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CNN Saturday Morning News

Interview With Peter Ford

Aired April 19, 2003 - 08:16   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Iraq's neighbors are calling for the U.S.-led coalition to bring security and stability to Iraq, help Iraqis form a new government then get out of the country. That's the decision reached at an Arab ministers meeting hosted by Saudi Arabia.
The Saudi foreign minister explained the goals and repeatedly referred to coalition troops as an occupying force.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAUD AL-FAISAL, SAUDI FOREIGN MINISTER (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): We want the government to be set up, a legitimate government to be set up immediately, if possible. But until or to be set up, the occupying forces that removed the previous Iraqi government, they have to provide security so that the new government is set up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: What role will Iraq's religious leaders play in a new government?

Well, for some answers to that question, we go live to Peter Ford in Baghdad. He's a correspondent for the "Christian Science Monitor."

Hello to you, Peter.

PETER FORD, "CHRISTIAN SCIENCE MONITOR": Hello, Heidi.

COLLINS: I'm wondering, why don't you tell us first off, just so we kind of get a better idea of things there, what religious factions are there in Baghdad, for the most part, to understand?

FORD: Well, the predominantly -- the predominant ones are the Sunni and the Shia Muslims. There are a few Christians. But the majority of the population in Iraq, and they're very, very big in eastern Baghdad, are the Shia Muslims. Now they are based, their leaders are based in Najaf, in southern Iraq, and they're quite closely linked with Iran.

COLLINS: Which of those two, then, do you think, if you can make a distinction, seem to be organizing their own new order? Are either one of them doing that yet?

FORD: Yes, the Shia are, very clearly. Yesterday I was at Friday prayers in what used to be known as Saddam City, a teeming slum. And there were 30,000 Shia Muslims worshiping in the streets outside a mosque. It's the first time in four years they've been allowed to do that because Saddam Hussein's regime repressed the Shia Muslims very brutally. And, in fact, they hadn't been out on the streets in those numbers since they were gunned down in 1999.

What was particularly interesting was that the ceremony was being protected by hundreds and hundreds of gunmen, mostly in civilian clothes, but some of them in makeshift uniforms. And they are part of what appears to be an effort by the Shia clerics to set up some kind of a rival, parallel administration in the city, not necessarily against the Americans, but completely independently of the Americans.

COLLINS: Very interesting then at this point to ask the question whether or not the U.S. forces have tried to make contact with the Shias in trying to bring about some new order? I mean we've heard so much about the U.S. or the coalition forces actually waiting to work in tandem with the Iraqi people and possibly these Shias.

Now what have they done in order to get their, to at least take the first couple of steps?

FORD: Well, the Shia cleric with whom I spoke yesterday said that they had not been approached by the Americans and that they had not approached the Americans themselves and they didn't intend to. He said that the Shia clerics, the leadership in Najaf want to organize Iraq themselves. They do not want any foreign participation and they want to just get on with it and do exactly what the Americans say they're doing, too, setting up hospitals, getting the electricity working, water, security, this sort of thing.

In effect, what we have are two different organizations. The Americans, with their local Iraqi allies, who've come back from exile in the last few days on the one hand, and the Shias on the other hand.

COLLINS: Do you think that will serve them better to do it on their own? Or will there be things that are compromised if they try to do it alone?

FORD: Well, I think probably the Americans stand a better chance of doing the complicated work than the Shias do. When it comes to repairing power plants or getting water supplies or oil supplies going again, the U.S. is obviously far better resourced than the local people.

But I think in the end it's probably going to come down to where Iraqi people's loyalties lie. And it's been clear to me over the last few days that most Iraqis would like to see the American troops leave as soon as possible and would like an Iraqi go to be 100 percent Iraqi. And over the last 35 years, there really hasn't been any sort of civil society in this country. With the Baath Party gone and Saddam Hussein gone, the only institution left which organizes people and rallies them is the mosque. And I think that will give the mosques and the senior imams a great deal of influence and power here.

COLLINS: Peter, is it possible, though, or realistic, I should say, that there might be inter-religious or ethnic fighting because of this? FORD: Well, it's certainly in the back of everybody's mind. The man with whom I spoke said that he did not intend, and his leadership did not intend to use their armed men -- and he said there were about 5,000 or 6,000 of them just in Saddam City district of Baghdad -- that they did not intend to use their weapons against any other party, even, he said, those who have come from abroad claiming to administer Iraq.

COLLINS: Peter Ford with the "Christian Science Monitor" live in Baghdad for us this morning.

