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On the Story
White House Staff Shake Up; Immigration Reform Bills On Capitol Hill; Protests In Support Of Amnesty For Illegal Immigrants; Jill Carroll Lands In Boston
Aired April 02, 2006 - 13:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOPHIA CHOI, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Sophia Choi at CNN Center in Atlanta. ON THE STORY begins in just a minute, but first the news.
Former hostage Jill Carroll is finally home eager to be with her waiting family. Her long journey from Baghdad ended at Boston's Logan Airport just a short time ago. She's now at "The Christian Science Monitor" building in Boston. Our Paula Hancocks is traveling with her and we will hear from Paula soon, so please stay with us for more live coverage.
Two military pilots are presumed dead after their helicopter crashes southwest of Baghdad. The U.S. military believed their Apache Long Bow was shot down during combat patrol operations on Saturday.
The Minutemen are back at the border. Right now volunteers are watching the U.S.-Mexico border in Arizona. The group claims that citizen patrols help arrests thousands of people trying to sneak into the U.S. some members say they actually spotted a group of would-be immigrants within their first hour of patrol yesterday.
Thousands paid their last respects to country music legend Buck Owens. Fans lined up in Bakersfield, California to view the open casket. His funeral later today will include musical tributes from industry friends. Owens died last week at age 76.
I'll have more news for you in 30 minutes. ON THE STORY starts right now.
ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: This is CNN and we are ON THE STORY from the campus of the George Washington University, in the heart of the nation's capital, our correspondents bring you the stories behind the stories they're covering.
Ed Henry is ON THE STORY of a White House shake-up, and who might call it quits next.
Andrea Koppel covers the immigration debate on Capitol Hill, and the tricky situation for Republicans.
Internet reporter Abbi Tatton is ON THE STORY of immigration protests, in the streets and online.
Jamie McIntyre is ON THE STORY of presidential power, over military trials and the nation's highest court.
Randi Kaye is ON THE STORY of a controversial treatment for troubled children. Is it torture?
And Alina Cho is ON THE STORY on the race for mayor in the Big Easy.
Welcome, I'm Ali Velshi, with me here Jamie McIntyre, Andrea Koppel, Ed Henry. And our correspondents will be taking questions from our studio audience drawn from visitors, college students, and people across Washington.
We begin with a staff shake-up at the White House. President Bush is bringing in a new chief of staff amid pressure to revitalize his administration. Well, it was Ed Henry's second day on the job as the new White House correspondent. Let's look inside his notebook.
ED HENRY, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I was kind of hoping that the first couple of days I'd be able to get my sea legs, maybe find the bathroom, do some of the basics, and not worry about breaking stories or anything.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: White House Chief Staff Andy Card is stepping down ...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: Pandemonium, you're rushing the story on the air. It was my first Rose Garden event. The president made some remarks. But all of a sudden the president finished his remarks, and turned as if he was just going to leave, so I started shouting.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: Do you have any more staff changes?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: The president wouldn't answer it, and there's a good reason for that. He's not sure, maybe. And in terms of sources and building relationships with the White House, I haven't covered it before directly.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: Immigration reform splitting the Republican Party.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: But you know, in covering politics and covering Congress you develop relationships with people all over town, at the White House, on the Hill, some of the lobbyists, and some of the strategists in both parties. And you end up finding information from all kind of sources.
The most memorable part has been this is a dream come true to actually be covering the White House and from day one, practically, you're just diving in, you're not even thinking about how, am I going do it? What am I going do? You just follow the story and instinct takes over.
VELSHI: Like a pro, he's carrying himself! Ed Henry, unbelievable. You can't ever guess in this news business what's going to happen. But a pretty good story to get your feet wet at the White House?
HENRY: Yes, absolutely. Everyone was talking about it. What's the president going to do to shake up these low poll numbers. We thought there might be some changes. We weren't expecting it right this week.
And I think what was most fascinating about it is they think the White House thought maybe this will quiet everyone down, but instead the Republicans immediately said this is not enough. They think sort of rearranging the deck chairs, as the Democrats put it, and a lot of Republicans agreed with that. They said, look, the new White House chief of staff Josh Bolten is also a Bush insider.
What Republicans have been saying is we want an outsider, we want some fresh blood. And immediately Republicans said this is not good enough. It is going to be a fascinating story to see how this plays out.
VELSHI: The only outsider the White House got this week was Ed Henry.
Your name and where are you from?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Curtis Burner), from Indiana.
Will we see a change in White House policy with Josh Bolten as the new chief of staff?
HENRY: No, I think that's maybe one of the problems -- or challenge, maybe -- for Josh Bolten. Is the fact that he's very much somebody who has been with this president since day one, back in 2001, just as Andy Card was.
