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The Brief with Jim Sciutto
White House Finalizing the Trump-Putin Summit; European Leaders To Hold Virtual Talks With President Trump And Zelenskyy; Chinese Ships Collide In South China Sea; Trump Suspends Higher China Tariffs Until November 10; Trump Threatens Lawsuit Against Fed Chair Over Renovations; Dozens Of Nations Demand Israel Allow More Aid Into Gaza; Supreme Court Asked To Overturn Same-Sex Marriage Ruling. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired August 12, 2025 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:00]
ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us from around the world, I'm Erica Hill in New York. Jim is off today. You're
watching "The Brief."
Just ahead this hour, the White House now describing this week's summit between president's Trump and Putin as a listening exercise. So, what does
that even mean and why isn't Ukraine invited? Confrontation in the South China Sea. Two Chinese vessels colliding while chasing a vote from the
Philippines, highlighting the growing volatility in this key waterway. And a new push for the Supreme Court to overturn its landmark decision,
legalizing same-sex marriage in the United States. That conversation and plenty more coming up.
But first this hour, the White House actually lowering expectations now, calling President Trump's upcoming meeting with Russian leader Vladimir
Putin Alaska a, quote, "listening exercise."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Only one party that's involved in this war is going to be present. And so, this for the president
to go and to get, again, a more firm and better understanding of how we can hopefully bring this war to an end.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: The president is also expected to participate in virtual talks this week with European leaders and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy on
Wednesday, of course, two days before that planned Alaska summit with Putin. For his part, President Zelenskyy is vowing not to give up land to
Russia, saying it would open the door for Moscow to start another war.
Kristen Holmes is joining us now live from the White House. So, it is now a listening exercise, Kristen, what are we expecting to come of this meeting?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, if you hear from the White House, they just want to hear Putin out. That's what we've
heard now from Karoline Leavitt saying that President Trump just wants to sit down face to face with Russian President Vladimir Putin. In fact, she
said specifically that the she thinks -- or that he thinks, excuse me, the president, that this will be the best indication of how Putin wants to end
this war and where his head is at. And that was an answer to a question as to why exactly President Zelenskyy of Ukraine wasn't invited.
Now, one thing the White House has told me repeatedly is that he, he being Donald Trump, is not ruling out a trilateral meeting eventually, but that
President Trump believed the most important thing for him to do now is sit down and have this face to face. And you heard the press secretary really
talking specifically about how President Trump wanted to do this over having these phone calls that he's been having.
And we've really seen these phone calls between President Trump and President Putin kind of devolved over the last several months. I mean,
originally, when they sat down or when they first had their phone call, it was over two hours. President Trump gave his own readout of all the things
that they talked about. The last couple of times the two of them have gotten on the phone, not only has President Trump not given any sort of
readout, but when he was asked about it, he grew frustrated. He said that Putin was all talk. At one point he said, we made absolutely no progress
when it came to Ukraine.
And in fact, we heard from the Kremlin that President Trump asked Vladimir Putin to end what was going on in Ukraine as quickly as possible. And Putin
essentially said he would not be doing that. It was not in the best interest of Russia. So, this clearly them trying to temper the
expectations.
But what's also interesting about this is that President Trump and the White House now continuing to say that they aren't expecting this to be a
deal, that this just an opportunity for the two leaders to sit down. You know, it seems to be that President Trump understands that he cannot go in
here -- or that he should not go in here, listen to our European allies and the Ukrainians, and try to make a deal between two superpowers with Ukraine
not involved.
Instead, he keeps saying that he's going to call Zelenskyy right after he talks to Putin, as well as these other European leaders to talk about where
Putin's head is at and if Putin actually wants to make a deal and bring this war to an end.
HILL: Kristen, really appreciate it. Thank you. Well, as for the Ukrainians who have heard President Trump talk about potential land swaps, they are
nervous when it comes to their future and they're waiting and watching the outcome of Friday's meeting. Nick Paton Walsh spoke with some of them in
Eastern Ukraine where Moscow's forces are gaining ground.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): Forget a moment about Alaska and imagine being here where Russia is advancing, where its drones could not reach when we were there a week ago,
despite the endless talk of a peace deal. It's exactly here that land might be swapped.
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: There'll be some land swapping going on.
[18:05:00]
WALSH (voice-over): His special envoy visit to the Kremlin leading to reports Ukraine might just give away Donetsk and sparking panic among real
people here yesterday at a Donetsk railway station and frankly all over Ukraine.
WALSH: Speaking to European officials over the past days, one of the challenges seems to have been for them trying to clarify exactly what it
was that U.S. Envoy Steve Witkoff was offered by the Kremlin. What are the bones and details of that potential deal? And that just adds to how
unconventional this whole process feels.
A meeting of this grandeur would take months normally to prepare with the agenda and details ironed out by teams of diplomats for months. Instead, at
this point, so much is still unknown.
TRUMP: This really a feel out meeting a little bit.
