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CNN Sunday Morning
Florida Court Prepares to Begin Couey Case; Sister Helen Discusses 'Death of Innocents'
Aired March 20, 2005 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TONY HARRIS, ANCHOR, CNN SUNDAY MORNING: Hot, hot, hot this morning. The next hour of CNN SUNDAY MORNING begins right now.
And good morning from the CNN Center. This is CNN SUNDAY MORNING. It is March 20th, 8 a.m. at CNN headquarters in Atlanta, 5 a.m. in the West, and good morning. Once again, everyone, I'm Tony Harris.
RANDI KAYE, ANCHOR CNN SUNDAY MORNING: And I'm Randi Kaye. Thanks so much for being with us.
It is going to be a busy day in Washington. Lawmakers are scrambling to pass legislation that would have a federal court review the Terri Schiavo case. Even President Bush is cutting short a trip to his Texas ranch so he can sign the bill when it's passed.
We'll talk to Terri Schiavo's husband and her brother ahead in the next hour of CNN SUNDAY MORNING.
In less than an hour, John Couey is expected to make his first court appearance before a Florida judge. The convicted sex offender is suspected of the kidnapping and killing of 9-year-old Jessica Lunsford.
He was transferred overnight from Georgia to Citrus County, Florida, where the girl's body was discovered early Saturday morning.
At least one person is dead after a powerful earthquake shook southwest Japan. Nearly 400 more are injured. Hundreds more evacuated their homes when the quake hit. Tsunami warnings followed the magnitude 7 quake, but were soon canceled.
For the first time in more than 2 1/2 decades Pope John Paul II did not lead Palm Sunday celebrations at the Vatican. Tens of thousands of faithful filled St. Peter's Square for the annual mass leading up to next week's Easter holiday.
The pope's failing health limited his role to a brief wave from a window.
HARRIS: And much more to come this hour on CNN SUNDAY MORNING.
President Bush plans to head back to the Oval Office as the life and death battle over Terri Schiavo gets closer to his desk. Also back in Florida, and in the next hour, the suspect in the killing of Jessica Lunsford makes his first court appearance since his arrest.
And in our Faces of Faith we'll introduce you to a nun who has a real habit of igniting public debates.
KAYE: Our top story this morning, Terri Schiavo is in her third day without food or water at a Florida hospice. But far from her bed, a new effort to keep her alive is in full swing, and President Bush is keeping close tabs.
We'll take you to Crawford, Texas, near the president's ranch. Our White House correspondent, Dana Bash, is there.
Then we'll take you to Pinellas Park, Florida, where national correspondent Bob Franken is outside Schiavo's hospice.
First, to Dana Bash.
DANA BASH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Randi. Well, about three hours from now President Bush is going to board Air Force One, leave Texas and head back to the White House, where he's essentially going to wait in order to sign what he hopes will lead to the reinstating of Terri Schiavo's feeding tube.
Now the president -- usually, when there is legislation passed in Congress and he is away, they send it to him wherever he is. But the White House says that this is a situation where even a few hours can make a difference. And this is a dramatic move designed to show how important this case and this issue is to President Bush.
As Scott McClellan, the president's spokesman said, "This is about defending life, from President Bush's perspective."
Now what the president hopes he will sign, either late, late tonight or early tomorrow morning, is a bipartisan compromise that Congress is gong to be debating today in a very rare session, Palm Sunday session as they are calling it.
What the bill would do would be to allow Terri Schiavo's parents to get a hearing in federal court.
Now there is no guarantee, but the hope by proponents of this is that a federal judge will be more likely to at least temporarily order her feeding tube back in, as the case is considered for the first time in federal court.
Now the Democrats, many say this is overreaching. Republicans know for them this has become a rallying cry and it is also, Randi, personal for President Bush, because his brother, the Florida governor, has been fighting this case for sometime.