Think about Andy Card, the job he's had for five and a half years. The average tenure for a White House chief of staff is something like 18, 19 months. He's been on the job for five and a half years. This is someone who basically was getting up at 4:30 in the morning and getting to work at 6:00 a.m., nonstop, hectic space, traveling with the president. A lot of times, they say, he was the first one in and he'd leave at 10:00, 11:00 at time sometimes, because we're at war. And you chief of staff, it's a difficult job. It's a grind. Clearly they needed to bring in fresh blood and we'll see whether or not there are more changes.
JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SR. PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: I have to say when you said, you know, about something happening right away on the job. It just reminds me, when I first started the Pentagon, same thing. You think you can have a chance to figure things out and, boom! We went to Somalia on my first week.
I have to a ask you. ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Oh, you show off!
MCINTYRE: They said, don't date yourself on this show. It was '92.
So what's the biggest difference between covering Capitol Hill and the White House?
HENRY: Well, the first thing is that I'm outside now. On Capitol Hill, I used to be indoors for my live shots. My first live shot, believe it or not, my hair was all over the place. And that's when I got the e-mail about -- not, you know, great job. It was get some hair spray, because normally on Capitol Hill, I'm indoors with the live shots. This time we're on the lawn with all the elements. Fortunately, it's spring now. And I've got the hair spray.
MCINTYRE: You can go all over on Capitol Hill, you can go anywhere you want. The White House is pretty restrictive, I think.
HENRY: It is somewhat restricted. Because you basically sit in -- we have our own booth, CNN, and we're in the basement so it's pretty dark and dank. But actually, since you're behind the White House gate you able to sort of, when you need to do some thinking, walk around the white house grounds a little bit and get some fresh air.
It's got pluses and minuses. But in terms of, in all seriousness, in covering the story, politics is politics. And as I said on the air this week, somewhat jokingly, is that it's just a different white building behind me. It used to be the Capitol and now it's the White House. In a way, you have to attack the story no matter where it is.
VELSHI: And we'll get the other side of the new job perspective from Andrea shortly, but one of the things you both covered at the Capitol and at the White House this week, is the huge story of immigration across this country. And I know just as it's captured the attention of the country, it's captured the attention of some people here.
I think you have a question on it, sir.
(Jake Reef), Atlanta, Georgia. I was wondering if you thought whether the immigration debate will alienate Hispanic voters from the Republican Party.
HENRY: That's one of the dilemmas the president is facing right now. Basically, you have conservatives in his party saying, look, if you have this guest worker program that the conservatives charges amnesty for the 12 million illegal immigrants already here. Conservatives will be upset and they'll not turn out in November in the mid-term elections. But there are other Republicans telling the president, wait a second if you don't push hard for a guest worker program, Hispanic voters -- which the president has been courting for the last five and a half years -- will leave the Republican in droves.
So he's sort of caught in between. What the president is trying to do is thread the political needle and pull both sides together, saying I'm from border security, toughening the borders, tightening them, but also some sort of a modified guest worker program. It will be a tough balancing act and I'm not convinced the Congress will finish any kind of legislation this year.
VELSHI: Your name, and where are you from?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm Mary Friedburg (ph) from Richmond, Virginia. I was wondering how much of an impact this immigration issue will have on the upcoming elections?
HENRY: Well, clearly when you look at the polls on both sides, there's a lot of passion. And we saw protesters all across country, specifically a lot of the protests were pushing for some sort of a guest worker program.
I think, Andrea, you saw it on the Hill. You see strange political alliances. I mean a lot of conservatives upset at the president. People like Ted Kennedy, standing up as a liberal and saying I support the president's guest worker program.
KOPPEL: That's right. And standing next to John McCain and other Republicans, who he usually doesn't necessarily see eye to eye on.
That's something. There a strange bedfellows aspect to the story, both on the Hill and also out in the community at large, where you're seeing alliances between the AFL-CIO, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the civil rights, some of the large civil rights groups as well as others, within the church community, all banding together because they each have a stake in the outcome of the immigration reform bill.
VELSHI: And two things you just mentioned, which we'll lead into. One of them are those massive protests we've seen this week, and what influence they have on any of you, or any of you watching. And the other, of course, is those strange bedfellows at Congress.
We'll take that from White House and the Capitol and the topic of immigration reform, and how it's dividing Republicans and prompting something Democrats, as Andrea said, to actually side with the president.
Cats are sleeping with dogs, what is going? Andrea Koppel is ON THE STORY, right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LOU DOBBS, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening, from Cancun, where the leaders of the United States, Mexico and Canada are holding summit talks tonight, tri-lateral summit talks on illegal immigration, border security, and so-called free trade.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: On a lonely stretch of highway, 20 miles north of the Arizona/Mexico border. You see a whole bunch of things which have been dropped by some illegal immigrants. Here are some garbage bags used to keep the rain off, these are bottles, bottles of water here. I see they're from Mexico.
