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CNN Live Sunday

How Deep Does al Qaeda Go In Saudi Arabia?

Aired November 16, 2003 - 18:16   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: Last weekend, al Qaeda was blamed for a bombing in a residential compound in Saudi Arabia. We want to explore how deeply the terror network is entrenched in the kingdom. Fawaz Gerges is a professor of Middle Eastern studies at Sarah Lawrence College. Thanks for being with us tonight.
FAWAZ GERGES, SARAH LAWRENCE COLLEGE: My pleasure.

LIN: What are your thoughts? What have you learned about al Qaeda since last week's bombing?

GERGES: Well, I think it's clear that much of the terrorist activity in the past year in Tunisia, in Indonesia, in Saudi Arabia and I think also in Turkey yesterday is the work of local and regional affiliates of al Qaeda. A major shift in al Qaeda tactics appears to have taken place in the past year.

And I think, Carol, this shift involves attacking pro-western Muslim governments and pro-western soft targets in the Muslim world, and I think it's a shift that is really driven by necessity, because I believe that al Qaeda does not appear to have the capacity to mount large-scale operations in the United States at this particular moment.

And I think this particular development is a result of the gradual erosion of al Qaeda's leadership and the dismantling of its command and control centralized structure, and I think what we are witnessing in Indonesia and Saudi Arabia, and again, in Turkey, is that local and regional affiliates are taking action into their own hands, and of course, with increasingly diminishing political returns.

LIN: So, by attacking pro-western Muslim targets, how is that likely to affect their fund-raising and their recruiting?

GERGES: That's an excellent point here. Let's take a look at what happened in Saudi Arabia and Turkey in the last 2 days. In Saudi Arabia Saturday, an al Qaeda affiliate attacked a housing complex inhabited mainly by Muslim and Arab expatriate workers. 17 killed, Arab and Muslims, including five children. Even in Turkey, most of those who were killed yesterday basically were Muslim turks,

And what we need to understand here is that al Qaeda or al Qaeda affiliates seem to be plunging into a self-destruct strategy. They're not only antagonizing world public opinion, but also Arab and Muslim public opinion, which really has discovered belatedly that al Qaeda is exploiting its grievances to launch a holy war, not only against the west, but also against Muslim and Arab societies and governments.

LIN: So, in effect, would it lead to its extinction then?

GERGES: Absolutely, and this is what we need understand. We should not really somehow over -- I mean lose sight of the big picture. The big picture is now there is really a potential for a multiethnic multicultureal, multilateral alliance between not just, I mean an alliance of security collaboration, but between Arabs and Muslims and westerners in order to collaborate and put an end to this particular deadly plague that is not only harming westerners, particularly Americans, but also Arabs and Muslims. And I think the seeds for such, what I call an interfaith, intercultural alliance is there. Thanks in particular to the bloody and tragic attacks in the last few weeks.

LIN: Do you see any indications of any real alliances forming? You're talking about an ideal.

GERGES: Absolutely. Carol what we need to understand here is that we know that terrorism cannot be defeated on the battlefield. Abd what we need to understand is that society is not just government, must be involved in trying to put an end to this particular plague. And it's about time that societies, civil societies, in particular. By the way, after the attack in Saudi Arabia, it was met with widespread condemnation by clerics of society, Arab public opinion.

It's about time that civil societies both in the west and the world of Islam take initiative and build an alliance in order to really put an end to this terrible, terrible deadly disease that's harming all of us, not just Americans and westerners.

LIN: Wouldn't that be something this were a turning point. Thank you very much.

GERGES: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired November 16, 2003 - 18:16   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: Last weekend, al Qaeda was blamed for a bombing in a residential compound in Saudi Arabia. We want to explore how deeply the terror network is entrenched in the kingdom. Fawaz Gerges is a professor of Middle Eastern studies at Sarah Lawrence College. Thanks for being with us tonight.
FAWAZ GERGES, SARAH LAWRENCE COLLEGE: My pleasure.

LIN: What are your thoughts? What have you learned about al Qaeda since last week's bombing?

GERGES: Well, I think it's clear that much of the terrorist activity in the past year in Tunisia, in Indonesia, in Saudi Arabia and I think also in Turkey yesterday is the work of local and regional affiliates of al Qaeda. A major shift in al Qaeda tactics appears to have taken place in the past year.

And I think, Carol, this shift involves attacking pro-western Muslim governments and pro-western soft targets in the Muslim world, and I think it's a shift that is really driven by necessity, because I believe that al Qaeda does not appear to have the capacity to mount large-scale operations in the United States at this particular moment.

And I think this particular development is a result of the gradual erosion of al Qaeda's leadership and the dismantling of its command and control centralized structure, and I think what we are witnessing in Indonesia and Saudi Arabia, and again, in Turkey, is that local and regional affiliates are taking action into their own hands, and of course, with increasingly diminishing political returns.

LIN: So, by attacking pro-western Muslim targets, how is that likely to affect their fund-raising and their recruiting?

GERGES: That's an excellent point here. Let's take a look at what happened in Saudi Arabia and Turkey in the last 2 days. In Saudi Arabia Saturday, an al Qaeda affiliate attacked a housing complex inhabited mainly by Muslim and Arab expatriate workers. 17 killed, Arab and Muslims, including five children. Even in Turkey, most of those who were killed yesterday basically were Muslim turks,

And what we need to understand here is that al Qaeda or al Qaeda affiliates seem to be plunging into a self-destruct strategy. They're not only antagonizing world public opinion, but also Arab and Muslim public opinion, which really has discovered belatedly that al Qaeda is exploiting its grievances to launch a holy war, not only against the west, but also against Muslim and Arab societies and governments.

LIN: So, in effect, would it lead to its extinction then?

GERGES: Absolutely, and this is what we need understand. We should not really somehow over -- I mean lose sight of the big picture. The big picture is now there is really a potential for a multiethnic multicultureal, multilateral alliance between not just, I mean an alliance of security collaboration, but between Arabs and Muslims and westerners in order to collaborate and put an end to this particular deadly plague that is not only harming westerners, particularly Americans, but also Arabs and Muslims. And I think the seeds for such, what I call an interfaith, intercultural alliance is there. Thanks in particular to the bloody and tragic attacks in the last few weeks.

LIN: Do you see any indications of any real alliances forming? You're talking about an ideal.

GERGES: Absolutely. Carol what we need to understand here is that we know that terrorism cannot be defeated on the battlefield. Abd what we need to understand is that society is not just government, must be involved in trying to put an end to this particular plague. And it's about time that societies, civil societies, in particular. By the way, after the attack in Saudi Arabia, it was met with widespread condemnation by clerics of society, Arab public opinion.

It's about time that civil societies both in the west and the world of Islam take initiative and build an alliance in order to really put an end to this terrible, terrible deadly disease that's harming all of us, not just Americans and westerners.

LIN: Wouldn't that be something this were a turning point. Thank you very much.

GERGES: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com