KAYE: And, Dana, this compromise is very specific to Terry Schiavo. Why is that so important? BASH: That is really the linchpin here. You know late last week the House of Representatives passed a broader piece of legislation that could apply to pretty much anybody in Terry Schiavo's case. The Senate though, many Democrats, some Republicans, have said that that is not what they want to do. They do not want to set precedent here. So they have something very specific to Terry Schiavo's case.
Well, you remember that there were some dramatic moves, that House Republicans sent a subpoena. They tried to get this stopped. They hit a brick wall in the state court.
So they essentially came back and agreed to compromise with Democrats to keep this very specific to the Terry Schiavo case, and that is exactly what this is. And the hope is that this will not set precedent, at least from the point of view of Democrats. Republicans hope that this will be much broader.
KAYE: All right. Thank you Dana Bash in Crawford, Texas.
HARRIS: Now let's go straight to Pinellas Park, Florida. Bob Franken is outside Terry Schiavo's hospice.
And, Bob, what's the story from where you are?
BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the interesting thing to me is the contrast. Here you have an issue that is generating such intense passion, and here you have the involvement of many people including many activists in the right-to-life movement, who are usually very vocal and sometimes even turn to, what some describe as violence in their tactics.
But here, on purpose, it's a very, very subdued setting. Of course this is a hospice. Inside it is by design peaceful. But outside, the strategy has been to present very quiet protest. You can see behind me at the moment not many people here.
But on this Palm Sunday, I'm sure that there will be any number of people who have strong beliefs about this, particularly supporters of the desire to reinstall the feeding tube. They will be out here, and the strategy right now is to present what they describe as quiet witness, so the politicians feel the pressure in Washington that that brings from here.
We would expect to see the parents of Terri Schiavo go in once again. Again, whatever the personal emotions, this also presents a stark image for Congress to consider, as it's debating the legislation -- Tony?
HARRIS: And, Bob, why do you think this approach to the protest? Is it because these groups don't want to be perceived as being wacky, kooky on such a serious matter?
FRANKEN: Well, I'm sure that they would probably come up with more elegant language. I think what they've decided is, tactically, the quiet protest actually has the most volume.
HARRIS: OK. All right.
Bob Franken we appreciate it. Bob, thank you.
KAYE: Later on CNN SUNDAY MORNING, they want what's best for Terri Schiavo, but they are bitterly divided over just what that means. We talk live to Terry Schiavo's brother and her husband. That's live in the 9 a.m. eastern hour of CNN SUNDAY MORNING.
HARRIS: And this brings us to our e-mail question of the day. Does Congress belong in the Terry Schiavo debate? Send your comments to wam@cnn.com.
KAYE: Fighting for death row inmates is something Sister Helen Prejean, the inspiration for the film "Dead Man Walking," knows well. She has a new book that tackles a new angle of the death penalty. Sister Helen Prejean joins us live in this Sunday's Faces of Faith.
HARRIS: And good morning, Daytona Beach. Your forecast straight ahead, as well as a look of the weather for the rest of the nation.
This is CNN SUNDAY MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAYE: There is a new development right now in the Jessica Lunsford killing. John Evander Couey, the convicted sex offender who allegedly confessed to the crime, is due for his first court appearance since returning to Florida overnight.
CNN's Sara Dorsey joins us from Iverness, Florida, with the details.
Sara, good morning.
SARA DORSEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Randi.
We are at the Citrus County detention center where we are awaiting a decision by the judge, who will be seeing Mr. Couey on his first appearance, to determine whether or not cameras will be allowed in the courtroom today.
Now, we are told Mr. Couey has not been charged with anything regarding the Jessica Lunsford case at this point. He's being held on other charges. That is because, according to a sheriff's official, the minute they charge him with anything in this case, the clocks are ticking, really because he has a right to a speedy trial.
So what sheriff's officers are doing, we are told, is they are continuing to build their case against Mr. Couey. They can hold him on these other charges, those charges that they were allowed to hold him on in Georgia and bring him back.
