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CNN Sunday Night
Rosa Parks' Life Celebrated; Interview with Richard Branson
Aired October 30, 2005 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: This is CNN SUNDAY NIGHT. Watching and waiting, all eyes are on the White House tomorrow. President Bush gets ready to name his latest nominee for the Supreme Court.
Also, Wilma one week later. We're live from South Florida. Thousands are still struggling to get basic utilities.
And national honors for a civil rights pioneer. Tonight, Rosa Parks remembered on Capitol Hill. These stories and a lot more next on CNN SUNDAY NIGHT.
Good evening, I'm Carol Lin at the CNN Center. Busy, busy in Washington, D.C. One eye on America's future, one eye on America's past. We've been told it may be just hours before we learn who President Bush picked to be the next U.S. Supreme Court nominee.
This on the same night that the nation pays the ultimate tribute to Rosa Parks. More on that in just a moment.
But first, here's CNN's Dana Bash on the sweeping up and the shaking up at the Bush White House.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DANA BASH, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A wave, a smile, and a hope he can finally start digging out from under the slew of political problems that threw his presidency into crisis.
The Bush clean-up campaign is expected to start Monday by announcing a new nominee for the Supreme Court to replace the embattled Harriet Miers.
Aides hope to calm conservatives with a pick that has a clear judicial record, unlike Miers.
SEN. JOHN CORNYN (R), TEXAS: I think, unfortunately, we're at a time in our nation's history where you have to have a demonstrated track record of a particular judicial philosophy that says that judges should not legislate from the bench. In other words, a traditional judicial philosophy.
BASH: Among those on the short list, appellate judges like known conservative Samuel Alito. Michael Luttig, another long time rank and file GOP favorite, as well as Priscilla Owen, and Alice Batchelder also considered by Mr. Bush before.
The White House hopes that do over debate about the Supreme Court, plus what aides call a back to basics focus on issues from the bird flu to the budget will help heal their political wounds.
But for rehabilitation, many allies are now going public with a long growing belief it's time to shake up a tired insular Bush staff.
SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: It's been five years now. Change is always good.
SEN. TRENT LOTT (R), MISSISSIPPI: I do think that new blood quite often helps change the dynamics.
KEN DUBERSTEIN, FORMER WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: All second term presidents need some fresh blood, some new ideas.
JULIE: One Bush adviser tells CNN the president is clearly disappointed in top staff for political debacles from hurricane recovery to the Miers nomination.
And senior aides say Mr. Bush will likely make changes, replacing the chief of staff and others as soon as the end of the year. One top official saying the president does not want to do anything that looks "brash or part of a PR effort."
Some outside advisers are already floating trade rep. Rob Portman to replace Andy Card. Deputy chief of staff Karl Rove escaped indictment for now, but sources say he did talk to reporters about a CIA operative. And some call the president's top political aide a liability.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's still around. He should be let go.
BASH (on camera): So far, Mr. Bush has given only one short statement praising former Cheney Chief of Staff Scooter Libby and expressing sadness for his indictment. Some on both sides of the aisle, however, say Mr. Bush should give a public statement saying what lessons he's learned from the leaks investigation.
A senior Bush official says that's not going to happen until the legal process is wrapped up.
Dana Bash, CNN, the White House.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LIN: Well, two former White House insiders will share lessons learned from past scandals and indictments. Bill Clinton's White House press secretary Joe Lockhart and a member of Ronald Reagan's inner circle are just ahead.
Now when the president announces who he wants to replace Justice Sandra Day O'Connor, many hope it will be a woman or a minority. O'Connor and Ruth Bader Ginsberg are the only women on the nation's highest court. Clarence Thomas is the only African American.
So you get to weigh in on our last call. Does race or gender matter in the next Supreme Court nomination? Give us a call at 1-800- 807-2620. Now the national tribute to the brave, the inspirational, and resolute face of American civil rights. A woman lies in honor tonight beneath the U.S. Capitol Rotunda. A live picture there at 10:00 at night.
That in itself is historic. The woman is Rosa Parks, who refused to give up her seat to a white man back in 1955. Gary Nuremberg on Capitol Hill -- Gary?
GARY NUREMBERG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Carol...
LIN: So many people lining up.
NUREMBERG: Oh, thousands, Carol. The casket bearing the remains of this woman described as the mother of the American Civil Rights movement started the day at a memorial service in Montgomery, Alabama, where Rosa Parks made history 50 years ago.
It ends today in the Rotunda of the United States Capitol, where by her simple presence, Rosa Parks is making history once again.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GARY NUREMBERG, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The body of the civil rights pioneer was taken from the newly renamed Baltimore- Washington International Thorgood Marshall Airport in a motorcade that included transit buses draped in black bunting.
Rosa Parks' coffin was carried into the United States Capitol Rotunda to lie in honor the first woman, only the second African- American, allowed the privilege.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: May her noble spirit remind us of the power of faithful, small acts.
