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State of the Union

Interview With Sen. Ruben Gallego (D-AZ); Interview With Former Vice President Mike Pence; Interview With Minneapolis, Minnesota, Mayor Jacob Frey. Aired 9-10a ET

Aired January 18, 2026 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST (voice-over): Escalation. The Trump administration expands its crackdown on Minnesota and targets local officials.

GOV. TIM WALZ (D-MN): End this occupation. You've done enough.

JACOB FREY (D), MAYOR OF MINNEAPOLIS, MINNESOTA: This is not creating safety.

TAPPER: How will they respond? Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey joins me in moments.

Plus: Not for sale.

PROTESTERS: Greenland not for sale!

PROTESTER: Make America go away.

TAPPER: President Trump won't take no for an answer on Greenland.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: May put a tariff on countries if they don't go along with Greenland, because we need Greenland.

TAPPER: Is he jeopardizing America's alliances? His former Vice President Mike Pence weighs in ahead.

And taking stock one year in. Americans hand Trump a dismal report card. What might that mean for the midterms? Democratic Senator Ruben Gallego joins me live. Plus, our political panel breaks it all down.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: Hello, I'm Jake Tapper in Washington, where the state of our union is ratcheted up. President Trump is aggressively challenging norms domestically and

internationally in risky high-stakes standoffs. On the global front, President Trump's determination to add Greenland to the United States by seemingly any means necessary risks blowing up the NATO alliance.

Just yesterday, the president accused close European allies of playing a -- quote -- "very dangerous game" by opposing his efforts to take Greenland from NATO ally Denmark. And he threatened new tariffs, up to 25 percent potentially, against those European allies unless they give him what he wants.

And, domestically, in Minnesota, a major escalation overnight. "The Washington Post" and ABC News are reporting that the Pentagon has put hundreds of active duty troops on standby to potentially deploy to Minnesota. These troops are with the Army's 11th Airborne Division in Alaska, specializing in cold weather operations.

Temperatures in Minneapolis, for those wondering, are hovering around zero degrees this morning.

Meanwhile, the Justice Department is opening a criminal probe, CNN is told, into Minnesota Governor Tim Walz and Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey, as the state's largest newspaper warns -- quote -- "Minnesota is under siege."

And joining us now is the Democratic mayor of Minneapolis, Jacob Frey.

Mayor Frey, what is your response to this breaking news that there are 1,500 active duty U.S. soldiers on standby to deploy to your state?

FREY: This act was clearly designed to intimidate the people of Minneapolis.

And here's the thing. We're not going to be intimidated. If the goal here is safety, we have got many mechanisms to achieve safety. And the best way to get safety is not to have an influx of even more agents, and, in this case, military, in Minneapolis.

Right now, we have about 600 police officers, and they have got 3,000 or so ICE agents and border control. That they are now talking about deploying 1,500 military, this is -- well, it's ridiculous, but we will not be intimidated by the actions of this federal government.

TAPPER: Earlier this week, "The Minneapolis Star Tribune" editorial board wrote that your state is -- quote -- "under siege" and compared the situation in Minneapolis to a -- quote -- "military occupation."

Is that how you see it? Is Minneapolis being occupied by the federal government?

FREY: Invaded, under siege, occupied,use whatever word or superlative that you want to attach, but the bottom line is, what is taking place is designed to intimidate, it is not fair, it's not just, and it's completely unconstitutional.

But one of the beautiful things that's taking place is that the people here in Minneapolis are not just resisting. They're standing up. They're standing up for their neighbors. They're loving people. They're making sure that they got a ride to the grocery store, a safe walk to their car.

They're making sure that they have those basic necessities that they need, because we have got a whole lot of people that are afraid to go outside, at the risk of getting torn apart from their own families.

And so, in the face of a whole lot of adversity, I'm so proud to be from Minneapolis. I'm so proud to be the mayor of this awesome city with these extraordinary people. They're peacefully protesting. They're standing up for one another.

