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CNN Saturday Morning News
Interview With Dr. Alvin Poussaint
Aired October 26, 2002 - 07:47 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: With the sniper suspects in custody now, a lot of people in the Washington area are breathing easier, especially parents. But even now that the danger seems to be over, some children may have lingering fears about the recent events.
Child psychiatrist Dr. Alvin Poussaint joins us from Boston to discuss this and other issues -- welcome.
DR. ALVIN POUSSAINT, PSYCHIATRIST: Thank you.
COSTELLO: Let's start with the other issue, shall we, because a lot of people are wondering bout the relationship between these two suspects -- a 41-year-old man and a 17-year-old kid and who was controlling who.
POUSSAINT: Well, I think it's clear that because of the separation in their ages that Muhammad was a father figure to this boy in some way. And because of that, I think the boy may have acted obediently. I think he had a great deal of influence over the -- this -- this young man.
How much we really don't -- don't -- know. They were in a desperate situation in the sense that they were homeless, they were wandering the country, they perhaps committed some other robberies so that this was a boy very dependent on this older man.
And we don't know how much because we don't know enough about this boy's background. We do know that apparently his father -- his real father -- biological father -- hadn't seen him for four years.
We don't know much about his relationship with his mother and why he left with Mr. -- Mr. Muhammad. But I think that...
COSTELLO: Interesting things, too, doctor...
POUSSAINT: ... but that's very important.
COSTELLO: Just let me interrupt just to draw out some more strange things. Mr. Muhammad was apparently posing as the boy's father; he tried to enroll him in school in Washington State. He had the boy on this strange special diet. He tried to gain legal custody from the mother, who apparently Mr. Muhammad was dating at the time.
POUSSAINT: That's right. So, Mr. Muhammad was really putting himself in the father role, probably demanding obedience, putting him on strange diets. And otherwise being very controlling and influencing this young man. Again, we don't know how much, but I think that's a critical ingredient in probably the boy's behavior and what happened.
COSTELLO: Police are now trying to determine whether the boy also took part in these shootings.
POUSSAINT: Yes, go ahead.
COSTELLO: Well, I was just wondering if the boy didn't have any violent tendencies, and I know we're speculating here -- how easy would it be to brainwash someone into killing?
POUSSAINT: Well, we don't know. I don't think we have enough information about the boy. But if the boy was trying to stay in the good graces of Mr. Muhammad, then he might do what Mr. Muhammad tells him -- tells him -- to do.
The other question is, apparently, he had to be a pretty good shot to -- in order to hit your victims, and I would wonder how Malvo would have learned how to shoot a rifle that accurately in such a short period of time. Whether he was really the one guiding the getaway car at most times and the killings were carried out by Mr. Muhammad. We just don't know at this point.
COSTELLO: And I suppose another factor in this was the young man was not a citizen of the United States, he faced possible deportation.
POUSSAINT: That's right, we don't know how that plays into it either. Suppose he was under some threat of being deported in his mind and Mr. Muhammad was in some way protecting him by taking him around, being with him, and keeping him away from the immigration officials. We -- again -- we don't have that information but that's certainly possible.
COSTELLO: How likely do you think that either one will turn on the other?
POUSSAINT: Well, they may. Let's say Malvo felt that Mr. Muhammad was obsessively controlling and was beginning to get -- beginning to get -- angry. We have some -- something about that was said at some point.
He may, under the circumstance of being separated from Mr. Muhammad, might possibly turn on him and perhaps testify against him. That's a very possible and in fact I think probably the prosecutors would probably help bring that about if it's possible at all.
COSTELLO: I'm certain they're wishing for that, too. OK, let's talk about children -- the innocent ones that were so fearful during this time when the snipers were killing people in the area. What do you tell your kids to make them feel safe now?
POUSSAINT: Well, I think you tell them now that the major danger is over, we don't know entirely but the major danger is over and I think parents are feeling that way so they're feeling more comfortable, they're feeling less anxious so I think the children will feel less anxious.
I think as things get back to normal routine with schools and their other activities outdoor activities, that the memories of this will begin to fade for most of the children. There may be a few who are still very anxious and require more support, more attention, but I think with time children will want to be children and get back to their normal routines, their friends, their sports, and other activities.
COSTELLO: So when your child comes up to you and says something like, Mommy, why did this man want to kill me -- because you know in a post-script in one of the letters from the sniper say he threatened children. How do you answer your child's question...
POUSSAINT: Well, you would say well you don't know that this man must be angry at someone, he must be troubled, he has problems, emotional problems, or he's doing bad things. And we don't know all the reasons why, but people like that have to be stopped, and they have to be arrested, and they have to go to jail, and have to be punished for those kinds of activities.
We can't pretend to know why they did it if we don't know. Except there are people like that and we try to make the world safe for children and -- and put away people who would do such things so that we can keep children protected.
