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State of the Union
Interview With Rep. Jamaal Bowman (D-NY); Interview With U.S. Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm; Interview With Rep. Mike Turner (R-OH); Interview With Gov. Asa Hutchinson (R-AR). Aired 9-10a ET
Aired August 14, 2022 - 09:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST (voice-over): Stunning discovery. An FBI search at President Trump's home leads the FBI to highly classified material.
MERRICK GARLAND, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: Upholding the rule of law means applying the law evenly, without fear or favor.
KEILAR: Were national security secrets at risk? And did President Trump break the law? The top Republican on the House Intelligence Committee, Congressman Mike Turner, ahead.
And across the finish line. Democrats pass their climate and tax bill on a party-line vote.
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): This is historic and it is cause for celebration.
KEILAR: As it heads to President Biden's desk, will Americans struggling with inflation feel any relief? I will speak to Cabinet Secretary Jennifer Granholm next.
Plus: making the case. The spotlight again on former President Trump, as his party looks ahead to the midterms and Democrats make inroads on their agenda. How will voters respond? Arkansas Republican Governor Asa Hutchinson is coming up.
KEILAR: Hello. I'm Brianna Keilar in New York, where the state of our union is wondering just how secure the storage rooms at Mar-a-Lago really are.
House leaders are requesting a briefing and a damage assessment from top intelligence leadership, after unsealed court papers reveal the FBI found highly classified documents in an unprecedented search of former President Trump's Florida resort on Monday.
The FBI recovered 11 sets of classified documents, including some of the most highly classified government information. And the warrant revealed the search was executed under three federal statutes, potential violations of the Espionage Act, obstruction of justice and the criminal handling of government records.
The revelations follow months of efforts by the government to recover classified information from Mar-a-Lago. New this weekend, two sources tell CNN that, in June, a lawyer for the former president signed a letter asserting there was no more classified information stored there, and that was clearly not the case.
For his part, the former president has said he did nothing wrong and lashed out at Attorney General Merrick Garland and the FBI over the search, attacks echoed by many of his supporters.
Just yesterday in Phoenix, armed protesters demonstrated outside an FBI field office. And the FBI is warning about new violent threats against its own law enforcement officers and government facilities.
Joining us now is the Republican Congressman Mike Turner of Ohio. He is the ranking member of the House Intelligence Committee.
Sir, thanks for being with us this morning.
REP. MIKE TURNER (R-OH): Hey, Brianna. Thank you for having me.
KEILAR: So, now that you have seen the level of classification we're talking about in these documents at Mar-a-Lago, and you have learned the DOJ is investigating possible Espionage Act violations, are you concerned that Donald Trump was keeping this highly classified documents -- these highly classified documents at his resort?
TURNER: Well, we have a number of concerns, Brianna, obviously.
One is whether or not the raid itself was justified. We have this list from the FBI, but we don't have conclusive as to whether or not this actually is classified material and whether or not it rises to the level the highest classified material.
On a bipartisan basis, Congress is saying, show us the goods. We want to know, one, what did the Department of Justice and the FBI tell the judge that they were going to find and what did they find?
There's nothing in those boxes that members of the intelligence community and the committee -- and the committee itself don't have the ability to see. If it rises to the level of an immediate national security threat, which it's what it would take to actually raid the president's home, because, as you know, they had a number of options available to them, including just going to court and asking for the courts to enforce the subpoena that they had.
Now, clearly, no one is above the law. Donald Trump is not above the law. And Attorney General Garland is not above the law either. And Congress has the powers of oversight. He needs to comply. We have seen material like this before. We have seen materials that have been submitted to courts for warrants.
This is not unprecedented. His actions are unprecedented in history, and he has a lot of questions to answer.
KEILAR: You're familiar with special access programs and the level of classification that is.
Why are you casting doubt on how classified this information was, if you see the property receipt, and it's very clear that this was SCI information, some of it?
TURNER: Well, but what the receipt shows is that this material was marked as such. It doesn't mean that it currently is.
I can give you an example for -- Zawahiri. We were giving briefings and briefing materials concerning the hunt for Zawahiri, all of the issues of trying to find Zawahiri, how they found Zawahiri.
Today, you know those -- that information. It's been broadcast on your own news channel. But yet, if you go down into the SCIF of the Intelligence Committee, we will still have materials that are still marked classified, TS/SCI.
Similarly, the Russian anti-satellite weapons, we have classified materials that are marked as classified, but yet you yourself have broadcast those. These are materials that are 2 years old. We don't know what they are.
