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CNN Live Sunday

Interview With Ken Rudin

Aired January 05, 2003 - 16:44   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: With a little more than a year until the first presidential primaries, Democrats with an eye on the white House are already lining up for the chance to challenge President Bush in 2004. Thought we'd take a look at them. Ken Rudin joins me now from Washington to talk about the Democratic hopefuls. Ken is the political editor at National Public Radio. Thanks for being with us, Ken.
KEN RUDIN, POLITICAL EDITOR, NPR: Thank you, Anderson.

COOPER: It seems every election cycle, it gets earlier and earlier when people announce that they are going to run. Why so early this time?

RUDIN: Well, two reasons. One, the Democrats and the Republicans both pushed back their calendar. Now Iowa is going to happen on January 19 next year, followed by New Hampshire on the 27th and then South Carolina February 3. So theoretically, this nomination fight for the Democrats will be over before we know it.

Secondly is that obviously this is the year where the candidates, given the fact that Al Gore is out of the race, and there's no longer an obvious front-runner, the other Democratic candidates need to build organizations, raise money, identify supporters in these key states, so they also have their work cut out for them earlier than expected, given the fact that Gore is no longer there.

Thirdly, I guess most interestingly perhaps, is that an impending war against Iraq will probably suck all the vacuum -- or all the air out of the Democratic -- the coverage of the Democrats. So maybe they have to start going earlier than usual.

COOPER: Let's talk about the money a little bit. How important is it? I mean, we all know how important money is in running for the president. How important, though, is it to get a lot of money up front to show that you are a serious candidate?

RUDIN: Well, it is extremely important. And a perfect example is what happened to Paul Tsongas in 1992. He won the New Hampshire primary over Bill Clinton, the front runner at the time, and everybody said Paul Tsongas is now the new front runner. But he didn't have the money. He didn't have the support in the key states. And then to just start raising money after a big upset win in New Hampshire, I don't know if that was much of an upset, but he's from neighboring Massachusetts, but after this big win he got in Massachusetts, he didn't have the mechanism and the apparatus around the country to suddenly say, look, now I'm viable. Let's raise the money. It's too late by then. That's why you've got to have the money early.

Plus the fact you want to make the media and the professional -- the political professionals know that you're serious. And one way of doing it is raising the money.

COOPER: Well, let's talk about some of the serious candidates out there. Edwards, what's your take?

RUDIN: Well, you know, I mean, he's the fresh face. Democrats say they need it, if Al Gore was the old school, John Edwards, the senator from North Carolina, is the fresh face. He's only been in the Senate four years. He's in his first Senate term. That's -- a lot of people say that given what happened on 9/11, you need more bona fide than that. But Edwards is a very charismatic campaigner, very intelligent, attractive guy. In "The New York Times," Maureen Dowd calls him the Ken doll of the Democratic field.

But, I mean, he's got to be more specific than that. He came out last week, he was -- he declared on "The Today Show," he made interviews -- did interviews with all the political journalists around the country and he said he stands for the little guy. Well, unless he's campaigning among the cast of "The Wizard of Oz," he's got to be more specific than that, and that may be his problem.

COOPER: There were a lot of those little people on "The Wizard of Oz," though. They might have a lot of votes to bring to the table.

RUDIN: That's right.

COOPER: It is funny, when talking about him, everyone says he's an attractive guy, you know, as if that is sort of like a big thing in running for president these days? But I guess it is?

RUDIN: Well, look where he announced for president, on "The Today Show." Look where everybody's announcing -- either on the "Oprah," or "David Letterman." Larry King had Ross Perot in '92 and '96. Obviously it is a TV medium. Nobody talked about Martin van Buren's looks back in the 1800s, but I guess Martin wasn't that good looking, as I recall.

COOPER: All right, Dick Gephardt, attractive guy or not, I'm not sure. What...

RUDIN: No eyebrows, that's for sure, no.

COOPER: Right -- go ahead.

