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The Story Is with Elex Michaelson
Tennessee Republican Matt Van Epps Wins U.S. House Seat; White House, Pete Hegseth Shift Responsibility for Double-Tap Strike; No Compromise on Plan for Ukraine After Putin Talks; Interview with Representative Brad Sherman (D-CA); Manhunt Underway After 4 Killed at Child's Birthday Party in California; Tennessee Republican Van Epps Wins U.S. House Seat; Trump Defends Hegseth on Strikes on Alleged Drug Boat; L.A. County Advances Proposed Law Enforcement Mask Ban; 24-Year- Old Artist to Perform with 284-Year-Old Violin. Aired 12-1a ET
Aired December 03, 2025 - 00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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ELEX MICHAELSON, CNN ANCHOR: This new take on "We are the World," you know, that brought all the artists together.
COATES: Yes.
MICHAELSON: He's going to be doing this in a few weeks, actually right here across the street from us. He's going to talk to us about that. Plus, get you motivated, give you hope for the holiday season at a time when we all could use a little pick-me-up, nobody does it quite like Tony Robinson. We're excited to talk to him.
COATES: I don't know why they didn't ask me to participate. Oh, I can't sing.
Have a great show, Elex.
MICHAELSON: Thanks, Laura.
THE STORY IS starts right.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MICHAELSON: THE STORY IS in Tennessee.
MATT VAN EPPS, U.S. HOUSE REPUBLICAN-ELECT: What a night.
MICHAELSON: Republicans are celebrating a special election win for their razor thin House majority.
THE STORY IS in Washington, D.C.
SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY): Either he was lying to us on Sunday or he's incompetent and didn't know what had happened.
MICHAELSON: The secretary of war is facing tough questions from his own party. With us Democratic Congressman Brad Sherman. THE STORY IS in Stockton, California, where the manhunt for a mass
killer is still underway. With us live, the mayor of Stockton, Christina Fugazi.
And THE STORY IS right here in Los Angeles, where a top musician is about to play a 284-year-old violin. Live in our studio.
ANNOUNCER: Live from Los Angeles, THE STORY IS with Elex Michaelson.
MICHAELSON: I'm Elex Michaelson.
So we're taking you all over the map in the next two hours but we begin with the story of politics. Republicans breathing a sigh of relief after a special election win in Tennessee. CNN projects that Republican Matt Van Epps will defeat Democrat Aftyn Behn for the Seventh House District seat. His nine-point margin of victory is much closer than a year ago, when Donald Trump scored a 22-point victory in that very district.
Van Epps is a former Army helicopter pilot. He got strong endorsements from Tennessee Governor Bill Lee, Speaker Mike Johnson and President Donald Trump.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VAN EPPS: What a night. What a night. We did it. Thank you. Thank you all. This is just an incredible win. An incredible win. Tonight you've sent a message loud and clear. The people of Middle Tennessee stand with President Donald J. Trump. And stood firmly behind our campaign. I am humbled beyond belief to stand before you tonight as your next representative. Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: Van Epps' victory means Republicans will hold on to a narrow majority in the House, at least for now. Here's the current balance of power. Republicans 220, Democrats 213. Two seats remain open. Remember, you need 218 to get to majority status.
Now to the story in Venezuela, where President Trump says the U.S. will begin striking targets, quote, "very soon." If that's true, it would mark a significant escalation in the U.S. crackdown on Caribbean drug trafficking. Since September, the U.S. has conducted at least 21 known strikes on alleged drug boats, killing more than 80 people. On Tuesday, the president said attacks on land would, quote, "be much easier."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: These people have killed over 200,000 people, actually killed over 200,000 people last year, and those numbers are down. Those numbers are down, way down. And they're down because we're doing these strikes, and we're going to start doing those strikes on land, too. You know, the land is much easier. It's much easier. And we know the routes they take. We know everything about them. We know where they live. We know where the bad ones live. And we're
going to start that very soon, too.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: So this comes as the administration faces intense scrutiny over a double tap strike in early September, which reportedly killed survivors on one of the boats. On Monday, the White House acknowledged the follow-up attack did occur and shifted the responsibility to the head of U.S. special command for carrying that out.
