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On the Story
A Look at John Allen Muhammad; Iran Agrees to Inspections of Nuclear Project
Aired October 25, 2003 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to CNN's ON THE STORY, where our journalists have the inside word on the stories we covered this week. I'm Jeanne Meserve, ON THE STORY of the first trial in the D.C. sniper case with suspect John Allen Muhammad even trying his hand as a lawyer.
JOSIE BURKE, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: I'm Josie Burke in New York, where tonight, the Yankees and Marlins play game six of the World Series. I'll be back later on the story of the history, the home runs, and even the hint of scandal that's made this a very unique fall classic.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And I'm Susan Candiotti, on the story of a right to die furor over a young woman named Terri Schiavo in Florida, as the debate surrounding her right to live or die involving her family, her lawyers, and even her state government, goes on.
PATTY DAVIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Patty Davis, in Washington. I'll be back later on the story of protests in the shadow of the White House about how the U.S. is fighting in Iraq and fighting terrorism at home.
ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN STATE DEPARTMENT CORRESPONDENT: I'm Andrea Koppel in Atlanta, on the story of how Iran agreed this week to international scrutiny of its nuclear program, while claiming, as it has all along, that it's for peaceful civilian use.
KATHLEEN HAYS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And I'm on the story of how the Feds raided Wal-Mart in 21 states this week. We're going to talk about all these stories.
We'll also be on the story of how the U.S. Senate took a big step this week to keep the spam off your computer. And we'll listen to the president's weekly radio address at the end of the hour. Email your comments to onthestory@cnn.com.
Now, straight to Jeanne Meserve and sniper trial.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was just basically a surreal experience to have a defendant, a person that's on trial be the one to question you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MESERVE: Paul Arufo (ph), one of the early witnesses in the first trial of a suspect in the D.C. sniper case, and he's talking about the surprise and temporary move by John Allen Muhammad to take over his own defense. You know, people had thought that the Malvo trial might be the more interesting of these sniper trials. It's going to be hard to match this one, which just had a wild first week.
CANDIOTTI: Jeanne, Susan here. I'm wondering how that's playing with the jury, the fact that Muhammad represented himself, at least for a short time.
MESERVE: Really difficult to say how it's playing with the jury. I can tell you that they didn't portray much in the way of facial emotion while he was acting as his own attorney. You know, he wasn't what we expected. Not what I expected, at least.
He was extraordinarily polite with everybody, fairly well spoken, didn't do a bad job, raised some objections, some of which were actually sustained by the judge in this case. And some people thought there was a real potential benefit to him in getting out there in front of the jury and displaying a little bit of his personality, talking a little bit about his view of this case, and perhaps coming across differently than what they might have expected, which may have been a very angry man. He didn't come across that way at all.
HAYS: Now if I'm following this correctly, his young accomplice, Malvo, was in the courtroom at one point this week. What is the interlink between these two trials, and how is Muhammad's appearance this week going to affect that outcome?
MESERVE: Actually, he was in the courtroom several times this week so witnesses could identify Malvo at several scenes. Prosecutors say he was sighted at several different locations. There was one really interesting moment when the jury was not in the room but Malvo and Muhammad both were. Muhammad had a toothache, and he'd been sitting with his hand on his cheek. And as Malvo turned to leave the courtroom, they locked eyes, and you could see Muhammad raise his fist and sort of make a motion like this.
It wasn't a wave, it wasn't a fist, but something sort of in the middle. It was intriguing to watch the interplay there.
As to the case, it's going to be really fascinating to see how they interlock. They're going to be fairly close to one another, they're going to overlap, and there's this real issue over whether -- who was shooting the gun, if indeed they are the guys who committed these crimes.
KOPPEL: Jeanne, I was wondering, the prosecution put forward an eyewitness from the Montgomery, Alabama case, which actually has more to do with Lee Boyd Malvo then it does with Muhammad. Why did they do that?
MESERVE: Well, they put on several witnesses around that case. That's sort of a pivotal moment here. There was a policeman who testified yesterday that he chased a young man from the scene. He's identified that individual as Lee Malvo. And then there was testimony that a 22 caliber handgun was found in the vicinity of that chase.
But at the same time, they talked about the victims in that shooting. There was two people shot; there was a woman killed and a woman wounded. And the medical examiner said that their wounds were consistent with a high-velocity rifle. Prosecutors tell us that will be the Bushmaster rifle that was used in the Washington sniper shootings.
So you have here an instance where there appear to be two guns at play, and therefore, two individuals. That would be Malvo and Muhammad. That's what prosecutors are going to contend; that's why they're talking so much about that case in particular.
CANDIOTTI: Jeanne, what was the atmosphere like in the courtroom as Muhammad was questioning one of his own alleged victims?
MESERVE: You know, the victim handled it pretty well while he was on the stand. This was Paul Arufo (ph), who you heard that sound bite from a little bit earlier. He remained fairly composed through all of this.
We were all extraordinarily curious to see what the interaction was going to be, but Arufo (ph) held it together. And it was only when he left the courtroom he talked about what a surreal experience it had been.
There was another victim who was on the stand. She was the woman who was wounded in Montgomery, Alabama. Muhammad did not question her. But as she left the courtroom, you could see her doing these sideways glances in his direction as she left the stand.
Also, there was a gentleman named Mohammed Rashid (ph) who had been shot at yet another earlier shooting. He was very emotional on the stand as well.
HAYS: You know, and that's one of the horrifying things I think about this whole trial, to kind of relive all those gory, horrible incidents.
MESERVE: Oh, and there are some incredibly difficult moments in there. They've been playing the 911 tapes in some of these early shootings. And Mohammed Rashid (ph), in particular, got extraordinarily emotional as he heard himself, because he was alone when he was shot in the parking lot of the liquor store where he worked.
You hear him on the phone saying "I'm dying. I'm dying. Oh my god. Oh my god." Very dramatic stuff and he was overcome.
First he dropped his head, and then put it down even further so we couldn't see his face. But clearly, an extraordinarily emotional moment for him.
And then, also, there were these photo displays. There are a series of screens in the courtroom. There is a big one facing the jury and smaller one so that we can sort of peek over and get some sense of what's on there. And they have been putting up photographs of the victims in life, also photographs of the victims in death, either at the crime scene or autopsy photos.
The defense has been leaping to its feet and saying, no, these should not be here, they're highly prejudicial. You can present this case without this. They've been overruled every time by the judge. But there are a lot of legal analysts out there who say this is very intentional on the part of the prosecution.
They want to get across to the jury the horror of these crimes. They're front-loading the case to make that impact right up front.
KOPPEL: Jeanne, why -- just looking ahead to the Lee Boyd Malvo case, why is it so important that his mother, who is a native of Jamaica, be allowed to remain in this country in order to testify on her son's case?
MESERVE: Well, it's very important for the defense in that case. There are two phases in these tries. It's a bifurcated system in Virginia, where first you have a guilt phase, and then you have a sentencing phase. Una James, the mother, we presume, is going to be very important if there is a guilty verdict during the mitigation phase because she's the one who can talk about the relationship between her son and John Muhammad.
And that is pivotal to the Malvo case. I mean, what his defense is going to say is that he was in the thrall of John Muhammad, that he was under his spell. There are few people who can go more to the real point of that than Una James can. So they've been fighting very hard to get her in here, and if she couldn't come, to make her available through video conferencing. The judge rejected that, and now it appears that she probably will be let in for a brief period during the trial, even though she had been in the country illegally and expelled.
CANDIOTTI: Jeanne, jurors aren't always allowed to take notes during a trial. They are in this instance. Are they doing it much?
MESERVE: Yes, they are. They are. I must say, this seems to be a very attentive jury. I have not seen anybody wandering mentally.
Nobody's falling asleep. Everybody's intent on what's happening before them, partially because this has been so dramatic. I mean, this really has been high-impact testimony they've been hearing there.
They are take notes. Those notes are collected every time they leave the courtroom and then redistributed again when they come back in.
HAYS: Final quick question. What is the sense of Muhammad, after representing himself, after questioning the jurors (ph), what impression do you think the jurors have? Do they have an impression of a nut or a man who really could have cold-bloodedly carried this out? MESERVE: That's a really hard question to answer. His opening statement was different, shall we say. Some people would character it as rambling. I wouldn't go that far, but it was certainly different than the conventional wisdom on what one would say in an opening statement.
But he was very lawyerly, as I said, very polite. I don't know what their impression is. Whether they come away thinking this is a guy who couldn't have done that, or come away thinking, wow, he must be really crazy if he did this because he's fooled himself into thinking he's a lawyer, I can't get inside their heads, I can't tell you how they feel.
One interesting thing though is the high publicity there has been in this case. A lot of publicity in Virginia Beach. The Malvo trial is going to be right next door.
Those potential jurors are reading all this stuff in the local paper. They're watching it in the newspapers. It's going to be really interesting to see how it impacts jury selection in that case when that comes out.
HAYS: A whole other interesting wrinkle. Well you know we're going to follow the trial in coming weeks, of course.