We don't know if they rise to the level of being a national security threat. But the fact that you have here the attorney general, who is going after the -- President Biden's political rival, whose own personal career was derailed on the way to the Supreme Court by Donald Trump himself, an unequal application of a law between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, and the fact that you have the FBI previously submitting in warrants warrant materials that were bogus that were politically motivated that targeted Donald Trump, there's a high level of skepticism.
But we don't have to speculate. We have the clearance. We have the oversight ability. Attorney General Garland needs to provide these materials. You have bipartisan calls to do that. Put the materials in a room. Let us see them. And then we can tell you what our answer is and what our discernment is of whether or not this is a true national security threat or whether or not this is an abuse of discretion by Attorney General Garland.
KEILAR: Do you take home documents marked special access?
KEILAR: And yet you're casting doubt on whether or not -- sorry. Go on.
TURNER: And, quite frankly, I have been in the Oval Office with the president. I'd be very surprised if he has actual documents that rise to the level of an immediate national security threat.
KEILAR: Well, the documents, just to be clear, several sets -- and you're aware of that because you have seen the property receipt. You're casting doubt. You want information. You don't actually have that information on which to base that conclusion at this point.
But you yourself would not take on documents that are marked special access? You would not take home this sensitive, compartmented information?
TURNER: Well, remember what I'm casting doubt on. I mean, not -- it's not -- these are labeled that. We don't know whether or not these are classified and rise to the level.
But the second thing we don't know is, are they a national security threat? Attorney General Garland could have gone to court to enforce the subpoena that he had...
KEILAR: Do you know they're not? Sir, do you know they're not?
TURNER: ... asking the court to demand that Donald Trump deliver the materials to the court.
Instead, he spent nine hours in his home. That rises to the highest level. We give them authority to be intrusive and invasive. And that's to be used sparingly. There are other options that are available to him. The fact that they spent nine hours in Trump's residence, they are going to have to justify.
KEILAR: They had concern this could be a national security threat.
When you cast doubt on that, do you have evidence that this was not a national security threat or that this was known to be not be a national security threat?
TURNER: Well, that's what great about this. We're actually to the point -- and I'm sorry. You're breaking up a bit for me.
But we don't have to speculate. We have all the clearance. Congress has all the powers of oversight. All Attorney Garland has to do is comply with the laws, provide this information to us, let us look.
Show us the goods. Bipartisan basis, people are calling for the attorney general, Garland, show us the goods. We need to determine, is this a national security threat? And as we also determine that, is -- was there abuse of discretion by Attorney General Garland?
KEILAR: So, you're awaiting that information that you would like to get from DOJ.
You mentioned Hillary Clinton. I would like to read a couple of things that you said about Hillary Clinton's e-mails in 2016.
You said -- quote -- in May of that year: "Hillary Clinton would be an awful president, as she has shown a blatant disregard for our laws."
You said: "Former Secretary of State Clinton has put our national security at risk by showing a blatant disregard for highly sensitive classified information." In October, you said: "I believe her actions as secretary of state were not in accordance with the law."
Some of your comments were said before it was even clear what was in her e-mails. You're not holding Donald Trump to the same standard. Why?
TURNER: Well, there are -- there are -- there's a significant difference here.
One, there was active transmission of ongoing diplomatic classified communications that were traveling through Hillary Clinton's server in her residence, which innately and inherently are going to be at risk. These are 2-year-old documents that are in the president's residence. We don't know what's in them.
They're not ongoing, certainly now, of which they waited two years and a weekend after they got their warrant to raid his home.
KEILAR: Are you -- do you have evidence -- do you have evidence -- sir, do you have evidence that they are not ongoing?
TURNER: They don't rise to the same level of ongoing communications that you had in Hillary Clinton.
KEILAR: Do you know that?
TURNER: But, remember, they did not raid Hillary Clinton's home.
This is why -- this is why Hillary -- this is why Garland has got to answer these questions. It's unequal application of the law. They did not raid her home.
KEILAR: Sir, how do you know -- how do you that they're not...
TURNER: They spent nine hours in his home.
KEILAR: Excuse me, sir. Sir, I just want to be clear. How do you know they're not ongoing? You haven't been briefed on what you want to be briefed on. How do you know that? Why are you saying that, if you don't know it?
TURNER: Well, according to the receipt, according -- well, we do know it. And even you know it.
