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CNN Sunday Morning

Interview With Perry Bacon

Aired September 07, 2003 - 09:13   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHEIKH YASSIN, HAMAS FOUNDER (through translator): These will prove that the assassination policy will not finish Hamas. Hamas leaders wish to be martyrs, and they're not scared of death. Jihad will continue and the resistance will continue until we have victory, or we will be martyrs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Those are comments from the founder of the militant group Hamas after he escaped an Israeli missile attack with only minor injuries. Several hours before yesterday's attack, Palestinian Prime Minister Mahmoud Abbas resigned, landing yet another blow to the road map to peace process.

"TIME" magazine reporter Perry Bacon, who writes about Abbas in this week's issue, joins us now from Washington to talk more about this. Thanks for being with us, Perry. We appreciate your time this morning.

What's your reaction to the news of the resignation? Did this come as a surprise?

PERRY BACON, "TIME" MAGAZINE: This did come as a bit of a surprise to the U.S. Colin Powell on Friday gave a speech actually talking about how Abbas was doing well and really being helpful to the peace process. So it is a surprise and is a setback as well for the administration.

President Bush has spent a lot of time promoting Mr. Abbas as the leader of the Palestinians and saying Arafat is no longer the leader of the Palestinians. So for Mr. Abbas to resign yesterday is quite a big blow to the administration's peace process and the road map to peace.

COLLINS: What about a blow to the Palestinian people? Do they see it that way at all?

BACON: It's unclear right now if they see it that way or not. One of the problems Abbas had was, to the Palestinian people he was seen as sort of the American who was sort of imposed on them. They for years supported Yasser Arafat for years.

And now -- and President Bush said Yasser Arafat cannot be the leader there, so Mr. Abbas was sort of imposed upon them. And therefore, he had very limited public support to start with there.

COLLINS: It sounds to us also like he had limited support obviously from Yasser Arafat, saying in his resignation that it was a very constraining position to be in. Let's go ahead and listen, if we could, to a little bit of sound from the White House spokesman -- I'm sorry, not the sound. We're going to look at some comments made by Scott McClellan, the White House spokesman, talking about this office of prime minister.

He says, "The creation of the office of prime minister was a key turning point for the Palestinian Authority in the development of new institutions to serve all the people, not just a corrupt few tainted by terror. The prime minister must be supported by a cabinet committed to fighting terror, political reform, and rooting out corruption."

He speaks about the prime minister. Who could that be now? With all of the research that you've done and the stories that you've covered, Perry, who is that person that could work essentially with Yasser Arafat?

BACON: We're not certain who that person is right now. There's a few names that are out there as far as people that are been in the Palestinian leadership before. But to some extent, this is really something that Yasser Arafat has to do, because whoever that person is has to have his support because he's the Palestinian leader there. And Mr. Abbas was actually quite close to Arafat before he took this position. But immediately the two had a lot of tension.

And so whoever this person becomes -- whoever is the next person really needs to have Yasser Arafat's support. And that's what the U.S. is trying to do, is say Mr. Arafat needs to give whoever the new prime minister is more authority than Mr. Abbas had.

COLLINS: Can you tell us anymore about the names of these people and their backgrounds, the names that are being thrown around?

BACON: There's a couple people that are in the Palestinian Parliament now that have been thrown around. Also, a few folks that -- one of the foreign ministers that Mr. Abbas worked with is someone who is also being discussed. But, at this point, Arafat should name a person within two weeks. At this point, it's not really clear that anyone -- they're heading toward one specific person at this point.

COLLINS: If this person is not found and if this person cannot work with Arafat, what happens next? I mean, where is the road map for peace now?

BACON: The road map right now has been in a lot of trouble and will continue to be. The U.S. has put a lot of faith in Abbas, and to some extent, that now -- we're back at square one, to some extent, because the U.S. didn't start this process until the Palestinians had a new prime minister. Now, basically the last four months with the new prime minister have sort of been taken away.

So we're back to square one to some extent. And it appears right now if sort of the cease-fire that these two sides had had -- also the Israelis attacked yesterday a place in Gaza where one of the leaders of Hamas was supposed to be in it. It appears that may cause some more escalation there as well as violence. So this is a problem for the U.S. in that regard as well.

COLLINS: "TIME" magazine reporter Perry Bacon coming to us from Washington this morning. Perry, thanks so much.

