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On the Story
Coal Mining Safety; Muslim Protest of Cartoons
Aired February 11, 2006 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LIN: ON THE STORY is coming up in just a moment, but first, a storm is brewing and that is not a figure of speech. It is a nor'easter. Straight to the CNN Weather Center and meteorologist Monica McNeal. Monica?
MCNEAL: All right, Carol. This is a classic nor'easter and all of the cities along the I-95 corridor will experience some very heavy snowfall. Let's talk about the totals. We're looking at Washington, DC, anywhere from about eight to 14. Philadelphia, you're looking at eight to 13, New York City, six to 12, and Boston, about 10 to 14. New York, you're getting light snow right now, but the brunt of your snow should start slamming sometime tomorrow morning as you're getting up, taking that sip of coffee. High temperatures tomorrow will not rebound at all. Temperatures will be in the 20s across New York, 25 across Boston. And we're going to factor in those winds because we will have blizzard like conditions tomorrow and that's really going to set the stage for even more problems. So heavy, heavy snowfall, lots of snow right along from Washington, Philadelphia, New York, back up into parts of Boston and when you factor in those winds, it spells big trouble. We're looking at winds gusting up to about 50 miles per hour. Carol.
CAROL LIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: All right, thanks Monica. I know you're working the story throughout the night.
Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon was rushed into surgery for an emergency operation this morning. Doctors spotted a problem with his large intestine and removed a portion of it. It's his fourth major surgery since suffering a massive stroke in early January. Now coming up ON THE STORY. CNN's reporters look as Muslim protests, growing frustration among hurricane victims and New York fashion week.
Later on "CNN Presents," fat chance. New research on how your genetic makeup may affect your ability to lose weight and keep it off. That coming up at 8:00 Eastern.
Another weather update at the bottom of the hour, but right now here's ON THE STORY.
JOE JOHNS, CNN ANCHOR, ON THE STORY: This is CNN and we're on the story. From the campus of the George Washington University in the heart of the nation's capitol, our correspondents have the stories behind the stories they are covering. Brent Sadler is in Beirut on the story of the cartoon protest in the Muslim world and whether extremists are fanning the flames.
Internet reporter Abbi Tatton goes online for reaction to news coverage of the cartoon story.
Kelli Arena reports on President Bush giving new details of a foiled terrorist plot to attack an LA skyscraper.
Sean Calebs looks at frustration along the Gulf coast over delays in identifying bodies and removing debris. And in New York City, Alina Cho gives us a front row seat for fashion week.
Welcome, I'm Joe Johns. I'll be talking about tensions in West Virginia over how safe and costly coal mining should be. With me here is justice correspondent Kelli Arena. Our correspondents will be taking questions from the studio audience, drawn from visitors, college students and people across Washington. From Scandinavia to the Middle East, from Afghanistan to Indonesia, violent protests in the Muslim world over cartoons depicting the prophet Muhammad. Our Beirut bureau chief Brent Sadler has been covering the story since a mob marched on the Danish consulate there. Let's take a look at his reporter's notebook.
BRENT SADLER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: When I arrived there, the level of the activity around the building, that houses the Danish embassy was intense. I remember walking towards the burning building so it is very clear that there was a complete breakdown of law and order. It was very difficult to really get accurate stories initially from some of the people because they were so mad.
Yet another deadly day of protest amid deepening fears about some western leaders that unless voices of moderation from both inside and outside the Islamic world succeed in calming this rage, this global revolt may get even worse. The initial challenges, of course, were trying to get to the facts as quickly as possible in the very dangerous and unstable situation. In these sort of circumstances, it's not improbable that crowds not only will turn against their main target, the Danish embassy. They also can take issue with western TV journalists.
JOHNS: Brent Sadler joins us now. Brent, I guess the first question is, tell us the story of where you were when the story broke.
SADLER: I was actually on an Iraqi airways plane, Joe, heading to Baghdad. The door was about to close. I got the call, I left the phone on for the very last second because I was getting some reports of trouble in Beirut. And the pilot and the crew got me off that plane, pretty amazing these days, very quickly and got into the center of town. So that's how it started.
JOHNS: We have a question from the audience. What is your name and what is your question?
QUESTION: I'm Chris and I'm from Alpine, Utah and I've heard that many of the protesters haven't actually seen the cartoons, but just heard about them from the radio or from people on the street. Is that true?
SADLER: I think it's pretty widely understood and accepted, Chris, that people have seen, majority have seen the reports about what has been shown on those cartoons. Don't forget here in the Muslim world, those pictures are generally not being printed, one or two exceptions. So most of what they are getting is what is being reported on the television, the radio and of course, what they get in the newspapers. So in terms of seeing the pictures themselves, no, the minority of people will not have seen them, of course.
