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The Brief with Jim Sciutto

Protests Outside Wisconsin Court; FBI Arresting Judge; Trump Claims Russia-Ukraine Peace Deal Is "Pretty Close"; Witkoff Meets Putin In Moscow; Pope Francis' Coffin Formally Sealed; Vietnamese Americans Weigh In On Trump; Trade Tensions Between U.S. And Europe; One Man's Fight Against Poverty. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired April 25, 2025 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us from all around the world. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington, and you're watching "The

Brief."

Just to add this hour, people protesting now outside of court in Wisconsin after the FBI arrested a judge for allegedly obstructing immigration

agents. Donald Trump claims a Russia-Ukraine peace deal is, quote, "pretty close" as his special envoy, Steve Witkoff, as you see there, meets

Vladimir Putin in Moscow. And the coffin of Pope Francis is formally sealed as world leaders arrive in Rome for his funeral, which will be in just a

matter of hours.

We begin in Wisconsin where protests have now erupted after the FBI arrested a Milwaukee judge. The Trump administration accused County Judge

Hannah Dugan of obstructing immigration authorities. They say she tried to help an undocumented immigrant evade arrest at her courthouse. Witnesses

say the judge confronted ICE agents inside the building telling them to leave and saying they needed a different warrant. They say Dugan then

directed the undocumented immigrant and his attorney to leave by a door normally used by the jury. Judge Dugan was released from custody today

after an initial court appearance.

Joining me now is Thomas Moukawsher. He's a former judge himself of the Connecticut Superior Court. Thanks so much for joining.

THOMAS MOUKAWSHER, FORMER CONNECTICUT SUPERIOR COURT JUDGE: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: So, first, tell me your response to your understanding of the facts here. Did the judge do anything wrong?

MOUKAWSHER: Probably not because what happened is that the judge conducted that person through a private doorway, which ultimately led the person

right back into the public hallway. So, I'm not sure exactly what the big deal is about it. The person walked out into the hallway and right up to a

DEA agent that accompanied the person down the elevator and then they arrested him. So, it's kind of hard for me to see this as a dramatic

intervention for a judge trying to sneak somebody out of the building. All that happened is he ended up right back in the hallway he was in before.

SCIUTTO: I imagine given the FBI knows the judge's name, knows where she works, knows her home address, that there were also legal options short of

arrest if you wanted to take her to court.

MOUKAWSHER: Well, of course. And there's also -- you know, there's a judicial code of ethics and if the person -- the judge was violating that

judicial code of ethics, there's a disciplinary way to deal with that. And I -- you know, these things deserve to be looked into and you have to be

sure that things were done correctly and ethically. But to arrest a judge is simply unacceptable under the circumstances that I can see from reading

the complaint. It looks like an arrest that was looking for a place to land.

SCIUTTO: And that was going to be my next question here, because of course, this does not happen in a vacuum. It happens in the midst of a number of

cases where the Trump administration and law enforcement agencies are pushing the limits of the law, at least, and some contend that they've

pushed beyond the limits of the law.

How does this fit into that broader pattern in your view, and is there something particular about arresting judges that's dangerous, in your view?

MOUKAWSHER: Well, I think it should be the last thing that should be on the minds of the executive branch or the judicial branch to have this kind of

thing going on, because it discredits both branches when you have circumstances like this. I don't think that judges should be doing things

that obstruct federal law enforcement people, but federal law enforcement people should - the last thing they should want to do is to arrest a judge

and discredit both branches of government by showing that they can't work together.

And so, I'm very disturbed by that and think it's part of a larger pattern of the executive branch bullying the judicial branch.

SCIUTTO: So, what's the recourse here? I mean, you have the individual case and Dugan, she was charged, as I understand it, with obstruction,

concealing an individual to avoid arrest, that carries a maximum of six years in prison, though I imagine that's at the outer range of what she

might actually face here.

[18:05:00]

So, she's got her own case. But what's to stop the FBI from doing this in other courtrooms around the country?

MOUKAWSHER: Well, I hope what happens is that it's made clear by the judiciary and through the prosecutions, if there are any, if this one

continues, for instance, that these cases aren't going to be successful. And this happened in the first Trump administration too, where they

arrested a judge and the charges were dismissed. I think the charges will likely be dismissed here too.

And the administration's got to understand that it cannot abuse its powers in the ways that it has, that are dozens and dozens of cases where the

administration has been found to be in flagrant violation of the law. And sooner or later, we hope as a country, that that's going to stop.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Former Connecticut judge Thomas Moukawsher, thanks so much for joining.

MOUKAWSHER: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: Well, Moscow now on a day of diplomacy between Russia and the United States aimed at ending the war in Ukraine, U.S. Special envoy, Steve

Witkoff, meeting with the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, behind closed doors. With Witkoff notably absent any advisers beside him.