And you and I can both agree that the inventory itself lists papers that were taken from his home in boxes. Papers are static. They're not ongoing data communications and transmissions of data, which is what was going through Hillary Clinton's server.
Remember, they did not raid his -- her home. They raided his home. They spent nine hours in his house. That's clearly...
KEILAR: You're talking about the information it -- but what you are talking about is the information itself and whether it is still classified or whether it is still a national security risk?
TURNER: No, I was not talking about that. I was talking about the manner of transmission and the timeliness, what it represents as classified information.
Now, as you know, also, what you didn't report, Donald Trump says he declassified these materials. No one questions that the president -- former president would have had, as president, the authority to declassify that material.
So it is possible that you yourself can see all this material. And I know CNN will be demanding, I'm sure, as you demanded that the warrant and the affidavit be released to you, I'm certain that, if it's declassified, which is a fact-based issue that's going to have to be also resolved, you yourself will want to see these documents.
How do they rise to the level -- because you have to agree, when the FBI chooses the most intrusive, the most invasive process of invading a man's home, and they have available to them other options...
KEILAR: Are you saying -- I just want to be clear. You're -- these are classified documents. These are classified documents, some at the highest level.
TURNER: ... demanding the court enforce the subpoena, demanding that former President Trump deliver the documents to the court, the fact that they choose the most invasive has to be concern to you also.
KEILAR: There are a number of steps they took before we have a graphic to show people of the timeline of the other steps they took leading up to it. I just want to be clear, they didn't jump from nothing to go into this search and seizure.
Just to be clear, are you saying that the -- where they were kept was secure?
TURNER: No, I have -- I have no idea. These are questions Attorney General Garland is going to have to answer it.
The question is not, did they jump and were they doing other things? The question is, what did they do in between? They had other options. I'm certain that you have to understand that going into his house, especially the former president, President Biden's political rival, into his house for nine hours, is the most intrusive, invasive -- and Attorney Garland's got to justify that.
Congress has the authority of power of oversight, and he needs to tell us, what is the justification? Show us these documents. We have the clearance to see them. He needs to show us the goods.
KEILAR: I do want to ask you.
The former president's social media network put out a push alert promoting a story from a conservative outlet that identified the FBI agents involved in this search. And this comes after an armed man tried to enter an FBI office in Cincinnati with an AR-15 assault rifle. He was killed in the process of that.
How is that not encouraging violence against federal law enforcement officers in this climate to identify them?
TURNER: Well, obviously, I don't know who you're referring to on social media.
But, resoundingly, the Congress has condemned any violence against -- and members of Congress have condemned, and I did and all of the Republican members of my committee jointly...
KEILAR: Should Trump?
TURNER: ... in a joint press conference, condemned any violence against any law enforcement officers.
KEILAR: Should the former president?
TURNER: ... and, in fact, said that we greatly appreciate -- we greatly appreciate the service of all of our FBI agents, men and women who are serving their nation.
KEILAR: Should the president, former president?
TURNER: I think always everyone should make it very clear that this is not an issue where violence is ever an answer.
I think you should make it very clear this is not something that should rise to the level of violence. This is an issue where, show us the goods, Attorney Garland. You have to follow the law, just as Donald Trump has to follow law. Congress has oversight and the full ability to see these documents. Justify that you went into this man's house for nine hours.
KEILAR: It was the president -- former president's social media network. You asked what it was. It was the former president's social media network.
TURNER: No, no, no, I said who. I don't know who said that. I don't know -- I -- what I said is, I don't know who said what.
KEILAR: Who said what?
TURNER: And I certainly -- you're saying that someone on social media said that.
I'm telling you what I have said. I'm telling you what members of Congress have said. I'm telling you what my entire...
KEILAR: I'm saying Breitbart reported it. His social media network put it out.
TURNER: My entire Republican committee membership, openly at the beginning of our press conference, demanding, as has bipartisan demands been, show us the goods, Attorney General Garland.
KEILAR: Which is separate from what I'm asking. Which is not what I'm asking, sir.
TURNER: And we did so first -- we did so by first opening and condemning all violence against any law enforcement and by specifically saying, we honor those men and women who serve in the FBI.
We question the leadership, Attorney General Garland, who has raided the home of his boss, President Biden's political rival, who himself has had Donald Trump derail his career on the way to the Supreme Court, where the FBI has a history of unequal application of the law with both Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, where the FBI has a history before of using bogus information that even "The New York Times" has reported it's bogus, the Russia dossier, to obtain a warrant targeting Donald Trump.
