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State of the Union

Interview With Sen. Chuck Schumer (D-NY); Interview With Sen. Markwayne Mullin (R-OK); Interview With Sen. John Fetterman (D-PA); Interview With Rep. Jasmine Crockett (D-TX). Aired 9-10a ET

Aired September 21, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:00:40]

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DANA BASH, CNN HOST (voice-over): Turning point. The stars of MAGA remember one of their own, as President Trump leans on top officials to go after his political enemies.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I just want people to act. They were ruthless and vicious.

BASH: Is the MAGA movement and the country at a crossroads? Trump ally Senator Markwayne Mullin joins me.

Plus: shutdown showdown again. Last time, Democrats blinked. Will this time be different?

SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY): Donald Trump says he doesn't want to talk. That's a recipe for a shutdown.

BASH: Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer joins me next, and Democratic Senator John Fetterman will respond.

And reality check. Under attack by the president, top Democrats turn on each other. Does the party need more soul-searching? Texas Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett will be here.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BASH: Hello. I'm Dana Bash in Washington, where the state of our union is watching our country change in real time.

Today, President Trump will give personal remarks to memorialize the loss of his friend and political ally Charlie Kirk at what is expected to be a huge memorial service in Arizona. But Kirk's assassination has roiled the MAGA movement and kicked off a presidential crackdown on Trump's critics and political foes.

The word unprecedented gets thrown around a lot these days, but, last night, the president took an extraordinary step. He publicly urged his attorney general, Pam Bondi, to go after his political adversaries. We're talking about New York Attorney General Letitia James, Senator Adam Schiff and James Comey. He called them -- quote -- "guilty as hell," and he complained -- quote -- "We can't delay any longer."

It's a retribution campaign the president has previewed for years.

Here with me now is the Senate Democratic leader, Chuck Schumer.

Thank you so much for being here.

We're going to start there. You are the top-ranking Democrat in the U.S. Senate. What is your reaction to the president's new pressuring of his top Justice Department official and what can you do about it?

SCHUMER: I think it's a real threat to democracy, Dana.

The Justice Department has always been a very, very strong civil service, no matter who was in charge, a Democrat or Republican. They went after law violators without fear or favor. What Trump is doing is, he's turning it. He's firing anybody who doesn't seem to be part of his acolytes.

And he's turning it into an instrument that goes after his enemies, whether they're guilty or not, and most of them are not guilty at all, and that helps his friends. This is the path to a dictatorship. That's what dictatorships do.

It is so -- it is so very, very frightening and damaging to our republic.

BASH: You heard the president over and over on the campaign trail saying that he was going to do just this, that he was going to investigate his political enemies, and he won the election.

So it's certainly not surprising.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: Go ahead.

SCHUMER: Yes, I was going to say, he didn't run on -- he ran on many other issues. The American people are overwhelming -- are...

BASH: He did, but he was very clear about this, and people chose to vote for him on other issues perhaps, but they were aware of this.

(CROSSTALK)

SCHUMER: Well, whether -- this is our rule of law. This is fundamental to our democracy, and we cannot let it stand.

And my belief is Democrats, Republicans, and independents, everybody will object to this, because it's so against what our democracy is all about.

BASH: Is there anything that you can do? Obviously, you are not in power in the Senate or in the House.

SCHUMER: Yes, well, we're going to fight strongly as we can in every way. There are going to be legal ways to fight this. We will try to find legislative ways to fight this.

But, also, the American people should let their representatives know how terrible this is to democracy. And we have seen conservatives speak out against this too. And we need our Republican colleagues more than ever to speak out against this violation of the fundamentals of democracy.

BASH: I want to talk about government funding. It is set to expire in nine days.

[09:05:03]

SCHUMER: OK.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: You and your fellow Democrats are pushing to add health care subsidies to the funding bill.

You're under a lot of pressure, I don't need to tell you, from the base of your party to fight Republicans on something, even it means, in this case, shutting down the government. Is that what's going to happen?

SCHUMER: Look, it's the Republicans shutting down the government.

First, these issues are very important to the American people. Health care was decimated. People are losing their health care. Hospitals are closing. People are losing their jobs. It's outrageous, and the American people can't stand it.

