Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Saturday Morning News
Martha Stewart's Attorney Plans to Appeal; Mexican President Visits with Bush in Texas; Legal Round Table Weighs in on Martha Stewart, Scott Peterson
Aired March 06, 2004 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ERICA HILL, ANCHOR: The next hour of CNN SATURDAY MORNING begins right now.
Coming to you live from the CNN center in Atlanta this is CNN SATURDAY MORNING. It is March 6, and good to have you with us. Good morning. I'm Erica Hill.
KELLI ARENA, ANCHOR: And I'm Kelli Arena. Thanks for being with us.
Well, here is what's ahead this hour. Martha Stewart leaves court a convicted felon, and experts say that she'll likely spend time in prison. We go live to New York for details on what happens next.
Jury selection is underway in the Scott Peterson trial. We'll analyze the process in our legal brief segment.
And it is time for a medical checkup in Iraq. "Weekend House Call" takes a look at the country's health system.
HILL: First now, a check of the headlines at this hour.
Death and violence in the Middle East from Gaza's Erez Crossing into Israel. Palestinian gunman attacked an Israeli military post. The Israelis killed one of the attackers. The other gunman blew up his Jeep, killing three Palestinian security officers. No Israeli casualties were reported.
Some U.S. Marines have moved out from the Haitian capital in an effort to provide security in former rebel strongholds in the northern and western parts of the country. The Marines are deployed as part of an international peacekeeping force.
And Attorney General John Ashcroft is still in intense care at a Washington hospital, being treated with antibiotics and painkillers. Ashcroft was hospitalized on Thursday night, suffering from severe gallstone pancreatitis. A specialist says patients with the condition are often hospitalized for a month or longer.
ARENA: Our top story this hour: a jury says that she lied, conspired and obstructed justice, and now she's fighting to clear her name.
After being found guilty of the four counts against her, homemaking maven Martha Stewart says that she plans to appeal.
CNN's Allan Chernoff has been following the trial, and he joins us live from New York with the very latest -- Allan.
ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Kelli.
And Martha Stewart did walk down the courthouse steps behind me yesterday afternoon a convicted felon, the jury determining that Stewart and her co-defendant, stockbroker Peter Bacanovic, had lied about the true reason for the sale of ImClone stock back in December of 2001.
Stewart and Bacanovic had claimed the reason she sold was simply they had an agreement to sell if the stock fell below $60 a share. The jury decided that was a cover story, and the true reason was that Stewart had been tipped that the former chief executive of ImClone was trying to dump his shares, and Stewart sold as soon as she found that out.
Now, in court Judge Miriam Cedarbaum read the verdict. Four times she said "guilty." Martha Stewart showed no emotion at all. The emotion actually came from the lead prosecutor, Karen Seymour, who was holding back tears.
Now, sentencing has been set for June 17. And Martha Stewart faces a theoretical maximum of 20 years, but the federal guidelines actually say it's closer to a maximum of three years. Many legal analysts are talking about one year. It really will be up to the judge after she does get a sentencing memo from the probation department.
Martha Stewart's attorney says that he is intending to appeal. He said he considers this losing the first round, and he said it's onto the next round -- Kelli.
ARENA: Alan, a lot of Monday morning quarterbacking going on. You spent all that time in the courtroom. Do you think that it was a mistake that the defense was so short?
CHERNOFF: Robert Morvillo said he put on a minimal defense, because he believed that the government had not proved its charges. But clearly the jury felt quite differently. And 20/20 hindsight, it clearly does seem to have been at least somewhat of a mistake not to have put on more of a case.
Morvillo had only one witness on the stand, and that was an attorney who was present who took notes when Martha Stewart was interviewed by the Securities and Exchange Commission and the U.S. attorney's office.
Clearly, Morvillo could have brought more witnesses to the stand. It's debatable, though, whether or not Martha Stewart taking the stand would have actually helped her case -- Kelli.
ARENA: All right. Allan Chernoff, thanks for joining us this morning. HILL: And on the subject of that, 12 people, 12 hours. That's how many and how long it took to decide the domestic diva's fate. One juror was asked if it mattered that Stewart didn't stake the stand in her own defense.
He said the mountain of evidence was against her.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHAPPELL HARTRIDGE, JUROR: If we had enough evidence, it didn't make a difference if Martha would have gone on and said something to the contrary. It didn't phase me one way or the other what she had to say.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: In a blunt message to the investment community, one juror also said, quote, "This is a victory for the little guy. No one is above the law."
