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CNN Live Sunday

Interview with Richard Murphy

Aired December 02, 2001 - 17:07   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DONNA KELLEY, CNN ANCHOR: Today's meeting between President Bush and Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon yielded a pledge from the president to intensify U.S. counter-terrorism cooperation with Israel. Joining us to about that and more is former U.S. assistant secretary of state, Richard Murphy. And he joins us now from New York.

Ambassador Murphy, thanks for coming in to talk with us.

RICHARD MURPHY, FMR. ASST. SECY. OF STATE: Thank you.

KELLEY: Do you think that intensifying the cooperation for counter intel could change the policy and how that might be?

MURPHY: If there is anything we have not already shared with Israel, in the issue of counter terrorism tactics, we certainly should be doing it right away. I would have the there was a full exchange from our side, with the Israelis from some time past.

KELLEY: What about between the United States and Israel? After this the president saying that he was horrified and saddened by this, talking about intensifying the cooperation. When you look that this and what went on in the meeting today between Mr. Sharon and Mr. Bush, didn't ask for restraint, didn't hear that they were encouraging them to get back to the negotiating table. What do you see in those comments and noncomments?

MURPHY: I will wait to see what happens in terms of the mission of General Zinni. I think this is a terrible test both of Israel's patience and of the Bush Administration's determination to be of help. If they pull General Zinni out as a result of this, this is, of course, just what the extremists on the Palestinian side want, is to bring the whole peace process down or not let it get restarted by allowing General Zinni to work out the terms of a cease-fire.

KELLEY: And General Zinni has said, he is there in the area along with Secretary Burns, he said that he thought people were trying to sabotage his mission. What do you think General Zinni and Secretary Burns can do?

MURPHY: It depends. I'm not party to those conversations they are having with the Palestinians and the Israelis, but what is clear is that an exchange of a strong response by the Israelis to this provocation is not by itself going to bring about a cease-fire. The need is to get the parties to the table. That's where the security of individual Israeli citizens can be worked out, not by just security actions.

KELLEY: And Palestinians who we have talked to over the weekend since this crisis hit, have said that they would like to get back to the negotiating table and they want Israel to change its behavior. But the Israelis have said, as have others in the world, you have got to stop this violence. How do you get to that point?

MURPHY: Well, I don't think there is any magic key to -- or a quick answer to that question. The Palestinians have got do more. Now Arafat has never before declared a state of emergency, to my recollection. He has never declared these perpetrators to be outside the law. If that signals a new determination to arrest and punish, then it may help move the process ahead.

KELLEY: Are you confident that Mr. Arafat can get control? They have made these arrests today, including, apparently, two hamas leaders. They are promising more arrests by tomorrow morning. Are you confident in his ability?

MURPHY: I am confident that he remains the unchallenged leader of the Palestinians. I am confident that he is still relevant, therefore, and it's not a question that he can't or won't, but that he has not done enough yet. But he has the capability.

KELLEY: Ambassador Richard Murphy, who is the former U.S. assistant secretary of state. We are so glad you could come to talk with us today. Thank you.

MURPHY: My pleasure, thank you.

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