But what we are asking very simply is what has always been done in these kinds of budget negotiations, a bipartisan negotiation. The Republican bill is a totally partisan bill with zero, zero input from Democrats. And that's not how to get things done.

We had two bills on the floor Friday. Both failed, the Democratic bill and the Republican bill. And that's because there has been no negotiation with the Republicans. There always used to be. When I was majority leader, for four years we didn't ever shut down because we sat down with Republicans.

So, Hakeem Jeffries and I have now demanded to sit down with Donald Trump, because that's the only way to avoid a Trump shutdown. The Republican leadership is listening to Trump, and not talking to us.

BASH: He, the president, has said he'd love to meet with you. Is it going to happen?

SCHUMER: We're ready to meet with him any time and place to negotiate and avoid the Trump shutdown. Right now, it's a Trump shutdown because he won't even talk to us. He won't even consider what the American people want, is lowering costs.

They don't like his tariffs. They don't like the health care stuff. And when you don't -- when you sit down and say, it's my way or the highway, you're creating a shutdown. This is a Trump shutdown unless he sits down and negotiates with us.

BASH: If nothing changes, negotiation or not, there will be a vote on the day of the deadline a week from Tuesday. If nothing changes, are you going to vote no and urge your Democratic colleagues to vote no, which will end with a shutdown?

SCHUMER: Look, we hope it doesn't come to that...

BASH: But what if it does?

SCHUMER: ... because everyone knows the American people -- the American people are on our side, Dana. By almost 2-1, they believe, if there's a shutdown, it's going to be caused by Trump, because they know how much they want relief in the health care issue, and they know he's not negotiating.

So it's up to them, and I hope and pray that Trump will sit down with us and negotiate a bipartisan bill. That's how it's always been done in the past. That's how shutdowns have been avoided in the past.

BASH: And if he doesn't, I'm just confirming here, you will vote no? Is that correct?

SCHUMER: We are hoping -- Dana, we are hoping that he will negotiate with us.

BASH: And if he doesn't?

SCHUMER: So far, he hasn't. And we have had two bills in the House and Senate, and neither of them have passed. Our Democrats are firm. We need to get something done to relieve the distress the American people are in.

BASH: OK, that sounded like a yes, but you can confirm that, and then I want to move on. Is that accurate?

SCHUMER: The bottom line is, we must, we must get a better bill than what they have, plain and simple.

BASH: OK.

The last time Congress was up against a funding deadline, about six months ago, you voted with Republicans to keep the government open. I want to play what you said on the Senate floor at that time, calling it a Hobson's choice.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCHUMER: Either proceed with the bill before us or risk Donald Trump throwing America into the chaos of a shutdown. This, in my view, is no choice at all. While the C.R. bill is very bad, the potential for a shutdown has

consequences for America that are much, much worse.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Mr. Leader, do you no longer believe what you said six months ago there?

SCHUMER: Things have changed, Dana, in three ways.

First, since March, when that happened, the American people have seen how terrible the Trump administration policies are. Their costs are going up because of tariffs, because of electric bills, and most of all because of the decimation of health care.

Second, we have seen what they're doing. They're illegally violating any appropriations bills, any spending bills we have done by their rescissions, their pocket rescissions, and things like that. And so they're doing it illegally anyway, whether we had an agreement or not.

And, third, Democrats are united. We all agree that we cannot allow the present situation, the status quo to continue, when the American people are demanding change. So, for the last six months we have been united. On the so-called Big Beautiful Bill, every single Democrat voted against it.

[09:10:15]

So the situation is a lot different now than it was then.

BASH: And you do have a Democratic base that is desperate for you to fight in any way, shape or form. Is that also a factor here, you're listening to your voters?

SCHUMER: In all due respect, Dana, it's not just the Democratic base. It's the American people.

Go talk to people in rural areas, Republicans, whose hospitals are closing. Go talk to people, middle-class folks who may have voted Republican whose parents are going to be kicked out of their nursing homes, and they don't know what to do with them. This is a demand from the American people, period, across the board. And there's lots of independents.