[09:05:00]

And, like I said, it's not just going to be resistance here in this city. We're not backing down. We're not going to be intimidated.

TAPPER: You mentioned both resistance and peaceful protesting in what you just said.

Where is that line between impeding what the officers are doing and obviously creating a physical conflict and peaceful resistance? Like, what do you tell your citizens to do so that they are resisting, in your view, but also not obstructing law enforcement from their duties?

FREY: Right.

We have tens of thousands of people throughout the city that are peacefully protesting. Of course, they're marching. Of course, they're expressing their First Amendment rights. Yes, they are able to record what is taking place.

I mean, that's part of their right as citizens of the United States. And, no, ICE agents can't stop, nor can they hide from a recording that is taking place. And, at the same time, the message is very clear that we are not going to take the bait. We will not counter Donald Trump's chaos with our own brand of chaos here.

And we're not going to give them an excuse to do the thing that clearly they're trying to set up to do right now, which is these 1,500 troops.

The fact that we're saying this out loud, Jake, is bizarre. I never thought in a million years that we would be invaded by our own federal government. Of course, there's different perspectives when a different party gets sworn into the White House. Of course, there are different ideologies throughout America.

That's part of what makes our country great. But you don't get investigated for having a different opinion. You don't have militarized troops deployed to a city for having a different perspective or because a city happened to vote for the opposite party.

That may be what happens in other countries, but it doesn't happen here. Here, this is America. And we have got to be standing up for these American values.

TAPPER: So you just alluded to the fact that the Justice Department said, it's investigating you and Democratic Governor Tim Walz of Minnesota over alleged obstruction of federal law enforcement.

Have you received any sort of official notice or subpoena? Are you even aware of what the specific allegations against you might be?

FREY: No, we have not received anything. I'm not aware of specific allegations.

But, if it were true, the targeting would be the product of performing one of the most basic responsibilities and obligations that I have as mayor, which is to speak on behalf of our great city, speak on behalf of our constituents.

And that the federal government would be going after me because of that speech should be deeply concerning, not just for people in Minneapolis, but for anybody throughout the country. And, of course, we have seen this before, whether it's me or Governor Walz or Senator Slotkin or Senator Kelly.

This is happening on the regular, and it's happening because people speak, speak up. But First Amendment speech is not something that we negotiate away in this country. First Amendment speech is something that we stand up for, whether you agree with it or not, whether you find it abhorrent or not.

It's one of the most basic and foundational rights that we have. And, thankfully, in Minneapolis, we stand up and value First Amendment speech. That's just kind of baked into who we are.

TAPPER: Governor Walz has mobilized the Minnesota National Guard. He has not yet deployed them.

I want to play something that you said earlier this week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FREY: We have residents that are asking the very limited number of police officers that we have to fight ICE agents on the street.

We cannot be at a place right now in America where we have two governmental entities that are literally fighting one another.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Literally fighting one another is pretty stark. Are you worried that that's where this is actually heading, with the National Guard and local police on one side in Minneapolis and active duty troops and ICE agents and other federal law enforcement on the other actually literally fighting, physically fighting?

FREY: As I said then, and I will say now, we can't have that in America. And so what we are hopeful for here is the judicial system to do its

part to see that necessary check and balance, to recognize that we can't have cities occupied in the United States that simply have a different view from the White House.

[09:10:02]

Now it's Minneapolis, but, importantly -- and I want to talk to everybody throughout America. I know you love your family, your neighborhood. I know that you love your town, regardless of where you are. And just imagine what it would feel like if you suddenly had an administration deployment of troops, of agents, come into your city by the thousands, vastly outnumber your police department, and cause chaos on your streets.

If the goal here is to create peace and safety and calm, there's a very clear antidote here, which is leave. The second these ICE agents leave the city, I'm telling you, you're going to have calm in Minneapolis and you will continue to see the great comeback that we had been experiencing. Let us get back to that comeback.

