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The Brief with Jim Sciutto
CNN Team Witnesses Cluster Munitions Exploding Over Tel Aviv; Rubio: U.S. Can Achieve War Objectives Without Ground Troops; Israel Vows To Intensify Attacks On Iran; Settler Attacks Against Palestinians Surging In West Bank; Tiger Woods Arrested On DUI Charge; Wall Street Sell-Off; Israel Strikes Iranian Nuclear Targets; TSA Agents Could Receive Paychecks Next Week; House GOP Rejects DHS Funding Bill. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired March 27, 2026 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:00]
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR, "THE BRIEF": Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us from all around the world. I'm Jim Sciutto, joining you live
once again from Tel Aviv. You're watching "The Brief."
Just ahead this hour, Secretary of State Marco Rubio says the U.S. can achieve its objectives in Iran without ground troops, as more service
members do head to this region. Tiger Woods is now jailed on a DUI charge after a car accident in Florida, and House Republicans reject a Senate
compromise that would have funded Homeland Security and paid all those airport security workers.
Well, in the midst of all this talk of negotiations, just a short time ago we captured this video of a cluster Iranian missile coming down in the sky
over Tel Aviv, each of those points of light a submunition released from an Iranian missile. This happened just minutes after the Israeli military
warned it had identified inbound missiles. Unfortunately, some of those munitions struck. They have killed at least one person, injured several
others.
Secretary of State Marco Rubio said earlier in the day that the U.S. is working to prevent attacks like this one. He said that this war could be
won without sending in U.S. ground forces.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARCO RUBIO, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: This is not going to be a prolonged conflict. The objectives I've outlined to you, again, I repeat them,
because I see these reports as like, the U.S. is not clear on what objectives are. We've been as clear as you can possibly be from the very
first night of what the objectives of this mission are. We're going to destroy their factories that make missiles and rockets and drones. We're
going to destroy their Navy. We're going to destroy their Air Force. And we are going to significantly destroy their missile launchers so they can
never hide behind these things to get a nuclear weapon.
We can achieve -- we are achieving all those objectives. We are ahead of schedule on most of them. And we can achieve them without any ground
troops, without any.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: The thing is, the president has also said he would like to see regime change in Iran. He's not talking about that anymore. Rubio said the
White House has not yet received a response from Iran to the U.S. 15-point peace proposal. Here's what President Trump had to say.
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: They are being decimated. They are talking. We are talking now. They want to make a deal. Very simply, our military is
the greatest in the world by far. Iran is being decimated.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: The fact is, Iran is still able to fire missiles, as we experienced here ourselves just in the last hour. Iran's foreign minister
condemned attacks on Friday by Israel. He said Israel has hit two of Iran's largest steel factories, a power plant and civilian nuclear sites, among
other infrastructure. Israel claims it acted in coordination with the U.S. The attack contradicts the president's extended deadline for diplomacy.
Iran will exact a heavy price for Israeli crimes. And perhaps those missiles we saw were part of that price.
Iran's Red Crescent says that nearly 2,000 Iranians have been killed since the start of this war four weeks ago. Here in Israel, the defense minister
said its attacks on Iran will escalate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ISRAEL KATZ, ISRAELI DEFENSE MINISTER (through translator): Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and I warned the Iranian terror regime to stop the
missile fire directed at Israel's civilian population. Despite the warnings, the firing has continued, and, therefore, IDF strikes in Iran
will escalate and expand to additional targets in areas that assist the regime in building and operating weapons used against Israeli civilians.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Well, at least one Israeli civilian is dead from Iranian attacks tonight. Joining me now, former U.S. Ambassador to Israel Daniel Shapiro.
He is now a distinguished fellow at the Atlantic Council.
First, if I can, I wonder how you interpret a day of escalating attacks, Israeli attacks on Iran, including energy infrastructure and these missiles
we've seen tonight, cluster munitions which are designed, we should note, specifically to hit civilian targets. Does that look to you like an
improving environment for diplomacy?
DANIEL SHAPIRO, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO ISRAEL AND DISTINGUISHED FELLOW, ATLANTIC COUNCIL: Jim, it looks like this war is continuing and will
continue for at least two to three, maybe four more weeks. You know, the president has twice now issued deadlines and then extended them. It seems
to be very much driven by his attempt to kind of affect the market price of oil and the stock market oil prices continue to go up $114 a day. Stock
market continue to go down.
[18:05:00]
But with these types of attacks continuing and really no overlap whatsoever between the U.S. positions that have been offered to Iran or demanded of
Iran and the Iranian positions, equally unrealistic, that have been articulated in return, suggests that there's no -- we're not close at all
to any kind of off ramp.