Now, Mr. Couey did arrive back here in Florida at about 2 o'clock this morning. And again, we will be here throughout the morning following this. If cameras are not allowed in, we will be in the courtroom ourselves, to bring you the latest news at it becomes available -- Randi?
KAYE: All right. And we will have the very latest on John Couey's court appearance coming up for you live in the very next hour.
We'll take a break here.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(WEATHER REPORT)
KAYE: Checking our top stories. First, the battle over Terri Schiavo. In a special Sunday session, lawmakers are expected to vote on a compromise bill today that would shift Schiavo's case to federal court. That could lead to her feeding tube being reinserted.
The man suspected of kidnapping and killing 9-year-old Jessica Lunsford is due to have his first court appearance in Florida in just about 45 minutes.
John Couey was booked in Citrus County jail over night after being transferred from Georgia.
And Pope John Paul II greeted tens of thousands of pilgrims from his apartment window this morning, but throat surgery prevented him from presiding over Palm Sunday mass for the first time in his 26 year papacy.
HARRIS: On this Palm Sunday we'll be joined by Sister Helen Prejean, best known for the book that inspired the film "Dead Man Walking." She talks about her new book, and looks at two death row cases and why, she says, they should not have been executed.
KAYE: And later "HOUSE CALL" looks at why men and women respond differently to certain situations. Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta explains gender brain distinction at the bottom of the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Well, lately the news has been filled with several high- profile crime stories in which some people say the suspects should be put to death. Sister Helen Prejean, best known for her 1993 book "Dead Man Walking," has written a new book that further challenges society's notion of capital punishment, "The Death of Innocents" focuses on the execution of two people Sister Helen now believes were not guilty.
She's with us this morning from New Orleans for today's Faces of Faith.
And, Sister Helen, I have been looking forward to talking to you. Thanks for being with us.
SISTER HELEN PREJEAN, AUTHOR, "THE DEATH OF INNOCENTS": Thank you, Tony. I'm glad to be here.
HARRIS: Well, in this book, you're asking whether the state should impose the death penalty. That was the first book. And in this book you're asking if we are killing innocent people. And part of what you claim is that the system is very flawed. Outline, if you would, some of the reasons why you believe the system is flawed and can lead to innocent people being put to death.
PREJEAN: Well, the stories of Doby Gillis Williams from Louisiana, African-American man with an IQ of 65 killed by Louisiana, and Joseph Odell, who was killed by the state of Virginia, both of these stories illustrate -- Notice that both of these executions happened in what's called the death belt of the United States, 10 to 12 southern states. They both had trials. The defense was totally inadequate. Joseph Odell defended himself. Doby had a lawyer so bad that he was later disbarred.
And what happens in the telling of the story, the people who read this book will hear things the jury never heard who sentenced them to death. You have a jail house snitch in the case of Joseph Odell, who lied. And in Doby's case you have the most contrived scenarios of a crime you ever heard. He had an all white jury, white - all the inequities and injustices that go on at trial.
They're both poor. They have inadequate defense. The truth doesn't come out at trial.
Once they get a death sentence, then the second part of the story is that the appeals courts just push them through. They never go back and reinvestigate, and the courts are part of this system of death as well.
And we now face the situation in the United States where over 118 wrongfully convicted people have come off of death row, saved mainly by innocence projects of college students.
So when you have that kind of setup, it's inevitable. And I believe these two men -- they've already been executed. Virginia refused to let Joseph Odell have an evidentiary hearing with complete DNA testing, had him killed, then destroyed the DNA testing.
HARRIS: OK.
PREJEAN: And that's what I put forth in "The Death of Innocents." And then I accompanied both of these people to their death, and the reader is going to go through their deaths, too. And by the time they get to their deaths or their killing, we should say, the reader is going to know what the jury never knew and can face the fact we are, in fact, killing innocent people along with the guilty.