JOHNS: It's not that easy to see them here. In fact, I had to search around on the Internet for quite a while. What's your name? Where are you from?
QUESTION: I'm John from Philadelphia. And I wanted to know how much was the Syrian government either encouraging or discouraging the violence, especially in Lebanon?
SADLER: Good question, John. We know that the Condoleezza Rice, the U.S. Secretary of State, has criticized openly Syria for having a hand in these riots, as well as Iran and Syria both close allies. What happens in Syria in terms of violence pretty quickly spread like wild fire to the Lebanese capital. And certainly there was a lot of claims immediately after the Beirut trouble that the hand of Syria was involved here. But some leaders have backtracked on that. However, there is a hand of Islamic extremism widely suspect of being behind this trouble.
JOHNS: And where are you from? What is your name?
QUESTION: My name's Casey (INAUDIBLE). I'm from Magenic (ph) Falls, Maine and my question is, is the violence over the Danish cartoons mainly from fundamentalist Muslims or is it endorsed by mainstream Muslim groups? How do moderate Muslims feel about it?
SADLER: Again, Casey, this is a very important question. You have to look at the problem as being a Muslim worldwide protest. The level of insult against the Islamic faith is regarded as intolerable, not just by Islamist groups, extremists and others, but also by the mainstream Muslim population. What you're not getting, I don't think, out of this reporting worldwide and we're seeing some more of it coming up probably in London this weekend, a big so called moderate protest planned is that the silent majority is simply not getting its voice out there. There is a gulf of misunderstanding between Islam and what many Muslims believe is a kind of western conspiracy against their religion and that kind of feeling is fired up by the events of what's happened since 9/11 and it is the more extremist groups that have been trying to exploit that for their own ends and, of course, if you go back to what Osama bin Laden said, before 9/11, that he was interested in those like minded terror groups like him in creating a clash of civilizations and you have this level of Islama-phobia that is being played on in many parts of the world and that's being used to whip up these sort of troubled demonstrations.
KELLI ARENA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Brent, how do you as a journalist get to that moderate voice to be able to put that in your reporting?
SADLER: We have been doing that for most of this week. I went to the American University of Beirut, a long-established educational institution here with a very high reputation in the Middle East. I can tell you that students and many of them have dual - it's interesting, dual Lebanese American passports. I saw a couple of students, fresh, just within the last couple of weeks sitting in class with others, Arabs from Lebanon and elsewhere, discussing this issue. And the Muslims, of course, were saying it is an insult. We cannot have freedom of expression of the press being used against Islam and that it is the laws of the western nations they believe, the moderates that should be dealing with this, that cases should be brought for trial before the law courts to test the blasphemy laws in European countries. And that, too, the important things that we hear a lot about. One, people want to hear an apology from Denmark. The government says that's not their job. That should be a legal matter. And two, Muslims, moderates and extremists of course want to see there be a redefinition in Europe by the European Union to some mechanism to create better control or better moral oversight, if you like, of the way newspapers and other publications can draw criticism or create reporting that ignites this is sort of religious sensitivity.
JOHNS: Brent, stay with us now. I'll be asking our audience here what they think about the news coverage of the cartoon protests and Abbi Tatton is back on the story online with what the blogs are saying about the cartoon story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOHNS: You are on the story. Tell us which correspondents you want to see, what you want to hear. E-mail us at onthestory@cnn.com. We're on the story online with Internet reporter Abbi Tatton. Abbi, the cartoon controversy has sparked enormous reaction in the Muslim world and in the western world. What are you seeing?
ABBI TATTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Joe, a huge amount of discussion and debate about the cartoons, the images themselves, about the violent backlash in the Muslim world and the reasons behind that. And, also, intense scrutiny of news organizations like CNN and others and the decisions that we've been making about whether to publish these cartoons or not. Glenn Reynolds is from instapundit.com. He's joining us to talk about this, author of the upcoming work "An Army of David." Now you have written about this, Glen. Thanks for joining us.
GLENN REYNOLDS, INSTAPUNDIT.COM: Thank you.
TATTON: Tell me, CNN has not published these cartoons. Many other news organizations have not either. You have been critical of some of these decisions, why is that?
REYNOLDS: I think you guys have blown it and I think by not publishing the cartoons, what you've done is let people imagine the worst. The actual cartoons are not that tame. And in fact, one way we know they're not that tame is the Danish imams had to add fake cartoons when they did their little tour to try to stir up trouble, because the real ones weren't bad enough. And I think when you cover things up, you let peoples' imaginations run wild and the result is worse that if you expose things. The press is there to tell us things, not to hide things from us.