And, you know, it looks a lot like the situation in February before the war began. Then President Trump had built up a very significant force in the
Middle East. You can't keep a force like that out there very long without using it. And then negotiations were ongoing, but he cut them off. The war
began on February 28th.
Right now, he has sent two Marine Expeditionary Units and the 82nd Airborne Unit from the Army into the region with the possibility they could be used
to conduct various types of ground operations that have been suggested on islands or on the mainland. And if the negotiations falter, it's not at all
-- it wouldn't surprise me at all if he pulls that trigger just as he did in February.
SCIUTTO: Do you believe the secretary of state, when he says that the U.S. can achieve all of its objectives without ground forces, or do you believe
that's still under serious consideration by the Trump administration?
SHAPIRO: You know, the military objectives that he outlined, the United States and Israel together, have made very significant progress on. Iran's
capabilities, missile, drone, air defense, naval, have definitely been significantly weakened. And perhaps more, much more weakening can be done.
Not sure they can be completely eliminated.
The problem is there's the still-hanging-out-there question of is this really intended to produce a regime change. I think on the Israeli side
that is an objective. I think the U.S. has not established that as a clear objective, but the president sometimes alludes to it.
But there's another objective that has now of necessity presented itself, and that's to ensure free shipping through the Strait of Hormuz. That was
not the case in the first week or two of the war before the Iranians closed it. Now, we have to establish that free shipping will be allowed. That's
the key to global economic prosperity and stability. And unless there is an agreement that may require additional force, that's why I think they are
considering ground troops.
SCIUTTO: Yes. Listen, I mean, it's really two objectives that haven't been achieved. The new one, which is now that Iran effectively controls the
Strait. But the other is that enriched uranium. And when I speak to Israeli officials, they tell me they will not consider this war won until that
uranium is taken care of, which almost certainly would require some sort of ground operation. Do you see either the U.S. or Israel willing to walk away
from this war without achieving that goal as well?
SHAPIRO: Obviously, it could be achieved through diplomacy if Iran were willing to relinquish that highly enriched uranium. But the alternative is
a very risky special operations forces operation by U.S. and/or Israeli forces.
It's clear that that was one of the motivating factors for the war last June to make sure that nuclear program was degraded and now part of the
reason for this war. But again, if the goal is in the next 10 days with very limited direct -- no direct, only indirect messages being passed
between the U.S. administration and an Iranian regime that is fighting for its very survival.
I think it's unlikely we're going to get total satisfaction on sending out the enriched uranium, agreeing to open the Strait of Hormuz, and relinquish
any remaining ballistic missile or drone capability. Iran will probably fight until they're even further destroyed. But that means even as the
weaker party, they're able to continue to cause damage in the Gulf, where they've struck many energy targets in the Strait of Hormuz, where they're
blocking shipping and causing the global economic pressure and by holding at risk the entire region if they can hold on to their highly enriched
uranium.
So, I don't think this is going to end easily or quickly or with a clean sweep of all U.S. objectives achieved through diplomacy.
SCIUTTO: Yes. I mean, the distance on some of those core issues between the Iranian and U.S. proposals are still quite wide at this point. Ambassador
Daniel Shapiro, we do appreciate your joining.
SHAPIRO: Thank you, Jim.
SCIUTTO: The Israeli military's chief of staff says that he is raising 10 red flags before the IDF, quote, "collapses." He's warning that the
military here is under severe strain from personnel shortages as it operates on multiple fronts now, including not just Iran or Lebanon, but
also the occupied West Bank, where settler attacks on Palestinians are surging.
My colleague Jeremy Diamond and his team just visited the West Bank. A warning, his report contains disturbing images.
[18:10:00]
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): 75-year-old Abdallah Daraghmeh (ph) moans in pain. His breathing is labored, his face
bloodied, bruised and swollen. Bones broken. His family and multiple eyewitnesses say Israeli settlers stormed into his home in the middle of
the night and beat him to a pulp.
In his West Bank village of Tayasir, those same settlers have now established an outpost, considered illegal even under Israeli law. Soldiers
standing idly by, until something else draws their attention. Producer Abeer Salman (ph) identifies us as journalists, before translating the
soldiers' commands.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sit down, sit down, sit down.
DIAMOND: So, the soldiers just immediately came up and started pointing their weapons directly at us, telling everyone to sit down immediately.
Obviously, we're not posing any threat here.
DIAMOND (voice-over): The commander comes straight for our camera, and within seconds --
DIAMOND (through translator): What are you doing? We're journalists. What are you doing?
DIAMOND (voice-over): -- a soldier has just put photojournalist Cyril Theophilus in a chokehold, forcing him to the ground.
