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CNN Saturday Morning News

Interview With Robert Hunter

Aired May 10, 2003 - 09:11   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I propose the establishment of a U.S. Middle East free trade area within a decade to bring the Middle East into an expanding circle of opportunity, to provide hope for the people who live in that region.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: That was President Bush. Now, he says a free trade zone can, in his words, "replace old hatred with new hopes." The president says the U.S. is going to use its influence and idealism to move the Middle East on a track toward peace.

How's it going to work? That's what we want to look at right now. This morning, we're looking at the so-called road map for peace that Colin Powell's bringing to the Middle East. He's due to arrive in Israel in just a couple of hours.

To help us assess the secretary of state's trip, we call on former U.S. ambassador to NATO Robert Hunter.

Ambassador Hunter, thanks very much for being with us. How...

ROBERT HUNTER, SENIOR ADVISER, RAND: Good to be with you.

COOPER: How important is personal diplomacy at this stage of the game?

HUNTER: Well, I think the most important thing is for the senior man in our diplomacy to show up in the Middle East after the Iraq war, that's number one.

Number two, for Colin Powell, who is second only to the president in this business, to show America's political commitment to moving Arab-Israeli peacemaking forward.

That's what the trip's about. The rest is what we they call fact-finding, which means doing a lot of listening.

COOPER: This -- the so-called road map to peace, it wasn't just put forward by the U.S. It's also sponsored by the U.N., Europeans, as well as the Russians, by the quartet, as it's called. Is the U.S. the key player in all this, though?

HUNTER: We're the 800-pound gorilla. The United States is the only country historically that has been able to do anything in Arab- Israeli peacemaking. We're also the ones who would have to make it happen if it comes to fruition. In fact, I suspect we will have some troops out there in some regard, if indeed there's an agreement between Israel and Palestine.

The others there are to give political cover. But it's -- this is an American show.

COOPER: The dynamic in the region seems to have changed, certainly the war in Iraq has made an enormous difference, the war on terrorism. How do you think that's going to affect both Israel and probably in particular the Palestinians?

HUNTER: Well, a lot of people were saying the road to Jerusalem lies through Baghdad, that is, you get rid of this guy Saddam Hussein, with efforts to get WMD and weapons of mass destruction, terrorism, and the like.

You now have a new prime minister for the Palestinians, Mahmoud Abbas, bypassing, if you can, Yasser Arafat, who's yesterday, who's history.

So this is a moment where things may be possible. But it's a long way between here and there.

COOPER: Yes, let me follow up on that. I mean, is Arafat really history? You know, you read these polls of Israelis, and they'll say, most of them still think Arafat is the one pulling the strings. Mahmoud Abbas has had a long, or not such long, but a very difficult road just getting to the seat of power where he is now. And it -- there's a big open question of, really, does he have the power?

HUNTER: Sorry, let me clarify that. He has to become history. That is, the United States won't deal with him. It is obvious we're going to play to the new man. He's the person who can cut the deals. And if Arafat still stands in the way, at some point nobody will talk to him.

COOPER: Do you think Mahmoud Abbas really, though, has the power to institute the kind of changes that the Israelis are calling for, and that this road map calls for?

HUNTER: At this point, no. It is going to have to be something where Israel does something, Palestinians do something, the United States standing there pushing both of them in the right direction. It's going to take a long time, it's going to be tough. A lot of concessions have to be made. And one of the first things is to try to stop the killing.

COOPER: How does this work? I mean, you've been in these negotiating rooms. It has got to be just an extraordinary process, trying to get movement from both sides. I mean, publicly, when you talk to Israeli officials, they say, Look, we're not doing anything until there's security on the ground, until the Palestinians move.

You talk to the Palestinians, they say, Look, we can't move, we can't make real security guarantees until we get some political movement.

How, once you're in those negotiating rooms behind closed doors, how do you get that movement going?

HUNTER: Well, this is really about survival and the future for both sides. So these are very serious discussions. It's not about air roots or about vegetables. It means the United States has to be there all the time, reassuring, and saying, Come what may, we will stand with Israel's security. Come what may, we are going to promote a Palestinian state, one that's prepared to live at peace with Israel.

The details are incredibly important, and everybody knows them all, going all the way back three-quarters a century. But it's the political engagement of the United States that's going to move them one painful step at a time in the right direction.

COOPER: Do you really believe something positive can happen in the next several weeks or months.

HUNTER: No. But the question is whether, over the duration of the road map and beyond, the president, the United States, and both the Palestinians and the Israelis will want to move it forward.

You know, the road map is like the old thing you take out of the glove compartment, you haven't looked at for years, but you also need AAA's triptych, which tells you, Here is the washout, here are the detours, here's what you got to do to change things.

But the destination is already clear, and we have to help both sides get to a state of peace.

COOPER: All right, we'll see who is driving the car pretty soon, I guess. Ambassador Robert hunter, appreciate you joining us. Thanks very much.