RUDIN: Well, actually, once upon a time, Dick Gephardt was the fresh face of the Democratic Party. He ran in 1988, won the Iowa caucuses. But again, he also didn't have the apparatus to go elsewhere. Now, again, Gephardt is different. It's 15 years later. He's now 62 years old. He's no longer that fresh face, that young face. But he does have a very strong organization in Iowa. He's liked very strongly by organized labor, the United Auto Workers likes Gephardt very much. The problem, of course, with Gephardt is that for the last six years he's been the leader of the Democrats -- last eight years, Democrats in the House. And the last four times he's tried and failed to recapture the House for the Democrats. So perhaps he's left the leadership to run for president, and that was not much of a sendoff.

COOPER: I mean, some people, some critics will say he sort of has this stigma of loss, which you're sort of alluding to. Does that stick to a candidate these days?

RUDIN: I don't know if it really matters that much. I mean, again, the fact is that both -- you know, the Democrats did not have a good year in 2002. They lost ground in the House and they lost the Senate as well. But again, a lot of Democrats say, well, President Bush was very popular. That may not be the case in 2004. But he's certainly popular now. No Democrat was going to make a breakthrough.

Gephardt, again, needs to do something exciting to shake up the race. And again, with Gore gone, if Gephardt is now the alleged supposed front runner in Iowa, one, if he doesn't win it, he's through, and if he does win it, well, everybody will say, well, he was supposed to win all along, what's the big news. So he's going to have to win elsewhere, and that's the question.

COOPER: Kerry, what are his chances, you think?

RUDIN: John Kerry, the senator from Massachusetts, also attractive candidate, if we're going back to the looks department. If Edwards lacks anything gravitas, Kerry certainly has it. He's been 18 years on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

But again, he's a Massachusetts Democrat, a Massachusetts liberal. Now, that may be good when running for the nomination, but again, in November 2004, against President Bush, where does he win in the south? I'm not sure if he does. You know, and he used to be Michael Dukakis' lieutenant governor. I'm sure that will be on the Web sites, Republican Web sites all over the country.

He is a ferocious campaigner. He campaigns hard. He is a very good campaigner. The question is whether he sells outside of the northeast.

COOPER: All right. Ken Rudin, there are others to talk about; we are simply out of time, though. I appreciate you joining us. Thanks very much.

RUDIN: Thank you, Anderson.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired January 5, 2003 - 16:44   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: With a little more than a year until the first presidential primaries, Democrats with an eye on the white House are already lining up for the chance to challenge President Bush in 2004. Thought we'd take a look at them. Ken Rudin joins me now from Washington to talk about the Democratic hopefuls. Ken is the political editor at National Public Radio. Thanks for being with us, Ken.
KEN RUDIN, POLITICAL EDITOR, NPR: Thank you, Anderson.

COOPER: It seems every election cycle, it gets earlier and earlier when people announce that they are going to run. Why so early this time?

RUDIN: Well, two reasons. One, the Democrats and the Republicans both pushed back their calendar. Now Iowa is going to happen on January 19 next year, followed by New Hampshire on the 27th and then South Carolina February 3. So theoretically, this nomination fight for the Democrats will be over before we know it.

Secondly is that obviously this is the year where the candidates, given the fact that Al Gore is out of the race, and there's no longer an obvious front-runner, the other Democratic candidates need to build organizations, raise money, identify supporters in these key states, so they also have their work cut out for them earlier than expected, given the fact that Gore is no longer there.

Thirdly, I guess most interestingly perhaps, is that an impending war against Iraq will probably suck all the vacuum -- or all the air out of the Democratic -- the coverage of the Democrats. So maybe they have to start going earlier than usual.

COOPER: Let's talk about the money a little bit. How important is it? I mean, we all know how important money is in running for the president. How important, though, is it to get a lot of money up front to show that you are a serious candidate?

RUDIN: Well, it is extremely important. And a perfect example is what happened to Paul Tsongas in 1992. He won the New Hampshire primary over Bill Clinton, the front runner at the time, and everybody said Paul Tsongas is now the new front runner. But he didn't have the money. He didn't have the support in the key states. And then to just start raising money after a big upset win in New Hampshire, I don't know if that was much of an upset, but he's from neighboring Massachusetts, but after this big win he got in Massachusetts, he didn't have the mechanism and the apparatus around the country to suddenly say, look, now I'm viable. Let's raise the money. It's too late by then. That's why you've got to have the money early.