WALSH (voice-over): President Trump has lowered expectations for their first meeting in six years. While Russia keeps flaunting claims, it's
captured towns like this.
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): He is definitely not preparing for a ceasefire or ending war.
WALSH (voice-over): President Zelenskyy clear, as the evidence supports so far, Putin does not seek peace.
ZELENSKYY (through translator): There is no sign that the Russians have received signals to prepare for a post-war situation. On the contrary, they
are moving their troops and forces in such a way as to launch new offensive operations.
WALSH (voice-over): On the Eastern frontline near this town of Dobropillya, reports Tuesday emerged over notable Russian advance, the extent or
permanent unclear, but enough to spark denials and reinforcements from Kyiv.
Wednesday, Zelenskyy will join German Chancellor Friedrich Merz and other key European leaders, and this time President Trump to pre-game Alaska.
Clarifying if the White House hasn't heard it yet, that Europe wants a ceasefire first and Ukraine at the table.
But what awaits in Alaska, likely only Putin and Trump. And from that, a roll of a dice between two men whose relationship is impenetrable, but
could decide the fate of tens of millions of lives in Ukraine and beyond.
Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, Kyiv, Ukraine.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HILL: A warship collided with one of its own Coast Guard vessels in the highly contested South China Sea. The vessels were chasing a Philippine
Coast Guard ship at high speed when all this happened on Monday. It's just the latest incident, underscoring the growing volatility in one of the
world's most strategically vital waterways. Ivan Watson has a closer look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Two Chinese ships colliding at high speed. This crash took place on Monday in a
tense part of the South China Sea. Video released by the Philippine Coast Guard shows a China Coast Guard ship with a water cannon and a grade
Chinese PLA Navy ship, both appearing to pursue a Coast Guard ship from the Philippines.
Chinese sailors hold a bumper at the front of the Coast Guard vessel when it suddenly smashes into the larger Navy ship. Seconds later, no sign of
those sailors on the heavily damaged bow of the Chinese Coast Guard ship. Aggressiveness and incompetence, says one 25-year veteran of the U.S. Navy.
TOM SHUGART, ADJUNCT SENIOR FELLOW, CENTER FOR A NEW AMERICAN SECURITY: There's a saying in the fleet, you know, play stupid games, you win stupid
prizes. And the PLA Navy has been engaging in what certainly the U.S. Navy has characterized as pretty unprofessional operations for quite some time.
WATSON (voice-over): The incident took place near Scarborough Shoal, which both the Philippines and China claim. These contested waters, the scene of
frequent confrontations, which CNN witnessed firsthand last year.
WATSON: That little boat in front is a Philippines resupply boat, and it is currently being pursued by 1, 2, 3, at least four Chinese ships.
WATSON (voice-over): It's a David and Goliath style contest. They blast the boat with water cannons. And it's not just ships from the Philippines and
China that have come in close contact in the South China Sea in recent years.
WATSON: We're getting a closeup look at a Chinese fighter jet and it's been shadowing this U.S. Navy plane now for about 15 minutes.
WATSON (voice-over): CNN has also filmed U.S. and Chinese warships and planes operating in close proximity here.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: U.S. aircraft, U.S. aircraft. This is Chinese navy waship. You are approaching me. Keep safe distance away from me. Over.
WATSON (voice-over): After Monday's Maritime Collision, Chinese State TV issued this statement from the China Coast Guard.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): The China Coast Guard took necessary measures such as tracking, monitoring, blocking, and controlling
to drive away the Philippine vessels. Onsite operations were professional, regulated, and legitimate.
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WATSON (voice-over): No official mention of the crash or possible casualties, exactly the kind of incident experts have long warned could
happen when huge ships play a dangerous game of chicken.
Ivan Watson, CNN, Hong Kong.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HILL: We also want to dig a little bit more now into Monday's major developments when it comes to the trade front for the U.S. and China.
Donald Trump extending that deadline for higher tariffs on Chinese goods, pushing it out another 90 days. The tariffs, which are of course already at
30 percent, will stay in place through now early November.
This move also coming on the heels of a new deal for NVIDIA and AMD, the administration, of course, allowing the companies to sell certain A.I.
chips to China. In exchange, they're going to pay the U.S. government 15 percent of their revenues from those sales.
Elizabeth Economy is a senior fellow at Stanford University's Hoover Institution, and also a former adviser for China in the U.S. Commerce
Department. Elizabeth, it's good to have you with us tonight. So, when we look at where things stand, pushing this out, another 90 days, that was
somewhat expected, we should point out, but is that enough time to work out a deal?
ELIZABETH ECONOMY, SENIOR FELLOW, STANFORD'S HOOVER INSTITUTE: It is enough time to work on a deal depending on what kind of deal you're actually
aiming for. I think what we've heard from the president thus far with his priority on, again, securing large purchases, I think he just mentioned
having China quadruple their purchases of soybeans, for example. I think, you know, having China, you know, ensure that they're not going to stop the
flow of rare earth elements, which we need for our military and technology industries and sort of trade adjacent issues around Fentanyl or our TikTok
deal. I think those things are -- you know, could be packaged within the, you know, next 90 days.