TATTON: You mean the images themselves are not that severe? REYNOLDS: They are not nearly as bad as the fake ones the Danish imams felt like they had to add to stir things up.
TATTON: Some of them though very offensive to people.
REYNOLDS: Everything is offensive to somebody. In the modern world, we all have to put up with some degree of offense. If fundamentalist Christians were rioting because of "Will and Grace" would you take it off the air?
TATTON: You've linked on your site to the cartoons. You didn't put them actually on your site. Why is that?
REYNOLDS: Well, they don't belong to me. They're not my intellectual property and I don't have permission. But I've linked to them freely.
TATTON: Any backlash from linking to them.'
REYNOLDS: I've gotten no negative publicity. Nobody's complained. I don't think I have gotten a single hate e-mail over it.
TATTON: Now this has been a subject of discussion on the left and on the right, but particularly among conservative bloggers. Why do you think that is?
REYNOLDS: Because I think conservative bloggers hear a lot of talk about free speech in other context. But it seems like people are willing to go to the mat to protect free speech when it's free speech irritates people on the right. But when it is free speech that irritates Muslims, they're more concerned about not offending.
JOHNS: Let me bring Brent Sadler in now in Beirut. Brent, obviously you have been dealing with this to a great degree. I guess the simple question for you is, editorially, what goes through your mind, sort of the pros and cons for putting these cartoons on the air?
SADLER: I think first and foremost, Joe, I live in this part of the world, have spent 25 years traveling most, if not all of the Islamic nations, especially those in the Middle East. And, you know, as I said earlier, you're not hearing from the majority of Muslims. But those that you speak to of all ilk, be they extremists, be they moderates, or be they those that really don't care too much about religion they feel a line has been crossed here. And I think this whole debate about whether or not news organizations including us here at CNN should be broadcasting these pictures really cuts to the core of the whole issue of how to treat press freedom as opposed to religious tolerance and deference to acutely sensitive religious issues. And I think the Danish government's position has been quite clear that this is a matter for their own legal authorities. Let legislation and the courts to laws of blasphemy. And I'm not sure how they are enacted throughout Europe and the rest of the world. But certainly many nations have laws about how there should be freedom of speech as it relates to blasphemy. And I think this is one of the core issues that people need to lock at here. JOHNS: A number of western news organizations coming down on one side or the other of this. Here's what we're saying. CNN is basically not showing this because it, the negative caricatures of the likeness of the prophet Mohammed, because the network believes its role is to cover the events surrounding the publication of the cartoons, while not unnecessarily adding fuel to the controversy itself.
A question for our audience now, should news organizations show the cartoons? Everybody who thinks so, would you raise your hands, please? All right. And let me ask you, now. What is your name and where are you from?
QUESTION: My name is Alex (INAUDIBLE) I'm from Round Pond, Maine.
JOHNS: And why? What is your view?
QUESTION: I think we need to be shown the images because it lets us understand why people in the Middle East are out raged by them.
JOHNS: All right. Great. Now everybody who thinks news organizations should not show the cartoons. Would you raise your hands for me? More people saying news organizations should not show the cartoons. What is your name?
QUESTION: (INAUDIBLE) Potomac, Maryland.
JOHNS: Why?
QUESTION: I think in the interest of building bridge and not add fuel to the fire and also respecting other's beliefs and understandings.
JOHNS: Got you. So Abbi, let's go back to you now.
TATTON: One thing Glenn can comment on also, is the fact that whatever we're deciding about whether to publish these images or not, they are out there. They're online. You can find them. How is the Internet contributed to the story?
REYNOLDS: I think it's helped people find these images they couldn't find through the mainstream press, which as always helps people bypass the gate keepers. But, look, my beliefs are offended when gangs of ignorant thugs burn embassies. Where is my respect for my beliefs? Do I need to burn embassies to get respect for my beliefs? Because that's the message CNN sends. The message they send is we will reward violence. And you're going to get more of what you reward. That's how it works.
TATTON: Glenn, thanks so much for joining us. Joe, back to you.
JOHNS: Thanks to you in the studio. Also thanks to Brent Sadler who stayed up late.
New details this is week from the very top about a terrorist plot against a Los Angeles skyscraper. Justice correspondent Kelli Arena is back on that story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We now know that in October 2001, the late (ph) Sheik Mohammad, the mastermind of the September 11 attacks, had already set in motion a plan to have terrorist operatives hijack an airplane using shoe bombs, to breach the cockpit door and fly the plane into the tallest building on the west coast.
