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State of the Union

Interview With Sen. Mark Warner (D-VA); Interview With Rep. Chrissy Houlahan (D-PA); Interview With Sen. Ron Johnson (R-WI); Interview With Stephen A. Smith. Aired 9-10a ET

Aired May 04, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:31]

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST (voice-over): Shakeup. President Trump ousts one key adviser and gives another his fourth government role, as Secretary of State Mark Rubio's star continues to rise.

MARCO RUBIO, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: Thank you for the honor to be able to serve.

TAPPER: What does this mean for America's national security? Top Intelligence Committee Democrat Senator Mark Warner joins me exclusively next.

And fallout. Trump downplays voters' economic concerns...

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Maybe the children will have two dollars, instead of 30 dolls.

TAPPER: ... and proposes more deep government cuts, as one large U.S. city struggles with the fallout.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It would be really nice to be able to pick up the phone and call them. Unfortunately, they're gone.

TAPPER: Are they on their own? Wisconsin Senator Ron Johnson is coming up.

Plus: a new contender? Trump says he could be the next president, another outspoken cultural icon with an unconventional approach. Could he be Democrats' answer to Trump?

STEPHEN A. SMITH, ESPN ANALYST: We all knew Donald Trump.

TAPPER: Stephen A. Smith is mulling a presidential run, and he will join us ahead.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: Hello. I'm Jake Tapper in Washington, where the state of our union is watching the prices of cars and dolls.

President Trump is 105 days down and brushing off concerns about his policies, from the economy to deportation. The new auto tariffs that went into effect this week could raise car prices by $4,000 apiece. But the president now says the U.S. would be OK with a short-term recession, as long as the long-term goals happen, and he trusts and he hopes that the public will be patient. Trump himself this week, though, lost patience with his embattled

national security adviser, Mike Waltz, who was ousted from his job, put at the U.N. and replaced by Secretary of State Marco Rubio, Rubio a rising star in the Trump administration who might be juggling both hugely demanding roles for months.

My next guest worked closely with Rubio for years leading the Senate Intelligence Committee. And joining us now, Virginia Senator Mark Warner, top Democrat on the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence.

So, in addition to being secretary of state and acting national security adviser -- and he might be this for months, they say -- he's also acting national archivist and acting head of USAID. Are you comfortable with anybody -- I mean, first of all, is Rubio, Senator, Secretary Rubio able to do the two main jobs there I mentioned?

SEN. MARK WARNER (D-VA): I don't know how anybody...

TAPPER: Right.

WARNER: ... could do these two big jobs. And they're, frankly, very different.

One is actually trying to diplomatically work with friends and adversaries around the world. And, unfortunately, the number of adversaries has gone up dramatically as Trump's approach has been so awful to our allies. The other around national security adviser has really grown into a major job.

Maybe slimming down some of that portfolio could make sense, but I don't see how any individual could do both of those. And then you add the other fact, Jake, that he's still overseeing the remnants of what used to be American soft power for 70 years, USAID, and even for a Marco Rubio, I don't think -- I think it's too much.

TAPPER: But you think well of him. You think that he's an able guy.

WARNER: Listen, I have worked very well with him for years.

I have been disappointed by some of the actions he's taken as secretary in this kind of kowtowing to Trump. As a matter of fact, the -- he appeared that Cabinet meeting earlier this week where everyone went around and basically paid kudos to the great leader.

It was something that, frankly, I would have expected out of North Korea, maybe not out of a Cabinet meeting in America.

TAPPER: Secretary Rubio's new job comes after President Trump ousted Mike Waltz from the national security adviser position.

Now the Senate is going to need to vote on whether he can serve as the U.S. ambassador to the United Nations. This is after he shared some sensitive information on -- sensitive intelligence on Signal, not to mention accidentally adding a reporter, Jeff Goldberg, to that Signal chat.

Do you have faith in him to be U.N. ambassador?

WARNER: I think it will be a brutal confirmation hearing. Waltz at least acknowledged a bit of a mistake. I think he's going to have tough questions not only from Democrats, but from Republicans.