Plus the fact you want to make the media and the professional -- the political professionals know that you're serious. And one way of doing it is raising the money.

COOPER: Well, let's talk about some of the serious candidates out there. Edwards, what's your take?

RUDIN: Well, you know, I mean, he's the fresh face. Democrats say they need it, if Al Gore was the old school, John Edwards, the senator from North Carolina, is the fresh face. He's only been in the Senate four years. He's in his first Senate term. That's -- a lot of people say that given what happened on 9/11, you need more bona fide than that. But Edwards is a very charismatic campaigner, very intelligent, attractive guy. In "The New York Times," Maureen Dowd calls him the Ken doll of the Democratic field.

But, I mean, he's got to be more specific than that. He came out last week, he was -- he declared on "The Today Show," he made interviews -- did interviews with all the political journalists around the country and he said he stands for the little guy. Well, unless he's campaigning among the cast of "The Wizard of Oz," he's got to be more specific than that, and that may be his problem.

COOPER: There were a lot of those little people on "The Wizard of Oz," though. They might have a lot of votes to bring to the table.

RUDIN: That's right.

COOPER: It is funny, when talking about him, everyone says he's an attractive guy, you know, as if that is sort of like a big thing in running for president these days? But I guess it is?

RUDIN: Well, look where he announced for president, on "The Today Show." Look where everybody's announcing -- either on the "Oprah," or "David Letterman." Larry King had Ross Perot in '92 and '96. Obviously it is a TV medium. Nobody talked about Martin van Buren's looks back in the 1800s, but I guess Martin wasn't that good looking, as I recall.

COOPER: All right, Dick Gephardt, attractive guy or not, I'm not sure. What...

RUDIN: No eyebrows, that's for sure, no.

COOPER: Right -- go ahead.

RUDIN: Well, actually, once upon a time, Dick Gephardt was the fresh face of the Democratic Party. He ran in 1988, won the Iowa caucuses. But again, he also didn't have the apparatus to go elsewhere. Now, again, Gephardt is different. It's 15 years later. He's now 62 years old. He's no longer that fresh face, that young face. But he does have a very strong organization in Iowa. He's liked very strongly by organized labor, the United Auto Workers likes Gephardt very much. The problem, of course, with Gephardt is that for the last six years he's been the leader of the Democrats -- last eight years, Democrats in the House. And the last four times he's tried and failed to recapture the House for the Democrats. So perhaps he's left the leadership to run for president, and that was not much of a sendoff.

COOPER: I mean, some people, some critics will say he sort of has this stigma of loss, which you're sort of alluding to. Does that stick to a candidate these days?

RUDIN: I don't know if it really matters that much. I mean, again, the fact is that both -- you know, the Democrats did not have a good year in 2002. They lost ground in the House and they lost the Senate as well. But again, a lot of Democrats say, well, President Bush was very popular. That may not be the case in 2004. But he's certainly popular now. No Democrat was going to make a breakthrough.

Gephardt, again, needs to do something exciting to shake up the race. And again, with Gore gone, if Gephardt is now the alleged supposed front runner in Iowa, one, if he doesn't win it, he's through, and if he does win it, well, everybody will say, well, he was supposed to win all along, what's the big news. So he's going to have to win elsewhere, and that's the question.

COOPER: Kerry, what are his chances, you think?

RUDIN: John Kerry, the senator from Massachusetts, also attractive candidate, if we're going back to the looks department. If Edwards lacks anything gravitas, Kerry certainly has it. He's been 18 years on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

But again, he's a Massachusetts Democrat, a Massachusetts liberal. Now, that may be good when running for the nomination, but again, in November 2004, against President Bush, where does he win in the south? I'm not sure if he does. You know, and he used to be Michael Dukakis' lieutenant governor. I'm sure that will be on the Web sites, Republican Web sites all over the country.

He is a ferocious campaigner. He campaigns hard. He is a very good campaigner. The question is whether he sells outside of the northeast.

COOPER: All right. Ken Rudin, there are others to talk about; we are simply out of time, though. I appreciate you joining us. Thanks very much.

RUDIN: Thank you, Anderson.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com