JOHNS: Stay tuned to CNN day and night for the most reliable news about your security. We're on the story at the George Washington University in the nation's capital. Kelli Arena broke the story a while back about a failed terrorist plot to hijack a plane and fly into it a Los Angeles building. She was back on the story this week. Take a look at Kelli's report.
ARENA: New details from the president about a plot that we first reported on back in 2003. According to the administration, Kalid Sheik Mohammad targeted the U.S. Bank tower in Los Angeles, the tallest building on the west coast. Counter terrorism officials discovered that the original plan for 9/11 was to simultaneously hit both the east and west coasts, but Osama bin Laden thought that idea was too ambitious. Rather than use Arab hijackers like the men who pulled off the September 11th attack, Kalid Sheik Mohammad looked for men from southeast Asia. By early 2002, the White House says there was a terrorist cell in place, a method of attack, and a target. But in February, the cell leader was arrested and the other members of the cell abandoned the plot. Since then, all four of them have been arrested.
JOHNS: Kelli Arena, of course, here on the set right now. We have a question for you from the audience. Where are you from?
QUESTION: I'm Brian from Minnesota. And I was wondering why the White House waited until just recently to release information concerning the 2002 LA terror threat and was this perhaps politically motivated?
ARENA: A lot of critics suggest that it is. The White House says that the reason that the president came forward with this is because they decided to declassify some more information and that they feel that it's the public's right to know about successes in the war on terror. But there are a lot of people who think that the president is looking to keep momentum building because as you know, there's been a lot of criticism about the domestic surveillance program and other criticism about the Patriot Act, so it's all part of that larger blueprint of saying, hey, we're successful in the war on terror, plus the Republicans still believe that they are very strong on that issue. And that the more that they pound that in, the midterm elections they benefit from that.
JOHNS: It's really one of those things that's just shrouded in secrecy. You deal with that a lot on your beat. I guess how on earth do you confirm anything in an environment like that? ARENA: Well this story actually we had to confirm from a variety of sources and most of them overseas because as you know, a lot of these arrests of al Qaeda operatives have been overseas not here in the United States. And sometimes you actually can get more information from overseas sources than you can get from sources here in the U.S.
JOHNS: What is your name?
QUESTION: My name is Mark from Florida State University. I was wondering Kelli, do you think that our nation's intelligence agencies have regained the public's trust after foiling al Qaeda's plots to attack the United States?
ARENA: I think that the polls at least show that they believe that the U.S. is somewhat successful in fighting the war on terror basically because you have not seen an attack on U.S. soil since the September 11 attacks. But I think a lot of people, though, are confused about the whole civil liberties issue versus security issue. You get a lot backlash as I mentioned before the NSA's domestic surveillance program. So I think more than a trust in the ability, I think that there's a lot of questions about exactly how far those intelligence agencies are going in the interest of national security.
JOHNS: What is your name?
QUESTION: My name is Amy from Aloa (ph), Oregon. And I would like to know as an intern in the Russell Senate office building where there was recently the nerve gas scare, why the detectors were not accurate and what can be done to detect real threats in the future?
ARENA: Those sensors are very, very sensitive and as one law enforcement official put it to me, our greatest strength is our greatest weakness. Those sensors are set the way they are so that they do pick up even minute substances. You know, minute amount of substances. So because of that, they will go off sometimes if there's a cleaning fluid or fertilizer and it went off as you know in the attic of that building. So they are not exactly sure what made that happen. It doesn't happen too often. I mean, at least that sensor, but you do know that there are some false positives. And until they come up with better technology, we're stuck with that.
JOHNS: One of the things that's so interesting about that. I was up on Capitol Hill that night, and you see this a lot now, where there's a fear of a plane flying into the capitol or there's an evacuation. Is there a danger do you think of sort of the sky is falling syndrome where you do it so many times people get used to it? You know, people were walking out of the Russell thing just sort of laughing and joking and there are no longer taking it seriously.
ARENA: But they did evacuate and they did follow instructions. So everybody got into that garage and you were stuck there for hours. So there are hundreds of people that were there and stayed there had and the interesting thing was that they didn't -- there wasn't as you say, yet, they weren't nervous but they also understood. I think more than anything there is this understanding that Washington remains a major terror target as New York and Los Angeles do. And people who live in those cities are -- know that, are willing to put up with precautions that people in other cities don't have to. And that actually according to law enforcement, is a good thing.
