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On the Story

Life in Aceh Slowly Improving; American Aid to Tsunami Victims Possibly Slow but Making up for Lost Ground

Aired January 08, 2005 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to CNN's ON THE STORY where our journalists have the inside word on the devastation in southern Asia and other stories we covered this week.

I'm Barbara Starr on the story of how the U.S. military is making a difference in helping tsunami victims.

KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I'm Kathleen Koch on the story of President Bush raising the amount of U.S. aid and getting eyewitness reports from his brother and Secretary of State Powell.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: I'm Elizabeth Cohen in Atlanta on the story of the rush to fight off disease in the areas hardest hit in southern Asia.

KATHLEEN HAYES, CNN FINANCIAL CORRESPONDENT: And I'm Kathleen Hayes on the story of how American companies are digging down to send money and supplies to the tsunami victims.

Atika Shubert is standing by in Banda Aceh, Indonesia with the latest on the tsunami aftermath.

And later in the hour we'll go to Sri Lanka where CNN's Paula Hancocks is also on the tsunami story.

E-mail us at onthestory@cnn.com.

Now, straight to Indonesia, Banda Aceh the area that may have suffered the most.

COHEN: The sounds of children, tsunami survivors, many of them now orphans, they're in Banda Aceh, the area of Indonesia hardest hit two weeks ago. On the story on that corner of the disaster is CNN's Atika Shubert.

Atika, tell us what's the latest in your area.

ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the latest in the city of Banda Aceh is that life is slowly returning to normal but it's going to take some time before it's really fully functioning yet.

Today is the first day we've been able to see supermarkets start to open. Markets are in full force with fresh vegetables and so forth but it's taking a long time for people to clear up the wreckage here because heavy moving equipment is taking so long to get here.

We went to the market today where people are just now starting to pick through the wreckage of their storefronts and there was one bulldozer there trying to plug its way through but it's going to take probably another six months before it's up and running as normal.

STARR: Atika, what are you seeing on the ground in terms of how much aid is directly getting through to the people and what the medical assistance situation is like right now?

SHUBERT: Well, in terms of the aid reaching this city of Banda Aceh, a lot of it is coming through. Every day here we see lines, orderly lines for food, clean water, medical supplies and that's the good news.

The bad news is on the west coast of Aceh, which was the area closest to the epicenter and the hardest hit, it is still almost -- it is virtually inaccessible by road.

The only way to reach those areas is by helicopter, so what that means is that clean water, food, medical supplies are very tough to come by there and they're really just being air dropped in and there has to be a better way to get the supplies that they need.

At the moment those survivors are really just living off of those air drops and there's no free flow of relief coming through there yet, so that's the first problem.

In terms of medical relief and medical aid what we do find in the city of Banda Aceh is that there are hospitals but they're overflowing so there's actually a desperate need to create more hospitals, so much so that a lot of victims are actually being medivac'd out to other cities in Indonesia like Medan (ph), so there's still a lot that needs to be done; however, it is at least coming through slowly.

HAYES: Atika, one thing that is striking about these people is in a way how calm they have been. Now, probably many of them are in true shock. They have been so traumatized but as the days go on what is the mood of the people? Are they patient? Are they getting impatient? How long can that patience persist?

SHUBERT: Sure. It's a good question because what we found the first couple of days were everyone here was so traumatized. They had this look, this hollow look in their eyes and whenever you talked to them the only thing that they could tell you is exactly what happened to them, where they were in the tsunami, what happened to their family, often breaking down into tears every time you spoke to them.

But after a few days we found their tears started to dry up. They wanted to move on with their lives and try and pick up the pieces and now we're in the stage where people are still mourning. They're devastated by what happened but they feel that in order to move on with their lives they need to get on with the business of salvaging what's left, picking up the pieces.

And it's important to know that the Acehnese (ph) are very proud people. They're people that have been used to a lot of -- a lot of disasters that have happened here, of course nothing on this scale but they're a very resilient people and they want to be able to move on and show that they're survivors.

KOCH: Atika, I know that when I'm watching the coverage from the region I've been moved to tears on almost a daily basis by the stories I've seen but I can turn the television off. I can go do something else.

But how do you as a journalist there, how do you cope because you can't look away? You're there 24/7, you and the rescue and the relief workers how are you managing?

SHUBERT: Well, it can be tough. I think the first couple of days was really overwhelming because when we first came to the city here in Banda Aceh nothing had been cleared up. There was debris and bodies everywhere and just to see the scale of the devastation and to literally be walking through streets filled with dead that was truly a very overwhelming experience.

And you talk about being reduced to tears, I think it's safe to say that I know I was and a lot of our crew were certainly reduced to tears those first few days.

Having said that, in the following -- in the days recently, there's been hope coming through and you see people trying to get on with their lives, strangers helping other victims, doing what they can and in that sense actually it's been encouraging and it's been nice to cover those kind of hopeful stories, so there's a heartening aspect to it as well.

COHEN: Atika, how are they coping with the problem of having so many orphan children?

SHUBERT: Well, it is a problem. Fortunately, though, when we talked to people at the United Nations Children's Fund or UNICEF they say one of the good things about Aceh is that it has a very strong extended family culture and community culture so that orphans if they're not -- if they have lost their immediate family are usually able to be placed with someone in the extended family.

And even if not the extended family, usually their neighbors or other members of the community are willing to take them in, so that kind of social support network is there.

But having said that, UNICEF says it's very important to register and identify all of these children, orphans or children who have lost just one parent. The reason for that is because they want to prevent any illegal trafficking of these children.

They're obviously very vulnerable now. They're left alone in the world and they want to make sure that they're able to track where they go, make sure not only that they're with a good family and they're being taken care of but also that that family then has enough to support this extra child.

STARR: Atika, even with this extended family structure in Aceh, are there refugee camps? Are most people now living in some sort of camp structure?

SHUBERT: Oh, yes. There are tens of thousands of people living in these displacement camps and at the very beginning of this crisis in a few days they really just gathered in these wide open spaces, mosques, any sort of public space that could hold them. They didn't have any tents or tarps and it was a very desperate situation.

That has improved. Recently what we've seen is a lot of the aid workers have come in, put them under plastic tarps and tents, been able to put together some sort of rudimentary sanitation system.

But again it's very, very basis and there still is a great need for more sanitation, more of these relief efforts to come in but the vast majority of the people who have lost their houses are now living in these sort of tent cities and, as you can imagine, it is a very difficult life. It's been pouring all day today. It only makes life worse for them now.

HAYES: Atika, what has been the reaction to the visit, for example, by Secretary of State Colin Powell and, of course, there have been many Senators and dignitaries? How do the people react to that?

SHUBERT: I think many people here are encouraged. Because the reaction was initially slow to Aceh, many people just didn't know the extent of the devastation because all of the infrastructure and communications here had been wiped out.

So, aid was initially quite slow coming to Aceh, so now that it's here and literally flooding in with these dignitaries visiting, a lot of Acehnese says that they're grateful to have this attention, although they do feel it's a little too late.

They're happy to have all this aid now coming in and it's certainly a good sign to see Secretary of State Colin Powell, for example, coming in. A lot of people here feeling that America is very much needed in this situation because of the vast resources they can apply to this rescue effort.

KOCH: Atika Shubert, thank you very much and good luck on covering that very difficult story in the coming days.

We will return to the disaster region in a moment and talk to Paula Hancocks in Sri Lanka.

President Bush pledged that America will be there to help the victims. I'm back on that story after this.

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GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We offer our sustained compassion and our generosity and our assurance that America will be there to help.

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KOCH: President Bush started the week by saying that the United States has committed $350 million, as well as quite a bit of military aid.

Welcome back, we're ON THE STORY.

STARR: Well that, Kathleen, may have been the announcement from the White House this week but clearly in the first days last week, the first days of this crisis the president appeared to be a little bit off tone, off message on this disaster.

KOCH: Quite true, Barbara and that was at least the initial perception I think worldwide and it was actually a very uncharacteristic reaction for this president who, you know, who is really -- the formative event in his presidency was 9/11 so he's used to dealing with a disaster and also personally.

He very quickly after disasters worldwide, after the death of a world leader or after say a suicide bombing in Israel, he quickly comes out, offers his condolences. So it was quite uncharacteristic the first week for him only to offer a statement on paper of condolence the day, the very day of the disaster, not to come out publicly on camera until Wednesday.