There's a history here that Attorney General Garland has to pass the bar for. He has to justify this. We have the clearance for it. There's a history of us seeing this document -- these documents and information before. Show us the goods.
KEILAR: Sir, we really appreciate you being with us. Thank you so much. We appreciate it.
TURNER: Thank you. Thank you. Appreciate it.
KEILAR: Congressman Turner, thank you.
TURNER: Thank you. Take care.
KEILAR: So, of course, lots of news this week. How is this going to affect the midterms this fall? We're taking a closer look ahead.
Plus, gas now costing less than $4 a gallon for the first time since spring. Are prices going to keep falling?
We have the energy secretary next.
KEILAR: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION. I'm Brianna Keilar.
President Biden is set to sign another of his big agenda items, a tax and climate bill that the House passed on Friday.
And this comes as average gas prices have dropped to below $4 a gallon for the first time in months, all of which Democrats are hoping might help them in close midterm races across the country.
Joining me now to discuss is U.S. Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm. Secretary, thanks for being with us.
JENNIFER GRANHOLM, U.S. ENERGY SECRETARY: You bet. Thanks for having me on, Brianna.
KEILAR: So, I want to talk about this bill here in just a moment.
But, first, I know that, as Cabinet secretary, you frequently work with sensitive government information. Are you concerned about learning that top secret sensitive, compartmented information was found at Mar-a-Lago?
GRANHOLM: Well, sure.
KEILAR: You are, but you don't want to say more, which I understand that the administration is keeping their distance here.
Yes, of course. The president, when he appointed Merrick Garland as attorney general, said to him: You work for the people. You don't work for me.
We are all reading the news reports. But let's have any questions that are outstanding answered by the Department of Justice.
KEILAR: There is a question for you that would be specific to the Department of Energy, though, which is that "The Washington Post" reports that the FBI was in part looking for classified documents related to nuclear weapons.
Your department, of course, helps oversee the safety and the integrity of U.S. nuclear weapons. Are you confident that this poses no threat to the nation's nuclear weapons security?
GRANHOLM: You know, Brianna, we don't know what's underneath this. So, again, I can't comment on this. And I just ask that all questions go to the Department of Justice.
KEILAR: OK. I understand that.
So, I do want to turn to some other issues. You heard gas prices mentioned there, which I know the administration is very happy to see this dip, the national average below $4 a gallon for the first time since March this week.
Is the worst behind us?
GRANHOLM: Well some of it -- as you know, gas comes from oil, and oil is traded on a global market. And global events affect the price of oil.
But the president has taken unprecedented steps to try to moderate supply and demand by releasing a million barrels per day from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve. Our Energy Information Administration has put out their short-term energy outlook. And they are projecting at the moment, without knowing what's going to happen globally, that the price in the fourth quarter of this year per gallon will probably drop to about $3.78.
So, we hope that that's true. But, again, it can be impacted by what's happening globally. The president has done more than any president in history to make sure that the price, insofar as he's got control, continues to decline, and has included asking for increased production both domestically and overseas.
KEILAR: The Inflation Reduction Act, headed to the president's desk after it passed the House along party lines Friday, there are three independent studies, though, that show it's actually going to have a minimal effect on inflation, and that many parts of the bill obviously don't even take effect until next year, some years later than that.
So what specifically will this bill do to lower costs for Americans right now?
GRANHOLM: Oh, I -- this -- first of all, immediately, people will be able to lower the fuel costs in their home. There's a 30 percent tax credit that you can claim in 2022 for installing energy-efficient windows, heat pumps, energy-efficient appliances. That is right away.
And on top of that, of course, if citizens want to install solar panels on their roofs, so that they can generate their own power, that's another 30 percent tax credit.
And, of course, there's the tax credits that are at the dealership for the automotive sector for electric vehicles, so -- and if you install an electric vehicle charging station in your home, you can also get a tax credit.
So there's many ways that this bill lowers the costs for everyday citizens. And that's one of the reasons why it's anti-inflationary, is to lower the cost, and, in addition to that, of course, lowering the cost of prescription drugs for people and capping the amount of out- of-pocket expenses that senior citizens pay for their prescription drugs, et cetera.
So -- and let me just say, Brianna, this president has been focused on everyday people throughout his presidency. There have been four bills that have been significant, passed as part of his overall economic plan to lower costs and create jobs.
And this bill is the biggest -- the biggest action on climate that any administration has passed, in the history of the United States times 10. So, it's a...