Let us live in peace. Let us have businesses that are open and day cares where you don't need to escort staff to and from. Let us live in a place where -- I mean, look, in Minneapolis, we will stand up. If we have to sled down ice hills to get to a protest, we will do that.

If we have got to make sure the people are escorted to the grocery store, we will do that. But, truthfully, we want to get back to a place where we can just love on our city, do our daily activities, just like any other town in America.

TAPPER: So the position of the administration -- first of all, a week ago, as you know, ICE released a list of 19 undocumented immigrants that they said they picked up in Minnesota. They have been convicted of crimes ranging from sexual assault and child abuse to murder.

The White House border czar, Tom Homan, said they need to pick up those dangerous individuals. And he said specifically that you can fix this issue today. Take a listen to what Tom Homan had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TOM HOMAN, WHITE HOUSE BORDER CZAR: We're arresting illegal aliens when we're out there looking for criminals.

You want less collateral arrests, then let us in the damn jail. Frey and Walz could fix us today. Let us in the jail, so we can arrest the public safety threat in the safety and security of a jail, rather than forcing us into the street to find these bad guys.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: What's your response to that, sir?

FREY: I'm going to take the most easy position I think I've ever taken. Hey, Minneapolis, we're anti-murder. Second most easy position, we're

anti-rape. Third most easy position, we're anti-crime. You can't do those things in Minneapolis. And, if you do, we investigate them, we prosecute, you charge, you arrest, and you put the people in jail. And, by the way, we have partnered extensively with the federal government to get the perpetrators of violent crime off our streets.

And we have seen great success in doing that. In fact, on the North Side, one example, we worked with the ATF and the FBI and the DEA and a number of different entities to successfully drive down shootings to record lows. So do we partner to get the bad guys? Of course we do.

Here's what we don't partner on. We don't partner to just yank random people off the street because they happen to look Latino or they happen to look Somali. We don't partner to do, like, constant checks of passports, requiring people to bring their passport or all this identification around with them all the time.

I mean, that's not America, not to mention I want our police officers not hunting down a father who has done nothing wrong. I want our police officers working to stop violent crime and prevent carjackings and do all this, the basic stuff that you need to do in a city.

And so, no, I don't think Homan understands the basic dynamic as to how stuff works in Minnesota here. But the bottom line is, as we know, this is not about safety. It's not about crime. This is about intimidation. And, in Minneapolis, we're not going to be intimidated.

TAPPER: Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey, thank you so much for joining us this morning.

FREY: Thank you so much for having me.

TAPPER: President Trump's new threat rattles America's allies.

I'm going to get a reaction from his former Vice President Mike Pence next.

Plus, is the Trump administration losing support among the American people over its immigration tactics?

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TAPPER: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION.

European leaders are warning of a -- quote -- "dangerous downward spiral" in U.S. relations over President Trump's determination to add Greenland to the United States.

Joining us now is the former Vice President of the United States Republican Mike Pence of Indiana. I see him wearing his Hoosier tie. I assume that that's a nod to Monday night's game.

Mr. Vice President, we are seeing a lot of... MIKE PENCE, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You better

believe it.

TAPPER: Yes.

We're seeing a lot of Republican pushback to the president's focus on Greenland and his threats yesterday to U.S. allies in terms of the tariffs. Republican Congressman Don Bacon told me yesterday, in the wake of the president's new tariff threats -- quote -- "I and most Americans disagree with the president's heavy-handedness. He is threatening NATO members, which is shameful" unquote.

Are you concerned that these actions are jeopardizing the NATO alliance?

PENCE: Well, I -- look, I think it's a question right now, Jake, not of what the president's trying to accomplish, but how.

And I have concerns about using what I think is a questionable constitutional authority, imposing unilateral tariffs on NATO allies, to achieve this objective, as much as I had concerns about the threat of a military invasion, which apparently is no longer being talked about.