JOHNS: Kelli Arena. From terrorism we're bound to New Orleans. One guy told our Sean Calebs he's so fed up with empty government promises of help that he never again wants to hear the phrase we've got you on our radar. Sean is back on our radar on the story after this. But first we take you behind the scenes at CNN. This week we caught up with White House producer Erika Dimmler on Air Force one.
ERIKA DIMMLER, CNN PRODUCER: Today we traveled to Manchester, New Hampshire, Bush gave a speech to the business and industry association on the budget.
BUSH: We have got to promote safe nuclear power.
DIMMLER: Our primary responsibilities while we're traveling are to make sure we get all the shots that we can of the president, (INAUDIBLE) make sure that we relay any and all information that happens on Air Force one.
We do look for the little moments, the small moments that sort of are unexpected, not necessarily planned, that kind of humanize the president. There are a lot little perks, as well. Today, for example, Scott McClellan came to the back of the airplane and threw little boxes of M&Ms to us. I think whether you've ridden on Air Force one time or a hundred times, I think it's an incredible experience and you can't help but be in awe.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: More of ON THE STORY in just a moment.
But first, a nor'easter is about to hit a big section of the country.
Straight to the CNN Weather Center and meteorologist Monica McNeal -- Monica.
MONICA MCNEAL, METEOROLOGIST: All right, Carol, we're starting to see those dreaded winds out of the Northeast that we really didn't want to see.
Take a look at this. Winds out of the Northeast just to the south of New York between 29 and 30 miles per hour. And then, just to southeast of Washington, D.C. out of the east at about 25 miles per hour. So we're really starting to see this storm as it intensifies and continues to drag its way up the coast. It will eventually park off of the New Jersey coast, dumping a heavy amount of snowfall for most of the entire region, especially across the I-95 Corridor.
Here's a look at our 24 hour snow totals to show you what's going to happen over the next 24 hours, especially for you in New York City. By tomorrow morning, it looks like you could see possibly up to about 12 inches of snow. In Boston, 10 to 14 inches of snow -- Carol. LIN: All right, thanks, Monica.
Ariel Sharon remains comatose after emergency surgery today. Doctors rushed him in for the operation after a C.T. scan spotted a problem with his large intestine. The Israeli prime minister suffered a stroke back in January.
At 8:00 p.m. Eastern, "CNN PRESENTS: FAT CHANCE." New research shows just how difficult it is for some people to lose weight and keep it off. Your genetics may play a big role.
That's what's happening right now in the news.
I'm Carol Lin.
Now back to ON THE STORY.
JOE JOHNS, HOST: CNN is ON THE STORY at the George Washington University in the nation's capital.
If you want a different view of this town, go down to New Orleans and hear straight talk about what Washington, FEMA, the Corps of Engineers promised and what they delivered.
Sean Callebs is on that story.
Let's look at his Reporter's Notebook.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
SEAN CALLEBS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: More than five months after the hurricane and I'm still stunned every time I go to these areas and I see debris up in the trees. I see concrete slabs where homes used to be.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My house, which was here, went in this direction.
CALLEBS: The house that used to be on this concrete slab was pushed all the way across Highway 11.
It's the resignation, at this point, on a number of people's faces. They're fed up with FEMA. They're fed up with the government. And many times, they're fed up with the media coverage. So just coming in here as an outsider trying to gain some aspect of what did it look like before, what was life like here before, looking at it now, nothing is the same.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I guess the anger, the anger grows out of frustration, personally and professionally, wanting to do more to help.
CALLEBS: I found people to be very open, very eager, very willing to tell their stories, even some things we may think, why would somebody want to say that? That seems kind of embarrassing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Every night, you know, you get -- I get depressed.
CALLEBS: A lot of times these people, it's either cathartic or they want to get the word out that they're simply fed up.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
JOHNS: So, Sean Callebs joining us now from New Orleans.
You look at those pictures and you see things still can be pretty bad.
How are the people coping with this emotionally?
CALLEBS: Well, you know, Joe, that's a great question. I think there's a certain degree of debris fatigue. This city, this area, the region, from Louisiana to Mississippi, trying to come back. But if you go outside your door every morning and you just see heaps of debris and know that every one of those piles, that's someone's life inside of a house. Everything now just dumped on the front lawn. It's tough, there's no question. It is tough.
JOHNS: I have a question for you.
What's your name and what's your question?
DIVARCA INSHAWN: My name is Divarca Inshawn (ph).
I was wondering when the health care infrastructure of New Orleans would be ready for another disaster.