And then, for the offering of U.S. aid to only gradually creep up, starting at $15 million Monday, $35 million Wednesday and then only up to the very substantial $350 million by Friday and it was only at that point that the president actually called the leaders of these countries on Wednesday. He sent them letters so it was very odd.

KOCH: So what are people saying behind the scenes then? Because obviously we've seen the criticism I the press and we know he's made up for lost time. He sent his brother and Colin Powell.

He got two ex-presidents, including his dad, to start raising money. We'll talk about that in a minute. Behind the scenes though what is the White House saying "We blew it" or "We just didn't see the picture soon enough" or what?

KOCH: There were a lot of things I think that came to play here. The White House was very sensitive about not wanting to say, distract attention from what was going on in the region, didn't want say to send people there, like say Powell, Jeb Bush or the president himself even to the aid conference.

They said "We want the focus to stay on the ground." The president doesn't have to come out on camera right away to show that he cares. You know, but again this criticism was out there but the White House really felt like they were -- they were doing the right thing, a measured response in a measured way.

And this week they've really recuperated. As you saw the president came right out Monday morning with what was a very well kept secret, the announcement having his father and then having President Clinton lead this nationwide aid effort.

And it's very much in keeping with the president's philosophy of private aid, not the government being responsible for all the aid that comes forth to any disaster. The president is very big on his faith- based initiatives with religious organizations coming out and helping the needy, not only in the U.S. but globally, lots of other things.

He donated $10,000 himself personally and then he's already met with his brother Jeb Bush. He's gotten a report on the region and will meet with Colin Powell on Monday.

COHEN: Kathleen, while the announcement this week was certainly dramatic you never get a second chance to make a first impression. Are there any feelings that there are any ramifications to what many perceive as a delay in the response immediately after the disaster?

KOCH: Well, I think the White House does not believe that there will be. I mean this is a very generous offer now, the $350 million of U.S. aid and the White House actually from the start when they initially announced the $15 million they said it was an initial response, initial aid and they always said that it would be adjusted according to the situation that they saw on the ground.

But clearly there is a great deal of concern. The Secretary of State, Secretary Powell made that point himself in the region that it is very important to reach out to the people there, in particular the Muslims, Indonesia being the largest Muslim country in the world because these are people whose hearts and minds it is important to win.

This is an important opportunity and if we don't reach out to them, get them the aid, get them the help they need right away then they could be vulnerable to say exploitation and recruitment by terrorist groups.

STARR: Now, the tsunami, of course, has dominated the news for so many days but there was other news in Washington this week. Congress is back in town and there was a confirmation hearing for attorney general that almost really went by unnoticed in the wake of all the tsunami news.

KOCH: And that was a confirmation hearing for the White House attorney, the president's own attorney Alberto Gonzales, an attorney who had served him when he was governor of Texas.

And I don't think though that the White House minded too much that the attention was a bit distracted from his confirmation hearings this week on Thursday because those were the sorts of hearings that would ordinarily have been covered gavel to gavel. But instead what we literally saw was that we were, even networks like ours, 24 hour networks were dipping in and out of that coverage. One important thing to point out, another action that the president took Congress did come back into session this week. One of their first actions was to say that all aid that Americans donate through the end of the month can now be deducted on their 2004 taxes and President Bush signed that yesterday.

STARR: Well, shifting a bit the focus from the White House to the Pentagon on both tsunami relief and Iraq. I'm back on those stories after this.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They were very excited to see us oftentimes running up underneath the helicopter, running around the tail rotor, so you're a little afraid at first and then you see a body or you see someone that's severely hurt and you're brought back to the reality of what had happened there.

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STARR: The front lines for the U.S. military in the disaster areas of southern Asia, major military muscle send in already, more on the way and a substantial part of what the U.S. has promised and will do in coming months.

Welcome back we're ON THE STORY.

KOCH: Barbara, some may have accused the president of being a bit slow off the mark in responding to the tsunami but I will tell you the U.S. military seemed to be there in just a heartbeat. Tell me what are they able to accomplish right now? What's the latest there?

STARR: You know, Kathleen, it's one of the stories that we see again and again. Once the U.S. military gets the orders from the political side of the house it is one of their great capabilities to move themselves from one side of the world to the other, as we saw in those pictures of the helicopter.

What they are continuing to do, of course, is ferry in food, water, medical assistance and what we are hearing from the U.S. Pacific Command is medical assistance is one of the things they're focusing on right now. That certainly is going to be a very long-term need, a lot of concern about disease and epidemic coming down the road in 30 days or so.

So, what they are looking at is what do they have to provide, what kinds of medical assistance can they put into the region that will really help this crisis over the long term? They know they're going to be there for quite a while.

COHEN: Barbara, of course, you're still covering the story in Iraq. The election is weeks away. Violence remains at high levels. What are you hearing about hopes for having real true elections given the situation? STARR: Well, Iraq really is, you're right Elizabeth, still the focus of what the Pentagon is looking at. Elections now less than 30 days away, a great deal of concern about violence.

I just returned from Iraq just before the holidays and what you hear is a great deal of concern. The U.S. is absolutely determined the elections will go forward. Interim President Allawi is determined the elections will go forward but yet we hear about these violent attacks every single day, every expectation that violence is going to grow.

KOCH: Barbara, if they cannot protect the governor of Baghdad who was murdered this week, how can they protect people at the polls? There are many Sunni groups who are saying delay the elections. We are now the minority in the country. Apparently many of the Shias are saying no, go ahead, and the Iraqis themselves are saying that could be then an illegitimate election, which leads to chaos not to more stability.

STARR: The issue, of course, that Allawi, President Allawi sees that President Bush sees if they delay the election, it's giving into the insurgents. That's how they view it that the insurgents then have achieved a victory and they are bound and determined that that will not happen.

Fourteen of 18 provinces they believe are relatively calm and that they can have elections. Of course, it is the Sunni Triangle, Falluja, Ramadi, Baghdad up to Mosul, Tikrit, all of these areas where the violence is continuing to grow and that they're the most concerned about. They're putting more troops in and, of course, the major unspoken issue is those Iraqi security forces how they perform.

KOCH: Barbara, you know, that's what I wanted to ask you about. I mean we are hearing from the Pentagon on a daily basis how when those elections begin January 30th they will rely so heavily on the Iraqi military for security in the immediate area, right there around those polling places but their track record up until now has been dismal.

STARR: Very iffy, very, very iffy. I mean we were hearing this in Iraq when we were there just before Christmas. At the highest levels of the U.S. military and I mean the highest there is a great deal of concern about Iraqi security forces.

We saw this week retired Four-Star General Gary Luck. He is headed over to Iraq to conduct an assessment. He's not conducting an assessment because things are going good. He's conducting an assessment because things are not going very well.

They know that they have got to get these Iraqi security forces up running and really fighting as a cohesive force to defend their country. That is going to be the solution to the insurgency. The assessment is, of course, there is not enough U.S. firepower to defeat an insurgency. The Iraqis are going to have to do it themselves.

COHEN: And, Barbara, it sounds from what you're saying that delaying the elections is not an option.

STARR: Not for the United States and it will be very interesting. At the last minute, if for some reason the Iraqi interim government decides it wants to delay the election, procedurally how will that take place because this election has all been set forth in the transition that happened last year, in the United Nations' decisions that the election would happen on January 30th. That train is moving and there seems to be nothing at this point that is going to stop it.

KOCH: Well, there's a couple weeks left to go. We shall see what happens next.

From Iraq we're going to turn back to the tragedy in southern Asia. I'll be talking about U.S. companies offering supplies, money and other aid.

And we'll go back to the tsunami region to talk with CNN's Paula Hancocks in Sri Lanka. We're back on that story too after this.

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BUSH: The greatest source of America's generosity is not our government. It's the good heart of the American people. In the weeks since the tsunami struck, private citizens have contributed millions of dollars.

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KOCH: President Bush on Monday and that good heart, as the president puts it, has generated millions of goods and services and cash to help tsunami victims.

Welcome back, we're ON THE STORY.

COHEN: Kathleen, the tsunami, of course, affected coastal areas. Is the economy operating normally inland in these countries? HAYES: I think that's a very interesting point, Elizabeth, about what is the economic impact of this because I think when we see all the devastation we think well this has got to be a terrible blow to the economies of Southeast Asia but that's the whole point.