Russian State Media says the talks ran for three hours with a senior Kremlin aide saying they discussed resuming direct negotiations between

Kyiv and Moscow. On social media, President Donald Trump said the talks were, quote, "going smoothly" and, quote, "seems success to be in the

future."

But that post was not without another swipe at the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, accusing him of dragging his feet over a separate rare

earths deal. Of course, Russia itself has not signed onto a ceasefire, which Ukraine signed onto more than a month ago.

Earlier today, Trump reiterated what he said was his aim in all of this, which is saving lives.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: That's what my aim is. I want to save 5,000 young men. They happen to be mostly Ukrainian and Russian. 5,000 young

Ukrainian and Russian men. And that's a big honor if I can do it. I think we're pretty close.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Fred Pleitgen wraps up the day's events.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STEVE WITKOFF, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY: How are you, Mr. President?

VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT: Thank you.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A warm welcome from the Russian leader. But then, straight down to business.

Vladimir Putin lined by two of his top expert negotiators, President Trump's envoy, Steve Witkoff, without any other senior U.S. officials in

his corner.

After three hours behind closed doors, the Russians say some progress was made.

This conversation allowed for further rapprochement between the positions of Russia and the United States, not only on Ukraine, but also on a number

of other international issues, a Russian negotiator told reporters by phone.

PLEITGEN: As President Trump's special negotiator, Steve Witkoff, met with Russian leader, Vladimir Putin, the Russians too say that they want a deal

as fast as possible, but they won't sign anything that could harm Russia's national interests.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): While Witkoff and Kirill Dmitriev, part of Russia's negotiating team, took a stroll down a shopping street in Central Moscow

before the Kremlin talks --

TRUMP: No, no. You've done a lot of talking.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): -- President Trump applied pressure on Ukraine's leadership in an interview with Time Magazine. Outright saying the Crimean

Peninsula, which Putin annexed in 2014 will stay with Russia and that he believes Ukraine's desire to join NATO was one of the root causes leading

to Russia's full-on invasion in 2022. All while later claiming a deal may be close at hand.

TRUMP: I think Russia and Ukraine, I think they're coming along. We hope. Very fragile.

PLEITGEN (voice-over): Fragile and violent. The talks come as Ukraine is still reeling from a powerful Russian missile attack that left dozens

killed and wounded on Thursday.

And today, a Russian general was killed by a car bomb outside Moscow, leaving the Russians fuming. While Ukraine has not commented, Moscow is

blaming Kyiv's intelligence services.

This once again shows that despite the peace talks, we must be on guard and understand the essence of this regime, Putin spokesman says.

How and when those talks will continue is up for debate as President Trump says his patience is increasingly running thin.

Fred Pleitgen, CNN, Moscow.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: There appear now to be two rival versions of a peace deal at the heart of the current negotiations, this according to a European official.

One apparently presented by Ukraine and its European allies, another backed and pushed by the Trump administration.

According to the official, the Ukrainian and European plan calls for a ceasefire, followed by discussions then about territory.

[18:10:00]

Kyiv would receive defense guarantees from its allies along the lines of Article 5. Article 5 is the core principle of NATO that an armed attack on

one member state is considered an attack against all. The official says the version set out by President Trump's envoy, Steve Witkoff, proposes the

U.S. recognize Russia's annexation of Crimea. It also offers robust security guarantees for Kyiv and prevents Ukraine from joining NATO, lifts

sanctions against Russia.

Joining me now is Michael Bociurkiw. He's a former spokesperson for the organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, also a senior fellow

at the Atlantic Council. Good to have you on.

MICHAEL BOCIURKIW, FORMER SPOKESPERSON, ORGANIZATION FOR SECURITY AND COOPERATION IN EUROPE: Thank you for having me.

SCIUTTO: In an op-ed, you, you wrote on peace for Ukraine. You say that Russia is now pushing a -- what you call a smorgasbord of concessions that

would be -- would've been unthinkable just a few weeks ago. This allows -- this includes allowing Russia to keep territory in the east that it took by

force. I wonder, from your perspective, is the Trump administration too willing to grant concessions to Russia?

BOCIURKIW: Yes, absolutely. You know, Jim, so many things moving at once, it reminds me of the fast train scenario you have. The Trump team and Mr.

Putin on a fast train with the curtains closed. You have Mr. Zelenskyy on the platform trying to hop on, and then you have the Europeans at the

tickets stall fumbling for change or permission from their parents to join.