HARRIS: You also make the point, and I'm struck by this living in the South, that the death penalty is largely a southern phenomenon. Explain that.
PREJEAN: Actually if you look, since the death -- the Supreme Court put the death penalty back in 1976 and the actual practice of the death penalty, the practitioners are the 10 to 12 southern states that have carried out over 80 percent of actual executions.
The Northeast, for example, less than 1 percent. I think we've got a constitutional question here. Doesn't it say over in the Supreme Court, equal justice under law. And yet we find that those who actually want to practice the death penalty and do in fact kill people are the southern states that practiced slavery the longest.
Texas in 2004 did half of all executions. Why is this not of concern to us? And the direction the court has taken in recent years, and what you call federalism is, "Well, if the states want to do this it's up to the states. There's nothing in the Constitution to forbid this or to override it." I think that's dead wrong.
And in the book I take, you know, ordinary citizens like myself into some of the constitutional issues that show that, in fact, the death penalty cannot be practiced while upholding our constitutional values.
PREJEAN: Sister Helen, you're Roman Catholic. Terry Schiavo, I know this is off the topic of your book, but I have to ask you this question because I know you have some thoughts on it and we'd love to hear your opinion on this.
You're Roman Catholic, Terry Schiavo is Roman Catholic as well. What do you make of the ongoing battle? I'm sure you're aware of it back and forth here.
You know, I just heard that President Bush is saying this is about defense of life. Look at all of the human energy around this woman, who is in a, you know, a state where you're saying, "Is she alive?"
Does she deserve to die? Well, we have killed almost 1,000 people through the death penalty.
If you want to talk about defense of life, you not only have to talk about this single individual and all of this around her particular life where her husband and other members in the family say, in fact, she should be allowed to die that, in fact, she already has died -- I see it as a bogus, diversionary thing.
We've got to look at the deep fabric of our society. Look at all the children that are killed by violence. Look at all of those who die from overdose of drugs. Yet we do not set up clinics around this country to help them to deal with drugs.
The Catholic bishops of the United States tomorrow are going to initiate a campaign as part of respect for life to end the death penalty in the United States. This is the protocol of death where intentionally we set about to kill human beings.
You want to talk about respect for life, let's look at it across the whole board, and put our attention and our energies into stopping government killings, which directly kill people who are alive and not diversionary tactics like everything is around whether or not this poor woman should be allowed to live or die when you get into all these complex things.
HARRIS: And we're going to have to leave it there. Sister Helen Prejean, we appreciate your taking the time to talk to us this Sunday morning.
PREJEAN: Thank you.
HARRIS: Thank you.
KAYE: And we want to thank all of you for all of your e-mails this morning. Our e-mail question of the day is, "Does Congress belong in the Terri Schiavo debate?" You've been e-mailing us at wam@cnn.com.
And here's one we'd like to share from Terry. "It's rather disgusting to think that in our so-called civilized country that one of our own is being starved to death, and we as a great nation go all out to help people who are starving in other parts of the world. I ask myself, where is the logic? I only hope that legislation is passed to protect people who are incapacitated."
HARRIS: And this from Cary in Ohio. "Congress has no business becoming involved in this issue. Individuals in this country have the right to determine if they want to have their life maintained by artificial means. Apparently, Terri made that choice. Her wish is the only one that matters."
Thank you so much for all the e-mails. Continue to send those along at wam@cnn.com. There's the question: Does Congress belong in the Terri Schiavo debate?
And we'll take more of those e-mails and read those back to you in the 9 o'clock hour.
KAYE: They want what's best for Terry Schiavo. The next hour, a family bitterly divided over just what that means. We talk live with Terri Schiavo's brother and her husband.
HARRIS: And at the bottom of the hour on "HOUSECALL," our Dr. Sanjay Gupta takes on gender brain differences, why men and women think the way they do.
I'm Tony Harris.