So is the Martha Stewart verdict really a victory for the little guys? We want to know what you think. Send us your thoughts to wam@CNN.com. We'll read some of them later in the show.
And the verdict is just the latest chapter in the long tale of Stewart's business and personal life. Today you can watch the story of the homemaking maven by watching "PEOPLE IN THE NEWS." That's at 5 p.m. Eastern right here on CNN.
The U.S. warns that economic sanctions against Syria are possible in the near future. Sanctions have been under consideration since November when Congress passed the Syria Accountability Act.
The exact nature and wording hasn't been finalized, but U.S. officials hinted late yesterday that something was in the works.
The sanctions are intended to punish Syria for, among other things, not doing enough to fight terrorism.
The U.S. today meantime trying to mend fences with its southern neighbor. Mexican President Vicente Fox is the guest this weekend at President Bush's Texas ranch.
And for more on that, CNN White House correspondent Dana Bash joins us from nearby Crawford, Texas.
Good morning.
DANA BASH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Erica.
And President Bush picked up President Vicente Fox here in Crawford, Texas, Texas-style in his white pickup truck, as the president went along with his wife to pick him up.
And start, really, what is a meeting that was supposed to happen a year and a half ago, but President Fox decided to cancel that meeting at the ranch, because he was protesting the Texas execution of a Mexican man.
That was just one of the many reasons why relations between the United States and Mexico and specifically these two men that were once very close had been frayed over the past couple of years.
Now, high on the list, of course, will be to try to mend those fences. But also high on the list in terms of policy will be immigration.
Of course, you remember that back in January before President Bush went to Mexico, he brought with him a new plan to allow illegal immigrants here in the United States to seek some temporary legal status if they do have a job. Many of the illegal immigrants are actually Mexican.
And President Fox was certainly very happy about that plan, but it really hasn't gone anywhere. Conservatives on Capitol Hill were not warm to it at all. It really landed with a thud in Congress. And Republican sources say that they couldn't expect to bring it up this year.
So we do expect President Fox to press the case, but he did make it clear before coming here that he understands the difficulties of getting it passed this election year.
Now another big issue is border security. President Fox has been quite upset about the fact that the U.S. has been fingerprinting and photographing Mexicans who are coming across the border for some routine visits to the United States. Senior officials have hinted in recent days that they are going to perhaps roll back some of those restrictions, making it easier for Mexicans to come across the border.
Aside from that, certainly NAFTA will be on the agenda. Water will be on the agenda, water rights.
But in general, officials tell us that we don't expect to have major new policy initiatives to come out of the summit. Instead, it's just a meeting between old friends and their wives. And we are told even that President Bush last night in their dinner was -- he actually caught the fish that they had in their dinner last night at his ranch here in Crawford.
Back to you.
HILL: How about that? I don't know if the Foxes were expecting that one when they came to Crawford. Good to have you with us. Thanks, Dana.
Looking and acting like the presumed presidential candidate, Democrat John Kerry is still campaigning hard. Yesterday he was in New Orleans. Today he'll be in Houston and San Antonio, ahead of Tuesday's primaries in Texas, Florida, Louisiana and Mississippi.
The Bush-Cheney campaign has already begun treating Kerry as the probable candidate, a distinction that Kerry is relishing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He went on TV and he said, if we had John Kerry's tax policies, we wouldn't have had the job growth we had in this country right now.
And I came here today to say, "You're darned right, Mr. Vice President. We'd have had real job growth. Americans would be working. That's exactly what we'd be doing."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ARENA: Kerry will deliver the Democratic radio address today. That's coming up in about three hours.
HILL: Republicans meantime are taking a swipe at anti-Bush ads produced and financed by the left leaning political group MoveOn.org. The Republican National Committee chief counsel fired off a letter to about 250 TV stations, alleging the ads were paid for in violation of a new campaign finance reform law.
Move On counters the ads were legally financed and the RNC letter was simply hardball politicking.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't think she's going to get time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why not?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because she's famous.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's too rich for that. Rich people don't go to jail.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ARENA: The verdict's in. Now the question looms, will Martha Stewart serve time in prison? Our legal eagles sort it all out.
HILL: Plus, take a look at this. Two women stranded, the details on this late night high water rescue when CNN SATURDAY MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ARENA: Today on "Weekend House Call," the state of Iraq's public health, almost one year after the war began, we have a progress report. Dr. Sanjay Gupta travels back to the country when CNN SATURDAY MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ARENA: Martha Stewart's conviction on obstruction of justice and other charges is the talk of the nation this morning. Her attorney vows to appeal.