So, it also indicate right now that of those two, you know, dropped proposals that were leaked, it's probably the U.S.-Russia one where the

lines will be frozen, where Crimea will be given international -- well, not international recognition, but recognition by the United States, lifting of

sanctions, perhaps some freezing of assets, flights between the two countries, a whole range of smorgasbord of things as -- yes, as we put it.

And definitely tilted not in Ukraine's favor.

SCIUTTO: I mean, a lot of those concessions you mentioned there are between the U.S. and Russia, right? It don't seem to be focused on Ukraine's

security, which is central to this given, of course, it is Russia that invaded Ukraine twice, by the way.

BOCIURKIW: Right.

SCIUTTO: I mean, has the U.S. put any meat on the bone as to what its security guarantees would be?

BOCIURKIW: It is very vague. One of the proposals does indicate that this will fall on the shoulders of European, but the Polish foreign minister

said earlier today that, you know, Europe isn't in the proper position right now to backfill what the United States provides.

There are some things, and there are -- there is a growing movement to up defense spending. But, you know, I can tell you, being in the U.K. for a

few days there are so many other priorities right here. And from a talk I gave last night, I don't -- I didn't pick up the sense that there's an

appetite here to redirect resources to aid Ukraine.

Having said that, it is sinking in, however, that if the U.K., European, and other allies don't push Mr. Putin back, he will make another play for

more territory beyond Ukraine's borders, and that will have its impact here as well.

SCIUTTO: I've asked European officials, I've asked Ukrainian officials that if the deal presented by the U.S. and Russia is not to their liking, if

they think that their security interests, both Ukrainian security interests and European security interests, are not met that they might very well

refuse, not sign on and keep fighting. And I wonder, do you believe that that's possible as well?

BOCIURKIW: Yes, it is. I think there is more discussion about what Ukraine could do to keep on fighting with European support, what little there is,

in a short-term anyway. And -- but that then would also probably have to include the very controversial move of Mr. Zelenskyy calling a full

mobilization, including perhaps women as well.

Because as you well know from your coverage there's a lot of tired soldiers at the Ukrainian frontline of advanced age. And, you know, I've been in

Odessa and other cities from the start of the war. You go and you see able- bodied men all over the place who are not fighting. So, that I think irks even European allies. So, something needs to be done in that direction as

well. Again, very controversial.

And quickly, Jim, we also heard from Vitali Klitschko, the mayor of Kyiv, today, and what he said was really shocking that, yes, perhaps we need to

temporarily give up territory. And that also signals to me a kind of fissures or cracks in the political unity that we've had almost from the

start of the war. So, the grounds under Mr. Zelenskyy are shifting very quickly.

[18:15:00]

SCIUTTO: They're -- I wonder when you look at the U.S. role in all this, given the way President Trump talks about this, he's far more critical of

Zelenskyy than he is of Putin. In fact, very rarely is he critical of Putin. And the deal presented by the U.S. is, let's be frank, more

favorable to Russia. Is the U.S. still seen in Europe as a fair mediator in these negotiations?

BOCIURKIW: No, not at all. And the -- well, not the proposal. The idea that I have floated a number of times now on air of the Ukrainians trying to

switch out the U.S. as an interlocutor and perhaps go for Turkey, which is also, of course, very much concerned about Black Sea security. They have

deep economic and political interest in Ukraine, that might work better in their favor.

I think there's a growing realization here that the Trump administration has very little regard for international norms. Look at the way they've

treated their allies. And you know, that clip that you showed at the beginning of Trump saying he is, you know, concerned about these 5,000 or

so lives spent every week. Well, I think, from what I picked up here, a lot of people suspect that he is more gunning for that Nobel Peace Prize, also

for a foreign affairs win. That's alluded him in Gaza, in Ukraine and elsewhere. And this does not bear the trademarks of the so-called master of

the art of the deal.

SCIUTTO: Michael Bociurkiw, thanks so much for joining as always.

BOCIURKIW: My pleasure. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Now, to the Vatican where Pope Francis' casket has now been formally sealed. Leaders from around the world are planning to attend

Saturday's funeral for the late pope, among them President Donald Trump and the first lady who are on their way to Rome now.

Pope's funeral in Vatican City is now just hours away from its start. However, we should note, he will not be buried in Vatican City. Instead,

he'll be the first pope in more than a century to be buried in Rome. Per his request he will be laid to rest at the basilica of Santa Maria

Maggiore, in a simple tomb.

Pope Francis made a point of connecting with people on the margins of society, whether in nations torn apart by war, in prisons, or in his own

backyard. Clarissa Ward spoke to one of the women who met him.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Behind the high walls in barbed wire in Rebibbia Women's Prison, it's easy to feel

forgotten. But that changed one day in late March of last year with a visit from Pope Francis.

Sitting in his wheelchair, the pope engaged in his centuries old pre-Easter ritual, washing the feet of 12 inmates. Dorota has spent a decade behind

bars was first in line.