DIAMOND: Don't touch him like that. Don't touch him like that. Give me my phone.
DIAMOND (voice-over): The soldier who assaulted Theophilus continues to demand he turn off his camera, before another smacks my phone.
DIAMOND: So, as you can see, what we have seen happen in the last 24 hours is that settlers came to this area, they settled that hilltop, and now you
have a lot of soldiers coming to this area with the Palestinians in this area. They're on top of the home of Imad (ph), the man that we were just
speaking to, and we're seeing the soldiers treat the Palestinians in the area as a threat, when really what started this problem was obviously the
settlers who came in the middle of the night and took over land that's not theirs.
DIAMOND (voice-over): The Palestinians here are detained and questioned. Soldiers detain us, too, and walk us back to our vehicle. They say they're
trying to establish order between settlers and Palestinians. But as the cameras keep rolling, it becomes clear these soldiers are here in service
of the settler movement.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We are here because this is our place.
DIAMOND (through translator): Is this your village?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): This land is ours.
DIAMOND (through translator): So, all the West Bank is yours?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Of course. And not just for the soldiers, for the Jews.
DIAMOND (voice-over): They also say it's personal. These soldiers tell me they were friends with the 18-year-old settler who authorities say was
killed last week by a Palestinian driver. Palestinians dispute that account.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): If you had a brother and they kill him, what would you have done?
DIAMOND (through translator): So, that's revenge?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Revenge.
DIAMOND (through translator): You're talking about revenge. But you're a soldier, is this normal to carry our revenge? As a soldier?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Listen, at the end of the day, if the state doesn't address what they did those who murders the youth the
settler last week, remember? What do you expect us to do?
DIAMOND: So, we're currently detained by the Israeli military. They've told us to sit in our cars and wait. As you can see, one of them is right here.
And what's really quite striking is the fact that so many of these soldiers are clearly manifesting the same kind of settler ideology.
DIAMOND (voice-over): This soldier, Meir (ph), makes that crystal clear.
DIAMOND (through translator): They don't have permission to be here even under Israeli law. Even under Israeli law, this isn't a settlement. This
isn't a legal settlement.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): That's right. But it will be a legal settlement.
DIAMOND (through translator): It will be. How do you know this?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Slowly, slowly.
DIAMOND (through translator): Thanks to your help, right?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Of course. I help my people.
DIAMOND (voice-over): Meir (ph) is describing the settler playbook and the role Israeli soldiers often play in propping it up. The Israeli military
did not respond to CNN's questions about soldiers' conduct in the West Bank, including our detention. Amid the war with Iran, those efforts are
intensifying, with at least four outposts established this week alone. Land often taken with the blood of Palestinians.
I didn't expect this, Abdullah's (ph) son says. This is not normal.
DIAMOND: So, just as we're visiting one patient in the hospital from a settler attack, we've just learned that there have been multiple other
settler attacks in the area, and one of the patients is at this same hospital.
DIAMOND (voice-over): Twenty-nine-year-old Saqr Salman (ph) says a scuffle broke out after settlers came onto his land, and one of them clubbed him in
the back of the head. When soldiers arrived, he says they arrested him and beat him with the butt of their guns. The soldiers are a protection for the
settlers.
I would tell the soldiers that they stole my sheep, and they would say that I'm lying and that I'm the one who attacked them, and every time I tried to
say something, the soldiers would beat me. Settlers, he says, always go free.
Jeremy Diamond, CNN, Tayasir, the West Bank.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[18:15:00]
SCIUTTO: An important story from another front of Israel's war. Well, there's news we're following back from the U.S. as well.
The golfer, Tiger Woods, is now in jail. He was arrested on suspicion of driving under the influence in Florida. The crash on Jupiter Island near
his home left his SUV overturned on its side. Woods, who is 50 years old, you can see the vehicle there, was unhurt. According to the county sheriff,
he was overtaking another vehicle and clipped it. The sheriff spoke to reporters a short time ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHERIFF JOHN BUDENSIEK, MARTIN COUNTY, FLORIDA: They did do some in-depth roadside tests, and when it was determined he was placed under arrest and
taken to the Martin County Jail. At the Martin County Jail, and even on scene, we really weren't suspicious of alcohol being involved in this case,
and that proved to be true at the jail.
So, Mr. Woods did a breathalyzer test, blew triple zeros, but when it came time for us to ask for a urinalysis test, he refused. And, so he's been
charged with DUI, with property damage, and refusal to submit to a lawful test.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Patrick Snell is joining me now. So, he's arrested for DUI. They say it wasn't alcohol. Have they specified then what they believe it is?