Thank you, Peter.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired April 19, 2003 - 08:16   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Iraq's neighbors are calling for the U.S.-led coalition to bring security and stability to Iraq, help Iraqis form a new government then get out of the country. That's the decision reached at an Arab ministers meeting hosted by Saudi Arabia.
The Saudi foreign minister explained the goals and repeatedly referred to coalition troops as an occupying force.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAUD AL-FAISAL, SAUDI FOREIGN MINISTER (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): We want the government to be set up, a legitimate government to be set up immediately, if possible. But until or to be set up, the occupying forces that removed the previous Iraqi government, they have to provide security so that the new government is set up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: What role will Iraq's religious leaders play in a new government?

Well, for some answers to that question, we go live to Peter Ford in Baghdad. He's a correspondent for the "Christian Science Monitor."

Hello to you, Peter.

PETER FORD, "CHRISTIAN SCIENCE MONITOR": Hello, Heidi.

COLLINS: I'm wondering, why don't you tell us first off, just so we kind of get a better idea of things there, what religious factions are there in Baghdad, for the most part, to understand?

FORD: Well, the predominantly -- the predominant ones are the Sunni and the Shia Muslims. There are a few Christians. But the majority of the population in Iraq, and they're very, very big in eastern Baghdad, are the Shia Muslims. Now they are based, their leaders are based in Najaf, in southern Iraq, and they're quite closely linked with Iran.

COLLINS: Which of those two, then, do you think, if you can make a distinction, seem to be organizing their own new order? Are either one of them doing that yet?

FORD: Yes, the Shia are, very clearly. Yesterday I was at Friday prayers in what used to be known as Saddam City, a teeming slum. And there were 30,000 Shia Muslims worshiping in the streets outside a mosque. It's the first time in four years they've been allowed to do that because Saddam Hussein's regime repressed the Shia Muslims very brutally. And, in fact, they hadn't been out on the streets in those numbers since they were gunned down in 1999.

What was particularly interesting was that the ceremony was being protected by hundreds and hundreds of gunmen, mostly in civilian clothes, but some of them in makeshift uniforms. And they are part of what appears to be an effort by the Shia clerics to set up some kind of a rival, parallel administration in the city, not necessarily against the Americans, but completely independently of the Americans.

COLLINS: Very interesting then at this point to ask the question whether or not the U.S. forces have tried to make contact with the Shias in trying to bring about some new order? I mean we've heard so much about the U.S. or the coalition forces actually waiting to work in tandem with the Iraqi people and possibly these Shias.

Now what have they done in order to get their, to at least take the first couple of steps?

FORD: Well, the Shia cleric with whom I spoke yesterday said that they had not been approached by the Americans and that they had not approached the Americans themselves and they didn't intend to. He said that the Shia clerics, the leadership in Najaf want to organize Iraq themselves. They do not want any foreign participation and they want to just get on with it and do exactly what the Americans say they're doing, too, setting up hospitals, getting the electricity working, water, security, this sort of thing.

In effect, what we have are two different organizations. The Americans, with their local Iraqi allies, who've come back from exile in the last few days on the one hand, and the Shias on the other hand.

COLLINS: Do you think that will serve them better to do it on their own? Or will there be things that are compromised if they try to do it alone?

FORD: Well, I think probably the Americans stand a better chance of doing the complicated work than the Shias do. When it comes to repairing power plants or getting water supplies or oil supplies going again, the U.S. is obviously far better resourced than the local people.

But I think in the end it's probably going to come down to where Iraqi people's loyalties lie. And it's been clear to me over the last few days that most Iraqis would like to see the American troops leave as soon as possible and would like an Iraqi go to be 100 percent Iraqi. And over the last 35 years, there really hasn't been any sort of civil society in this country. With the Baath Party gone and Saddam Hussein gone, the only institution left which organizes people and rallies them is the mosque. And I think that will give the mosques and the senior imams a great deal of influence and power here.

COLLINS: Peter, is it possible, though, or realistic, I should say, that there might be inter-religious or ethnic fighting because of this? FORD: Well, it's certainly in the back of everybody's mind. The man with whom I spoke said that he did not intend, and his leadership did not intend to use their armed men -- and he said there were about 5,000 or 6,000 of them just in Saddam City district of Baghdad -- that they did not intend to use their weapons against any other party, even, he said, those who have come from abroad claiming to administer Iraq.

COLLINS: Peter Ford with the "Christian Science Monitor" live in Baghdad for us this morning.

Thank you, Peter.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com