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CNN Live Sunday

Haifa Endures Heaviest Barrage of Hezbollah Rockets; Lebanese Sr. Official Calls for Changes to U.N. Ceasefire Plan

Aired August 06, 2006 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

HALA GORANI, CNN ANCHOR: Israel 's third largest city feels the heat of Hezbollah's largest attacks so far.
FIONNUALA SWEENEY, CNN ANCHOR: In all more than 180 rockets fall on northern Israel, among the dead, a dozen Israeli reservists killed before they even got to the battlefield.

GORANI: While Beirut is battered again along with targets in Qana and near Tyre, Israel says were launch points for the rockets that struck Haifa.

SWEENEY: It is midnight in Lebanon and in Israel. I'm Fionnuala Sweeney in Haifa, in northern Israel.

GORANI: And I'm Hala Gorani in Beirut. Welcome to our continuing coverage of the crisis in the Middle East on CNN.

Israel and Hezbollah exchange some of the heaviest blows in the conflict so far. Here are the latest developments for you. Haifa endures the heaviest barrage of Hezbollah rockets since the conflict began. The Israeli port city has suffered a barrage and an attack of rockets that have killed at least three people; scores are wounded.

Israel says more than 180 rockets landed in the northern part of its country on Sunday. Also the greatest number of Israelis killed in a single incident occurred in Kfar Giladi. A dozen Israeli paratroop reservists were killed. Israel responded with its heaviest artillery barrage of targets in southern Lebanon this day. And Israel also staged air raids on targets in Lebanon, near the border with Syria in the southern suburbs of Beirut.

And here, in southern Lebanon, Lebanon says at least 14 people were killed in raids on Sunday. More than 600 on both sides have been killed in the conflict -- Fionnuala.

SWEENEY: Here in Haifa, it was a night of terror and emergency rescue operations after a barrage of Hezbollah rockets struck in an Israeli/Arab neighborhood. The rocket explosions happened about four hours ago, following the air raid sirens soundings. Before the air raid siren had even finished, the rockets had begun landing across the Bay of Haifa.

We were able to witness them landing and see, indeed, smoke rise immediately afterwards. For some time people were trapped in the rubble of partially collapsed buildings. All in all, as Hala says, three people killed, 100 wounded. Haifa still very much on the radar for Hezbollah.

Since those rocket attacks, though, we have been told by the IDF they believe they have attacked and taken out a rocket launcher in Qana, which they believe was launching rockets towards Haifa earlier this evening.

Now, indeed, the Israeli military tell us since this conflict began, some 3,000 rockets have been fired by Hezbollah into Israel. Even as the Israeli military touts its success in destroying the Hezbollah rocket launchers. More on that now, from Paula Hancocks.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The immediate aftermath at the single deadliest rocket to the hit Israel, 12 people killed as they stood near the entrance to the communal farm of Kfar Giladi, a stone's throw from the Lebanese border.

Eyewitnesses say the barrage lasted more than 15 minutes. Just a fraction of more than 2500 rockets launched by Hezbollah, in the past three and a half weeks. Three Israeli Arabs were killed in Saturday's barrage, a mother and two daughters.

Three Israelis died the day before, and eight were killed on Thursday. Israeli deaths steadily rising, as Israeli politicians insist they are breaking Hezbollah's back.

EHUD OLMERT, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER (through translator): They have been very seriously hurt and it will take them a long time to recover from this if they ever can. We have moved the Hezbollah from along the border with Israel and we have removed this immediate threat.

HANCOCKS: Israel has most powerful military machine in the Middle East. But after thousands of air strikes and intense shelling of southern Lebanon, the rockets are still flying, some liken Hezbollah to Israel's invisible enemy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is a kind of guerrilla warfare. You see someone in the morning, he's a civilian. You come the next time, you see him with rocket launcher. So, you don't know who have to shoot, who you have to be careful of.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The Hezbollah fighter is much better than what we saw in '82. They're much better, they're well trained. They know how to fight. They're good enemy. I mean, for -- and it is a little bit harder now.