KEILAR: But, on the inflation -- on the inflation part of this -- I mean, you're kind of making my point, because when we're talking about drugs, negotiating directly, having Medicaid negotiate directly, you're talking about 2026 to 2029. That's when those provisions kick in. When you're talking about a tax credit on solar panels, electric vehicles, energy-efficient appliances and windows, people who are spending money on those things aren't the ones who are living paycheck to paycheck and inflation is hitting the most.
GRANHOLM: Well, actually, no, I mean, people who are able to qualify, for example, for weatherization.
There was a massive increase, billions of dollars, for people who are low and moderate income to be able to weatherize their home and save money right away. Thirty -- up to 30 percent of energy bills can be saved. That was part of the bipartisan infrastructure law, which is one of the four pieces of legislation that I think have the biggest impact on lowering costs for people that has been passed by this president.
So, no, there are some things that take effect into the future, some that take effect right now. And the president -- and a lot of the energy provisions and the energy-efficiency provisions are applicable right now.
KEILAR: The drug piece not right now. Just want to be very clear on that.
The bill includes $30 billion for nuclear energy, nuclear power plants. You just were at a nuclear power plant here in the last week. Can the country meet the administration's emissions goals without new nuclear energy?
GRANHOLM: No, nuclear has to be part of the array of clean energy technologies, zero carbon-emitting baseload power.
And so there is -- there is money both in the bipartisan infrastructure law, as well as in the Inflation Reduction Act, to incentivize the development and keeping the existing fleet online as well. So, nuclear has to be a part of that.
KEILAR: All right, Secretary Granholm, thank you so much for spending part of your Sunday with us. We do appreciate it.
GRANHOLM: Well, of course. Of course.
KEILAR: So, one red state introduces new steps to help mothers and infants after Roe v. Wade was overturned. Why aren't other states doing the same?
That is next.
KEILAR: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION. I'm Brianna Keilar.
In case there was ever any doubt, Donald Trump is going to be front and center in this fall's midterm elections. And, this week, we saw Republicans circling the wagons around the former president in a way that we haven't seen since the last election.
Here now to discuss is the Republican governor of Arkansas, Asa Hutchinson.
Sir, we thank you so much for spending part of your Sunday with us.
This FBI search warrant that we saw revealed that investigators took multiple boxes from Mar-a-Lago, multiple sets of top secret documents, including some classified at the highest security level.
You -- just to put into context here, you're a former U.S. attorney, a former DHS official. You served on the Intelligence Committee when you were in Congress. Are you alarmed that the former president possessed this highly classified material at his unsecured resort?
GOV. ASA HUTCHINSON (R-AR): Sure. I'm concerned about it. And I understand the need to retrieve those documents.
There's a lot of facts, as Congressman Turner pointed out, that we do not have yet. And the biggest question is why and how. Why were those documents there? Why did the White House believe that they wanted them there, presumably, if that was the case? And so those facts have to be determined.
And so the American public is operating without sufficient information. I think we all have to take a deep breath and say we're going to have to wait to see the facts that come out. There is some urgency in it, because this is unprecedented, the search of a former president's home.
The American public wants to understand that. And, right now, you mentioned the circling of the wagons around Donald Trump. And it's simply because they see the establishment is going after Donald Trump, and they question whether that was the right move and whether there was less intrusive means to accomplish the same purpose.
We're going to have to be a little patient. The attorney general did the right thing by getting information out this week, some information. I actually encouraged him to release the affidavit in redacted form, but that would provide and shed more information on why this search might have been necessary and explain the probable cause that the judge saw whenever he signed the search warrant.
KEILAR: Republicans, you have heard them. They have been also attacking the FBI over this investigation.
Let's listen to some of this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ELISE STEFANIK (R-NY): The FBI raid of President Trump is a complete abuse and overreach of its authority. SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY): Do I know that the boxes of material they took
from Mar-a-Lago, that they won't put things in those boxes to entrap him?
REP. LAUREN BOEBERT (R-CO): I will make sure these tyrants pay the price.
SEN. RICK SCOTT (R-FL): The way our federal government has gone, it's like what we thought about the Gestapo or people like, that they just go after people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: More recently, Trump's social network actually amplified a conservative report with the personal information of the FBI agents who were involved in the search.
Are Trump and some Republicans putting the lives of the FBI's men and women at risk?