When you ask people, do you like what they have done in the big the big bad -- the Big Beautiful Bill, it's 2-1 against it, not only every Democrat, but two-thirds to three-quarters of the independents and 30 percent of the Republicans. So it's the American people demanding change. That's who it is.

BASH: Senator, you said earlier this week that Democrats -- quote -- "have a damn good chance" of winning back the Senate in the 2026 midterms.

SCHUMER: Right. BASH: A CNN poll from this summer found only 28 percent of Democrats,

these are your fellow Democrats, view your party favorably. How can you be so confident when you see numbers like that?

SCHUMER: First because of what Donald Trump is doing to America. It's amazing how bad it is. And when you ask people in similar polls, do you prefer a Democratic candidate or a Republican candidate, it's 47 Democrat, 39 Republican.

We have to do more to build up a strong, strong platform as to what we will do. And Hakeem Jeffries and I, House and Senate, are working on that. But they hate what Trump is doing to them, and they prefer Democratic candidates.

In addition, we have had some great recruiting. It's amazing the candidates who have stepped forward. And I will tell you something nice, Dana, about this. You know why they're stepping forward? They worry about the future of the country. They worry about their children and grandchildren, at the way this administration is heading America into decline.

And so we have had great candidates. People are angry with what Trump's doing. And we're in a much better chance today than we were six months ago of taking back the Senate. I'm optimistic.

BASH: OK. Before I let you go, speaking of candidates, you have been asked numerous times if you will endorse Zohran Mamdani for New York City mayor. You always say you're going to continue to talk.

There are two key questions here that you haven't answered. One is, will you ever endorse him? And, two, what do you need from him to get your endorsement?

SCHUMER: OK. Well, first of all, I know him. We have had a good relationship in the past. And we had a good meeting two weeks ago, a very long meeting with a lot of serious questions.

And all I can tell you is, I'm going to continue talking to him.

BASH: What's the holdup?

SCHUMER: I got to continue talking to him, and that's what I'm going to do.

BASH: Is part of the calculus, that if you endorse a Democratic socialist, you're worried it will be damaging to your party, maybe even your chances of winning back the Senate?

SCHUMER: I'm going to continue talking to him, Dana. You can ask me again.

BASH: All right. Had to try, Senator.

I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for coming on this morning. Nice to see you.

SCHUMER: Hey, Dana, and a happy, good -- a happy Rosh Hashanah to you.

BASH: Thank you. You too.

SCHUMER: My wife is -- has just cooked -- she's just cooked a five- generation brisket recipe, and the kitchen smells great.

BASH: All right, well, we can have -- we can have a brisket-off next time I see you.

Thank you.

SCHUMER: Great.

BASH: Up next, my guest is warning his party's strategy will backfire. Senator John Fetterman tells me why.

And then it's being called a MAGA state funeral for Charlie Kirk. What to expect today at an extremely volatile time in America. Senator Markwayne Mullin will be there, and he's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:18:19]

BASH: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION.

You just heard from the leader of Senate Democrats. He hasn't convinced everyone in his party that he's on the right track.

Here with me now is Democratic Senator John Fetterman of Pennsylvania.

Thank you so much for being here, sir.

It does sound like we could be headed for a government shutdown. What's your response to the leader of your party in the Senate?

SEN. JOHN FETTERMAN (D-PA): Yes, I know. It does seem that.

And I have been -- at least been one that says, hey, now I would love to restore a lot of those health care things. That's the right outcome, but that's a dangerous tactic if you are going to shut the government down for one of our policies do.

I think it's the right thing to extend those health care things, but it is absolutely the wrong thing for a lot of reasons that we're going to shut our government down. I condemned it when the Republicans threatened to do that thing, and it's entirely wrong for us to do the same thing now.

BASH: And you heard Senator Schumer say that, if the government shuts down, it would be on the Republicans. Who do you think would get the blame?

FETTERMAN: I really -- I don't know. I don't know.

But what people will know is that that's going to have a profound impact on millions of Americans, and that's the wrong kinds of chaos that our country needs right now in this time, I mean, after the Kirk assassination and a lot of the other kinds of drama.

And now, for me, as a Democrat, if you are concerned by a lot of these changes that have occurred during the Trump presidency, why would you turn over a shuttered government over to Vought and the OMB to effectively remake the government in all kinds of ways? I refuse to be a part of things to empower individuals that really want to take away union workers and eliminate more kinds of parts of the government.