Bigger issues, things like getting China to address sort of fundamental issues around the way that its economic model works, for example, the
export of its overcapacity and batteries and EVs and solar panels, and I think soon to be seeing, you know, legacy semiconductors, I don't think
that kind of issue is going to be able to be addressed.
So, I think, you know, a set of issues, yes, within 90 days, but sort of fundamental issues dealing with long-term strategic challenges that the
United States and other countries confront with China's economy, I don't see those as being sort of dealt with in any meaningful way within the next
three months.
HILL: You know, to that point, you've noted in the past that this really, and I think as you were laying out there, for the U.S. this also part of a
push by the U.S. to frankly change the way that China does business, fundamentally. The reality of that happening, I mean, are you seeing any
signs that there's any sort of movement there? Obviously not within 90 days, as you point out, but even in the long-term, are there any shifts
that you have seen?
ECONOMY: I mean, there's a lot of talk within China about the need to develop a consumer led economy to not rely as much on exports and on, you
know, very significant government investment. But despite all that talk, and this talk has been going on for, you know, seven, eight years, we
really haven't seen any significant moves in that direction. Instead, what you get are, you know, trade-in programs for consumer goods, right? So,
trade in your washing machine and your new washing machine will -- you'll get a 15 percent rebate on that.
You know, those are good short-term -- sort of gives you short-term spikes and in consumption, but they don't deal with the fundamentals of the
Chinese economy. They don't redirect, for example, investment away from, you know, construction or technology industries to the health education,
the social welfare system that would give the Chinese people comfort that they could spend and not have to save for such emergencies.
So, there are a number of sort of steps that the Chinese government could take to signal that they were serious about redirecting the balance in
their economy. But they're not taking those steps.
HILL: They're not taking those. There's been a lot made of this this deal, essentially this agreement, I should say, between NVIDIA and AMD to hand
over 15 percent of their revenues in terms of when selling chips to China to the administration. There are details which the administration had
admitted that still really do need to be worked out in terms of how this could even legally be done. But I was struck by the fact that in the
background to all of this, you have the Chinese government encouraging companies there not to use NVIDIA's H20 chips for government, international
security related work. What could the impact of a deal like this be?
ECONOMY: You know, I think there are many different issues sort of wrapped up in what we've just seen transpire over the past week and a half. I
think, first of all, it's important to recognize that the administration has yet to articulate a clear China strategy that would enable us to
understand whether or not this decision to allow the sale of the H20s to China and the AMD's equivalent chip, which, you know, had been banned just,
you know, four months ago, this administration had decided that these chips should be, you know, placed under export controls, which means that at some
level we believe that selling them to China could turn around and harm our national security.
[18:15:00]
Now, we've -- the president, you know, after meeting with the CEO of NVIDIA, changed his mind and said, it's OK to sell these chips. We don't
understand. Does this reflect, you know, a change in priorities for the administration, away from national security toward, you know, just doing
deals and, you know, the economics of it, or is there some new information with regard to the chips that we should understand that we didn't before?
So, it's hard to understand what the priorities of the administration are.
Then you have the second decision, which you just mentioned, which is to basically tell NVIDIA and AMD that they have to pay a price for the ability
to export to China, which only reinforces the notion that we are somehow selling our national security out.
So, it's a puzzling, you know, set of moves by the administration without any real context. And as you point out, the Chinese government has launched
a campaign, you know, telling their own companies not to rely on the H20 saying that they're not environmentally -- you know, they're not
environmentally good, that they probably have back doors to them. That somehow the -- you know, NVIDIA could, you know, just control these chips
in ways that would cause them to stop working at some point in time.
So, there are -- you know, it's basically putting out a message that doesn't matter now that President Trump has made this gesture that actually
China is bound to determine to develop its own indigenous A.I. chips and it wants its companies to be using, you know, those chips, Huawei chips. So, I
think that's -- you know, for all of this effort and work now, this the sort of scenario that NVIDIA and AMD confront.
HILL: Yes, absolutely. Elizabeth, great to have your insight. Thank you.
Still ahead here, overall inflation in the United States holding steady in July. Some encouraging news there for the Fed. But you may want to hold off
on all the celebrations just yet. We're going to break down a little bit more of what we found in that report.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HILL: Welcome back to "The Brief." Checking the action on Wall Street for this Tuesday. U.S. stocks rallying across the board. The S&P 500 and the
NASDAQ rising to fresh record highs thanks to a market-friendly read on U.S. inflation. Headline, consumer prices rising at a weaker than expected
2.7 percent annual rate in July. So, that's unchanged from June.