Another develop story this week, baseball, the World Series. A battle of an old, established rich team against the interlopers. Josie Burke is back on that story in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOSH BECKETT, MARLINS PITCHER: Nobody give us any credit. Nobody gives the Marlins any credit for being a good team. It's always about curses and billy goats and everything like that. That's what makes me mad.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURKE: That's Florida Marlins' 23-year-old pitcher Josh Beckett. He gets the start in game six tonight. Welcome back to ON THE STORY.
Beckett wondering why his team can't get a little attention. And one quick reason, Yankees, 26 world championships, Marlins one. But this guy, himself, he can't really complain about being off anyone's radar screen because ever since he was a 14-year-old throwing 95 mile an hour fastballs back in Texas, everyone has expected that he would be on this stage. And he'll certainly get his fair share of attention if he can somehow pitch the Marlins to a title tonight.
HAYS: Well, you know there is a theme in this series. Obviously, we touched on it at the beginning, Josie, that it seems like it's the kids, you know, up against the older guys, right? But -- and then the Yankees are supposed to win this and they're supposed to pull it out at the end. But it looks like -- what if there's an upset? Is that good for baseball or bad for baseball?
BURKE: Well, I think that baseball would argue that anytime more teams get involved, it's good for them. The Yankees have certainly been here, done that. They're seemingly in the World Series every year.
But to point out the fact that there are differences in these two franchises is certainly something that's been getting a lot of attention. The Marlins haven't been winning the series, if you look at how they're batting, and the fact they've been outscored. But they have been doing the little things that the Yankees normally do, and that's why they're on the verge of this upset. And it would be an upset just because of the disparity and history element.
KOPPEL: Josie, I forget the name of the player, the 37-year-old on the Marlins who is considered to be...
BURKE: Jeff Conine.
KOPPEL: Right, the old man of the team. He was saying before this series began that he was so surprised that none of the other players, the younger guys had said to him, "So what's it going to be like at the World Series?" Have you heard anything from the players since then? Are they talking a little more about it?
BURKE: Well, I think it was interesting, because I actually talked to Jeff Conine in the clubhouse last week. And he said that he thought that the guys would come and ask him, what's it going to like at Yankee Stadium? And they didn't.
And I thought that that was a sign that maybe things weren't all that right with that Marlins team. But clearly, it's worked for them. They said to a man (ph) that part of the reason they've been able to have success is they're not really aware of what's at stake, where they are, how big this moment is. But that's something that's certainly going to be tested tonight in Yankee Stadium, because after what the Yankees did in game seven of the ALCS at home against the Red Sox, there was a lot of talk about the fact, again, that there are ghosts in that place that somehow come out and work for New York in the postseason.
CANDIOTTI: Josie, you know where my loyalties must lie, of course, reporting to you from here in Miami, so go Marlins. But I love both teams. My question is, do you think Jack McKeon made the right call to go with Josh Beckett tonight and think positively, or should he have held off, do you think, until the seventh game, just in case?
BURKE: This has certainly gotten a lot of attention, a lot of scrutiny, because the element of -- the fact that Beckett is going to be pitching on short rest. Normally, a pitcher will have four day's rest and pitch on the fifth day. Well, he's only going to have three days rest and pitch on the fourth day.
A lot of people are now second-guessing this decision. But McKeon said, hey, you're sort of in a situation where no matter what you do, people are going to question it. McKeon's thinking is that this 23-year-old is young. His arm is strong and he's his best shot to wrap up this tonight.
There's a scary element playing a game seven in Yankee Stadium. He's hoping that Beckett gets it done tonight and they don't have to face that.
MESERVE: You know, Josie, there had been talk that baseball was fading as a sport. Is there a revival here? And would the revival had been even more pronounced if you had the Cubs and Sox in the series?
BURKE: Well, clearly, had the Red Sox and Cubs been playing in this series, we would have seen ratings off the chart. But as it is, ratings for the World Series are still up about 13 percent.
People got interested in those championship series because of the involvement of those two cursed franchises, and they've stuck with it. But the games have been going late. There haven't necessarily been night after night the most compelling games. There have certainly been at times compelling story lines and compelling finishes, but as -- in general, you can say that people are tuning in greater numbers than they have in the past.
HAYS: Well, you know, another interesting story line that has kind of crept up over the last couple of weeks, getting a lot more attention, is -- Jason Giambi (ph) is dragged into it as well -- is the unfolding drug scandal, designer steroids, formerly untraceable, now wheeling in people like Marion Jones, the great track and field runner. Josie, give us the latest on that story. And what is the implication for sports generally, and baseball in particular?
BURKE: Well, baseball in particular, it probably happened at the worst possible time because they wanted everyone to be focusing on the game itself. And we learned this week that Jason Giambi (ph) and also Barry Bonds, the huge slugger from the Giants, they've both been subpoenaed to testify before this federal grand jury that's investigating a laboratory in northern California called Balco.
At this point in time, no one is saying that those players are the subject of the investigation, they are merely going to be witnesses. But this is a story that gets bigger and bigger. And you can only imagine that it's not going to stop anytime soon.
Just the fact that in the last two weeks we've seen it get to the point where, not only is baseball involved, not only is track and field involved, you've got skiing now saying they're going to test for this new steroid. You have rugby saying they're going to test for it. This is going to cut across every sports professional and amateur league that you can imagine.
CANDIOTTI: Thank you, Josie. What are you looking for later today -- ON THE STORY predictions?
BURKE: I'm not in the business of predictions, but I will tell you it will be interesting to see -- we haven't seen champagne flowing in the visitor's clubhouse after a World Series game since 1981. It's been a long time. Everyone waiting to see if that's going to happen.
CANDIOTTI: Thank you, Josie. Well, when we come back, in Florida there is a life and death drama playing out here involving a young woman by the name of Terri Schiavo, living in a vegetative state. I'm back ON THE STORY in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOB SCHINDLER, TERRI SCHIAVO'S FATHER: Terri has brain damage. She's a disabled young woman. And she deserved a chance to recover and she never had that. And that's what we're going to do with her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CANDIOTTI: That's Bob Schindler, the father of Terri Schiavo, the brain-damaged woman at the center of a very public debate, a very painful one over the right to die or the right to live. Welcome back. I'm ON THE STORY.
New developments in this story that has been going on for more than 10 years. As you might recall, Terri Schiavo was taken off life support under a court order for about a week, and then last Monday, Florida Governor Jeb Bush got involved at the request of her parents and more or less got the Florida legislature to give him the power to make an end-run in effect, legal scholars say, around the courts, and have her feeding tube reinserted after she had been off life support for a week.
And she is now slowly getting stronger, according to all. But what is going to happen to her now is pretty much -- still very much a debate. More legal developments expected to come.
KOPPEL: Susan, is this a precedent to have the state legislature of Florida issue a law, giving the governor the right to, as you said, make an end-run around this decision?
CANDIOTTI: This has thrown a lot of legal scholars, Andrea. Many of them saying that this is out and out unconstitutional, because, they say, you cannot create a special law, a one-time law, just on behalf of one person to benefit one person. Many people say it is clearly unconstitutional.
Obviously, he has lawyers in the state of Florida telling him otherwise. But very few people doubt that this is not going to wind up before the Florida Supreme Court before it's over.
MESERVE: What's her condition now, Susan?
CANDIOTTI: Well, on Friday, when I was talking with the attorney who represents Michael Schiavo -- that's her husband -- he said that now that the feeding tube has been reinserted, she does appear gaunt. However, he said that her color, her complexion is good. And though there was fear that some of her organs had suffered some damage, that does not appear to be the case now. So everyone's waiting to see what's going to happen next. Now that the feeding tube is back in, her family is allowed to visit her, only with the permission of her husband. But it's very clear these two families don't get along.
HAYS: And that's certainly a big problem. Now some of the stories that have been written, some of the coverage of this, Susan, talks about the settlements that Michael Schiavo received, a suit against her ob-gyn, a suit against the family doctor. And the implication is that he has somehow misused these funds, used them for himself, casting him in a somewhat negative light. Is there any validity to this?
CANDIOTTI: Well, according to his lawyer, absolutely not. Yes, there was a malpractice award, a jury award that amounted to almost $1.5 million. However, the lawyers say all but about $50,000 of that has been spent on her care. And they say that he is not benefiting from this.
She has no money left in her estate when she does eventually die. And that he is not benefiting from this in the least. In fact, they said, look, obviously this is a man who loves his wife. Why else would he put himself through this?
He hasn't said much, Michael Schiavo has, for months now publicly. However, as we now know, he will be doing a live interview with Larry King for the first time in a long time on Monday evening.
KOPPEL: Susan this sounds like an advertisement for all of us signing a living will. I think -- does it come back to the issue of what is a mostly vegetative state, because that's what they say that Louise (ph) is in.
CANDIOTTI: Yes. Terri Schiavo.
KOPPEL: I'm sorry.