But it's the possibility of jail time that Stewart and co- defendant Peter Bacanovic are likely thinking about.
Stewart's dilemma is the focus of this morning's "Legal Round Table." Former prosecutor Nelda Blair and civil liberties attorney John De Leon join us with their expert perspective on the case.
I want to thank you both for joining us.
JOHN DE LEON, CIVIL LIBERTIES ATTORNEY: Thank you, Kelli.
ARENA: Why don't we start with this whole concept of an appeal. I've heard many legal experts say the judge was very careful.
John, why don't you give me your opinion? Do you think that an appeal is possible? A successful appeal?
DE LEON: Well, you know, I think the appeal is going to go through. And one of the big issues I think the defense attorneys are going to be dealing with is the amount of evidence that came in about Martha Stewart which was unrelated to the actual sale of the stock.
I mean, we heard a lot of evidence about the -- about Martha and about how nasty she was, and some of the phone calls and such she made. And I think what the jurors said yesterday bears that out.
I mean, they were talking about, I believe, an arrogant Martha Stewart. And I think this case should not have been about Martha Stewart but about what she is alleged to have done. And I think that may be one of the bases for the appeal.
Do I think it will be a successful one? I don't know. Based on what I've heard and read so far, I think they'll have a difficult road to hoe.
ARENA: Nelda, let's talk about possible prison time for her. Obviously there are sentencing guidelines involved. What's your best guess?
NELDA BLAIR, FORMER PROSECUTOR: Well, she can receive up to five years and up to $1 million in fines, because each count carries a maximum $250,000 fine. Whether or not she will serve a prison sentence is the talk of the streets right now.
ARENA: Right.
BLAIR: But let me say, you know, this jury convicted a Martha Stewart that may have felt like she was above the law. Or some people felt like she was above the law. I believe that she will receive some jail time.
And I don't think it will be five years, but I think that, because there are so many counts, and they are important. I mean, this particular criminal act is a serious criminal act. Yes, I think she'll receive jail time.
DE LEON: Nelda, I think ironically what happened by her not testifying, which may have put her whole case in jeopardy, may actually help her, because if the jury would have rejected what she'd said, the judge could have taken that into consideration as her lying on the stand and not taking responsibility. And it could have made it worse for her in terms of sentencing.
ARENA: Well, let's talk about this. I mean, nobody has heard from Martha, yet...
BLAIR: I think that's important.
ARENA: ... in the courtroom. So is there something that she can do in a statement or something, that might help ease the pain of this prison time?
BLAIR: Sure, sure. She can certainly testify in the sentencing phase. There's no question about it. Whether or not they'll have her testify is another thing.
You know, every court observer says that Martha was calm, cool and collected all during the trial. She probably would have made a good witness. She's trained to talk to millions through a television camera. She probably could have been a model witness.
But remember, Martha had to get on that stand and tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. And in my opinion, that's what she could not do, because she would have helped convict herself.
DE LEON: That's true. She would have been in a catch-22, because in order for her to have won this case, she would have had to, according to what the jury's verdict would have been, would have been to have lied.
Now if she comes out and acts contrite and apologetic for what she did, that will help her in sentencing. It would not have helped her in her trial. It won't help her in her appeal.
BLAIR: And so far, she's not doing that.
ARENA: And lots of review, obviously, of the short amount of time that the defense spent, only one witness brought to the table.
BLAIR: In retrospect they certainly could have brought more people up. Of course, I hate to second-guess any defense lawyer, because once a guilty verdict is in, obviously hindsight is perfect.
I'm sure today they probably wish they brought more people onto the stand. They probably wish they had let Martha testify. But I think they felt like they had a good defense.
ARENA: All right.
DE LEON: I agree with Nelda...
ARENA: I'm going to switch gears on you -- I'm sorry.
DE LEON: Sure. ARENA: Because we need to talk about Scott Peterson. And obviously jury a big issue. What do you -- I mean, is there any hope for an objective jury in this case?
BLAIR: Absolutely. That's why the case was moved in the first place. There's almost half a million people that are potential jurors in this case. Sure there's hope for an unbiased jury. That's what we get in every courtroom that we -- across America, we have to choose among the people that may have heard something about the case.
DE LEON: What really happens is, I think, is that the prosecutors want a certain type of juror, and the defense attorneys want a certain type of juror. And they're going to bring their biases to the table, and we -- each side will want the biases that will help their side.
ARENA: Well, John, what type of jurors does the defense want?