[18:20:00]
The numbers though suggest tariffs not really having an immediate large impact on the U.S. inflation, although new wholesale price numbers, which
are out later in the week, could potentially tell a different story. The data could also give the Fed more leeway to cut interest rates at its
upcoming policy meeting in September.
That said, it's the core inflation data, so that strips out food and energy prices, that's getting a lot of attention. It rose above 3 percent last
month. That is its highest rate since February. The White House press secretary hailing these latest numbers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEAVITT: If you look at grocery prices, they fell, energy prices fell, fuel -- oil fell, ship fairs fell, propane fell, butter, margarine eggs, non-
prescription drugs. You go through the list of items that are falling. And then, I would also point to that report this morning showing that small
business optimism has reached a five-month high. So, look, we inherited an economic mess from the previous administration, but this administration is
focused on fixing it every day.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: The White House's positive reaction to today's inflation number standing in sharp contrast to its very negative reaction to the latest jobs
numbers earlier this month. The numbers are put out by the same agency, it's important to note, the Bureau of Labor Statistics.
President Trump called the weak jobs numbers fake, however, and politically rigged, saying they were there to make Republicans bad.
Meantime, the president's new pick to head the Bureau of Labor Statistics, E.J. Antoni, said before his nomination he was in favor of doing away with
those monthly jobs reports because they tend to be revised dramatically. He suggested quarterly data should be released instead to improve accuracy.
Economists Steven Moore, who recommended Antoni for the job says he has since changed his mind and that Antoni will no longer push for a change in
the frequency of the reporting. I spoke with the former Federal Reserve vice chairman Alan Blinder a short time ago who talked about that change
and perhaps that idea, he says tampering with the timing of economic reports is quite simply a terrible idea.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALAN BLINDER, FORMER VICE CHAIR, U.S. FEDERAL RESERVE: I think as soon as those monthly reports go away, if they do, there's going to be tremendous
suspicion about cooking the books. If you start suspending numbers, there's going to be suspicions all over the place, not just from politicians of the
other party, but from market people and foreign investors, and you name it.
HILL: Do you believe we are approaching a point in this country where these historically independent agencies, whether we're talking about the BLS,
whether we're talking about the Federal Reserve, are those days waning or can there still be these independent bodies under President Trump, who, as
we know, does appreciate and in many cases, demand loyalty?
BLINDER: I'm very worried. I wish I could answer a confident yes. I guess I should say yes. If he changes his stripes, and you could decide how likely
you think that is, we can go back quickly to independent statistical agencies. The personnel is all there, the traditions are there, the
software is there, and so on.
But as long as President Trump insists that loyalty to him is the most important qualification for office, including the head of the statistical
agency, not to mention the head of the Fed, that's a whole different story. But as long as he's insisting on that, I think the independence of all of
these statistical agencies, the BLS is only the most obvious one, is in question and in danger.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: Well, the White House today said Antoni was merely floating the idea of suspending monthly jobs reports numbers and said that it was still
committed to releasing those numbers monthly. Global Economic Analyst Rana Foroohar joins me now.
Rana, always good to talk to you to help us put things in perspective here. I was struck by that conversation that I had a short time ago with Alan
Blinder. Now, again, important to note, Stephen Moore now reportedly backtracking on this call to suspend these monthly jobs reports, that's
according to Stephen Moore.
But initially, Rana, he had said, look, these have to be -- the revisions are too great. There's an issue with the data. We should simply go to
quarterly reports. They would be more accurate. He said they'd be better for the Fed. What would a change potentially in data reporting actually
mean?
RANA FOROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMICS ANALYST AND GLOBAL BUSINESS COLUMNIST AND ASSOCIATE EDITOR, FINANCIAL TIMES: Yes, it's a really fascinating
question. You know, I thought Professor Blinder made some really important points about the general politicization of data by this administration.
That's kind of the baseline that we're starting from. That said, you can make an argument for quarterly data I think at this point in the economic
cycle, when there's so much that's uncertain. I mean, even if we didn't have Trump in office, this would be a delicate moment.
We're probably due for a slowdown at some point soon. Now, you've got the president with a lot of volatility, a lot of changes. I don't think this
the moment to be thinking about drawing out to quarterly data from monthly. I think we need to understand what's happening every month. That said, it
doesn't hurt to remind people that, look, these figures do get revised, and that's normal.
[18:25:00]
I think one thing that I find quite problematic really about how the White House is handling this is you can definitely talk about data analysis and
modernizing it and reforming it, but when you're saying one set of figures from the same agency is in -- you know, is wrong, is fake, and then you're
lauding another set just because it favors your politics, that doesn't leave people feeling confident.
HILL: It doesn't at all. And it's so important to remind people, right, that both these sets of numbers, so we're talking about the inflation
numbers and also the jobs reports are coming from the same place. When you talk about the possibility of maybe changing the way things are done, the
revision. So, we know that every month, I think anybody who covers it or who relies on them is familiar with the fact that when you get the most
recent jobs numbers, you're also going to get the revisions. But I don't know that that is as widely known. Is that also part of the issue here?