The shore area is devastated but you could -- and the roads gone. This is going to be a huge cost, part of the rebuilding and all that aid money that the president is talking about that has been piling up.

But inland base economies, their factories, their services, everything functioning very well. It's interesting that the forecasts are for maybe a tiny little bit of GDP shaved off of these economies this year.

But it also varies between the big countries, like India and Indonesia. I mean India has actually pledged aid to Colombo, so they're standing on fairly solid ground. Sri Lanka, though, a small country, a poor country devastated and, again, the economic impact for these basically subsistent fishing communities is huge and that's why so much of this aid money is going to be so important.

These people don't have insurance. Insurance companies won't take a hit but, again, they don't have the kind of support system that we just take for granted in modern industrialized countries.

STARR: And that seems to be one of the key questions now. Billions of dollars flowing into the region how is that money really going to get down to the local fishermen on the coast, the local village that has been wiped out?

HAYES: Well, first let's start by looking at some of the billions of dollars because, you know, the tally for just charitable contributions is so far $337 million was the number I saw this morning and, of course, this includes millions of dollars from corporations.

I think we have a list of some of them, Pfizer giving $10 million in cash, $25 million in drugs; Citigroup $3 million. You can see G.E. at $1 million, Coca Cola giving $10 million, not on that list but also involved in providing bottled water. Everyone wants to help. There's been a huge outpouring.

Now it's interesting that right now Australia is the country that has pledged the most, over $800 million, double the United States' $350 million but it's also interesting that their officials have been raising the question of we prefer to get involved directly say with Indonesia, where they're going to concentrate their relief money to make sure that the money does get directly into organizations that are going to rebuild, get the money to the people.

Whereas, some people would say it's OK to go through some of the big multilateral organizations, go through the U.N., so I think that's going to be part of the debate moving forward.

And there have been cases in the past where millions were given in all good will and all good heart but because of people trying to rebuild too much too fast, like in Central America after Hurricane Mitch, a World Bank study suggesting that a few years later not even half of the money was actually spent. Again, this is something I think that people will be very carefully watching in the months ahead.

KOCH: Kathleen, you know, obviously so many of these countries that were hit by the earthquake and then the tsunami were really poverty stricken already. Does debt relief come to play here or forgiveness, is that on the table? What are the chances of (UNINTELLIGIBLE)?

HAYES: Oh that came to the fore very quickly. The Germans have been pushing for this. Gordon Brown, who is the U.K.'s finance minister, who is the chairman this year of the group of seven, group of eight, depending on if you include Russia or not, this is, you know, the world's richest nations, they're going to be talking about debt relief in February.

The Paris Club, which is a loosely organized group of the big, rich countries is meeting next week. They're also talking about a debt moratorium which would be these countries that have billions of dollars of debt, most of them do in this region, could just delay their interest payments, maybe even have some debt forgiveness.

But the question is, again, would that help the people on the ground or some people say it would just help the governments themselves and so they're wondering if -- how much debt relief will really be in the cards. But, again, the hearts are in the right place. People are just figuring out the best way to get it done.

COHEN: So many people want to give money and want to help out and there are so many different charities to give to. Is there a way to figure out if you give your money which charity do you have the highest hopes that it will go directly to the victims and not go to some kind of administrative costs?

KOCH: There's a great website, among many, charitynavigator.org talks a lot about different organizations and you can ask any charity for information on how much of their money goes directly to the people, how much is used for administration? It really varies from charity to charity so it's probably really something for people to check out if that concerns them.

And I think it's very interesting too, one more thing I'd like to add, Doctors Without Borders, who are very heavily involved in this relief effort have already said, it's on their website, "Don't send us any more money that is earmarked for tsunami victims."

They're saying continue to send us money for emergency relief. Remember the Darfur and the Sudan there was lots of people who suffered all kinds of calamities.

This happens yearly just not of this scope, not so much in the glare of the television cameras and I think they're just trying to tell people keep sending money but if you haven't sent yet or you want to send more, maybe it's good to think a little more broadly about the many, many people who are suffering around the world.

STARR: And, Kathleen, just to touch on one domestic economic event during the week, the jobs picture. We always talk about that.

HAYES: Well, good news for the United States. Jobs are growing again and when you compare us to what people are suffering other places, our problems seem very small.

STARR: Of course.

HAYES: But one problem for us is wage growth. We went from a jobless recovery last year, people are calling, some people are calling it a payless recovery this year. You can see the economy added 157,000 jobs, over two million jobs last year, the first decent, first positive job growth since the recession but wages on average up only 2.7 percent.

Inflation is running at 3.5 percent, not keeping up with the cost of living. A survey of small businesses this past week showed that last year jobs grew more than 4 percent but wages actually fell. They said there are just too many people out there.

When you sit down to sign on the dotted line the boss says "Take it or leave it." You said, "Well, I'm making less than I made in my last job." They say, "Well, there's someone else we can give the job to. If you don't want it, they'll take it." That's the kind of thing a lot of American workers are facing.

COHEN: Well, from the business world we're going to go back to southern Asia and CNN's Paula Hancocks.

Also coming up why the race against time is so crucial in the coming days in Southern Asia to help injured tsunami victims and protect them from disease.

We're back on that story after this.

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STARR: Children reaching out for emergency supplies in Sri Lanka. Food and other necessities offered up in this case by local residents.

Welcome back we're ON THE STORY.

And joining us now from the region, CNN's Paula Hancocks on the story in Sri Lanka. Paula, what's the situation on the ground today where you are?

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Barbara, things have certainly got better over the last two weeks but there is still a tremendous amount to do. Aid organizations are getting through to those who need it but not every single person who needs it.

There have been some U.N. officials saying that by this weekend every single person who needs food and water will have food and water. I have to say that may not be the case. Maybe most of the refugee camps will have food and water but there are a lot of people who are homeless who aren't in those camps themselves. As I was driving along the south coast we saw a lot of people standing on the roads, hundreds of people at eleven o'clock at night just holding out their hands for anything that trucks going by, that cars going by could give to them, any food and water.

So, there definitely are some areas of the south and east coast of Sri Lanka that haven't been touched yet, some of these more remote places and I'm sure there are still people that haven't got the bare necessities that they do need.

HAYES: I think one of the things that is so poignant, Paula, is seeing fishermen who say they can never go back to the sea but so many of these people depend on the sea for their subsistence. They don't have boats. They're afraid. They're traumatized. The food is not there. What's going to happen to them?

HANCOCKS: Well, that's the thing. This is where I am at the moment, Beruwala on the southwest coast of Sri Lanka. This one particular town lived off the sea. It made its living from the sea and some people I've been speaking to along the sea front that are trying to sift through the rubble of what used to be beach bars, restaurants, hotels, one jewelry store just down the road, they are now saying that they want to build their lives and rebuild their businesses inland. They don't want to be next to the sea front anymore.

So many people are now scared of the sea, as you can imagine they would be having gone through what they have gone through. One jewelry shop owner I was speaking through was sifting through every single grain of sand trying to find any gems that he could have. He knew that he was one of the lucky ones.

He has nine brothers and sisters, 49 children between them, all of them survived but they all had about six businesses along the sea front between them and all of those were destroyed, none of them insured because they said they couldn't make up the monthly payment.

But they are saying that they are considering moving inland and moving away from the beach so there is definitely a case to be made that many people do not want to build up their lives on the beach anymore. They are too afraid of the water, the water that they once made their living from.

KOCH: Paula, we hear so often about the dead, vacant stare in the eyes of so many of the survivors and, of course, we know that keeping people alive has to be the focus right now but what about their mental state? Has anyone begun giving them any aid in that respect?

HANCOCKS: That has begun. I've got to say I don't think enough is being done. It's quite terrifying to see the looks in some people's eyes. I went along with one of the U.S. aid agencies AmeriCares for a few days along the south coast. We were going into hospitals and I was there with a doctor from Connecticut and he said that was the most shocking thing to him. It is shocking to see the sheer devastation. It's shocking to see dead bodies. It is shocking to see the destruction here but he said the worst thing was talking to people and their eyes were completely dead. There was no life in them. He felt like they were looking through him.

They haven't even begun in most cases to try and deal with what has happened to them. It's complete incomprehension in their eyes. They can't understand what's happening.