DE LEON: Well, I think the defense really wants an independent juror, somebody who's not going to buy into everything that they're sold. They'll want a juror -- I think they'll want a juror who doesn't read, necessarily, you know, "People" magazine every week, who doesn't watch soap operas, who doesn't buy into the whole drama of the case and will look at the evidence to see if the prosecution will be able to prove their case, to not rely on the entire situation about the extramarital...
BLAIR: Kelli, the defense wants one thing. They want people who can get past the fact that Scott is a lying, cheating scoundrel of a husband.
DE LEON: That's true.
BLAIR: And once they get to that point, then they can possibly convince them that he's innocent.
DE LEON: Absolutely. I agree with that one 100 percent. And I think they can do it, and I think it depends on the types of jurors that they get.
BLAIR: And absolutely that. I will agree with that. But the defense has a tough time in this particular case.
ARENA: Well, let me ask you this. You know, when the jury pool was brought in, there was the first time that they could see Scott Peterson up close and personal. I'm told he smiled and said hello. This could very well be the only time that that jury hears from him.
BLAIR: It could be.
ARENA: Does that -- does that really matter, how he conducts himself in that little short...?
DE LEON: Absolutely.
BLAIR: Absolutely. And the reason is because those jurors are human just like you and I, and they're going to form an opinion about his air, his acts, his talk, his way of carrying himself, the way he appears to them.
They're going to form an opinion about him, and it's going to color whatever they hear in that trial.
DE LEON: And I'm sure people are going to...
ARENA: You know what guys? I'm sorry. We have -- we will be watching this for a long time. But I'm out of time. And I want to thank you both for joining us this morning.
DE LEON: Thank you for having us.
ARENA: Take care.
DE LEON: Bye.
HILL: Windy weather tears across the Midwest. Will it die down today? Rob Marciano is here with the forecast.
ARENA: Plus what you are saying this morning about yesterday's Martha Stewart verdict.
HILL: But first, picture this, the look of joy on the face of this 12-year-old Iraqi girl as she gives a warm hug to her new best friend, Taylor.
Mara Atami's (ph) home north of Baghdad was hit by a U.S. mortar last November. She lost five family members and is partially paralyzed. The Iraqi girl is recovering in Washington at the national rehabilitation hospital, where she met Taylor, a therapy dog.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HILL: This was no fun water ride. It's, in fact two women being pulled through water after the car they were riding in was washed off a road in Kansas City, Missouri.
The pair used a cell phone to call for help and -- get this -- waited for two hours on top of their car before being pulled to safety on Friday. Neither of them were hurt.
ARENA: Talk about braving the elements. This is the result of some pretty high winds in Amherst, Ohio. The whopping winds sent a tree crashing into a car and blew over a gas station sign.
The car's driver says that she narrowly escaped danger.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am just so glad and thankful that I wasn't inside. Nobody got hurt.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(WEATHER REPORT)
HILL: Time for a quick check of the headlines.
President Bush and Mexican President Vicente Fox are meeting for the second straight day in Crawford, Texas. They are expected to focus on President Bush's immigration proposals, as well as holding trade discussions.
It took the jury just 12 hours of deliberations to find Martha Stewart guilty on all four counts. Legal analysts say that she'll likely be sentenced to a year or two in prison. Sentencing is scheduled for June 17.
And we have the results of our question of the day: "Is the Martha Stewart verdict a victory for the little guys?"
Well, we heard from A. Giovanni in West Haven, Connecticut. He said, "Martha was one of the little guys who made something of herself in this country. I think that some of the women on that jury were and are jealous of that. Whatever may have occurred between Martha and her broker is happening daily on Wall Street."
And now coming to us from Dorothy and Charles, who say, "a.k.a. the little guys." They tell us, "We're disgusted and appalled at the jury which boasts of having struck a blow for the 'little guy.' What an ugly joke. Shame on the government and its nasty little surrogates!"
And with that, we're going to turn our attention back to Baghdad now.
Nearly one year after the start of the war, Dr. Sanjay Gupta travels back to Iraq and shows you the state of Iraq's public health. That is straight ahead for you on "Weekend House Call."
And at 9 a.m. Eastern, the house that Martha built. What effect will the domestic diva's conviction have on the Martha Stewart brand?
And coming up at 9:45 a.m. Eastern, 14 foods that will change your life. We're talking super foods, and we'll tell you exactly what they are.