DOROTA, INMATE (through translator): When I got on the stage and the pope got close to me, I felt very strong emotion. I was shaking. And the thing

that really struck me the most was that I felt a true warm kiss on my feet. Something that can't be described. It'll never happen again in my life.

WARD: Did you feel that you were in the presence of someone who's close to God?

DOROTA (through translator): Yes, I could feel a lot of humility in him. I saw that he's good. A man with a big heart that is close to us. A very

religious person, an extraordinary person.

WARD (voice-over): The foot washing ritual seeks to imitate Jesus Christ washing his disciples' feet the night before his death. This was the first

time a pope washed the feet of all women. A striking departure from his predecessor Benedict who only washed the feet of men and later only the

feet of priests.

WARD: And what do you think made this pope special or different? Why do you think it is that he had the ability to touch so many hearts?

DOROTA (through translator): Because he was truly a good pope. The pope of the people, of all the poor, of everyone in need, prisoners, the homeless.

He was there with his heart.

WARD (voice-over): I ask if the other woman felt the same way.

DOROTA (through translator): Yes. In fact, here I have a paper with some thoughts from the other inmates. For us inmates, the pope's visit was very

emotional. Through Pope Francis, we felt as though our hearts had received true forgiveness. We felt seen and understood. He never abandoned us, not

even in his final days.

[18:20:00]

WARD (voice-over): Returning to her cell, Dorota said she won't be watching the funeral on TV. It would be too painful. Instead, she'll carry the

memory of that meeting when Pope Francis brought warmth to the hardest of places.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: Join CNN for Pope Francis' funeral on Saturday. Our special coverage begins at 8:00 a.m. in Rome, 3:00 p.m. in Tokyo. That is 2:00 a.m.

here in Washington, D.C.

Coming up, President Trump said to mark 100 days in office next week. One important U.S. voting bloc, Vietnamese-Americans are weighing in on his job

performance so far. We'll have that story and more coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: Welcome back to "The Brief." U.S. stocks ended Friday's session higher, wrapping up a week of strong gains. Today, once again, driving

sentiment trade. Reports say Beijing is lowering its 125 percent tariffs on semiconductors made here in the U.S. Beijing has yet to confirm those

reports. But any softening of its trade stance would be welcome news for Trump administration officials who've been trying to walk back their own

attacks on China and tariffs this past week.

The news comes amid ongoing confusion over whether the U.S. and China are, in fact, engaged in trade talks at all. China denied once again Friday that

talks are underway. President Trump saying something different.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN REPORTER: You said you spoke with President Xi. Have you spoken to him since the tariff? When did you last speak with him?

TRUMP: I don't want to comment on that, but I've spoken to him many times.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Well, didn't answer the question there. Trump also warned that he will not extend his 90-day pause of his so-called reciprocal terrorists,

placing new pressure on countries to sign trade deals soon, before the end of that 90 days. Trump marks his 100th day in office next week. Recent

polls are showing a majority of Americans are unhappy with his handling of the economy, with his overall approval rating below where it was in his

first term at the same time.

One group that tends to vote Republican appears split on the job he's doing so far. MJ Lee has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MJ LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): These crispy fried rice flour shells stuffed with shrimp and pork are one of the dishes

Thanh Thi Truong cooked when President Donald Trump campaigned at her restaurant last fall.

LEE: What was it like to have him here?

TEETY TRONG (PH) (through translator): I found him to be very friendly. It seemed like he really wanted to visit a restaurant that truly captured

Vietnamese culture and cuisine.

[18:25:00]

LEE (voice-over): Truong Tien tucked away in one corner of Eden Center, a sprawling strip mall at the heart of the Vietnamese American community in

suburban Virginia.

In 2024, the majority of Asian Americans voted for Democratic candidate Kamala Harris, but the electorate shifted to the right by five points

compared to 2020. And Vietnamese American voters tend to lean more Republican than other Asian ethnic groups, with 51 percent of them

identifying as Republican compared to 34 percent among all Asian American voters.

Almost 100 days into Trump's second term, the community here remains divided about the president.

On a recent rainy afternoon, Sam Hua says Trump is to blame for high prices.

LEE: You're not happy with him because prices are going up?

SAM HUA, VIETNAMESE AMERICAN HARRIS VOTER: Yes. Every price, everything up now. Eggs too expensive too. I come 1979, only $1, the egg.

LEE (voice-over): 1979 is the year Hua came to the U.S. He's part of an entire generation of Vietnamese Americans that settled here after the fall

of Saigon.

Hua recently retired, but at 69 years old, had to start working part-time again at a restaurant for extra cash. He voted for Harris. Two of his

brothers did not.