They're trying to grieve and there has been a case the president of Sri Lanka has started to send out some groups of psychologists. She's also called for doctors and pediatricians and other psychologists to come to training groups so they can to out as well and start to talk to some people who have been through so much.

But that is going to be a very big problem going forward the fact that these people are so traumatized trying to deal with what they have seen and what they have experienced and, also at the same time, trying to grieve and try and rebuild their lives and trying to stay alive and get food and water. It's just too much for people to deal with.

COHEN: Paula, you mentioned that there is say food and water in these refugee camps but that not everyone has made their way to the camps. Is there an effort to try to get those folks you saw on the side of the road who don't have that say food and water to those camps?

HANCOCKS: There didn't seem to be as we were driving through. We drove through from about nine to eleven o'clock at night and there were hundreds of people along the roads.

The counselors of all these different districts are calling for people to go into the refugee camps. Many people have done it already but, of course, there's no communication across the board. The coordination of some of these aid organizations and the communication to the people who have lost their homes is very difficult. How do you get through to most people?

When I was down in (UNINTELLIGIBLE) on the south, southeast tip of Sri Lanka there were many people who were still during the day standing next to what was once their house.

There was probably about 500 meters in from the sea. It was completely flattened. There were hundreds and hundreds of houses I'm told though you couldn't tell where one house started and the next house finished and obviously all the people that were in those houses at the time the tsunami hit would have been killed instantly.

Many people, though, who knew relatives and had relatives in these houses were hovering around the houses, some of them telling me they were hoping that some of their relatives would return there or they would find some evidence of what had happened to some of their relatives or maybe find some pictures or find some personal items that they would want to keep. So many of these people didn't want to go to the refugee camps. They almost wanted some sort of connection with the life that they had before this happened.

STARR: Paula, I am so struck by what you're talking about because, of course, what we've all seen in the last several days is a lot of, you know, feel good pictures about aid and relief flowing in and indeed it is but you're on scene and there's a very strong feeling I guess that we may not yet be seeing the top of the curve of this disaster that there's an awfully long way to go here.

HANCOCKS: There is, yes, without a doubt. I mean I have to say that the aid organizations that I have spoken to are doing an absolutely sterling job. There is a risk of people being too critical that the aid organization has not got to every single corner of the country. It hasn't got to every single corner of the country but the thing is this is on such a huge scale there's no way it could do it in such a short period of time.

The thing that I have noticed the most is the local organizations are fantastic. They are the ones that are getting to the people who absolutely need the food, the water, the mattresses, the basic necessities just to stay alive.

One group I was talking to yesterday, called Rebuilding Sri Lanka, which just formed itself the day after the tsunami hit, I went along with them to one of the bars that they were coordinating with trying to cook food for the refugee camps.

They got a call from one of the refugee camps saying, "We have 32 babies, no mattresses." Within 20 minutes they had gone to a local hospital, sorry a local hotel who had donated all these mattresses that they needed and within an hour and a half we were driving into this refugee camp and the babies had something to sleep on that night. That is the sort of coordination on a local level that is amazing to see. On an international level, inevitably without local knowledge it is going to be a lot harder but there are people where this aid is just not getting through to.

KOCH: Paula, do you hear from the people there now any anger that there was no warning system in place? There is a Pacific Ocean Tsunami Warning System. True, most of tsunamis happen there but millions of lives probably or millions of homes would have been -- people would not be homeless now. We wouldn't have the deaths if people had known they could get out of the way. Any anger on the ground there?

HANCOCKS: Amazingly not one single person I've spoken to has had any sort of anger that there was no warning system. They're not focusing on that at all. Many people have told me it's God's will. I don't understand God's will but this is what happened.

There has not really been any blame game. It's a very different sort of scenario. Usually, you know, usually there's two sides to every story. You have to be balanced. You have to think this person is right. This person is wrong.

The fact that it's nature versus humanity so they're not blaming anybody. They are saying where are the aid organizations, though? A lot of people were saying that to me but not in an angry way. They were trying to come to terms with what has happened.

But, amazingly, I really was quite staggered by this, there was very little anger from anybody that I spoke to. The spirit of the Sri Lankans really is quite staggering.

COHEN: Well, Paula Hancocks, our thanks to you and we'll be watching your reports as time continues. Please come back ON THE STORY soon.

Meanwhile, worries continue about millions of tsunami survivors facing the risk of disease. I'll be back on that part of the disaster story after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. WILLIAM TRIST, (R), TENNESSEE: This is the disaster after the disaster unless you focus on that number one priority of water.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: Republican leader in the Senate and doctor Bill Frist, who's making his own tour of the disaster region. His point is that clean drinking water can mean life or death and prevent what he calls a disaster after a disaster.

Welcome back, we're ON THE STORY.

KOCH: Elizabeth, I really do personally find it hard to believe that this situation could get any worse with more than 150,000 people dead but tell me how serious is the situation? What are the health threats on the ground to the survivors right now?

COHEN: Well, as Dr. Frist said and Senator Frist said, the number one threat is clean drinking water and that's why you see the pictures of people lining up for the clean water. When you drink contaminated water, terrible things can happen, diarrheal infections, cholera, dysentery, things that have not been happening thus far but threats that can happen.

So, safe drinking water really number one. Sanitation, making sure that waste does not get into drinking water and shelter, of course, a very important consideration, also infections following injury. So, these are real threats and these are things that they're going to be watching out for in the weeks and even the months to come.

STARR: Elizabeth, as you say, it's going to be down the road. This is all underscoring isn't it that this is a very long term situation in this region?

COHEN: That's right. I mean we're talking about months and months. The public health authorities have to be vigilant for all of these problems. Again, number one problem, contaminated water.

I mean we all in the United States take it for granted. You turn on the tap, you've got clean water. Obviously, when you have the situation that you have in Southern Asia, that clean water is not as accessible. You have to rebuild plants.

In the meantime, you have to distribute millions of water purification tablets, which the World Health Organization and others have been doing. And, again, this is not going to go away quickly. There are systems that need to be set up to prevent problems perhaps for months and months and probably even longer.

KOCH: Two different worlds in so many ways. This week, though, some very interesting news out of the group of doctors at Tufts University I believe looking at diets.

Now we can think this is frivolous, except that we know that obesity is a huge health problem for this country and for kids getting to be a worse problem every single year.

COHEN: That's right. Many people put it second just to smoking in terms of a public health risk that we can actually do something about. And so, now most, even though this is such a huge public health risk, people usually don't go to their doctors to figure out how to lose weight. They just go to the bookstore. They look at ads on TV.

And so these doctors at Tufts said, look, we're going to put four popular diets to the test. We're going to do a gold standard clinical trial to see which works the best. And so they looked at The Zone, Atkins and Weight Watchers and the Dean Ornish very low fat diet.

And what they found was actually one was not better than the other but the news was very sobering. What they found is that 75 percent of the people in this study could not stay on the diet for the entire length of the study, which was one year.

So, 75 percent of these people could not stay on the diet for one year and that explains why these overweight and obese folks started out at 220 pounds and only lost six pounds in the course of the year.

KOCH: Elizabeth, what was behind that though? I mean is it a problem that people get bored with those diets or are they picking the wrong diet?

COHEN: Well, it's really that people are picking the wrong diet in many ways. What this study found, there was a little bit of good news, that 25 percent of people who could stay on the diet they lost 15 pounds in the year and that was good news. So, the good news is if you find the right diet you actually can lose weight.

STARR: Well, thank you Elizabeth.

And all of us we're back ON THE STORY after this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: A woman who redefined racial and gender roles was in the news this week. What's her story? More when we return. (END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Shirley Chisholm, what's her story? The first African American woman elected to Congress and a pioneer for civil rights died this week. Born in New York, Chisholm started as a teacher and in 1964 won a seat in the state assembly and later in the U.S. Congress. In 1972, she was the first black woman to seek the Democratic nomination for president. Chisholm was outspoken and ready to take on the establishment.

SHIRLEY CHISHOLM: I want to be remembered as a woman who fought for change in the 20th Century. That's what I want.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HAYES: Thanks so much to my colleagues for another great show. Thank you for watching ON THE STORY. We'll be back next week.

Stay with CNN as we continue to learn more about what's happening in southern Asia and the rush to save tsunami survivors.

Still ahead, "PEOPLE IN THE NEWS" focusing this week on voices of hope from the disaster region.