PETER VILES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Why the flag of Mexico and the flags of Guatemala and other nations? One woman told us, yes, I am an American, but I have to stand up for my culture and I have to support my heritage and other people with that heritage. Not a particularly American idea when it comes to civics, and politics, but it is certainly prevailing here in Los Angeles.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VELSHI: CNN's been ON THE STORY covering the immigration debate in Mexico, around the United States, and right here in Washington, D.C. This issue has created surprising allies and bitter discourse on Capitol Hill. Let's click back to a report from Congressional Correspondent Andrea Koppel.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDREA KOPPEL (voice over): As the first full day of debate got underway, critics of a proposed plan to layout a path to citizenship for an estimated 11 million illegal immigrants hammered away at what they saw as the plan's Achilles' heel.
SEN. DAVID VITTER, (R) LOUISIANA: Any measure tantamount to amnesty sends exactly the wrong message.
KOPPEL: But the plan's supporters which include prominent Republicans as well as Democrats insisted these illegal immigrants would not get a free pass.
(On camera): There really is a split within the Republican Party over this issue.
I just ran into Senator John McCain. He said to me that what is going right now is transcendent.
Over in the House, Tom Tancredo, Republican of Colorado, who stood before an enormous banner with an X going through the word "amnesty". He said according to recent polls, Americans are not in favor of legalizing those illegal aliens.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
VELSHI: Andrea Koppel has been part of that shake-up at the White House that we saw Ed Henry end up there. You are now at the Capitol, again, big story, first few days on the job.
KOPPEL: Yes. Oh, my goodness. You know, Ed has to remember a few names now over at White House. I've got 535 names to learn, staffers -- I mean, I already had tremendous respect for Ed and I have even more now that I've been there so it's been -- .
ANNOUNCER:
This is CNN Breaking News. CHOI: Hello, I'm Sophia Choi at the CNN Center in Atlanta. We will take you back to ON THE STORY in just a bit. First, we want to bring you back up-to-date on the story. Less than an hour ago, former hostage Jill Carroll arrived back at the U.S. She landed at Boston's Logan International Airport. CNN's Paula Hancocks was onboard the flight with Carroll from Germany to Boston and she joins us live now with more details.
Paula, what was her reaction as she touched U.S. soil after this huge ordeal?
PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, I spoke to her earlier on in the flight, Sophia, she seemed very relaxed and she seemed extremely happy, as you can imagine.
She was also almost counting down the hours and the minutes before she was going touchdown. She did touchdown just about an hour ago as we all did, and she was whisked off the plane before anybody else was.
When I spoke to her she wanted to point out just how flattered she and was how shocked she was that everyone had taken such an interest, and how everybody had been really working hard to try and secure her release. She was saying that the U.S. military was incredibly helpful. Those Ramstein Air Base in Western Germany. She said the guys were fantastic, and they were very helpful.
She said, primarily, all she wanted to do now was to meet her family. She wasn't thinking about interviews and she wasn't thinking about what she was going to do the day after today. All she wanted was to meet her family again.
CHOI: Paula, we know that she's at "The Christian Science Monitor" building there in Boston, right now. Do you think that she's going release another statement through them, as she did yesterday?
HANCOCKS: I really don't know. To be honest, she doesn't want to do interviews on the plane, so we just went over to her and said hello, and just sort of introduced ourselves and chatted for a bit. She wasn't going give any information out.
I did ask her about a statement that she gave out on Saturday in "The Christian Science Monitor" and she did say, well, I felt it had to be said. So that's the reason she said that she had to make that statement, itself. But she was just very relaxed. She was chatting away to Scott Peterson, who was sitting next to her on the plane.
A little later on, when most of the lights were off, sort of a few hours before we touched down, and everyone in first class was sleeping, the two of them were still up gossiping and chatting and laughing. So, obviously, they had a lot to catch up on in the last three months or so. She just seemed incredibly happy and she kept saying she wanted to see her family. She has spoken to her family so many times and she was desperate to see them.
CHOI: We understand she's supposed to go into seclusion with them in an apartment that's been set up with close friends and family members. She asked in her statement yesterday for some time to heal. So I guess we'll be hearing from her when she's ready.
Paula Hancocks, thank you so much for that update.
So, Jill Carroll back in the U.S. after 82 days in captivity in Iraq. We'll bring you more updates on the story as they happen now back to ON THE STORY.
KOPPEL: Because I actually did find out the answer to it, and it is a quorum call can last a minute, or it can last hours upon hours, right?
HENRY: I'm not going to give you the answer. Go on the Web site and find out the answer to that.
VELSHI: Andrea Koppel, thank you so much and congratulations to both of you on passing your first ON THE STORY test in your first week on the job.
From Senate debate on Capitol Hill to those Los Angeles marches that we're talking about, CNN is ON THE STORY of immigration reform.