PATRICK SNELL, CNN WORLD SPORT: Well, this is what we're tracking at this time, Jim, but let me just say this is not the first time that the American
golf great is at the center of, really, let's be honest, unwanted headlines. 15-time major winner, second only to the great Jack Nicklaus,
who won 18 golf majors.
But I think important to point out is that this is not the first time that the is really important to point out that, thankfully, nobody, nobody, as
we understand it, nobody at all injured in this incident, and that's really very important to point out.
So, to recap then, as you say, Jim, Woods arrested on suspicion of DUI, and basically, as you said there off the top, Woods driving, the vehicle that
Woods was driving at the time was a Land Rover, and clipping allegedly a pickup truck, which at the time was pulling a small trailer, police telling
reporters that the collision caused Woods's Land Rover to roll onto its side, and again, and this is what caught my eye, again, according to
police, Woods crawling out of the passenger door of the vehicle that he had allegedly been driving.
So, reaction, of course, has been coming in, as I said, Woods not for the first time at the center of headlines that he could well do without this,
as he's preparing potentially to make a comeback to the sport after not playing anywhere competitively since the 2024 Open Championship in
Scotland. Let's hear now from U.S. President Donald Trump, who has a friendship with Tiger Woods, the U.S. President speaking a short while ago.
Let's take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: I feel so badly. He's got some difficulty. There was an accident, and that's all I know. Very close friend of mine.
He's an amazing person, amazing man, but some difficulty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SNELL: U.S. President Donald Trump. Now, Jim, I recall reporting on the 2021 car crash which Woods was involved in. That was in Los Angeles,
Southern California, and following that, he had a whole series of injuries to his ankle, to his legs as well. This past year, he ruptured his
Achilles, and late last year, he had a seventh back surgery. It's just been a whole litany of injuries. He even had spinal fusion surgery earlier in
his career.
Across the last five seasons, he's played only 11 events, but this is what gave his fans hope recently. This past week, on Tuesday evening, he played
in the indoor formatted competition, the TGL, Tomorrow's Golf League, and Woods did play in that. Struck some nice balls, long drives of 300 yards
off the tee, and afterwards saying he was trying, trying to potentially play in the Masters, which begins on April the 9th.
He's a five-time champion. They said he's going to be at Augusta regardless, with the champions dinner in play there. But you have to think
now that this is going to have an impact on any potential return to the sport at the Masters. We shall see. Back to you for now.
SCIUTTO: Well, beyond the sport here, though, this is not his first car accident. It's also not his first DUI, though, correct?
SNELL: That is correct, yes. There are incidents that you go back to. Certainly in 2009, you're quite right to point this out, Jim. Woods was
cited for careless driving, and 2017, arrested for a DUI as well. As I said, it's exactly what I said. It's this whole series of, you know, Tiger
Woods, right? One of the greatest players to play the sport. For many people, absolutely the greatest.
[18:20:00]
Tiger Woods, right? One of the greatest players to play the sport. For many people, absolutely the greatest. He's 50 years of age now, he'll turn 51
later on this year. He is a role model to so many, to so many people worldwide. It's something he could well do without, Jim, no question about
that.
SCIUTTO: Yes. Patrick Snell, thanks so much. We're still ahead this hour. Another big sell-off on Wall Street today. The major averages hitting new
lows for the year. Oil spiking again as well. The latest on the markets and the impact on the economy more broadly, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCIUTTO: Welcome back in today's Business Breakout. Another dismal day on Wall Street. The major averages tumbled again with the Dow joining the
Nasdaq now in correction territory. That is a 10 percent drop from its most recent high. The NASDAQ finished the day down more than 2 percent.
Stocks fell, another surge in oil prices. Brent Crude rose more than 4 percent to more than $112 a barrel. U.S. crude spiked almost 5.5 percent.
Crude prices are now close to their highest levels of the Iran war so far. All this as the average price for a gallon of gas in the U.S. is closing in
on $4, the price at the pump helping contribute to a 6 percent drop in U.S. consumer sentiment this month alone. As inflation fears grow, the futures
market sees a growing risk that the Fed's next big policy move will be to raise interest rates.
Joining me now, Rana Foroohar. Rana, it's good to have you. It strikes me that the markets --
RANA FOROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMICS ANALYST: Thank you.
SCIUTTO: -- are seeing longer-term pain from this war now.
FOROOHAR: Yes, for sure. I mean, many of us were skeptical that this was going to be a quick in and out. I mean, even if you did see this war ending
in the next few weeks, which I frankly don't think is going to be the case, there's been so much disruption at this point that I think oil is going to
stay higher than it has been for some time for longer. And it's coming at a time when there were already a lot of headwinds to the economy. You already
saw labor markets softening. You've seen consumer spending be a little bit weaker. You know, companies are starting to think about what they can do to
keep margins up. They do not want the smell of stagflation, which is what we've got right now. And that's going to make them very reluctant to hire.