[09:20:13]

But the what here I think is absolutely in the interest of the United States of America. I mean, literally, I think it was Abraham Lincoln's secretary of state, who negotiated the purchase of Alaska, who first suggested that the United States also purchase Greenland.

I traveled to the region in 2019, visited Iceland, to literally make the case of our national security interest as China and Russia continue to intrude farther and farther into the Arctic. So what the president's trying to do here, I think is absolutely in the interest of the United States of America.

I would just rather see the present use his persuasive powers and U.S. investment in Greenland to lay a foundation for ultimately achieving that goal.

TAPPER: As you know, we have a treaty with Denmark that allows the United States to build as many military installations on Greenland as the United States wants. There's one right there now, and there have been up to 17 in the past.

French President Emmanuel Macron, in terms of the how President Trump is attempting this, he posted on X yesterday in response to the president's threats of tariffs -- quote -- "No intimidation or threat will influence us, neither in Ukraine nor in Greenland nor anyone else in the world, when we are confronted with such situations" -- unquote.

And that's Macron implicitly putting Trump and Putin on the same level. Are you worried at all that how President Trump is making this play for Greenland is doing the U.S. more harm than good?

PENCE: Yes, well, look, Denmark is a very strong ally of the United States of America.

I was in Washington, D.C., on 9/11. Our NATO allies, for the first time ever, used Article 5. They sent their own into harm's way to defend our country, which is what the NATO treaty requires. And no country lost more soldiers on a per capita basis than Denmark.

But I -- so, I do think that the current posture, which I hope will change and abate, does threaten to fracture that strong relationship, not just with Denmark, but with all of our NATO allies. But this is not new.

It's important that people understand it was 2019 I think the president first mentioned buying Denmark. And the Danish prime minister, or -- I think referred to that as an absurd idea. And the president canceled a trip to Denmark. I ended up traveling to Europe a month later and then to Iceland to make the case.

So I just -- I really want to support the president's objective here. I want to encourage people around the country to recognize that we have an absolute national security interest in controlling and I think ultimately owning Greenland. But how we do that, I honestly believe, look, as you said, we have had a treaty with Denmark since 1951.

We have a military base there now. There was a point in time where we had 10,000 troops in Greenland. Now I think it's about 200. I think one of the things that the administration could do is simply deploy forces into the region, because the threat that we are faced, with continued Arctic incursions by China and Russia, is real, are -- the Golden Dome, which I think is a spectacular and visionary idea by the president, will require more real estate, including Greenland, to fully implement it.

So we have a real interest here. But I'd rather see us making investments. And I think that would lay the predicate for the people of the territory and ultimately Denmark to finding a pathway forward to the United States being able to take Greenland off their hands.

TAPPER: A minute ago, you referred to buying Denmark, and I know you meant buying Greenland. I just want to make sure for the record.

PENCE: Yes, I'm sorry. Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: On Tuesday -- let's turn to Iran for a second. On Tuesday, the president posted a message to Iranian patriots in the street, promising -- quote -- "Help is on its way."

Yesterday, the president said it's time for new leadership in Iran after the supreme leader in Iran called the president a criminal. What do you think American help for the citizens of Iran should look like? And should the goal here be regime change?

PENCE: Well, look, Iran is the leading state sponsor of terror in the world. It's a regime that's been in place under the mullahs for the last 50 years. It's not only oppressed and tyrannized their people, but they have also exported terror across the region, claimed American lives in the region and around the world.

[09:25:10]

And we -- it is absolutely in the interest of the United States of America to see a change in Iran. And I am grateful that, different than President Obama in his first year in office, now we have a president who is willing to speak out and express support for the people of Iran as they take to the streets.

Back in 2009, I actually authored a resolution in the Congress while President Obama and the Obama administration remained silent during the Green Revolution. We had to pass a resolution in Congress by almost a unanimous vote to ultimately see our president speak out on behalf of those people, but the revolution was crushed.

