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CNN Saturday Morning News

Bernard Kerik has Withdrawn Himself From Consideration; Is the New Intelligence Bill to Far Reaching

Aired December 11, 2004 - 09:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BETTY NGUYEN, CNN ANCHOR: Well, good morning, everyone. From the CNN Center in Atlanta, this is CNN SATURDAY MORNING. I'm Betty Nguyen.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Tony Harris. If you're just waking up on the West Coast, the clock says 6:00 a.m.

Let's get started with the day's headlines.

Bernard Kerik has abruptly withdrawn himself as President Bush's nominee for homeland security secretary, citing, quote, "personal reasons." Kerik is a former New York City police commissioner. Now there's a scramble at the White House for a new homeland security candidate. We'll go there live in a minute.

Pakistani authorities have made an arrest in the kidnapping of three U.N. aid workers in neighboring Afghanistan. The three were released November 23 after nearly a month in captivity. Officials say the suspect arrested in Karachi is the leader of a Taliban splinter group.

Yasser Arafat's nephew has given his uncle's medical records to Palestinian Authority officials. The late Palestinian leader died in a Paris hospital November 11, but the official cause of death was never released.

And it's a quiet weekend for jurors in the Scott Peterson murder trial. They are sequestered in a hotel in Redwood City, California, after finishing their first full day of deliberations. They're deciding whether Peterson should get life in prison or death for killing his wife and unborn son. Deliberations resume on Monday.

NGUYEN: Here's what we've got coming up for you today.

Hopes fade in the northern Philippines. The search for survivors is ending after recent storms leave hundreds dead. We will have a live report.

Also, he is the nation's top doc. What are the surgeon general's biggest concerns about the health of American kids? We'll find out in The Novak Zone.

And security versus privacy. The nation ushers in new intelligence reforms, and that means more eyes may be on you. HARRIS: Our top story this hour, a job opening and what you might call a want ad. President Bush is looking for yet another person to fill the job of homeland security secretary after Bernard Kerik withdraw his name from consideration to lead the department.

More on this story now from CNN's Elaine Quijano, live at the White House. Good morning, Elaine.

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Tony.

That's right. No word yet on whom the White House might tap next to be the next homeland security chief. But this news really coming as a surprise, because all day long yesterday, White House officials both on the record and also on background were saying that they were not worried about Bernard Kerik's confirmation process.

Now, this morning, as President Bush left the White House, he made no comment about the Kerik situation.

But it was last night, of course, that the White House announced that he was withdrawing, that Kerik was withdrawing his name from consideration, and the reason given by Kerik was the questionable immigration status of a nanny.

Now, in his statement last night, the White House said Kerik was withdrawing his name for personal reasons, that the president respects his decision and wishes Kerik and his wife well. Kerik, of course, you see there, nominated about a week ago. Former New York City police commissioner was tapped to replace the outgoing homeland security secretary, Tom Ridge.

Now, in his statement, Kerik said that in the course of completing documents that were required for Senate confirmation, he discovered the information about the nanny, and in his letter to President Bush, Kerik said that he was "convinced that, for personal reasons, moving forward would not be in the best interests" of the Bush administration, the Department of Homeland Security, or the American people.

Now, there had been questions raised separately about Kerik's involvement with Taser International, a stun-gun manufacturing company, through which Kerik earned millions of dollars in stock options by selling those stock options. But yesterday, White House officials said they had a high degree of confidence that officials had thoroughly looked at that particular issue.

And Tony, they said they were quite confident about the vetting process that had been put into place. But again, this news coming as quite a surprise last night, the announcement coming here from the White House, Tony.

HARRIS: OK, and Elaine, just to be clear about this, this is the decision that, at this point, we believe that Kerik made on his own, and that he was not forced into this decision?

QUIJANO: That's exactly right. There is nothing to indicate, at this point, that the White House asked him to withdraw his name from consideration. The decision, in fact, the letter coming from Kerik, we understand there was a phone call that was made to the White House around 8:30 last night. And then the White House coming out after that with this statement, a very short statement, which I just mentioned a short time ago.

And at this point, no indication that Kerik himself was asked to withdraw his name, but I'm certain that we'll hear more details in the days to come, Tony.

HARRIS: For sure. Elaine Quijano at the White House. Elaine, thank you.

NGUYEN: Now to the latest on the fight for Iraq.

Two high-ranking officials in Iraq's interior ministry were gunned down this morning in southwestern Baghdad. The two colonels worked in a criminal intelligence department. Their car was sprayed with bullets as they were going to work.

Army Staff Sergeant Johnny Horn (ph), Jr., has been sentenced to three years in prison after pleading guilty to killing a severely wounded Iraqi civilian. Horn will also get a dishonorable discharge. An investigator said the wounded civilian was in a burning truck, and he was shot to, quote, "put him out of his misery."

HARRIS: And time now to update you on the week's major developments in the war on terror.

A judge has awarded $156 million to the parents of an American teenager gunned down by Hamas militants in the West Bank. It is one of the first jury awards against U.S.-based organizations accused of supporting terrorism. The suit was filed against three Islamic charity organizations and another group accused of raising money for Hamas.

And Minnesota will begin issuing a unique driver's license designed to stop counterfeiters. The licenses have a reflective image that appears to float above and below the card when it is tilted. Since the 9/11 attacks, the practice of making fake licenses has received much greater scrutiny. That's because counterfeit ID cards made it possible for the hijackers to board commercial flights.

NGUYEN: In the Philippines, a half-million people are coming to grips with the grim and soggy reality that now surrounds them. Massive storms have turned the region into a huge mud pit. Searchers do not expect to find any more survivors after rescuing a woman and three children 10 days after they were buried alive by a landslide.

CNN's Aneesh Raman joins us now from Manila with an update on a desperate humanitarian situation there. Hi, there, Aneesh.

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Betty, good morning to you.

The office of civil defense here now upgrading the death toll substantially for the third consecutive day. Numbers that we just got have the death toll at 1,060, the number injured hovering around 1,000. Officials say that is to be expected in the days ahead. As the situation stabilizes, that death toll will continue to increase substantially.

Now, just a few hours ago, we returned from the ground zero of this relief effort. It's the eastern province of Kaezan (ph) about 40 miles outside of Manila. We went and visited the two hardest-hit towns of Riyal (ph) and Infanta (ph), and there the people are quite literally digging their way out. Mind you, it's been about two weeks since the last storm passed through, but everything is just covered with mud.

The people we spoke to, some were in complete shock, just now realizing the implications of what lies ahead for them. Others jovial, realizing that the worst is behind them. But a good number are still in that survival mode, gathering up their belongings and trying to find their loved ones.

Now, the focus of everything is the relief effort. Some 600 U.S. Marines and Navy personnel are in country. They have come from Japan. They're helping -- (audio interrupt) ... the only way in and out is by helicopter. And when the weather is bad, the helicopters can't fly, the supplies can't land. Today was one of those days.

So for these people on the ground, they've survived the worst, but what lies ahead will be difficult as well, Betty.

NGUYEN: All right, CNN's Aneesh Raman in Manila for us today. Thank you, Aneesh. Tony?

HARRIS: In news across America now, if you own a Dodge Durango SUV or a Dodge Dakota pickup, you may want to visit your dealer. DaimlerChrysler is recalling 600,000 of the vehicles from model years 2000 through 2003. A safety investigation shows they have a defect that could cause the wheels to fall off. Nearly 72,000 2004 Durangos are also being recalled because of a cable problem that could cause an engine fire.

In Virginia, a close call and some fast footwork. An SUV skids out of control on a wet highway -- look at this -- narrowly missing a man working nearby. The man says he ducked when he got a glimpse of the truck hurtling his way. It came within a foot or two of his head. Both the SUV driver and the highway worker escaped without injury.

In Oregon, two men have a bridge to sell you. Police say two thieves stole the metal guard rails off this bridge and sold the scraps for drugs. Police say the money they raised helped fund suspected drug dealers.

And a common situation, at least to a novel idea. The book is called "My Dad Is Going Away, but He Will Be Back One Day." Its 16 pages help children in military families cope when a parent is away on duty serving for long periods. James Thomas, a helicopter pilot and his wife, Melanie, of Virginia wrote the book. It's available at several online stores. NGUYEN: Well, we know there are many who feel protecting America's borders should start with stricter control over who gets a driver's license. Well, is that the next step for intelligence reform? Expanded coverage of what's in that bill right here on CNN SATURDAY MORNING.

HARRIS: Plus, the health of the nation's children. Meet the man in charge of getting young America off the couch and into the gym. The U.S. surgeon general in The Novak Zone.

ORELON SIDNEY, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Well, I'm Orelon Sidney, and this is a look at the big storm that's headed across the eastern United States. Lots of rain and snow here. But it looks great in San Francisco. You're going to see a good day. Skies will be cloudy to partly cloudy today, a high of 63. I think we even have a picture of the Bay Bridge this morning with your current temperature at 54 degrees. Enjoy it.