LEE: Why do they like Trump?

HUA: Because he make no too many, illegals come to United States.

LEE (voice-over): On this issue, he happens to agree with his brothers.

LEE: You think too many people are coming in illegally?

HUA: Yes, the people.

LEE (voice-over): Richard Nguyen also came to the U.S. after the Vietnam War as a refugee.

LEE: What did you buy today? Just coffee.

RICHARD NGUYEN, VIETNAMESE AMERICAN TRUMP VOTER: Coffee, yes. Today it the thing that on sale.

LEE (voice-over): Nguyen's supports Trump on immigration and trimming the federal government. His backing for the Republican Party has much to do

with his own memories of escaping communism.

NGUYEN: I escaped my country because the communists in my country. After the 1975, right? Henry Kissinger, they sell my country.

LEE (voice-over): Inside the shopping center, Huy Pham owns a prepared food store.

LEE: How much is this one?

HUY PHAM, PREPARED FOODS STORE OWNER: Bag is $15 for 10 pieces.

LEE: OK.

LEE (voice-over): Pham voted for Harris and he sees a clear generational divide in his community when it comes to politics.

LEE: The shop owner across the hallway was wearing a Make America Great Again hat. So, I mean, you see that all around you here, right?

PHAM: Yes.

LEE: Yes.

PHAM: We good neighbor. I like him a lot.

LEE (voice-over): One issue that's top of mind for Pham recently is immigration.

PHAM: We have a big population of immigrants, right, migrants. They're good people. You know, they just try to make a living here.

LEE (voice-over): A few doors down. Floris Huan Vo declined to say who he voted for in the last election.

HUAN VO, FLOWER STORE OWNER: As a business owner, we are not just only, you know, tailored to this party or the other party, and we would like to serve

everybody equally.

LEE (voice-over): As he braces for tariffs.

VO: These, you know, daisies is right here. They come from Colombia. Big roses just right here. They come from Ecuador. Laos also could be, you

know, from 10 percent up to 20 percent from the tariff.

LEE (voice-over): Vo says he's not entirely sure how to make sense of Trump's second term so far.

LEE: Do you feel like life is better?

VO: It is hard to tell. Everything is really uncertainty at the moment right now with a lot of changes.

LEE (voice-over): MJ Lee, CNN, Falls Church, Virginia.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: President Trump's second term in office has been marked by a deluge of controversial pardons. On his first day in office, you'll

remember he issued pardons from 1,500 rioters who stormed the U.S. Capitol on January 6, 2021. He has pardoned more than 20 anti-abortion activists,

convicted of blocking clinics and harassing patients. He also pardoned former Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich, a former contestant on the

president's old TV show, "The Celebrity Apprentice," who, we should note, was convicted of multiple corruption charges.

His latest pardon also facing criticism, president pardoning disgraced Las Vegas politician Michele Fiore, who was found guilty of raising $70,000 to

build a statue of a fallen police officer and then spending the money on plastic surgery, her daughter's wedding, rent, and other personal expenses.

Prosecutors say she used tragedy to line her own pockets. She was due to be sentenced next month. Fiore has been called Lady Trump for her staunch pro

MAGA stance.

Coming up, where Europe's trade negotiations with Washington stand right now? One-on-one with the E.U.'s economy chief. That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:30:00]

SCIUTTO: Welcome back to "The Brief." I'm Jim Sciutto. And here are more international headlines we're watching today. President Trump insists a

Russia-Ukraine peace deal is, quote, "pretty close" despite major sticking points remaining. His special envoy, Steve Witkoff, met with Vladimir Putin

in Moscow, as you see there, today for three hours. A senior Kremlin aide says they discussed resuming direct negotiations between Ukraine and

Russia.

Luigi Mangione, the 26-year-old accused of killing UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson last year appeared in New York Federal Court on Friday. He

pleaded not guilty to all the federal charges against him. His legal team also signaled it wants his federal case to go to trial before his state

cases. U.S. government has said that it will seek the death penalty for Mangione.

Disgraced former U.S. congressman George Santos has been sentenced to 87 months in prison. Santos pleaded guilty to aggravated identity theft and

wire fraud charges, this in connection to his 2022 political campaign. The judge ruled that Santos must surrender by July 25th. He also must pay

$373,000 in restitution.

The International Monetary Fund's Europe director is urging the U.S. and the European Union to de-escalate the trade war and negotiate a deal. He

said, quote, "In our discussions with European leaders, I don't sense any difference of views with regard to the importance of that relationship."

This after the E.U. economy commissioner Valdis Dombrovskis said this, the European Union is not giving up on our closest, deepest, and most important

partnership with the United States. And he joins me now. Thanks so much for taking the time.