But the guy that should be gone is Pete Hegseth, who is so far beyond his abilities, who I have challenged repeatedly, come down to Norfolk, Virginia, and explain to the friends of the sailors who are on the Truman -- that was where -- the Truman was the aircraft carrier that the jets were launched that went against the Houthis -- and try to explain how that information getting out wouldn't have put their loved ones in harm's way.

[09:05:00]

Hegseth should go. But, also, candidly, as vice chair of the Intelligence Committee, former chair, Tulsi Gabbard, who I don't think there was a day that goes by -- she is the director of national intelligence -- isn't out literally trashing the intelligence work force.

So you have got our two major areas of protecting our country, the Defense Department and all of our intelligence community. There's not a day that goes by that I don't hear people's morale is plummeting because of their lack of confidence in these leaders.

TAPPER: Speaking of these constituents of yours, representing Virginia, where so many government officials and employees work, "The Washington Post" is reporting that the CIA is set to cut 1,200 positions and thousands of more jobs will be eliminated across other intelligence agencies.

I know you live in Virginia. What are Republican senators telling you privately about this deterioration of the work force in the intelligence community?

WARNER: I raise this virtually every meeting, oftentimes in private, because we're in classified settings.

And I hear a lot of: "Gosh, Mark, keep talking about this. Yes, this is important."

I basically am imploring my Republican colleagues, at least go out and say you have faith in our intelligence work force. With this kind of approach -- and, Jake, it costs about $340,000 to train a CIA officer, get a clearance, go through the training process.

When we are going to be laying off or accreting a lot of these younger members, who in their right mind is going to want to go be a CIA officer, go work for the NSA, where we do cryptography? They can all go make much more money in the tech world. But we are undermining what I think would be a potential next generation of workers in the intelligence domain and, for that matter, across the federal government. We're going to be paying the price for this first 100 days-plus of rapid cuts I think literally for years.

TAPPER: So the top Republicans on the intelligence community, before the current one, Tom Cotton from Arkansas, were Burr from North Carolina and Rubio from Florida, and you were able to work in a bipartisan way, regardless of whether the Republican or the Democrat was actually the chairman.

Do you have that relationship with Tom Cotton?

WARNER: We're working on it.

TAPPER: You're working on it.

WARNER: We're working on it.

But the vast majority of the other members of the committee, I know they're good folks. They just have to be willing -- I had one member say: "Mark, you're sounding like our conscience."

I don't want to be your conscience. I want you to vote your conscience. Just don't talk to me privately. I do think we're getting close to them stepping up. But the problem is going to be, how much structural damage is going to be done before my Republican friends find their voice and voice publicly what they're already saying privately?

TAPPER: So Israel had to shut down its main international airport last night after a Houthi missile fired from Yemen could not be intercepted and landed in the vicinity of the airport. The defense minister of Israel is warning about a severe response to the attack.

This comes amid repeated U.S. threats against Iran. How worried are you about an escalation of the conflict with Iran, whether Israel-Iran or the U.S. and Iran?

WARNER: I am very worried.

Obviously, Iran has bad actors in the region. They are on their back foot, candidly, because of the overthrow of the Assad regime in Syria, the takedown of Hezbollah in Lebanon. You know, the best thing we could do to stand up against Iran would be for Israel to end the conflict in Gaza, get the hostages back, because starting to rebuild and giving the Palestinians some hope for life would allow Saudi Arabia and other nations in the region to, frankly, recognize Israel and then put an even more united front against Iran.

TAPPER: I want to ask you about what happened in your state Thursday, your commonwealth, rather, on Thursday, at Reagan National Airport, two aborted landings of passenger jets.

A U.S. Army helicopter was flying nearby from the exact same unit as the helicopter that tragically crashed into the American Airlines jet in January, killing 67 people. What can you tell us about what happened Thursday? Is it safe to fly into Reagan National Airport?

WARNER: I'm still flying in and out, but I have to tell you, the fact that this still happens, the fact that the Pentagon and the FAA and the folks at National have not been able to coordinate this -- but, again, I think this is a reflection.

When you randomly fire folks at the FAA, when you push people out of air traffic controllers, where we're already 3,000 people short, you are going to take what has been historically the safest airspace in the world, the American airspace.

And there's not a day that goes by that I don't hear people are concerned. And I have got a lot of constituents now who say, I'm just not sure I'm going to be willing to fly out of Reagan.