CANDIOTTI: Yes, she is in a vegetative state -- yes. Yes, of course, this has brought to the forefront once again how important it is to have a living will. And when people see these videotapes of her, and it appears that she is responding -- and her family absolutely believes she is responding to her -- most doctors say that these are simply involuntary movements that she would be reacting in this way, whether someone was in the room or was not in the room.
It's very, very sad. And we have to remember that the courts in this case, after hearing all the debate and all the evidence, did agree that she had told her husband at some point -- though it was never written down -- that she did not want to live a life like this. And so that's why he has had the legal right, as her guardian, to make the decision to withdraw that life support, the feeding tube.
HAYS: And it is a heartbreaking case. But certainly it is a reminder to people to include a living will as part of your estate plan. And you can download living wills from the Internet. It certainly underscores how important that is. From the fate of Terri Schiavo in Florida to the long-running debate over the national economy, where it is now, and where it's heading, I'm back on that story in a moment after this and a quick check on what's making headlines at this hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: When Americans have more take-home pay to spend, to save, or invest, the whole economy grows and people are more likely to find a job.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYS: President Bush at a fund-raiser in Hawaii at the end of his Asian trip this week, praising his economic program. Welcome back. We're ON THE STORY.
And of course, another interesting companion piece to this was Treasury Secretary John Snow out-speaking and saying how he expects the U.S. economy to create two million new jobs by November of next year. Now, so far, the economy has lost nearly three million jobs all the time President Bush has been in office. The exception, recently, being September, when the economy gained 57,000.
So it's a long way to go, but, certainly, everybody putting the best face on things. And it seems like trying to talk the economy up as best they can.
MESERVE: Can they do it?
HAYS: Well, you know, let's do the math. That's about 12 months, that's about 166,000 jobs a month, in a growing economy. Something around 150,000 to 200,000 would be no big deal.
I think right now there's a question. We're seeing a great surge in growth in the third quarter of this year. We're probably seeing good growth in the fourth quarter. And the question is, once the impact of the tax credit checks that went out dissipates and things settle down to a more leisurely pace of growth, will it be enough to keep creating kind of jobs you need to create to get the unemployment rate down, which is something around 150,000 jobs a month? Because this is obviously going to be such a big deal as you run into the election next year.
KOPPEL: How important is psychology to all of this, Kathleen? It seems as if, you know, if you say it enough, people will believe it, and then they'll do it. But is there really a psychological component to job creation?
HAYS: Well, let's look at it from the point of view of businesses, because they're the ones that have to hire, obviously. And I think that what -- one of the things that will build up business confidence very quickly is if the stock market keeps rallying. The stock market kind of hit a soft spot this week. And the president can say all he wants. The treasury secretary can say all he wants about the economy picking up. But there has to be orders. There has to be business picking up.
To give the administration their due, many people think that the tax credit checks have had an impact. They think that the dividend tax relief is encouraging more companies to pay dividends, that this is encouraging to investors. And people say, you know, the cuts in the marginal tax rates, which are going to carry over until 2004, are also going to have a positive impact. It's just a little too early to say if it's a sustainable kind of thing, the kind of thing that everyone in the country and in Washington is hoping to see.
CANDIOTTI: You know, we hear all the time about people who are losing their jobs. A lot of times to people overseas, to locations and factories over there. So what kinds of jobs are they trying to get created, or see being created here in the United States, since a lot of blue collar jobs are being exported?
HAYS: Well, actually, the problem is now, Susan, a lot of white collar jobs, too. You know, the customer service jobs, information processing jobs, even some research -- stock research kind of job, the kind you would find on Wall Street, have gone overseas to a certain extent.
A lot of job growth is supposed to be in things like health care. And some of that is high quality kind of job, high tech. But of course some of that is, you know, hospital care, the kind of thing that doesn't necessarily lend itself to the technological advantages that really keep an economy moving forward.
But when you talk about the whole question of jobs going overseas, it makes me think of one of the other big stories this week, you know, why send the jobs overseas? They're bringing a lot of the lowest paid blue collar jobs in by the fact that we have so many undocumented workers.
MESERVE: Well, there's real schizophrenia on that whole issue of illegal immigration in this country, isn't there?
HAYS: Well, there sure is. And of course, the raid on Wal-Mart, though, people think that may send a big signal. The Feds arrested some 250 undocumented aliens at 61 Wal-Marts across the country. And we know that there are something like eight million undocumented workers in a 140 million-person workforce.
Now, the past couple of years, the efforts to round up the undocumented workers have kind of languished, more focus on fighting terror. But some people think maybe the government will get more serious. The problem is that a lot of big companies, a lot of individual Americans, are benefiting from low-wage workers.
The problem is, right now, we have a lot of people who are out of work. People say Americans won't do those kinds of jobs, but I think on the side that is against just, you know, unstoppable immigration, the side that says, no, let's don't make these illegal workers legal, they say this is taking jobs away from American worker. It's driving down the pay scale at the lowest end of the ladder and making things much harder for people who are already here struggling to get a leg up.
KOPPEL: Well, doesn't Wal-Mart have a little bit of a loophole, Kathleen, because it doesn't hire these workers directly? And I'm sure a couple attorneys at Wal-Mart may have advised them to do that. They go through another company. So are they actually liable?
HAYS: That's a very good question. And of course, this is all under investigation right now. This case started in Pennsylvania. There was a grand jury investigation.
But the (UNINTELLIGIBLE) is that the government actually has some Wal-Mart executives on tape talking about these janitorial services that they contracted out, and the allegation is -- or the supposition is -- that they did know that the janitorial firms that they were contracted to knew that they hired illegal workers. And that's how the government may get Wal-Mart.
Remember, they're the biggest retailer in the world. They're the biggest employer in the country outside of the government. So this is a very, very important case.
But you know employers are only required to just ask workers if they have the right documents. They're not required to show the documents, they're not required to do any enforcement on their own, which make some experts feel that the laws, the government structure, has not really been serious about cracking down on this, again, because it benefits so many people. When the labor market was real tight in the late '90s, maybe it wasn't such an issue. But now with unemployment at six percent and unmeasured unemployment taking us to 10 or 12 percent, this is becoming a more important debate.
CANDIOTTI: Kathleen, I know you don't want to get into making predictions or giving people advice about what kind of stocks to buy, but since you said you're looking for growth in the health care sector, in terms of jobs, is that where people should be looking as one area in which to invest in the stock market?
HAYS: Well, it's interesting. This week, as I said, Susan, the stock market kind of stumbled. And even though the stock market had some really great earnings news, Microsoft, a tech giant, beat its forecast. J.P. Morgan, one of the big financial firms did well.
But people are really wondering now if a lot of the good news has been priced into the stock market. The earnings -- something like two-thirds of the companies in the S&P 500, very, very soundly beat their earnings forecast for the latest period we just went through. So I think right now experts are advising a little caution.
And it's interesting you bring up health care, because one of the things that caused the market to stumble at the end of the week was Merck. They're like one of the leading drug companies. But they are facing patents -- drugs have come off patent. They don't have new drugs in the pipeline. They're kind of stumbling. Pfizer is the leader. They did pretty well. But as Merck announced its earnings, which disappointed a bit, they also cut 44,000 jobs. And it just reminded people on Wall Street that it's still a mixed picture, and it's still a question of how far and how fast the market has come and how much further it can go.
I think a lot of people are saying, let's be cautious. Let's wait a minute and see how the next earnings goes and see how the economy really does as we get into the end of the year.
KOPPEL: Well, money matters were also a big part of U.S. international policy this week. I'll be ON THE STORY of the U.S. drumming up financial support for Iraq operations right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: Performance is what counts. And so we'll have to see exactly what the Iranians are prepared to do and what they're prepared to make available to the IAEA.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KOPPEL: Secretary of State Colin Powell signaling to Iran that actions will speak louder than words when it comes to reassuring the U.S. and the rest of the world about its nuclear plans. Welcome back. We're ON THE STORY.
You know, Iran's sudden 180 caught the Bush administration a little bit by surprise. They knew, of course, that the foreign ministers from France, Germany, and the U.K. had gone there. But there was this October 31st deadline just around the corner, and suddenly Iran, under pressure from the International Atomic Energy Association, agrees to the terms and says that they will temporarily suspend their nuclear reprocessing and enrichment and that they will agree to let nuclear inspectors come in the door. The big question is, though, when will they do it?
CANDIOTTI: Well, Andrea, why do you think Iran agreed to the suspension, at least temporarily, of this enriched uranium? And do you really think that they're going to follow through on unfettered inspections?
KOPPEL: Right. Well, the Bush administration is skeptical, to say the least. They're welcoming it as a positive move. Most believe that the main reason Iran is doing this is it truly had been backed into a corner.
It had all 35 members of the IAEA that had put pressure on it, saying unless it were to agree to those terms, to let inspectors in and to freeze its nuclear reprocessing, the uranium enrichment, that they might take some kind of economic sanctions or move towards economic sanctions. And so Iran has really pulled a -- you know, a surprise, pulled the rabbit out of the hat, and said, OK we agree. But one of their senior officials this week, Susan, said, We don't know if we'll agree to suspend for a day or for a year. So that's why the Bush administration is so skeptical.