In a Cabinet meeting on Tuesday, both President Trump and Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth continue to distance themselves from that incident, which may be a war crime, insisting they were not aware of the second strike order. Hegseth says he left the room right before it happened to go to a meeting somewhere else. But he defended Admiral Frank Bradley for making that decision.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE HEGSETH, DEFENSE SECRETARY: I watched that first strike live. As you can imagine, at the Department of War, we got a lot of things to do. So I didn't stick around for the hour and two hours or whatever, where all the sensitive site exploitation digitally occurs. So I moved on to my next meeting. A couple of hours later, I learned that that commander had made the -- which he had the complete authority to do.
And by the way, Admiral Bradley made the correct decision to ultimately sink the boat and eliminate the threat.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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MICHAELSON: Now, some U.S. lawmakers are questioning Hegseth's honesty there, and his overall ability to U.S. -- to lead the U.S. Military. The Senate Armed Services Committee is promising a bipartisan investigation into this whole incident.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL: Secretary Hegseth said he had no knowledge of this and it did not happen. It was fake news. It didn't happen. And then the next day, from the podium of the White House, they're saying it did happen. So either he was lying to us on Sunday or he's incompetent and didn't know what had happened.
MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Do you have full confidence in his handling of his job as secretary of defense?
SEN. JOHN THUNE (R-SD): Well, I think that the fundamental question is, is the country safer than it was under the Biden administration? I think the answer to that is unequivocally yes. And so, Secretary Hegseth is a part of that. He serves at the pleasure of the president.
(END VIDEO CLIP) MICHAELSON: Now, Donald Trump's top negotiators have not closed a deal with Russia's president to end his so-called special military operation in Ukraine. U.S. special envoy Steve Witkoff and Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, sat with Russian president Vladimir Putin in a meeting that lasted for nearly five hours, a top Kremlin aide says those talks were, quote, constructive and highly substantive. But there are other points that, quote, "do not suit us."
Putin appears to be accusing Europe of altering the Trump administration's original 28-point peace plan. That proposal had been criticized for appearing to favor Russia. Putin also said this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): We are not planning to go to war with Europe. I have already spoken about this a hundred times, but if Europe suddenly wants to go to war with us and starts, we are ready right now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: Now, shortly after the meeting ended, a top Russian official posted a single word on social media. Quote, "Productive," punctuated by a dove and olive branch emoji.
CNN's Matthew Chance has more from Moscow.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CHIEF GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, after those marathon talks in the Kremlin, which lasted nearly five hours, progress appears to have been minimal. Trump's special envoy, Steve Witkoff, and Jared Kushner, his son-in-law, were in Moscow to present possible compromises to end the Ukraine war already discussed with Kyiv, and to see if the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, was prepared to buy in.
What they got was a diplomatic but unenthusiastic reception, with the Kremlin aide calling the talks useful and constructive, an opportunity to discuss joint work on a peaceful settlement to the Ukraine crisis. But the aide also said that no compromises were reached on key issues, and that a meeting between the Russian and U.S. leaders was not yet being planned.
Earlier, Witkoff and Kushner took a VIP tour of Moscow's Red Square, browsing a New Year's market before heading into the Kremlin, where Witkoff, on his sixth visit to Moscow, told Putin he'd enjoyed a, quote, "beautiful walk" through what he described as the magnificent city. Despite those pleasantries, though, the talks ended without the Kremlin fully signing up to President Trump's peace efforts.
But they weren't dismissed out of hand. President Putin still keeping his options open for a peace deal that delivers him a victory that he insists Russia will otherwise win on the Ukrainian battlefield.
Matthew Chance, CNN, Moscow. (END VIDEOTAPE)
MICHAELSON: Joining me now from Washington is Brad Sherman, Democrat from California, a senior member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee and a member of the Congressional Ukrainian Caucus.
Congressman, welcome to THE STORY IS for the first time.
REP. BRAD SHERMAN (D-CA): Good to be with you.
MICHAELSON: So let's start by talking about Ukraine. We have this very, very long meeting today. It doesn't seem like much came out of it. Where do you think we're at right now?
SHERMAN: Well, we started with this 28-point plan that was put forward as a U.S. plan. But that Secretary Rubio admitted not only to Agnus King, but to Senator Rounds was really written in Moscow, and it was a terrible plan. And I think Trump realizes that he cannot impose that plan on Ukraine. The worst part of that plan was a severe limit on the size of the Ukrainian military, which is odd because President Trump is doing everything possible and bragging about how he's getting Europeans to spend more on their defense.
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He even tells European countries, we won't defend you if you're not doing enough for yourself. And then he turns to the Ukrainians and says, you should do less to defend yourself. A limit on the Ukrainian military is just an invitation to the third war, which Putin will initiate when he thinks the West is distracted.