HUNTER: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired May 10, 2003 - 09:11   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I propose the establishment of a U.S. Middle East free trade area within a decade to bring the Middle East into an expanding circle of opportunity, to provide hope for the people who live in that region.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: That was President Bush. Now, he says a free trade zone can, in his words, "replace old hatred with new hopes." The president says the U.S. is going to use its influence and idealism to move the Middle East on a track toward peace.

How's it going to work? That's what we want to look at right now. This morning, we're looking at the so-called road map for peace that Colin Powell's bringing to the Middle East. He's due to arrive in Israel in just a couple of hours.

To help us assess the secretary of state's trip, we call on former U.S. ambassador to NATO Robert Hunter.

Ambassador Hunter, thanks very much for being with us. How...

ROBERT HUNTER, SENIOR ADVISER, RAND: Good to be with you.

COOPER: How important is personal diplomacy at this stage of the game?

HUNTER: Well, I think the most important thing is for the senior man in our diplomacy to show up in the Middle East after the Iraq war, that's number one.

Number two, for Colin Powell, who is second only to the president in this business, to show America's political commitment to moving Arab-Israeli peacemaking forward.

That's what the trip's about. The rest is what we they call fact-finding, which means doing a lot of listening.

COOPER: This -- the so-called road map to peace, it wasn't just put forward by the U.S. It's also sponsored by the U.N., Europeans, as well as the Russians, by the quartet, as it's called. Is the U.S. the key player in all this, though?

HUNTER: We're the 800-pound gorilla. The United States is the only country historically that has been able to do anything in Arab- Israeli peacemaking. We're also the ones who would have to make it happen if it comes to fruition. In fact, I suspect we will have some troops out there in some regard, if indeed there's an agreement between Israel and Palestine.

The others there are to give political cover. But it's -- this is an American show.

COOPER: The dynamic in the region seems to have changed, certainly the war in Iraq has made an enormous difference, the war on terrorism. How do you think that's going to affect both Israel and probably in particular the Palestinians?

HUNTER: Well, a lot of people were saying the road to Jerusalem lies through Baghdad, that is, you get rid of this guy Saddam Hussein, with efforts to get WMD and weapons of mass destruction, terrorism, and the like.

You now have a new prime minister for the Palestinians, Mahmoud Abbas, bypassing, if you can, Yasser Arafat, who's yesterday, who's history.

So this is a moment where things may be possible. But it's a long way between here and there.

COOPER: Yes, let me follow up on that. I mean, is Arafat really history? You know, you read these polls of Israelis, and they'll say, most of them still think Arafat is the one pulling the strings. Mahmoud Abbas has had a long, or not such long, but a very difficult road just getting to the seat of power where he is now. And it -- there's a big open question of, really, does he have the power?

HUNTER: Sorry, let me clarify that. He has to become history. That is, the United States won't deal with him. It is obvious we're going to play to the new man. He's the person who can cut the deals. And if Arafat still stands in the way, at some point nobody will talk to him.

COOPER: Do you think Mahmoud Abbas really, though, has the power to institute the kind of changes that the Israelis are calling for, and that this road map calls for?

HUNTER: At this point, no. It is going to have to be something where Israel does something, Palestinians do something, the United States standing there pushing both of them in the right direction. It's going to take a long time, it's going to be tough. A lot of concessions have to be made. And one of the first things is to try to stop the killing.

COOPER: How does this work? I mean, you've been in these negotiating rooms. It has got to be just an extraordinary process, trying to get movement from both sides. I mean, publicly, when you talk to Israeli officials, they say, Look, we're not doing anything until there's security on the ground, until the Palestinians move.

You talk to the Palestinians, they say, Look, we can't move, we can't make real security guarantees until we get some political movement.

How, once you're in those negotiating rooms behind closed doors, how do you get that movement going?

HUNTER: Well, this is really about survival and the future for both sides. So these are very serious discussions. It's not about air roots or about vegetables. It means the United States has to be there all the time, reassuring, and saying, Come what may, we will stand with Israel's security. Come what may, we are going to promote a Palestinian state, one that's prepared to live at peace with Israel.

The details are incredibly important, and everybody knows them all, going all the way back three-quarters a century. But it's the political engagement of the United States that's going to move them one painful step at a time in the right direction.

COOPER: Do you really believe something positive can happen in the next several weeks or months.

HUNTER: No. But the question is whether, over the duration of the road map and beyond, the president, the United States, and both the Palestinians and the Israelis will want to move it forward.

You know, the road map is like the old thing you take out of the glove compartment, you haven't looked at for years, but you also need AAA's triptych, which tells you, Here is the washout, here are the detours, here's what you got to do to change things.

But the destination is already clear, and we have to help both sides get to a state of peace.

COOPER: All right, we'll see who is driving the car pretty soon, I guess. Ambassador Robert hunter, appreciate you joining us. Thanks very much.

HUNTER: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com