MESERVE: Andrea, now Iran says it's going to send tourists into Iraq as part of the result of this donors' conference. The overall results of that, very disappointing to the administration?
KOPPEL: Well, you know, Jeanne, it's one of those things that could be the glass half full or the glass half empty. The Bush administration was very, very cautious going into this meeting, refused to set a figure for how much it hoped it would be able to raise. In fact, there was even talk a couple weeks back that some countries were saying maybe they shouldn't have the donors' conference because they wouldn't get very much money at all.
They came out with -- and I feel like I'm doing a Kathleen Hays segment here, so please bear with me with the numbers. But what you're talking about is the U.S. and the international community has said that they will need about $55 billion over the next four years. They came out of this conference with $33 billion.
But subtract from that the $20 billion that the U.S. has already said that it will pledge. It's still unclear how much will be loans, how much will be grants. So you come up with $13 billion. And then you keep subtracting -- you're talking about the World Bank anteing up about $4.5 billion, you're talking about the IMF anteing up several billion.
And then, thank got for Japan. The Japanese are also anteing up the remainder. And then you've got some change, a couple hundred million from the EU, a couple hundred million from the Canadians. And that's where you come up with the $13 billion.
Still fall far short of the $55, $56 billion that say they'll need over the next four year. And there's also a question, another big question, how much of it will be loans, how much will the Iraqis have to pay back, and how much will be just here's some grants?
HAYS: Right. And that's a tough thing, because they already have -- you want another number. I'm so glad you figured out the beauty of numbers, Andrea. But I think they already have something like $125 billion in foreign debt. And how will they ever pay that back?
But let's switch to another part of the world, because I was just really stunned by the events in North Korea this week, when we finally get, you know, China, U.S., Japan, you know, five nations to say, OK, North Korea, we won't attack you if you'll disarm. And the North Koreans just say, hey, that's a joke.
KOPPEL: Right. Well, hold on to your hat, because, as of today, the North Koreans are now saying well, you know, maybe we'll consider the latest suggestion by President Bush that there would be some kind of written security assurances in exchange for North Korea taking various steps towards freezing and eventually completely dismantling its nuclear program.
I got to tell you, I've been following North Korea for the last 10 years since I lived in Japan. And never be surprised by what the North Koreans do. These guys are the most amazing saber rattlers you'll ever believe.
They also today, at the same time they held out the carrot, they also fired off another short-range missile. So there are a lot of mixed signals. The North Koreans, when it comes right down to it, are all about regime survival. And so whatever it takes for Kim Jong-Il, the North Korean leader, to keep in power, he will do.
We don't know where this is going to go. But it's a fun story to follow.
MESERVE: And from reaction to U.S. policy overseas to protests here at home, my colleague Patty Davis is back ON THE STORY of a protest here in Washington right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's all loved ones who are on the line. So I think that we have a special voice that perhaps people will listen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DAVIS: That is Susan Shuman (ph). Her son is in Iraq. He's with the Massachusetts National Guard. She's with Military Families Speak Out, just one of many groups here today.
Welcome back. I am ON THE STORY here on the Washington Mall.
This group is going to start rallying here in just about an hour. Then they head up, march up to the White House, down to the Justice Department, and back here. Police say they expect some 40,000 to 50,000 protesters from 140 cities, 40 states, and they do expect it to be peaceful.
HAYS: Well, Patty, I have to say, I like any rally that starts out with some nice music in the background. It's a beautiful day here in Washington. But seriously, what is the point? What are these people trying to prove?
DAVIS: Well, what they're saying here is they want an end to the occupation, the U.S. military occupation of Iraq. They're also, interestingly, protesting against the U.S. Patriot Act, the second anniversary this weekend from when that was signed. They say it is an invasion of privacy.
And what they say that President Bush should be focusing on is the U.S. economy, how we've got high unemployment, we've got 43 million people without health insurance. This is where the priority needs to be, not a war in Iraq. The U.S. needs to pull its troops.
KOPPEL: Patty, we know before the war there were sort of a series of huge anti-war demonstrations. But to my memory, I think, is this the first since the war ended, or are we just not seeing a lot of them?
DAVIS: Well, you're right. The last one we saw was in April, and that was before President Bush came out and declared the combat phase over in Iraq.
What these people say they've been doing is reorganizing. They had to figure out where they go next, once the occupation was taking place. And they have reorganized. They come back and they say, what we'll do is start doing rallies like this.
We've been focusing on education, we've been focusing on sending letters and emails to Congress. And now it's time to get a large group out again and send this message.
CANDIOTTI: Patty, to what degree are you seeing families of troops represented at these protests? Because a lot of times, obviously, families of those who are serving in Iraq and other places are saying that they feel like protests like these are unpatriotic. How do those who are there respond to that?
DAVIS: Well, you know, it's very interesting. We (UNINTELLIGIBLE) about 50 families of military. And we're also being told that we do expect some active military here, some who will be heading over to Iraq. They plan to remain incognito.
We'll see if we can get interviews with some of them. I'm not sure. But they say that they certainly support the troops over there, they just don't support the policy of the United States. And they really believe -- we see people come back in body bags, they say, every day.
We don't want another Vietnam, is what they say. Bring our sons and daughters home. That's what you hear from these military families.
MESERVE: And Patty, there's another protest this afternoon, correct?
DAVIS: We have a counter-demonstration. Another group, Freedom -- it's a justice group, I'm trying to remember their name exactly -- it's called Free Republic, actually. And the D.C. chapter is going to be counter-demonstrating here in support of U.S. troops, in support of the U.S. policy on terrorism.
We don't know if we'll see a confrontation at some point. We'll just have to wait and see how the day develops. Right now though, our producer is estimating we're seeing about 8,000 anti-war protesters here. We're not sure how many counter-demonstrators that we'll see.
MESERVE: OK. Thanks, Patty. And President Bush gets his say in his weekly radio address. More when we're back ON THE STORY.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HAYS: Thanks to my colleagues. And thank you for watching ON THE STORY. We'll be back next week. Don't forget the time change, fall back.
Still ahead, "PEOPLE IN THE NEWS" with CNN's Richard Quest on the final transatlantic flight of the Concorde. At 12:00 noon Eastern, 9:00 a.m. Pacific, "CNN LIVE SATURDAY". And at 1:00 p.m. Eastern, 10:00 a.m. Pacific, CNN's "IN THE MONEY," with a look at airport security.
Coming up at the top of the hour, a check of the top stories. But first, the president's weekly radio address.
(BEGIN AUDIOTAPE)
BUSH: Good morning.
Last month, I addressed the United Nations and told member countries that the peace and security of Iraq are essential to the peace and security of all free nations. I encouraged countries to help the people of Iraq to build a future of freedom and stability. I also called for a U.N. resolution supporting the efforts of our coalition in Iraq.
The Security Council has now responded by unanimously passing Resolution 1511, which endorses a multinational force in Iraq under U.S. command and urges greater international support for Iraqi reconstruction. In recent week, leaders of South Korea, Japan, Great Britain, Denmark, Spain, and other nations have committed billion of dollars to Iraqi reconstruction.
This week brought even more progress. In Madrid, representatives of more than 70 nations and international bodies, including the World Bank, UNICEF and the Organization of the Islamic Conference gathered to discuss the future needs of Iraq and the ways in which other countries can help. And these nations and international organizations pledged billions of dollars to aid the reconstruction of Iraq.
This growing financial support will allow us to build on the success of the broad military coalition already serving in Iraq. Today, American forces in Iraq are joined by about 24,000 troops from 32 other countries, including Great Britain, Poland, the Czech Republic, Italy, Spain the Netherlands, Thailand, El Salvador, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, Ukraine and the Philippines. Coalition forces are helping to hunt down the terrorists and Saddam holdouts, clearing mines from Iraqi waterways so that aid shipments can proceed, and coordinating the recruitment and training of a new Iraqi police force, army and border police.
Members of our coalition are also showing the compassion of our cause in Iraq. We are rebuilding schools and clinics and power plants. The Iraqi people are moving steadily toward a free and democratic society. Economic life is being restored to the cities. A new Iraqi currency is circulating.
Local governments are up and running. And Iraq will soon begin the process of drafting a constitution with free elections to follow.
There's still difficult work ahead because freedom has enemies in Iraq. Terrorists and loyalists of the former regime reveal their true character by their choice of targets. They've attacked diplomats and embassies, relief workers and the United Nations headquarters in Baghdad, all symbols of the international effort to help the Iraqi people.
America and the international community will not be intimidated. Every coalition member understands that Iraq must never again become the home of tyranny and terror and a threat to the world. So we will be patient and determined and unified.
America will continue working with the United Nations and our coalition partners to finish the work we have begun. Having liberated Iraq from a brutal tyrant, we will stand with the people of Iraq as that country becomes more stable, secure and free.
Thank you for listening.