Now a check on what's making news right now.

(NEWSBREAK)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com


Aired January 8, 2005 - 10:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(NEWSBREAK)

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Welcome to CNN's ON THE STORY where our journalists have the inside word on the devastation in southern Asia and other stories we covered this week.

I'm Barbara Starr on the story of how the U.S. military is making a difference in helping tsunami victims.

KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I'm Kathleen Koch on the story of President Bush raising the amount of U.S. aid and getting eyewitness reports from his brother and Secretary of State Powell.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: I'm Elizabeth Cohen in Atlanta on the story of the rush to fight off disease in the areas hardest hit in southern Asia.

KATHLEEN HAYES, CNN FINANCIAL CORRESPONDENT: And I'm Kathleen Hayes on the story of how American companies are digging down to send money and supplies to the tsunami victims.

Atika Shubert is standing by in Banda Aceh, Indonesia with the latest on the tsunami aftermath.

And later in the hour we'll go to Sri Lanka where CNN's Paula Hancocks is also on the tsunami story.

E-mail us at onthestory@cnn.com.

Now, straight to Indonesia, Banda Aceh the area that may have suffered the most.

COHEN: The sounds of children, tsunami survivors, many of them now orphans, they're in Banda Aceh, the area of Indonesia hardest hit two weeks ago. On the story on that corner of the disaster is CNN's Atika Shubert.

Atika, tell us what's the latest in your area.

ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the latest in the city of Banda Aceh is that life is slowly returning to normal but it's going to take some time before it's really fully functioning yet.

Today is the first day we've been able to see supermarkets start to open. Markets are in full force with fresh vegetables and so forth but it's taking a long time for people to clear up the wreckage here because heavy moving equipment is taking so long to get here.

We went to the market today where people are just now starting to pick through the wreckage of their storefronts and there was one bulldozer there trying to plug its way through but it's going to take probably another six months before it's up and running as normal.

STARR: Atika, what are you seeing on the ground in terms of how much aid is directly getting through to the people and what the medical assistance situation is like right now?

SHUBERT: Well, in terms of the aid reaching this city of Banda Aceh, a lot of it is coming through. Every day here we see lines, orderly lines for food, clean water, medical supplies and that's the good news.

The bad news is on the west coast of Aceh, which was the area closest to the epicenter and the hardest hit, it is still almost -- it is virtually inaccessible by road.

The only way to reach those areas is by helicopter, so what that means is that clean water, food, medical supplies are very tough to come by there and they're really just being air dropped in and there has to be a better way to get the supplies that they need.

At the moment those survivors are really just living off of those air drops and there's no free flow of relief coming through there yet, so that's the first problem.

In terms of medical relief and medical aid what we do find in the city of Banda Aceh is that there are hospitals but they're overflowing so there's actually a desperate need to create more hospitals, so much so that a lot of victims are actually being medivac'd out to other cities in Indonesia like Medan (ph), so there's still a lot that needs to be done; however, it is at least coming through slowly.

HAYES: Atika, one thing that is striking about these people is in a way how calm they have been. Now, probably many of them are in true shock. They have been so traumatized but as the days go on what is the mood of the people? Are they patient? Are they getting impatient? How long can that patience persist?

SHUBERT: Sure. It's a good question because what we found the first couple of days were everyone here was so traumatized. They had this look, this hollow look in their eyes and whenever you talked to them the only thing that they could tell you is exactly what happened to them, where they were in the tsunami, what happened to their family, often breaking down into tears every time you spoke to them.

But after a few days we found their tears started to dry up. They wanted to move on with their lives and try and pick up the pieces and now we're in the stage where people are still mourning. They're devastated by what happened but they feel that in order to move on with their lives they need to get on with the business of salvaging what's left, picking up the pieces.

And it's important to know that the Acehnese (ph) are very proud people. They're people that have been used to a lot of -- a lot of disasters that have happened here, of course nothing on this scale but they're a very resilient people and they want to be able to move on and show that they're survivors.

KOCH: Atika, I know that when I'm watching the coverage from the region I've been moved to tears on almost a daily basis by the stories I've seen but I can turn the television off. I can go do something else.

But how do you as a journalist there, how do you cope because you can't look away? You're there 24/7, you and the rescue and the relief workers how are you managing?

SHUBERT: Well, it can be tough. I think the first couple of days was really overwhelming because when we first came to the city here in Banda Aceh nothing had been cleared up. There was debris and bodies everywhere and just to see the scale of the devastation and to literally be walking through streets filled with dead that was truly a very overwhelming experience.

And you talk about being reduced to tears, I think it's safe to say that I know I was and a lot of our crew were certainly reduced to tears those first few days.

Having said that, in the following -- in the days recently, there's been hope coming through and you see people trying to get on with their lives, strangers helping other victims, doing what they can and in that sense actually it's been encouraging and it's been nice to cover those kind of hopeful stories, so there's a heartening aspect to it as well.

COHEN: Atika, how are they coping with the problem of having so many orphan children?

SHUBERT: Well, it is a problem. Fortunately, though, when we talked to people at the United Nations Children's Fund or UNICEF they say one of the good things about Aceh is that it has a very strong extended family culture and community culture so that orphans if they're not -- if they have lost their immediate family are usually able to be placed with someone in the extended family.

And even if not the extended family, usually their neighbors or other members of the community are willing to take them in, so that kind of social support network is there.

But having said that, UNICEF says it's very important to register and identify all of these children, orphans or children who have lost just one parent. The reason for that is because they want to prevent any illegal trafficking of these children.

They're obviously very vulnerable now. They're left alone in the world and they want to make sure that they're able to track where they go, make sure not only that they're with a good family and they're being taken care of but also that that family then has enough to support this extra child.

STARR: Atika, even with this extended family structure in Aceh, are there refugee camps? Are most people now living in some sort of camp structure?

SHUBERT: Oh, yes. There are tens of thousands of people living in these displacement camps and at the very beginning of this crisis in a few days they really just gathered in these wide open spaces, mosques, any sort of public space that could hold them. They didn't have any tents or tarps and it was a very desperate situation.

That has improved. Recently what we've seen is a lot of the aid workers have come in, put them under plastic tarps and tents, been able to put together some sort of rudimentary sanitation system.

But again it's very, very basis and there still is a great need for more sanitation, more of these relief efforts to come in but the vast majority of the people who have lost their houses are now living in these sort of tent cities and, as you can imagine, it is a very difficult life. It's been pouring all day today. It only makes life worse for them now.

HAYES: Atika, what has been the reaction to the visit, for example, by Secretary of State Colin Powell and, of course, there have been many Senators and dignitaries? How do the people react to that?

SHUBERT: I think many people here are encouraged. Because the reaction was initially slow to Aceh, many people just didn't know the extent of the devastation because all of the infrastructure and communications here had been wiped out.

So, aid was initially quite slow coming to Aceh, so now that it's here and literally flooding in with these dignitaries visiting, a lot of Acehnese says that they're grateful to have this attention, although they do feel it's a little too late.

They're happy to have all this aid now coming in and it's certainly a good sign to see Secretary of State Colin Powell, for example, coming in. A lot of people here feeling that America is very much needed in this situation because of the vast resources they can apply to this rescue effort.

KOCH: Atika Shubert, thank you very much and good luck on covering that very difficult story in the coming days.

We will return to the disaster region in a moment and talk to Paula Hancocks in Sri Lanka.

President Bush pledged that America will be there to help the victims. I'm back on that story after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We offer our sustained compassion and our generosity and our assurance that America will be there to help.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KOCH: President Bush started the week by saying that the United States has committed $350 million, as well as quite a bit of military aid.

Welcome back, we're ON THE STORY.

STARR: Well that, Kathleen, may have been the announcement from the White House this week but clearly in the first days last week, the first days of this crisis the president appeared to be a little bit off tone, off message on this disaster.

KOCH: Quite true, Barbara and that was at least the initial perception I think worldwide and it was actually a very uncharacteristic reaction for this president who, you know, who is really -- the formative event in his presidency was 9/11 so he's used to dealing with a disaster and also personally.

He very quickly after disasters worldwide, after the death of a world leader or after say a suicide bombing in Israel, he quickly comes out, offers his condolences. So it was quite uncharacteristic the first week for him only to offer a statement on paper of condolence the day, the very day of the disaster, not to come out publicly on camera until Wednesday.