NUREMBERG: President and Mrs. Bush laid a wreathe in tribute in the private ceremony, which took place before doors were opened to the public.
Parks old friend Dorothy Hite says her defiance was inspired.
DOROTHY HITE, FRIEND: And she said when the bus driver wanted her to move from her seat, it was as if she could hear a soft voice say to her, "Rosa Parks, you're a child of God. You can make a difference." I think she would want to say that there's a lot of work for us to do to make freedom and equality a reality, and that each of us can make a difference.
NUREMBERG: Thousands of men, women, and children waited hours to file by the coffin to pay their respects. Kimberly Burns came here from Maryland with both her parents and her 12-year old daughter, determined to be a part of history.
KIMBERLY BURNS: We now have rights to do some of the things she couldn't do and my parents couldn't do. So we have equal rights now.
NUREMBERG: A lesson her daughter has already learned.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That it is important for us to be part of this history that she gave us.
NUREMBERG: Why?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because she made equal rights. And just because she stood up now, we have equal rights. So why not be a part of the history?
NUREMBERG: Rosa Parks will lie in honor in the Capitol Rotunda until mid morning, a symbol of the America she helped change.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NUREMBERG: After the public viewing, Mrs. Parks' body will be taken to a church in Washington, D.C. for yet another memorial service to this woman who helped make 21st century America a far different place, Carol, than it was in 1955.
LIN: Gary, thank you so much.
An update now. So far, Hurricane Wilma killed 21 people in Florida. More than a million customers are still without electricity, even though it's been a week since the hurricane hit.
At least one utility says there might be power by Thanksgiving, but that is weeks away. So most schools are still closed.
So many people still need medical care, they are setting up MASH tents out in the open.
CNN'S Rusty Dornin reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RUSTY DORNIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Frank Azad fired up his chain saw to get rid of the mess in his yard. He thinks he's being extra careful, as do tens of thousands of other south Floridians trying to repair the mess wrought by Wilma.
But accidents happen. And local emergency rooms have been jammed. So the call went out a la Hawkeye Pierce. Now FEMA MASH units have erected tents in the parking lots of two south Florida hospitals.
This one is at Memorial Hospital Pembroke.
There's Gary Eastman recovering from back surgery when Wilma hit. He had to put up shutters before the storm. Now he's hurting.
GARY EASTMAN, PATIENT: It's pretty serious. And now they're talking about not restoring power another three weeks. And I can't get a hold of my doctor. The pharmacies are closed. There's no power.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What you did when you jacked off that tree, you tore.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So you tore some ligaments.
DORNIN: Robert Novak hurt himself jumping out of a tree in his backyard.
FEMA medic Edit Whitbread has seen a lot of hurricane related injuries over the last few months. He helped out on Katrina and Rita. Now he's patching up a man who sliced himself cutting a tree with his chainsaw.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're getting more and more chain saw injuries. And they tend to be pretty bad. People have been lucky, no amputations or anything, but a lot of stitches. Some back surgeries that could be, you know, long lasting.
UNKNOWN FEMALE: See the saline files?
DORNIN: The call went out to bring in the MASH units last week.
Once you arrive in the hospital parking lot, how quickly can you get this whole thing up and start seeing patients?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The whole thing? Two hours. Two hours to get things gong and patients, you know, cared for.
DORNIN: The hospital's emergency room director, Susan Cramer, says it's taken a huge load off their shoulders.
SUSAN CRAMER, MEMORIAL HOSPITAL PEMBROKE: We would be significantly overwhelmed. For our facility here, we would be seeing 200 percent of our normal volume.
DORNIN: As for the patients, well, Gary Eastman had severe muscle spasms. He got a shot and some medication all in under an hour.
So how long did you wait all together here?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was here I don't know, maybe half an hour, 45 minutes at the most.
DORNIN: An emergency room wait that might even make Hawkeye Pierce envious.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DORNIN: Things have been pretty quiet here throughout the past half hour, but these disaster medical assistance teams will be here all night.
And the MASH units will be in the south Florida area until the hospitals no longer need them -- Carol?
LIN: Wow. Thanks very much, Rusty.
Now let's take a look at stories around the world. 59 dead and 210 wounded in yesterday's blast in New Delhi.
A group has claimed responsibility, but police have not arrested anyone yet. Pakistan and the U.S. condemn the attacks.
A U.S. Marine died after being wounded Saturday by an improvised explosive device near Fallujah. At least 2015 U.S. troops have died in the Iraq War.
The brother of an Iraqi vice president and his driver were killed in Baghdad. Elsewhere, eight other Iraqis were killed in separate incidents.