MICHAELSON: So how does this end?
SHERMAN: Well, hopefully it ends with a ceasefire along the line of control that we have now. And that that becomes the new de facto border for a while. Hopefully the part of this plan that I do like, which is that $100 billion of Russian money becomes available to Ukraine to rebuild is an important part of that.
MICHAELSON: You did not say that part of the way that this ends is Ukraine getting into NATO.
SHERMAN: I don't think we're going to see Ukraine in NATO any time soon, in part because as long as Ukraine is occupied, if Ukraine is part of NATO, that means we have to treat it as if America was being occupied by Russian forces. And that's an act of war. We don't want to be in a position where we are obligated to be at war with Russia on day one.
MICHAELSON: Meanwhile, there's some people speculating that the U.S. could be getting into war with Venezuela. We have this report of a sort of double attack on this boat. Few people survive. Then there's a second attack. President Trump now says that he didn't know about that. The secretary of defense has kind of been all over the place in terms of what he said about this.
You're in Congress. It's your job to do oversight of this. Do you have any idea what actually happened here?
SHERMAN: We're not going to know the details, except to the extent that the executive branch reveals them. But what we do know is that this is an action against criminals. And the way they're doing it is a complete violation of every law on how to deal with criminal interdiction. You should be stopping these boats, arresting people, getting information from them, and going after the kingpins.
Instead, we've got the former head of the country of Honduras who's in prison in the United States for a lifetime term being potentially freed by Trump. It's as if he wants to kill the low-level drug dealer folks, and allow in the top people that he thinks are important folks at his level.
MICHAELSON: Your colleague in the House from Southern California, Maxine Waters, put out a statement saying that President Trump is a murderer for what he's doing here. Do you agree with that?
SHERMAN: That's Maxine's wording. In this case Trump has ordered the destruction of these boats. I doubt the president was involved in a decision as to whether to hit a particular boat a first time, a second time, or even a third time. But he has directed the military to treat this as if it's a military operation when it is, in fact, a law enforcement operation.
MICHAELSON: Congressman Brad Sherman, thank you so much. Appreciate you joining us and sharing your views.
SHERMAN: Thank you. And I look forward to a Democratic majority in Congress. The results in Tennessee are actually a forecast of a good year next year. And you'll see a lot more oversight when you have a Democratic majority in the House.
MICHAELSON: There you go. Already making the pitch all these months in advance. We appreciate it.
SHERMAN: That's my job.
MICHAELSON: That's my job to try to keep him honest.
Up next, the mayor of Stockton, California, joins us live with the latest on a massive manhunt following a mass killing at a children's birthday party over the weekend.
And THE STORY IS the weather, especially in the Midwest. Look at those pictures. Residents preparing for the coldest temperatures of the season.
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): Two one. There you go.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: In between partisan squabbling and not getting a whole lot done, some Christmas cheer on Capitol Hill after the annual Christmas tree lighting ceremony. House Speaker Mike Johnson hosted the event on Tuesday. This year's tree is a 53-foot red fir from Nevada, nicknamed "Silver Bell." The ceremony has been held every year since 1964.
A fast-moving winter storm has dumped several inches of snow and freezing rain across parts of the U.S. Pennsylvania state troopers say they responded to more than 600 vehicle crashes on Tuesday. Vermont and New Hampshire saw snow falling as fast as one inch every hour.
More cold weather is on the way. The Midwest is set to see temperatures up to degrees lower than normal. Until that snow melts, states are still on alert. New Jersey's governor declared a state of emergency in five counties and is urging all residents to be careful while traveling.
Meantime, in West Virginia, icy roads caused a semi-truck driver to lose control of their vehicle. That cab skidded over the highway, dangled off the side of a bridge. Emergency crews were able to successfully rescue that driver.
Check out these live images right now from Denver, where the snow is falling during this holiday season.
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Meanwhile, the U.S. is pausing immigration applications for people from 19 countries, what the Trump administration calls nations of concern. They include Afghanistan, Iran, Venezuela and Somalia. Immigration officials say requests from these countries will undergo a, quote "comprehensive review." Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem says that list needs to be even longer, with about a dozen countries added, according to one source.
The man accused of shooting two National Guard members near the White House last week has pleaded not guilty to all charges, including first-degree murder and assault. 29-year-old Rahmanullah Lakanwal appeared virtually from a hospital bed in his first court appearance on Tuesday. He was ordered to be held without bond before trial. That Afghan national came to the U.S. in 2021 after working with U.S. forces, including the CIA, in Kandahar, Afghanistan. He was granted asylum earlier this year by the Trump administration.