KAYE: And I'm Randi Kaye in for Betty Nguyen. "HOUSECALL" and your top stories straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired March 20, 2005 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TONY HARRIS, ANCHOR, CNN SUNDAY MORNING: Hot, hot, hot this morning. The next hour of CNN SUNDAY MORNING begins right now.
And good morning from the CNN Center. This is CNN SUNDAY MORNING. It is March 20th, 8 a.m. at CNN headquarters in Atlanta, 5 a.m. in the West, and good morning. Once again, everyone, I'm Tony Harris.
RANDI KAYE, ANCHOR CNN SUNDAY MORNING: And I'm Randi Kaye. Thanks so much for being with us.
It is going to be a busy day in Washington. Lawmakers are scrambling to pass legislation that would have a federal court review the Terri Schiavo case. Even President Bush is cutting short a trip to his Texas ranch so he can sign the bill when it's passed.
We'll talk to Terri Schiavo's husband and her brother ahead in the next hour of CNN SUNDAY MORNING.
In less than an hour, John Couey is expected to make his first court appearance before a Florida judge. The convicted sex offender is suspected of the kidnapping and killing of 9-year-old Jessica Lunsford.
He was transferred overnight from Georgia to Citrus County, Florida, where the girl's body was discovered early Saturday morning.
At least one person is dead after a powerful earthquake shook southwest Japan. Nearly 400 more are injured. Hundreds more evacuated their homes when the quake hit. Tsunami warnings followed the magnitude 7 quake, but were soon canceled.
For the first time in more than 2 1/2 decades Pope John Paul II did not lead Palm Sunday celebrations at the Vatican. Tens of thousands of faithful filled St. Peter's Square for the annual mass leading up to next week's Easter holiday.
The pope's failing health limited his role to a brief wave from a window.
HARRIS: And much more to come this hour on CNN SUNDAY MORNING.
President Bush plans to head back to the Oval Office as the life and death battle over Terri Schiavo gets closer to his desk. Also back in Florida, and in the next hour, the suspect in the killing of Jessica Lunsford makes his first court appearance since his arrest.
And in our Faces of Faith we'll introduce you to a nun who has a real habit of igniting public debates.
KAYE: Our top story this morning, Terri Schiavo is in her third day without food or water at a Florida hospice. But far from her bed, a new effort to keep her alive is in full swing, and President Bush is keeping close tabs.
We'll take you to Crawford, Texas, near the president's ranch. Our White House correspondent, Dana Bash, is there.
Then we'll take you to Pinellas Park, Florida, where national correspondent Bob Franken is outside Schiavo's hospice.
First, to Dana Bash.
DANA BASH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Randi. Well, about three hours from now President Bush is going to board Air Force One, leave Texas and head back to the White House, where he's essentially going to wait in order to sign what he hopes will lead to the reinstating of Terri Schiavo's feeding tube.
Now the president -- usually, when there is legislation passed in Congress and he is away, they send it to him wherever he is. But the White House says that this is a situation where even a few hours can make a difference. And this is a dramatic move designed to show how important this case and this issue is to President Bush.
As Scott McClellan, the president's spokesman said, "This is about defending life, from President Bush's perspective."
Now what the president hopes he will sign, either late, late tonight or early tomorrow morning, is a bipartisan compromise that Congress is gong to be debating today in a very rare session, Palm Sunday session as they are calling it.
What the bill would do would be to allow Terri Schiavo's parents to get a hearing in federal court.
Now there is no guarantee, but the hope by proponents of this is that a federal judge will be more likely to at least temporarily order her feeding tube back in, as the case is considered for the first time in federal court.
Now the Democrats, many say this is overreaching. Republicans know for them this has become a rallying cry and it is also, Randi, personal for President Bush, because his brother, the Florida governor, has been fighting this case for sometime.