The toll, the violence in Iraq, and on civilians is hard to measure. But a recent Pentagon report contained a rough estimate. CNN'S Aneesh Raman reports from Baghdad on one of the few attempts to put hard numbers on the emotional pain. And we caution, this report contains images and language some viewers may find disturbing.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Amid charred debris, they stand in disbelief, a small farming community crippled Saturday by a car bomb that killed nearly 30, that destroyed the central marketplace, that stunned generations.
Grieving women huddled on the roadside, as children stood next to the wheels of a blown out vehicle. Witness to a sequence played out often in many Iraqi cities.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): A vehicle drove near to the mosque, but there was nobody there. So it turned back to the market, where many people were around. And it exploded.
RAMAN: It is virtually impossible to know the true civilian toll of these sustained insurgent attacks. But tucked away in a report to Congress last month, the Pentagon, for the first time publicly estimated that 26,000 Iraqis have been killed or wounded by insurgents since the start of 2004 with an average of 64 civilian casualties daily by early September this year.
The numbers can be numbing. But each time, for each community, these attacks stop time and fuel sectarian divisions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Why do they kill our children? Make god damn them. God revenge them in this life and after life. God send them to hell.
RAMAN: At the local hospital, the scenes are familiar as well. The wounded, like nine year Ali Nasser, desperately tried to stay alive. His father turned away in anguish. Hours later, Ali died, one of four children killed in the attack. And so, as has happened before, as will happen again in Iraq, in the village of Whiter (ph), the coffins were lined up. Hasty burials carried out. (on camera): The rising number of civilian deaths is the tragic drumbeat of Iraq's insurgency. And while it will never be known how many have died in the past 2.5 years, such a number would undoubtedly do no justice to the loss suffered by families throughout this country.
Aneesh Raman, CNN, Baghdad.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LIN: A Halloween party turns violent in Wisconsin. Police use pepper spray and make arrests to try to break up the thousands out of control in Madison.
Some states are restricting sexual predators on Halloween. Does this make our kids safe?
And a media mogul wants to prove charity and profit can go together when it comes to capitalism. I'm going to speak live with Richard Branson.
You're watching CNN SUNDAY NIGHT.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LIN: Live pictures now out of Washington, D.C. as Rosa Parks, a civil rights leader and icon, lays in honor beneath the Capitol Rotunda.
Now new presidential poll numbers are out tonight. CNN/"USA TODAY" and Gallup asked 800 American adults to gauge their gut feelings about the president, and to look into the future.
Well, here's what they said. Just under half responded. They found President Bush honest and trustworthy. That's up since September, indicating the CIA leak scandal didn't hurt the president's approval, at least in that regard.
But then there's this. Asked about the remainder of this administration, 55 percent of respondents predict failure. The poll was taken this weekend. Consider there is a three point margin for error.
Now tomorrow, we are told we can expect the announcement of the new Supreme Court nominee.
And soon, possibly some new names and faces on the president's top staff. It is the classic political response to controversy and scandal that no administration has escaped.
Earlier, I spoke with two former White House insiders, one of whom endured the Reagan era Iran Contra affair.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Carol, there is a key difference. With Iran- Contra, President Reagan himself was at issue and was implicated. And in this particular situation, of course, President Bush is not. It's just individual staff.
Nevertheless, when you have a scandal like this that does touch the White House, I think you have to put all hands on deck. You want to segregate out the legal problems, delegate those to one individual.
Most importantly, try to move forward and implement your agenda. Try to take everybody's mind off the scandal and on the issues that you want to focus on.
LIN: Joe, how important is it, do you think, for President Bush to simply come out himself and say mistakes were made, and then do a full house cleaning at the White House in the inner circle.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, Well, I think, listen, I think he's got to speak in something more declarative than the passive voice. Mistakes were made. I don't think we'll cut it here.
I actually thinks it's important for him to come out and say more than the said on Friday. I do think he has time. I don't think that there was any time limit on this.
He'll have to decide whether he wants to clean house. And I think people mistake the loyalty question.
And you know, it's something the president will have to decide himself.
LIN: Joe, how distracting is this for the White House staff. It's such a crucial time for this president. I mean, his poll numbers are dropping. He's on the
Is loyalty is not to his staff. It's to the country. And if his staff or any member of his staff that's too (INAUDIBLE). Can do the job. That he owes it to the country to bring somebody in who can concentrate on it.
So I think it's a false question of loyalty. And that, you know, see. You know, it's something hat the president will have to decide himself.
Natalie, Joe, how distracting is this for the White House staff at such a crucial time. For this president, I mean, his poll numbers are dropping. He's on the cusp. Now of naming yet another Supreme Court nominee after the Harriet Miers debacle.
In your days at the White House, during the Clinton scandals, managing the behind the scenes, what was that like for the White House staff?