(END AUDIOTAPE)
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of Nuclear Project>
Aired October 25, 2003 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to CNN's ON THE STORY, where our journalists have the inside word on the stories we covered this week. I'm Jeanne Meserve, ON THE STORY of the first trial in the D.C. sniper case with suspect John Allen Muhammad even trying his hand as a lawyer.
JOSIE BURKE, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: I'm Josie Burke in New York, where tonight, the Yankees and Marlins play game six of the World Series. I'll be back later on the story of the history, the home runs, and even the hint of scandal that's made this a very unique fall classic.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And I'm Susan Candiotti, on the story of a right to die furor over a young woman named Terri Schiavo in Florida, as the debate surrounding her right to live or die involving her family, her lawyers, and even her state government, goes on.
PATTY DAVIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Patty Davis, in Washington. I'll be back later on the story of protests in the shadow of the White House about how the U.S. is fighting in Iraq and fighting terrorism at home.
ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN STATE DEPARTMENT CORRESPONDENT: I'm Andrea Koppel in Atlanta, on the story of how Iran agreed this week to international scrutiny of its nuclear program, while claiming, as it has all along, that it's for peaceful civilian use.
KATHLEEN HAYS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And I'm on the story of how the Feds raided Wal-Mart in 21 states this week. We're going to talk about all these stories.
We'll also be on the story of how the U.S. Senate took a big step this week to keep the spam off your computer. And we'll listen to the president's weekly radio address at the end of the hour. Email your comments to onthestory@cnn.com.
Now, straight to Jeanne Meserve and sniper trial.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was just basically a surreal experience to have a defendant, a person that's on trial be the one to question you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MESERVE: Paul Arufo (ph), one of the early witnesses in the first trial of a suspect in the D.C. sniper case, and he's talking about the surprise and temporary move by John Allen Muhammad to take over his own defense. You know, people had thought that the Malvo trial might be the more interesting of these sniper trials. It's going to be hard to match this one, which just had a wild first week.
CANDIOTTI: Jeanne, Susan here. I'm wondering how that's playing with the jury, the fact that Muhammad represented himself, at least for a short time.
MESERVE: Really difficult to say how it's playing with the jury. I can tell you that they didn't portray much in the way of facial emotion while he was acting as his own attorney. You know, he wasn't what we expected. Not what I expected, at least.
He was extraordinarily polite with everybody, fairly well spoken, didn't do a bad job, raised some objections, some of which were actually sustained by the judge in this case. And some people thought there was a real potential benefit to him in getting out there in front of the jury and displaying a little bit of his personality, talking a little bit about his view of this case, and perhaps coming across differently than what they might have expected, which may have been a very angry man. He didn't come across that way at all.
HAYS: Now if I'm following this correctly, his young accomplice, Malvo, was in the courtroom at one point this week. What is the interlink between these two trials, and how is Muhammad's appearance this week going to affect that outcome?
MESERVE: Actually, he was in the courtroom several times this week so witnesses could identify Malvo at several scenes. Prosecutors say he was sighted at several different locations. There was one really interesting moment when the jury was not in the room but Malvo and Muhammad both were. Muhammad had a toothache, and he'd been sitting with his hand on his cheek. And as Malvo turned to leave the courtroom, they locked eyes, and you could see Muhammad raise his fist and sort of make a motion like this.
It wasn't a wave, it wasn't a fist, but something sort of in the middle. It was intriguing to watch the interplay there.
As to the case, it's going to be really fascinating to see how they interlock. They're going to be fairly close to one another, they're going to overlap, and there's this real issue over whether -- who was shooting the gun, if indeed they are the guys who committed these crimes.
KOPPEL: Jeanne, I was wondering, the prosecution put forward an eyewitness from the Montgomery, Alabama case, which actually has more to do with Lee Boyd Malvo then it does with Muhammad. Why did they do that?
MESERVE: Well, they put on several witnesses around that case. That's sort of a pivotal moment here. There was a policeman who testified yesterday that he chased a young man from the scene. He's identified that individual as Lee Malvo. And then there was testimony that a 22 caliber handgun was found in the vicinity of that chase.
But at the same time, they talked about the victims in that shooting. There was two people shot; there was a woman killed and a woman wounded. And the medical examiner said that their wounds were consistent with a high-velocity rifle. Prosecutors tell us that will be the Bushmaster rifle that was used in the Washington sniper shootings.
So you have here an instance where there appear to be two guns at play, and therefore, two individuals. That would be Malvo and Muhammad. That's what prosecutors are going to contend; that's why they're talking so much about that case in particular.
CANDIOTTI: Jeanne, what was the atmosphere like in the courtroom as Muhammad was questioning one of his own alleged victims?
MESERVE: You know, the victim handled it pretty well while he was on the stand. This was Paul Arufo (ph), who you heard that sound bite from a little bit earlier. He remained fairly composed through all of this.
We were all extraordinarily curious to see what the interaction was going to be, but Arufo (ph) held it together. And it was only when he left the courtroom he talked about what a surreal experience it had been.
There was another victim who was on the stand. She was the woman who was wounded in Montgomery, Alabama. Muhammad did not question her. But as she left the courtroom, you could see her doing these sideways glances in his direction as she left the stand.
Also, there was a gentleman named Mohammed Rashid (ph) who had been shot at yet another earlier shooting. He was very emotional on the stand as well.
HAYS: You know, and that's one of the horrifying things I think about this whole trial, to kind of relive all those gory, horrible incidents.
MESERVE: Oh, and there are some incredibly difficult moments in there. They've been playing the 911 tapes in some of these early shootings. And Mohammed Rashid (ph), in particular, got extraordinarily emotional as he heard himself, because he was alone when he was shot in the parking lot of the liquor store where he worked.
You hear him on the phone saying "I'm dying. I'm dying. Oh my god. Oh my god." Very dramatic stuff and he was overcome.
First he dropped his head, and then put it down even further so we couldn't see his face. But clearly, an extraordinarily emotional moment for him.
And then, also, there were these photo displays. There are a series of screens in the courtroom. There is a big one facing the jury and smaller one so that we can sort of peek over and get some sense of what's on there. And they have been putting up photographs of the victims in life, also photographs of the victims in death, either at the crime scene or autopsy photos.
The defense has been leaping to its feet and saying, no, these should not be here, they're highly prejudicial. You can present this case without this. They've been overruled every time by the judge. But there are a lot of legal analysts out there who say this is very intentional on the part of the prosecution.
They want to get across to the jury the horror of these crimes. They're front-loading the case to make that impact right up front.
KOPPEL: Jeanne, why -- just looking ahead to the Lee Boyd Malvo case, why is it so important that his mother, who is a native of Jamaica, be allowed to remain in this country in order to testify on her son's case?
MESERVE: Well, it's very important for the defense in that case. There are two phases in these tries. It's a bifurcated system in Virginia, where first you have a guilt phase, and then you have a sentencing phase. Una James, the mother, we presume, is going to be very important if there is a guilty verdict during the mitigation phase because she's the one who can talk about the relationship between her son and John Muhammad.
And that is pivotal to the Malvo case. I mean, what his defense is going to say is that he was in the thrall of John Muhammad, that he was under his spell. There are few people who can go more to the real point of that than Una James can. So they've been fighting very hard to get her in here, and if she couldn't come, to make her available through video conferencing. The judge rejected that, and now it appears that she probably will be let in for a brief period during the trial, even though she had been in the country illegally and expelled.
CANDIOTTI: Jeanne, jurors aren't always allowed to take notes during a trial. They are in this instance. Are they doing it much?
MESERVE: Yes, they are. They are. I must say, this seems to be a very attentive jury. I have not seen anybody wandering mentally.
Nobody's falling asleep. Everybody's intent on what's happening before them, partially because this has been so dramatic. I mean, this really has been high-impact testimony they've been hearing there.
They are take notes. Those notes are collected every time they leave the courtroom and then redistributed again when they come back in.
HAYS: Final quick question. What is the sense of Muhammad, after representing himself, after questioning the jurors (ph), what impression do you think the jurors have? Do they have an impression of a nut or a man who really could have cold-bloodedly carried this out? MESERVE: That's a really hard question to answer. His opening statement was different, shall we say. Some people would character it as rambling. I wouldn't go that far, but it was certainly different than the conventional wisdom on what one would say in an opening statement.
But he was very lawyerly, as I said, very polite. I don't know what their impression is. Whether they come away thinking this is a guy who couldn't have done that, or come away thinking, wow, he must be really crazy if he did this because he's fooled himself into thinking he's a lawyer, I can't get inside their heads, I can't tell you how they feel.
One interesting thing though is the high publicity there has been in this case. A lot of publicity in Virginia Beach. The Malvo trial is going to be right next door.
Those potential jurors are reading all this stuff in the local paper. They're watching it in the newspapers. It's going to be really interesting to see how it impacts jury selection in that case when that comes out.
HAYS: A whole other interesting wrinkle. Well you know we're going to follow the trial in coming weeks, of course.