CALLEBS: Well, that's a great question. And that is the unknown. What could happen with the hurricane season now only a matter of months away, there were a number of hospitals up and running. Now, at least two of the major hospitals still have no plans to reopen.
So could this city handle another catastrophe? You saw how it handled the last one. It could be more of the same.
JOHNS: Where are you from?
STACY: Hi, I'm Stacy (ph).
I'm from Maryland.
Now my question is, is the public still offering as much help to New Orleans as it was directly after the disaster?
CALLEBS: Not only this city, but, really, we see that all along the Gulf Coast. I've been in Pascagoula, in Waveland, in Biloxi, all throughout this state, and, really, that is one thing that the people do point to that has given them a sign of hope. They may say -- they say the government, in many cases, state, federal, letting them down. But they are still overwhelmed by the number of church organizations, the number of charitable organizations that simply roll into this area and say what can I do? I saw one group building houses for people in Waveland. They would go in, all they'd say is that the people have to pay for the supplies, but these -- this labor force would go up and throw the houses up. It was really amazing to watch.
KELLI ARENA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Sean, you went to the DNA lab where they're still trying to identify missing people.
What was that like for you?
CALLEBS: You know, that is a story that I really think needs more attention. We know that there are 1,300 people who died in this hurricane. That's the number known. But the state medical examiner says there are about 2,200 still missing. There are only about 100 unidentified bodies in the lab. So think about that. There could be significantly more fatalities.
What happens is this DNA lab gets a piece of bone and they get some DNA out of that. They send it all the way over to the former Yugoslavia because that area, dealing with the genocide from the Bosnia conflict in the mid-'90s, they are the ones doing the DNA testing.
And then that comes back. Then they try to put this very complex profile back together, try to hook these families up.
The medical examiner here in the state, Dr. Louis Cataldi, has not had one day off since the hurricane struck. His goal, his mandate, is to link up all these unidentified bodies with those loved ones, because he knows this is a story -- there are going to be loved ones who never know, never know what happened to their loved ones.
JOHNS: You know, covering this story, it was months ago that it first made headlines. And unlike so many other stories, it just simply has not died. It's still page one again and again. And for reporters, there's always that question of how do you keep it fresh?
Does this story feel stale to you yet?
CALLEBS: No. No. No, not in any way, shape or form. And I hope -- I mean that's the challenge. You don't want to run into Katrina fatigue, where people are tired of seeing it, because it is a -- it is a very emotional story, one that needs to be out there, for so many reasons. One, just this city as a whole, its culture, its place in history. Many people want to see this city come back, they would say, despite the leadership of the various governments. But they want to see it come back.
And if you just go out and deal with these people day in and day out, you see people who are still living on tents on cement slabs where their houses were. You see people who are basically in tears because they don't have FEMA trailers. And then you can go up in Arkansas and see thousands of trailers yet to be brought down here to hook up with the people who dearly need them.
So I implore people to follow this story, to keep talking about it, to stay on the people in charge, because this is such an important story.
We talked to one person and she said look at my face, this could be you next time a hurricane comes through. And it's -- it really is true.
JOHNS: A lot of passion there.
Sean Callebs in New Orleans.
Thanks so much.
We're back ON THE STORY of West Virginia and what I saw there this week. New calls for coal miners' safety, new worries that if safety costs too much, jobs will be lost.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ARENA: CNN is ON THE STORY.
Joe Johns was back in West Virginia this week, back on the story of coal mine disasters as the state went through a special safety check.
Here's Joe's Reporter's Notebook.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
JOHNS: It's very much a closed society and that comes from my memory of working in West Virginia years and years ago, when I first started in the business.
People are not happy to see the TV cameras there.
No one we spoke with today could say whether more teaching and training could have helped those miners who died over the last month. Those investigations are still going on.
It's an emotional story. That's -- that's one of the things that's hard. There's a lot of emotion driving it because people's lives are at stake.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They haven't done -- made many changes in the last few years. There are still some things they could do.
JOHNS: If these coal mines go down, those people who have lived off of the mines are not going to have a job. It's the safety of the miners versus their jobs, that's the balance you have to keep in mind.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
ARENA: Joe, OK, so I understand they have this stand down, but that they didn't shut the mines down, right?
So was this like a P.R. move or was this really something that was beneficial?
JOHNS: Well, see, that was one of the questions we were asking, what's the point of the stand down?
MSHA, that's the Mine Safety and Health Administration, essentially said we're going to do this nationwide. We're going to ask mines all over the country to take a time out, an hour or so at the beginning of each shift. Let us come in, talk to the miners about safety, how to get out, rescue, the things you need to do to stay alive. And that's basically...