VALDIS DOMBROVSKIS, E.U. COMMISSIONER, ECONOMY AND PRODUCTIVITY: Good afternoon.

SCIUTTO: So, I spoke yesterday with France's economic minister who said that the mood and negotiations with the U.S. had improved markedly. He said

much more positive today than it was some two months ago. And I wonder, during your visits here, do you find a change, a positive change in the

tone at least of the talks?

[18:35:00]

DOMBROVSKIS: Well, in a case we now have this 90 days pause, at least partial suspension of so-called reciprocal tariffs. Also from the European

Union side, we have suspended our first set of counter tariffs also for 90 days. So, now, we, indeed, need to use this window of time to reach a

negotiated and mutually acceptable agreement. And that's very strong E.U. preference because, indeed, E.U. and U.S. trade relationship is largest

trade relationship in the world. So, there's lots of at stake also economically.

SCIUTTO: You met with the treasury secretary, Scott Bessent, who has been very much the lead for Trump in these trade negotiations. Did you make any

progress for the -- on the outlines of what a U.S.-E.U. deal might look like?

DOMBROVSKIS: Well, indeed, we had a conversation on both on possible steps forward regarding this negotiated solution, also on macroeconomic

implications on these tariffs, which are negative both for E.U. and even more so for U.S. So, it's an actually an economic interest of all sides to

find this solution. And from E.U. side, we already have put a couple of ideas on a table like willingness to purchase more U.S. LNG or generally

have more cooperation in area of energy, also, zero -- for zero tariffs in industrial goods.

So, currently, it's still, in a sense, some kind of scoping. But indeed it's important to make progress swiftly as those 90 days clock is ticking.

SCIUTTO: The Trump administration, as you know, President Trump has used pressure tactics, to say the least, including ratcheting it up tariffs

enormously. And now, he's setting a deadline. He is saying that if there is not a deal reach within -- after this 90 days expires, that he will raise

the tariffs again. I just wonder, from your perspection -- perspective, does that pressure tactic work? Does it help move the negotiations along,

or does it sour the relationship?

DOMBROVSKIS: Well, actually, we're also negotiating with these 90 days deadline in mind, because certainly, current situation is asymmetric.

Because already now we are facing, from the U.S. side, steel and aluminum tariffs, we are facing car and car parts tariffs, and both of those are 25

percent. And on top of this, there is those 10 percent, quote/unquote, "reciprocal tariffs."

Whereas on -- from our side, we are currently not putting any additional tariffs on the U.S. We have agreed this first package, which was our

response to steel and aluminum tariffs, but we have suspended them. So, therefore, it's also in our interest to actually move swiftly with those

negotiations and to make sure that those Trump tariffs are removed.

SCIUTTO: Is it -- given that Donald Trump appears to see any trading relationship, where there's a deficit, where the U.S. is buying more than

it's selling as somehow a loss, somehow in the red, as if the nation were in the red, and he can't be shaken from that point of view. Is that someone

you can negotiate with in a constructive way?

DOMBROVSKIS: OK. In any case, President Trump administration has signaled this willingness to engage and these negotiations, this engagement is

currently happening. So, I cannot now predict the outcome because there's still lots of work to do. But from E.U. side, we are willing to explore

this opening, because our preference is a negotiated solution. And indeed, we are not seeing a trade in those terms. So, we are not see seeing --

seeking as a European Union balance trade with every country in the world, because that's not how international trade works and is also many domestic

imbalances, which needs to be addressed, also to adjust certain trade imbalances or deficits.

SCIUTTO: If you do come to an agreement at some point, as you know, Donald Trump as president, has negotiated trade deals in the past and then broken

those trade deals. He negotiated the USMCA deals with Canada and Mexico. And as Canadian officials and Mexican officials have noted, he's now

breaking those deals. Does the E.U. have confidence that if you do come to an agreement and sign a deal with President Trump, that he will stick to

that agreement?

DOMBROVSKIS: Well, obviously, we see this imposition of tariffs as unjustified and economically harmful, economically harmful for both sides.

Therefore, we are exploring these possibilities to reach negotiated settlement and then hope that it holds.

[18:40:00]

SCIUTTO: Right. Sometimes all you could have is hope, I suppose. Valdis Dombrovskis, thanks so much for joining. We appreciate you taking the time.

Coming up, Beyonce's mother opens up. What she's telling us about her family and raising a superstar.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: In her new memoir, "Matriarch," pop star, Beyonce's mother and fashion designer, Tina Knowles, shared how her family's sewing skills were

an important gift passed down to each generation, including to her daughters. Sara Sidner has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): She says her mother lived in a state of fear for her children, but focused on her master craft,

sewing to make sure that her children never looked poor. That craft was handed down to her children.