I think the first thing is to express support, to make it clear to the people of Iran that we oppose their government. We don't oppose them. We want to see them have their freedom restored. But I also believe that the credible threat of the use of force, the president's willingness to strike the Iranian nuclear facilities earlier this year was an extraordinary step forward.

And I think making it clear that, if the mullahs continue this reign of terror against their people, that all options are on the table, I think is a way to save lives, but ultimately, ultimately set the table for a change in Iran, which would not only change the Middle East, Jake. It would change the world.

TAPPER: Let's turn back to our own hemisphere in Venezuela.

The Trump administration right now seems satisfied with what is basically still the Maduro regime minus Maduro and his wife remaining in power. His vice president is the acting president. And the president has repeatedly praised Delcy Rodriguez. There are no plans for elections as of right now.

You were the point person on this issue when you were the vice president. Are you worried at all that the president is abandoning the Trump-Pence administration's commitment to a democratic future in Venezuela?

PENCE: Well, people need to understand that, before Chavez and then Maduro brought their tyranny and socialism, that Venezuela was the second most prosperous nation in our hemisphere.

They literally broke that country. They created the kind of deprivation that saw eight to 10 million people literally flee the country in all points on the map. Our administration took decisive efforts to recognize a new president. Juan Guaido was elected. We had 60 countries back us in that, but ultimately Maduro survived.

So I'm grateful that President Trump unleashed our elite armed forces, Delta Forces, to take Maduro down, to bring him to the United States to face justice. And I was a historic and an important step forward towards restoring freedom in that country. But what comes after is just as important, Jake. And I want to say,

Delcy Rodriguez is not the right leader for Venezuela going forward. I understand the need for an interim period of time. There will be a stabilization fund, as the secretary of state has said.

But I think it should be the objective of the United States to move forward as quickly as possible to restore basic liberties, to restore free market principles, do that through free and fair elections. And I have no doubt in my mind, whether it's Maria Machado or someone else, that the people of Venezuela will choose freedom.

I will say one last thing on this, and that is that there are many voices around the president now that are reflecting this kind of new isolationism for the United States. I think it partly accounts for the back-and-forth on the rhetoric about and support for Ukraine.

The president pushed those voices aside when he used our armed forces to strike Iran, but he also pushed those voices aside when he took down Nicolas Maduro. And I'm grateful for that. America is the leader of the free world. We continue to need to act like it, especially when it comes to our hemisphere.

TAPPER: Vice President Mike Pence, good to see you, sir. Thank you so much. Really appreciate hearing from you.

PENCE: Yes, thank you, Jake.

TAPPER: Should Democrats resurrect an old slogan for a new fight with the White House?

Arizona Democratic Senator Ruben Gallego weighs in next.

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[09:34:20]

TAPPER: Welcome back to STATE OF THE UNION.

New tensions this morning in Minnesota, as the Trump administration weighs deploying U.S. troops in response to protests there.

Joining us now, veteran and Democratic Senator Ruben Gallego of Arizona.

Senator, thanks for joining us.

So, sources tell us that the Pentagon has ordered about 1,500 active duty soldiers to prepare for a possible deployment to Minnesota, not necessarily going to happen, not necessarily imminent, but still possible. This is after President Trump has been threatening to invoke the Insurrection Act, according to defense officials.

What's your reaction?

SEN. RUBEN GALLEGO (D-AZ): Well, this is what the president's wanted the whole time. There's no reason for us to even have this many ICE agents running

around Minnesota. The president threw them into this very volatile area in order for them to create this environment, because he thinks the military is his tool, his toy that he could just use at any time.

[09:35:09]

And he wants nothing more to be able to use them and deploy them to these blue cities to intimidate, not because it's going to bring any more safety. As a matter of fact, it will just cause more harm than any kind of safety.

But, that way, he could just say that he did it. And that's a danger of this president. He's not looking out for the safety and security of Americans. He's looking out for his own personal entertainment. And he doesn't care who gets hurt in the process of it.