FOROOHAR: You know, I think it is. There is a conversation that, you know, economic wonks like me have been wanting to have for a long time about how
we measure things in our economy. Truth be told, since we came up with these models, a lot has changed in the economy. You know, we started out
the BLS measuring a lot of factory data, industrial data. We're living in a digital economy. We're living in gig economy. There's just a lot that could
be modernized and rethunk really for the 21st century.
Would I like this administration in charge of it? Not really given the track record of politicizing the Fed, firing people when they don't like
the data, lauding things from the same agency. It doesn't make me feel safe about it. That said, yes, I think looking at how and what is measured is
always a good thing.
HILL: We also -- when I was speaking with Alan Blinder, we were also talking about the -- you know, today's inflation report. And what we have
been hearing for months, frankly, since April 2nd about these tariffs and when they're going to kick in and how bad it's going to be. And yet, we are
not at that point yet. And he said, you know, we still have probably -- he wasn't going to put a date on it, but there are still months to come
because of the way likely businesses have shored up in terms of inventory.
Is there an issue as well, with having talked so much about that, of this turning into a boy who cried wolf situation?
FOROOHAR: It is also a great question. I'll be honest, there are many of us that thought we were going to see a little more inflationary effect before
now. I think a couple of things account for what's happened. Let's remember that we've heard a tremendous amount of talk since April, but not all of
that talk has actually landed in reality. Tariffs have been on, they've been off, they've changed. They're now hitting, but there's always a lag
time between when things are shipped from a country, when they arrive in U.S. ports, when they go to shelves, how much inventory, different
companies or industries have in different parts of the country.
So, this a slow-moving cycle, and I think you've made a really good point that we've heard a lot about it. People have a little bit of a fatigue. And
so, that creates an opportunity for the president to say, hey, you know, look, this really isn't having much of an effect yet, which is true in the
data. Whether that will be true in another quarter, two quarters from now, if nothing changes, I'm not so sure.
HILL: Yes. Well, we will be watching and I have a feeling you and I will be discussing it. Always a pleasure. Thank you, Rana.
FOSTER: Thank you.
HILL: Well, the White House today confirming President Trump is considering filing a lawsuit against Fed Chair Jerome Powell because of Powell's
handling of the renovation at the Fed's D.C. offices. Now, this on top of Mr. Trump's attacks against Powell for not lowering interest rates sooner.
On social media, the President posting Powell has done a, quote, "horrible and grossly incompetent job in managing the construction." He says
renovations that have cost 3 billion should have cost a mere $50 million. The Fed defending its renovation, noting that the renovation of two of its
buildings will cost $2.5 billion, a lower number than the Trump figure.
Still to come here, heat waves fueling wildfires across Europe and the impact now on both residents and the summer tourism season.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:30:00]
HILL: Welcome back to "The Brief." I'm Erica Hill. Here are the international headlines we're watching today.
The White House calls President Trump's upcoming meeting with Russian leader Vladimir Putin a, quote, "listening exercise." Press Secretary
Karoline Leavitt says the summit will give President Trump an indication as to where Russia's war on Ukraine is headed. Those talks scheduled to be
held in Anchorage, Alaska on Friday. Ukraine will not be represented.
The body of Senator Miguel Uribe lying in state in Columbia's Congress. The senator and presidential hopeful was shot in the head during a campaign
rally two months ago. He died Monday at a Bogota hospital. Police have arrested six people in connection with the attack, including a 15-year-old
hitman. It is unclear who was behind it. A public funeral service is set for Wednesday.
South Korea's former first lady arrested. This as investigators seek to charge the wife of former President Yoon Suk Yeol over suspected crimes,
including bribery and stock manipulation. It is the first time a South Korean presidential couple has been simultaneously arrested over criminal
allegations. Yoon was arrested last month over his imposition of martial law in December.
Dozens of countries are calling for urgent action in Gaza, demanding Israel allow more aid into the enclave and allow humanitarian groups to operate
there. Their joint statements as the suffering has reached unimaginable levels as more people die of hunger. And the humanitarian crisis could get
even worse if Israel moves to take over Gaza City in an effort to defeat Hamas.
There were protests outside the IDF headquarters earlier. Israeli Air Force reservists and retired pilots calling for an end to the war in Gaza. Oren
Liebermann has the latest now from Jerusalem.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN JERUSALEM BUREAU CHIEF: We're seeing a big push now from Europe and from countries in the region here, not only to see if it's
possible to avert Israel's planned occupation and takeover of Gaza City, but also to see if it's possible to get ceasefire negotiations back on
track.
According to three Hamas sources, a Hamas delegation has headed to Cairo to begin talks with Egyptian officials about negotiations towards a ceasefire.
The question, where will this lead? We also know that U.S. Envoy, Steve Witkoff, met with the Qataris in Spain over the course of the weekend. The
problem is there isn't concrete movement on this, as we saw towards the end of July before that ceasefire effort fell apart after the U.S. and Israel
withdrew, blaming Hamas of acting in bad faith.