Now, do these large-scale protests really sway public opinion? I'm going ask our audience here, when we come back and we'll find out what our Internet reporter Abbi Tatton sees ON THE STORY, online. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: You are ON THE STORY. You are ON THE STORY. Tell us what topics you want to discuss, just e-mail us at ONTHESTORY@CNN.com.
We've all seen the massive protests in Los Angeles, and around the country this week, as students and immigrant workers took to the streets in opposition of legislative action against illegal immigrants. Those pictures were impressive with half a million people marching. And I want to ask our audience how many of you think that protests and demonstrations like that actually sway public opinion? Give me a show of hands if you think they actually sway public opinion. OK. How many of you don't think they have any effect on public opinion?
This audience looks like it's almost split half way. Let's talk about where we're getting a lot of discussion on this, and that's on the blogs. The bloggers were ON THE STORY and in the streets this week. Keeping watch for us is our Internet Reporter Abbi Tatton. What are you seeing about this?
ABBI TATTON, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Well, Ali, from the political bloggers, a lot of commentary and dissecting the immigration bills in Washington. A lot of people were out on the streets covering protests that were going. One of them was Dave Bullock, this is his site, eq.com. He was in downtown LA, heard the commotion outside of his window, and decided to take his camera and go out and record what was going on. And Dave is with us today. He's joining us via web cam from his home in Los Angeles.
Dave, thanks for joining us.
DAVE BULLOCK, DAVEBULLOCK.COM: Thank you.
We've seen a lot of the pictures. We've seen the aerial shots of what was going on your doorstep, what was it like on the ground?
BULLOCK: It was an amazing experience. I've never seen that many people all together in one place. Everyone was so excited, and it was such a positive energy, it was amazing.
TATTON: So you went to the protest. You also went to some of the student walkouts there. You were talking to some of the students. How were they organizing? How were they mobilizing?
BULLOCK: The student I talked to on Monday said they organized via the networking site MySpace, as well as cell phones and cell phone calls, printed flyers and word of mouth.
TATTON: There's been some accusation, discussion online that some of these kids were trying to get out of school. You talked to some of them. Was that the impression you were getting?
BULLOCK: Well, you know, anybody as a youth doesn't always like being in school, but for the most part almost every kid I spoke to was very enthusiastic and felt strongly about the topics at hand. And they weren't there as a ditch day. I'm sure, there were some that were, but that's how it goes.
VELSHI: All right. So, Dave, you were observing this, we followed it. I want to go back to the audience. I know this woman here was one of the people who felt that it does sway public opinion, it does have an effect. Stand up and tell me why you think so.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Think it's because the general population sees that thousands of people are affected by this issue. So it increases public awareness about the issue.
VELSHI: And it puts some faces and names. Thank you.
Before I go back to you, Dave are for your comment, I think you were one of those people who said you don't feel like it has that much impact, tell me why.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't think it does. It makes people feel strongly about the opinions they have previously. It makes them more aware of the issue, but just so strongly about it. At least I know for myself.
VELSHI: Like if you were in favor of the issue you're probably more in favor and if you were against it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. VELSHI: Dave, what do you think?
BULLOCK: Well, for me, I didn't have a strong opinion on it either way until I went down to the march, and I saw these people so -- they were moved by this bill. And they all came out in such great numbers that it was inspiring for me, and I definitely swayed my opinion and I definitely support them now.
VELSHI: Abbi, Dave went out and saw it himself. You've been tracking it on the Internet. What's your sense of what the bloggers feel about the impact of demonstrations like this?
TATTON: On the impact on the bill, there's a lot of -- there's a lot of talk. There was some skepticism that you're seeing out there, like I said, what were the kids doing? Where were they coming out on this?
What I was interested in is how the Internet was being used to mobilize some of these kids, these Web sites that they used to chat with each other. They were using to organize these protests, to organize these walkouts, so that for me was an interesting Internet element, this week that we saw.
VELSHI: Let me get a quick question in from our audience. I know you have a question about this, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Brian from Missoula, Montana, we see lots of men on the street polls, and Internet polls, and they're not accurate, they're not represented and not scientific. Why do journalists insist on using them?
TATTON: Journalists using Internet polls and when we use them on CNN, and we do say this is an Internet poll. It's not scientific. It's actually interesting that the bloggers often poll their audiences as well. They asked their readers who, for example, they would like as a potential candidate. But when they're doing that, they're not saying that's representative, for example, of the whole country. They're asking for reaction from their specific readers, which is an interesting subsection as well.
VELSHI: Dave, thank you for being with us. Abbi, it's an important point to make. So thank you as well for being with us. Important topic. And it was god have somebody on the ground who was seeing what was happening. Dave and Abbi, thanks very much.