TAPPER: A CNN poll this week found that half of Americans, more than half, really, think ICE is making cities less safe.

A growing number of Democrats are renewing calls to abolish ICE entirely in the wake of the death of Renee Good a couple weeks ago. You have said that ICE is a problem, it's out of control, but that abolishing ICE would be a mistake. Why?

GALLEGO: Well, look, I think ICE needs to be totally torn down. It has to be created in the image of what people want, right?

And what does that look like? From my experience running in Arizona, in a very hard, hard state when it comes to immigration and immigration issues, people want immigration enforcement that goes after criminals, right, and focuses on criminals, and immigration enforcement that is actually focused on security, and not the goon squad that has come from Stephen Miller and Donald Trump, one that issues warrants, one that doesn't have people masked and acting like we're a Third World police force.

What we're seeing right now is not what we want from ICE. And we can create and have a force that's actually focused on immigration and on security, and not this type of intimidation that's happening right now.

TAPPER: As you know, there's a government funding bill that comes due this month, and there's a growing push by some Democrats in the House and Senate to freeze ICE funding as a point of contention in the government funding bill.

A year ago, you voted to expand ICE funding. What are you going to do this week, this time? Because Democratic Senator Chris Murphy said -- quote -- "Democrats cannot vote for a Department of Homeland Security budget that doesn't restrain the growing lawlessness of this agency."

GALLEGO: Yes, he's 100 percent right, and I'm talking to him.

We cannot vote for anything that actually adds more money and doesn't constrain ICE. It's not what the -- what we want out of ICE. Again, we want a security force that is focused on targeting and deporting criminals. What they're doing right now is none of that. What they're doing right now is actually suppressing U.S. citizens, racially profiling in all parts of our country, bringing violence to areas that you don't need.

You have men with very little training shooting U.S. citizens. This is not at all what we need. And I'm certainly not going to fund something of that nature if it's only going to cause more and more problems and more harm and less security for Americans and everyday people that are just trying to live their lives.

TAPPER: Even if that means shutting down the government? And are there enough Democrats that agree with that the government actually will be shut down?

GALLEGO: I can't speak for everybody else, but if I have to shut down the portion of ICE -- just to be clear, we're not shutting down the rest of the government -- the portion of ICE that is causing this kind of harm, racially profiling people, terrorizing our cities, I know the implications of that. I know the political implications potentially of that.

But we cannot keep funding this type of goon squads that are just spreading throughout the whole country just to enforce some weird policy position that Stephen Miller has, where he thinks that we have to punish blue cities.

TAPPER: I want to turn to foreign policy, because you have called President Trump an idiot for his push to take control of Greenland, and you have said that Congress can't take any chances of allowing that to happen.

You have met with the foreign ministers of both Denmark and Greenland this past week. How are they reacting to President Trump's threats?

GALLEGO: Look, they're shocked. And they're trying to find reason within what's happening here.

And I tried to explain to them there is no reasoning, right? The president just wants to have a legacy piece, where he gets to claim that he brought in this big chunk of land that he sees on the map, even though it's a distorted map. And he's willing to ruin our whole foreign policy, all of our alliances, our economy just so he could get what he wants.

This man is doing everything for himself and nothing for us. Even the idea of buying it, we're going to spend billions and billions of dollars, potentially half-a-trillion dollars, which is never going to happen. But, right now, we can't even afford health insurance for U.S. citizens, and we're talking about buying land.

And let me just say one more time, Denmark, the kingdom of Denmark and Greenland, has said, we will give you everything you want, short of giving you possession of our land. You want more bases, you get more bases. You want to put more people, you get it. The idea that we're going to waste money for everything we want is the

dumbest decision we could make. The only person who could make a decision this dumb is someone that would actually let a casino go under. And guess who's president right now?

TAPPER: All right, Senator Ruben Gallego, Democrat of Arizona, good to see you, sir. Thanks for joining us today.

President Trump says he's done such a good job, the midterms should just be canceled, there's no need for them. Was he joking?