And then, for the offering of U.S. aid to only gradually creep up, starting at $15 million Monday, $35 million Wednesday and then only up to the very substantial $350 million by Friday and it was only at that point that the president actually called the leaders of these countries on Wednesday. He sent them letters so it was very odd.

KOCH: So what are people saying behind the scenes then? Because obviously we've seen the criticism I the press and we know he's made up for lost time. He sent his brother and Colin Powell.

He got two ex-presidents, including his dad, to start raising money. We'll talk about that in a minute. Behind the scenes though what is the White House saying "We blew it" or "We just didn't see the picture soon enough" or what?

KOCH: There were a lot of things I think that came to play here. The White House was very sensitive about not wanting to say, distract attention from what was going on in the region, didn't want say to send people there, like say Powell, Jeb Bush or the president himself even to the aid conference.

They said "We want the focus to stay on the ground." The president doesn't have to come out on camera right away to show that he cares. You know, but again this criticism was out there but the White House really felt like they were -- they were doing the right thing, a measured response in a measured way.

And this week they've really recuperated. As you saw the president came right out Monday morning with what was a very well kept secret, the announcement having his father and then having President Clinton lead this nationwide aid effort.

And it's very much in keeping with the president's philosophy of private aid, not the government being responsible for all the aid that comes forth to any disaster. The president is very big on his faith- based initiatives with religious organizations coming out and helping the needy, not only in the U.S. but globally, lots of other things.

He donated $10,000 himself personally and then he's already met with his brother Jeb Bush. He's gotten a report on the region and will meet with Colin Powell on Monday.

COHEN: Kathleen, while the announcement this week was certainly dramatic you never get a second chance to make a first impression. Are there any feelings that there are any ramifications to what many perceive as a delay in the response immediately after the disaster?

KOCH: Well, I think the White House does not believe that there will be. I mean this is a very generous offer now, the $350 million of U.S. aid and the White House actually from the start when they initially announced the $15 million they said it was an initial response, initial aid and they always said that it would be adjusted according to the situation that they saw on the ground.

But clearly there is a great deal of concern. The Secretary of State, Secretary Powell made that point himself in the region that it is very important to reach out to the people there, in particular the Muslims, Indonesia being the largest Muslim country in the world because these are people whose hearts and minds it is important to win.

This is an important opportunity and if we don't reach out to them, get them the aid, get them the help they need right away then they could be vulnerable to say exploitation and recruitment by terrorist groups.

STARR: Now, the tsunami, of course, has dominated the news for so many days but there was other news in Washington this week. Congress is back in town and there was a confirmation hearing for attorney general that almost really went by unnoticed in the wake of all the tsunami news.

KOCH: And that was a confirmation hearing for the White House attorney, the president's own attorney Alberto Gonzales, an attorney who had served him when he was governor of Texas.

And I don't think though that the White House minded too much that the attention was a bit distracted from his confirmation hearings this week on Thursday because those were the sorts of hearings that would ordinarily have been covered gavel to gavel. But instead what we literally saw was that we were, even networks like ours, 24 hour networks were dipping in and out of that coverage. One important thing to point out, another action that the president took Congress did come back into session this week. One of their first actions was to say that all aid that Americans donate through the end of the month can now be deducted on their 2004 taxes and President Bush signed that yesterday.

STARR: Well, shifting a bit the focus from the White House to the Pentagon on both tsunami relief and Iraq. I'm back on those stories after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They were very excited to see us oftentimes running up underneath the helicopter, running around the tail rotor, so you're a little afraid at first and then you see a body or you see someone that's severely hurt and you're brought back to the reality of what had happened there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STARR: The front lines for the U.S. military in the disaster areas of southern Asia, major military muscle send in already, more on the way and a substantial part of what the U.S. has promised and will do in coming months.

Welcome back we're ON THE STORY.

KOCH: Barbara, some may have accused the president of being a bit slow off the mark in responding to the tsunami but I will tell you the U.S. military seemed to be there in just a heartbeat. Tell me what are they able to accomplish right now? What's the latest there?

STARR: You know, Kathleen, it's one of the stories that we see again and again. Once the U.S. military gets the orders from the political side of the house it is one of their great capabilities to move themselves from one side of the world to the other, as we saw in those pictures of the helicopter.

What they are continuing to do, of course, is ferry in food, water, medical assistance and what we are hearing from the U.S. Pacific Command is medical assistance is one of the things they're focusing on right now. That certainly is going to be a very long-term need, a lot of concern about disease and epidemic coming down the road in 30 days or so.

So, what they are looking at is what do they have to provide, what kinds of medical assistance can they put into the region that will really help this crisis over the long term? They know they're going to be there for quite a while.

COHEN: Barbara, of course, you're still covering the story in Iraq. The election is weeks away. Violence remains at high levels. What are you hearing about hopes for having real true elections given the situation? STARR: Well, Iraq really is, you're right Elizabeth, still the focus of what the Pentagon is looking at. Elections now less than 30 days away, a great deal of concern about violence.

I just returned from Iraq just before the holidays and what you hear is a great deal of concern. The U.S. is absolutely determined the elections will go forward. Interim President Allawi is determined the elections will go forward but yet we hear about these violent attacks every single day, every expectation that violence is going to grow.

KOCH: Barbara, if they cannot protect the governor of Baghdad who was murdered this week, how can they protect people at the polls? There are many Sunni groups who are saying delay the elections. We are now the minority in the country. Apparently many of the Shias are saying no, go ahead, and the Iraqis themselves are saying that could be then an illegitimate election, which leads to chaos not to more stability.

STARR: The issue, of course, that Allawi, President Allawi sees that President Bush sees if they delay the election, it's giving into the insurgents. That's how they view it that the insurgents then have achieved a victory and they are bound and determined that that will not happen.

Fourteen of 18 provinces they believe are relatively calm and that they can have elections. Of course, it is the Sunni Triangle, Falluja, Ramadi, Baghdad up to Mosul, Tikrit, all of these areas where the violence is continuing to grow and that they're the most concerned about. They're putting more troops in and, of course, the major unspoken issue is those Iraqi security forces how they perform.

KOCH: Barbara, you know, that's what I wanted to ask you about. I mean we are hearing from the Pentagon on a daily basis how when those elections begin January 30th they will rely so heavily on the Iraqi military for security in the immediate area, right there around those polling places but their track record up until now has been dismal.

STARR: Very iffy, very, very iffy. I mean we were hearing this in Iraq when we were there just before Christmas. At the highest levels of the U.S. military and I mean the highest there is a great deal of concern about Iraqi security forces.

We saw this week retired Four-Star General Gary Luck. He is headed over to Iraq to conduct an assessment. He's not conducting an assessment because things are going good. He's conducting an assessment because things are not going very well.

They know that they have got to get these Iraqi security forces up running and really fighting as a cohesive force to defend their country. That is going to be the solution to the insurgency. The assessment is, of course, there is not enough U.S. firepower to defeat an insurgency. The Iraqis are going to have to do it themselves.

COHEN: And, Barbara, it sounds from what you're saying that delaying the elections is not an option.

STARR: Not for the United States and it will be very interesting. At the last minute, if for some reason the Iraqi interim government decides it wants to delay the election, procedurally how will that take place because this election has all been set forth in the transition that happened last year, in the United Nations' decisions that the election would happen on January 30th. That train is moving and there seems to be nothing at this point that is going to stop it.

KOCH: Well, there's a couple weeks left to go. We shall see what happens next.

From Iraq we're going to turn back to the tragedy in southern Asia. I'll be talking about U.S. companies offering supplies, money and other aid.

And we'll go back to the tsunami region to talk with CNN's Paula Hancocks in Sri Lanka. We're back on that story too after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)




(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BUSH: The greatest source of America's generosity is not our government. It's the good heart of the American people. In the weeks since the tsunami struck, private citizens have contributed millions of dollars.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KOCH: President Bush on Monday and that good heart, as the president puts it, has generated millions of goods and services and cash to help tsunami victims.

Welcome back, we're ON THE STORY.

COHEN: Kathleen, the tsunami, of course, affected coastal areas. Is the economy operating normally inland in these countries? HAYES: I think that's a very interesting point, Elizabeth, about what is the economic impact of this because I think when we see all the devastation we think well this has got to be a terrible blow to the economies of Southeast Asia but that's the whole point.