Another develop story this week, baseball, the World Series. A battle of an old, established rich team against the interlopers. Josie Burke is back on that story in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOSH BECKETT, MARLINS PITCHER: Nobody give us any credit. Nobody gives the Marlins any credit for being a good team. It's always about curses and billy goats and everything like that. That's what makes me mad.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURKE: That's Florida Marlins' 23-year-old pitcher Josh Beckett. He gets the start in game six tonight. Welcome back to ON THE STORY.
Beckett wondering why his team can't get a little attention. And one quick reason, Yankees, 26 world championships, Marlins one. But this guy, himself, he can't really complain about being off anyone's radar screen because ever since he was a 14-year-old throwing 95 mile an hour fastballs back in Texas, everyone has expected that he would be on this stage. And he'll certainly get his fair share of attention if he can somehow pitch the Marlins to a title tonight.
HAYS: Well, you know there is a theme in this series. Obviously, we touched on it at the beginning, Josie, that it seems like it's the kids, you know, up against the older guys, right? But -- and then the Yankees are supposed to win this and they're supposed to pull it out at the end. But it looks like -- what if there's an upset? Is that good for baseball or bad for baseball?
BURKE: Well, I think that baseball would argue that anytime more teams get involved, it's good for them. The Yankees have certainly been here, done that. They're seemingly in the World Series every year.
But to point out the fact that there are differences in these two franchises is certainly something that's been getting a lot of attention. The Marlins haven't been winning the series, if you look at how they're batting, and the fact they've been outscored. But they have been doing the little things that the Yankees normally do, and that's why they're on the verge of this upset. And it would be an upset just because of the disparity and history element.
KOPPEL: Josie, I forget the name of the player, the 37-year-old on the Marlins who is considered to be...
BURKE: Jeff Conine.
KOPPEL: Right, the old man of the team. He was saying before this series began that he was so surprised that none of the other players, the younger guys had said to him, "So what's it going to be like at the World Series?" Have you heard anything from the players since then? Are they talking a little more about it?
BURKE: Well, I think it was interesting, because I actually talked to Jeff Conine in the clubhouse last week. And he said that he thought that the guys would come and ask him, what's it going to like at Yankee Stadium? And they didn't.
And I thought that that was a sign that maybe things weren't all that right with that Marlins team. But clearly, it's worked for them. They said to a man (ph) that part of the reason they've been able to have success is they're not really aware of what's at stake, where they are, how big this moment is. But that's something that's certainly going to be tested tonight in Yankee Stadium, because after what the Yankees did in game seven of the ALCS at home against the Red Sox, there was a lot of talk about the fact, again, that there are ghosts in that place that somehow come out and work for New York in the postseason.
CANDIOTTI: Josie, you know where my loyalties must lie, of course, reporting to you from here in Miami, so go Marlins. But I love both teams. My question is, do you think Jack McKeon made the right call to go with Josh Beckett tonight and think positively, or should he have held off, do you think, until the seventh game, just in case?
BURKE: This has certainly gotten a lot of attention, a lot of scrutiny, because the element of -- the fact that Beckett is going to be pitching on short rest. Normally, a pitcher will have four day's rest and pitch on the fifth day. Well, he's only going to have three days rest and pitch on the fourth day.
A lot of people are now second-guessing this decision. But McKeon said, hey, you're sort of in a situation where no matter what you do, people are going to question it. McKeon's thinking is that this 23-year-old is young. His arm is strong and he's his best shot to wrap up this tonight.
There's a scary element playing a game seven in Yankee Stadium. He's hoping that Beckett gets it done tonight and they don't have to face that.
MESERVE: You know, Josie, there had been talk that baseball was fading as a sport. Is there a revival here? And would the revival had been even more pronounced if you had the Cubs and Sox in the series?
BURKE: Well, clearly, had the Red Sox and Cubs been playing in this series, we would have seen ratings off the chart. But as it is, ratings for the World Series are still up about 13 percent.
People got interested in those championship series because of the involvement of those two cursed franchises, and they've stuck with it. But the games have been going late. There haven't necessarily been night after night the most compelling games. There have certainly been at times compelling story lines and compelling finishes, but as -- in general, you can say that people are tuning in greater numbers than they have in the past.
HAYS: Well, you know, another interesting story line that has kind of crept up over the last couple of weeks, getting a lot more attention, is -- Jason Giambi (ph) is dragged into it as well -- is the unfolding drug scandal, designer steroids, formerly untraceable, now wheeling in people like Marion Jones, the great track and field runner. Josie, give us the latest on that story. And what is the implication for sports generally, and baseball in particular?
BURKE: Well, baseball in particular, it probably happened at the worst possible time because they wanted everyone to be focusing on the game itself. And we learned this week that Jason Giambi (ph) and also Barry Bonds, the huge slugger from the Giants, they've both been subpoenaed to testify before this federal grand jury that's investigating a laboratory in northern California called Balco.
At this point in time, no one is saying that those players are the subject of the investigation, they are merely going to be witnesses. But this is a story that gets bigger and bigger. And you can only imagine that it's not going to stop anytime soon.
Just the fact that in the last two weeks we've seen it get to the point where, not only is baseball involved, not only is track and field involved, you've got skiing now saying they're going to test for this new steroid. You have rugby saying they're going to test for it. This is going to cut across every sports professional and amateur league that you can imagine.
CANDIOTTI: Thank you, Josie. What are you looking for later today -- ON THE STORY predictions?
BURKE: I'm not in the business of predictions, but I will tell you it will be interesting to see -- we haven't seen champagne flowing in the visitor's clubhouse after a World Series game since 1981. It's been a long time. Everyone waiting to see if that's going to happen.
CANDIOTTI: Thank you, Josie. Well, when we come back, in Florida there is a life and death drama playing out here involving a young woman by the name of Terri Schiavo, living in a vegetative state. I'm back ON THE STORY in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOB SCHINDLER, TERRI SCHIAVO'S FATHER: Terri has brain damage. She's a disabled young woman. And she deserved a chance to recover and she never had that. And that's what we're going to do with her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CANDIOTTI: That's Bob Schindler, the father of Terri Schiavo, the brain-damaged woman at the center of a very public debate, a very painful one over the right to die or the right to live. Welcome back. I'm ON THE STORY.
New developments in this story that has been going on for more than 10 years. As you might recall, Terri Schiavo was taken off life support under a court order for about a week, and then last Monday, Florida Governor Jeb Bush got involved at the request of her parents and more or less got the Florida legislature to give him the power to make an end-run in effect, legal scholars say, around the courts, and have her feeding tube reinserted after she had been off life support for a week.
And she is now slowly getting stronger, according to all. But what is going to happen to her now is pretty much -- still very much a debate. More legal developments expected to come.
KOPPEL: Susan, is this a precedent to have the state legislature of Florida issue a law, giving the governor the right to, as you said, make an end-run around this decision?
CANDIOTTI: This has thrown a lot of legal scholars, Andrea. Many of them saying that this is out and out unconstitutional, because, they say, you cannot create a special law, a one-time law, just on behalf of one person to benefit one person. Many people say it is clearly unconstitutional.
Obviously, he has lawyers in the state of Florida telling him otherwise. But very few people doubt that this is not going to wind up before the Florida Supreme Court before it's over.
MESERVE: What's her condition now, Susan?
CANDIOTTI: Well, on Friday, when I was talking with the attorney who represents Michael Schiavo -- that's her husband -- he said that now that the feeding tube has been reinserted, she does appear gaunt. However, he said that her color, her complexion is good. And though there was fear that some of her organs had suffered some damage, that does not appear to be the case now. So everyone's waiting to see what's going to happen next. Now that the feeding tube is back in, her family is allowed to visit her, only with the permission of her husband. But it's very clear these two families don't get along.
HAYS: And that's certainly a big problem. Now some of the stories that have been written, some of the coverage of this, Susan, talks about the settlements that Michael Schiavo received, a suit against her ob-gyn, a suit against the family doctor. And the implication is that he has somehow misused these funds, used them for himself, casting him in a somewhat negative light. Is there any validity to this?
CANDIOTTI: Well, according to his lawyer, absolutely not. Yes, there was a malpractice award, a jury award that amounted to almost $1.5 million. However, the lawyers say all but about $50,000 of that has been spent on her care. And they say that he is not benefiting from this.
She has no money left in her estate when she does eventually die. And that he is not benefiting from this in the least. In fact, they said, look, obviously this is a man who loves his wife. Why else would he put himself through this?
He hasn't said much, Michael Schiavo has, for months now publicly. However, as we now know, he will be doing a live interview with Larry King for the first time in a long time on Monday evening.
KOPPEL: Susan this sounds like an advertisement for all of us signing a living will. I think -- does it come back to the issue of what is a mostly vegetative state, because that's what they say that Louise (ph) is in.
CANDIOTTI: Yes. Terri Schiavo.
KOPPEL: I'm sorry.