And I think it's going to have a snowball effect.
[18:25:00]
SCIUTTO: A lot of market watchers have noticed, and this is not difficult to do, that President Trump times announcements of good news, progress in
talks, or a new commitment to diplomacy to market opens and market closes when it's down. He tried that yesterday after the market closed down. Is it
your sense that the markets aren't buying those good words as much as they did, that they don't quite find them credible?
FOROOHAR: I think that's right. And I think the president has bumped up against his ability to control the markets, given the amount of
geopolitical chaos that has ensued, largely from this war of choice.
You know, Iran is different than Venezuela. It's certainly not Greenland. It is where 20 -- the Strait of Hormuz is where 20 percent of the world's
oil travels. It is a choke point. It is a global choke point. In fact, aside from maybe the South China Seas, it's difficult to think of a more
strategically important area.
And Iran's a complicated country. You know, it's a very nationalistic country. You know, it is -- people have suffered a lot. I think the idea
that they were somehow going to come into the streets, you know, and support the U.S., and this is going to be done quickly, was naive.
SCIUTTO: So, tell me how the U.S. Fed views this, because, of course, it has two jobs, right, keep inflation under control, keep the economy going.
But this is certainly, almost certainly, going to contribute to inflation as you see energy prices rise. But at the same time, to your point about
stagflation, you're seeing growth impacted perhaps globally. How does the Fed try to manage this?
FOROOHAR: Oh, man, it's going to be very, very difficult. And I think it's going to make it really almost impossible to see any kind of rate cut soon.
When you have oil above $100 a barrel, you have to worry about inflation.
You know, food, fuel, these are the things that really hit people. They're the things that you can't cut out of your budget. And it's also having a
big impact globally. A lot of emerging market countries, which is where people had hoped the growth would be going forward in the next few years,
are oil importers. And so, they're going to be hit even harder than the U.S. I am not looking for a good next couple of years growth-wise.
SCIUTTO: It's quite a prediction. Rana, we know you'll keep on top of it. Thanks so much for joining.
FOROOHAR: Thank you.
SCIUTTO: Coming up just after the break, Iran has been condemning Israeli attacks on several steel plants today as well as nuclear facilities. It
says they're civilian, with Israel vowing to expand its strikes. Where does that leave the president's diplomacy? We'll take a closer look next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[18:30:00]
SCIUTTO: Welcome back to "The Brief." I'm Jim Sciutto live in Tel Aviv and here are the international headlines we're watching today.
Golfer Tiger Woods has been arrested after a rollover crash in Florida. The Martin County sheriff says the golfer is suspected of driving under the
influence. A photo from CNN affiliate WPTV shows a Range Rover on its side in Jupiter Island near the golfer's home. CNN has reached out to the
sheriff's office and Woods' agent for further comment.
A deal to fund U.S. airport security has now fallen apart but it looks like TSA agents might get paid anyway. Just hours ago, Republicans in the House
rejected a funding deal the Senate had backed on Thursday but President Donald Trump has now ordered the TSA workers should be paid anyway. Not
clear how he's going to do that legally but that could start on Monday.
Iran's foreign minister is condemning new Israeli strikes on several Iranian nuclear facilities as well as steel plants threatening a heavy
price. Israel's defense minister today vowed to escalate and expand its attacks on Iran calling that a response to Iranian missile fire against
civilians in Israel. We experienced some of that missile fire in the last several hours here in Tel Aviv. One of the cluster munitions struck in Tel
Aviv and killed one person.
Joining me now Jasmine El-Gamal a former Middle East advisor at the Pentagon the host of the "View From Here" podcast. Jasmine good to have you
back.
JASMINE EL-GAMAL, FORMER PENTAGON MIDDLE EAST ADVISER, MIDDLE EAST ANALYST AND HOST, "THE VIEW FROM HERE" PODCAST: Thanks for having me Jim.
SCIUTTO: When we spoke about a month ago you said that the Iranian regime will not give up easily. In just the last few hours as we've seen here Iran
continues to fire missiles at Israel. We now are hearing that the Houthis might be joining the fight. Do you see Iran is calculating it can survive
this war for longer?
EL-GAMAL: Absolutely. I mean, listen, this is not something I can uniquely take credit for as being particularly prescient. I think anyone who's ever
worked on the Middle East or understands it knew what was going to happen if this war actually started. And that's why no U.S. president has actually
gone down this path before.
And so, you see the Iranians now continuing to maintain a grip on their survival and not only that you know they're getting more and more hardline
every time. This is a playbook that we've seen before in Gaza and with Hamas leadership for example is that when a top tier leadership is taken
out the people who usually replace them are even more hardline.