That had a tremendous amount of optimism around it, at least before it collapsed. We don't have that same sense that there is positive movement in
the right direction to get a ceasefire on track. But clearly, you see the efforts are there.
[18:35:00]
And when it comes to Israel's plan, takeover of Gaza City, the criticism has been fierce with both countries and humanitarian organizations warning
it would only lead to a worsening humanitarian catastrophe inside Gaza, and of course, specifically Gaza City.
In a public letter, 24 foreign ministers, mostly from Europe, but also from Japan and Australia, as well as the European Union wrote a letter saying,
famine is unfolding before our eyes. They call on Israel to not only let in more aid, but also to allow in more humanitarian aid organizations to try
to get aid to as many people who need it as possible. In the letter they write, all crossings and routes must be used to allow a flood of aid into
Gaza, including food, nutrition, supplies, shelter, fuel, clean water, medicine, and medical equipment.
According to the Palestinian Ministry of Health, five more people died of malnutrition on Tuesday. That brings the total to 227 in the besiege
territory who have died of malnutrition, including according to the ministry, 103 children.
Oren Liebermann, CNN, in Jerusalem.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HILL: Wildfires fueled by heat waves across Europe are forcing visitors to change their travel plans. Those fast-moving fires sweeping across
residential areas near Madrid on Monday. Emergency teams working around the clock battling those blazes. CNN's Barbie Latza Nadeau has more now and how
the fires are impacting, of course, residents and also the summer tourism season.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BARBIE LATZA NADEAU, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Tourists forced to flee one of southern Spain's most popular beaches after a wildfire, driven
by strong winds, swept through the resort town of Tarifa, forcing local authorities to evacuate nearly 2,000 tourists and residents. Just one part
of what's becoming an apocalyptic European summer. Official data shows that Europe has seen more than twice as many fires as it saw on average by mid-
August in recent decades.
Many are set on purpose, some sparked accidentally and others fueled by extreme heat caused by manmade climate change. There were similar scenes on
the Italian island of Sardinia last month, where beachgoers had to be evacuated by boat after wildfires blocked other escape routes.
Disaster also struck the Italian tourist hotspot of Pompeii after forest fires quickly burned up the flanks of the Mount Vesuvius volcano, where
authorities had to close trails to keep hikers safe.
Even in Scotland, not typically known for its hot summers, a brush fire spread across a popular tourist attraction in dormant volcano, Arthur's
Seat. In Spain, where fires led to the death of one man near Madrid, the costs are almost impossible to measure.
JOSE ANGEL RODRIGUEZ, OREILAN LOCAL COUNCIL PRESIDENT (through translator): The damage is incalculable at this point, whether it's to the chestnut
trees or the loss of tourism.
NADEAU (voice-over): And as wildfires continue to threaten European tourism, more travelers are being forced to rethink plans, cancel flights
and take extra precautions. Like this tourist in Tarifa who wore a face mask to protect herself from the thick smoke.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): It's a genuine shame, everything that's happened. As I had to evacuate practically everything. I was so
afraid of so many chalets, houses, shops were burnt. It's such a shame.
NADEAU (voice-over): A sunburn used to be one of the biggest concerns most holiday makers had. Now, they face a far more burning threat.
Barbie Latza Nadeau, CNN, Rome.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HILL: Still to come here, the U.S. Supreme Court could hear a challenge to same-sex marriage. Who's behind that appeal and why the court may take it
up. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:40:00]
HILL: The U.S. Supreme Court could hear an appeal to overturn same-sex marriage 10 years after it became the law of the land. The court has been
officially asked to overturn Obergefell versus Hodges. So, who's behind all of this? Kim Davis, the name may sound familiar. She's a former Kentucky
County clerk who made headlines for refusing to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples in 2015.
Now, the Supreme Court could still decide not to take up the case. Same-sex marriage was a hot button topic in American politics 25 years ago. Today
the poll show, close to 70 percent of Americans approve of it.
Joining me to discuss CNN Supreme Court Analyst Steve Vladeck. Steve, always good to have you with us. So, I guess the first question would be,
do you think there are enough of the justices interested in revisiting this case?
STEVE VLADECK, CNN SUPREME COURT ANALYST, PROFESSOR, GEORGETOWN UNIVERSITY LAW CENTER AND EDITOR, "ONE FIRST" SUPREME COURT NEWSLETTER: So, Erica, I
think it's the right question, and my best guess is maybe, but the key for everyone to understand is even if there were, this a singularly bad vehicle
through which to revisit Obergefell because the question in the lower courts was not about whether a particular marriage license was or was not
lawful, the question was whether Kim Davis, the county clerk, had violated the rights of this same-sex couple in Kentucky as the law was established
in Obergefell itself.
So, even if there were, Erica, four or five votes on the court to take this up, I don't think this the case in which the justices would want to do it.