That's all ahead when CNN SATURDAY MORNING continues.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
President Visits with Bush in Texas; Legal Round Table Weighs in on Martha Stewart, Scott Peterson>
Aired March 6, 2004 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ERICA HILL, ANCHOR: The next hour of CNN SATURDAY MORNING begins right now.
Coming to you live from the CNN center in Atlanta this is CNN SATURDAY MORNING. It is March 6, and good to have you with us. Good morning. I'm Erica Hill.
KELLI ARENA, ANCHOR: And I'm Kelli Arena. Thanks for being with us.
Well, here is what's ahead this hour. Martha Stewart leaves court a convicted felon, and experts say that she'll likely spend time in prison. We go live to New York for details on what happens next.
Jury selection is underway in the Scott Peterson trial. We'll analyze the process in our legal brief segment.
And it is time for a medical checkup in Iraq. "Weekend House Call" takes a look at the country's health system.
HILL: First now, a check of the headlines at this hour.
Death and violence in the Middle East from Gaza's Erez Crossing into Israel. Palestinian gunman attacked an Israeli military post. The Israelis killed one of the attackers. The other gunman blew up his Jeep, killing three Palestinian security officers. No Israeli casualties were reported.
Some U.S. Marines have moved out from the Haitian capital in an effort to provide security in former rebel strongholds in the northern and western parts of the country. The Marines are deployed as part of an international peacekeeping force.
And Attorney General John Ashcroft is still in intense care at a Washington hospital, being treated with antibiotics and painkillers. Ashcroft was hospitalized on Thursday night, suffering from severe gallstone pancreatitis. A specialist says patients with the condition are often hospitalized for a month or longer.
ARENA: Our top story this hour: a jury says that she lied, conspired and obstructed justice, and now she's fighting to clear her name.
After being found guilty of the four counts against her, homemaking maven Martha Stewart says that she plans to appeal.
CNN's Allan Chernoff has been following the trial, and he joins us live from New York with the very latest -- Allan.
ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Kelli.
And Martha Stewart did walk down the courthouse steps behind me yesterday afternoon a convicted felon, the jury determining that Stewart and her co-defendant, stockbroker Peter Bacanovic, had lied about the true reason for the sale of ImClone stock back in December of 2001.
Stewart and Bacanovic had claimed the reason she sold was simply they had an agreement to sell if the stock fell below $60 a share. The jury decided that was a cover story, and the true reason was that Stewart had been tipped that the former chief executive of ImClone was trying to dump his shares, and Stewart sold as soon as she found that out.
Now, in court Judge Miriam Cedarbaum read the verdict. Four times she said "guilty." Martha Stewart showed no emotion at all. The emotion actually came from the lead prosecutor, Karen Seymour, who was holding back tears.
Now, sentencing has been set for June 17. And Martha Stewart faces a theoretical maximum of 20 years, but the federal guidelines actually say it's closer to a maximum of three years. Many legal analysts are talking about one year. It really will be up to the judge after she does get a sentencing memo from the probation department.
Martha Stewart's attorney says that he is intending to appeal. He said he considers this losing the first round, and he said it's onto the next round -- Kelli.
ARENA: Alan, a lot of Monday morning quarterbacking going on. You spent all that time in the courtroom. Do you think that it was a mistake that the defense was so short?
CHERNOFF: Robert Morvillo said he put on a minimal defense, because he believed that the government had not proved its charges. But clearly the jury felt quite differently. And 20/20 hindsight, it clearly does seem to have been at least somewhat of a mistake not to have put on more of a case.
Morvillo had only one witness on the stand, and that was an attorney who was present who took notes when Martha Stewart was interviewed by the Securities and Exchange Commission and the U.S. attorney's office.
Clearly, Morvillo could have brought more witnesses to the stand. It's debatable, though, whether or not Martha Stewart taking the stand would have actually helped her case -- Kelli.
ARENA: All right. Allan Chernoff, thanks for joining us this morning. HILL: And on the subject of that, 12 people, 12 hours. That's how many and how long it took to decide the domestic diva's fate. One juror was asked if it mattered that Stewart didn't stake the stand in her own defense.
He said the mountain of evidence was against her.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHAPPELL HARTRIDGE, JUROR: If we had enough evidence, it didn't make a difference if Martha would have gone on and said something to the contrary. It didn't phase me one way or the other what she had to say.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: In a blunt message to the investment community, one juror also said, quote, "This is a victory for the little guy. No one is above the law."
So is the Martha Stewart verdict really a victory for the little guys? We want to know what you think. Send us your thoughts to wam@CNN.com. We'll read some of them later in the show.