The shore area is devastated but you could -- and the roads gone. This is going to be a huge cost, part of the rebuilding and all that aid money that the president is talking about that has been piling up.

But inland base economies, their factories, their services, everything functioning very well. It's interesting that the forecasts are for maybe a tiny little bit of GDP shaved off of these economies this year.

But it also varies between the big countries, like India and Indonesia. I mean India has actually pledged aid to Colombo, so they're standing on fairly solid ground. Sri Lanka, though, a small country, a poor country devastated and, again, the economic impact for these basically subsistent fishing communities is huge and that's why so much of this aid money is going to be so important.

These people don't have insurance. Insurance companies won't take a hit but, again, they don't have the kind of support system that we just take for granted in modern industrialized countries.

STARR: And that seems to be one of the key questions now. Billions of dollars flowing into the region how is that money really going to get down to the local fishermen on the coast, the local village that has been wiped out?

HAYES: Well, first let's start by looking at some of the billions of dollars because, you know, the tally for just charitable contributions is so far $337 million was the number I saw this morning and, of course, this includes millions of dollars from corporations.

I think we have a list of some of them, Pfizer giving $10 million in cash, $25 million in drugs; Citigroup $3 million. You can see G.E. at $1 million, Coca Cola giving $10 million, not on that list but also involved in providing bottled water. Everyone wants to help. There's been a huge outpouring.

Now it's interesting that right now Australia is the country that has pledged the most, over $800 million, double the United States' $350 million but it's also interesting that their officials have been raising the question of we prefer to get involved directly say with Indonesia, where they're going to concentrate their relief money to make sure that the money does get directly into organizations that are going to rebuild, get the money to the people.

Whereas, some people would say it's OK to go through some of the big multilateral organizations, go through the U.N., so I think that's going to be part of the debate moving forward.

And there have been cases in the past where millions were given in all good will and all good heart but because of people trying to rebuild too much too fast, like in Central America after Hurricane Mitch, a World Bank study suggesting that a few years later not even half of the money was actually spent. Again, this is something I think that people will be very carefully watching in the months ahead.

KOCH: Kathleen, you know, obviously so many of these countries that were hit by the earthquake and then the tsunami were really poverty stricken already. Does debt relief come to play here or forgiveness, is that on the table? What are the chances of (UNINTELLIGIBLE)?

HAYES: Oh that came to the fore very quickly. The Germans have been pushing for this. Gordon Brown, who is the U.K.'s finance minister, who is the chairman this year of the group of seven, group of eight, depending on if you include Russia or not, this is, you know, the world's richest nations, they're going to be talking about debt relief in February.

The Paris Club, which is a loosely organized group of the big, rich countries is meeting next week. They're also talking about a debt moratorium which would be these countries that have billions of dollars of debt, most of them do in this region, could just delay their interest payments, maybe even have some debt forgiveness.

But the question is, again, would that help the people on the ground or some people say it would just help the governments themselves and so they're wondering if -- how much debt relief will really be in the cards. But, again, the hearts are in the right place. People are just figuring out the best way to get it done.

COHEN: So many people want to give money and want to help out and there are so many different charities to give to. Is there a way to figure out if you give your money which charity do you have the highest hopes that it will go directly to the victims and not go to some kind of administrative costs?

KOCH: There's a great website, among many, charitynavigator.org talks a lot about different organizations and you can ask any charity for information on how much of their money goes directly to the people, how much is used for administration? It really varies from charity to charity so it's probably really something for people to check out if that concerns them.

And I think it's very interesting too, one more thing I'd like to add, Doctors Without Borders, who are very heavily involved in this relief effort have already said, it's on their website, "Don't send us any more money that is earmarked for tsunami victims."

They're saying continue to send us money for emergency relief. Remember the Darfur and the Sudan there was lots of people who suffered all kinds of calamities.

This happens yearly just not of this scope, not so much in the glare of the television cameras and I think they're just trying to tell people keep sending money but if you haven't sent yet or you want to send more, maybe it's good to think a little more broadly about the many, many people who are suffering around the world.

STARR: And, Kathleen, just to touch on one domestic economic event during the week, the jobs picture. We always talk about that.

HAYES: Well, good news for the United States. Jobs are growing again and when you compare us to what people are suffering other places, our problems seem very small.

STARR: Of course.

HAYES: But one problem for us is wage growth. We went from a jobless recovery last year, people are calling, some people are calling it a payless recovery this year. You can see the economy added 157,000 jobs, over two million jobs last year, the first decent, first positive job growth since the recession but wages on average up only 2.7 percent.

Inflation is running at 3.5 percent, not keeping up with the cost of living. A survey of small businesses this past week showed that last year jobs grew more than 4 percent but wages actually fell. They said there are just too many people out there.

When you sit down to sign on the dotted line the boss says "Take it or leave it." You said, "Well, I'm making less than I made in my last job." They say, "Well, there's someone else we can give the job to. If you don't want it, they'll take it." That's the kind of thing a lot of American workers are facing.

COHEN: Well, from the business world we're going to go back to southern Asia and CNN's Paula Hancocks.

Also coming up why the race against time is so crucial in the coming days in Southern Asia to help injured tsunami victims and protect them from disease.

We're back on that story after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

STARR: Children reaching out for emergency supplies in Sri Lanka. Food and other necessities offered up in this case by local residents.

Welcome back we're ON THE STORY.

And joining us now from the region, CNN's Paula Hancocks on the story in Sri Lanka. Paula, what's the situation on the ground today where you are?

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Barbara, things have certainly got better over the last two weeks but there is still a tremendous amount to do. Aid organizations are getting through to those who need it but not every single person who needs it.

There have been some U.N. officials saying that by this weekend every single person who needs food and water will have food and water. I have to say that may not be the case. Maybe most of the refugee camps will have food and water but there are a lot of people who are homeless who aren't in those camps themselves. As I was driving along the south coast we saw a lot of people standing on the roads, hundreds of people at eleven o'clock at night just holding out their hands for anything that trucks going by, that cars going by could give to them, any food and water.

So, there definitely are some areas of the south and east coast of Sri Lanka that haven't been touched yet, some of these more remote places and I'm sure there are still people that haven't got the bare necessities that they do need.

HAYES: I think one of the things that is so poignant, Paula, is seeing fishermen who say they can never go back to the sea but so many of these people depend on the sea for their subsistence. They don't have boats. They're afraid. They're traumatized. The food is not there. What's going to happen to them?

HANCOCKS: Well, that's the thing. This is where I am at the moment, Beruwala on the southwest coast of Sri Lanka. This one particular town lived off the sea. It made its living from the sea and some people I've been speaking to along the sea front that are trying to sift through the rubble of what used to be beach bars, restaurants, hotels, one jewelry store just down the road, they are now saying that they want to build their lives and rebuild their businesses inland. They don't want to be next to the sea front anymore.

So many people are now scared of the sea, as you can imagine they would be having gone through what they have gone through. One jewelry shop owner I was speaking through was sifting through every single grain of sand trying to find any gems that he could have. He knew that he was one of the lucky ones.

He has nine brothers and sisters, 49 children between them, all of them survived but they all had about six businesses along the sea front between them and all of those were destroyed, none of them insured because they said they couldn't make up the monthly payment.

But they are saying that they are considering moving inland and moving away from the beach so there is definitely a case to be made that many people do not want to build up their lives on the beach anymore. They are too afraid of the water, the water that they once made their living from.

KOCH: Paula, we hear so often about the dead, vacant stare in the eyes of so many of the survivors and, of course, we know that keeping people alive has to be the focus right now but what about their mental state? Has anyone begun giving them any aid in that respect?

HANCOCKS: That has begun. I've got to say I don't think enough is being done. It's quite terrifying to see the looks in some people's eyes. I went along with one of the U.S. aid agencies AmeriCares for a few days along the south coast. We were going into hospitals and I was there with a doctor from Connecticut and he said that was the most shocking thing to him. It is shocking to see the sheer devastation. It's shocking to see dead bodies. It is shocking to see the destruction here but he said the worst thing was talking to people and their eyes were completely dead. There was no life in them. He felt like they were looking through him.

They haven't even begun in most cases to try and deal with what has happened to them. It's complete incomprehension in their eyes. They can't understand what's happening.