President Trump says he is, quote, "very proud of the two National Guard members who were shot in last week's attack." In Tuesday's Cabinet meeting, the president called 20-year-old Sarah Beckstrom, quote, "an incredible person" and 24-year-old Andrew Wolfe, a fighter. Beckstrom died from her injuries on Thanksgiving. Officials say Wolfe remains in critical condition but has shown positive signs of recovery. President Trump added it would be a miracle if he survives.
Wolfe and Beckstrom were deployed to Washington, D.C. from West Virginia as part of the Trump administration's effort to reduce crime in the nation's capital. Minnesota's Twin Cities are bracing for new federal immigration raids
targeting undocumented Somali immigrants. The new operation comes as the U.S. president ramps up his attacks against the Somali community in Minneapolis and St. Paul. Looking at images right now of the governor of Minnesota, Tim Walz. On Tuesday, Donald Trump called the Somali immigrants, quote, "garbage," specifically calling out Somali- American Congresswoman Ilhan Omar. He said he doesn't want Somalis in the U.S.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Ilhan Omar is garbage. She's garbage. Her friends are garbage. These aren't people that work. These aren't people that say, let's go, come on, let's make this place great. These are people that do nothing but complain. But when they come from hell and they complain and do nothing but (EXPLETIVE DELETED), we don't want them in our country. Let them go back to where they came from and fix it.
Thank you very much, everybody.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: Now talk about Democratic Governor Tim Walz of Minnesota called the federal operation a PR stunt that is indiscriminately targeting immigrants. Meanwhile, the mayors of the Twin Cities emphasized their citizens have rights and legal resources and offered their support for the Somali community.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR MELVIN CARTER, ST. PAUL, MINNESOTA: The last thing that we need is federal agents coming here pretending that we should be afraid of somebody just based on the color of their skin, just based on what they look like, just based on what country their ancestors came as -- honor as a motherland.
MAYOR JACOB FREY, MINNEAPOLIS, MINNESOTA: To our Somali community, we love you and we stand with you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: Tonight, police in California are still searching for the people suspected of a mass shooting in Stockton. Four people, including three children, were killed in Saturday's shooting at a child's birthday party, 11 others were injured. The mayor of Stockton says the shooting was a result of, quote, "group gang violence." The sheriff says it's too early to make that determination, but he says the attack appears to have been targeted.
The father of one of the victims says he saw a gunman wearing a face mask firing several shots in his son's direction.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PATRICK PETERSON, FATHER OF 14-YEAR-OLD SHOOTING VICTIM: I am -- I have an image of my son dying in my head over and over and over and over. Maybe I should have just dove in front of the bullets, and maybe he would still be alive. If you have enough sense to pick up a gun and aim and shoot it, you got enough sense to take your responsibility of your actions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: Christina Fugazi is the mayor of Stockton, California. She joins us live.
Welcome to THE STORY IS for the first time.
MAYOR CHRISTINA FUGAZI, STOCKTON, CALIFORNIA: Thank you.
MICHAELSON: What do we know about who did this?
FUGAZI: Well, I would say that I wish we knew more. There are many people that are still being interviewed that were there. This investigation is being done by our sheriff and his department, and his investigators are working tirelessly to make sure that they identify the correct suspect or suspects in this heinous crime, and that they bring him to justice.
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MICHAELSON: I know you've spoken to a lot of the family members. We just heard that father's pain.
What do you say to those family members?
FUGAZI: I actually spoke to that gentleman's wife, Amari's mom. They are -- they're struggling, but there are no words. There -- all you can do is be there to listen. Help them with whatever they need. And sometimes that is just sitting with them and letting them grieve.
MICHAELSON: How is your community processing this? We know that there have been problems with gang violence in Stockton, as there have been in so many other California cities over the years. But this feels different, at a child's birthday party, doesn't it?
FUGAZI: Yes, it was a 2-year-old's birthday party, believe it or not. And so the community initially was, well, we're all still very heartbroken and sad over this. And then the community as well as myself turned that to anger. Being very upset, being furious that this even -- something like this even had the potential to happen in our city. But if there was a silver lining, I will tell you that our community has come together.
We have a number of organizations that have said, hey, we can't do this alone. We have to work together in order to solve these things from happening in our community because, you know, we're no different than any other city. And we know we have issues, but we have to work collectively if we want to limit or eliminate, should I say, this issue.