KAYE: And, Dana, this compromise is very specific to Terry Schiavo. Why is that so important? BASH: That is really the linchpin here. You know late last week the House of Representatives passed a broader piece of legislation that could apply to pretty much anybody in Terry Schiavo's case. The Senate though, many Democrats, some Republicans, have said that that is not what they want to do. They do not want to set precedent here. So they have something very specific to Terry Schiavo's case.
Well, you remember that there were some dramatic moves, that House Republicans sent a subpoena. They tried to get this stopped. They hit a brick wall in the state court.
So they essentially came back and agreed to compromise with Democrats to keep this very specific to the Terry Schiavo case, and that is exactly what this is. And the hope is that this will not set precedent, at least from the point of view of Democrats. Republicans hope that this will be much broader.
KAYE: All right. Thank you Dana Bash in Crawford, Texas.
HARRIS: Now let's go straight to Pinellas Park, Florida. Bob Franken is outside Terry Schiavo's hospice.
And, Bob, what's the story from where you are?
BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the interesting thing to me is the contrast. Here you have an issue that is generating such intense passion, and here you have the involvement of many people including many activists in the right-to-life movement, who are usually very vocal and sometimes even turn to, what some describe as violence in their tactics.
But here, on purpose, it's a very, very subdued setting. Of course this is a hospice. Inside it is by design peaceful. But outside, the strategy has been to present very quiet protest. You can see behind me at the moment not many people here.
But on this Palm Sunday, I'm sure that there will be any number of people who have strong beliefs about this, particularly supporters of the desire to reinstall the feeding tube. They will be out here, and the strategy right now is to present what they describe as quiet witness, so the politicians feel the pressure in Washington that that brings from here.
We would expect to see the parents of Terri Schiavo go in once again. Again, whatever the personal emotions, this also presents a stark image for Congress to consider, as it's debating the legislation -- Tony?
HARRIS: And, Bob, why do you think this approach to the protest? Is it because these groups don't want to be perceived as being wacky, kooky on such a serious matter?
FRANKEN: Well, I'm sure that they would probably come up with more elegant language. I think what they've decided is, tactically, the quiet protest actually has the most volume.
HARRIS: OK. All right.
Bob Franken we appreciate it. Bob, thank you.
KAYE: Later on CNN SUNDAY MORNING, they want what's best for Terri Schiavo, but they are bitterly divided over just what that means. We talk live to Terry Schiavo's brother and her husband. That's live in the 9 a.m. eastern hour of CNN SUNDAY MORNING.
HARRIS: And this brings us to our e-mail question of the day. Does Congress belong in the Terry Schiavo debate? Send your comments to wam@cnn.com.
KAYE: Fighting for death row inmates is something Sister Helen Prejean, the inspiration for the film "Dead Man Walking," knows well. She has a new book that tackles a new angle of the death penalty. Sister Helen Prejean joins us live in this Sunday's Faces of Faith.
HARRIS: And good morning, Daytona Beach. Your forecast straight ahead, as well as a look of the weather for the rest of the nation.
This is CNN SUNDAY MORNING.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KAYE: There is a new development right now in the Jessica Lunsford killing. John Evander Couey, the convicted sex offender who allegedly confessed to the crime, is due for his first court appearance since returning to Florida overnight.
CNN's Sara Dorsey joins us from Iverness, Florida, with the details.
Sara, good morning.
SARA DORSEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Randi.
We are at the Citrus County detention center where we are awaiting a decision by the judge, who will be seeing Mr. Couey on his first appearance, to determine whether or not cameras will be allowed in the courtroom today.
Now, we are told Mr. Couey has not been charged with anything regarding the Jessica Lunsford case at this point. He's being held on other charges. That is because, according to a sheriff's official, the minute they charge him with anything in this case, the clocks are ticking, really because he has a right to a speedy trial.
So what sheriff's officers are doing, we are told, is they are continuing to build their case against Mr. Couey. They can hold him on these other charges, those charges that they were allowed to hold him on in Georgia and bring him back.