From immigration protests to power struggle at Supreme Court. Our Jamie MCINTYRE is back ON THE STORY of how much legal protection terror suspects should receive. That's coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHOI: I'm Sophia Choi at the CNN Center in Atlanta. ON THE STORY continues in a moment, but first this developing story, journalist Jill Carroll is finally back in the U.S. She arrived at Boston's Logan Airport a short time ago. First stop, the offices of the "Christian Science Monitor," that's the news organization she was freelancing for when she was abducted in Iraq. CNN's Allan Chernoff is there and he joins us now live. Alan, what have you got?
ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Sophia, right now a very joyful reunion taking place. Jill Carroll seeing once again, her mom, dad and twin sister Katie. Our producer and cameraman did see her limousine pop into the underground parking garage of this huge complex for the Christian Scientists. And so somewhere in this complex, we believe Jill Carroll is once again with her family. A very joyful reunion, of course, after being released after 82 days of captivity in Baghdad.
We are not expecting Jill Carroll to make any statements today. She had said through the "Christian Science Monitor" yesterday that she needed time to heal, time to be with her family. A little quiet time. So we're expecting no comments from her today. Possibility, though that the "Christian Science Monitor" itself may make some statements later today. We understand that two editors of the "Monitor" did escort Jill Carroll from the airport. Sophia?
CHOI: Allan, I know that the "Christian Science Monitor" had also said a couple of days ago that they planned a celebration upon her return and then a news conference of some sort, but on her timetable.
CHERNOFF: Yeah. They certainly want to give Jill time to reacclimate, to basically be with her family. In fact the editor of the "Monitor" yesterday said let the healing begin and they do want this to be a time of heal for example Jill Carroll.
CHOI: All right, Allan Chernoff, thank you so much. We are going to stay on top of this developing story and I'm going have more top stories for you in about 30 minutes. We join ON THE STORY now in progress.
VELSHI: We are ON THE STORY the George Washington University. Now, everybody's been doing a new job this week. CNN's Jamie McIntyre normally reports from the Pentagon but this week he was somewhere else, across the Potomac River at the Supreme Court. He sat in as the high court weighed the limits of presidential power in the war on terrorism. Here's his reporter's notebook.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MCINTYRE: It's really good for a reporter who's been -- who covers one beat all of the time to get out and see things from the other side. It could be a historic case. And all of the earmarks of potentially having a landmark ruling.
This case is really about the limits of presidential power and it was interesting to see how the justices seemed to take umbrage at the fact that Congress was usurping some of their jurisdiction to decide this case.
Part of the job is listening to the arguments, talking to the people who know more about it than you do and trying to sift through what's really important. You can't help but being struck by the majesty of the court when you go in. The ritual, the routine, the respect that everybody has, all of the reporters follow a very orderly pattern as you file into the courtroom. It's a completely different dynamic, of course, than walking around the 17 1/2 miles of the Pentagon corridor.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HENRY: Jamie, you went from indoors to outdoors. Did you use hairspray?
MCINTYRE: I didn't. I didn't use makeup, either. I didn't bring any with me. They told me it was a little shiny out there.
HENRY: In all seriousness, you got a chance to see the political dynamics that you might not normally look at in terms of the new Supreme Court justices. We have a new Chief Justice Roberts, of course, Justice Alito and what was your sense of how they interacted?
MCINTYRE: It's really fascinating and it's just too bad and I hope some day they allow cameras in the courtroom because every American ought to be able to watch these things. But to get the chance to sit there for 90 minutes with no distractions and just watch what's going on. And Alito was very active. And you could tell that Justice Alito and Justice Scalia were fairly sympathetic to the government and you could also count at least four or five justices who seemed to be much more skeptical and that's not to say you can predict how the case is going to go, and of course, very interestingly, as is always the case, Justice Thomas never says anything. He just sits there and listens.
HENRY: What about the new chief justice, because people are wondering whether he'll be on the administration's side, whether Alito and Roberts.
MCINTYRE: It's interesting because he had recused himself from this case because he sat on a lower court that ruled in favor of the government. But you really do get a sense in the way the justices asked the question of how they're thinking and it's interesting to see what they focus on.
KOPPEL: You know what? What I don't get is that it's been five years since 9/11 and there hasn't been a single trial yet before these military tribunals. Why do we -- why do they bother talking about it?
MCINTYRE: Part of it's been the legal challenges to them and they've modified the rules. One of the complaints that the lawyers have is the rules for these commissions keep changing all of the time. You're trying to take this very complex case and boil it down to its essentials. I remember at one point I said on the air it really comes down to whether president bush can be judge, jury and executioner.
And soon as I said that I thought well, is that too harsh, but in effect, President Bush decides which people - who is an enemy combatant, who is going to go before this trial. He set up all of the rules, which is by the way a lot of lawyers complain are not fair including some human rights groups and others and then he reviews the sentences. When they appeal it goes back to the president again and he's the ultimate authority, so it's a very interesting case and it could be, as I said, a landmark decision, there could be nothing. Because it's a jurisdictional issue. If they decide they don't have jurisdiction they won't rule anything.