Music from the Hives this morning. We'll take a look at the rest of your weather in about 15 minutes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

HARRIS: And this just in to CNN. Doctors are speaking in Vienna right now in Austria, and they are updating reporters on the condition of opposition leader in the Ukraine, Viktor Yushchenko. And you'll remember that Yushchenko has been claiming for a long time that the disfiguring that you see in his face here, you see the before picture from July of '04 and the most recent picture of Yushchenko, he has claimed that the disfiguring that you see on his face is from poisoning.

And we can confirm that doctors, speaking right now, briefing reporters in Vienna, are saying that there is no doubt he was poisoned by dioxin. And this is from a doctor that you see who is speaking right now live at a press briefing.

And we're also getting information -- we don't know at this point whether the poisoning was deliberate. But you'll remember that Yushchenko is saying and claiming that the poisoning was deliberate, and that it was brought on by his enemies, who were trying to steal the November 21 runoff election from him.

And as you know, the supreme court has invalidated that election and has set new elections for December 26.

Once again, this is breaking news in to CNN. Viktor Yushchenko's doctors in Vienna are confirming that the opposition presidential candidate was poisoned, no doubt, words from the doctor, no doubt he was poisoned by dioxin.

And we will continue to follow this story and bring you additional information...

NGUYEN: Yes, no doubt this is going to...

HARRIS: ... as it comes in.

NGUYEN: ... cause an investigation as to who poisoned him and how this came about.

But right now, we want to get the latest information on the weather outside this morning as you're waking up out there. Orelon Sidney joins us with a look at that. You said 15 minutes, Orelon...

HARRIS: We couldn't wait that long.

NGUYEN: ... it's been, what, five?

HARRIS: We couldn't wait that long.

(LAUGHTER)

SIDNEY: Fifteen minutes, give or take 12.

NGUYEN: Yes.

HARRIS: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

(LAUGHTER)

(WEATHER FORECAST)

HARRIS: The Hives.

SIDNEY: The Hives.

NGUYEN: Yes, on this show, it's not a bad thing to have the Hives.

(LAUGHTER)

SIDNEY: I'm going to go get some Ovino (ph). I'll be right back.

NGUYEN: OK...

HARRIS: OK.

NGUYEN: ... you do that. Thank you, Orelon.

SIDNEY: You're welcome.

HARRIS: We'll take a break, and we'll come back with more CNN SATURDAY MORNING after this, OK?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NGUYEN: Well, it's not always easy to do the right thing, but the ethics guy is here to help. Send your e-mails to the ethics guy at CNN.com. Bruce Weinstein, the ethics guy, will be here to answer all of your questions at noon Eastern today.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

HARRIS: We're going to spend about a next five, six, maybe even 10 minutes, though, on our top story this hour.

As we told you just a couple of minutes ago, was breaking news just in to CNN, Ukraine opposition presidential candidate Viktor Yushchenko was, now, in fact, poisoned. That coming from doctors in Vienna who have been treating him on and off for a while now.

You can take a look at the pictures for yourself, the before picture of Yushchenko and the after picture after the poisoning.

Now, you know that he has long maintained that the reason for the disfiguring was as a result of poisoning, and he blamed it on opposition, his enemies who were trying to deny him the presidency of the Ukraine.

And you take a look at these pictures right now of Yushchenko during rallies that have been held over the last month in Ukraine.

He claimed that he was poisoned by the opposition and enemies who wanted to keep him from the presidency.

Let's bring in Jill Dougherty, who has been following this story for what seems like the last month, month and a half, who is in Moscow right now.

And Jill, this is the confirmation of what Viktor Yushchenko has been saying for quite a while now.

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN MOSCOW BUREAU CHIEF (on phone): It is, Tony. The doctors in Vienna are saying that there is no doubt that he was poisoned with dioxin. Now, the big question still remaining is, how did it happen? Who did it? Was it deliberate?

He, but Mr. Yushchenko has said, in fact, he said it to us when we were there speaking with him in Ukraine, he said that he always felt the aim was to kill him, that it was an act of a political settling of scores. And now the doctors in that clinic, to which he went right after he became sick back in September, they're confirming it's dioxin. And that would explain some of that very, very severe scarring that you see on his face.

Just a few months ago, he was a very young-looking, very attractive 50-year-old, and now he looks like an old man. His face is completely scarred. It has lesions and is, from political experience, I can tell you, it's dark and quite frightening. But that's the latest, Tony.

HARRIS: Yes.

NGUYEN: Yes, the before and after, Jill, is quite shocking, really, to look at the pictures here. This is a man who was known for his movie-star looks. And then you look at him in this December 6 photo that we're putting up on the screen right now. You can see the discoloration on his face and the pockmarks.

Give us an idea of the timeline. Where was Yushchenko just before he became ill? Can you trace back to where he was, and possibly put the pieces together as to who may have been involved, if someone indeed was involved in this poisoning?

DOUGHERTY: Well, he was out to dinner. And that is the night, really, when this happened. And his suspicion has already always been that whoever it was introduced that in some way into his food. But...

HARRIS: Yes.

DOUGHERTY: ... that's still surmisal at this point.

But he feels that he got it that way, and his wife, who, by the way, is an American citizen, said just recently that she tasted some type of metal thing on his lips when he came home that night. And then the next day he became violently ill. Really been a very a serious thing for him.

HARRIS: Well let's, you know, I just pulled up some information on dioxin as we take a look at the live picture from Vienna of the doctors holding that press briefing for reporters. And Jill, I just pulled up some information on dioxin. Let me read a little bit of this. It is the name of a family of chemical compounds that are unintentional byproducts of certain industrial, nonindustrial, and natural processes.

But more to the point that you were just making, 95 percent of human exposure to dioxin is through the diet. Exposure levels are generally more a function of what you eat, to your point, rather than where you live. So it seems to support at least the claim being made right now that this was a poisoning done through Yushchenko's diet and through his food.

DOUGHERTY: Right. But again, nobody really knows, at this stage, at least, how that was done, exactly by whom, where did they get it? You know, the doctors were really stumped on this...

HARRIS: Yes.

DOUGHERTY: ... ever since he went to the hospital back in September. They ran tests. But then he felt he had to get back on the campaign trail. He went back. They didn't complete the tests. They wanted to do more studies.

And finally, now that things have kind of quieted down, there's going to be another election on December 26, he felt that it was safe to go back to Vienna. And this time, they really did a big 24-hour workup on him with nuclear medicine, blood tests, et cetera. So they feel very confident in what they're saying right now.

NGUYEN: OK, Jill. So now that the doctors have said, yes, this is a result of dioxin, does it give them an idea of how to treat this? And can you cure what has happened to him? DOUGHERTY: Well, his doctors have said that actually the worst in the physical sense could be over, that initially, when he came in, his internal organs, especially his digestive tract, were literally ulcerated. And that has really gone back to some type of pretty normal situation.

And don't forget, he's been keeping up a really intense campaign schedule and apparently doing pretty well with that. So overall, as he told me, his health is getting back to normal. But it's this terrible scarring...

NGUYEN: Right.

DOUGHERTY: ... and that could take, experts say, maybe even two to three years to go.

NGUYEN: Well, Jill, we want to pause for just a minute and let our viewers hear what the doctors had to say today about Yushchenko's condition.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): After having completed our examination, which we have conducted in the course of the past 24 hours, as well as after having conducted a series blood tests, there is no doubt about the fact that Mr. Yushchenko's disease has been caused by a case of poisoning based on dioxin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: And Jill, there's the announcement from the doctors. I've got to ask you a political question. What does this mean now, now that this poisoning has been confirmed? How does this change the dynamics on the ground politically, do you think?

DOUGHERTY: Well, I would think that, of course, it would increase support for him. His supporters will be furious. They already felt that this was the case, and here, at least, is half the proof that definitely he was poisoned. Who did it, they don't know.

But it's going to increase (UNINTELLIGIBLE) lot, I think, the questioning, where did it come from, who did it? And they will be determined to find that out.

HARRIS: OK, Jill Dougherty reporting for us live this morning from Moscow. Jill, thank you.

NGUYEN: Well, does the massive intelligence reform put your personal liberties at stake? Will you lose some of your privacy once the bill is signed?

HARRIS: One of the many questions many people have as the president prepares to approve the most sweeping changes in the intelligence community in five decades. What you don't know about the planned changes to the way the U.S. handles intelligence. A special report right here on CNN SATURDAY MORNING. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It is a good piece of legislation. It is a necessary piece of legislation. It's a piece of legislation that is important for the security of our country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: It is the biggest overhaul of America's intelligence community since just after World War II. It calls for an increase in border patrols, creates a new intelligence director, and it forms a national counterterrorism center.

But this morning, we'll dig a little deeper, and tell you what you may not know about the massive reform bill.

HARRIS: And welcome back, everyone. I'm Tony Harris.

You're watching extended coverage inside CNN SATURDAY MORNING. The subject intelligence reform -- what you don't know.

NGUYEN: And I'm Betty Nguyen.