TAPPER: Very quick question. There's a "New York Magazine" piece out this week about your fellow Democratic Senator John Fetterman, with a former top aide, Adam Jentleson, who you know because he used to work for Harry Reid, expressing deep concerns about his mental health and behavior.

[09:10:04]

Senator Fetterman tells "New York Magazine" he's in good health, he doesn't understand why this is even a story.

Have you -- have you witnessed or observed any concerning behavior from Senator Fetterman at all?

WARNER: I have not seen this story, not read it. My interactions with John have been fine.

TAPPER: All right, Senator Mark Warner, the top Democrat on the Senate Intelligence Committee, thanks for being here this morning. Appreciate it.

President Trump proposing deep cuts to more government services. It's hitting home in one community. Wisconsin Senator Ron Johnson joins me next.

And then: Could he be Democrats' answer to Donald Trump? I'm going to talk to ESPN's Stephen A. Smith about his confrontation with the president this week and his plans for the future.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:15:04]

TAPPER: And welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION.

Much of what President Trump has done in his first few months in office has been by executive order. And now Republicans in Congress are trying to take up their role and pass some legislation. We will see how smoothly that goes.

Joining us now, Wisconsin Senator Ron Johnson. Senator, thanks so much for joining us.

I do want to start with something close to home for you. At least nine schools in Milwaukee have been temporarily closed this year after some students were found to have elevated blood lead levels, which can cause developmental issues.

The CDC has denied city officials' request for help after HHS Secretary Kennedy shut down the agency's lead poisoning prevention program. Your fellow Wisconsin Senator Democrat Tammy Baldwin wrote to Secretary Kennedy, saying he "needs to immediately rectify the issue" -- unquote.

Do you agree? Have you talked to Secretary Kennedy about this?

SEN. RON JOHNSON (R-WI): Good morning, Jake.

First of all, lead in paint and buildings has been an issue for decades. We know how to test for it. We know how to mitigate it. I wouldn't think this is something that requires federal government involvement in it.

It sounds like Secretary Kennedy -- again, when you have a budget now that's $7 trillion large, having only been $4.4 trillion large in 2019, and you try and pare back government, there's some things that you're going to have to reverse. And it sounds like Secretary Kennedy is going to take a look at this and see if he's got -- he needs some experts on this in CDC.

But, again, this is an issue that's been a long -- around a long time. And local and state officials ought to be able to handle this.

TAPPER: Let's turn to the U.S. economy.

I want you to take a listen to what President Trump told NBC. He was asked if he would be comfortable with the country potentially dipping into a recession in the short term if he were able to achieve his long-term goals. Here's his response.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Some people on Wall Street say that we're going to have the greatest economy in history.

KRISTEN WELKER, MODERATOR, "MEET THE PRESS": Is it OK in the short term to have a recession?

TRUMP: Remember this. Look -- yes, everything's OK.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: "Everything's OK." That's the president saying everything's OK, including a short-term recession. Do you agree?

JOHNSON: Well, I'm old enough to remember when Ronald Reagan took office and inflation was completely out of control. He and Paul Volcker had to take some pretty bold and swift actions to tame inflation.

That included a pretty severe recession, but that's what it took. When you come into office and you are inheriting enormous messes across the spectrum, an open border that presents a clear and present danger, a 40-year high inflation that has dramatically devalued dollar, endless wars going on, it's hard to clean up those enormous messes.

So I appreciate President Trump has acted boldly, swiftly, decisively to clean up some of these messes. And, yes, it's not going to be easy. And, sometimes, results are going to have to be reevaluated and relooked at, some actions reversed, but you have to act boldly when you have that responsibility.

TAPPER: I hear you when it comes to the border. I hear you when it comes to inflation. I hear you when it comes to massive debt.

But this is President Trump trying to reshape the American economy, bring more manufacturing jobs here through a very aggressive menu of tariffs all over the world, which will, of course, raise prices, according to almost every major economist.

And it does seem like there's been a reluctance on the part of the president to acknowledge -- he acknowledges disruption, but to acknowledge how much this could hurt lower-income people.