VELSHI: Your name and where are you from?
QUESTION: Kirk von Sturmberg (ph), from Minneapolis. I was wondering how the White House policy on the war on terror might change if they lose the Guantanamo Bay cases?
MCINTYRE: Well it's interesting because the White House has made a big point of saying they're not treating terrorism the way -- they're not using the laws that you would use to prosecute criminals to fight terrorists. They say it just doesn't work. And what the court will look at here is basically when they do have to treat terror suspects essentially the same way you treat a criminal defendant and give them the same rights. So it could have profound effect. It also could have a profound effect on how much power the president can just exercise on his own without strong have Congress sign off.
KOPPEL: If I could just add a quick footnote. I covered the State Department for eight years before I moved to Capitol Hill.
MCINTYRE: I remember that.
KOPPEL: You remember that? And the fact is what they're also trying to do, the State Department is trying to send a lot of there are about, 800-some odd Guantanamo combatants that are still being held in Gitmo, they're trying to get them back to the countries where they came from and that's part of the negotiations going on so maybe they don't have to go to trial.
VELSHI: Thirty seconds and let's see if we can get another question in.
QUESTION: I'm Hanna Door (ph) from San Francisco, California. I'm just wondering if the detainees are going to be tried as war criminals. why they're not provided with the same protections -- provided by the Geneva Convention?
MCINTYRE: That's one of the cases that - that's one of the things the Supreme Court is going to rule on. Whether they're entitled to the Geneva protection. The administration keeps saying no, that there's a tradition that goes back to George Washington's time that they can try combatants under these conditions. The other argument is that these are essentially a kangaroo court. So that's the essential question the court is going to decide.
HENRY: What about body armor. That obviously came up at the end of the week as a big issue. It's been out there for a long time.
MCINTYRE: Huge hot button issue because the army says to troops that they can't wear any body armor that they bought themselves. Only the stuff the army gave them. Some people think why can't they buy better body armor but the Pentagon and the army says the body armor we're giving them is the best available. And there is a private company out there that is trying to sell armor to the army. They say their armor is better and the army says no. There's a big name- calling going on.
VELSHI: What I love about that story. Just didn't think they could buy their own armor. I thought everything they get they get. Good story. Thanks, folks. Coming up next, the story of New Orleans remains on our plate and the mayoral race there is the next thing that we're going to be talking about. Plus there are some other stories CNN covered this week from around the globe. Take a look elsewhere.
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BILL SCHNEIDER, CNN ANALYST: A new Israeli government is elected led by Kadima, a party that didn't exist six months ago. The vote in Israel showed that confidence in the old alternatives has collapsed. Israelis believe the security is fence is working. So Ehud Olmert said he would turn the fence into a border, unilaterally.
JEFF KOINANGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Former exile-turned fugitive Charles Taylor attempting to flee across Nigeria's board into neighboring Chad was captured early Wednesday by an alert border guard. Taylor is accused of aiding and abetting the RUF that waged a 10-year civil war in Sierra Leone and was responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of innocent civilians.
PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This is how the French unions hoped their protests would not end. A day of peaceful and well- attended demonstrations across the country degenerating in Paris into a standoff. Students want the job security that the government had guaranteed their parents and their grandparents. French politicians say they need to give employers more flexibility so they'll create more jobs.
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VELSHI: Welcome back to CNN's ON THE STORY from the George Washington University campus in Washington. New Orleans resident will elect a mayor in just a few weeks and Alina Cho traveled back to the Big Easy to scope out the competition. Here's her reporter's notebook.
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ALINA CHO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The main candidates the candidates who can afford to are traveling to places like Houston, to Atlanta, to Dallas, other parts of the state. I mean, you're not talking about a voting block that is just in New Orleans anymore.
What we found interesting that was there were actually subtle differences in the way that people viewed things. For instance, people who live in New Orleans, according to the candidates, care more about things like garbage pickup, are the city lights working, whereas when you go to places like Houston they want to know how can I get home? There are 23 candidates in the mayoral race and that is not including the incumbent Ray Nagin. Some of the candidates are serious contenders, a few of them, most are not. We spoke tie 24-year-old med student from Tulane University. Nick Bockay's (ph) platform is that he wants young professionals to come back to New Orleans.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That that's what we're looking for.
CHO: You're talking about a lot of, out there on the table post- Katrina and everyone who wants to be heard.
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VELSHI: Alina Cho joins us from New York. I think it's your eighth time you've been back there so you will know as much as many people in New Orleans know about this. I want to go straight to the audience and I think this gentleman here had a question. Your name and where you're from.
QUESTION: Mike Schulmaber (ph) from Columbia, Missouri. My question is how will the mayor of New Orleans statement about wanting the city to be chocolate again affect him in the upcoming election?