For the next half-hour, we're going to take you inside the bill that plans for a major overhaul of the intelligence community.

But first, here's a look at today's top stories.

Word in from Austria this morning. Doctors say Ukrainian presidential candidate Viktor Yushchenko was poisoned. After examining him this weekend, they say it was the poison dioxin that caused the pockmarks and swelling in his face. Take a look at these before-and-after shots of Yushchenko. The opposition leader has claimed he was poisoned by his political enemies.

Bernard Kerik won't be the nation's new homeland security secretary. A week after President Bush nominated him, the former New York City police commissioner has backed out. The reason, Kerik cites questions about the immigration status of a hired nanny.

President Bush is at the doctor's office this morning for the fourth physical of his presidency. The White House says there's every indication that the 58-year-old president is in good health. Mr. Bush is at Bethesda Naval Medical Center near Washington, where he's also visiting wounded U.S. troops.

OK, let's look at some of the changes coming in the way of the government, in the way that the government gathers intelligence. This morning, we are talking about upgrades in border security that include cargo inspections and the hiring of thousands of border patrol agents.

What about privacy concerns? Critics say the intelligence bill allows for the possibility of abuse. We'll talk with a legal expert. Also coming up, new rules for driver's licenses, and other state records. We'll have a report on one way the feds hope to trap terrorists.

HARRIS: We start with an overview.

President Bush will sign the bill into law next week, but as CNN's David Ensor reports, critics say lawmakers left some unfinished business.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

REP. DENNIS HASTERT (R), SPEAKER: The conference report is adopted.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The intelligence reform bill promises major change, creating what could be a powerful new director of national intelligence. But experts say it raises more questions than it answers.

DAVID KAY, FORMER CIA OFFICIAL: The real issue is, what is his relationship with all the 15 intelligence agency? Who actually works for him? Where is the national intelligence council going to be? Who's going to brief the president every day? And what's the basis for that? These are things that actually have to be worked out.

ENSOR: As it stands now, one man, Porter Goss, wears two hats. He's the CIA director, and he's also the director of central intelligence, nominally in charge of all 14 other U.S. intelligence agencies, as well as the national counterterrorism center, which began operations Monday.

Under the bill, a director of national intelligence replaces the DCI and is put over the top of a separate CIA director, the counterterrorism center, and the 14 other intelligence agencies.

But the most important change has to do with these two key agencies, the National Security Agency, the big ear of the U.S. government, the eavesdroppers, and the National Geospatial Intelligence Agency, the big eye of the U.S. government that analyzes imagery from spy satellites.

Right now, though the intelligence director has nominal authority, the Pentagon largely controls the budgets and personnel of these two crucial spy agencies. Under the bill, a new intelligence director gains considerably more control, potentially shifting the balance of power in Washington.

FLYNT LEVERETT, SABAN CENTER: It is not the culmination. It is the beginning. And it gives a hopefully entrepreneurial first director of national intelligence some tools that he might use to try and achieve real reform.

ENSOR: In the bill, Congress failed to reform itself to address the overlapping web of more than 20 committees overseeing parts of U.S. intelligence. KAY: There is nothing in this bill that addresses the fiefdoms on the Hill, and that is going to be an issue that Congress is got to return.

ENSOR (on camera): You think they punted on it.

KAY: I think they (UNINTELLIGIBLE) punt, I mean, at least you have contact when you punt. I think they ran away from it.

ENSOR: Senior U.S. intelligence officials say the key will be who the president picks for intelligence chief. He or she must have credibility, communication skills, a lot of discretion, a thick skin, and the absolute trust of the man in the White House. Pretty tall order.

David Ensor, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: What changes, if any, will the average person see after the intelligence reform bill becomes law?

Andrea Seabrook, a congressional reporter for National Public Radio, joins us to talk about that.

Andrea, good morning.

ANDREA SEABROOK, CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER, NATIONAL PUBLIC RADIO: Good morning. How are you?

HARRIS: Oh, good, good.

Where will we see this? Where will we feel this, as everyday Americans?

SEABROOK: Well, you know, that's kind of the trick about looking at a bill like this. I mean, regular Americans aren't supposed to feel anything. In fact, with any luck, we won't see any of the effects of this bill, right? We'll have a completely streamlined intelligence community, we won't have any more terrorists attacks. That's what they're hoping for out of this.

The truth is, there are some little things that Americans can see in the future that will change. For instance, in many states, there aren't standards of driver's licenses that include things like your gender and what you look like on your driver's license. These things will be federally mandated now. There will be certain standards that all states have to comply with.

This also includes security features of your driver's license, digital signatures, digital pictures, holograms, these sorts of things.

So you'll, you can expect your driver's license to change. Not a huge deal, but, you know, this is one of the effects of this law that you'll see on the ground. HARRIS: But I do...

SEABROOK: Also...

HARRIS: No, go ahead, go ahead.

SEABROOK: Well, border patrol agents is another thing. I mean, people on the north and south borders of the United States will see more agents along those borders protecting them.

HARRIS: Andrea, I do want to go back to the heightened security features on the driver's license. Are, do they get us closer to a national ID card?

SEABROOK: That is a good question. That is what some, some groups say that it does get us there, because this is the first time that the federal government has ever mandated standards across the government -- the -- across the United States for what has to be on driver's licenses. Now, that said, this driver's license doesn't do a lot of the things that some in Congress wanted it to do.

For example, immigration reform. It doesn't, it, people who are immigrants to the United States, illegal immigrants who have overstayed their visas, aren't automatically cut off from getting driver's licenses, for example.

HARRIS: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

SEABROOK: But it does create those standards across the country that could be seen as sort of a national ID card, so, which is something some people object to, because it, of privacy concerns.

HARRIS: OK. Andrea Seabrook, congressional reporter for National Public Radio, thanks for being with us this morning, Andrea Good to see you.

SEABROOK: You're welcome. Good to see you.

NGUYEN: The intelligence bill sets up a privacy and civil liberties board. That panel will be made up of private citizens, who will have access to all government agencies to review policies and practices. The bill also grants a new wiretapping authority to go after the so-called lone wolf terrorists who are not affiliated with a terrorist group or state.

Now, some critics believe the intelligence reform bill weakens civil liberties and privacy rights.

Here now to talk about that, both sides of the issue, is law professor and civil rights attorney Avery Friedman. Good morning to you, Avery.

AVERY FRIEDMAN, CIVIL RIGHTS LAW PROFESSOR: Hi, Betty, nice to see you again.

NGUYEN: Good to see you. Well, how does this reform bill infringe on privacy rights?

FRIEDMAN: Well, you know, it is interesting. And I listened carefully to what Andrea had to say. The linchpin from the standpoint of privacy and from the standpoint of civil liberties was an oversight board, which was recommended by the 9/11 commission.

And the legislation that came out of the Senate this week had the privacy and civil liberties oversight board, but guess what? The subpoena power that the board was supposed to have to make sure there's not overreach in government, the ability to subpoena records and information, was deleted.

So now what we have, again, from the perspective of privacy and perspective of civil liberties, is, there's no entity that has the power to deal with the overreach of government.

NGUYEN: So you're saying we have this new board, but this board doesn't have any power.

FRIEDMAN: Board doesn't have any power.

The other problem is that the concept that came out of the 9/11 report this past July was supposed to be, again, a check and balance, the idea of presidential appointments, congressional appointments. Well, now what we have is strictly an executive appointment.

So these are people appointed by the president, again, an absence of checks and balances.

NGUYEN: All right. Let's get to the nitty-gritty, the details of this bill. Talk to me a little bit about the wiretaps. Does this give the government more power to eavesdrop on people?

FRIEDMAN: Oh, it absolutely does. And the idea was, again, from an intelligence-gathering perspective, this is actually a good thing. You want to have coordination among intelligence agencies.

The difficulty is that, among other things, for example, where you have a wiretap of an individual who has no association with an enemy government or an enemy. What has happened here is that the government has essentially unrestrained ability to do surveillance, even though there's no connection between the so-called lone wolf and an enemy of the state.

So...

NGUYEN: But Avery...

FRIEDMAN: ... we have...

NGUYEN: ... some will argue...

FRIEDMAN: ... broader powers.

NGUYEN: ... that, in light of 9/11, tougher restrictions need to be in place. The government needs to have the ability to make sure that terrorists don't attack our country again.

FRIEDMAN: Well, as a general rule, no one's going to dispute that, Betty. The problem with the concept is that there should be some connection between the suspect, the target, and what that terrorism is. The difficulty is that this is a bill that reaches very far beyond that, and again, as far as oversight, there really isn't any.

NGUYEN: All right, quickly, we're out of time. But I do want to get your opinion on biometrics. Is this delving into our privacy rights?

FRIEDMAN: It most certainly is. And again, in the absence of a check-and-balance system, Betty, there is no way to restrict that. So we got a long way to go on biometrics.

NGUYEN: So they're going to have our fingerprints and our eye scans out there, and you say that...