BACON: Thanks a lot.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired September 7, 2003 - 09:13   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHEIKH YASSIN, HAMAS FOUNDER (through translator): These will prove that the assassination policy will not finish Hamas. Hamas leaders wish to be martyrs, and they're not scared of death. Jihad will continue and the resistance will continue until we have victory, or we will be martyrs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Those are comments from the founder of the militant group Hamas after he escaped an Israeli missile attack with only minor injuries. Several hours before yesterday's attack, Palestinian Prime Minister Mahmoud Abbas resigned, landing yet another blow to the road map to peace process.

"TIME" magazine reporter Perry Bacon, who writes about Abbas in this week's issue, joins us now from Washington to talk more about this. Thanks for being with us, Perry. We appreciate your time this morning.

What's your reaction to the news of the resignation? Did this come as a surprise?

PERRY BACON, "TIME" MAGAZINE: This did come as a bit of a surprise to the U.S. Colin Powell on Friday gave a speech actually talking about how Abbas was doing well and really being helpful to the peace process. So it is a surprise and is a setback as well for the administration.

President Bush has spent a lot of time promoting Mr. Abbas as the leader of the Palestinians and saying Arafat is no longer the leader of the Palestinians. So for Mr. Abbas to resign yesterday is quite a big blow to the administration's peace process and the road map to peace.

COLLINS: What about a blow to the Palestinian people? Do they see it that way at all?

BACON: It's unclear right now if they see it that way or not. One of the problems Abbas had was, to the Palestinian people he was seen as sort of the American who was sort of imposed on them. They for years supported Yasser Arafat for years.

And now -- and President Bush said Yasser Arafat cannot be the leader there, so Mr. Abbas was sort of imposed upon them. And therefore, he had very limited public support to start with there.

COLLINS: It sounds to us also like he had limited support obviously from Yasser Arafat, saying in his resignation that it was a very constraining position to be in. Let's go ahead and listen, if we could, to a little bit of sound from the White House spokesman -- I'm sorry, not the sound. We're going to look at some comments made by Scott McClellan, the White House spokesman, talking about this office of prime minister.

He says, "The creation of the office of prime minister was a key turning point for the Palestinian Authority in the development of new institutions to serve all the people, not just a corrupt few tainted by terror. The prime minister must be supported by a cabinet committed to fighting terror, political reform, and rooting out corruption."

He speaks about the prime minister. Who could that be now? With all of the research that you've done and the stories that you've covered, Perry, who is that person that could work essentially with Yasser Arafat?

BACON: We're not certain who that person is right now. There's a few names that are out there as far as people that are been in the Palestinian leadership before. But to some extent, this is really something that Yasser Arafat has to do, because whoever that person is has to have his support because he's the Palestinian leader there. And Mr. Abbas was actually quite close to Arafat before he took this position. But immediately the two had a lot of tension.

And so whoever this person becomes -- whoever is the next person really needs to have Yasser Arafat's support. And that's what the U.S. is trying to do, is say Mr. Arafat needs to give whoever the new prime minister is more authority than Mr. Abbas had.

COLLINS: Can you tell us anymore about the names of these people and their backgrounds, the names that are being thrown around?

BACON: There's a couple people that are in the Palestinian Parliament now that have been thrown around. Also, a few folks that -- one of the foreign ministers that Mr. Abbas worked with is someone who is also being discussed. But, at this point, Arafat should name a person within two weeks. At this point, it's not really clear that anyone -- they're heading toward one specific person at this point.

COLLINS: If this person is not found and if this person cannot work with Arafat, what happens next? I mean, where is the road map for peace now?

BACON: The road map right now has been in a lot of trouble and will continue to be. The U.S. has put a lot of faith in Abbas, and to some extent, that now -- we're back at square one, to some extent, because the U.S. didn't start this process until the Palestinians had a new prime minister. Now, basically the last four months with the new prime minister have sort of been taken away.

So we're back to square one to some extent. And it appears right now if sort of the cease-fire that these two sides had had -- also the Israelis attacked yesterday a place in Gaza where one of the leaders of Hamas was supposed to be in it. It appears that may cause some more escalation there as well as violence. So this is a problem for the U.S. in that regard as well.

COLLINS: "TIME" magazine reporter Perry Bacon coming to us from Washington this morning. Perry, thanks so much.

BACON: Thanks a lot.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com