I want to play something else President Trump said about concerns over the impact that the tariffs are having on prices.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Somebody said, oh, the shelves are going to be open. Well, maybe the children will have two dolls, instead of 30 dolls, you know? And maybe the two dolls will cost a couple of bucks more than they would normally.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Do you worry at all at this let them play with fewer dolls rhetoric that it might seem out of touch, especially coming from a billionaire?

JOHNSON: Well, first of all, it's amazing how dismissive you are of the enormous challenges on the border and the other problems that President Trump has to deal with.

TAPPER: Oh, I'm not. I'm not. I'm granting the point. I'm not -- I'm granting the point, sir.

(CROSSTALK)

JOHNSON: So, the fact is that we have allowed manufacturing of very strategic, very important products to be offshored.

President Trump fully understands that. He fully understands one of the reasons he won the presidency is because of Joe Biden's high inflation, so he's fully aware of that. Again, I have my concerns. The markets have shown those concerns. They have bounced back.

For my part, what I have been trying to keep the administration priceless of, of the businesses that are going to suffer if this continues long term, but it does sound like his bold strategy is resulting in other nations coming to the table and negotiating in better faith than they have in the past. I don't know where this all goes. I don't want to lessen President Trump's leverage by undermining him whatsoever.

[09:20:03]

I just keep him and his administration apprised of how it impacts the Wisconsin businesses. I think that's currently my role...

TAPPER: How...

JOHNSON: ... and, again, actually cheerlead, hope for the best here, as opposed to I think a lot of people are hoping he fails. I hope he succeeds.

TAPPER: I hope he succeeds too.

How concerned are you about the next four to six weeks, with the final Chinese container ships pre-tariff reaching American shores, with warnings of empty shelves, with warnings of higher prices? What are you -- what industries in Wisconsin are you worried about most right now?

JOHNSON: Yes, primarily those that are involved in manufacturing where they also export. They will import component parts.

They're competing against foreign companies that won't be subject to those types of tariffs. So, again, it all depends on how high those tariffs are. A 10 percent above-the-board tariff, I mean, that's on the wholesale cost of goods. That probably will not have that significant impact on inflation. Nobody can predict all these things.

But, again, my role is listening to my constituents, relaying that to the administration. I will say, the administration, the trade representatives are very accessible. They are listening to this. They understand the concerns. I think President Trump understands concerns.

But this is a multidecade firmly held belief on the president -- part of President Trump that America has put itself in peril by allowing so many strategic products to be offshored. He's trying to turn that situation around. It's not easy. This is a problem that's built over decades. He's trying to do it in -- within one administration.

That's why he's acting boldly and swiftly.

TAPPER: Yes, I don't think dolls are in the American strategic interests though, right? I mean, you're talking about semiconductors and the like, and I understand your point.

And that's why even many conservatives say that there should be more -- like Stephen Moore, for example -- there should be more discrete targeting of industries, and not just a wide swathe of anything coming from any other country.

JOHNSON: Well, again, President Trump has a negotiating strategy, a negotiating style. I think he's throwing the entire world out of balance.

I think he understands that creates uncertainty and instability, which is not good for economic activity. He understands those things. But that's his negotiating strategy. And it sounds like nations are coming to the table and starting to negotiate in good faith, which they have not been willing to do in the past.

I have done a lot of negotiating. Sometimes, you have got to be hard, take a hard position with your negotiating partners. It sounds like that's the approach he's taking. Again, I, for one, am wishing him success.

TAPPER: You have long been opposed on principle to the IRS being used to punish an administration's opponents in any way. You were very outspoken about that during the Obama administration. We would have you on all the time to talk about it.

And here you are during the Biden administration, a hearing on government weaponization. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHNSON: My eyes began opening to this reality with the disclosure of how the Obama administration weaponized the IRS to harass Tea Party groups by denying them tax-exempt status.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: President Trump is out in the open threatening to target Harvard, a move that the conservative editorial board of "The Wall Street Journal" says is unwise and sets a bad precedent.

Do you oppose his instruction to the IRS to take away Harvard's tax- exempt status?

JOHNSON: Well, first of all, what I would like to do is simplify and rationalize our tax code, so we really don't try and socially and economically engineer the economy through the tax code. It should be simple. It should be rational. It should raise the revenue we have.

The tax-exempt status of all kinds of entities, you kind of scratch your head. You know, so many of these entities, for example, universities, pretty easy for them to not make a profit, so what value does that tax-exempt status have?