HANCOCKS: Before Sunday's deadly rocket attack, Israeli politicians sounded positive on the draft U.N. resolution calling for a cessation of hostilities on both sides. The resolution did not call for an Israeli pullout from southern Lebanon. Israel does not want to gap between its forces leaving and an international force arriving. The fear it would give Hezbollah the chance to rearm and reposition itself. SHIMON PERES, ISRAELI DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER: We are waiting and see if really the Lebanese government is a government, if they can really make the decisions, if they can really replace the Hezbollah forces on the southern part of Lebanon.

HANCOCKS (on camera): The Israeli military said, Sunday it has captured one of the Hezbollah militants responsible for the kidnapping of the two Israeli soldiers on July 12th. The kidnapping that sparked this ongoing conflict between Israel and Hezbollah. The IDF says the militant confessed to his role. No confirmation yet on whether he's given indications on where these two Israeli soldiers are currently being held. Paula Hancocks, CNN, Haifa, Israel.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GORANI: Well, that's what happened in Israel on this side of the border, another day of attacks. We heard clearly from our position here, two loud explosions in a daylight attack on the southern suburbs of Beirut. Also in the last few hour, Qana, as well was hit. Jim Clancy has been following developments and joins us now with more -- Jim.

JIM CLANCY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hala, as you note, there were air strikes in broad daylight here in the capital, rocking the southern suburbs once again. There was also a bomb falling in the Bekaa Valley. Fierce fighting all along that front, in southern Lebanon, an attack by the Israelis on Qana; a number of civilians reported killed.

Right now there are more than 700 Lebanese civilians that are thought to be dead. More than 2,700 wounded, some 90, only 90 among those are officially listed as Hezbollah fighters.

Now against that backdrop, we also heard more criticism of the draft U.N. resolution this day. Let's be honest, whatever the diplomats, the politicians, had to say from the sidelines it was mere punctuation to everything we heard this day in Lebanon.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY (voice over): Thick gray smoke rose above Beirut's skyline as a daylight bombing raid again targeted the southern suburbs.

Beirut's fire brigade has been dodging the falling bombs, responding to smoldering ruins to douse flames and search for survivors. This is the remains of a ten story apartment block hit more than 24 hours earlier. Completely flattened, it was a death trap for a family of three unable to flee along with other residents. A bicycle and teddy bear lie in the rubble with bedding, furniture and other belongings.

Nearby, another apartment block, another bomb site. The fire is out, but anger still burns.

"Let Israel, America and Britain know they can't drive us away," declared this resident. "We're stronger than that. We are not afraid. If a bomb drops on us, we either die or keep standing. We don't run away."

There is uncommon conviction among residents of the southern suburbs. Conviction is Israel alone is not to blame that the U.S. provided the bombs and together with Britain let Israel play a deadly military card in their neighborhoods for weeks, a conviction that Hezbollah deserves all of their support.

Many believe it is this sentiment on the streets that is driving Arab diplomats to take a tougher stand in the conflict. Ahead of a major meeting Monday, Arab League Secretary-General Armor Moosa (ph) arrived in the Lebanese capital even as it shook from Israel's daylight strike. His criticism of the draft U.N. ceasefire paled in comparison to Parliament Speaker Nabi Barry, who said the draft resolution paid attention to Israel's demands but ignored Lebanon's needs.

Barry, who is Lebanon's negotiator, says the draft was the result of dictation, not negotiation. And said he wanted no part of it.

"I thank them," Barry said, sarcastically. "I was supposed to negotiate. They relieved me of that responsibility. And I no longer have anything to do with it. Before it even comes up for a vote, I say, Merci, au revoir. Thanks and good-bye."

The Lebanese are concerned with more than the fate of two captured Israeli soldiers. They want their own prisoners freed and all Israeli troops off Lebanese territory. It is a tough stand. Like the fires that still smolder in Beirut, putting out the flames of this conflict is going to be tough, much tougher than anyone imagined at the outset.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY: To that end, Condoleezza Rice cautioned that just this U.N. draft resolution, when it is voted on in the coming day or two, is not going to end the fighting. She said it is going to take some time. She says it is a first step and we're going to see who is for peace and who isn't.

On another front, Arma Moosa (ph) saying the great powers, here he didn't refer to the United States, Hala, but clearly he's referencing the United States, he says the great powers blocked a ceasefire. He says the Arab League is probably going to vote to support the Lebanese seven-point plan, that would include for all of the troops being withdrawn, Israeli troops withdrawn from Lebanese soil.