LOCKHART: Well, I think it is - it's distracting and frustrating. Distracting because there are a lot legal issued that have nothing to do with why the president was elected that are on your plate, that you have to deal with. Frustrating because you believe in your agenda. You want to move it forward. Whether it's a Democratic agenda or a Republican agenda, you want to move forward.
And you just can't seem to get any attention to it, because the press all seems focused on the scandals. You've got to segregate the work out. Take a few people. Have them deal with the Vivgo issues. And tell everybody else you were sent here to do a job. Focus on your job. Don't worry about the legal issues.
LIN: But doesn't it undercut his ability to perhaps name, a really bold name for the Supreme Court nominee?
LOCKHART: Well. Listen, you know, it - a weakened president is going to have difficulty getting any through - anything to Congress much less a life time appointment to the Supreme Court.
But you've got to remember here the president is getting cross pressure. You know, Harriet Miers basically upset his base, the right win of the Republican party. So there's no doubt that what we're going to get is someone who satisfies that vase.
Now the problem is if that's someone that the Democrats have problems with, a weakened president's going to have trouble getting it through. I think Democrats will be much more emboldened to stand up and say, this is not a main stream jurist. And you know, go back to the drawing board.
LIN: So Frank, where does the president have the opportunity to really hit it out of the ballpark?
FRANK DONATELLI, PRES. REAGAN'S POLITICAL DIR.: Well, I think first of all, I think the Supreme Court nomination, I guess I would slightly disagree with Joe. I believe that what John Roberts proved, Carol, is that someone that makes the constitutionalist case for a minimalist judiciary, judges fairly are narrowing interpreting the constitution.
A nominee like that can win not just the Republican base, but independence and a good number of Democrats. John Roberts got 78 votes. He's articulate to be sure, but I don't think he's one of a kind by any means. So I would - that would - that's where I would look.
I might also look to try to get a budget true and maybe some spending cuts, Carol. And then next year, you have the opportunity maybe to do some tax cuts and maybe take on the immigration issue.
There's plenty for them to do.
LIN: Frank Donatelli, Joe Lockhart, thank you. We'll see what happens.
In the meantime, a California teen dresses up in a black cape and helmet and goes on a deadly shopping rampage.
Also, an annual Halloween event in Wisconsin, maybe over for good after a riot almost breaks out.
The last call question tonight, does trace or gender matter in the next Supreme Court nomination. Give us a call at 1-800-807-2620.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LIN: News across the nation, starting in Madison, Wisconsin. It was another rowdy Halloween college town weekend. Police arrested 450 people, but no one was seriously hurt.
Not much to report on property damage, but the pictures are pretty dramatic. The mayor complained that the city spent $350,000 to maintain order. He thinks the annual event on State Street might be canceled because people keep causing trouble.
Four students are Cal State Chico got anywhere from one year to 90 days probation. They pleaded guilty after a fraternity pledge died after drinking too much water in a hazing ritual. Two more students go to court later next month.
In Louisiana, NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue says he wants the saints to stay in New Orleans. The team might move to San Antonio in the wake of Hurricane Katrina. The team went up against the Dolphins today in Baton Rouge. It was the Saints first season game in their home state. Miami beat the saints, though, 21 to 6. No sympathy there.
And in Las Vegas, it's not every day you see a teenager pony up a half million dollars. But professional golfer, Michelle Wie, can probably afford it.
She made that donation to build Clinton's Katrina fund and personally gave him the check. And then later, the 16-year old and the former president hit the links for a friendly round of Golf.
All right, convicted sex offenders in some states may have to stay indoors this Halloween. Up next, trying something new to eat his (INAUDIBLE). But it may be a waste of time.
Plus, an upscale neighborhood is the scene of a horrific crime. A teen shooting rampage is in the news. You're watching CNN SUNDAY NIGHT.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LIN: Tropical Storm Beta dumps more rain on Nicaragua and Honduras. It was a Category 2 hurricane when it toppled trees and collapsed homes. Floods and mud slides are the next big threat.
The Philadelphia transit workers say they will strike at midnight, if they don't get a labor deal they like. A strike would virtually shut down all subway, bus, and trolleys used by half a million people.
Prince Charles and his wife Camilla arrive in the U.S. on Tuesday for a week. It's his first official tour of the country in nearly 10 years. The two will inaugurate a memorial garden in New York for British victims of the 9/11 attacks. They also plan to visit with President and Mrs. Bush in Washington.
Now, police in Southern California are trying to uncover a motive for a bizarre shooting rampage. It happened in Orange County, south of Los Angeles. Police say a 19-year-old man shot and killed two neighbors, shot into the home of a third, and aimed his gun at another before returning home and taking his own life. CNN's Kareen Wynter has this bizarre story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KAREEN WYNTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Donning a black cape and helmet, Orange County investigators say the alleged gunman, 19-year-old William Freund, left his house Saturday morning, not on a Halloween hunt; instead, a deadly mission -- a shooting spree that would rock this upscale suburban Southern California neighborhood.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was just scary, because this has never happened so close to home before.