So, again, that's part of the complication of our tax code. We need to simplify it. And that's certainly what I'm trying to do, certainly with this reconciliation bill.

TAPPER: Right, but President Trump is out there instructing his IRS to target Harvard. And you have been very outspoken about -- when targeting was done of conservative groups during the Obama years, which he apologized for, ultimately.

And I'm wondering if you are also upset at this.

JOHNSON: Well, in the past, people have used tax-exempt status on churches and religious universities as well. Again, that's why I don't like a complex tax code. I don't want anybody to be using the tax code in this type of manner.

And so what I'd say is, let's simplify the tax code. That's the solution here.

TAPPER: All right, Senator Ron Johnson, thank you so much for your time today. I really appreciate it.

JOHNSON: Have a good day.

TAPPER: My next guest took it to President Trump this weekend.

He's getting buzz as a potential Democratic presidential candidate.

ESPN's Stephen A. Smith joins us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:29:18]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Stephen A. is a -- he's a good guy. He's a smart guy. I love watching him. He's got great entertainment skills, which is very important. People watch him. A lot of these Democrats I watch, I say they have no chance.

I have been pretty good at picking people and picking candidates. And I will tell you, I'd love to see him run.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: President Trump expressing some unexpected support for a potential presidential bid for my next guest.

Could he be who Democrats are looking for?

Joining us now is the host of "The Stephen A. Smith Show" and ESPN's "The Take," Stephen A. Smith, who is floating a potential 2028 presidential run.

You just heard President Trump again expressing that unexpected support for a potential 2028 bid. What was your reaction when he said that the other night?

[09:30:04]

SMITH: I was aghast, to be quite honest with you. I wasn't looking for any kind of endorsement from anybody, especially him. But he is the president in the United States. There's a bit of

flattery that comes with getting such words from the man who holds the highest office in the land. And I can appreciate that.

But, in the same breath, I'm saying to myself, you know what, evidently, I'd have no chance, because somebody like that is throwing out my name, clearly they think that, yes, go ahead and do it so we can beat you. We can romp you too. So I'm not falling for it. It was nice. It was nice to hear and I appreciated it. But, obviously, it is what it is. I hear where he's coming from.

But I wasn't thinking about it any more seriously than that.

TAPPER: You -- it's been -- President Trump's been in office now for more than 100 days. What's been your reaction to his administration so far?

SMITH: I think it's been a bit haphazard. That's something I have been on the record is saying.

Certainly, we understand that waste, fraud and all of that stuff needs to be addressed. But the manner in which he went about it with Elon Musk gave me cause to pause with DOGE. So I certainly wasn't happy about that. The tariff wars. I thought he was going to focus first on lowering taxes. That's what I would have liked to have seen, because that was something that he campaigned on.

Even though he campaigned on tariffs a lot as well, I certainly expected him to -- I would have liked, rather, to see him focus more on lowering taxes first, as opposed to engaging in a tariff war, particularly a tariff war that didn't just include China, but practically everybody else, at least for a short period of time, before folks got in his ears and got him to sort of retract a little bit.

So I see that. I have no problem with what he's done with the borders. I thought it was absolutely necessary. So I definitely think that that was a plus because I was never a proponent of open borders. But outside of that, I take a wait-and-see approach, because history has taught me that the prism of history is how you determine the success of a president, as opposed to looking at things in the moment in real time, because usually that's going to garner extreme reactions one way or the other.

And I try not to lean in either direction of the extreme. I'm a centrist and a moderate at heart. And I try to make sure I'm as balanced in my thinking as I possibly can be.

TAPPER: If you were to run for president, though, it would be as a Democrat, or no?

SMITH: You know what? I'm an independent. I'm a registered independent. I would lean -- who leans left. I'm fiscally conservative when it comes to my money. I'm socially liberal. I'm liberal when it comes to social issues pretty much across the board. I believe in living and let living. So I'm a moderate. And I would say, if I had to run, it would be as a

Democrat, but I'm not happy with the Democratic Party. So the Democratic Party, as presently constructed, it would pretty much need to be purged in order for me to assume that I would want to be associated with them and I would garner their support, because I don't like the way they have gone about doing a lot of things for a very, very long period of time.