In a final note, Jacques Chirac, the French president, said all of the parties here in Lebanon have to live up to their responsibilities.

The diplomats are weighing in, but so far on the ground, we're not seeing any evidence that it is working for peace -- Hala. GORANI: On that note, I talked about that U.N. draft resolution with the a senior adviser to the Lebanese prime minister, Mohamad Chatah. The Lebanese prime minister called that resolution, quote, "not adequate." This is what Mohamad Chatah had to say about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MOHAMAD CHATAH, SR. ADVISOR TO LEBANESE PM: I wouldn't say that the cabinet squarely rejected the draft resolution. The cabinet said, basically, that this resolution goes some way. But it has weaknesses, it can be improved to make the ceasefire happen on the ground, to make it stick. It is not enough to call for a ceasefire, we want that can be implemented and that be sustained.

And this -- these are the type of changes that our government is working around the clock, with the members of Security Council, to make those changes, to put those steps in the resolution, that it will ensure that it will be implemented.

GORANI: Specifically what part of the resolution did the Lebanese cabinet and the prime minister find disappointing, and why?

CHATAH: OK. Two or three main ones. The resolution does not have an immediate ceasefire. This should happen quickly. This war is not going to end on its own. We see the war escalating day after day. First, this should be an immediate ceasefire.

Second, right after the ceasefire, we should have a number of things. Israel should begin withdrawing from the south. With UNIFIL (ph), the United Nations Force monitoring and helping them. At the same time, the Lebanese army moving to the south, taking over all military installations, all weapons.

Also, in the resolution we want issues, pending issues between Israel and Lebanon, like the Shebaa Farms (ph) territory.

GORANI: But that's included in the draft.

CHATAH: Yes, but it is included in such a vague way that leaves a lot of question marks. We can improve the text to make sure that what I just described, movement of the Lebanese army, and movement of the Israelis happening immediately, if we wait for a week or two for international forces to come, God knows what can happen during that time.

GORANI: So that being said, let's look forward to tomorrow, Monday, and next week. Are you confident that the text can be improve upon in a way that satisfied the Lebanese government and that it will be voted and adopted by the U.N. Security Council?

CHATAH: That's our hope. Work working, even now -- at this very moment --

GORANI: Are you in telephone contact with Washington?

CHATAH: We are in telephone contact with Washington, New York, Paris and London, and with people here, to make sure we use every possibility to make these changes that will make the ceasefire work. We have not rejected the resolution. Lebanese people are the ones who are suffering the most. We want the resolution to work. We're concerned that it will be a resolution that is not implemented. That's not the point. The point is to make the war stop.

GORANI: In those telephone conversations, is there a sense that Washington and Paris are listening to you? That they are listening to your concerns and are willing to make those changes?

CHATAH: I think there is some understandings of our concerns. These things do not happen very quickly. These things have time. We have a problem. We need to race against rockets that are flying on people's homes and killing people, families, people sitting in their shelters. This ought to stop.

There is understanding of our concern. People are talking about the need for a ceasefire that works, and one that can be sustained. So we're speaking the same language and we're working on these steps -- hopefully -- hopefully this will happen in the next hours. So that we do have a resolution, in a day, or two days that can really put an end to the war.

GORANI: So, you still think the one or two days, you think the Tuesday, Wednesday, sort of horizon is feasible?

CHATAH: It is feasible. We are working towards that. It is nothing assured. But a lot is at stake.

GORANI: Because I've been sensing a lot of more pessimism coming from everybody, including the cabinet ministers and senior government.

CHATAH: It is an uphill battle. But it is a battle worth fighting. We're doing it.

GORANI: Let me ask you this, you say the Lebanese cabinet doesn't squarely reject this draft text. However, when we listen to the Hezbollah cabinet ministers it sounds like a -- just a complete rejection. Isn't it -- Hezbollah is the warring party here. It is not the Lebanese cabinet.

CHATAH: Look, Hala, people express their viewpoint in their own way. Clearly when you don't have an immediate ceasefire and a clear objective of having Israel is withdraw and sustain ceasefire, you can say they reject the resolution. No one in their right mind can reject something that can put an end to this. We, the government, representatives of the Lebanese people, are working day and night to make it happen and we don't care if it takes a miracle. We're going to go after a miracle. We are going to put and end to this war.