CHO: Well, it's hard to say. He admitted himself to me when I sat down and interviewed him that these days whenever he says something it seems to offend either the white community or the black community. He can't seem to win.
Let me tell you, what was interesting that was I think the media tends to cover Ray Nagin, the incumbent when he makes a gaffe, when he says something that he shouldn't have. And what I think people tend to forget, particularly around the country, but people in New Orleans know this, is that a lot of people support him. When we were with him, we were in a local restaurant, everyone wanted to shake his hand. Everyone was telling him what a great job he was doing and one thing to keep in mind, too, is when we were in Houston speaking to Katrina evacuees they said the same thing. They were saying we support Nagin because he went through the storm with us and that was very surprising to me.
VELSHI: Another question for you, Alina, from the audience. Sir, your name and where you're from.
QUESTION: I'm Logan Copley (ph) from Phoenix City, Alabama. And I was wondering what effect will Senator Mary Landrieu have on the mayor race in New Orleans since her brother is vying for the position.
CHO: Well, Mitch Landrieu is certainly an interesting man to speak to. He was the lieutenant governor. He has 18 years of experience and he's been in politics. I said in my piece earlier this week that his greatest asset may be his name. If his name, Landrieu sounds familiar, it is because it is. His father was the last white mayor of New Orleans back in the 70s. His sister is U.S. Senator Mary Landrieu of Louisiana. He had some interesting things to say. One thing that he did say and this was echoed across the board with all of the candidates when you were serious or not is that this is probably the most important local election in New Orleans' history. MCINTYRE: Alina, you said that Mayor Nagin admitted he made a gaffe. The Washington definition of a gaffe is, don't you? Is accidentally telling the truth. But I'm curious to know what was your personal impressions. We said this is your eighth time back. What did you see? What's different? What's happening?
CHO: Well, I do notice things gradually changing every time I go there. The one thing I noticed this time that was really interesting was there were cabs in New Orleans. I was surprised to see that. I live in New York so I'm used to seeing it here, but certainly not in New Orleans. The other thing we noticed that was there were actually many tourists there. There were tour buses. It was shocking to me and this is not something that I have seen. I've spent about three months there since Hurricane Katrina. I had never seen that.
One interesting note, when we were following Ray Nagin around at this local restaurant, he was speaking to a couple from Los Angeles and they said we love New Orleans. We want it to come back. Support the city and the interesting thing they said was they were having a little debate about whether they should go visit some of the destruction and the mayor said I think you should, TV doesn't do it justice. I think you should go to the 17th Street Canal and see where the levee breached and that was quite interesting to me.
KOPPEL: Alina, it seemed like there were real characters who were throwing their hat in the mayoral ring. That young graduate student who wants to bring young professionals. What more can you tell us about him and some of the other candidates?
CHO: He has a history in politics. He's the president of the graduate schools at Tulane, Andrea. He's 24 years old. He fully admits he doesn't think he'll be a very serious candidate, but I think like all of these other candidates, one thing they found was interesting. You may not be a serious contender, but these people take their candidacy very seriously. They fully admit they don't think they'll win, but, remember post-Katrina there are so many problems, so many issues out there and everybody wants to be heard. We spoke to, for instance, a 38-year-old radio show host James Arie (ph), he's a radio show host, as I mentioned and opera singer. His platform is bringing back the arts.
Now that probably won't get him elected. But he's saying, listen, if one of the bigger candidates can fold this issue into their platform, then he'll be happy.
VELSHI: Alina Cho in New York thanks so much for joining us and for those repeated trips back to New Orleans. Coming up, a Massachusetts school shocks its students to keep them on their best behavior.
Our Randi Kaye reported on that story and received a lesson of her own. We're back in a moment with that.
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VELSHI: We are back ON THE STORY. Can electric shock therapy improve a troubled child's behavior? Well, our Randi Kaye who some might think is a troubled child took a shot in the arm to test the theory. Let's click back to her report.
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RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The Judge Rotenberg Center claims to be the only one in the country using electric shock aversion therapy. They call it the graduated electronic decelerator, the GED, and half their student goes to school each day tethered to electrodes housed in a fanny pack. It's a therapy almost as old as electricity itself. Banned as barbaric at a far higher voltage, illegal in some states, Dr. Matthew Israel has been under fire from parents, doctors and psychiatrists since he invented the electric shock device 16 years ago.
Dr. Israel calls it behavioral skin shock, an electric spanking, nothing like the convulsive shock treatments demonized in films upon.
I strapped one here to my arm to see how powerful the shock is and it's delivered with a remote control.
Oh, man! That hurt! These parents say their kids are the worst of the worst. A danger to themselves and others. That the GED, which is only administered with court and parental approval, saved their children's lives.