SIDNER: How many of Destiny's Child clothes and Beyonce's clothes did you end up sewing or having being involved with?

TINA KNOWLES, AUTHOR, BEYONCE'S MOTHER AND FASHION DESIGNER: Oh, I started styling them maybe, maybe six months into their singing career. And I did

both. I sewed and I styled them.

SIDNER: I have to ask you about one of the particular outfits that is iconic.

KNOWLES: OK.

SIDNER: And that is the "Survivor" outfit.

KNOWLES: Oh, yes.

SIDNER: That everybody talks about.

KNOWLES: That was so much fun.

(MUSIC PLAYING)

SIDNER: Where did that idea come from?

KNOWLES: Well, actually, Beyonce saw something B.C. with Raquel Welch.

SIDNER: Oh, yes?

KNOWLES: And she had this fur bathing, you know --

SIDNER: Yes, it's a little tiny furs.

KNOWLES: Yes. Yes. It was a lot tinier than theirs. I made theirs more. But she saw that and she was like, oh, that would be great for "Survivor." And

so, this guy Jaime (ph), who was incredibly talented, he and I made those together.

SIDNER (voice-over): She also worked to ensure that her daughter's relationship with one another was as tight as one of her sewing stitches.

SIDNER: Tell me about how you forged those relationships, because you have one daughter who is the most famous female recording artist in the world.

Like there is no other like her. And then Solange also has a talent. But how do you, as a mother, make them both feel that they are special?

[18:45:00]

KNOWLES: Well, I think one of the things is that you look at them as individuals because they were very, very different. She's very, very

different. And I think how I forged that relationship with them is I was terrified when Beyonce turned around 10. She might have been 10 or 11, and

she was in the singing group. And the kids would say to Solange every day, be quiet, Solange. Because she would try to choreograph, and, you know --

SIDNER: She's bossy.

KNOWLES: -- she wanted to be involved. She bossy, too. But she -- and they didn't want her involved. And then I started noticing that Beyonce would

allow them to talk to her like that, or she would say, OK, mom, can you get Solange out of here because she's doing -- and I'm like, wait a minute,

this is her house, and you got to be nice to her. And I told her all the things, you know, how important it was for her.

But finally, I realized that they weren't listening, and I saw a wall between them coming. And so, I got them in therapy. And --

SIDNER: You did?

KNOWLES: Yes. And it was really early because my family was like, you going to make those girls crazy? Cause, you know, in --

SIDNER: Yes.

KNOWLES: -- especially in the black community back then --

SIDNER: You didn't do therapy?

KNOWLES: No, you didn't.

SIDNER: People don't do it now.

KNOWLES: Right. But that -- back then --

SIDNER: Wow.

KNOWLES: -- it was really taboo.

SIDNER: Yes.

KNOWLES: And even my husband, he was like, I just don't know if they're too young for you to do that. And I'm like, I'm not asking. I'm going to find

somebody. And I found this wonderful therapist, child therapist. And it's funny because he told Beyonce all the things I had told her, but she

listened from him.

SIDNER: Right.

KNOWLES: Even though she hated therapy, she hated going. Solange loved therapy. She loved talking and, you know, expressing herself. And the

outcome was great. It was really great because they have been super tight since.

SIDNER: I had no idea.

KNOWLES: Yes.

SIDNER: And it's such a beautiful gift that you gave to them.

KNOWLES: Yes.

SIDNER: Because they are clearly tight.

KNOWLES: Yes, they are very tight.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: That's some good parenting there. Well, coming up after the break, proving one person can make the world a better place, we're going to hear

from the CEO of Global Citizen who has been recognized for his crusade to tackle extreme poverty.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: To a man on a mission uniting political leaders, Hollywood stars, some of the biggest names in music under the banner of ending extreme

poverty. The Global Citizen Movement is the culmination of a lifetime's work for my next guest, Australian-born Hugh Evans. It's CEO and co-

founder. Age 12 he supported world vision's fight against famine. He went on to establish the aid and development NGO, the Oak Tree Foundation, and

then the Global Poverty Project, which has since become global citizen.

Its aim, to defeat poverty, demand equity, and defend the planet. Global Citizen festivals attract some of the biggest names in the business, Doja

Cat, Lisa, Chris Martin, Ed Sheeran appearing on stage in New York last year.

[18:50:00]

Hugh Evans' dedication to fostering peace and human rights won him now a major accolade in South Korea where he was presented with the 2025 Sunhak

Peace Prize. And he joins me now. Hugh, thanks so much for taking the time.

HUGH EVANS, CO-FOUNDER AND CEO, GLOBAL CITIZEN: Jim, thank you so much for having me on your program today. It's very kind of you.