CANDIOTTI: Yes, she is in a vegetative state -- yes. Yes, of course, this has brought to the forefront once again how important it is to have a living will. And when people see these videotapes of her, and it appears that she is responding -- and her family absolutely believes she is responding to her -- most doctors say that these are simply involuntary movements that she would be reacting in this way, whether someone was in the room or was not in the room.
It's very, very sad. And we have to remember that the courts in this case, after hearing all the debate and all the evidence, did agree that she had told her husband at some point -- though it was never written down -- that she did not want to live a life like this. And so that's why he has had the legal right, as her guardian, to make the decision to withdraw that life support, the feeding tube.
HAYS: And it is a heartbreaking case. But certainly it is a reminder to people to include a living will as part of your estate plan. And you can download living wills from the Internet. It certainly underscores how important that is. From the fate of Terri Schiavo in Florida to the long-running debate over the national economy, where it is now, and where it's heading, I'm back on that story in a moment after this and a quick check on what's making headlines at this hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: When Americans have more take-home pay to spend, to save, or invest, the whole economy grows and people are more likely to find a job.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAYS: President Bush at a fund-raiser in Hawaii at the end of his Asian trip this week, praising his economic program. Welcome back. We're ON THE STORY.
And of course, another interesting companion piece to this was Treasury Secretary John Snow out-speaking and saying how he expects the U.S. economy to create two million new jobs by November of next year. Now, so far, the economy has lost nearly three million jobs all the time President Bush has been in office. The exception, recently, being September, when the economy gained 57,000.
So it's a long way to go, but, certainly, everybody putting the best face on things. And it seems like trying to talk the economy up as best they can.
MESERVE: Can they do it?
HAYS: Well, you know, let's do the math. That's about 12 months, that's about 166,000 jobs a month, in a growing economy. Something around 150,000 to 200,000 would be no big deal.
I think right now there's a question. We're seeing a great surge in growth in the third quarter of this year. We're probably seeing good growth in the fourth quarter. And the question is, once the impact of the tax credit checks that went out dissipates and things settle down to a more leisurely pace of growth, will it be enough to keep creating kind of jobs you need to create to get the unemployment rate down, which is something around 150,000 jobs a month? Because this is obviously going to be such a big deal as you run into the election next year.
KOPPEL: How important is psychology to all of this, Kathleen? It seems as if, you know, if you say it enough, people will believe it, and then they'll do it. But is there really a psychological component to job creation?
HAYS: Well, let's look at it from the point of view of businesses, because they're the ones that have to hire, obviously. And I think that what -- one of the things that will build up business confidence very quickly is if the stock market keeps rallying. The stock market kind of hit a soft spot this week. And the president can say all he wants. The treasury secretary can say all he wants about the economy picking up. But there has to be orders. There has to be business picking up.
To give the administration their due, many people think that the tax credit checks have had an impact. They think that the dividend tax relief is encouraging more companies to pay dividends, that this is encouraging to investors. And people say, you know, the cuts in the marginal tax rates, which are going to carry over until 2004, are also going to have a positive impact. It's just a little too early to say if it's a sustainable kind of thing, the kind of thing that everyone in the country and in Washington is hoping to see.
CANDIOTTI: You know, we hear all the time about people who are losing their jobs. A lot of times to people overseas, to locations and factories over there. So what kinds of jobs are they trying to get created, or see being created here in the United States, since a lot of blue collar jobs are being exported?
HAYS: Well, actually, the problem is now, Susan, a lot of white collar jobs, too. You know, the customer service jobs, information processing jobs, even some research -- stock research kind of job, the kind you would find on Wall Street, have gone overseas to a certain extent.
A lot of job growth is supposed to be in things like health care. And some of that is high quality kind of job, high tech. But of course some of that is, you know, hospital care, the kind of thing that doesn't necessarily lend itself to the technological advantages that really keep an economy moving forward.
But when you talk about the whole question of jobs going overseas, it makes me think of one of the other big stories this week, you know, why send the jobs overseas? They're bringing a lot of the lowest paid blue collar jobs in by the fact that we have so many undocumented workers.
MESERVE: Well, there's real schizophrenia on that whole issue of illegal immigration in this country, isn't there?
HAYS: Well, there sure is. And of course, the raid on Wal-Mart, though, people think that may send a big signal. The Feds arrested some 250 undocumented aliens at 61 Wal-Marts across the country. And we know that there are something like eight million undocumented workers in a 140 million-person workforce.
Now, the past couple of years, the efforts to round up the undocumented workers have kind of languished, more focus on fighting terror. But some people think maybe the government will get more serious. The problem is that a lot of big companies, a lot of individual Americans, are benefiting from low-wage workers.
The problem is, right now, we have a lot of people who are out of work. People say Americans won't do those kinds of jobs, but I think on the side that is against just, you know, unstoppable immigration, the side that says, no, let's don't make these illegal workers legal, they say this is taking jobs away from American worker. It's driving down the pay scale at the lowest end of the ladder and making things much harder for people who are already here struggling to get a leg up.
KOPPEL: Well, doesn't Wal-Mart have a little bit of a loophole, Kathleen, because it doesn't hire these workers directly? And I'm sure a couple attorneys at Wal-Mart may have advised them to do that. They go through another company. So are they actually liable?
HAYS: That's a very good question. And of course, this is all under investigation right now. This case started in Pennsylvania. There was a grand jury investigation.
But the (UNINTELLIGIBLE) is that the government actually has some Wal-Mart executives on tape talking about these janitorial services that they contracted out, and the allegation is -- or the supposition is -- that they did know that the janitorial firms that they were contracted to knew that they hired illegal workers. And that's how the government may get Wal-Mart.
Remember, they're the biggest retailer in the world. They're the biggest employer in the country outside of the government. So this is a very, very important case.
But you know employers are only required to just ask workers if they have the right documents. They're not required to show the documents, they're not required to do any enforcement on their own, which make some experts feel that the laws, the government structure, has not really been serious about cracking down on this, again, because it benefits so many people. When the labor market was real tight in the late '90s, maybe it wasn't such an issue. But now with unemployment at six percent and unmeasured unemployment taking us to 10 or 12 percent, this is becoming a more important debate.
CANDIOTTI: Kathleen, I know you don't want to get into making predictions or giving people advice about what kind of stocks to buy, but since you said you're looking for growth in the health care sector, in terms of jobs, is that where people should be looking as one area in which to invest in the stock market?
HAYS: Well, it's interesting. This week, as I said, Susan, the stock market kind of stumbled. And even though the stock market had some really great earnings news, Microsoft, a tech giant, beat its forecast. J.P. Morgan, one of the big financial firms did well.
But people are really wondering now if a lot of the good news has been priced into the stock market. The earnings -- something like two-thirds of the companies in the S&P 500, very, very soundly beat their earnings forecast for the latest period we just went through. So I think right now experts are advising a little caution.
And it's interesting you bring up health care, because one of the things that caused the market to stumble at the end of the week was Merck. They're like one of the leading drug companies. But they are facing patents -- drugs have come off patent. They don't have new drugs in the pipeline. They're kind of stumbling. Pfizer is the leader. They did pretty well. But as Merck announced its earnings, which disappointed a bit, they also cut 44,000 jobs. And it just reminded people on Wall Street that it's still a mixed picture, and it's still a question of how far and how fast the market has come and how much further it can go.
I think a lot of people are saying, let's be cautious. Let's wait a minute and see how the next earnings goes and see how the economy really does as we get into the end of the year.
KOPPEL: Well, money matters were also a big part of U.S. international policy this week. I'll be ON THE STORY of the U.S. drumming up financial support for Iraq operations right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: Performance is what counts. And so we'll have to see exactly what the Iranians are prepared to do and what they're prepared to make available to the IAEA.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KOPPEL: Secretary of State Colin Powell signaling to Iran that actions will speak louder than words when it comes to reassuring the U.S. and the rest of the world about its nuclear plans. Welcome back. We're ON THE STORY.
You know, Iran's sudden 180 caught the Bush administration a little bit by surprise. They knew, of course, that the foreign ministers from France, Germany, and the U.K. had gone there. But there was this October 31st deadline just around the corner, and suddenly Iran, under pressure from the International Atomic Energy Association, agrees to the terms and says that they will temporarily suspend their nuclear reprocessing and enrichment and that they will agree to let nuclear inspectors come in the door. The big question is, though, when will they do it?
CANDIOTTI: Well, Andrea, why do you think Iran agreed to the suspension, at least temporarily, of this enriched uranium? And do you really think that they're going to follow through on unfettered inspections?
KOPPEL: Right. Well, the Bush administration is skeptical, to say the least. They're welcoming it as a positive move. Most believe that the main reason Iran is doing this is it truly had been backed into a corner.
It had all 35 members of the IAEA that had put pressure on it, saying unless it were to agree to those terms, to let inspectors in and to freeze its nuclear reprocessing, the uranium enrichment, that they might take some kind of economic sanctions or move towards economic sanctions. And so Iran has really pulled a -- you know, a surprise, pulled the rabbit out of the hat, and said, OK we agree. But one of their senior officials this week, Susan, said, We don't know if we'll agree to suspend for a day or for a year. So that's why the Bush administration is so skeptical.