And the verdict is just the latest chapter in the long tale of Stewart's business and personal life. Today you can watch the story of the homemaking maven by watching "PEOPLE IN THE NEWS." That's at 5 p.m. Eastern right here on CNN.
The U.S. warns that economic sanctions against Syria are possible in the near future. Sanctions have been under consideration since November when Congress passed the Syria Accountability Act.
The exact nature and wording hasn't been finalized, but U.S. officials hinted late yesterday that something was in the works.
The sanctions are intended to punish Syria for, among other things, not doing enough to fight terrorism.
The U.S. today meantime trying to mend fences with its southern neighbor. Mexican President Vicente Fox is the guest this weekend at President Bush's Texas ranch.
And for more on that, CNN White House correspondent Dana Bash joins us from nearby Crawford, Texas.
Good morning.
DANA BASH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Erica.
And President Bush picked up President Vicente Fox here in Crawford, Texas, Texas-style in his white pickup truck, as the president went along with his wife to pick him up.
And start, really, what is a meeting that was supposed to happen a year and a half ago, but President Fox decided to cancel that meeting at the ranch, because he was protesting the Texas execution of a Mexican man.
That was just one of the many reasons why relations between the United States and Mexico and specifically these two men that were once very close had been frayed over the past couple of years.
Now, high on the list, of course, will be to try to mend those fences. But also high on the list in terms of policy will be immigration.
Of course, you remember that back in January before President Bush went to Mexico, he brought with him a new plan to allow illegal immigrants here in the United States to seek some temporary legal status if they do have a job. Many of the illegal immigrants are actually Mexican.
And President Fox was certainly very happy about that plan, but it really hasn't gone anywhere. Conservatives on Capitol Hill were not warm to it at all. It really landed with a thud in Congress. And Republican sources say that they couldn't expect to bring it up this year.
So we do expect President Fox to press the case, but he did make it clear before coming here that he understands the difficulties of getting it passed this election year.
Now another big issue is border security. President Fox has been quite upset about the fact that the U.S. has been fingerprinting and photographing Mexicans who are coming across the border for some routine visits to the United States. Senior officials have hinted in recent days that they are going to perhaps roll back some of those restrictions, making it easier for Mexicans to come across the border.
Aside from that, certainly NAFTA will be on the agenda. Water will be on the agenda, water rights.
But in general, officials tell us that we don't expect to have major new policy initiatives to come out of the summit. Instead, it's just a meeting between old friends and their wives. And we are told even that President Bush last night in their dinner was -- he actually caught the fish that they had in their dinner last night at his ranch here in Crawford.
Back to you.
HILL: How about that? I don't know if the Foxes were expecting that one when they came to Crawford. Good to have you with us. Thanks, Dana.
Looking and acting like the presumed presidential candidate, Democrat John Kerry is still campaigning hard. Yesterday he was in New Orleans. Today he'll be in Houston and San Antonio, ahead of Tuesday's primaries in Texas, Florida, Louisiana and Mississippi.
The Bush-Cheney campaign has already begun treating Kerry as the probable candidate, a distinction that Kerry is relishing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He went on TV and he said, if we had John Kerry's tax policies, we wouldn't have had the job growth we had in this country right now.
And I came here today to say, "You're darned right, Mr. Vice President. We'd have had real job growth. Americans would be working. That's exactly what we'd be doing."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ARENA: Kerry will deliver the Democratic radio address today. That's coming up in about three hours.
HILL: Republicans meantime are taking a swipe at anti-Bush ads produced and financed by the left leaning political group MoveOn.org. The Republican National Committee chief counsel fired off a letter to about 250 TV stations, alleging the ads were paid for in violation of a new campaign finance reform law.
Move On counters the ads were legally financed and the RNC letter was simply hardball politicking.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't think she's going to get time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why not?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because she's famous.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's too rich for that. Rich people don't go to jail.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ARENA: The verdict's in. Now the question looms, will Martha Stewart serve time in prison? Our legal eagles sort it all out.
HILL: Plus, take a look at this. Two women stranded, the details on this late night high water rescue when CNN SATURDAY MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ARENA: Today on "Weekend House Call," the state of Iraq's public health, almost one year after the war began, we have a progress report. Dr. Sanjay Gupta travels back to the country when CNN SATURDAY MORNING continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ARENA: Martha Stewart's conviction on obstruction of justice and other charges is the talk of the nation this morning. Her attorney vows to appeal.