SCIUTTO: Well, first of all, congratulations on the award, the first Australian to receive it. You said, as I mentioned briefly there, that from

the age of 12 you had the inspiration to end extreme poverty. Can you explain where that came from and how it's evolved over the years?

EVANS: Absolutely. So, when I was 12 years old a lady from World Vision came and spoke at our high school about raising money to support

communities in the developing world. And when you're that age, you know, you put up your hand and you do everything you can. And I was given the

opportunity to go to the Philippines when I was 14 because I raised more money than any kid in Australia.

And one night in the Philippines changed my life forever, where we were taken onto a slum in the center of Manila, called Smokey Mountain. It's a

community built on top of a rubbish dump where the whole infrastructure revolves around scavenging. And that night, I was placed in the care of a

kid my own age named Sonny Boy. We were both 14 at the time. But where I'd come from, you know, just middle class Melbourne in Australia, he had

tattoos on his forearm at the age of 14 because he was about to become his gang leader.

And that night, when we came time to go to sleep, we just lay on the concrete slab. Myself, Sonny Boy and his whole family, seven of us in this

long line with cockroaches crawling all over us that night. And I decided that night that I wanted to try to do everything I could to eradicate

extreme poverty within our lifetime.

I didn't know exactly what form that would take at that age, but I knew as Warren Buffet called it, that it truly is the ovarian lottery. I didn't

deserve where I was born. He didn't deserve where he was born. And so, hereby the grace of God go all of us.

SCIUTTO: Wow. Gosh. What an experience. And I'm, you know, amazed all you took from that experience, right, the difference you've made. In your

acceptance speech for the Sunhak Award, you mentioned South African president, the late South African president, Nelson Mandela, helped inspire

you. How did his vision contribute?

EVANS: Well, Mandela, as well as ending working towards the eradication of Apartheid in South Africa. In one of his final speeches in Trafalgar Square

in 2005, he said that overcoming poverty is not a gesture of charity, it's an act of justice. And he went on to say that, like slavery and apartheid,

poverty is not natural, it's manmade and can be overcome and eradicated by the actions of human beings.

And I think in that speech lies two really important truths. Firstly, that poverty is a systemic issue. And secondly, that actions of citizens can

make the difference. That's why through the Global Citizen app, we said to everyone, we don't want your money. We want you to take action. Because if

12 and a half million Global Citizens come together in unison and call on a world leader, we can raise billions of dollars for the eradication of

extreme poverty.

That's why over the last 12 years, we've been able to secure over $43 billion. On the Global Citizen platform to impact the lives of some 1.3

billion people on the planet because our members take action together. We've had all kinds of heads of state, Fortune 100 CEOs make bold

commitments, and we then hold their feet to the fire to make sure they follow through on those commitments for the eradication of extreme poverty.

SCIUTTO: You're stepping into the world of sport through the FIFA World Cup halftime partnership. Of course, we're entering into the World Cup next

year. Can you tell us how you'll take part?

EVANS: We are so proud to partner with FIFA for -- and we're going to be producing the first ever halftime show for the World Cup final next year.

And we're going to be taking over Times Square during the finals weekend.

And our goal here, and we have a huge announcement next week at Global Citizen NOW, where FIFA's president, Gianni Infantino, will be joining me

on stage to talk about this announcement. But the whole objective is to use this as a platform to change the world.

And so, next week we're going to announce that platform and how we're going to use what will be the most viewed event of the year to galvanize people

to make a huge difference in the lives of those less fortunate.

SCIUTTO: Yes, no question. Well, we wish you the best luck. It's an important mission and we appreciate all you've already done, but keep at

it. We need it.

EVANS: Thank you. Thank you, Jim. Thanks for your woods of encouragement.

SCIUTTO: Hugh Evans. Well, in our field of play, big names now off the board. The Tennessee Titan selected University of Miami quarterback Cam

Ward, as expected, with the number one overall pick in the first round of the NFL draft. The Jacksonville Jaguars moved up and selected Heisman

Trophy winner, Travis Hunter, with the second pick, that after a big trade with the Cleveland Browns to move up. The second round of the draft will

begin in less than 10 minutes. A lot of choices left to come.

[18:55:00]

And a stunning sight lit up the night skies over Southern Brazil. Cameras caught this meteor flaring brightly on Wednesday. Wow. It looks huge. It

entered the atmosphere over the Atlantic Ocean before soaring across the country. It then split into multiple fiery trails as it disintegrated in

the atmosphere, illuminating the skies of Brazil's southernmost state. The director of a local space observatory said it might be the largest meteor

ever to fall in the region. Glad it didn't land on us.

Thanks so much for your company. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington. You've been watching "The Brief." Have a great weekend. Please do stay with CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:00:00]

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