So, again, Jim none of this is surprising. So, what's happening now is that the players are practically stuck. Both Iran and the U.S. see themselves as
having the upper hand and that means that given how far apart, they are on their demands really, really far apart, neither side sees itself as being
in a position of weakness. So, it's really difficult to figure out how this off ramp can be activated.
And the only way that I can think of and speaking to people in the region is really with the regional involvement and outside involvement that the
way to move this forward is not to have it be just a conversation between Iran and the U.S. That is just not going to happen. They're too far apart.
But the way is to talk about the collective responsibility that regional actors that international actors China Pakistan Turkey have in bringing
down the temperature and having those regional and international actors be the adults in the room and be the voices that are calming down Iranians and
the Americans.
[18:35:00]
SCIUTTO: But what middle ground can they find. I mean for instance on the Strait of Hormuz that appears to becoming Iran's primary bargaining chip in
the war given that it effectively controls it. And it certainly is a focus of the president's because he's quite worried about the price of oil. What
would the potential compromise be on that?
EL-GAMAL: Jim, unfortunately, the answer to that is that the middle ground is going to have to mean that each side is going to have to make
concessions that they were not prepared to make and don't want to make. But this is a situation now where before this war started the biggest issues
that the U.S. had with Iran was the nuclear file potentially ballistic missiles and proxies, right, those were the issues they were negotiating.
Now, it's, add to that, the Strait of Hormuz and that is a huge issue added on to the negotiating table.
The way to address this is not to think how is one side going to emerge victorious or what is the middle ground that can make both of them happy.
The middle ground means both of them are going to have to be, to some degree, unhappy with the final status of negotiations. But it's going to be
an arrangement that both can live with.
SCIUTTO: OK. How about Israel though? Because Israel has its own objectives in this war. It has a particular focus on Iranian nuclear capabilities. It
does not appear that the U.S. at least at this moment is prepared to take the steps of a significant ground operation to secure that enriched
uranium. Israel has a vote in this war as well.
EL-GAMAL: Absolutely. And I'm so glad you mentioned that because I think we spoke about this last time, and I've been saying for a while now that there
will come a moment in this war when U.S. and Israeli objectives diverge to a point where they no longer agree on when to stop the war and how much
further to go.
And that's exactly what we're starting to see right now, Jim. The Israelis have different objectives than the Americans do and they have different
longer-term objectives. I don't know if you saw the exchange with Prime Minister Netanyahu. He was answering the question that Richard Engel was
asking and he started talking about how the long-term vision here is to is to make the Strait of Hormuz completely, you know, out of -- the use out of
the question and start going through alternative pathways and through Israel. So, those are different from the U.S.'s goals.
And so, what the U.S. is going to have to do right now is decouple its strategic interests from those of Israel and do what it needs to do to
bring back the situation to a point where the Gulf allies aren't threatened. U.S. national security interests aren't threatened and Iran is
-- it's not -- the regime is not going to fall, but the regime is also going to have to learn that if this war is to end, they will also have to
give concessions to the Americans and the Gulf allies that they won't be some wounded tiger waiting in the in the -- you know, on the side waiting
to pounce against. They will also have to provide concessions of their own.
SCIUTTO: Jasmine El-Gamal, I'm sure it's not the last time we talk about this. Thanks for joining.
Coming up TSA agents in the U.S. could start getting paid again as early as Monday. Is a long-term solution. Where exactly would that money be coming
from. We'll discuss.
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[18:40:00]
SCIUTTO: A key House committee has advanced its own package to fund the Department of Homeland Security. This after House Speaker Mike Johnson
rejected a funding bill passed overnight by the Senate. That bill would have mostly funded DHS except for ICE and Border Patrol. The new proposal
from the House, Republicans there, fully funds ICE. It's seen as dead on arrival in the Senate. For his part, President Trump has now ordered TSA
agents to be paid as early as Monday. Just not clear where that money would come from or if it's even legal.
Joining me now, Larry Sabato, director of the Center for Politics at the University of Virginia. Larry, it's good to have you. Does Trump have a
legal way to pay TSA agents without Congress? I thought Congress had the power of the purse?
LARRY SABATO, DIRECTOR, UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA CENTER FOR POLITICS AND CO- EDITOR, "CAMPAIGN OF CHAOS": Well, it does, but Congress hasn't been asserting itself very much during the Trump presidency part two. The people
I trust who really understand the budget and how Congress runs say that there is no legal way, no obvious legal way that Trump can use to pay and
to deposit the money by Monday, in the accounts of all these TSA workers.