MICHAELSON: I know you've reached out to both the Trump administration and Washington and the Newsom administration in Sacramento. What have those conversations has been like, and how potentially can they help your city?
FUGAZI: Well, I will tell you my conversation with the governor was specifically about our youth. I have 31 years in education. You know, as a high school teacher and administrator. So I'm intimately aware of what that lifestyle is like. For our young people and what it takes to get many of them to go on a different pathway. So last summer, we had 100 students for summer youth employment program that is funded through the governor's budget.
But we had 1400 applicants. We had 1400 young people who wanted a job, and we weren't able to give it to 1300 of them. So I asked the governor, I said, we need more resources and support for our youth in our -- in our city. When it comes to Washington, D.C., we had met with the Department of Justice in May, and then we met with them again in July and with the FBI as well. And we need more resources.
And when I say more resources, we don't have a fully staffed police department. We have 1.1 officers per 1,000 residents. And we are struggling with that. But we need to have partners in this. And currently we have the FBI. We have the ATF. They're helping through this investigation, but we have to say enough is enough. This type of behavior is not allowed in our city, and we need to do something about it. And we need to end this school-to-prison pipeline as well.
MICHAELSON: Well said. Mayor Christina Fugazi, thank you so much for coming on and sharing your views. And please pass on our condolences to your residents tonight. Thank you.
FUGAZI: Thank you.
MICHAELSON: After a quick break, our political panel will be here, Stephanie Miller and Jennifer Horne. A lot to get into with them. We'll be right back.
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MICHAELSON: One of America's richest men is making a major investment in the future of children.
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Michael Dell, CEO of Dell Technologies, and his wife, Susan, are donating $6.25 billion to supplement so-called Trump accounts. Under the president's plan, the government will fund a $1,000 investment for all children born in the U.S. from the start of this year to the end of 2028.
Money will be invested in stock index funds or mutual funds. Family members can contribute up to $5,000 extra every year. No withdrawals are allowed until the child turns 18.
The Dell donation covers children under the age of ten who are not already eligible.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) AFTYN BEHN (D), TENNESSEE CONGRESSIONAL CANDIDATE: This was a district that Trump won handily, and he and his billionaire friends had to spend millions of dollars to bolster their candidate of choice.
And so, I think it looks -- it portends what will happen next year, when you have Republicans that are in more competitive seats you know, struggling with candidates that look a lot like me.
MATT VAN EPPS (R), TENNESSEE REPRESENTATIVE-ELECT: Politicians who run from the president or abandon the commonsense policies that the American people gave us a resounding mandate on, do so at their own peril.
No matter what the D.C. insiders or liberal media say, this is President Trump's party. I'm proud to be a part of it and can't wait to get to work.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: CNN projects Republican Matt van Epps, who we just heard from there, will win the U.S. House special election in Tennessee in a closer than expected race with Democrat there. You see, he is up right now.
Our panel here to talk about that and more. Stephanie Miller is a national radio and TV host on the left. Jennifer Horn is the host of "The Morning Answer" on 870 AM here in Los Angeles, on the right.
Jennifer, Stephanie, welcome. We've got two powerhouse women from talk radio on opposite sides of the aisle coming together for THE STORY IS.
STEPHANIE MILLER, RADIO AND TV HOST: Yes.
JENNIFER HORN, HOST, "THE MORNING ANSWER": Thanks for having us.
MILLER: Oh, we already get in a fistfight. And --
HORN: We did. I pulled a little hair, but it's fine. We look fine.
MILLER: It's fine.
MICHAELSON: We're ready to get going.
MILLER: This is way past my bedtime, but I'm not going to fall asleep like Trump did 47 times today in the cabinet meeting. I promise.
HORN: He was thinking, Stephanie. He was thinking, I mean, speaking of sleeping.
MILLER: So sharp, Jennifer, quick impression. (SNORING)
HORN: We got Joe Biden, who was the sleeper in chief for about four years.
MILLER: When he can't even stay awake to listen to someone suck up to him, like Marco Rubio right next to him. HORN: Liberals do recognize nappers unless he's the president of the
United States.
MILLER: How's "Sleepy Joe" looking to everybody now?
HORN: Sleepy.
MICHAELSON: We're off. Yes, he's still looks pretty tired.
HORN: Yes.
MICHAELSON: But. But Jennifer, since it's a Republican win, let's start with you. I guess congratulations. Your takeaway from -- from the win in Tennessee.
HORN: Obviously, I'm happy about the win, because this helps us with our -- with our count in the House of Representatives.