WYNTER: Armed with a shotgun, officials say Freund drove about 70 yards to a neighbor's house and killed 22-year-old Christina Smith and her 45-year-old father. Both were shot in the upper torso, the bodies found on the staircase and in the family room.
Christina's brother heard the gunshots and escaped through the backdoor.
Investigators say the shooting continued. Freund shot through a neighbor's window, and came face to face with another neighbor.
JIM AMORMINO, ORANGE COUNTY SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT: The suspect then pointed the shotgun at him, attempted to fire that gun at that potential victim. However, the shotgun misfired. Then, the suspect apparently went home and then shot himself to death.
WYNTER: Neighbors described Freund as a loner. And just what triggered the shooting rampage has investigators baffled.
ERIN GIUDICE, ORANGE CO. SHERIFF'S DEPT: There doesn't seem to be any relationship with the victims. There's been no dispute. He doesn't have a record, not that we know of at this time.
WYNTER (on camera): Investigators say autopsy results on Freund and the victims offered no additional insight as to the teen's motive for the shootings. Toxicology tests were conducted on Freund, but according to sheriff officials, the results won't be available for another several weeks.
Kareen Wynter, CNN, Los Angeles.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LIN: Well, that story had to creep you out, so consider the "Talk Tonight," when a lot of you are going to be sending your kids out into the streets dressed up as little ghosts and goblins, going door to door. Several states want to make sure that they're safe, so they're enacting curfews to restrict the activities of paroled sex offenders. Now, some states require sex offenders to attend treatment programs for several hours on Halloween night. Others tell sex offenders to stay at home and not hand out candy. The only people these folks will be seeing on Halloween are probation officers or police. They come by to make sure sex offenders are complying with the law.
All right, some people say that the laws are ineffective, because most children are victimized by people they know, not strangers, and they say the restrictions have limited value, because they focus on just one night a year. Tom Morris is a field reporter for "America's Most Wanted," and Carolyn Atwell Davis, well, she is the director of legislative affairs for the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. Welcome to both of you.
TOM MORRIS, AMERICA'S MOST WANTED: Thank you.
LIN: Tom, let me begin with you. Is there any evidence that sex offenders are out there, trying to target kids on Halloween night?
MORRIS: I think it's more paranoia than anything else, but nonetheless, these types of activities by the police, to try to keep sex offenders off the street on Halloween are a good thing. Anything that puts pressure on sex offenders is a good thing, and we support that.
LIN: Really? It doesn't sound like -- it doesn't sound like a shtick to you? You know, a good PR attempt, hey, we're doing something about sex offenders?
MORRIS: Well, it definitely gets attention. It definitely gets PR, and that's why we're talking about it. But it's also something that does put pressure on sex offenders. It lets them know that they're not under the radar. And I think that you still have to come back to the common sense thing, that parents ultimately have to be responsible for the safety of their children 365 days a year, not just on Halloween.
LIN: Right. It's surprising, you know, the number of parents that, you know, really just let their kids walk out the door and say, you know, come back in an hour.
Carolyn, do you think that enacting curfews, restrictions of these sex offenders is going to prevent crime? Is it going to work?
CAROLYN ATWELL DAVIS, MISSING AND EXPLOITED CHILDREN CENTER: Well, I think the greater value in it, as Tom pointed out, is that it reinforces to sex offenders that, in fact, law enforcement is watching them. And also, there is great value in reinforcing to parents that they must take steps to protect their children on the other days of the year.
But in fact, it may prevent harm to some children at least, even though it's for a limited period of time, on one night of the year. LIN: Well, why not enact a curfew nationwide? And why not, you know, 365 days a year?
MORRIS: Well, I think you have different levels of sex offenders, first of all. If you're talking about, you know, level three sex offenders, those people need constant, constant monitoring. And you know, we put an ankle bracelet on Martha Stewart, but there are a whole lot of sex offenders in this country that really should be monitored, and have electronic monitoring, particularly level three sex offenders.
I'm more concerned right now with the fact that we had 220 -- I guess 2,200 sex offenders that are unaccounted for from Louisiana after Katrina, and they're spread across 48 states, and tomorrow night you really couldn't not -- you may not know who is in your neighborhood, because no one knows he's even there.
LIN: Well, you know, I mean, if you're talking about level three sex offenders who need constant monitoring, Carolyn, you got to ask, what are they even doing out on the street? I mean, that's a whole different discussion, but you know, it just seems crazy where you get to the point where you have to think about Halloween night and how to keep these perverts indoors and away from the kids?
DAVIS: Well, that's a good point, but the fact of the matter is, the best laws and the most restrictive restrictions in the world on sex offenders are not going to protect children from all the sex offenders that are out there. It's only going to protect them from the sex offenders we know about. And as you already pointed out, Carol, most children are, in fact, victimized by someone that they know, either a family member, a close family friend, or someone who's involved in a child's activities on a daily basis -- say, a coach or a teacher or someone.