MESERVE: Andrea, now Iran says it's going to send tourists into Iraq as part of the result of this donors' conference. The overall results of that, very disappointing to the administration?
KOPPEL: Well, you know, Jeanne, it's one of those things that could be the glass half full or the glass half empty. The Bush administration was very, very cautious going into this meeting, refused to set a figure for how much it hoped it would be able to raise. In fact, there was even talk a couple weeks back that some countries were saying maybe they shouldn't have the donors' conference because they wouldn't get very much money at all.
They came out with -- and I feel like I'm doing a Kathleen Hays segment here, so please bear with me with the numbers. But what you're talking about is the U.S. and the international community has said that they will need about $55 billion over the next four years. They came out of this conference with $33 billion.
But subtract from that the $20 billion that the U.S. has already said that it will pledge. It's still unclear how much will be loans, how much will be grants. So you come up with $13 billion. And then you keep subtracting -- you're talking about the World Bank anteing up about $4.5 billion, you're talking about the IMF anteing up several billion.
And then, thank got for Japan. The Japanese are also anteing up the remainder. And then you've got some change, a couple hundred million from the EU, a couple hundred million from the Canadians. And that's where you come up with the $13 billion.
Still fall far short of the $55, $56 billion that say they'll need over the next four year. And there's also a question, another big question, how much of it will be loans, how much will the Iraqis have to pay back, and how much will be just here's some grants?
HAYS: Right. And that's a tough thing, because they already have -- you want another number. I'm so glad you figured out the beauty of numbers, Andrea. But I think they already have something like $125 billion in foreign debt. And how will they ever pay that back?
But let's switch to another part of the world, because I was just really stunned by the events in North Korea this week, when we finally get, you know, China, U.S., Japan, you know, five nations to say, OK, North Korea, we won't attack you if you'll disarm. And the North Koreans just say, hey, that's a joke.
KOPPEL: Right. Well, hold on to your hat, because, as of today, the North Koreans are now saying well, you know, maybe we'll consider the latest suggestion by President Bush that there would be some kind of written security assurances in exchange for North Korea taking various steps towards freezing and eventually completely dismantling its nuclear program.
I got to tell you, I've been following North Korea for the last 10 years since I lived in Japan. And never be surprised by what the North Koreans do. These guys are the most amazing saber rattlers you'll ever believe.
They also today, at the same time they held out the carrot, they also fired off another short-range missile. So there are a lot of mixed signals. The North Koreans, when it comes right down to it, are all about regime survival. And so whatever it takes for Kim Jong-Il, the North Korean leader, to keep in power, he will do.
We don't know where this is going to go. But it's a fun story to follow.
MESERVE: And from reaction to U.S. policy overseas to protests here at home, my colleague Patty Davis is back ON THE STORY of a protest here in Washington right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's all loved ones who are on the line. So I think that we have a special voice that perhaps people will listen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DAVIS: That is Susan Shuman (ph). Her son is in Iraq. He's with the Massachusetts National Guard. She's with Military Families Speak Out, just one of many groups here today.
Welcome back. I am ON THE STORY here on the Washington Mall.
This group is going to start rallying here in just about an hour. Then they head up, march up to the White House, down to the Justice Department, and back here. Police say they expect some 40,000 to 50,000 protesters from 140 cities, 40 states, and they do expect it to be peaceful.
HAYS: Well, Patty, I have to say, I like any rally that starts out with some nice music in the background. It's a beautiful day here in Washington. But seriously, what is the point? What are these people trying to prove?
DAVIS: Well, what they're saying here is they want an end to the occupation, the U.S. military occupation of Iraq. They're also, interestingly, protesting against the U.S. Patriot Act, the second anniversary this weekend from when that was signed. They say it is an invasion of privacy.
And what they say that President Bush should be focusing on is the U.S. economy, how we've got high unemployment, we've got 43 million people without health insurance. This is where the priority needs to be, not a war in Iraq. The U.S. needs to pull its troops.
KOPPEL: Patty, we know before the war there were sort of a series of huge anti-war demonstrations. But to my memory, I think, is this the first since the war ended, or are we just not seeing a lot of them?
DAVIS: Well, you're right. The last one we saw was in April, and that was before President Bush came out and declared the combat phase over in Iraq.
What these people say they've been doing is reorganizing. They had to figure out where they go next, once the occupation was taking place. And they have reorganized. They come back and they say, what we'll do is start doing rallies like this.
We've been focusing on education, we've been focusing on sending letters and emails to Congress. And now it's time to get a large group out again and send this message.
CANDIOTTI: Patty, to what degree are you seeing families of troops represented at these protests? Because a lot of times, obviously, families of those who are serving in Iraq and other places are saying that they feel like protests like these are unpatriotic. How do those who are there respond to that?
DAVIS: Well, you know, it's very interesting. We (UNINTELLIGIBLE) about 50 families of military. And we're also being told that we do expect some active military here, some who will be heading over to Iraq. They plan to remain incognito.
We'll see if we can get interviews with some of them. I'm not sure. But they say that they certainly support the troops over there, they just don't support the policy of the United States. And they really believe -- we see people come back in body bags, they say, every day.
We don't want another Vietnam, is what they say. Bring our sons and daughters home. That's what you hear from these military families.
MESERVE: And Patty, there's another protest this afternoon, correct?
DAVIS: We have a counter-demonstration. Another group, Freedom -- it's a justice group, I'm trying to remember their name exactly -- it's called Free Republic, actually. And the D.C. chapter is going to be counter-demonstrating here in support of U.S. troops, in support of the U.S. policy on terrorism.
We don't know if we'll see a confrontation at some point. We'll just have to wait and see how the day develops. Right now though, our producer is estimating we're seeing about 8,000 anti-war protesters here. We're not sure how many counter-demonstrators that we'll see.
MESERVE: OK. Thanks, Patty. And President Bush gets his say in his weekly radio address. More when we're back ON THE STORY.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HAYS: Thanks to my colleagues. And thank you for watching ON THE STORY. We'll be back next week. Don't forget the time change, fall back.
Still ahead, "PEOPLE IN THE NEWS" with CNN's Richard Quest on the final transatlantic flight of the Concorde. At 12:00 noon Eastern, 9:00 a.m. Pacific, "CNN LIVE SATURDAY". And at 1:00 p.m. Eastern, 10:00 a.m. Pacific, CNN's "IN THE MONEY," with a look at airport security.
Coming up at the top of the hour, a check of the top stories. But first, the president's weekly radio address.
(BEGIN AUDIOTAPE)
BUSH: Good morning.
Last month, I addressed the United Nations and told member countries that the peace and security of Iraq are essential to the peace and security of all free nations. I encouraged countries to help the people of Iraq to build a future of freedom and stability. I also called for a U.N. resolution supporting the efforts of our coalition in Iraq.
The Security Council has now responded by unanimously passing Resolution 1511, which endorses a multinational force in Iraq under U.S. command and urges greater international support for Iraqi reconstruction. In recent week, leaders of South Korea, Japan, Great Britain, Denmark, Spain, and other nations have committed billion of dollars to Iraqi reconstruction.
This week brought even more progress. In Madrid, representatives of more than 70 nations and international bodies, including the World Bank, UNICEF and the Organization of the Islamic Conference gathered to discuss the future needs of Iraq and the ways in which other countries can help. And these nations and international organizations pledged billions of dollars to aid the reconstruction of Iraq.
This growing financial support will allow us to build on the success of the broad military coalition already serving in Iraq. Today, American forces in Iraq are joined by about 24,000 troops from 32 other countries, including Great Britain, Poland, the Czech Republic, Italy, Spain the Netherlands, Thailand, El Salvador, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, Ukraine and the Philippines. Coalition forces are helping to hunt down the terrorists and Saddam holdouts, clearing mines from Iraqi waterways so that aid shipments can proceed, and coordinating the recruitment and training of a new Iraqi police force, army and border police.
Members of our coalition are also showing the compassion of our cause in Iraq. We are rebuilding schools and clinics and power plants. The Iraqi people are moving steadily toward a free and democratic society. Economic life is being restored to the cities. A new Iraqi currency is circulating.
Local governments are up and running. And Iraq will soon begin the process of drafting a constitution with free elections to follow.
There's still difficult work ahead because freedom has enemies in Iraq. Terrorists and loyalists of the former regime reveal their true character by their choice of targets. They've attacked diplomats and embassies, relief workers and the United Nations headquarters in Baghdad, all symbols of the international effort to help the Iraqi people.
America and the international community will not be intimidated. Every coalition member understands that Iraq must never again become the home of tyranny and terror and a threat to the world. So we will be patient and determined and unified.
America will continue working with the United Nations and our coalition partners to finish the work we have begun. Having liberated Iraq from a brutal tyrant, we will stand with the people of Iraq as that country becomes more stable, secure and free.
Thank you for listening.
(END AUDIOTAPE)
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