I do think that we need to look at this as a little bit of a warning. I think that this was a bigger victory than many people expected. I think we'll probably see this go to about nine, ten points in a win.
But this was a 22 Trump district. And so, I think that the message for the Republican Party is figure out how to win when Trump is not on the ballot.
And I think you have to counter the pie-in-the-sky messaging that the Democrat socialists that are running in these elections are throwing to the American people, because we know socialism doesn't work. But they are selling an idea to the American people.
I think Republicans need to counter with their own plans and have to be ready to go for 2026, because it's going to be a lot tighter than we think.
MICHAELSON: This wasn't a Democratic socialist in this district, right?
MILLER: No, it was not. I -- I was really going to fall asleep during that only because it's a 22-point district, as you said, Jen. Twenty- two points Trump won by.
This has got to scare the bejesus out of Republicans.
HORN: We won by ten.
MILLER: We already had a blue wave. We had -- we won Mississippi. We won everything you could win in the last election.
And this one, they had to spend millions of dollars in, a, you know, solid Trump district. So, there's a blue tsunami coming. I'm just telling you. I'm wearing red tonight just for you, because it's the last time you're going to win.
HORN: I appreciate it.
MILLER: It's the last time --
MICHAELSON: We'll see.
MILLER: -- you're going to win anything.
MICHAELSON: But in terms of this member of Congress, it doesn't matter if you win by 50 or if you win by five votes. You're still a member with the same voting record. And it will help them in this very thin majority that they have there.
Let's talk about what's happening right now with Secretary Pete Hegseth, who's under fire.
The Trump administration has been very upset at people on the left who are in the military, who came out with a video that said, if the commander in chief gives unlawful orders, don't follow them, which is, by the way, the law of the land.
So, here is Pete Hegseth, when there was a different commander in chief years ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE HEGSETH, U.S. SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: I do think there have to be consequences for abject war crimes. If you're doing something that is just completely unlawful and -- and ruthless, then there is a consequence for that.
That's why the military said it won't follow unlawful orders from their commander in chief. There's a standard; there's an ethos. There's a belief that we are above what so many things that our enemies or others would do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAELSON: So, that's when the commander in chief was Barack Obama.
MILLER: You would think that drunk texting war plans would -- Signalgate would have been. I mean, not saying I haven't drunk-texted war plans, but I'm not the secretary of defense, so no one cared. But --
MICHAELSON: We don't know that he drunk texted. It was a joke. That is a joke. Yes, yes.
MILLER: I mean, the fact that this -- every legal expert has said this is clearly either a war crime or murder. Either way, it is absolutely despicable. There is no defending it.
And he proved the point that these people, that these, you know, Democrats made in the video: that you shouldn't obey illegal orders. There is no planet on which this is not illegal.
MICHAELSON: Does it not feel like a little bit of hypocrisy when you hear that video?
HORN: It doesn't feel like hypocrisy to me at all. Pete Hegseth is talking about the necessary need for -- for whistleblowers.
What we had here are two anonymous sources that were debunked today by "The New York Times." Democrats are clutching to this story, because they want to prove that Donald Trump committed a war crime, so that Mark Kelly doesn't get brought before a military tribunal because of his lies and his inappropriate behavior.
Look, "The Washington Post" ran with this story.
MICHAELSON: What did he -- what did he lie about? I mean --
HORN: Mark Kelly?
MICHAELSON: In that video. What did he lie about?
HORN: That there were illegal orders given by President Trump when they were --
MICHAELSON: He didn't say -- he didn't say that.
MILLER: -- illegal orders.
HORN: But let's -- let's say that he was insinuating that illegal orders would be given. That was inappropriate. That was not the place of a senator.
And let me ask you this question honestly. If anybody did that to Joe Biden under -- any Republican senator, if Ted Cruz came out, they'd have him already sitting in the town square throwing stones at him.
The hypocrisy here is on the Democrat side.
And let's talk about this scandal, because this is the important part. Pete Hegseth -- I feel like James Comey should get royalties on this story, because this is the scam that Democrats run all the time.
They come up with anonymous sources, two of them. They feed that story, traditionally, to a mainstream news media outlet like the "The Washington Post." "The Washington Post" runs with it. It gets debunked, and nobody apologizes for it.
How is that possible? We heard from "The New York Times" they have five sources that say Pete Hegseth did not give the order that "The Washington Post" said that they did in their reporting. So, where's the retraction?