GORANI: Let me ask you one last thing, that I've heard also from Lebanese officials. One of their fears is -- let's assume that a zone is established between the border and the Litania (ph) River, with the Lebanese army and say a U.N. force that has some enforcement powers. Some of their fears is that then would push Hezbollah forces back on the other side of the Litania (ph) River, closer to the center of the country, and instead of having Hezbollah armed in the southern part of the country, you have it in the middle of the country.

CHATAH: Look, that's why we have approached it, from the beginning, we have approached this problem as one that has need of a package to solve it. Immediate steps to make the ceasefire work, but also the elements that will lead to a sustained solution. What we mean by that, elements that will enable the Lebanese government to exercise its authority throughout the country. Hezbollah is --

GORANI: Is it strong enough?

CHATAH: Of course it is not strong enough. When you have a political agreement, when the army is in power, it can do that. What cannot happen is try to force Hezbollah, simply get a foreign contingent or a the Lebanese army, and try to force Hezbollah to disarm. The Israelis have been fighting Hezbollah for three weeks, almost four weeks now.

What is happening, mainly, civilians are dying. There is a way, the Lebanese cabinet includes Hezbollah ministers. They have agreed that the government -- the Lebanese army should be the only authority with weapons. This is in national agreement that where are committed to implementing. But only -- only if the package makes sense and it is approved and that's what we're going to the Security Council with.

GORANI: Can I ask you a question that requires a one-word answer?

CHATAH: Ah, OK.

GORANI: Pessimistic or optimistic?

CHATAH: Ah, optimistic.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SWEENEY: There is more of our coverage on the crisis in the Middle East just ahead, including a look at the Syrian prime minister, and what he had to say during his visit to Lebanon.

Also ahead, we'll see how residents are coping in the Lebanese city of Sidon, where Israeli leaflets have warned of an impending attack. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GORANI: Welcome back to our special coverage of the conflict in Lebanon and Israel. I'm Hala Gorani in Beirut.

SWEENEY: And I'm Fionnuala Sweeney in Haifa, Israel. Thank you for watching our special coverage.

Now, on the diplomatic front, U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice says it is important to get a vote in a day or two on a U.N. draft resolution aimed at ending the conflict.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) CONDOLEEZZA RICE, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: I would urge, and I think, we are urging all states of the Security Council now, to back this resolution as a first step toward not just an end to the crisis, but as a first step toward moving to a more stable set of solutions. So that is -- the mood in the council has been very good. And I think you will see support for the resolution.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GORANI: Well, Syria, which supports Hezbollah, has rejected the draft U.N. Security Council resolution and through its foreign minister has warned of instability if it passes without all parties agreeing to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WALID MOALLEM, SYRIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: This draft resolution is a recipe for the continuation of the war, because unfortunately it is not fair for Lebanon. Second, it is a recipe for possible civil war in Lebanon, which nobody, nobody, nobody has any interest to see this happening except Israel.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SWEEENEY: Well, Israel is taking await and see approach to the United Nations draft resolution. The Israeli Deputy Prime Minister Shimon Peres says the first and second resolutions must be approved before Israel can react.

And he told CNN's "Late Edition" that it was unlikely Israel would exchange a captured Hezbollah member for the kidnapped Israeli soldiers. But he hinted Israel may talk to Lebanese officials about a prisoner exchange.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHIMON PERES, ISRAELI DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER: We don't feel we have to compensate the Hezbollah because they took, first off, two of our soldiers. But if then Lebanon would like to talk about exchange of prisoners, we are always ready to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SWEENEY: Peres also says Israel's action would depend on whether or not the Lebanese government can rid its nation of Hezbollah.

GORANI: Well, here in Lebanon in the southern part of the country, about half of the population has left trying to flee the violence. In some cases the Israeli military dropped leaflets on some of the towns and villages, a warning residents to evacuate. It did so in Sidon, in the southern part of Lebanon, a few days ago. Ben Wedeman has the story on why the residents of Sidon, many of them, have decided to stay put.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) BEN WEDEMAN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): In Sidon's old market, it's business as usual, less than an hour's drive from the bombing and shelling in the south. This city, Lebanon's third largest, is peaceful, at least for now.

Saturday Israeli aircraft dropped leaflets over Sidon, calling on residents to leave because Hezbollah targets in and around the city would be bombed. Down by the harbor the usual group of pensioners gathers for a midday water pipe and a cup of tea.