And I think that I don't view Donald Trump as winning the election. I view the Democrats as losing the election, as absolutely, positively blowing it with some of their actions. And that's why I think that, again, if somebody was to associate me with that, the party, as presently constructed, where it leans so extremely left, or at least has spent the vast majority of time doing that, oh, that is not something that I would vibe with at all.

I would definitely be looking to be a game changer in that regard.

TAPPER: What are some of the things that Democrats have been doing that have turned you off and that make you say the party needs to be purged? Who needs to be purged from it, first of all? Do you have any names?

SMITH: Well, I'm not going to name names. I'm not going to do that to a lot of people, but we know who the extreme left is. We know how they go about operating. We know what we lean towards when it came to open borders.

We know that the spending was excessive, even though it's excessive on the Republican side as well. I think a $37 trillion budget, when Republicans try to act like it's just the Democrats, that's not true. But the Democrats certainly shouldn't be absolved from blame in that regard.

Certainly, with identity politics, woke culture, cancer culture, I thought that that was something that ravaged our nation psychologically, because you had people literally scared they were going to lose their jobs if they pronounced the wrong pronoun, for crying out loud. It got that bad.

And I think that that's one of the reasons that Donald Trump is in office today, because so much stuff, a lot is focused on the individual, as opposed to actual policies itself. I'm talking about what they preached and what they talked to the American people about more so than what they're doing. The kind of messages that they were disseminating was incredibly uncomfortable to listen to and to hear.

And I thought that it wasn't emblematic of what most Americans are thinking about. They're trying to pay their mortgages, rent, buy food and groceries, pay gas and deal with the prices, the cost of living. And they want safety in the streets. That's primarily what most American citizens are about, trying to live in peace and harmony.

And that's not something that I think either side has promoted along the way. And that's why I think the state of the nation is what it is at this particular moment in time. [09:35:01]

TAPPER: You last month said that there are clearly other people more qualified to be president than you.

SMITH: Absolutely.

TAPPER: So what do you say to somebody out there who's watching who thinks you have no political history, no foreign policy experience? You're a gifted TV sports commentator, without question, but are you really prepared to be president of the United States?

How would you answer that?

SMITH: I would say they're absolutely right. I'm not prepared. I'm not qualified. I have no political history whatsoever.

I have never been interested in politics a day in my life. How did I come to this conclusion where I have left the door open? I will tell you how. Elected officials have come up to me. Folks in the streets of America come up to me every single day. Not only that.

My own pastor, A.R. Bernard from Christian Cultural Center in Brooklyn, New York, said to me, show respect to people who love and support you by leaving the door open because you never know what God has planned for you or for us as a nation in the years to come. Just leave the door open. So that's what I did.

I know that I have a voice, whether it's on ESPN, whether it's with "The Stephen A. Smith Show" on YouTube and iHeartRadio or any place else that I go. I know that, when I speak, millions upon millions of people hear me. One would surmise that they listen to some of the things that I say. And then I look at our politics.

How worse can it get? Do you realize right now -- and I'm saying this facetiously because I know that you do, Jake, doing what at you do every single day. Do you realize that if you are an elected official, your real work is with the campaign? Once you get into office, literally, you can get away -- I'm talking about the nation's capital specifically, not state and local politics, just the nation's capital.

You realize that you can literally go on Capitol Hill and all your job is to do is to disagree with the other side? You don't even have to do anything else. Whatever the other side feels, you feel the opposite. That's not work. That's not going across the aisle. That's not maneuvering your way through the terrain, through the political terrain and really negotiating on behalf of your constituency and the American people.

All we're doing is engaging in acrimony and hate. And as a result, the American citizens are suffering. So, when I look at it from that standpoint, and I think the kind of impact that I could have as a centrist, as a moderate, as somebody who believes in being sensical and engaging in common sense, unfortunately, I believe that, if I did take this very, very seriously and I moved forward and I decided that I wanted to be a politician, do I believe I could win? You're damn right. But it's by default. It's not because I'm the most qualified candidate in the world. It's because of the state of our politics in the nation's capital, the politicians that we're looking at, and the fact that we don't believe for one second that they are serving the interests of the American people, nor are they interested in it.