So the most important thing is for parents to teach children how to empower themselves to stay safe.
LIN: And what tip is that?
DAVIS: Well, three basic ways. Which is to -- they can say no to an adult, they can run, they can go, and they should tell someone, a trusted adult, about what happened. So say no, go, and tell.
It's very important, because parents are not going to be supervising their children at all times. They're going to be at school and activities. And so if the children have the tools to keep themselves safe, that is going to be a very important lesson to take away from this.
LIN: Carolyn, thank you. Tom, thank you very much.
DAVIS: Thank you, Carol.
LIN: Let's hope it's a safe Halloween for everybody.
DAVIS: Thank you. LIN: Well, a Wal-Mart memo sparks controversy. Does a corporation have the legal right to screen applicants and only hire healthy workers? Find out tonight in our "Rap Sheet."
And still to come, my live interview with media mogul Richard Branson. You're watching CNN SUNDAY NIGHT.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): It was a shocking sideshow, captured by TV crews gathered at the L.A. County courthouse to cover the Robert Blake hearing in 2003. Attorney Gerald Curry was at the courthouse for an unrelated case when William Strier approached him, asked his name, and opened fire.
Strier then calmly walked away. He was apparently angry that Curry was representing Strier's sister in a dispute over a trust fund.
Curry was shot in the neck, both arms, and shoulder, and taken from the scene by paramedics.
Curry survived, recovered completely, and still lives and practices law in Southern California.
GERALD CURRY, ATTORNEY: When I leave the office, when I go to court, when I go to the parking structure, I tend to, you know, keep my eyes open, look around.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He has a gun.
COOPER: Curry's shooter, William Strier, was ruled mentally unfit to stand trial and remains in a state hospital. But Curry says he doesn't harbor any bad feelings for Strier.
CURRY: The odds of this happening were probably one in a million. And so therefore I try not to let it affect my life or not having bitterness and try to maintain a positive and optimistic outlook.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LIN: Right now, an update on an emotional story from Maryland: A woman's fight for life. Her name is Yvette Cade. She's 31 years old, from suburban Washington, D.C. She's in a burn ward in critical condition after it's reported her husband doused her with gasoline and set her on fire.
Now, this man, a Prince George's District Court judge, didn't attack her, but he lifted a restraining order from the man who allegedly did. He is Judge Richard Palumbo, and this isn't the first time he's raised eyebrows in Maryland, and he's certainly upset Cade's family members. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHEREEN JACKSON, YVETTE CADE'S SISTER: Come forth to my family and a segment of the population and express your extreme remorse over your remarks, and step down. Let someone else more qualified to deal with domestic violence cases take over.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LIN: Well, we put this young woman's fight for life on tonight's "Rap Sheet." Also, an internal Wal-Mart health care memo that's causing a lot of controversy.
Joining me tonight, Stacey Honowitz, a Broward County, Florida prosecutor, and criminal defense attorney Jayne Weintraub.
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Hi, Carol.
LIN: It's been way too long, ladies, I'm so glad to see both of you.
STACEY HONOWITZ, BROWARD COUNTY, FL PROSECUTOR: Hi, Carol.
LIN: Stacey, let me begin with you. All right, so Judge Palumbo. He's on administrative leave. He's still receiving a paycheck. He can't be sued, right? I mean, the guy can't be sued. So is there any other way that this judge could be punished?
HONOWITZ: Well, Carol, you know, a lot of times it's happened. This really is not an isolated incident. You probably, if you researched, could find all around the country that judges have been in the same position, where they've unfortunately lifted restraining orders or protective orders, and then subsequent to that, the person who it was lifted against goes out and commits a crime, as in this case.
So what can be done? Well, certainly there's not going to be an impeachment proceeding, but people can notify the Judicial Nominating Committee, these people that nominate these people to be judges, and certainly there can be a review as to whether or not this person should be sitting in a domestic violence situation.
WEINTRAUB: Why are you presuming that anything wrong happened here? We don't even know what the evidence was. We don't know what was said. We haven't seen the transcript. We don't know anything, except that she asked for a continuation of the restraining order.
Stacey, you of all people know that women and men go into these courts all the time, day in and day out, for money in divorce and custody cases, and they lie. And they make things up...
(CROSSTALK)
HONOWITZ: And Jayne, and look what happened. And in a number of cases, what happens...
(CROSSTALK)
HONOWITZ: ... in Prince George's County, happens all over, where a restraining order is lifted, and two weeks later, the woman is killed. So it happens all the time. All I'm saying is, there does need to be a review of that judge if something like this happens.
I'm not saying that every judge can look in the future and say we know what's going to happen, but in a case like this, if there is a pattern of conduct by this judge...