HUTCHINSON: Well, if the GOP is going to be the party of supporting law enforcement, law enforcement includes the FBI.
As a United States attorney, I work with the FBI, the DEA, the federal law enforcement agencies. Those folks on the ground do extraordinarily heroic efforts to enforce our rule of law, which is fundamental to the Republican Party and to our democracy.
The FBI is part of that. And so, yes, we need to pull back on casting judgment on them. No doubt that they have -- higher-ups in the FBI has made mistakes. They do it. I have defended cases as well. And I have seen wrong actions.
But we cannot say that, whenever they went in and did that search, that they were not doing their job as law enforcement officers. If you want to hold people accountable, it is the Department of Justice. It is the attorney general, who said he supervised that. The FBI is simply carrying out their responsibilities under the law, a lawful search warrant that a magistrate to signed off on.
And they didn't go in there with FBI raid jackets. They tried to constrain their behavior carrying out that warrant. So, let's be -- let's support law enforcement. Let's stand with them. Whether it's the DEA, the FBI, or your local law enforcement. That's critically important that we do that, because they're simply trying to do their job and to keep anarchy away from our country.
KEILAR: I want to talk to you about abortion, because Arkansas has done something interesting.
Arkansas, yes, has an unenviable record on maternal and infant care, but you have taken some steps to improve care for mothers and infants, like expanding Medicaid coverage for pregnant women. If you're going -- if Republican states are going to force women to have babies they wouldn't otherwise have had, do those Republican-led states need to support them more? Because many states are not doing this.
HUTCHINSON: Well, the answer is yes.
And I hope that we're all looking at that, because, in Arkansas, because we had a trigger law, that we have reduced the number of abortions dramatically -- last year, we had 3,000. And that means there's going to be 3,000 pregnancies in round numbers that might be unwanted or might be under difficult circumstances.
And so we have got to provide the maternal care, the improved foster care. We have got to be able to ride increase adoption services. And it's not because we have neglected that in the past. It's because we do anticipate more live births, which is a good thing and something we support.
And so here, in Arkansas, we have made progress in reducing teen pregnancy, but our infant mortality rate is not where it should be. And that counts those infants that die in the first year after birth. And so we want to expand Medicaid coverage, health care services for that mom with that young child in our home to increase the chances of survivability and better health outcomes both for the mom and both for the child.
KEILAR: I want to ask you about something in Nebraska, where an 18- year-old and her mother are facing multiple charges after allegedly conducting an illegal self-managed medication abortion.
You had police there obtaining their private Facebook messages, which is raising concerns that law enforcement is going to use people's private data to enforce state abortion laws. A complicated case, yes, but is that something that you would endorse in Arkansas? And do you think this is right?
HUTCHINSON: Well, I'm not familiar with that specific case.
But it's very important under Arkansas law and that in all of the pro- life laws that we have that we say that it's illegal to perform an abortion, and the penalties is after the provider. There is no punishment for the woman. That is not the target of what we have, nor should it be, nor should we collect for that purpose.
KEILAR: The provider in this case would be -- it was self-managed.
HUTCHINSON: Well, right. So, there's not a provider, but...
KEILAR: Right? It's a medication. So don't go after them, you're saying?
HUTCHINSON: So, there should -- yes, don't go after the woman. That's not the target of that.
If there's some provider or some Internet provider that sent that medication in, that would be a violation of Arkansas law. But there's no penalty, consequences for the woman. We have sympathy for her. We want to improve the health. We want to help them make the right decisions and to care for that child. [09:40:15]
KEILAR: Governor Hutchinson, it's great to have you. Thanks for being with us.
HUTCHINSON: Thank you. Great to be with you.
KEILAR: President Biden has checked off another piece of his agenda. So what do progressives think of him now?
I will ask one next.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This was not just extreme carelessness with classified like material, which is still totally disqualifying.
I'm going to enforce all laws concerning the protection of classified information. We can't have someone in the Oval Office who doesn't understand the meaning of the word confidential or classified.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: Former President Trump's standard for Hillary Clinton clearly one he does not hold himself to.
Our panel is here with me now to discuss.
What a big week.
And I know -- we know now that the FBI found multiple boxes containing classified information at Mar-a-Lago, including some -- a set of documents that were classified at the highest level.
Congressman Bowman, to you, should Congress investigate Trump over this?
REP. JAMAAL BOWMAN (D-NY): Oh, absolutely. Trump should be investigated for many things.