FRIEDMAN: That's exactly right.

NGUYEN: ... there's no check and balance.

FRIEDMAN: That's right.

NGUYEN: All right. Avery Friedman, you're on at 2:00 p.m. Eastern today to talk more about this.

FRIEDMAN: Exactly right.

NGUYEN: See you then. Thank you.

FRIEDMAN: We'll see you then. Thanks.

HARRIS: The intelligence bill calls for more customs agents to protect the nation's borders. But that's not all. Find out what you don't know about plans to keep out terrorists as our expanded coverage of the intelligence bill rolls on.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (R), MAINE: At the end of the day, I think we have a bill that is a strong bill, that is an historic bill, and that is a bill that's going to make a real difference for this country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: More now in our continuing security watch.

The intelligence reform bill is bringing big changes to the nation's borders. First off, it increases the number of border patrol agents, adding thousands of them over the next five years. The number of immigration and customs agents will also go up dramatically. Meantime, it will be harder to qualify for a visa. The bill also toughens visa application requirements. More manpower, will that really make America's borders safer? Some in law enforcement don't think so.

Let's hear what a criminal justice expert has to say. Joining us now from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, is Jack Riley from the Rand Corporation.

Jack, good to see you.

JACK RILEY, RAND CORPORATION: Good morning.

HARRIS: Good morning.

RILEY: Thank you for having me.

HARRIS: Give us your take on this. We're going to get more agents, more customs agents, more immigration agents. That's got to be helpful.

RILEY: This bill is very, very strong on border security provisions, everything from the requirements for more agents, as you just outlined, to increased detention space and requirements to integrate technology, including unmanned surveillance, into border protection. It's very strong on border protection measures.

HARRIS: Do you have any problems with any aspects of the border security measures?

RILEY: I think it is a matter of how the process is unrolled, making sure that the people that are brought in are trained effectively, that they're integrated properly, and that some of the previous guests described or discussed that the surveillance information is properly vetted and that civil liberties are addressed.

HARRIS: Yes. And can you give us a sense of how, for example, the sensors, the video, the unmanned aerial vehicles, how those will come into play, and how they'll be used by this department?

RILEY: Well, in a way, they're just a simple extension of manned surveillance. A lot of what the border patrol is looking for when it's out on duty is movement, individuals, people that shouldn't be in certain spots where they are doing patrol.

And the sensors that are out there, for example, to detect movement are basically an extension of the eyes and the ears of the border patrol.

HARRIS: And...

RILEY: So they -- those kinds of sensors will be used to extend law enforcement operations, to apprehend people that are trying to cross the border illegally.

HARRIS: Will this really give us a better sense of who is crossing the borders? And once these people come into the country, does it make sense to get some kind of documentation on them, i.e, the driver's license, and addressing that issue in a very serious way in the next session of Congress?

RILEY: I think it's going to make a tremendous difference. There are a lot of information management issues that have to be worked out here. But when people come into the country through legal channels, such as through the airports now, we're doing a much better job of knowing who they are. This gets back to some of the issues that were discussed in the previous segment about the visa requirements, the biometric enabling of passports, and so forth.

Where we don't get the information that we need, and where there are a large number of people that are coming in, is over those unregulated land borders. Last year, I think, somewhere between 900,000 and a million people were apprehended between border patrol stations, and the estimates are another 3 to 5 million crossed over without even being touched.

HARRIS: Yes, there's (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

RILEY: So it's important to know who those people are, get information on them, get a fingerprint, so that if they're caught again, that we have more information about where they're coming from and how they're getting in.

HARRIS: OK. Jack Riley from the Rand Corporation, thanks for taking the time to be with us this morning. We appreciate it.

RILEY: Thank you.

NGUYEN: So what is next for intelligence reform? A few lawmakers say one answer could be at your local DMV.

Expanded coverage of the intelligence reform bill right here on CNN SATURDAY MORNING.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)

SEN. JOE LIEBERMAN (D), CONNECTICUT: The 9/11 commission said some of the main reasons why that tragedy occurred was because no one is in charge of the American intelligence community.

REP. NORM COLEMAN (R), SOUTH DAKOTA: We've got somebody in charge, which we hadn't had before.

(END VIDEO CLIPS)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: And you're watching a special edition of CNN SATURDAY MORNING.

Our focus this morning, intelligence reform, what you may not know. The new intelligence bill for the first time does set national standards for driver's licenses and birth certificates. The measure is designed to make it harder for terrorists and illegal aliens to obtain such documents.

But there is some criticism that intelligence reforms could have a negative impact on civil liberties.

Lisa Sylvester (ph) reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): If you don't succeed at first, try again next year. Congressman James Sensenbrenner and other lawmakers say without meaningful immigration reform, the intelligence bill is simply a Band-Aid.

REP. JAMES SENSENBRENNER (R): American citizens have the right to know who is in their country, that people are who they say they are, and that the name on a driver's license is the holder's real name, not some alias.

SYLVESTER: The intelligence bill adds 14,000 border guards and inspectors, and sets new standards for driver's licenses.

But absent are measures to close immigration loopholes. Sensenbrenner says he'll introduce legislation on the first day of the new session that includes prohibiting illegal aliens from getting drivers's licenses, setting a higher standard for political asylum, and finishing a fence on the Mexico-California border.

President Bush and the House Republican leadership have promised immigration reform supporters they won't stand in the way. The 9/11 hijackers had multiple driver's licenses from various states, a problem clearly identified in the 9/11 commission report.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If people can't get in here, they can't commit these acts. And with open borders, they will get in. And that's what we have right now. We have essentially open borders. And this bill just doesn't do the job.

SYLVESTER: Thirty-nine states and the District of Columbia already require that applicants prove they are in the country legally before getting driver's licenses.

(on camera): The most likely scenario is, the immigration provisions will be included in an Iraq supplemental appropriations bill. Pro-immigration groups are promising to fight any new legislation, saying the measures will not make the country safer.

Lisa Sylvester, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NGUYEN: Want to talk more now on Bernard Kerik, who stunned Washington by withdrawing his nomination as homeland security secretary. And he's doing it for a reason that's also plagued nominees from past administrations.

Joining us now from New York is Mark Hosenball from "Newsweek" magazine.

Good morning to you.

MARK HOSENBALL, "NEWSWEEK" MAGAZINE (on phone): Hello.

NGUYEN: Well, let's talk about this, because Kerik says he employed a nanny with questionable status. He's also citing some problems with taxes and paying that nanny. But some are wondering if there's more to this than just that. What have you uncovered?

HOSENBALL: Well, all I know is that we've been digging various things related to Kerik, including some stuff related to his business deals and previous personal finance issues, including a series of lawsuits related to a condo that he owned over in New Jersey fairly recently, within the last five or six years.

And last night, we came up with a warrant document for his arrest in this condo case, where he had apparently failed to pay...

NGUYEN: For his arrest in this condo case?

HOSENBALL: For his arrest, yes, a 1998 warrant for the arrest of Bernard Kerik in Bergen County, New Jersey, in a case where he had failed to pay condo fees and then apparently failed to respond to a subpoena seeking to find out information from him about why he failed to pay. And some judge issued a warrant for his arrest.

And we were looking around to see whether this (UNINTELLIGIBLE) somebody (UNINTELLIGIBLE), and we couldn't find it. We sent a copy of this to the White House, trying to figure out what it was about, at about 5:30 or 6:00 yesterday, and then, like, three hours later, two or three hours later, we hear about this.

I mean, I don't know what it all means. I do know that the -- Kerik's people who I spoke to and the White House who I spoke to said that the warrant had nothing whatsoever to do with his decision to drop out, said that was all related to this nanny issue, where he hired this apparently illegal alien as a nanny, and didn't pay her taxes and didn't pay...

NGUYEN: OK.

HOSENBALL: ... her Social Security. And we know that that previously had knocked out attorney general candidates, a couple of them, for Clinton, because the -- in those days, the attorney general headed the immigration service, and now the department of homeland security includes the immigration service.

NGUYEN: So some questions to be answered. All right. Mark Hosenball with "Newsweek" magazine, we're out of time. But we do have so much more to ask. Thank you, though, for your time this morning.

Tony? HARRIS: To Washington now and Kelli Arena for a preview of "ON THE STORY." Hi, Kelli.

KELLI ARENA, "ON THE STORY": Hi, Tony.

Well, we are "ON THE STORY" of Bernie Kerik out as the president's choice for homeland security, war, terrorism, and higher oil prices, as well as sports and steroids, and how Martha Stewart will be out of the slammer onto your TV screen. I'll be talking about suspicions of ecoterrorism after those house fires in Maryland. Barbara Starr is "ON THE STORY" of soldiers zinging Rumsfeld over too few armored vehicles. It is a lot. It's all coming up, all "ON THE STORY."

HARRIS: We'll be watching. Kelli, thank you.

NGUYEN: Yes, we will.

But right now, we are out of time. We appreciate you joining us this morning.