People look at me, and they know one thing. I would be interested in serving the American people and doing what's in the best interest of this country. That means you. That means me. That means the black community, the Hispanic community, the white community, everybody, because, if all of us are rife with chaos, all that's going to lead to is America's destruction.

And why would we want to be a part of that? So, again, I'm not qualified. There are plenty of people that qualify more qualified to be -- a practically everybody. But are you going to win? And are you going to be committed to doing what's in the best interest of America? I know I'm that kind of person. That much, I will say for myself. I'm not interested in division.

I'm interested in galvanizing. That's what I'm about. That's what I try to be about. And sometimes you do that by calling it like you see it. And that's certainly something that I have proven I would do. I'd call it like I see it. People wouldn't know that.

TAPPER: A hundred percent.

Stephen A. Smith, we will have you back. Thank you so much. Good to see you. Thanks for getting up early. I knew you're in California.

SMITH: Thank you.

TAPPER: President Trump maybe -- said kids will maybe have to make do with fewer toys this year. Is that a winning message?

I'm going to ask my panel next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:43:25]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Somebody said, oh, the shelves are going to be open. Well, maybe the children will have two dolls, instead of 30 dolls, you know? And maybe the two dolls will cost a couple of bucks more than they would normally.

I don't think a beautiful baby girl needs -- that's 11 years old needs to have $30. I think they can have three dolls or four dolls.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION. Let them eat baby dolls? I'm not exactly sure what the message is

here. President Trump apparently downplaying concerns about his economic policies and insisting Americans can be patient.

My panel joins me now.

Of course, we're going to start with the member of Congress at the table.

What do you make of this message? I mean, obviously, he is also saying there's going to be some disruption if we remake the American economy and bring manufacturing jobs here. But I don't know who in his life has 10 or 30 baby dolls. I don't even know...

(LAUGHTER)

REP. CHRISSY HOULAHAN (D-PA): Well, gender stereotyping aside and the ridiculousness of that, I don't think that the American public is cool with ruining Christmas, full stop.

And as a person who came from industry before, the manufacturing industry, you can't fix supply chains in three months. It takes, in some cases, years and years. And people have put in orders for things like baby dolls months and months ago. They're possibly on the water right now, if they even got off the shore, off of -- out of China because of the tariff threats.

And so what's happening is, we're seeing an enormous threat, I guess, to the fact that everything on the shelves, consumer products, will no longer be there, because vendors are scared, because consumers are scared, because it's just going to end up being kind of a disaster. And I think that the American public is not patient. They should not be patient with the idea of tariffs.

And I think, unfortunately, that's what our president is asking us to be.

[09:45:06]

TAPPER: Let me ask the pollster, the Republican pollster at the table here, because I think that there is a way to message this, short-term disruption for a long-term gain.

But I don't know that kids don't need to have 30 baby dolls, two is fine, or what he told NBC, it's OK if there's a short-term recession, as long as the long-term goals happen -- what would you advise talking to voters, as you do?

KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I would advise keeping the focus on the benefits.

And I really think that it's important for this White House to, whatever they're negotiating, land on something that that short-term pain is not going to be that painful. People do want to see manufacturing come back to the U.S. They do want to see cost of living go down. They do want to see America make more things and make great things.

And that's all fine. Then keep the focus on that, because, right now, in the short term, if we get to Christmas and kids have fewer toys, but the factory down the street hasn't reopened, that does create a really big political problem for the White House.

TAPPER: And McDonald's had some earnings report, financial report that talked about people, especially lower-income and middle-income, going to McDonald's less because of these concerns.

As a Democrat, what's your take on this? And is your party doing enough to draw attention to these issues?

ASHLEY ALLISON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I think those are two separate questions.

The first is...

TAPPER: I will take no on the second one.

(LAUGHTER)

ALLISON: No, no, no, the first is, it's a compounding effect, right?

So, to Chrissy's point, just to build on that, if the factory is closed, you already weren't making enough money, and things cost more, and then you pass a budget that the social safety net is ripped out, so your Medicaid, your Social Security, that is not going to bring stability or relief to the American people.

Right now, I do think, even though polls are starting to trend that folks are not agreeing with the way Donald Trump is handing the economy, he's still just a few days past 100 and folks are giving him some leeway. But come Christmas, even come August, on the other side of the Fourth of July, Americans, especially if it takes longer for things to arrive and they're more expensive, people just are not going to be excited about that.