My panel weighs in next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:44:16]

TAPPER: One year ago this Tuesday, President Trump swept into office again riding high. Where do things stand now?

My panel is here.

All right guys, good to see you.

So, let me start with you, the pollster in the group. Tuesday marks the one-year anniversary of President Trump being in office. A CNN poll out just a couple days ago shows that a majority of Americans, 58 percent, believe that President Trump's first term in office so far is a failure.

How do you interpret a poll like that?

KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: So a lot of Republicans are happy with what they have seen. They feel like Donald Trump has delivered on a lot of promises that he's made. And that's the 42 percent in the poll.

But there are an awful lot of folks, particularly political independents, many of those younger voters who were part of what ushered Trump into office, who really feel like cost of living has not gotten under control. And that's the main reason why they're feeling agitated. They feel like, hey, we were promised lower cost of living and we didn't get it.

[09:45:07]

And that's why you see that 58 percent number. That's a pretty big warning sign for Republicans headed into the midterms, where typically voters hold the party in power accountable if they think they have gotten things done or not. One year in, Republicans feeling happy, everyone else not as much.

TAPPER: So, Bryan, the chairman of the Republican National Committee posted on X -- quote -- "Republicans are going to defy history in November because there is nobody who can energize our base more than President Trump." And he linked to a FOX News headline that reads, "RNC chairman bets on secret weapon to defy midterms history."

What do you think? Is that...

BRYAN LANZA, FORMER TRUMP CAMPAIGN ADVISER: Sure, it's possible, but history is against us, right?

And the economy right now appears to be against us. I think there's a recognition from this administration that they need to do more on the economy. You certainly have Vice President Vance and a lot of the team saying President Trump needs to be more focused on the economy.

And there's an argument to be made on the economy. Inflation is lower. Some -- gas prices, energy cost is lower. There's these things that they can be made, but it's getting lost by the other topics that are taking place, the international affairs.

And my belief is, if President Trump is out there campaigning, highlighting the improvements that have been made on the economy, they make a stronger case, than as opposed to him talking about Greenland or putting more tariffs on our European allies.

(LAUGHTER)

TAPPER: Yes, I saw there was a graffito on -- from New York that was on social media. It was something like: We don't want Greenland. We want health care.

And Dan Pfeiffer, the former Obama communications director, said, not a bad message for the midterms or something like that.

KAREN FINNEY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Right. Yes.

TAPPER: President Trump told Reuters in an interview this week he; he's accomplished so much that -- quote -- "When you think of it, we shouldn't even have an election."

White House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt said the president was obviously being facetious.

FINNEY: People -- there's real reason to have concerns about that.

Even if we do have an election, the actions that the president has taken in terms of the executive orders on voting to make it harder for people to vote, I mean, they're real concerns. That being said, I think the most important thing for Democrats, and what I found interesting in our poll, is, yes, we need to do the work to make sure we have an election.

But we have to make the argument to voters that they can trust us to deliver on what we say we're going to do. What was interesting to me in the poll is, people kind of said, we're motivated to vote. Democrats are motivated. They don't think that Trump has delivered. That's an opportunity. He's lost younger voters.

But some of them said that they feel like, well, we think -- we will bet on Democrats. That's not exactly a mandate for a blue wave. We still have to make the argument and prove that we're going to deliver, and that part of what we will deliver is health care, lower costs, reining in Trump, less focus on fighting battles overseas, more focus on right here at home.

SOLTIS ANDERSON: And not to interrupt, but to just further your point, I mean, in that CNN poll, only 38 -- 39 percent of respondents said that they felt like they would be better off if Democrats took control of Congress.

It's a poll that otherwise has a lot of really good news for Democrats. Really underscores what Karen said.

TAPPER: That's a good point.

XOCHITL HINOJOSA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes.

TAPPER: That number sucks.

HINOJOSA: Right. Exactly.