HARRIS: "ON THE STORY" with Kelli Arena coming up next, after a check of the morning headlines.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com

Aired December 11, 2004 - 09:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BETTY NGUYEN, CNN ANCHOR: Well, good morning, everyone. From the CNN Center in Atlanta, this is CNN SATURDAY MORNING. I'm Betty Nguyen.
TONY HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Tony Harris. If you're just waking up on the West Coast, the clock says 6:00 a.m.

Let's get started with the day's headlines.

Bernard Kerik has abruptly withdrawn himself as President Bush's nominee for homeland security secretary, citing, quote, "personal reasons." Kerik is a former New York City police commissioner. Now there's a scramble at the White House for a new homeland security candidate. We'll go there live in a minute.

Pakistani authorities have made an arrest in the kidnapping of three U.N. aid workers in neighboring Afghanistan. The three were released November 23 after nearly a month in captivity. Officials say the suspect arrested in Karachi is the leader of a Taliban splinter group.

Yasser Arafat's nephew has given his uncle's medical records to Palestinian Authority officials. The late Palestinian leader died in a Paris hospital November 11, but the official cause of death was never released.

And it's a quiet weekend for jurors in the Scott Peterson murder trial. They are sequestered in a hotel in Redwood City, California, after finishing their first full day of deliberations. They're deciding whether Peterson should get life in prison or death for killing his wife and unborn son. Deliberations resume on Monday.

NGUYEN: Here's what we've got coming up for you today.

Hopes fade in the northern Philippines. The search for survivors is ending after recent storms leave hundreds dead. We will have a live report.

Also, he is the nation's top doc. What are the surgeon general's biggest concerns about the health of American kids? We'll find out in The Novak Zone.

And security versus privacy. The nation ushers in new intelligence reforms, and that means more eyes may be on you. HARRIS: Our top story this hour, a job opening and what you might call a want ad. President Bush is looking for yet another person to fill the job of homeland security secretary after Bernard Kerik withdraw his name from consideration to lead the department.

More on this story now from CNN's Elaine Quijano, live at the White House. Good morning, Elaine.

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, Tony.

That's right. No word yet on whom the White House might tap next to be the next homeland security chief. But this news really coming as a surprise, because all day long yesterday, White House officials both on the record and also on background were saying that they were not worried about Bernard Kerik's confirmation process.

Now, this morning, as President Bush left the White House, he made no comment about the Kerik situation.

But it was last night, of course, that the White House announced that he was withdrawing, that Kerik was withdrawing his name from consideration, and the reason given by Kerik was the questionable immigration status of a nanny.

Now, in his statement last night, the White House said Kerik was withdrawing his name for personal reasons, that the president respects his decision and wishes Kerik and his wife well. Kerik, of course, you see there, nominated about a week ago. Former New York City police commissioner was tapped to replace the outgoing homeland security secretary, Tom Ridge.

Now, in his statement, Kerik said that in the course of completing documents that were required for Senate confirmation, he discovered the information about the nanny, and in his letter to President Bush, Kerik said that he was "convinced that, for personal reasons, moving forward would not be in the best interests" of the Bush administration, the Department of Homeland Security, or the American people.

Now, there had been questions raised separately about Kerik's involvement with Taser International, a stun-gun manufacturing company, through which Kerik earned millions of dollars in stock options by selling those stock options. But yesterday, White House officials said they had a high degree of confidence that officials had thoroughly looked at that particular issue.

And Tony, they said they were quite confident about the vetting process that had been put into place. But again, this news coming as quite a surprise last night, the announcement coming here from the White House, Tony.

HARRIS: OK, and Elaine, just to be clear about this, this is the decision that, at this point, we believe that Kerik made on his own, and that he was not forced into this decision?

QUIJANO: That's exactly right. There is nothing to indicate, at this point, that the White House asked him to withdraw his name from consideration. The decision, in fact, the letter coming from Kerik, we understand there was a phone call that was made to the White House around 8:30 last night. And then the White House coming out after that with this statement, a very short statement, which I just mentioned a short time ago.

And at this point, no indication that Kerik himself was asked to withdraw his name, but I'm certain that we'll hear more details in the days to come, Tony.

HARRIS: For sure. Elaine Quijano at the White House. Elaine, thank you.

NGUYEN: Now to the latest on the fight for Iraq.

Two high-ranking officials in Iraq's interior ministry were gunned down this morning in southwestern Baghdad. The two colonels worked in a criminal intelligence department. Their car was sprayed with bullets as they were going to work.

Army Staff Sergeant Johnny Horn (ph), Jr., has been sentenced to three years in prison after pleading guilty to killing a severely wounded Iraqi civilian. Horn will also get a dishonorable discharge. An investigator said the wounded civilian was in a burning truck, and he was shot to, quote, "put him out of his misery."

HARRIS: And time now to update you on the week's major developments in the war on terror.

A judge has awarded $156 million to the parents of an American teenager gunned down by Hamas militants in the West Bank. It is one of the first jury awards against U.S.-based organizations accused of supporting terrorism. The suit was filed against three Islamic charity organizations and another group accused of raising money for Hamas.

And Minnesota will begin issuing a unique driver's license designed to stop counterfeiters. The licenses have a reflective image that appears to float above and below the card when it is tilted. Since the 9/11 attacks, the practice of making fake licenses has received much greater scrutiny. That's because counterfeit ID cards made it possible for the hijackers to board commercial flights.

NGUYEN: In the Philippines, a half-million people are coming to grips with the grim and soggy reality that now surrounds them. Massive storms have turned the region into a huge mud pit. Searchers do not expect to find any more survivors after rescuing a woman and three children 10 days after they were buried alive by a landslide.

CNN's Aneesh Raman joins us now from Manila with an update on a desperate humanitarian situation there. Hi, there, Aneesh.

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Betty, good morning to you.

The office of civil defense here now upgrading the death toll substantially for the third consecutive day. Numbers that we just got have the death toll at 1,060, the number injured hovering around 1,000. Officials say that is to be expected in the days ahead. As the situation stabilizes, that death toll will continue to increase substantially.

Now, just a few hours ago, we returned from the ground zero of this relief effort. It's the eastern province of Kaezan (ph) about 40 miles outside of Manila. We went and visited the two hardest-hit towns of Riyal (ph) and Infanta (ph), and there the people are quite literally digging their way out. Mind you, it's been about two weeks since the last storm passed through, but everything is just covered with mud.

The people we spoke to, some were in complete shock, just now realizing the implications of what lies ahead for them. Others jovial, realizing that the worst is behind them. But a good number are still in that survival mode, gathering up their belongings and trying to find their loved ones.

Now, the focus of everything is the relief effort. Some 600 U.S. Marines and Navy personnel are in country. They have come from Japan. They're helping -- (audio interrupt) ... the only way in and out is by helicopter. And when the weather is bad, the helicopters can't fly, the supplies can't land. Today was one of those days.

So for these people on the ground, they've survived the worst, but what lies ahead will be difficult as well, Betty.

NGUYEN: All right, CNN's Aneesh Raman in Manila for us today. Thank you, Aneesh. Tony?

HARRIS: In news across America now, if you own a Dodge Durango SUV or a Dodge Dakota pickup, you may want to visit your dealer. DaimlerChrysler is recalling 600,000 of the vehicles from model years 2000 through 2003. A safety investigation shows they have a defect that could cause the wheels to fall off. Nearly 72,000 2004 Durangos are also being recalled because of a cable problem that could cause an engine fire.

In Virginia, a close call and some fast footwork. An SUV skids out of control on a wet highway -- look at this -- narrowly missing a man working nearby. The man says he ducked when he got a glimpse of the truck hurtling his way. It came within a foot or two of his head. Both the SUV driver and the highway worker escaped without injury.

In Oregon, two men have a bridge to sell you. Police say two thieves stole the metal guard rails off this bridge and sold the scraps for drugs. Police say the money they raised helped fund suspected drug dealers.

And a common situation, at least to a novel idea. The book is called "My Dad Is Going Away, but He Will Be Back One Day." Its 16 pages help children in military families cope when a parent is away on duty serving for long periods. James Thomas, a helicopter pilot and his wife, Melanie, of Virginia wrote the book. It's available at several online stores. NGUYEN: Well, we know there are many who feel protecting America's borders should start with stricter control over who gets a driver's license. Well, is that the next step for intelligence reform? Expanded coverage of what's in that bill right here on CNN SATURDAY MORNING.

HARRIS: Plus, the health of the nation's children. Meet the man in charge of getting young America off the couch and into the gym. The U.S. surgeon general in The Novak Zone.

ORELON SIDNEY, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Well, I'm Orelon Sidney, and this is a look at the big storm that's headed across the eastern United States. Lots of rain and snow here. But it looks great in San Francisco. You're going to see a good day. Skies will be cloudy to partly cloudy today, a high of 63. I think we even have a picture of the Bay Bridge this morning with your current temperature at 54 degrees. Enjoy it.