HILL: So, then walk us through. What is the legal argument here to take it up again? And I think that'll help us understand perhaps why maybe they
wouldn't be up for it.
VLADECK: Sure. I mean, so, you know, the question is some state or some county or some local official behaving in a way that is basically refusing
to take Obergefell seriously. Are they denying marriage licenses? Are they trying to reenact a ban on same-sex marriage? The likes of which the
Supreme Court struck down back in 2015.
And, Erica, we haven't seen that yet. The case that's getting in the headlines right now, the Davis case, you know, is the continuing fallout
from the refusal of a single county clerk in Kentucky to issue marriage licenses nearly a decade ago. The lawsuit before the Supreme Court is not
actually a married couple challenging their -- or trying to enforce their marriage, it's rather suing Davis personally for damages for refusing to
provide the license that a majority of the Supreme Court said she had to provide.
So, Erica, even if you could count to four justices to grant certiorari or five justices to even reconsider Obergefell on the merits and to
potentially uphold a same-sex marriage ban, this really isn't the case to do it. I think part of what we're seeing is an effort maybe to move the
Overton window so that it's in the conversation, it's in the public discourse, so that people like you and I are sitting here talking about
whether the Supreme Court might actually revisit this massively important 10-year-old ruling.
HILL: So, you kind of read my mind on that one, because that's my next question, because I think if folks think about the, frankly, decades long
effort, right, that led to Roe v. Wade being overturned, it is these small movements in different courts, right? So, I'm curious, are you seeing
evidence of that happening across the country when it comes to same-sex marriage?
VLADECK: Not nearly the way that we saw it in the years leading up to Dobbs. I mean, so, you know, there are a lot of folks saying that when
people like me pour cold water on the idea that the Supreme Court's about to take this up, well, you know, look what happened with Roe and Dobbs. But
Erica, that was very different.
In Dobbs, you had states, like Mississippi, passing new laws that were directly designed to challenge the Roe decision, you had a meaningful
change in the composition of the Supreme Court that opened the door to the possibility that the justices would revisit the Roe decision. And you had,
Erica, not the same kind of broad public support for abortion that we see in the quite the same numbers for same-sex marriage.
[18:45:00]
So, you know, it seems to me that some of this might be wishful thinking on the part of the anti-same-sex marriage crowd, that some of this might be a
bit of doom scrolling on the part of the pro same-sex marriage crowd. But even for folks who are cynical about the current Supreme Court and, you
know, there are days when I count myself among them, there are lots of reasons why in general I think the court would be wary at this particular
moment of jumping back into the question of same-sex marriage and why the Kim Davis case specifically is a poor vehicle through which to do so.
Part of why I think this going to end pretty quietly sometime in October or November with the Supreme Court denying Kim Davis' cert petition.
HILL: We'll be watching for that. Steve, always good to talk to you. Thank you.
VLADECK: Thank you.
HILL: Still ahead here, one of the world's biggest pop stars at making a surprise announcement, Taylor Swift. Yes. There are new details and we're
going to share them with you, but you're just going to have to wait until after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HILL: The Empire State Building here in New York City lit up in orange last night as part of a special announcement. Taylor Swift is firmly in a new
era, it turns out. At 12:12 a.m. on the 12th of August, TS12 finally got a name, "The Life of a Showgirl." Taylor revealing her latest album as part
of a tease for the New Heights podcast, which of course is the work of her boyfriend, Travis Kelce, and his brother Jason.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TAYLOR SWIFT, SINGER: So, I wanted to show you something.
JASON KELCE, HOST, NEW HEIGHTS PODCAST: OK. What do we got?
SWIFT: We got --
KELCE: A briefcase.
SWIFT: Yes.
KELCE: Mint green with TS on it.
SWIFT: Yes.
KELCE: What's in it?
SWIFT: This my brand-new album, "The Life of a Showgirl."
KELCE: TS12.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HILL: Jason Kelce not the only one apparently, with that reaction. Joining me now, entertainment journalist Segun Oduolowu. It's great to have you
with us. So, this certainly took over the interwebs for a little bit and a lot of anticipation here. What do we actually know about "The Life of a
Showgirl"?
SEGUN ODUOLOWU, ENTERTAINMENT JOURNALIST: Well, we know that these five albums in like five years. This a Rihanna type run. This coming off of a
record-breaking world tour, Erica. Like, let's just talk numbers when we talk Taylor. Typically, social media engagement is around 0.5 to 0.69
percent. So, if you have a million followers, 0.5 of those followers typically respond. When Taylor drops something, when Taylor talks like E.F.
Hutton, people listen. Her engagement is around 59 percent, right?
[18:50:00]
So, of her 200 plus million followers, when she says something about a hundred million people get activated. And when she's going to go on
tomorrow and talk about the dropping of this album, the internet is going to go into a collective, ah, moment. That's actually the official thing,
ah. That's exactly what they're going to do.