They're trying to grieve and there has been a case the president of Sri Lanka has started to send out some groups of psychologists. She's also called for doctors and pediatricians and other psychologists to come to training groups so they can to out as well and start to talk to some people who have been through so much.

But that is going to be a very big problem going forward the fact that these people are so traumatized trying to deal with what they have seen and what they have experienced and, also at the same time, trying to grieve and try and rebuild their lives and trying to stay alive and get food and water. It's just too much for people to deal with.

COHEN: Paula, you mentioned that there is say food and water in these refugee camps but that not everyone has made their way to the camps. Is there an effort to try to get those folks you saw on the side of the road who don't have that say food and water to those camps?

HANCOCKS: There didn't seem to be as we were driving through. We drove through from about nine to eleven o'clock at night and there were hundreds of people along the roads.

The counselors of all these different districts are calling for people to go into the refugee camps. Many people have done it already but, of course, there's no communication across the board. The coordination of some of these aid organizations and the communication to the people who have lost their homes is very difficult. How do you get through to most people?

When I was down in (UNINTELLIGIBLE) on the south, southeast tip of Sri Lanka there were many people who were still during the day standing next to what was once their house.

There was probably about 500 meters in from the sea. It was completely flattened. There were hundreds and hundreds of houses I'm told though you couldn't tell where one house started and the next house finished and obviously all the people that were in those houses at the time the tsunami hit would have been killed instantly.

Many people, though, who knew relatives and had relatives in these houses were hovering around the houses, some of them telling me they were hoping that some of their relatives would return there or they would find some evidence of what had happened to some of their relatives or maybe find some pictures or find some personal items that they would want to keep. So many of these people didn't want to go to the refugee camps. They almost wanted some sort of connection with the life that they had before this happened.

STARR: Paula, I am so struck by what you're talking about because, of course, what we've all seen in the last several days is a lot of, you know, feel good pictures about aid and relief flowing in and indeed it is but you're on scene and there's a very strong feeling I guess that we may not yet be seeing the top of the curve of this disaster that there's an awfully long way to go here.

HANCOCKS: There is, yes, without a doubt. I mean I have to say that the aid organizations that I have spoken to are doing an absolutely sterling job. There is a risk of people being too critical that the aid organization has not got to every single corner of the country. It hasn't got to every single corner of the country but the thing is this is on such a huge scale there's no way it could do it in such a short period of time.

The thing that I have noticed the most is the local organizations are fantastic. They are the ones that are getting to the people who absolutely need the food, the water, the mattresses, the basic necessities just to stay alive.

One group I was talking to yesterday, called Rebuilding Sri Lanka, which just formed itself the day after the tsunami hit, I went along with them to one of the bars that they were coordinating with trying to cook food for the refugee camps.

They got a call from one of the refugee camps saying, "We have 32 babies, no mattresses." Within 20 minutes they had gone to a local hospital, sorry a local hotel who had donated all these mattresses that they needed and within an hour and a half we were driving into this refugee camp and the babies had something to sleep on that night. That is the sort of coordination on a local level that is amazing to see. On an international level, inevitably without local knowledge it is going to be a lot harder but there are people where this aid is just not getting through to.

KOCH: Paula, do you hear from the people there now any anger that there was no warning system in place? There is a Pacific Ocean Tsunami Warning System. True, most of tsunamis happen there but millions of lives probably or millions of homes would have been -- people would not be homeless now. We wouldn't have the deaths if people had known they could get out of the way. Any anger on the ground there?

HANCOCKS: Amazingly not one single person I've spoken to has had any sort of anger that there was no warning system. They're not focusing on that at all. Many people have told me it's God's will. I don't understand God's will but this is what happened.

There has not really been any blame game. It's a very different sort of scenario. Usually, you know, usually there's two sides to every story. You have to be balanced. You have to think this person is right. This person is wrong.

The fact that it's nature versus humanity so they're not blaming anybody. They are saying where are the aid organizations, though? A lot of people were saying that to me but not in an angry way. They were trying to come to terms with what has happened.

But, amazingly, I really was quite staggered by this, there was very little anger from anybody that I spoke to. The spirit of the Sri Lankans really is quite staggering.

COHEN: Well, Paula Hancocks, our thanks to you and we'll be watching your reports as time continues. Please come back ON THE STORY soon.

Meanwhile, worries continue about millions of tsunami survivors facing the risk of disease. I'll be back on that part of the disaster story after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. WILLIAM TRIST, (R), TENNESSEE: This is the disaster after the disaster unless you focus on that number one priority of water.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: Republican leader in the Senate and doctor Bill Frist, who's making his own tour of the disaster region. His point is that clean drinking water can mean life or death and prevent what he calls a disaster after a disaster.

Welcome back, we're ON THE STORY.

KOCH: Elizabeth, I really do personally find it hard to believe that this situation could get any worse with more than 150,000 people dead but tell me how serious is the situation? What are the health threats on the ground to the survivors right now?

COHEN: Well, as Dr. Frist said and Senator Frist said, the number one threat is clean drinking water and that's why you see the pictures of people lining up for the clean water. When you drink contaminated water, terrible things can happen, diarrheal infections, cholera, dysentery, things that have not been happening thus far but threats that can happen.

So, safe drinking water really number one. Sanitation, making sure that waste does not get into drinking water and shelter, of course, a very important consideration, also infections following injury. So, these are real threats and these are things that they're going to be watching out for in the weeks and even the months to come.

STARR: Elizabeth, as you say, it's going to be down the road. This is all underscoring isn't it that this is a very long term situation in this region?

COHEN: That's right. I mean we're talking about months and months. The public health authorities have to be vigilant for all of these problems. Again, number one problem, contaminated water.

I mean we all in the United States take it for granted. You turn on the tap, you've got clean water. Obviously, when you have the situation that you have in Southern Asia, that clean water is not as accessible. You have to rebuild plants.

In the meantime, you have to distribute millions of water purification tablets, which the World Health Organization and others have been doing. And, again, this is not going to go away quickly. There are systems that need to be set up to prevent problems perhaps for months and months and probably even longer.

KOCH: Two different worlds in so many ways. This week, though, some very interesting news out of the group of doctors at Tufts University I believe looking at diets.

Now we can think this is frivolous, except that we know that obesity is a huge health problem for this country and for kids getting to be a worse problem every single year.

COHEN: That's right. Many people put it second just to smoking in terms of a public health risk that we can actually do something about. And so, now most, even though this is such a huge public health risk, people usually don't go to their doctors to figure out how to lose weight. They just go to the bookstore. They look at ads on TV.

And so these doctors at Tufts said, look, we're going to put four popular diets to the test. We're going to do a gold standard clinical trial to see which works the best. And so they looked at The Zone, Atkins and Weight Watchers and the Dean Ornish very low fat diet.

And what they found was actually one was not better than the other but the news was very sobering. What they found is that 75 percent of the people in this study could not stay on the diet for the entire length of the study, which was one year.

So, 75 percent of these people could not stay on the diet for one year and that explains why these overweight and obese folks started out at 220 pounds and only lost six pounds in the course of the year.

KOCH: Elizabeth, what was behind that though? I mean is it a problem that people get bored with those diets or are they picking the wrong diet?

COHEN: Well, it's really that people are picking the wrong diet in many ways. What this study found, there was a little bit of good news, that 25 percent of people who could stay on the diet they lost 15 pounds in the year and that was good news. So, the good news is if you find the right diet you actually can lose weight.

STARR: Well, thank you Elizabeth.

And all of us we're back ON THE STORY after this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: A woman who redefined racial and gender roles was in the news this week. What's her story? More when we return. (END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Shirley Chisholm, what's her story? The first African American woman elected to Congress and a pioneer for civil rights died this week. Born in New York, Chisholm started as a teacher and in 1964 won a seat in the state assembly and later in the U.S. Congress. In 1972, she was the first black woman to seek the Democratic nomination for president. Chisholm was outspoken and ready to take on the establishment.

SHIRLEY CHISHOLM: I want to be remembered as a woman who fought for change in the 20th Century. That's what I want.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HAYES: Thanks so much to my colleagues for another great show. Thank you for watching ON THE STORY. We'll be back next week.

Stay with CNN as we continue to learn more about what's happening in southern Asia and the rush to save tsunami survivors.

Still ahead, "PEOPLE IN THE NEWS" focusing this week on voices of hope from the disaster region.

Now a check on what's making news right now.

(NEWSBREAK)

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