[09:20:17]

And that would allow them to redefine exactly what's essential and what is not. And, for me, I'm not sure we have the appropriate kinds of leverage. Now, to be clear, I hope, I hope they decide to restore a lot of those health care things. But, for me, I don't think -- like I said, it's the right outcome, but it's the wrong tactic at this time always, always to shut our government down.

BASH: Republicans would need seven Democrats to vote for their funding bill in order to avoid a government shutdown. You're one. Have you spoken to any of your Democratic colleagues?

FETTERMAN: Oh, yes.

BASH: Would they vote with you?

FETTERMAN: Yes, I am -- I am a confirmed no. I really led that charge back in March, because I thought it was wrong then too. It's always wrong to shut our government down.

I will be a Democrat, and I understand that our base wants these kinds of things, but I will be an honest Democrat that says, hey, I think that's not it. I don't agree with the vast majority of the things that have happened, but now I refuse to add massive chaos under this.

And then, if that -- I think they want us to shut the government down because that it would allow them to do further things that they aren't able to or now constrained by the judges right now.

BASH: Are there six other Democrats?

FETTERMAN: So, for me, I haven't talked -- I haven't gotten a straight answer from any of my colleagues what that is. Will the votes be there or not? I have said it will be there for me, not because I -- I voted for the Democratic C.R. to restore all of those kinds of health care things.

And I also believe it's not the kinds of chaos that our country can withstand at this point.

BASH: You just heard the Democratic leaders say he is more confident than before about taking back the Senate in 2026. Senator, you're the only Democrat to flip a Republican-held seat in the Senate in the past two elections. Do you think your party is on the path to taking the majority back? FETTERMAN: Yes, well, I will give it honest assessment. I do think

we're going to take -- we're going to take North Carolina. Cooper is really the ideal candidate. And I absolutely know Ossoff's going to prevail in Georgia.

And, now, I also think we have an outstanding opportunity. I believe the Maine governor now just announced that she's just about to join that. So I think we -- I feel really good.

It's not just hyping it one way or the other, but, effectively, things are very favorable because we have had really great kinds of candidates. Now, Brown -- Brown's tough. Brown's going to be tough in Ohio. But Ohio is a difficult lift, no matter who that is. But if it is flippable, then that would be Sherrod Brown.

BASH: So you're more bullish than maybe I thought you would be, given your assessment of where your party is going.

FETTERMAN: I'm saying is that we have -- in the best possible position to do those things. I mean, I'm not rah, rah, rah it's guaranteed 100 percent. It's not a great map for us. But we do have some great candidates. And I do believe that it is possible, and at least if not to flip, but also to close from 53 to 47.

BASH: Senator John Fetterman, thank you so much for being here. I appreciate it.

FETTERMAN: My pleasure. Thank you so much.

BASH: And President Trump wants retribution. That's been clear for years now. Will his Justice Department deliver what he wants?

Senator Markwayne Mullin is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:27:53]

BASH: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION.

Right now, everyone who's anyone in the MAGA movement is heading to Arizona for what Steve Bannon is calling a MAGA state funeral for Charlie Kirk.

Here with me now is Republican Senator Markwayne Mullin of Oklahoma.

Thank you so much for being here. I know you are going to the memorial service for Charlie Kirk. President Trump and Vice President Vance are among the top leaders who will be speaking. What do you want their message to be? What is the best way for them to remember your friend?

SEN. MARKWAYNE MULLIN (R-OK): His legacy.

I mean, Dana, he was a Christian man first, a husband and a father, and honor his legacy, which he would say, don't honor my legacy. Let's carry on what I was fighting for. But his legacy is that. He left a lasting impression on people around the world.

And I believe you're going to hear true friends speak about him. I mean, it's pretty amazing. A guy that's 31 years old, the day he was assassinated, you had the president of the United States cancel his official schedule and address the country from the Oval Office.

You had the vice president of the United States change his schedule and, on the 11th, fly down to receive his remains and transport them back home and take his family with him. I mean, you just -- it's hard to believe a guy 31 years old made an impact like that around the world. You saw what happened in Korea.