COSTELLO: All right, Dr. Poussaint, thank you very much -- you have enlightened us this morning.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired October 26, 2002 - 07:47 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: With the sniper suspects in custody now, a lot of people in the Washington area are breathing easier, especially parents. But even now that the danger seems to be over, some children may have lingering fears about the recent events.
Child psychiatrist Dr. Alvin Poussaint joins us from Boston to discuss this and other issues -- welcome.
DR. ALVIN POUSSAINT, PSYCHIATRIST: Thank you.
COSTELLO: Let's start with the other issue, shall we, because a lot of people are wondering bout the relationship between these two suspects -- a 41-year-old man and a 17-year-old kid and who was controlling who.
POUSSAINT: Well, I think it's clear that because of the separation in their ages that Muhammad was a father figure to this boy in some way. And because of that, I think the boy may have acted obediently. I think he had a great deal of influence over the -- this -- this young man.
How much we really don't -- don't -- know. They were in a desperate situation in the sense that they were homeless, they were wandering the country, they perhaps committed some other robberies so that this was a boy very dependent on this older man.
And we don't know how much because we don't know enough about this boy's background. We do know that apparently his father -- his real father -- biological father -- hadn't seen him for four years.
We don't know much about his relationship with his mother and why he left with Mr. -- Mr. Muhammad. But I think that...
COSTELLO: Interesting things, too, doctor...
POUSSAINT: ... but that's very important.
COSTELLO: Just let me interrupt just to draw out some more strange things. Mr. Muhammad was apparently posing as the boy's father; he tried to enroll him in school in Washington State. He had the boy on this strange special diet. He tried to gain legal custody from the mother, who apparently Mr. Muhammad was dating at the time.
POUSSAINT: That's right. So, Mr. Muhammad was really putting himself in the father role, probably demanding obedience, putting him on strange diets. And otherwise being very controlling and influencing this young man. Again, we don't know how much, but I think that's a critical ingredient in probably the boy's behavior and what happened.
COSTELLO: Police are now trying to determine whether the boy also took part in these shootings.
POUSSAINT: Yes, go ahead.
COSTELLO: Well, I was just wondering if the boy didn't have any violent tendencies, and I know we're speculating here -- how easy would it be to brainwash someone into killing?
POUSSAINT: Well, we don't know. I don't think we have enough information about the boy. But if the boy was trying to stay in the good graces of Mr. Muhammad, then he might do what Mr. Muhammad tells him -- tells him -- to do.
The other question is, apparently, he had to be a pretty good shot to -- in order to hit your victims, and I would wonder how Malvo would have learned how to shoot a rifle that accurately in such a short period of time. Whether he was really the one guiding the getaway car at most times and the killings were carried out by Mr. Muhammad. We just don't know at this point.
COSTELLO: And I suppose another factor in this was the young man was not a citizen of the United States, he faced possible deportation.
POUSSAINT: That's right, we don't know how that plays into it either. Suppose he was under some threat of being deported in his mind and Mr. Muhammad was in some way protecting him by taking him around, being with him, and keeping him away from the immigration officials. We -- again -- we don't have that information but that's certainly possible.
COSTELLO: How likely do you think that either one will turn on the other?
POUSSAINT: Well, they may. Let's say Malvo felt that Mr. Muhammad was obsessively controlling and was beginning to get -- beginning to get -- angry. We have some -- something about that was said at some point.
He may, under the circumstance of being separated from Mr. Muhammad, might possibly turn on him and perhaps testify against him. That's a very possible and in fact I think probably the prosecutors would probably help bring that about if it's possible at all.
COSTELLO: I'm certain they're wishing for that, too. OK, let's talk about children -- the innocent ones that were so fearful during this time when the snipers were killing people in the area. What do you tell your kids to make them feel safe now?
POUSSAINT: Well, I think you tell them now that the major danger is over, we don't know entirely but the major danger is over and I think parents are feeling that way so they're feeling more comfortable, they're feeling less anxious so I think the children will feel less anxious.
I think as things get back to normal routine with schools and their other activities outdoor activities, that the memories of this will begin to fade for most of the children. There may be a few who are still very anxious and require more support, more attention, but I think with time children will want to be children and get back to their normal routines, their friends, their sports, and other activities.
COSTELLO: So when your child comes up to you and says something like, Mommy, why did this man want to kill me -- because you know in a post-script in one of the letters from the sniper say he threatened children. How do you answer your child's question...
POUSSAINT: Well, you would say well you don't know that this man must be angry at someone, he must be troubled, he has problems, emotional problems, or he's doing bad things. And we don't know all the reasons why, but people like that have to be stopped, and they have to be arrested, and they have to go to jail, and have to be punished for those kinds of activities.
We can't pretend to know why they did it if we don't know. Except there are people like that and we try to make the world safe for children and -- and put away people who would do such things so that we can keep children protected.
COSTELLO: All right, Dr. Poussaint, thank you very much -- you have enlightened us this morning.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