These old timers are philosophical about this war. It's not their first, by a long shot. They aren't easily swayed by scraps of paper falling from the sky.

"Israelis are trying to scare us all away," says Mustafa Geeva (ph). "But even if they start bombing, we're not going anywhere."

This is a predominantly Sunni Muslim city. It's hero, assassinated former Lebanese prime minister and Sidon native, Rafik Hariri (ph). Israel is trying to appeal in whatever way it can, to those who are not Hezbollah hardcore supporters.

(On camera): Normally, this frequency, 92.2 FM is Izza Tanore (ph), which is Hezbollah's radio station, but since the fighting began, the Israelis are bumping into this frequency with a message of their own.

(Voice over): In Arabic, a voice claiming to speak in the name of the state of Israel calls upon the people of Lebanon not to allow Hezbollah to destroy their country. In Sidon's old quarter, refugees from the south squat in a building dating back to when Lebanon was a remote province of the Ottoman Empire. Leaflets and radio broadcasts aren't enough to send them packing, again.

"We can't go any further," says Amel Shahatta (ph), who fled here from Tyre. "We've gone as far as we can go. We don't have the money." So, they'll stay put and hope the war will pass them by. Ben Wedeman, CNN, Sidon, Lebanon.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SWEEENEY: Well, here in Haifa, it is about four and a half hours after a barrage of rockets hit Israel's the third largest city, killing three and wounding 100. As one surveys the city, one can still see the lights of the emergency rescue services dotted at the various places where these rockets made impact.

Haifa's rescue and emergency services tend to clear up very quickly after a rocket attack. But this rocket attack tonight, one of the largest, and one of the most deadly on Haifa since this conflict began three and a half weeks ago.

Earlier I spoke to the Yonah Yahav, he is the mayor of Haifa and he had just come from visiting the scene of these rocket attacks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) YONAH YAHAV, MAYOR, HAIFA: I told you before this is a very strong society in Haifa. And we can overcome and prevail over very many difficulties. Even though we are not used to a war, the last war we have faced here in Haifa was 1948, the Independent War.

But you see how the people are reacting. And now, this evening, which was a very sad evening, the rockets hit the Arabic residential area of the city. And unfortunately three people were killed. And more than 100 people injured.

But nothing can jeopardize the harmonious life between Jews and Arabs, which is lasting already more than 100 years in this city. This is the only place in the world where Jews and Arabs are living in peace and even Hassan Nasrallah can't jeopardize it. And you must see the reactions. I have been all over the places. I spoke with the people, I got their reactions, they are very deadly mad at the person, at what he represents, and what he's doing. And hopefully the Lebanese will be strong enough in order to kick him out.

SWEENEY: Now, we were out and about earlier today before these rocket attacks and people telling us that they're getting increasingly angry and frustrated at the government's apparent inability to stop these rockets being launched.

YAHAV: Look, I knew that it will take more than a month. I said it right in the beginning. This is a war against guerrilla, a war against guerrilla is not easy. We see it in Afghanistan. Big America is not able to prevail over this Taliban. But eventually it will happen. Eventually the end of Nasrallah will come.

SWEENEY: How long do you think Haifa will have to endure these rocket barrages then?

YAHAV: It will take at least week or two more. Depends on what is going on in the U.N., and if the U.N. is going to impose the settlement here up north. But even if you U.N. will impose, doesn't necessarily -- will bring tranquility to the area. We have enough power and we are strong enough to stay and see what is going to happen.

SWEENEY: And yet we're seeing 200 rockets plus being fired across from Lebanon into Israel every single day. Do you think that this city itself can sustain that kind of barrage? What is it doing to the economy of this town?

YAHAV: First of all, the question is not if this city can sustain. The question is whether the Western world can sustain. Because we have to see that it starts in Tehran and the longer man of Tehran is Hezbollah. And if this will penetrate into the minds of the Western world, we can sustain. Where are doing the work now. We are doing the dirty work of the Western world. And the Western world has to conceive it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SWEEENEY: Mayor of Haifa Yonah Yahav speaking to me earlier. We will have much more of our extended coverage of the crisis in the Middle East after this break.

GORANI: And an Israeli official talks about Hezbollah's rocket attacks against Haifa. That and more, stay with CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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