You saw what's happening in London. You saw what's happening on our campuses, our high school campuses, our college campuses around the country. It's just absolutely amazing. And so we're there to truly celebrate his life and then move forward carrying on his message.

BASH: One of the things that is maybe a hallmark of the legacy that I'm sure you would say and I know you have said that he wants to -- would want to leave behind is engaging in one of the most fundamental American rights, which is free speech.

[09:30:00]

MULLIN: Right.

BASH: And I do want to ask you about that, because ABC this week indefinitely suspended comedian Jimmy Kimmel not long after FCC Chairman Brendan Carr went on TV and warned -- quote -- "We can do this the easy way or the hard way."

Your Republican colleague Senator Ted Cruz called the threats from Carr -- quote -- "dangerous as hell." Listen to more of what he said.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX): I think it is unbelievably dangerous for government to put itself in the position of saying, we're going to decide what speech we like and what we don't, and we're going to threaten to take you off air if we don't like what you're saying.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

BASH: Do you agree with him?

MULLIN: No.

Here's what I want to point out real quick on this is, the ABC executives, they have the right to do what they choose to. They're running a business, and a for-profit business, just like when FOX decided to remove Tucker Carlson over his COVID comments. If it doesn't align with a private business, then they have the right to remove them if it doesn't fit with their brand. It's that simple.

BASH: Can I just stop you right there for one second? Can I stop you right there for one second? MULLIN: Sure.

BASH: Because the difference between this and FOX and a lot of other instances where private companies make a decision on who is employed by them and if they don't like what they say or what they do, they fire them. Fine.

The big difference here, as you know, is that this is a broadcast network that is -- was threatened by a government individual who has oversight over the regulation and potential for a merger in the future. And so that was part of the decision.

MULLIN: This is also -- this is also a -- sure, but this is also a network that has not been friendly to this administration whatsoever. And so I don't think a threat would make any difference whatsoever.

They made a decision because Jimmy Kimball said something that was extremely insensitive and a flat-out lie about the president of the United States, and there was no excuse for it. There is no excuse for making a joke -- I don't care if you're a comedian or who you are -- to making a joke about an assassination. There's no room for that at all.

And ABC made that decision, and just like FOX made the decision over Tucker Carlson. And for anyone to say that we're trying to silence free speech, these are the same people that didn't stick up for Tucker Carlson when he got fired for speaking his mind about COVID on FOX.

So it's -- this isn't a two-way street at this point. This is the left that's being extremely hypocritical of themselves.

BASH: Well...

MULLIN: And the hypocrisy is bad.

And, Dana -- or, Dana, let me point out something too. And you may or may not get to this question, but I want to point out the hypocrisy on the left again over just what happened yesterday or -- I say yesterday -- I'm sorry -- Friday in the House of Representatives.

When you had Melissa Hortman, the state representative that was assassinated, a resolution came forward. The entire House unanimously supported to condemn and to honor the life of her, condemn the assassination and honor the life. That same resolution with the name changed said Charlie Kirk, what happened...

BASH: Senator, I have some -- Senator, I have Democrats on, and I'm going to talk to them about it.

MULLIN: I want to point this out, though. You had 58 -- but I want to point it out too, because the hypocrisy for both sides on the free speech needs to be pointed out, because the same resolution that had Charlie Kirk's name on, you had 58 representatives vote no, 38 voted present, 22 chose not to vote.

BASH: OK. MULLIN: That is silence. So you had 118 individuals that didn't condemn it, because why? Because of hypocrisy over both sides.

BASH: OK, Senator, we're going to get to that.

But I want to return to you saying that it's sort of just liberals saying that this is a pushback against free speech, because you mentioned Tucker Carlson. He's one of the conservatives who is saying, whoa, just be careful. It's Ted Cruz, who's definitely not a liberal, Tucker Carlson, Ben Shapiro and others saying that they are concerned that, if the Trump FCC and the president himself go down this road, that what's to say that the same thing couldn't happen when Democrats take office?

And is free speech just free speech?