Music from the Hives this morning. We'll take a look at the rest of your weather in about 15 minutes.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

HARRIS: And this just in to CNN. Doctors are speaking in Vienna right now in Austria, and they are updating reporters on the condition of opposition leader in the Ukraine, Viktor Yushchenko. And you'll remember that Yushchenko has been claiming for a long time that the disfiguring that you see in his face here, you see the before picture from July of '04 and the most recent picture of Yushchenko, he has claimed that the disfiguring that you see on his face is from poisoning.

And we can confirm that doctors, speaking right now, briefing reporters in Vienna, are saying that there is no doubt he was poisoned by dioxin. And this is from a doctor that you see who is speaking right now live at a press briefing.

And we're also getting information -- we don't know at this point whether the poisoning was deliberate. But you'll remember that Yushchenko is saying and claiming that the poisoning was deliberate, and that it was brought on by his enemies, who were trying to steal the November 21 runoff election from him.

And as you know, the supreme court has invalidated that election and has set new elections for December 26.

Once again, this is breaking news in to CNN. Viktor Yushchenko's doctors in Vienna are confirming that the opposition presidential candidate was poisoned, no doubt, words from the doctor, no doubt he was poisoned by dioxin.

And we will continue to follow this story and bring you additional information...

NGUYEN: Yes, no doubt this is going to...

HARRIS: ... as it comes in.

NGUYEN: ... cause an investigation as to who poisoned him and how this came about.

But right now, we want to get the latest information on the weather outside this morning as you're waking up out there. Orelon Sidney joins us with a look at that. You said 15 minutes, Orelon...

HARRIS: We couldn't wait that long.

NGUYEN: ... it's been, what, five?

HARRIS: We couldn't wait that long.

(LAUGHTER)

SIDNEY: Fifteen minutes, give or take 12.

NGUYEN: Yes.

HARRIS: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

(LAUGHTER)

(WEATHER FORECAST)

HARRIS: The Hives.

SIDNEY: The Hives.

NGUYEN: Yes, on this show, it's not a bad thing to have the Hives.

(LAUGHTER)

SIDNEY: I'm going to go get some Ovino (ph). I'll be right back.

NGUYEN: OK...

HARRIS: OK.

NGUYEN: ... you do that. Thank you, Orelon.

SIDNEY: You're welcome.

HARRIS: We'll take a break, and we'll come back with more CNN SATURDAY MORNING after this, OK?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NGUYEN: Well, it's not always easy to do the right thing, but the ethics guy is here to help. Send your e-mails to the ethics guy at CNN.com. Bruce Weinstein, the ethics guy, will be here to answer all of your questions at noon Eastern today.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

HARRIS: We're going to spend about a next five, six, maybe even 10 minutes, though, on our top story this hour.

As we told you just a couple of minutes ago, was breaking news just in to CNN, Ukraine opposition presidential candidate Viktor Yushchenko was, now, in fact, poisoned. That coming from doctors in Vienna who have been treating him on and off for a while now.

You can take a look at the pictures for yourself, the before picture of Yushchenko and the after picture after the poisoning.

Now, you know that he has long maintained that the reason for the disfiguring was as a result of poisoning, and he blamed it on opposition, his enemies who were trying to deny him the presidency of the Ukraine.

And you take a look at these pictures right now of Yushchenko during rallies that have been held over the last month in Ukraine.

He claimed that he was poisoned by the opposition and enemies who wanted to keep him from the presidency.

Let's bring in Jill Dougherty, who has been following this story for what seems like the last month, month and a half, who is in Moscow right now.

And Jill, this is the confirmation of what Viktor Yushchenko has been saying for quite a while now.

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN MOSCOW BUREAU CHIEF (on phone): It is, Tony. The doctors in Vienna are saying that there is no doubt that he was poisoned with dioxin. Now, the big question still remaining is, how did it happen? Who did it? Was it deliberate?

He, but Mr. Yushchenko has said, in fact, he said it to us when we were there speaking with him in Ukraine, he said that he always felt the aim was to kill him, that it was an act of a political settling of scores. And now the doctors in that clinic, to which he went right after he became sick back in September, they're confirming it's dioxin. And that would explain some of that very, very severe scarring that you see on his face.

Just a few months ago, he was a very young-looking, very attractive 50-year-old, and now he looks like an old man. His face is completely scarred. It has lesions and is, from political experience, I can tell you, it's dark and quite frightening. But that's the latest, Tony.

HARRIS: Yes.

NGUYEN: Yes, the before and after, Jill, is quite shocking, really, to look at the pictures here. This is a man who was known for his movie-star looks. And then you look at him in this December 6 photo that we're putting up on the screen right now. You can see the discoloration on his face and the pockmarks.

Give us an idea of the timeline. Where was Yushchenko just before he became ill? Can you trace back to where he was, and possibly put the pieces together as to who may have been involved, if someone indeed was involved in this poisoning?

DOUGHERTY: Well, he was out to dinner. And that is the night, really, when this happened. And his suspicion has already always been that whoever it was introduced that in some way into his food. But...

HARRIS: Yes.

DOUGHERTY: ... that's still surmisal at this point.

But he feels that he got it that way, and his wife, who, by the way, is an American citizen, said just recently that she tasted some type of metal thing on his lips when he came home that night. And then the next day he became violently ill. Really been a very a serious thing for him.

HARRIS: Well let's, you know, I just pulled up some information on dioxin as we take a look at the live picture from Vienna of the doctors holding that press briefing for reporters. And Jill, I just pulled up some information on dioxin. Let me read a little bit of this. It is the name of a family of chemical compounds that are unintentional byproducts of certain industrial, nonindustrial, and natural processes.

But more to the point that you were just making, 95 percent of human exposure to dioxin is through the diet. Exposure levels are generally more a function of what you eat, to your point, rather than where you live. So it seems to support at least the claim being made right now that this was a poisoning done through Yushchenko's diet and through his food.

DOUGHERTY: Right. But again, nobody really knows, at this stage, at least, how that was done, exactly by whom, where did they get it? You know, the doctors were really stumped on this...

HARRIS: Yes.

DOUGHERTY: ... ever since he went to the hospital back in September. They ran tests. But then he felt he had to get back on the campaign trail. He went back. They didn't complete the tests. They wanted to do more studies.

And finally, now that things have kind of quieted down, there's going to be another election on December 26, he felt that it was safe to go back to Vienna. And this time, they really did a big 24-hour workup on him with nuclear medicine, blood tests, et cetera. So they feel very confident in what they're saying right now.

NGUYEN: OK, Jill. So now that the doctors have said, yes, this is a result of dioxin, does it give them an idea of how to treat this? And can you cure what has happened to him? DOUGHERTY: Well, his doctors have said that actually the worst in the physical sense could be over, that initially, when he came in, his internal organs, especially his digestive tract, were literally ulcerated. And that has really gone back to some type of pretty normal situation.

And don't forget, he's been keeping up a really intense campaign schedule and apparently doing pretty well with that. So overall, as he told me, his health is getting back to normal. But it's this terrible scarring...

NGUYEN: Right.

DOUGHERTY: ... and that could take, experts say, maybe even two to three years to go.

NGUYEN: Well, Jill, we want to pause for just a minute and let our viewers hear what the doctors had to say today about Yushchenko's condition.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): After having completed our examination, which we have conducted in the course of the past 24 hours, as well as after having conducted a series blood tests, there is no doubt about the fact that Mr. Yushchenko's disease has been caused by a case of poisoning based on dioxin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: And Jill, there's the announcement from the doctors. I've got to ask you a political question. What does this mean now, now that this poisoning has been confirmed? How does this change the dynamics on the ground politically, do you think?

DOUGHERTY: Well, I would think that, of course, it would increase support for him. His supporters will be furious. They already felt that this was the case, and here, at least, is half the proof that definitely he was poisoned. Who did it, they don't know.

But it's going to increase (UNINTELLIGIBLE) lot, I think, the questioning, where did it come from, who did it? And they will be determined to find that out.

HARRIS: OK, Jill Dougherty reporting for us live this morning from Moscow. Jill, thank you.

NGUYEN: Well, does the massive intelligence reform put your personal liberties at stake? Will you lose some of your privacy once the bill is signed?

HARRIS: One of the many questions many people have as the president prepares to approve the most sweeping changes in the intelligence community in five decades. What you don't know about the planned changes to the way the U.S. handles intelligence. A special report right here on CNN SATURDAY MORNING. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It is a good piece of legislation. It is a necessary piece of legislation. It's a piece of legislation that is important for the security of our country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: It is the biggest overhaul of America's intelligence community since just after World War II. It calls for an increase in border patrols, creates a new intelligence director, and it forms a national counterterrorism center.

But this morning, we'll dig a little deeper, and tell you what you may not know about the massive reform bill.

HARRIS: And welcome back, everyone. I'm Tony Harris.

You're watching extended coverage inside CNN SATURDAY MORNING. The subject intelligence reform -- what you don't know.

NGUYEN: And I'm Betty Nguyen.

For the next half-hour, we're going to take you inside the bill that plans for a major overhaul of the intelligence community.

