real.
(voice-over) In fact, it was Justice Antonin Scalia, in a blistering dissent from the court's sodomy decision, who raised doubts about whether states could now forbid gay marriages.
And that, says scholar Stanley Kurtz, tests the limits of public tolerance.
STANLEY KURTZ, HOOVER INSTITUTION: I think the public in general hasn't thought through the gay marriage issue carefully. It's more of a feeling, a queasy feeling in the gut, that the institution of marriage has already been under a lot of change, it's weakened. If we do something big to change marriage, people wonder what might happen.
GREENFIELD: It's a concern that Barney Frank, the first openly gay congressman, recognizes but finds utterly puzzling.
REP. BARNEY FRANK (D), MASSACHUSETTS: You're a heterosexual. You want to get married. You are married. How can it possibly have any impact on you what two other people do who aren't in any way affecting your life?
GREENFIELD: Maggie Gallagher, a conservative writer whose MarriageDebate.com Web site focuses on this issue says the argument highlights the country's fundamental ambiguity.
MAGGIE GALLAGHER, MARRIAGEDEBATE.COM: Yes, we want to live in a country where people can disagree about sexual affects and sexual practices, but a big chunk of Americans do not believe that homosexuality is morally acceptable. GREENFIELD (on camera): The major Democratic candidates for president all favor civil unions for gays though they oppose gay marriage. The president may find himself backing a constitutional amendment to forbid the idea.
So this debate is likely to spill over into next year's presidential election.
Jeff Greenfield, CNN, New York.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Marriage Debate Continues>