(CROSSTALK)

MULLIN: Yes, why don't we ask the executives of ABC why they fired Jimmy Kimmel? Maybe it was a fact that his show was losing money. I don't know. Maybe they were looking for an exit.

But I really don't believe ABC would have decided to fire Jimmy Kimmel over a threat. ABC has been a longstanding critic of President Trump. They did it because they felt like it didn't meet their brand anymore. That's it.

BASH: Well, it was -- there was business pressure.

MULLIN: So while you and I can debate why they did it, we can assume that it was because of a message. The only person that can answer that question is their executive board. That's it.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: OK, I want to move on.

MULLIN: Right.

BASH: But there was pressure from the FCC very publicly and from the president of the United States threatening to take away licenses.

[09:35:00]

I want to move on to sort of a different version of what we have seen this week from the president. He claimed that 97 percent of stories about him on newscasts are negative. And he said: "I think that's really illegal." Here's a little bit more of what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: When somebody is given -- 97 percent of the stories are bad about a person, that's no longer free speech. That's no longer -- that's just cheating.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BASH: Senator, he really seems to be redefining free speech as speech that is only favorable to him.

I can't imagine that you're comfortable with that, as somebody who swore an oath to the Constitution, and a pretty prominent part of the Constitution is the right to free speech.

MULLIN: He didn't say free speech. He said cheating. And what he was referring to is elections.

When you have 98 or 97 percent of the news stories over that...

BASH: No, that's not what he was talking about.

MULLIN: He said -- no, well, he just said it. I just -- I'm playing back exactly the message.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: He wasn't talking about elections. He said 97 percent of stories about him on newscasts are negative.

MULLIN: He said it was cheating. But he said it was cheating. I'm repeating the clip you just played, because I didn't watch that. You just played it for me for the first time.

BASH: But he wasn't referring to elections.

MULLIN: OK, then what would he be referring to when he said cheating?

BASH: He was referring to he believes...

MULLIN: Because he didn't say free speech.

BASH: He believes -- it was a very long, long statement that he made. He was saying that he believes that the stories on network television about him are negative and that it should be potentially illegal. That is my question to you, whether or not you are comfortable with that.

MULLIN: OK, well, I -- that is not -- I can't -- Dana, I can't answer a question I didn't hear.

I'm repeating what the clip you just played. The clip you just played that the president -- and it said that that is cheating. That's his words. That's not me making the assumption. That's not paraphrasing what he said. That's the clip you played. And that 100 percent -- because we have had this conversation, that 100 percent refers to elections.

When you have 97 percent of the news stories on him that's constantly telling bad stories -- and, by the way, that wasn't even close to what was happening with Biden in office. You guys were covering it up constantly what he was doing.

And so when 97 percent of the news stories are negative about him and 99 percent about Pete Hegseth is negative, it is cheating, because you're putting out a narrative that isn't true.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: I guess my question is, if you just kind of take a step back, sir, because let's say he was talking about -- you speak Trump-speak. You talk to him all the time. Let's just say you're right that when he said cheating he in his mind was referring to elections.

But it is -- since the beginning of time in the United States of America, presidents have not liked the criticism that they got when they get coverage that they don't believe is favorable to them, but they have said that's just part of being the president in the United States of America with a free press.

You don't think there's a slippery slope going on here with that?

MULLIN: Well, I would like to go back and look at the comparisons of how many negative stories were ran against Biden, against Obama, against Clinton, and even against Bush 41 and Bush 43.

BASH: But let's say there was. Does that -- would that give the president the right to crack down?

(CROSSTALK)

MULLIN: I'm just saying, let's -- he didn't say he was going to crack down. He said it was cheating. I'm just repeating the words, but I'm just saying there is a problem. And I agree with him there is a problem.

There isn't any positive -- negative stories that our left-leaning media outlets can tell about him.

BASH: You believe in free speech.

MULLIN: And, look, has he been such a bad president? Absolutely, I believe in free speech. Without a question, I believe in free speech.

But there's a thin line between free speech and when it crosses a line and causes violence. And when you start calling someone fascist, which is what we have seen prescribed on the bullets and on the magazines of these individuals, when you start using words that he's a Nazi and comparing him to Hitler -- and I'm not saying you have done that.