WEINTRAUB: Judges make mistakes.
(CROSSTALK)
HONOWITZ: ... look at this judge's history. That's exactly right...
(CROSSTALK)
HONOWITZ: If it happens enough, you can review it.
WEINTRAUB: Judges do the best they can, otherwise the judge, according to you, would just have to grant every single time...
LIN: Well, wait a second, Jayne...
HONOWITZ: Absolutely...
LIN: Jayne, fist of all, is it acceptable to you that this judge lifted this restraining order, and then in a matter of days, this woman was set on fire by her ex-husband?
WEINTRAUB: Is it acceptable? Of course not. I'm sure it's not acceptable to this judge either, and if he had any idea that would happen, he never would have agreed to let the restraining order be lifted.
This -- what I'm saying, Carol, is we don't know why the restraining order was lifted. We don't know if somebody's credibility was at stake, we don't know if somebody, you know, if it had gone on too long. And mistakes can happen. Judges make mistakes. You know, people out on bond commit other crimes sometimes.
HONOWITZ: That's right.
WEINTRAUB: That doesn't mean all the time...
HONOWITZ: Jayne is 100 percent right on that.
WEINTRAUB: ... that you don't give somebody a bond. That means...
(CROSSTALK)
HONOWITZ: ... review. Judges do make mistakes, where they can't see (INAUDIBLE), they don't always know the future, but they can be reviewed, other than by the governor -- by the Judicial Nominating Committee.
LIN: Hey, guys, did you hear about this Wal-Mart memo, all right? It was a memo that was leaked by this executive, who was making some suggestions on how the company could save money on health care, and perhaps do a different profile, get a healthier worker, because apparently, their rate of obesity and heart disease is six times greater than the national average. All right? So everybody went kind of crazy about this, because it sounded like Wal-Mart -- it was suggested that Wal-Mart would start profiling for maybe skinnier or younger, you know, healthier employees.
WEINTRAUB: You pay less insurance for them.
LIN: Exactly. Jayne, do you think they did anything wrong?
WEINTRAUB: Yeah, I think they probably did. You know, while it's very commendable that Wal-Mart wants healthier, younger workforce, the bottom line is that if they want that, they need to promote an incentive program to get that. You can't discriminating against somebody because they're older or sicker or disabled. That's against the law.
So what Wal-Mart should do if they want to promote a wellness program is do just that. Give somebody a bonus if they participate in an exercise program every day.
LIN: Well, do you think a company should foot the bill for an unhealthy lifestyle?
WEINTRAUB: I think that if it's not related to the work, that it is none of the employer's business, actually. And if they're good workers, they're good workers. Somebody isn't going to tell me I can't go outside of my office and eat if I'm employed by them.
LIN: Stacey?
HONOWITZ: Listen, I can't believe that we're actually disagreeing on this, but I've got to tell you something, if they want to lower their health bills and they don't want the financial responsibility, they shouldn't have to foot the bill for sick employees. And if this is their way, although there are certain things they can't discriminate against, I think if they want a healthy atmosphere, they have to describe what they mean by healthy. They have every reason, every right in the world to want to have healthy employees (INAUDIBLE)...
(CROSSTALK)
LIN: The wording is -- the wording is attract healthier associates.
HONOWITZ: OK, so they have to define healthy. What do they mean? Someone who is thinner, someone who is in better shape, someone who doesn't have high blood pressure? There is nothing wrong with anything like that.
If a company that wants healthy employees and doesn't want to have to fit -- doesn't have to foot the bill for...
(CROSSTALK)
WEINTRAUB: But you can't discriminate, you can't fire somebody because they're older and sicker or a little heavier and more susceptible to (INAUDIBLE).
LIN: OK, we got to wrap up there, ladies.
(CROSSTALK)
LIN: For the record, it's not that they were saying they were going to fire anybody; it's that they were trying to attract a healthier associate, and the question is, what does that mean? The executives are saying, well, we might offer, you know, better programs, you know, maybe free gym memberships, that was the implication.
WEINTRAUB: I'll tell you, Carol, after a week of hurricaning it without a power station, I'm ready to sign up for the gym.
LIN: I know. I'm so glad to see both of you doing well. We were thinking about you last week.
WEINTRAUB: Thank you.
LIN: All right.
HONOWITZ: Thanks, Carol.