MILLER: Well, which story is it? He keeps changing his story. So, how do you know what the story is? And --
HORN: I don't think that he's changed his story. He's been pretty clear. He has denied it. So has President Trump. So has Karoline Leavitt.
MILLER: He said it live on FOX News that he -- that he watched the strike.
HORN: And he stepped out after the second strike.
MILLER: First of all, the first strike was illegal. The second strike was clearly also illegal.
MICHAELSON: But he has defended. He's defended. But he has also said that the strike was the right call.
HORN: Of course. The strike is legal.
MICHAELSON: Do you think it was -- do you think it was the right call?
HORN: This is a group of people. This Tren de Aragua has been designated as a terrorist group by the Trump administration.
MILLER: You have no evidence. They have no evidence.
HORN: What about their boat full of drugs? I mean, Venezuela is --
MILLER: This is not how you --
HORN: -- a transit point for China and drug traffickers.
MILLER: You interdict the boat, and you charge them. You don't -- this -- this is clearly illegal. The entire thing. This is exactly what they're talking about.
HORN: I think that you have a terrorist group, and the government is in their right.
MILLER: And then they poor -- threw this poor admiral under the bus. Right? He's like, Oh, he's a fine American. And, you know, I support him.
HORN: I think that they've actually supported him. I mean, they seem to be supporting him and saying that he gave a lawful order. I don't think that anybody is throwing him under the bus.
I think that everybody within the Trump administration, and I maintain that this is a lawful strike. And I think Democrats simply just want to come up with a war crime so that they can save themselves.
MILLER: I think the latest story is this wasn't there. He was out doing shots. So, I think that's what he said. He didn't - He stepped out.
MICHAELSON: That's -- she's also joking about that.
Let's talk -- let's talk about the -- the -- a story happening here in Southern California. The L.A. County Board of Supervisors today approving this idea that it should be illegal for ICE, Border Patrol, other federal law enforcement agents to wear masks when they're out on patrol.
A lot of those folks in the federal government have said that they get doxed, that it is unsafe for them to be out doing this, which is why they wear the masks. What do you make of this? And is it even legal for -- for this, for
the board or for California to tell the federal government how to do their job?
MILLER: Yes, I think it is, because I think officers should -- they're -- I live right near the Home Depot, Elex. They are jumping out of trucks, not identifying themselves, and throwing people in vans.
I mean, it's -- there is -- that should be the bare minimum, that you have to have insignia and identify yourself. I'm sorry. They're wearing masks says they're cowards.
HORN: I think it's interesting that it's not legal for the Trump administration to bomb terrorists, but it is legal for a local government to tell federal agents what to wear.
This is the double standard that we have. We have to think about this story in Los Angeles. And look, I'll admit, and I --
MILLER: Terrorists or fishermen. We don't really know, but sure. Go ahead.
MICHAELSON: OK.
HORN: OK, I don't know about --that's an interesting kind of bait that those fishermen were using on their expedition.
But I will say in Los Angeles, look, I will be totally honest with you that I don't love the idea of federal agents wearing masks. I want people to be clearly identified.
But I also understand that it's a really dangerous time right now. You have snipers taking positions on buildings, trying to go after these guys. You have kids being threatened. And they have the right to protect themselves.
And here's the problem with L.A. County. They can vote all day long, but they have no jurisdiction over federal agents. That is the federal government's call, no matter what the board of supervisors want to impose.
MICHAELSON: On the state of California passed similar laws statewide from Scott Wiener, that president -- that Governor Newsom supported. Sorry, yes.
MILLER: Immigration used to be -- used to be Trump's best issue. He is underwater on that, along with every other issue. But underwater, because the American people are saying, not like this.
MICHAELSON: Yes.
MILLER: Nobody is for illegal immigration. But we are not like this, not what they are doing. They are terrorizing people.
MICHAELSON: Do you support the idea of -- of shutting down the border, the fact that there are so many fewer people coming across illegally because of what the Trump administration has done?
We could have had comprehensive immigration reform if it weren't for Republicans. George Bush was for it. John McCain was for it.
MICHAELSON: Yes.
[00:45:00]
MILLER: We've -- that's what we really need.
MICHAELSON: There were a lot of Democrats and Republicans who have not been for that.
HORN: Yes.
MICHAELSON: When Democrats had total control of Congress, they didn't pass it either.
MILLER: It was always Republicans that blocked it.
MICHAELSON: Yes. Yes.
MILLER: Even though there was a Republican president trying to get it done.