I'm saying this is the negative stories that have been played about him. There is a problem at some point. And some people had to be held accountable. But hate -- free speech is free speech. Hateful speech is also free speech. But when it leads to violence, now there's -- that's a crossover. And when -- and people should be held accountable for that.

BASH: OK, we are out of time.

I wanted to ask you about one other thing very quickly about the president making a pretty remarkable statement on his TRUTH Social post saying -- addressed to Pam Bondi, his attorney general, saying: "I reviewed over 30 statements and posts saying essentially the same old story as last time, all talk, no action. Nothing is being done. What about Comey, Adam 'Shifty' Schiff, Letitia? They're all guilty as hell, but nothing is being done."

He's asking his attorney general in a public way to go after his political enemies, very open about it. You're OK with that?

MULLIN: Well, I think what we know is, President Trump is very open and transparent with the American people and he speaks his mind. And that's what his supporters love about him and that's what America loves about him.

[09:40:06]

I don't think there's any question that Comey should be looked at. I mean, we just got to look at the 86 comment that he made and when we start looking at the lies that he chose to continue with Russiagate. Adam Schiff went out while he was the chairman of Intel every single meeting and said that we had the smoking gun. And he said that for how many weeks straight?

And you're going, where was the smoking gun? At some point, what -- their actions need to be looked into. And if they did something, I don't know. We're -- this is a country that should look into it. If they did something illegal, if they were leaking classified information, if they used their position of power to -- for corruption, then they 100 percent should be held accountable.

And I -- what President Trump is saying here is, it's time to look into them and say -- and hold them accountable for what they said.

BASH: OK.

Thank you so much, Senator. I really appreciate your time.

MULLIN: Thank you for having me on.

BASH: Up next, Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett will be here.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:45:42]

BASH: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION.

You just heard Republican Senator Markwayne Mullin criticize political rhetoric on the left.

I'm going to talk about that and much, much more with Democratic Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett.

I want to ask you about that in one second, but I do want to start -- first of all, welcome. Thank you for being here.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: With "The New York Times" reporting that the DOJ closed an investigation into the president's border czar, Tom Homan, after he allegedly accepted a bag of cash from undercover FBI agents.

Now, we should say the FBI director and the deputy attorney general say they found no evidence of wrongdoing. You're a member of the House Oversight Committee. Are you going to try to get information about the investigation?

REP. JASMINE CROCKETT (D-TX): This is absolutely something that not only Oversight, but Judiciary should look into.

And I sit as the ranking member on the subcommittee for Judiciary that is oversight. So this is something that me and my team are definitely going to look into. And, hopefully, the chairman of that subcommittee is interested in finding out what the truth is, because that is what we are really supposed to do.

We are not supposed to figure out who is best friends with the president, and if they are closely aligned with him, then just ignore things, while trying to make up things about political opposition.

BASH: Well, on that note, I do want to turn to something that you heard the senator just say, which is, he was talking about a resolution that came before the House this past week honoring Charlie Kirk.

And there were 58 Democrats who voted against it. You were one.

CROCKETT: Yes.

BASH: Why?

CROCKETT: Absolutely.

You know what? One of the things I do want to point out...

BASH: Yes.

CROCKETT: ... that's not been laid out that honestly hurts my heart is, when I saw the no-votes, there were only two Caucasians.

For the most part, the only people they voted no were people of color, because the rhetoric that Charlie Kirk continuously put out there was rhetoric that specifically targeted people of color. And so it is unfortunate that even our colleagues could not see how harmful his rhetoric was specifically to us.

And I can tell you that, a month prior to him passing away, he had actually gotten out on his podcast -- I wasn't aware of this at the time, but he got out there and he was talking negatively about me directly.

So, if there was any way that I was going to honor somebody who decided that they were just going to negatively talk about me and proclaim that I was somehow involved in the great white replacement, yes, I'm not honoring that kind of stuff, especially as a civil rights attorney and understanding how I got to Congress, knowing that there were people that died, people that were willing to die that worked to make sure that voices like mine could exist in this place.

So, to me, just like we wanted to make sure that those Confederate relics were taken down, the idea of a new age relic being propped up was something that I just could not subscribe to. And it is unfortunate that more of my colleagues even on my side of the aisle could not see the amount of harm that this man was attempting to inflict upon our communities.