We still have the January 6 hearings taking place. Really looking forward to seeing what they continue to find in terms of his involvement with the insurrection. The fact that his home was seized, I mean, there was obviously a reason for it to be seized. He didn't comply. There was some information that he may have lied, and this is why they went in to seize the documents.
And they found classified documents that shouldn't have been there. So Trump should be investigated from multiple angles. He's being investigated in New York as well. So, America is going through a reckoning right now. And part of that reckoning is going to be holding Trump accountable going forward.
KEILAR: Politically, this could work for him. Do you worry about that?
BOWMAN: I don't think so. I think the American people are tired of Trump's antics and what he represents and who he is.
I think, sure, the Trumpers and the MAGA supporters are going to galvanize behind him. I mean, we already saw some armed supporters outside the FBI offices in Arizona.
But, listen, he's dangerous, and the MAGA supporters are dangerous, and many in the Republican Party are dangerous for not condemning him. And it's important for him to be condemned and for us to move forward while holding him accountable.
S.E. CUPP, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I totally agree. Maybe Democrats should not have supported some Trump candidates in some of these elections, because they are dangerous people who want to continue to overturn elections.
I got an e-mail this morning in my inbox from Jim Jordan, spam mail. The subject line was, "They're Coming For You."
This is what Republicans are -- and MAGA world is telling their voters. It's insane. If you believe that the FBI is coming to your house, it's probably because you committed a crime or you're delusional.
But this is the conspiracy theory that the MAGA world is going to traffic in. And it's convincing some people that this is going to make Trump more powerful.
I completely disagree. Polling shows that most Americans think what the FBI did was correct, and that Trump needs to be held accountable.
SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I do think, in the immediate aftermath of the raid, there was some polling done that showed him ticking up a few points among Republicans, because there is a reflectiveness with him, even -- and I heard this from people who are even ready to move on from Trump -- that we don't want to let them -- we want to take him out.
Like, we don't want to let them do it.
JENNINGS: And so I do think, at least temporarily, that's helping him.
I mean, I sort of felt this week like we're at the circus now. We're all under the big top. And this can only end one of two ways. He's got to be indicted, or Merrick Garland has to resign. You can't raid the president's house, the former president, and possible future candidate, say to the American people, we think he's violating three different laws, and then do nothing.
So this has -- to me...
KEILAR: Was it justified?
JENNINGS: Well, yes. If you think there are classified documents -- and I totally get, if you have got top secret information -- which we don't know what it is, by the way.
But if you got these documents, and they're not supposed to be out in the open, absolutely. But this cannot end in any -- in any other way. I mean, how could it possibly end with just, well, OK, we got them back, and it's over now? That -- there's no going back now.
HILARY ROSEN, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: You know, I -- this is unpopular for Democrats to say, but we are giving Trump way too much oxygen. And it really bothers me.
I -- it's not that I don't think he should be held accountable if he breaks the law, but, big surprise, Trump's a hypocrite, that he's saying something -- a different standard for himself than Hillary Clinton. The whole country knows he's a con man. They know he cheats on his taxes. They know that he's lied multiple times and that there was haphazard control over documents at the White House.
And so there's -- none of this is new information. And so for us to over and over keep talking about this in a week where Democrats finally got on our front feet, right? That's how by the way, for conspiracy theorists, that the White House had nothing to do with this raid, right?
ROSEN: Because it totally stepped on Joe Biden's week.
ROSEN: And we have a lot of things going into this election, that Republicans -- there was not a single Republican vote this week for lowering drug costs.
There's -- the Republican Supreme Court has taken away rights that women have had for 50 years. We have a lot to talk about. I just want to stop talking about Donald Trump.
KEILAR: You want to stop talking about Donald Trump.
CUPP: He does not.
CUPP: He wants us to keep talking about him.
(CROSSTALK) ROSEN: That's right, because it's in his interest to have us keep talking about it.
ROSEN: And now the party has -- he was on the wane.
FOX News had stopped talking about him over the last couple months. And you know what? Now the party has coalesced again -- around him again.
JENNINGS: This point is a good one, though, because you could start to feel like, well, maybe Republicans were starting to feel like, OK, let's just -- let's just ease on from this. DeSantis was on the rise. There were state polls. There was a national poll showing him within single digits.
And then you did see at least a temporary snapback. I don't know if it's going to last. But that's true.
ROSEN: Congressman, I hope that we don't have a whole new set of hearings investigating Donald Trump.