But it's the possibility of jail time that Stewart and co- defendant Peter Bacanovic are likely thinking about.
Stewart's dilemma is the focus of this morning's "Legal Round Table." Former prosecutor Nelda Blair and civil liberties attorney John De Leon join us with their expert perspective on the case.
I want to thank you both for joining us.
JOHN DE LEON, CIVIL LIBERTIES ATTORNEY: Thank you, Kelli.
ARENA: Why don't we start with this whole concept of an appeal. I've heard many legal experts say the judge was very careful.
John, why don't you give me your opinion? Do you think that an appeal is possible? A successful appeal?
DE LEON: Well, you know, I think the appeal is going to go through. And one of the big issues I think the defense attorneys are going to be dealing with is the amount of evidence that came in about Martha Stewart which was unrelated to the actual sale of the stock.
I mean, we heard a lot of evidence about the -- about Martha and about how nasty she was, and some of the phone calls and such she made. And I think what the jurors said yesterday bears that out.
I mean, they were talking about, I believe, an arrogant Martha Stewart. And I think this case should not have been about Martha Stewart but about what she is alleged to have done. And I think that may be one of the bases for the appeal.
Do I think it will be a successful one? I don't know. Based on what I've heard and read so far, I think they'll have a difficult road to hoe.
ARENA: Nelda, let's talk about possible prison time for her. Obviously there are sentencing guidelines involved. What's your best guess?
NELDA BLAIR, FORMER PROSECUTOR: Well, she can receive up to five years and up to $1 million in fines, because each count carries a maximum $250,000 fine. Whether or not she will serve a prison sentence is the talk of the streets right now.
ARENA: Right.
BLAIR: But let me say, you know, this jury convicted a Martha Stewart that may have felt like she was above the law. Or some people felt like she was above the law. I believe that she will receive some jail time.
And I don't think it will be five years, but I think that, because there are so many counts, and they are important. I mean, this particular criminal act is a serious criminal act. Yes, I think she'll receive jail time.
DE LEON: Nelda, I think ironically what happened by her not testifying, which may have put her whole case in jeopardy, may actually help her, because if the jury would have rejected what she'd said, the judge could have taken that into consideration as her lying on the stand and not taking responsibility. And it could have made it worse for her in terms of sentencing.
ARENA: Well, let's talk about this. I mean, nobody has heard from Martha, yet...
BLAIR: I think that's important.
ARENA: ... in the courtroom. So is there something that she can do in a statement or something, that might help ease the pain of this prison time?
BLAIR: Sure, sure. She can certainly testify in the sentencing phase. There's no question about it. Whether or not they'll have her testify is another thing.
You know, every court observer says that Martha was calm, cool and collected all during the trial. She probably would have made a good witness. She's trained to talk to millions through a television camera. She probably could have been a model witness.
But remember, Martha had to get on that stand and tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. And in my opinion, that's what she could not do, because she would have helped convict herself.
DE LEON: That's true. She would have been in a catch-22, because in order for her to have won this case, she would have had to, according to what the jury's verdict would have been, would have been to have lied.
Now if she comes out and acts contrite and apologetic for what she did, that will help her in sentencing. It would not have helped her in her trial. It won't help her in her appeal.
BLAIR: And so far, she's not doing that.
ARENA: And lots of review, obviously, of the short amount of time that the defense spent, only one witness brought to the table.
BLAIR: In retrospect they certainly could have brought more people up. Of course, I hate to second-guess any defense lawyer, because once a guilty verdict is in, obviously hindsight is perfect.
I'm sure today they probably wish they brought more people onto the stand. They probably wish they had let Martha testify. But I think they felt like they had a good defense.
ARENA: All right.
DE LEON: I agree with Nelda...
ARENA: I'm going to switch gears on you -- I'm sorry.
DE LEON: Sure. ARENA: Because we need to talk about Scott Peterson. And obviously jury a big issue. What do you -- I mean, is there any hope for an objective jury in this case?
BLAIR: Absolutely. That's why the case was moved in the first place. There's almost half a million people that are potential jurors in this case. Sure there's hope for an unbiased jury. That's what we get in every courtroom that we -- across America, we have to choose among the people that may have heard something about the case.
DE LEON: What really happens is, I think, is that the prosecutors want a certain type of juror, and the defense attorneys want a certain type of juror. And they're going to bring their biases to the table, and we -- each side will want the biases that will help their side.
ARENA: Well, John, what type of jurors does the defense want?