But first, here's a look at today's top stories.

Word in from Austria this morning. Doctors say Ukrainian presidential candidate Viktor Yushchenko was poisoned. After examining him this weekend, they say it was the poison dioxin that caused the pockmarks and swelling in his face. Take a look at these before-and-after shots of Yushchenko. The opposition leader has claimed he was poisoned by his political enemies.

Bernard Kerik won't be the nation's new homeland security secretary. A week after President Bush nominated him, the former New York City police commissioner has backed out. The reason, Kerik cites questions about the immigration status of a hired nanny.

President Bush is at the doctor's office this morning for the fourth physical of his presidency. The White House says there's every indication that the 58-year-old president is in good health. Mr. Bush is at Bethesda Naval Medical Center near Washington, where he's also visiting wounded U.S. troops.

OK, let's look at some of the changes coming in the way of the government, in the way that the government gathers intelligence. This morning, we are talking about upgrades in border security that include cargo inspections and the hiring of thousands of border patrol agents.

What about privacy concerns? Critics say the intelligence bill allows for the possibility of abuse. We'll talk with a legal expert. Also coming up, new rules for driver's licenses, and other state records. We'll have a report on one way the feds hope to trap terrorists.

HARRIS: We start with an overview.

President Bush will sign the bill into law next week, but as CNN's David Ensor reports, critics say lawmakers left some unfinished business.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

REP. DENNIS HASTERT (R), SPEAKER: The conference report is adopted.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The intelligence reform bill promises major change, creating what could be a powerful new director of national intelligence. But experts say it raises more questions than it answers.

DAVID KAY, FORMER CIA OFFICIAL: The real issue is, what is his relationship with all the 15 intelligence agency? Who actually works for him? Where is the national intelligence council going to be? Who's going to brief the president every day? And what's the basis for that? These are things that actually have to be worked out.

ENSOR: As it stands now, one man, Porter Goss, wears two hats. He's the CIA director, and he's also the director of central intelligence, nominally in charge of all 14 other U.S. intelligence agencies, as well as the national counterterrorism center, which began operations Monday.

Under the bill, a director of national intelligence replaces the DCI and is put over the top of a separate CIA director, the counterterrorism center, and the 14 other intelligence agencies.

But the most important change has to do with these two key agencies, the National Security Agency, the big ear of the U.S. government, the eavesdroppers, and the National Geospatial Intelligence Agency, the big eye of the U.S. government that analyzes imagery from spy satellites.

Right now, though the intelligence director has nominal authority, the Pentagon largely controls the budgets and personnel of these two crucial spy agencies. Under the bill, a new intelligence director gains considerably more control, potentially shifting the balance of power in Washington.

FLYNT LEVERETT, SABAN CENTER: It is not the culmination. It is the beginning. And it gives a hopefully entrepreneurial first director of national intelligence some tools that he might use to try and achieve real reform.

ENSOR: In the bill, Congress failed to reform itself to address the overlapping web of more than 20 committees overseeing parts of U.S. intelligence. KAY: There is nothing in this bill that addresses the fiefdoms on the Hill, and that is going to be an issue that Congress is got to return.

ENSOR (on camera): You think they punted on it.

KAY: I think they (UNINTELLIGIBLE) punt, I mean, at least you have contact when you punt. I think they ran away from it.

ENSOR: Senior U.S. intelligence officials say the key will be who the president picks for intelligence chief. He or she must have credibility, communication skills, a lot of discretion, a thick skin, and the absolute trust of the man in the White House. Pretty tall order.

David Ensor, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARRIS: What changes, if any, will the average person see after the intelligence reform bill becomes law?

Andrea Seabrook, a congressional reporter for National Public Radio, joins us to talk about that.

Andrea, good morning.

ANDREA SEABROOK, CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER, NATIONAL PUBLIC RADIO: Good morning. How are you?

HARRIS: Oh, good, good.

Where will we see this? Where will we feel this, as everyday Americans?

SEABROOK: Well, you know, that's kind of the trick about looking at a bill like this. I mean, regular Americans aren't supposed to feel anything. In fact, with any luck, we won't see any of the effects of this bill, right? We'll have a completely streamlined intelligence community, we won't have any more terrorists attacks. That's what they're hoping for out of this.

The truth is, there are some little things that Americans can see in the future that will change. For instance, in many states, there aren't standards of driver's licenses that include things like your gender and what you look like on your driver's license. These things will be federally mandated now. There will be certain standards that all states have to comply with.

This also includes security features of your driver's license, digital signatures, digital pictures, holograms, these sorts of things.

So you'll, you can expect your driver's license to change. Not a huge deal, but, you know, this is one of the effects of this law that you'll see on the ground. HARRIS: But I do...

SEABROOK: Also...

HARRIS: No, go ahead, go ahead.

SEABROOK: Well, border patrol agents is another thing. I mean, people on the north and south borders of the United States will see more agents along those borders protecting them.

HARRIS: Andrea, I do want to go back to the heightened security features on the driver's license. Are, do they get us closer to a national ID card?

SEABROOK: That is a good question. That is what some, some groups say that it does get us there, because this is the first time that the federal government has ever mandated standards across the government -- the -- across the United States for what has to be on driver's licenses. Now, that said, this driver's license doesn't do a lot of the things that some in Congress wanted it to do.

For example, immigration reform. It doesn't, it, people who are immigrants to the United States, illegal immigrants who have overstayed their visas, aren't automatically cut off from getting driver's licenses, for example.

HARRIS: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

SEABROOK: But it does create those standards across the country that could be seen as sort of a national ID card, so, which is something some people object to, because it, of privacy concerns.

HARRIS: OK. Andrea Seabrook, congressional reporter for National Public Radio, thanks for being with us this morning, Andrea Good to see you.

SEABROOK: You're welcome. Good to see you.

NGUYEN: The intelligence bill sets up a privacy and civil liberties board. That panel will be made up of private citizens, who will have access to all government agencies to review policies and practices. The bill also grants a new wiretapping authority to go after the so-called lone wolf terrorists who are not affiliated with a terrorist group or state.

Now, some critics believe the intelligence reform bill weakens civil liberties and privacy rights.

Here now to talk about that, both sides of the issue, is law professor and civil rights attorney Avery Friedman. Good morning to you, Avery.

AVERY FRIEDMAN, CIVIL RIGHTS LAW PROFESSOR: Hi, Betty, nice to see you again.

NGUYEN: Good to see you. Well, how does this reform bill infringe on privacy rights?

FRIEDMAN: Well, you know, it is interesting. And I listened carefully to what Andrea had to say. The linchpin from the standpoint of privacy and from the standpoint of civil liberties was an oversight board, which was recommended by the 9/11 commission.

And the legislation that came out of the Senate this week had the privacy and civil liberties oversight board, but guess what? The subpoena power that the board was supposed to have to make sure there's not overreach in government, the ability to subpoena records and information, was deleted.

So now what we have, again, from the perspective of privacy and perspective of civil liberties, is, there's no entity that has the power to deal with the overreach of government.

NGUYEN: So you're saying we have this new board, but this board doesn't have any power.

FRIEDMAN: Board doesn't have any power.

The other problem is that the concept that came out of the 9/11 report this past July was supposed to be, again, a check and balance, the idea of presidential appointments, congressional appointments. Well, now what we have is strictly an executive appointment.

So these are people appointed by the president, again, an absence of checks and balances.

NGUYEN: All right. Let's get to the nitty-gritty, the details of this bill. Talk to me a little bit about the wiretaps. Does this give the government more power to eavesdrop on people?

FRIEDMAN: Oh, it absolutely does. And the idea was, again, from an intelligence-gathering perspective, this is actually a good thing. You want to have coordination among intelligence agencies.

The difficulty is that, among other things, for example, where you have a wiretap of an individual who has no association with an enemy government or an enemy. What has happened here is that the government has essentially unrestrained ability to do surveillance, even though there's no connection between the so-called lone wolf and an enemy of the state.

So...

NGUYEN: But Avery...

FRIEDMAN: ... we have...

NGUYEN: ... some will argue...

FRIEDMAN: ... broader powers.

NGUYEN: ... that, in light of 9/11, tougher restrictions need to be in place. The government needs to have the ability to make sure that terrorists don't attack our country again.

FRIEDMAN: Well, as a general rule, no one's going to dispute that, Betty. The problem with the concept is that there should be some connection between the suspect, the target, and what that terrorism is. The difficulty is that this is a bill that reaches very far beyond that, and again, as far as oversight, there really isn't any.

NGUYEN: All right, quickly, we're out of time. But I do want to get your opinion on biometrics. Is this delving into our privacy rights?

FRIEDMAN: It most certainly is. And again, in the absence of a check-and-balance system, Betty, there is no way to restrict that. So we got a long way to go on biometrics.

NGUYEN: So they're going to have our fingerprints and our eye scans out there, and you say that...

FRIEDMAN: That's exactly right.

NGUYEN: ... there's no check and balance.