LIN: Making a better pitch for world health. Up next, a live chat with billionaire businessman Richard Branson on his pending visit to the Global Health Summit.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LIN: An extraordinary event is happening right now at the nation's capital. The first woman to lie in honor there, Rosa Parks, a civil rights pioneer, because she refused to give up her seat back in 1955 on a bus to a white man. That triggered the civil rights movement. Tonight, we want to share with you the highlights of tonight's tribute.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(MUSIC)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We give thanks for the life and legacy of Rosa Parks. We thank you that her courageous spirit ignited a movement that aroused our national conscience.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh gracious God, we do thank you that on this 30th day of October 2005, that we can gather in this historic rotunda, an see laying in repose and in dignity the life of a brave woman who, almost 50 years ago, sat down on a segregated bus in Montgomery.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As your three children, we say to Mrs. Rosa Parks, ride on. Ride on in the direction of endless hope.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some might say she sleepeth, but we know in our hearts she liveth, because it's people like her that will bless unborn generations to rise up and to keep the march moving.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LIN: And now, my conversation with Richard Branson.
Charity and profit are not usually used in the same sentence, but maybe they should be. Sir Richard Branson, founder of Virgin Group Limited, will make that argument this week at the Global Health Summit, sponsored by Time, Inc. He joins us from New York tonight.
Sir Richard -- may I call you Sir Richard?
RICHARD BRANSON, FOUNDER, VIRGIN GROUP: You can call me Richard.
LIN: OK. I like the sound of Sir Richard, though.
I like the notion of what you're talking about at the Global Health Summit, the fact that it could be good business. Never mind major corporations, what about the stockholders? Why would stockholders think it's good business to invest in global health?
BRANSON: Well, I mean, I'd just come back from Africa, and if you go to the hospitals there, basically the hospitals are places you go to die. There are rows and rows and rows of dying people. In fact, there's about 16,000 people who die every day of an unnecessary illness, and that's AIDS. And if they got three pills a day before they actually got AIDS, when they were HIV positive, not one of those people need die.
So, if you're running a company in Africa, I think you have a moral obligation to make sure that none of your employees die. But it's also good business sense not to let a whole generation of 16- to 45-year-olds die. You know, you've got -- every single company has got enormous costs involved, and people being ill and people dying. But overwhelmingly, we all have an enormous moral obligation to sort out -- sort out this awful illness, and a completely unnecessary illness as well.
LIN: You know, Richard, it's interesting that you're bringing this up, because all this week, you know, one of the big stories in America is this company, Wal-Mart, which hires more than a million people in the United States, and a whole debate about how much healthier the quality of health care it gives its workers. And there is an argument in this country that says, look, companies really don't have an obligation to offer health care to its employees. How do you change that mind-set in America, where there is so much money, and there are a lot of people with a big heart, but when you're talking about corporate America, there is so much money, but it's the stockholder that people are thinking about, not those dying in Africa? BRANSON: Well, I mean, to be perfectly frank, I'm not too bothered about what happens in America. The problems there are that much compared to what's happening in Africa. You know, what, I mean, just to put light in perspective, we've got the equivalent of 40 jumbo jets of people -- 40 jumbo jets crashing into the sea every single day of people dying in Africa. And it's completely unnecessary for those people to die. And the problem is resolvable, and hopefully this, you know, we can concentrate this week at the Time Health Summit and actually try to make sure that it doesn't happen in the future.
It is a sin. It's unforgivable.
In America, yes, there are issues, but those issues are insignificant to what we're allowing to happen, only a continent away.
LIN: Sir Richard, yeah, I think it's going to always be a constant battle in this country to get people to think outside of our own backyards.
BRANSON: Well, today, I mean, today, you know, we're celebrating the life of a black lady who was willing to...
LIN: Rosa Parks.
BRANSON: ... you know, to stand up on a bus -- or not stand up on a bus and not be moved. I mean, you know, what we hopefully we'll be doing is celebrating in three or four years' time the fact that nobody in Africa is dying unnecessarily.
LIN: Wouldn't that be a gift. Richard Branson, I'm sorry...
BRANSON: And it's up to all of us to do so.
LIN: ... we're going to have to leave it there.
BRANSON: Thank you.
LIN: A pleasure to speak with you. Good work and good luck at the speech.
BRANSON: Thank you.
LIN: Coming up at the top of the hour, "CNN PRESENTS: Reasonable Doubt." Can crime labs be trusted? Plus, a check of the headlines. But first, your responses to tonight's "Last Call" question. Does race and gender matter in the next Supreme Court nomination? Here is what you said.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CALLER: (INAUDIBLE) Alabama. I don't believe that it matters, as long as they're qualified.
CALLER: Dave from Quincy, Illinois. The Supreme Court needs to represent the diversity of our country.
CALLER: (INAUDIBLE) from Ocean Springs, Mississippi. No. Race or gender does not matter.
CALLER: My name is Devonia (ph). I am calling from Perry, Georgia. Yes, race and gender does matter. We need someone who represents the minority of America. We need someone that represents fresh blood and just America in general.
CALLER: This is Cadey (ph) from Victorville, California. I think it does matter, but I think it matters more how they think and how they'll vote, and whether they're a judge, and if they have references and showing how they voted in the past and how they'll vote in the future.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
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