Now, Mr. Couey did arrive back here in Florida at about 2 o'clock this morning. And again, we will be here throughout the morning following this. If cameras are not allowed in, we will be in the courtroom ourselves, to bring you the latest news at it becomes available -- Randi?
KAYE: All right. And we will have the very latest on John Couey's court appearance coming up for you live in the very next hour.
We'll take a break here.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(WEATHER REPORT)
KAYE: Checking our top stories. First, the battle over Terri Schiavo. In a special Sunday session, lawmakers are expected to vote on a compromise bill today that would shift Schiavo's case to federal court. That could lead to her feeding tube being reinserted.
The man suspected of kidnapping and killing 9-year-old Jessica Lunsford is due to have his first court appearance in Florida in just about 45 minutes.
John Couey was booked in Citrus County jail over night after being transferred from Georgia.
And Pope John Paul II greeted tens of thousands of pilgrims from his apartment window this morning, but throat surgery prevented him from presiding over Palm Sunday mass for the first time in his 26 year papacy.
HARRIS: On this Palm Sunday we'll be joined by Sister Helen Prejean, best known for the book that inspired the film "Dead Man Walking." She talks about her new book, and looks at two death row cases and why, she says, they should not have been executed.
KAYE: And later "HOUSE CALL" looks at why men and women respond differently to certain situations. Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta explains gender brain distinction at the bottom of the hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARRIS: Well, lately the news has been filled with several high- profile crime stories in which some people say the suspects should be put to death. Sister Helen Prejean, best known for her 1993 book "Dead Man Walking," has written a new book that further challenges society's notion of capital punishment, "The Death of Innocents" focuses on the execution of two people Sister Helen now believes were not guilty.
She's with us this morning from New Orleans for today's Faces of Faith.
And, Sister Helen, I have been looking forward to talking to you. Thanks for being with us.
SISTER HELEN PREJEAN, AUTHOR, "THE DEATH OF INNOCENTS": Thank you, Tony. I'm glad to be here.
HARRIS: Well, in this book, you're asking whether the state should impose the death penalty. That was the first book. And in this book you're asking if we are killing innocent people. And part of what you claim is that the system is very flawed. Outline, if you would, some of the reasons why you believe the system is flawed and can lead to innocent people being put to death.
PREJEAN: Well, the stories of Doby Gillis Williams from Louisiana, African-American man with an IQ of 65 killed by Louisiana, and Joseph Odell, who was killed by the state of Virginia, both of these stories illustrate -- Notice that both of these executions happened in what's called the death belt of the United States, 10 to 12 southern states. They both had trials. The defense was totally inadequate. Joseph Odell defended himself. Doby had a lawyer so bad that he was later disbarred.
And what happens in the telling of the story, the people who read this book will hear things the jury never heard who sentenced them to death. You have a jail house snitch in the case of Joseph Odell, who lied. And in Doby's case you have the most contrived scenarios of a crime you ever heard. He had an all white jury, white - all the inequities and injustices that go on at trial.
They're both poor. They have inadequate defense. The truth doesn't come out at trial.
Once they get a death sentence, then the second part of the story is that the appeals courts just push them through. They never go back and reinvestigate, and the courts are part of this system of death as well.
And we now face the situation in the United States where over 118 wrongfully convicted people have come off of death row, saved mainly by innocence projects of college students.
So when you have that kind of setup, it's inevitable. And I believe these two men -- they've already been executed. Virginia refused to let Joseph Odell have an evidentiary hearing with complete DNA testing, had him killed, then destroyed the DNA testing.
HARRIS: OK.
PREJEAN: And that's what I put forth in "The Death of Innocents." And then I accompanied both of these people to their death, and the reader is going to go through their deaths, too. And by the time they get to their deaths or their killing, we should say, the reader is going to know what the jury never knew and can face the fact we are, in fact, killing innocent people along with the guilty.
HARRIS: You also make the point, and I'm struck by this living in the South, that the death penalty is largely a southern phenomenon. Explain that.