ARENA: They hadn't done this before?
JOHNS: Well, they have. Actually, something like 2001 they had another stand down. That was because they had had a series of problems in the mines.
Meanwhile, though, in West Virginia, where most of the problems have occurred, they actually did go in and do inspections. But they have not closed down the mines and in some ways, yes, it is P.R. because they want to show that they're doing something.
The investigations aren't over yet, so you can't say for sure what they're going to need to do at the end of the day with like regulation and legislation.
A question from the audience?
Yes?
What's your name?
HENRIETTA RITZ: My name is Henrietta Ritz (ph).
I'm from Germany and currently a congressional fellow with the Event In Action (ph) program here in Washington.
My question is do you think the lack of oversight in the West Virginia coal mining business relates somehow to a lack of public attention this remote and poor area receives from the public?
JOHNS: Well, the truth is that there have been a lot of regulations out there and there have been a lot of inspectors going into mines year after year. The question here in Washington is whether -- since we've been doing all these cost-benefit analyses on things that are regulated, whether that may have, in some way, contributed to a more lax environment. And the governor of West Virginia himself has said look, I don't want to put a price on a miner's life. Every miner's life is priceless.
So, what's really going on here, in a lot of ways, is scrutiny of the coal mining industry because coal has started to go into a boom period. A lot more people are buying it. There's a lot more interest in alternative energy sources.
ARENA: Plus, Joe, you know West Virginia. I mean that is a very difficult nut to crack in terms of the miners and the coal mining companies, isn't it? JOHNS: Yes, certainly. And when you put the emotion into it, the emotion of a tragedy like the Sago coal mine, people, they don't want to talk about their tragedies. They don't want to talk about some situation that could lead them to have less coal mined, and that means fewer jobs.
So there's not a lot of incentive to talk to media people who are coming in and sort of intruding on all of this. It's human tragedy and it's sad for the country, but people here are living through this. And I said it's the choice between their lives and their livelihoods. It's a hard choice.
Yes, sir?
JOHN BOLLAR: My name is John Bollar (ph) from the University of Iowa.
I'm just curious, what's the current condition of the sole survivor of the disaster in West Virginia?
JOHNS: The last I heard -- Randal McCloy is his name -- was sort of making progress. I heard drifting, perhaps, in and out of consciousness, not -- not fully OK. It doesn't sound to me yet like they've had an opportunity to really interview him and talk to him.
ARENA: Right, no. His -- yes, one of the reports that we just saw was that the -- he was actually responding when his children were saying, "daddy"...
JOHNS: Right.
ARENA: ... that he had shown some recognition. But they don't know the extent of the brain damage still.
JOHNS: Right. Yes. And so it could still be a while for him. A lot of people, obviously, would like to talk to him and find out what happened, because it is still a real mystery and he knows more about it, perhaps, than anyone else, if he remembers it.
Coming up, hip-hop mogul turned designer Sean Combs has some fashion advice for our Alina Cho.
And we'll go to New York, where Alina reported from Fall Fashion Week.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOHNS: We're ON THE STORY to New York and the runways of Fashion Week. It's glamour, glitz and a chance for designers to show off what they hope will be the hottest trends.
CNN's very passionable Alina Cho was there.
Here's her notebook.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE) ALINA CHO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's a place to be and a place to be seen. I mean you can be photographed when you're in there, so you'd better look good.
The fashion shows are held in a venue which is simply known as "the tent." It's a big white tent in the middle of Manhattan. And getting access to this tent is not easy. In order to get inside, you need to be invited by the designer. And depending on the show, it can be a tough ticket to get.
Is there one thing that you think I should have?
SEAN "PUFFY" COMBS: You should have a nice sexy top to go out with.
CHO: All right.
You need to have contacts. This time through my contacts, we were actually able to gain access to people like Sean Combs, Carolina Herrera.
Well, I happen to be wearing Tory Burch today.
One thing I hear a lot from people when I'm in the tents covering the shows is what are you doing here? You know, I'm used to seeing you out covering a hurricane or something like that. And what I tell them is that fashion is a beat, like anything else. And I like to cover it. And I feel like it's often a little gift that the network gives me every season.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
JOHNS: Alina Cho joins us now from New York.
We have a question from the audience.
What's your name? What's your question?
MEGAN DANIELS: My name is Megan Daniels from Eastern Michigan University.
And my question is what do you think the fashion industry would be like if designers didn't put on fashion shows and just relied on catalogs and pictures of models?
CHO: Well, it might be a little more boring, I can tell you that.