I thought that the best comment came from one of the TSA workers who's been through a lot saying, I'll believe it when I see it. That's the posture of
most of these people. So, could he do it? Maybe, Jim. I think it's very doubtful that it would stick and it'll probably be challenged.
SCIUTTO: Yes. So, the Senate had a deal. By the way, the Senate's controlled by Republicans, too. They were willing to move forward and set
aside the funding for ICE and Border Patrol. House rejected that. Who's winning the politics of this, particularly as those airport lines get
longer? No one enjoys those lines. Are the Democrats winning the politics? Are the Republicans?
SABATO: The Democrats are now. The Republicans have made a terrible error. Speaker Johnson refused to acknowledge the fact that the Senate unanimously
approved this unanimously. Fifty-three Republicans to forty-seven Democrats pretended as though somehow the Republicans weren't involved. No one buys
that. Everyone knows what this means. The speaker himself was probably ready to accept this. And then the Freedom Caucus ultra conservatives
jumped into action and demanded that it be rejected. That's exactly what happened.
SCIUTTO: So, that's why the House overrules the Senate here. So, what happens with this legislation? Because we know the House package is dead on
arrival there. I mean, this is Republicans negotiating with the Republicans at this point.
SABATO: Yes, it's Republicans versus Republicans, spy versus spy. And as we remember from the old cartoon, neither spy won in the end. They both
generally bonked each other on the head. So, that's what's happening in Congress.
I don't know how they're going to resolve it. There must be some way around. But it's really tough to do it because you see, Congress has the
power of the purse. And most congresses have asserted themselves to grab the power of the purse. It's funny how it doesn't work that way under
Donald Trump.
SCIUTTO: Larry Sabato, thanks so much for explaining.
SABATO: Thank you.
SCIUTTO: Well, while much of the world's attention is firmly on the Middle East, the death and destruction from Russia's ongoing invasion of Ukraine
continues.
[18:45:00]
Now, U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio is considering the possibility that weapons intended for Ukraine could be diverted for the war with Iran.
We're going to take a closer look next.
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SCIUTTO: A Russian drone strike on the Ukrainian city of Dnipro has injured five people and sparked a large fire. Moscow stepped up drone attacks in
recent days, saying that civilian infrastructure is a legitimate target because striking them reduces Kyiv's ability to wage war.
U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio confirmed today that weapons intended for Ukraine to defend itself against the ongoing Russian invasion could now
be diverted to the war against Iran. He said it hasn't happened yet.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RUBIO: I don't have anything to announce. It's not like I can tell you that that's happening right now. But it could happen. And it could have always
happened. If we need something for America, and it's American, we're going to keep it for America first. But as of now, that has not happened. So,
far, Perl (ph) has been unaffected by this operation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: This week, Moldova's parliament voted to impose a 60-day state of emergency on its energy sector. This after Russian strikes knocked out a
power line in Ukraine linking Moldova to Romania. The Moldovan prime minister says Russia's attack on Ukraine is also an attack on his country.
Joining me now, Vladislav Kulminski. He's Moldova's ambassador to the U.S. Ambassador, thanks so much for joining.
VLADISLAV KULMINSKI, MOLDOVAN AMBASSADOR TO U.S.: Thank you very much for the invitation, Jim.
SCIUTTO: President Trump in the last 24 hours has said once again that the Ukraine war is not America's war. It's too far away, simply doesn't matter.
You have said, and you have noted, that Russian leaders compare your country to Ukraine. I've heard that from other leaders in Eastern Europe.
They fear they're next. Do you believe that President Trump doesn't understand the risk that Russia poses to Europe, or simply doesn't care?
KULMINSKI: Jim, I think that the president and his administration has been very instrumental in preventing Russia from taking this war to other
countries, spreading it to other countries like the Republic of Moldova. That deterrence has worked until now.
But look, I think it has to do with the fact that Moldova is now making decisive steps to leave Russia's sphere of influence, to leave Russia's
geopolitical orbit. And Russia doesn't want that to happen. So, Russia tried to take over Moldova last year through parliamentary elections, when
Russia financed, you know, unreformed Communist and Socialist Party, which traced their lineage to the Soviet times, and they tried to install them in
the Republic of Moldova. That didn't work out.
[18:50:00]
So, now, they turned to creating essentially humanitarian disasters. Just recently, they bombed a power station in Ukraine, and that power station is
located on a river which supplies 70 percent of Moldova's water, and the water was polluted.
So, you know, it was a really major humanitarian issue for the Republic of Moldova. And now, this power line, which is designed to essentially, you
know, plunge us into darkness.