BASH: So, meanwhile, you obviously feel very strongly about the rhetoric that Charlie Kirk used that you find objectionable...

CROCKETT: Yes.

BASH: ... and also from others in the MAGA movement.

As the memorial service for him is going to happen later today, there is a debate over heated rhetoric on all sides. And...

CROCKETT: Listen...

BASH: Go ahead.

CROCKETT: Whether it's heated or not, the fact is, Charlie Kirk should still be here. It should not have been that there was political violence that resulted because of the words that were coming out of his mouth, just like plenty of MAGA hates when I mention white supremacy, which kind of tells you where MAGA stands.

But, nevertheless, they get very upset when I talk about white supremacy, but that doesn't mean that somebody should then try to find a bullet or try to find a knife and harm me, not in America. That's not who we are supposed to be.

BASH: Well, let me ask you, because I do want to play a couple of statements that you made earlier this year.

CROCKETT: OK.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CROCKETT: Unfortunately, we have someone that is occupying the White House, and, as far as I'm concerned, he is an enemy to the United States.

They want to show that they are loyal to this -- I don't even know what to call them. I have called him so many things, but this wannabe Hitler, for sure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[09:50:02]

BASH: And, to be clear, the president has attacked, other people have attacked you in his orbit, maybe not him personally.

But do you have a responsibility as an elected official not to raise the temperature, but rather lower the temperature, particularly when there are people out there who listen to elected officials all over the place who are not well who use that as a way to instigate the political violence that you are calling out?

CROCKETT: I think that my responsibility is to be transparent and to be honest.

And the reality is that we are living in a time in which this administration and this regime is not interested in making sure that people understand history. We need to understand why they are so problematic. And so I am using that language because it is accurate language when we see the consolidation of power, when we see them trying to chill speech of jokesters, when we're seeing all of this.

That is a playbook out of Hitler. And I won't deny it. Like, these are the facts. But one of the things that I have never done that the president has done consistently is called specifically for violence. He has said, oh, beat that one up. He has said those types of things.

We know that Charlie Kirk was saying things about who should live and who should die. I have never said those kinds of things. And I think that those things are the ones that are really, really dangerous. And even still, some of that will still be protected.

We know that we still have laws that are on the book that certain speech is not protected, that it does cross over, when you are inciting violence, such as what we saw on January 6, when you are doing what we consider to be a terroristic threat of some sort, where it's a matter of, I'm not just saying it, but I have the apparent ability to carry that out.

But me laying out historical facts, just like they don't want to talk about the fact that slavery was real in this country and that my people were enslaved and dragged and raped and abused, and they don't want to account for any of that, they don't believe in reparations, no, I think it is OK for me to understand history and communicate in a very clear way about why we should feel as if there is a concern.

And when we swear an oath, which is what that first clip was, we swear an oath to the Constitution to protect against all enemies foreign and domestic. And so if there is someone that is evidencing themselves, such as the president, who is going out and says, yes, I will take a $400 million plane from a foreign government or is engaged in receiving crypto that we cannot track in exchange for, say, giving away chips to Saudi Arabia, no, we absolutely need to understand how these things could cause us harm.

Or when he's cozying up to somebody like Vladimir Putin, it's not only a problem for us, but it's a problem for our allies when you have somebody like Poland that is like, yes, this is what Russia's up to, and the president is like, oh, that may have just been a mistake.

We need to understand what all his business dealings are, even with Russia, because that has the potential of putting us in harm's way.

BASH: Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett, thank you so much for being here. Nice to see you.

CROCKETT: Good to see you too.

BASH: And up next: Two planes full of White House staff and leaders in the MAGA movement are heading to the Charlie Kirk memorial.

What to expect when they take the stage -- that's next.

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[09:57:57]

BASH: Quick look ahead now at the memorial service for Charlie Kirk. We will hear personal remarks from President Trump and many more leaders from the MAGA movement. Police are preparing for as many as 100,000 attendees. Our special coverage begins at 1:00 p.m., and I hope you will join me.

Thank you for spending your Sunday morning with us.

Fareed Zakaria picks it up next.