PREJEAN: Actually if you look, since the death -- the Supreme Court put the death penalty back in 1976 and the actual practice of the death penalty, the practitioners are the 10 to 12 southern states that have carried out over 80 percent of actual executions.
The Northeast, for example, less than 1 percent. I think we've got a constitutional question here. Doesn't it say over in the Supreme Court, equal justice under law. And yet we find that those who actually want to practice the death penalty and do in fact kill people are the southern states that practiced slavery the longest.
Texas in 2004 did half of all executions. Why is this not of concern to us? And the direction the court has taken in recent years, and what you call federalism is, "Well, if the states want to do this it's up to the states. There's nothing in the Constitution to forbid this or to override it." I think that's dead wrong.
And in the book I take, you know, ordinary citizens like myself into some of the constitutional issues that show that, in fact, the death penalty cannot be practiced while upholding our constitutional values.
PREJEAN: Sister Helen, you're Roman Catholic. Terry Schiavo, I know this is off the topic of your book, but I have to ask you this question because I know you have some thoughts on it and we'd love to hear your opinion on this.
You're Roman Catholic, Terry Schiavo is Roman Catholic as well. What do you make of the ongoing battle? I'm sure you're aware of it back and forth here.
You know, I just heard that President Bush is saying this is about defense of life. Look at all of the human energy around this woman, who is in a, you know, a state where you're saying, "Is she alive?"
Does she deserve to die? Well, we have killed almost 1,000 people through the death penalty.
If you want to talk about defense of life, you not only have to talk about this single individual and all of this around her particular life where her husband and other members in the family say, in fact, she should be allowed to die that, in fact, she already has died -- I see it as a bogus, diversionary thing.
We've got to look at the deep fabric of our society. Look at all the children that are killed by violence. Look at all of those who die from overdose of drugs. Yet we do not set up clinics around this country to help them to deal with drugs.
The Catholic bishops of the United States tomorrow are going to initiate a campaign as part of respect for life to end the death penalty in the United States. This is the protocol of death where intentionally we set about to kill human beings.
You want to talk about respect for life, let's look at it across the whole board, and put our attention and our energies into stopping government killings, which directly kill people who are alive and not diversionary tactics like everything is around whether or not this poor woman should be allowed to live or die when you get into all these complex things.
HARRIS: And we're going to have to leave it there. Sister Helen Prejean, we appreciate your taking the time to talk to us this Sunday morning.
PREJEAN: Thank you.
HARRIS: Thank you.
KAYE: And we want to thank all of you for all of your e-mails this morning. Our e-mail question of the day is, "Does Congress belong in the Terri Schiavo debate?" You've been e-mailing us at wam@cnn.com.
And here's one we'd like to share from Terry. "It's rather disgusting to think that in our so-called civilized country that one of our own is being starved to death, and we as a great nation go all out to help people who are starving in other parts of the world. I ask myself, where is the logic? I only hope that legislation is passed to protect people who are incapacitated."
HARRIS: And this from Cary in Ohio. "Congress has no business becoming involved in this issue. Individuals in this country have the right to determine if they want to have their life maintained by artificial means. Apparently, Terri made that choice. Her wish is the only one that matters."
Thank you so much for all the e-mails. Continue to send those along at wam@cnn.com. There's the question: Does Congress belong in the Terri Schiavo debate?
And we'll take more of those e-mails and read those back to you in the 9 o'clock hour.
KAYE: They want what's best for Terry Schiavo. The next hour, a family bitterly divided over just what that means. We talk live with Terri Schiavo's brother and her husband.
HARRIS: And at the bottom of the hour on "HOUSECALL," our Dr. Sanjay Gupta takes on gender brain differences, why men and women think the way they do.
I'm Tony Harris.
KAYE: And I'm Randi Kaye in for Betty Nguyen. "HOUSECALL" and your top stories straight ahead.
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