FRIEDMAN: That's right.

NGUYEN: All right. Avery Friedman, you're on at 2:00 p.m. Eastern today to talk more about this.

FRIEDMAN: Exactly right.

NGUYEN: See you then. Thank you.

FRIEDMAN: We'll see you then. Thanks.

HARRIS: The intelligence bill calls for more customs agents to protect the nation's borders. But that's not all. Find out what you don't know about plans to keep out terrorists as our expanded coverage of the intelligence bill rolls on.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (R), MAINE: At the end of the day, I think we have a bill that is a strong bill, that is an historic bill, and that is a bill that's going to make a real difference for this country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: More now in our continuing security watch.

The intelligence reform bill is bringing big changes to the nation's borders. First off, it increases the number of border patrol agents, adding thousands of them over the next five years. The number of immigration and customs agents will also go up dramatically. Meantime, it will be harder to qualify for a visa. The bill also toughens visa application requirements. More manpower, will that really make America's borders safer? Some in law enforcement don't think so.

Let's hear what a criminal justice expert has to say. Joining us now from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, is Jack Riley from the Rand Corporation.

Jack, good to see you.

JACK RILEY, RAND CORPORATION: Good morning.

HARRIS: Good morning.

RILEY: Thank you for having me.

HARRIS: Give us your take on this. We're going to get more agents, more customs agents, more immigration agents. That's got to be helpful.

RILEY: This bill is very, very strong on border security provisions, everything from the requirements for more agents, as you just outlined, to increased detention space and requirements to integrate technology, including unmanned surveillance, into border protection. It's very strong on border protection measures.

HARRIS: Do you have any problems with any aspects of the border security measures?

RILEY: I think it is a matter of how the process is unrolled, making sure that the people that are brought in are trained effectively, that they're integrated properly, and that some of the previous guests described or discussed that the surveillance information is properly vetted and that civil liberties are addressed.

HARRIS: Yes. And can you give us a sense of how, for example, the sensors, the video, the unmanned aerial vehicles, how those will come into play, and how they'll be used by this department?

RILEY: Well, in a way, they're just a simple extension of manned surveillance. A lot of what the border patrol is looking for when it's out on duty is movement, individuals, people that shouldn't be in certain spots where they are doing patrol.

And the sensors that are out there, for example, to detect movement are basically an extension of the eyes and the ears of the border patrol.

HARRIS: And...

RILEY: So they -- those kinds of sensors will be used to extend law enforcement operations, to apprehend people that are trying to cross the border illegally.

HARRIS: Will this really give us a better sense of who is crossing the borders? And once these people come into the country, does it make sense to get some kind of documentation on them, i.e, the driver's license, and addressing that issue in a very serious way in the next session of Congress?

RILEY: I think it's going to make a tremendous difference. There are a lot of information management issues that have to be worked out here. But when people come into the country through legal channels, such as through the airports now, we're doing a much better job of knowing who they are. This gets back to some of the issues that were discussed in the previous segment about the visa requirements, the biometric enabling of passports, and so forth.

Where we don't get the information that we need, and where there are a large number of people that are coming in, is over those unregulated land borders. Last year, I think, somewhere between 900,000 and a million people were apprehended between border patrol stations, and the estimates are another 3 to 5 million crossed over without even being touched.

HARRIS: Yes, there's (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

RILEY: So it's important to know who those people are, get information on them, get a fingerprint, so that if they're caught again, that we have more information about where they're coming from and how they're getting in.

HARRIS: OK. Jack Riley from the Rand Corporation, thanks for taking the time to be with us this morning. We appreciate it.

RILEY: Thank you.

NGUYEN: So what is next for intelligence reform? A few lawmakers say one answer could be at your local DMV.

Expanded coverage of the intelligence reform bill right here on CNN SATURDAY MORNING.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)

SEN. JOE LIEBERMAN (D), CONNECTICUT: The 9/11 commission said some of the main reasons why that tragedy occurred was because no one is in charge of the American intelligence community.

REP. NORM COLEMAN (R), SOUTH DAKOTA: We've got somebody in charge, which we hadn't had before.

(END VIDEO CLIPS)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARRIS: And you're watching a special edition of CNN SATURDAY MORNING.

Our focus this morning, intelligence reform, what you may not know. The new intelligence bill for the first time does set national standards for driver's licenses and birth certificates. The measure is designed to make it harder for terrorists and illegal aliens to obtain such documents.

But there is some criticism that intelligence reforms could have a negative impact on civil liberties.

Lisa Sylvester (ph) reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LISA SYLVESTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): If you don't succeed at first, try again next year. Congressman James Sensenbrenner and other lawmakers say without meaningful immigration reform, the intelligence bill is simply a Band-Aid.

REP. JAMES SENSENBRENNER (R): American citizens have the right to know who is in their country, that people are who they say they are, and that the name on a driver's license is the holder's real name, not some alias.

SYLVESTER: The intelligence bill adds 14,000 border guards and inspectors, and sets new standards for driver's licenses.

But absent are measures to close immigration loopholes. Sensenbrenner says he'll introduce legislation on the first day of the new session that includes prohibiting illegal aliens from getting drivers's licenses, setting a higher standard for political asylum, and finishing a fence on the Mexico-California border.

President Bush and the House Republican leadership have promised immigration reform supporters they won't stand in the way. The 9/11 hijackers had multiple driver's licenses from various states, a problem clearly identified in the 9/11 commission report.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If people can't get in here, they can't commit these acts. And with open borders, they will get in. And that's what we have right now. We have essentially open borders. And this bill just doesn't do the job.

SYLVESTER: Thirty-nine states and the District of Columbia already require that applicants prove they are in the country legally before getting driver's licenses.

(on camera): The most likely scenario is, the immigration provisions will be included in an Iraq supplemental appropriations bill. Pro-immigration groups are promising to fight any new legislation, saying the measures will not make the country safer.

Lisa Sylvester, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NGUYEN: Want to talk more now on Bernard Kerik, who stunned Washington by withdrawing his nomination as homeland security secretary. And he's doing it for a reason that's also plagued nominees from past administrations.

Joining us now from New York is Mark Hosenball from "Newsweek" magazine.

Good morning to you.

MARK HOSENBALL, "NEWSWEEK" MAGAZINE (on phone): Hello.

NGUYEN: Well, let's talk about this, because Kerik says he employed a nanny with questionable status. He's also citing some problems with taxes and paying that nanny. But some are wondering if there's more to this than just that. What have you uncovered?

HOSENBALL: Well, all I know is that we've been digging various things related to Kerik, including some stuff related to his business deals and previous personal finance issues, including a series of lawsuits related to a condo that he owned over in New Jersey fairly recently, within the last five or six years.

And last night, we came up with a warrant document for his arrest in this condo case, where he had apparently failed to pay...

NGUYEN: For his arrest in this condo case?

HOSENBALL: For his arrest, yes, a 1998 warrant for the arrest of Bernard Kerik in Bergen County, New Jersey, in a case where he had failed to pay condo fees and then apparently failed to respond to a subpoena seeking to find out information from him about why he failed to pay. And some judge issued a warrant for his arrest.

And we were looking around to see whether this (UNINTELLIGIBLE) somebody (UNINTELLIGIBLE), and we couldn't find it. We sent a copy of this to the White House, trying to figure out what it was about, at about 5:30 or 6:00 yesterday, and then, like, three hours later, two or three hours later, we hear about this.

I mean, I don't know what it all means. I do know that the -- Kerik's people who I spoke to and the White House who I spoke to said that the warrant had nothing whatsoever to do with his decision to drop out, said that was all related to this nanny issue, where he hired this apparently illegal alien as a nanny, and didn't pay her taxes and didn't pay...

NGUYEN: OK.

HOSENBALL: ... her Social Security. And we know that that previously had knocked out attorney general candidates, a couple of them, for Clinton, because the -- in those days, the attorney general headed the immigration service, and now the department of homeland security includes the immigration service.

NGUYEN: So some questions to be answered. All right. Mark Hosenball with "Newsweek" magazine, we're out of time. But we do have so much more to ask. Thank you, though, for your time this morning.

Tony? HARRIS: To Washington now and Kelli Arena for a preview of "ON THE STORY." Hi, Kelli.

KELLI ARENA, "ON THE STORY": Hi, Tony.

Well, we are "ON THE STORY" of Bernie Kerik out as the president's choice for homeland security, war, terrorism, and higher oil prices, as well as sports and steroids, and how Martha Stewart will be out of the slammer onto your TV screen. I'll be talking about suspicions of ecoterrorism after those house fires in Maryland. Barbara Starr is "ON THE STORY" of soldiers zinging Rumsfeld over too few armored vehicles. It is a lot. It's all coming up, all "ON THE STORY."

HARRIS: We'll be watching. Kelli, thank you.

NGUYEN: Yes, we will.

But right now, we are out of time. We appreciate you joining us this morning.

HARRIS: "ON THE STORY" with Kelli Arena coming up next, after a check of the morning headlines.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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