DE LEON: Well, I think the defense really wants an independent juror, somebody who's not going to buy into everything that they're sold. They'll want a juror -- I think they'll want a juror who doesn't read, necessarily, you know, "People" magazine every week, who doesn't watch soap operas, who doesn't buy into the whole drama of the case and will look at the evidence to see if the prosecution will be able to prove their case, to not rely on the entire situation about the extramarital...
BLAIR: Kelli, the defense wants one thing. They want people who can get past the fact that Scott is a lying, cheating scoundrel of a husband.
DE LEON: That's true.
BLAIR: And once they get to that point, then they can possibly convince them that he's innocent.
DE LEON: Absolutely. I agree with that one 100 percent. And I think they can do it, and I think it depends on the types of jurors that they get.
BLAIR: And absolutely that. I will agree with that. But the defense has a tough time in this particular case.
ARENA: Well, let me ask you this. You know, when the jury pool was brought in, there was the first time that they could see Scott Peterson up close and personal. I'm told he smiled and said hello. This could very well be the only time that that jury hears from him.
BLAIR: It could be.
ARENA: Does that -- does that really matter, how he conducts himself in that little short...?
DE LEON: Absolutely.
BLAIR: Absolutely. And the reason is because those jurors are human just like you and I, and they're going to form an opinion about his air, his acts, his talk, his way of carrying himself, the way he appears to them.
They're going to form an opinion about him, and it's going to color whatever they hear in that trial.
DE LEON: And I'm sure people are going to...
ARENA: You know what guys? I'm sorry. We have -- we will be watching this for a long time. But I'm out of time. And I want to thank you both for joining us this morning.
DE LEON: Thank you for having us.
ARENA: Take care.
DE LEON: Bye.
HILL: Windy weather tears across the Midwest. Will it die down today? Rob Marciano is here with the forecast.
ARENA: Plus what you are saying this morning about yesterday's Martha Stewart verdict.
HILL: But first, picture this, the look of joy on the face of this 12-year-old Iraqi girl as she gives a warm hug to her new best friend, Taylor.
Mara Atami's (ph) home north of Baghdad was hit by a U.S. mortar last November. She lost five family members and is partially paralyzed. The Iraqi girl is recovering in Washington at the national rehabilitation hospital, where she met Taylor, a therapy dog.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HILL: This was no fun water ride. It's, in fact two women being pulled through water after the car they were riding in was washed off a road in Kansas City, Missouri.
The pair used a cell phone to call for help and -- get this -- waited for two hours on top of their car before being pulled to safety on Friday. Neither of them were hurt.
ARENA: Talk about braving the elements. This is the result of some pretty high winds in Amherst, Ohio. The whopping winds sent a tree crashing into a car and blew over a gas station sign.
The car's driver says that she narrowly escaped danger.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am just so glad and thankful that I wasn't inside. Nobody got hurt.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(WEATHER REPORT)
HILL: Time for a quick check of the headlines.
President Bush and Mexican President Vicente Fox are meeting for the second straight day in Crawford, Texas. They are expected to focus on President Bush's immigration proposals, as well as holding trade discussions.
It took the jury just 12 hours of deliberations to find Martha Stewart guilty on all four counts. Legal analysts say that she'll likely be sentenced to a year or two in prison. Sentencing is scheduled for June 17.
And we have the results of our question of the day: "Is the Martha Stewart verdict a victory for the little guys?"
Well, we heard from A. Giovanni in West Haven, Connecticut. He said, "Martha was one of the little guys who made something of herself in this country. I think that some of the women on that jury were and are jealous of that. Whatever may have occurred between Martha and her broker is happening daily on Wall Street."
And now coming to us from Dorothy and Charles, who say, "a.k.a. the little guys." They tell us, "We're disgusted and appalled at the jury which boasts of having struck a blow for the 'little guy.' What an ugly joke. Shame on the government and its nasty little surrogates!"
And with that, we're going to turn our attention back to Baghdad now.
Nearly one year after the start of the war, Dr. Sanjay Gupta travels back to Iraq and shows you the state of Iraq's public health. That is straight ahead for you on "Weekend House Call."
And at 9 a.m. Eastern, the house that Martha built. What effect will the domestic diva's conviction have on the Martha Stewart brand?
And coming up at 9:45 a.m. Eastern, 14 foods that will change your life. We're talking super foods, and we'll tell you exactly what they are.
That's all ahead when CNN SATURDAY MORNING continues.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
President Visits with Bush in Texas; Legal Round Table Weighs in on Martha Stewart, Scott Peterson>