And it's going to start to affect folks in the midterm. Now, whether Democrats are doing enough about this, here's what I would just say. It's not enough to say this is bad, this is bad, this is bad. What are you going to do to make a difference?

Because the reason why Donald Trump is getting a little bit of space to figure this out is because people were feeling so much pain before November 5. But Democrats just can't be anti-Trump. They have to have a vision for the future and they need to figure it out.

TAPPER: And, Shermichael, there is going to be this big budget debate in which Trump...

SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Right.

TAPPER: ... pushes to have the Trump tax cuts extended. And a lot of those tax cuts hit lower-, middle-income people, but a lot of them are also for upper-income people because they pay more taxes. There's going to be an easy way for Democrats to say you're continuing

to cut taxes for the wealthy, while your -- the prices are going up and hurting the lower- and middle-income people.

SINGLETON: Look, I think, legislatively, I'd probably shift the focus to working-class people, that the president really saw a realignment of working-class people.

TAPPER: So you would not -- you would get rid of the tax cut extensions for...

SINGLETON: I would say I would get rid of it. I would probably do more, though, Jake, to prioritize working-class people.

What we have seen with the Republican Party in the most recent election was that there's a shift, a drastic shift, of working class, blue-collar people who voted Republican. That's really unprecedented. And so I think if that is going to become a cemented base of the party, you really have to prioritize these people.

Now, the president has some benefit here. You look at the stock market, you saw the rally Friday. All the losses that we saw from April 2, the -- quote, unquote -- "liberation day," have indeed recovered. The job numbers were pretty strong. Unemployment remains steady. Workers compensation, for the most, part remained steady.

So the marketplace is suggesting that they're giving the president an opportunity, but they do want stability. So I would advise the White House to quickly finalize this tariff negotiation, if you will. And if the president does that, the market will continue to rally, and I think you will ultimately see a surplus.

TAPPER: So there's a new clip that I'm told about President Trump asked if he is always going to abide by the U.S. Constitution. And here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WELKER: Your secretary of state says everyone who's here, citizens and noncitizens, deserve due process. Do you agree, Mr. President?

TRUMP: I don't know. I'm not -- I'm not a lawyer. I don't know.

WELKER: Don't you need to uphold the Constitution of the United States as president?

TRUMP: I don't know. I have to respond by saying again, I have brilliant lawyers that work for me, and they are going to obviously follow what the Supreme Court said.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: I mean, some of the backstory here is that President Trump's invocation of the Alien Enemies Act was an effort, paused right now by a Trump-appointed judge, to get around some of the due process obligations when it comes to deporting undocumented immigrants in this country, but anyway.

HOULAHAN: I mean, your head should explode when you hear the president of the United States say that he's not really sure if he's going to abide by the Constitution and then say something as weak as that he's not a lawyer.

[09:50:02]

It doesn't matter what he is. He's the president of the United States. And the idea that he can seriously with a straight face say something like that should offend all Americans, should offend all voters, and should be an indicator of who he is as a person.

And I think one of the things we were talking about earlier was sort of a legislative responsibility. The reality is, right now, it's not just the president who's behaving as though the Constitution doesn't matter. So is the legislature.

We, every week, week after week, are passing less than five or six bills. And they're ridiculous bills that mean nothing. We have so far had five laws come into being as a result of the last 100 days. We are anemic as a legislative body, and we refuse to actually do our constitutional job, which is to do the things like tariff policy.

Instead of doing that, my Republican colleagues have literally voted on the ability to not vote on tariffs. And that's where we are right now as a legislature.

TAPPER: All right, thanks, one and all, for being here. Really appreciate it.

A big election this week. President Trump wants in. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:55:43]

TAPPER: There will likely be a new pope this week.

President Trump is making some jokes about being in the mix, even though he's not even Catholic. He put out an artificial intelligence image of himself as pope. It drew a mixed reaction social media, including a stern review from Catholic bishops in his home state of New York, as more than one billion Catholics grieve the death of Pope Francis.

Thanks for spending your Sunday morning with us.

"FAREED ZAKARIA GPS" starts next.

And I will see you tomorrow on "THE LEAD."