MICHAELSON: All right. We're going to have to leave it there. Spirited fun. Enjoy having both of you. Thank you so much.
MILLER: Last time you're going to win. Red for you.
MICHAELSON: All right. We'll be right back.
We've got this amazing violinist and a violin that's older than the country. We're going to have a live performance when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[00:50:08]
MICHAELSON: All right. It's time for something special. An ancient violin in the hands of a young master.
In the coming hours, 24-year-old Ray Ushikubo will play a 284-year-old violin at a free concert in downtown L.A.
Ray was selected to get an indefinite loan of the Playfair violin, an instrument that's older than the U.S. The Playfair was made in 1741. "The L.A. Times" says its value is somewhere in the eight-figure range, which is worth more than anything else here.
Ray, welcome to THE STORY IS, and thanks for bringing the violin.
RAY USHIKUBO, VIOLINIST: Thank you for having me and this incredible violin.
MICHAELSON: Is it, like, nerve-wracking for you to be around it? USHIKUBO: You know, I should say I feel nervous, but the more
appropriate term is excited.
MICHAELSON: Yes, you've had it for a couple months now.
USHIKUBO: Yes.
MICHAELSON: You've been playing. You haven't played it publicly yet.
USHIKUBO: Right.
MICHAELSON: Right? What -- what is it that makes this so special? And is there something different or better about an older violin compared to a newer one?
USHIKUBO: Well, the two most famous violin makers, I would say, are Stradivarius and Guarneri del Gesu, and they happen to be very old, so very rare to find. And thus, the incredible price range. However, they do sound the best, from my personal experience.
MICHAELSON: You can -- you can hear a difference?
USHIKUBO: Yes, I can clearly hear a difference.
The first time I played on this instrument this past summer, immediately, when I just played a few notes, immediately I knew it was something else. I mean, the sound had a type of shine in it that I had never quite heard often before.
MICHAELSON: And you've been playing for a long time, even though you're -- you're only 24, right? I mean, was it ten years old? You were on "The Tonight Show with Jay Leno" or something like that?
USHIKUBO: Yes. That's right. Yes.
MICHAELSON: Yes. I mean, you're, like, a child prodigy.
What is it about this instrument? What got you involved with this in the first place?
USHIKUBO: Well, I was very fortunate, because my violin teacher and the Colburn School connected me with the Colin Maki Violin Shop in New York. And they said, Do you want to try out this incredible violin? And I said, sure.
So, I flew to Aspen, Colorado, and I played on it, and it was -- I immediately fell in love with it.
MICHAELSON: Yes. No, but I mean, as a kid, what got you started?
USHIKUBO: Oh, as a kid.
MICHAELSON: Yes.
USHIKUBO: When I was about five, my parents were watching a Japanese TV series, and the deuteragonist was a pianist and violinist. And I thought, oh, my gosh, I want to be just like him.
And so, for my sixth birthday, my parents got me a $20 quarter-size violin. And the rest is history.
MICHAELSON: Talk to us about the big performance tomorrow. That's open and open to the public, right?
USHIKUBO: Yes. Tomorrow I will be performing on this violin in Zipper Hall at the Colburn School in downtown Los Angeles, tomorrow at 2 p.m.
MICHAELSON: But you're going to give us a little preview now.
USHIKUBO: Yes.
MICHAELSON: For everybody watching CNN around the world. So, what are you going to play for us?
USHIKIBO: This is the concertmaster solo from "The Meditation from Thais" by Jules Massenet.
MICHAELSON: Which is a little -- which is an older piece. Right?
USHIKIBO: Umm-hmm.
MICHAELSON: OK, take it away.
USHIKIBO: All right.
(MUSIC: CONCERTMASTER SOLO FROM "THE MEDITATION FROM THAIS" BY JULES MASSENET)
MICHAELSON: Bravo.
USHIKUBO: Thank you. Thank you.
[00:55:02]
MICHAELSON: That was so, so good.
USHIKUBO: Thank you.
MICHAELSON: Thank you so much. Our first live performance here on THE STORY IS.
So again, people can check you out tomorrow --
USHIKUBO: Yes.
MICHAELSON: -- at 2 p.m. Ray, thank you so much. Really appreciate it.
USHIKIBO: Thank you so much for having me.
MICHAELSON: We'll be back with more of THE STORY IS right after this. Will you play us to break?
USHIKIBO: Yes. (MUSIC)
MICHAELSON: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MICHAELSON: Check out these unique palm trees that are blooming in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil.