HILL: Yes. It's perfect. I noticed it already among my nieces on social media. And look, I am a Swifty. I am a Taylor Swift fan. However, I don't
dig deep into the Easter eggs here. And so, I'm curious if you have any insight. Is there something we should know about the color orange?
ODUOLOWU: Well, she -- all of her albums have kind of had this color coded, like, release. And orange is the new one, right? She's -- it's like she's -
- I mean, well, orange is the new black I always feel so. But yes, she's kind of doing everything with this color coded --
HILL: Or she loves the Netherlands. Who knows?
ODUOLOWU: Or she loves the Netherlands and tulips and that's where we're going. But the Empire State Building is getting in on the action. And what
people should find really unique are those Easter eggs. How rabid her fan base is to try and discover, sift, look for clues like a Ouija board
whenever it comes to Taylor doing something or doing anything. And this just another example of -- again, she drops a little bit here, a little
hint there. No one knows exactly when the album is coming out. It could come out tomorrow, it could come out Friday, it could come out a month from
now. No one's really sure, but the appetite is sharpened to the point it could cut diamonds. And again, diamonds is appropriate because that's kind
of what Taylor's album sell.
HILL: Yes, absolutely. I also love the fact, right, that you have everything happening at once here. So, it's the, oh, I've got a new album.
Look at this, and I'm announcing it sitting next to my boyfriend on his podcast with his brother. I mean, it's tough to ignore that moment.
ODUOLOWU: No, it's a beautiful moment because, one, it helps legitimize this relationship that many are speculating, is it real? Is this another --
you know, is this another celebrity kind of hoax? What's going on here? No one really knows. But in -- but by doing it this way, she controls the
narrative. She and Travis and his brother Jason, they control the narrative. She is a master at doing that. She tells the story she wants to
tell. She stands by her man. Her man stands beside her. And we've already seen millions of uptakes in New Heights podcast, in subscriptions, in
anticipation of what she's going to say.
It's a brilliant marketing move where you got to go to the -- you got to go to this podcast to find all about it. Again, brilliant strategy from a
brilliant strategist.
HILL: Yes. I think it's such a great point, and that's one of the things that's always fascinated me about her in the way that she handles
everything in her life seemingly, and that it is so controlled. And she -- you know, she puts out the message that she wants to put out when she wants
to put it out. And it's remarkable, especially in this era. Pun not intended, but there you go. In the era that we live in when it is so
difficult to control information.
ODUOLOWU: It is difficult to control information. She has like Mossad level, CIA level security and secretive when it comes to how she moves. But
what I would say in this instance is this a very strong declaration I think for women everywhere when it comes to your relationship.
Like there -- like I said, controlling the narrative. She is releasing it on Travis' -- and Travis' podcast. This helps him. She could go and do this
anywhere and the needle will move. By doing it this way, she shows that they're united. And I think in this era where relationships are hard to
maintain, they're hard to foster, we speculate wildly on beyond, she is doing this in such a very calculated but also compassionate way to say
like, this our thing. I'm going to do it on your platform. It's going to help you, it's going to help me, and it's going to help us together.
And I hope more young girls see that you can do this. You can control your narrative. You don't have to, you know, shake dance or do whatever you
think you have to do for likes. Tell your story the way you want to tell it. She's famous for masters -- releasing her records. So, you can call her
a control freak, I'll call her a really savvy businesswoman that shows why she's a billion-dollar industry all to herself.
HILL: Yes, I'm with you. I will. I am firmly in your camp there. Great to see you. Thank you, Segun.
ODUOLOWU: Thank you, Erica.
HILL: And check this out, while we're talking music. Billboard reporting the song "Golden" has now clinched the number one spot on its Hot 100
Chart.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HILL: So, why is this such a big deal you're asking? It's because the popular hit by Hunters is featured in the animated film K-Pop "Demon
Hunters," which calling it popular would probably be one of the largest understatements of the year. Billboard says it's the ninth song to be
associated with K-Pop to take that top spot on the Hot 100.
[18:55:00]
It's the first by female led singers and the -- also they're sort of animated as part of a series and a made-up band. So, there's that.
Destiny's Child, by the way, was the last all women collective of three or more members to top the hot 100 that happen. 24 years ago.
In today's Good Brief, the iconic photography giant Kodak warning investors it may not survive much longer. The 133-year-old company says it just
doesn't have enough money to pay $500 million in upcoming debt. The first Kodak camera was sold in 1888 for $25, and it was designed to make
photography, of course, more widely accessible.
At one point in the '70s, Kodak was responsible for some 85 percent of camera sales in the United States. It introduced the first digital camera
in 1975. Unfortunately, though Kodak failed to capitalize on the rise of digital technology, it does still manufacture films and chemicals for
businesses, including the movie industry.
Thanks so much for your company this hour. I'm Erica Hill joining you from New York. You've been watching "The Brief." Stay with CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:00:00]
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