(LAUGHTER)

TAPPER: What do Democrats need to do so that more than 38 percent of the American people -- they're the opposition party. They should be riding high right now?

HINOJOSA: Well, so the problem here is that Trump, he sees an expansive view of the presidency. He believes that no one can stop him. He even said that only his conscience could potentially stop him. And what...

TAPPER: His morality.

LANZA: His morality.

(CROSSTALK)

HINOJOSA: His morality, sorry, his morality, Which we should all -- that's a joke.

But the reality is that Congress hasn't served a check. Congress has two responsibilities, to serve a check on the president and the administration and to pass legislation that actually helps the American people. And what they have seen, Democrats don't have control of everything.

So I think voters actually see those -- see that Congress hasn't done anything to stop this administration and wonder, if Democrats are in power, will they do that? Democrats are in power, will they lower health care costs? And so I -- you're right that Democrats actually have to prove to the American people.

But I also believe that I think it's 58 percent of Americans believe Trump has gone too far, and they want someone to stop him, and that will be Congress' responsibility. LANZA: But I would add to that, as much as all these things that have

taken place, if you look at people who feel the country is moving in the right directions, it's 10 points better than when he took office, right?

You know, Biden had -- it was such a low bar for Joe Biden that Trump has improved it by 10 points. At least it's moving in the right direction. I think, if they can narrow their message strictly on the economy, you're going to continue to see movement in the right direction.

HINOJOSA: He can't narrow his message, though. I'm sorry. He doesn't know how to have message discipline.

And I think a lot of vulnerable Republicans right now are worried about that. There are 18 districts, congressional districts that are key to winning the House, and they're currently leaning Democrat. And that's really bad news for Republicans.

TAPPER: You can't really argue with that. If you just look at the president's TRUTH Social posting this weekend, there really wasn't a lot on affordability. There was quite a bit on like outlawing rival college football games from competing with the Army-Navy game.

And that's the nicest one I could cite.

LANZA: Yes, listen, like I said, any minute, every second that he is not talking about the economy and how he's working to make things better, how energy costs, lower are all these sorts of -- he is hurting himself and the party.

[09:50:00]

And I think the party's trying to get him to focus more on that. And I think we have an uphill battle, because Donald Trump is who he is, but we know what can win.

TAPPER: You know, I could talk to you for -- all day with mimosas.

HINOJOSA: Hey.

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: Maybe that's our new branding opportunity.

But thanks so much for being here.

President Trump's new pardons are raising serious questions. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: President Trump says he's worried about fraud, especially in Minnesota, when it comes to government spending.

[09:55:05] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We got elected to, among other things, find all of this fraud and abuse, all of this horrible stuff going on.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Especially in Democratic-led cities, he says.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: They do everything possible to protect criminals at the expense of American citizens, and it breeds fraud.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: You can be forgiven if you're having difficulty taking the president's concerns seriously after he issued new pardons this week for individuals with ties to his administration, according to "The New York Times," after they were charged with or convicted of, you guessed it, fraud.

Take Adriana Camberos. After Trump commuted her fraud sentence in his first term, she was convicted again of a different fraudulent scheme in 2024. She was pardoned on Thursday. "The New York Times" reports she enlisted the help of lawyers connected to President Trump, including one who previously represented Rudy Giuliani.

Also pardoned this week, a banker facing charges, including felony bribery. That's pretty fraudulent. His daughter donated millions of dollars to Trump's MAGA super PAC.

And then there's former health care CEO Terren Scott Peizer, who also got a pardon after being prosecuted last year by Trump's own Justice Department for securities fraud and insider trading, also fairly fraudulent.

In case you were wondering, "The New York Times" reports his legal team also includes that same lawyer who has ties to Rudy Giuliani. There are more examples, but I only have a few minutes.

The point stands. Fraud is bad, regardless of who commits it, even if they find a way into the president's orbit and get a pardon.

Thank you for spending your Sunday morning with us.

"FAREED ZAKARIA GPS" starts next.