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CNN Saturday Morning News
U.S. Forces, Eastern Alliance Focus on Mountains
Aired December 08, 2001 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: First, Tora Bora and the hunt for Osama bin Laden. U.S. warplanes pound the eastern Afghan mountains, and Eastern Alliance fighters tangle with al Qaeda mortarmen.
CNN's Brent Sadler is there.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BRENT SADLER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It has been another day of U.S. bombing in the lowland areas leading up to Tora Bora, but less intense I would say than it has been over the past few days. Strike planes hit their positions held by al Qaeda in what's thought to be caves and woodlands in the lower part of the mountains you can see behind me.
Now it's been interested that even though there has been one week, at least, of sustained and heavy U.S. air strikes in this area, al Qaeda has still be able to show its teeth, firing salvos of mortar rounds against positions of the Eastern Alliance.
In fact, the mortar rounds were targeting a road, the main road leading up to the valley, leading to where it's thought there was a concentration of al Qaeda forces with heavy weapons.
Now these mortar rounds were falling successively in one area, clearly trying to cut off the road and achieving that, because very soon after that, we saw a fallback of anti-Taliban Eastern Alliance troops coming back down from where they were trying to advance forward to, coming down along the road, coming back at nightfall.
And as I told you, now you can probably hear the rumble of T-55 tanks behind me. These have moved just 24 hours ago to a more forward position, they too now coming back, having been out of sight from this position for the past day or so.
Also today, we saw more activity from what we believe are forward air controllers moving about the area, coordinating U.S. air strikes. But as I said, a less intense day in terms of U.S. air activity.
Other points of interest, commanders of the Eastern Alliance on the ground here have reported intercepting radio traffic, they share the same walkie talkies, radio traffic which they heard al Qaeda fighters talking about how the "sheik" was, and that's believed to be perhaps a reference to Osama bin Laden himself who could, of course, be directing these defensive operations by al Qaeda against the Eastern Alliance.
So it does seem that after a slow-moving assault against al Qaeda in this area in the lowlands of Tora Bora, it does seem, for now at least, that this offensive has stalled.
Brent Sadler, CNN, in the White Mountains of eastern Afghanistan.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
O'BRIEN: In Tora Bora, the hunt and the focus is on Osama bin Laden. In and around Kandahar, the hunt and the focus is on the mullah, who's in charged of the Taliban, Mullah Mohammed Omar.
For more on exactly where things go from here as that hunt continues, we turn to our military analyst, retired Major General Don Shepperd, to talk about why the U.S. has not yet found these leaders of the Taliban and al Qaeda. General Shepperd, good morning to you, sir.
MAJ. GEN. DON SHEPPERD (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Good morning, Miles.
O'BRIEN: There must be a bit of frustration in the audience's mind right now, given the fact that there's been such stunning success militarily, and yet the people in charge are still eluding capture.
SHEPPERD: Yes. Indeed in the public's mind, they got to be wondering what's happening. The whole country has fell and fell quickly and we got one city there left in Kandahar. It's fallen. Why don't we know where Omar is, and why can't we -- what happened to all the al Qaeda that were supposedly in this town.
If I can go to the Telestrator here, let me show you a little bit of the problem. If I can go down to the Kandahar area here, the Marine Base, Camp Rhino, is down in this area right here, southwest of town.
That Marine camp's got about 1,200 Marines in the area, and basically what they have to do is cut the roads here, cut the roads here, cut the roads here and then, the idea behind cutting those road, of course, is to keep the al Qaeda and the hardcore Taliban with their weapons from escaping.
Now they have air support. They have helicopters. They have aviator Harrier jump jets out of the Arabian Sea and what have you, but this is a very, very big area for 1,200 Marines. You really are searching for a needle in a haystack.
And in addition, they really don't know where Mullah Omar is, and it's apparent that Hamid Karzai does not know where he is either. He's somewhere in the vicinity of Kandahar, but there's lots of places to hide in the Oruzgan Province to the north and Zabul to the northeast, and that road between Kabul and Kandahar, that whole area between Kabul and Kandahar, is still not secure.
So there's plenty of places for these people to get away and 1,200 Marines doesn't go very far in this search. They're doing what they can, but it's going to take some time.
O'BRIEN: You mention cutting off the roads, General Shepperd. Obviously these people, very familiar with this turf and this terrain, and might not need roads with perhaps traveling on horseback for example.
SHEPPERD: Yes. If you can think of a city the size of New Orleans and all the roads out of New Orleans, that's what you're looking at there at Kandahar. Now, of course, you got the mountains to the north. But on the other hand, there's lots of ways you can just, you can just haul out over the desert, and these people really do know the area. They know all the places to hide.
And the other thing is, the Marines can't just shoot anything that's moving. What they've got on their hands here is a bunch of people fleeing the area, normal commerce going on, and so you can't just shoot every vehicle. You got to be sure that what you're shooting, if you're going to shoot, are al Qaeda or hardcore Taliban trying to escape.
The other element is that these people can go into neighboring Pakistan, if they can get there across the very porous border, and they can be relatively safe with the Pashtun sympathy in that whole area.
So it's a very difficult, very difficult situation, and as General Franks has said, this is just the very beginning. This is not mop-up operations, where we're about to close shop. It's the very beginning in the hunt for Omar, the very beginning in the hunt for al Qaeda, lots going on in Tora Bora, lots going on to stabilize across the whole country.
So tough stuff still going on, Miles.
O'BRIEN: General, you mentioned that porous border into Pakistan. Pakistan allied with the U.S. but treading a very fine line there given the sensibilities of the region and their concerns about geopolitics. I'm curious how the rules of engagement would change if, in fact, the pursuit moved across the border.
SHEPPERD: Well, we're not going to reveal the rules of engagement obviously, but if you're in hot pursuit of someone, you can basically do what you need to do to protect yourself.
But let me go back to the Telestrator here and show you just a couple things. Look at this border with Pakistan. Look at the length of the border with Pakistan, very porous border, lots of mountainous areas all the way down here. It's very, very difficult to keep people from getting across that border.
Now this area right here is the Pashtun area of Pakistan, lots of sympathy for anyone that goes in there, lots of protection in this whole area for anyone that wants to escape in there.
If we are pursuing them into that area, once you get into Pakistan, the Pakistan military is in charge. So, although we have liaison with Pakistan, you can't just go into somebody else's country and start blowing people away.
If you're in hot pursuit, you do what you have to do, but you got to be careful.
O'BRIEN: Major General Don Shepperd, retired U.S. Air Force, our military analyst, thanks as always, appreciate it.
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