I hope we have a set of hearings about where we go with health care costs, about what we do on the economy, about what people are actually going through in their lives, and to not do this again with Donald Trump.
CUPP: But there's nearly three months until the election. I mean, there's going to be a lot more news cycles than this one.
BOWMAN: So, yes, but I think we can walk and chew gum at the same time.
ROSEN: No, we cannot.
BOWMAN: I think there's a way...
ROSEN: We can't.
BOWMAN: Yes, we can.
ROSEN: We have proven we can't.
BOWMAN: There's a way to hold Donald Trump accountable, whether that's hearings or otherwise, right? There's a way to hold him accountable and still...
ROSEN: Well, the law will now hold him accountable.
BOWMAN: Exactly -- and still champion what we have been winning in Congress over the past several weeks, the passing of the PACT Act...
ROSEN: Right. Let the Justice Department do its job.
BOWMAN: ... the passing of the Inflation Reduction Act, and all the work we continue -- the passing of the CHIPS bill, right?
So there's a lot of things we can celebrate...
BOWMAN: ... that are going to help rebuild our economy, deal with inflation, and respond to the needs of the American people.
More work to do, obviously, but there's so much to celebrate and talk about.
ROSEN: There is.
KEILAR: Well, let's talk about President Biden, because he has had a good stretch here, quite a good stretch here.
And yet it seems that a lot of Democrats still aren't sure they want him to run again in 2024. Let's listen to what they're saying.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D-NY): Should he run again? I think that I think it's -- it's -- we will take a look at it.
QUESTION: Do you want to see Joe Biden run?
REP. CORI BUSH (D-MO): I don't want to answer that question, because we have not -- that's not -- yes, I don't want to answer that question.
REP. JERROLD NADLER (D-NY): Too early to say. It doesn't serve the purpose of the Democratic Party to deal with that until after the midterms.
QUESTION: Ms. Maloney.
REP. CAROLYN MALONEY (D-NY): I don't believe he's running for reelection.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: Congressman, do you want him to run again?
BOWMAN: Well, I want us to keep winning as Democrats right now in the House. I mean, we're talking a year or two away. I'm not thinking a year or two away. I have my...
KEILAR: Well, how about you walk and chew gum at the same time...
KEILAR: ... and tell us if you think that he should run again or not?
BOWMAN: Here's the most important thing for us to focus on right now.
We have to keep the House, which I think we have a chance to do. We have to win multiple seats in the Senate, which I know we have a chance to do. And once we do that, we show our strength as a party, which will make him stronger...
JENNINGS: Well, hold on. Hold on.
BOWMAN: ... and will help us as we enter 2024.
JENNINGS: There are numerous articles out this weekend about how he is aggressively planning his reelection campaign.
JENNINGS: So, you should -- I think you should assume he's running. So I think what Democrats would want to know from someone like you, an important leader in the Democratic Party, is, are you ready to get behind the incumbent president of the United States for reelection right now?
BOWMAN: Yes, if the president is running for office...
JENNINGS: If? If?
BOWMAN: If he's running, I will support him, right?
What's more important, in my opinion, is for us to continue to have victories in Congress, so that the American people can see we're fighting for them. That's the most important thing. And we have had those recently.
CUPP: I think Democrats -- Democrats need to figure this out soon, because I think you either need to set expectations...
BOWMAN: It's 2022. Why do we need to figure it out right now?
CUPP: Well, because you don't have a bench.
And so, if you're going to condition an environment for voters to get used to someone other than Joe Biden, you had better go ahead and tell us who that's going to be.
KEILAR: We have to leave it there.
It is a simple question, the answers not so simple, as we see.
(LAUGHTER) KEILAR: Thank you all so much.
BOWMAN: Thank you. Thank you.
KEILAR: Thank you all so much for being with us this morning.
BOWMAN: Thank you.
KEILAR: Coming up: Tomorrow marks one year since the capital of Afghanistan fell to the Taliban.
CNN takes a closer look at what's happening in the country now.
KEILAR: U.S. Capitol Police say an armed man drove his car into a barricade outside the Capitol Building early this morning, firing several shots in the air, before taking his own life. Police say no one else was injured, and it doesn't appear any members of Congress were targeted.
And one year after Kabul fell to the Taliban, former Afghan President Ashraf Ghani talks with CNN's Fareed Zakaria to explain why he fled the country, despite a pledge to stay.
That is next in "The Fall of Kabul: One Year Later," a "FAREED ZAKARIA GPS" special.
Thank you so much for being with us this morning.