SCIUTTO: Well, as you know, there have been a number of Russian attacks on Europe outside of Ukraine. There have been drone strikes. There have been
suspected strikes on civilian infrastructure. If deterrence is working, if U.S.-led deterrence is working against Russia, why are those attacks
happening? Why does Russia believe that it can get away with such attacks?
KULMINSKI: I think they're signaling. This is probably a signal that, you know, that Russia wants its own sphere of influence, that Russia wants to
have some countries within its orbit, just like the Soviet Union had in the past. Russia did not really resort, you know, to fully fledged the war in
those countries, such as the Republic of Moldova, even though the Republic of Moldova is not a member of NATO and not a member of the European Union.
So, that powerful message from Washington, D.C., that war needs to be contained and brought to a close, is really important. I think it has so
far worked.
I don't think Russia is going to take that war to other countries. They're trying to undermine those countries from within. They're trying to create,
you know, major issues, such as, you know, this issue with cutting off electricity supplies to the Republic of Moldova. But that deterrence is
still there. It's still working.
SCIUTTO: Do you believe that the war in Iran gives Russia something of an advantage? I mean, certainly from a perspective of oil, it does. The price
of oil is up. The U.S. has allowed Russia to sell oil, which adds to its coffers to continue to wage war. Do you believe this war gives Russia an
advantage now, not against Ukraine, but also against Europe?
KULMINSKI: Russia's positions throughout the war are weakening. They're not becoming stronger. Look, Russia is a declining power. There's absolutely no
question about it. And they're trying to bite more than they can chew.
Look, Ukraine has preserved 80 percent of its territory. Ukraine is an independent state, despite the fact that the key goal of Russian war
against Ukraine was precisely to dismember that country, to erase it from the map. And that didn't happen. So, Russia essentially is not winning the
war. Russia is -- has lost the war already. It is time for Russia to recognize the fact that, you know, people in the Republic of Moldova,
people in Ukraine don't want Russia there. They don't want to be dominated by Russia. And that fact is not going to change for many, many generations
to come.
I think that, you know, it's really time to bring that war to a close, and I hope that that is going to happen this year.
SCIUTTO: As you know, speaking of Moldova's experience with Russian interference in its election, failed interference, as you noted, there's
another election coming up in Hungary. We know that Russia supports Viktor Orban, the incumbent. Do you believe that Russia will attempt at least to
try to sway the election in Hungary as well?
KULMINSKI: Russia has interfered very massively in elections, you know, throughout Europe and in the Republic of Moldova in particular. We know how
brutal that interference was last year in November. They spent almost 2 percent of Moldova's GDP to try to change the result of that election and
to bring to power political parties and personalities that are loyal to Russian geopolitical interests in the region.
But that ultimately didn't really work, because ultimately -- you know, Jim, I think that, you know, just like in the case of Hungary, Poland,
Romania, in the past, after the collapse of the Soviet Union, once the people want to be free, once they want liberty, they want to be
independent, they want to preserve their values and their societies, I think it is not going to be possible to bring them back under Russian
dominion, under Russian influence anymore. That is just over. It's just not going to be like that. Definitely not in the case of Southeastern Europe or
Ukraine and Moldova.
So, ultimately, the people will decide, because those countries now have free and fair elections, which is one of the -- probably one of the most
significant achievements those countries have made after the collapse of the Soviet Union.
SCIUTTO: So, is it somewhat disconcerting for you to see the U.S. -- there's talk of J.D. Vance going to Hungary to back Orban in this election,
give him a boost. Is it disconcerting to see the U.S. and Russia backing the same candidate in an election in Europe?
[18:55:00]
KULMINSKI: Jim, I don't think that that they're backing the same candidate. And, you know, look, what really matters to the Republic of Moldova these
days, it is just to make sure that we're not going to end up on that side of the fence, that we're not going to end up in Russian sphere of influence
again, because we've been there. We don't want to return there, and we will never return there. And that's what really matters. Despite Russian efforts
to bring us back, that is not something that the people of Moldova will ever accept or will ever agree to.
So, you know, I think that Russia is really losing influence throughout the world. Look at sort of, you know, at Cuba, look at Venezuela, look at, you
know, Russian positions throughout the world. And it is time for Russia to recognize that former Soviet Union countries will decide their own destiny,
that they will not be Russia within Russian sphere of influence. And that, of course, will create a foundation for a lasting peace in the region, in
which both Ukraine and Moldova will be able to make its own geopolitical choices that will not threaten Russia in any way.
SCIUTTO: Ambassador Vladislav Kulminski, we appreciate you joining the program.
KULMINSKI: Thank you very much for the invitation, Jim.
SCIUTTO: And thanks so much to all of you for joining us today. I'm Jim Sciutto in Tel Aviv. You've been watching "The Brief." Please do stay with
CNN.
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