You know, listen, a lot of people think Fashion Week here in New York is a very sort of elite, insular kind of a world that a lot of people don't understand. Which is why this time around we did a piece on Runway To Reality, that's what we called it.
And essentially we explained why fashion designers hold fashion shows in the first place. Really, this is for fashion editors, for celebrities, sometimes, and also for retailers. I mean these people from department stores like Saks Fifth Avenue, Bergdorf Goodman, Neiman Marcus, they come here to shop, essentially.
And they tell me that there's really no substitute for seeing the clothes walk down the runway live on a model. You see how the dress moves. You see how a suit hangs on a person. And, as many of you know, it is different on a person than it is on a hangar.
ARENA: Alina, you got to talk to a lot of the fashion big shots this week, including Karl Lagerfeld, I'm told.
CHO: I did.
ARENA: What are they like?
CHO: Well, you know, he's making a big splash in New York. He has never shown in New York, despite the fact that he has shown in Paris and Milan. You're talking about an icon in the industry. I mean he designs for Chanel. He designs for Fendi. A lot of people don't know that.
But he has shown in these other venues in Europe. He's making a splash in New York now with his own collection. And, you know, I was a little nervous interviewing him because he is really, to fashion, what Madonna is to music. He is a rock star.
But he couldn't have been nicer. He said he's really superstitious. He never wears his new collection before it goes down the runway.
What I found really interesting is he is not afraid to wear other designer's clothes. And when we spoke to him, he talked about fashion not just being a career, but a way of life.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KARL LAGERFELD, DESIGNER: I mean, you know, do you ask yourself why you breathe and how you breathe? No, you don't. You breathe. But doing a collection for me is like breathing, part of it. If not, I would collapse.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNS: Alina, we have a question from the audience.
What's your name?
What's your question?
IRIS: Hi, I'm Iris (ph) from Annapolis, Maryland.
And I was wondering if covering the fashion hype and glamour ever seems superficial to you in the face of the hard and horrific news going on right now, from the war to the torchings of the embassies?
CHO: You know, it can. You know, I have to admit, you know, particularly when you think about being down in New Orleans, as I have many times, it can seem a little bit like that. But, you know, for the people in this industry, it is a very big business. It is a very serious business. And you're talking about looking at clothes come down the runway. It does seem, sometimes, like fashion is frivolous.
But these are the clothes that eventually make their ways to the stores and these are the clothes that people like you and me buy eventually.
So it is a very important business. It's a very big business. And it is something that CNN is committed to covering.
JOHNS: One question I've always had is who decides what's hot and what's not? Is it the reporters? Is it the fashion editors? Who decides and what do they base that on?
CHO: You know, a little bit of both. Probably a lot the fashion editors, Joe. So, you're right about that. Essentially what we know about fashion shows is that the fashion editors often sit in the front row. So do the celebrities, obviously, and hopefully wearing the designers' clothes when they go to the fashion show.
But these fashion editors, essentially, with one word can create buzz about a dress, a suit, a coat, shoes, bags, an entire collection, really. They can make or break a designer. And that is precisely why these fashion shows are so important.
ARENA: Alina, did you see any clothes that are for real people, I mean not just celebrities and rich people? This is a room full of students here.
CHO: Yes. I mean listen, you know, part of the reason why these retailers go there is to get ideas. And, you know, what -- immediately, it's interesting, one of the designers I spoke to, Mark Badgley of Badgley & Mishka -- they're famous for their evening wear -- one thing he told me is that Style.com has become sort of the bible for the industry because the very next day after the show, you can go -- you and me, anybody, really -- can go onto the Internet, look the at these pictures and eventually these designs will be copied and they will end up in department stores.
And so while you might not be able to have the label of a Carolina Herrera, a Michael Koors, a Ralph Lauren or an Oscar de la Renta, you might be able to get something similar. And, of course, for a far less price.
JOHNS: Alina Cho in New York, thanks so much.
Coming up, we'll tell you what stories we're working on for next week.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOHNS: Keep yourself on the story at cnn.com.
Our Web site tells you about the panel, the topics and how to get tickets to join our audience.
Let's take a quick look ahead ON THE STORY.
What are you looking at next week?
ARENA: Jury selection for Zacarias Moussaoui, the -- it's his trial for sentencing. And so with him, he's a live wire. You never know what you're going to get.
And you're busy.
JOHNS: Yes, I am busy. We have a new round of waste, fraud and abuse on the hurricane Katrina beat. So, stay tuned for that.
Thanks to my colleagues and our audience here at the George Washington University.
And thank you for watching ON THE STORY.
We'll be back each week, Saturday night, Sunday afternoon.
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