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VELSHI: Randi Kaye is with us and that is crazy stuff. Randy, I'm a business reporter and the worst thing I would do is buy a stock and make money off of it. Right to the audience for a question. Your name and where you're from.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Bertie Kildow (ph) from Minneapolis, Minnesota. What kind of negative effects could the shock therapy have on students mentally or physically.
KAYE: Well, actually, Dr. Matthew Israel who founded that center and also created the GED which is the device that gives the shock, he has done some research and he says that it doesn't harm the heart and it doesn't harm the brain at all. So he doesn't expect any long-term effects from this at all and of course I asked those questions before I decided to try it on myself.
VELSHI: Yeah.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What was that like, Randi?
VELSHI: There are a lot of questions here. We'll go straight to the audience for another one. Your name and where you're from.
QUESTION: I'm Rashnigo Fernando (ph) from Round Lake Beach, Illinois. And I'm wondering if there are any scientific studs that prove that electric shock therapy is helpful.
KAYE: Well, I can tell thaw that according to Dr. Israel, he doesn't have hard and fast proof I guess, but he can tell us and he has shown us and we've talked to parents there who say their kids wouldn't be alive today if they weren't using this electric shock therapy. This boy Antoine (ph) who we met there and interviewed. He was acting out, harming himself and harming others about 5,000 times in one week and when they put him on this therapy, those incidents went down to zero. So there seems to be some proof that it does work.
VELSHI: Does that have anything to do with science or the fact that somebody goes through something you went through. I'd stop doing anything bad if I had to go through what it looked like you went through.
KAYE: And you wouldn't have much choice, Ali. Because when you put it on, it's strapped to your muscle. So the kids wear about five of them. I only had one of them on and it completely stops your arm. You can't move your arm. It feels like this non-stop bombardment of little pin tricks of in your arm. You can see your body just twists in pain and you lose all muscle control. So if you're attacking a staff member or harming yourself, that's how it prevents you from doing any more than that.
KOPPEL: Randi, why is it necessary to have five of them? Just looking at your reaction with one on the arm and do you ever reach a point when the kids don't have to wear them when they're cured?
KAYE: They do fade them out, Andrea. There was one student, at one point who was actually shocked, believe it or not, 5,000 times in one day. So they do say that they fade it out, but the reason they wear five of them is because they're in all different parts of the body and if you're only wearing one on this arm or one on that arm you know if you might act it out you might remember that you can pull it off your arm because that's where you will get hit with the zapped. So this way you never know where you're going to get it and it is so creepy because everyone who is working with these kids has a remote control. So if someone's accounting out they can just zap you from another room or another part of the center. It's just the strangest thing.
HENRY: And Randi, what is it with -- It seemed like the people who were involved with the program are such believers in it. I seem to remember in your piece that they started almost attacking you when you raised tough questions about it. What was that like?
KAYE: Sure. We talked to about 200 parents. That's how many people Dr. Israel had there and he insisted that we interview him in front of these parents and it was just very strange. He had his own cameras rolling and these parents were very, very defensive of this gadget. They believe in it and they feel very, very strongly about it and to walk in that room and you know that everybody there is certainly in favor of this and you're there to sort of raise some questions and take a look at the controversy. It was a little nerve- racking at first, but I think it was important to understand their point of view and meet their children as well.
MCINTYRE: Any second thoughts about putting yourself on the story and trying it out on yourself. KAYE: Well, I don't usually like to do that, but because the story was specifically about this and about this shock and how strong it was I was told it was 65 volts and that it would just feel like a pinprick or a bee sting. I really wanted to know in order to really know what it feels like and put your heart into the story you kind of have to feel it for yourself in this case.
VELSHI: Stay tuned for Randi Kaye's encore. I don't know what you're doing for the next story. Good to see you, Randi.
KAYE: You too.
VELSHI: Thank you so much. We'll keep Randi on those stories. We're back with what we're predicting for next week ON THE STORY right after this.
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VELSHI: Hi. This is when we take a look ahead ON THE STORY to see what we're covering next week. Are you going to be in the same job next week?
MCINTYRE: I think maybe I should cover the White House. Seriously, we're going to take a look at an important story next week. Whether or not marines were involved in a massacre in Iraq last year.
VELSHI: Andrea?
KOPPEL: More immigration reform. The majority leader Bill Frist says he wants to have it done by the end of the week by the time they leave for their Easter/Passover break. Don't know if they can do it.
HENRY: Everyone at the White House ...
VELSHI: You've got to find a bathroom at the White House.
HENRY: Yeah, I still got to do that but we're going to be watching that Senate debate closely but also whether or not there'll be more staff changes, more of a shakeup, that's something everyone's going to be talking about.
What about you, money man?
VELSHI: My job stays the same so I don't do any hard work. I'm going to a Knicks and Cavs game on Wednesday night. Thank you to all of you. Good to see you. Thank you to all of you for being here, our audience at the George Washington University and thank you to you for watching ON THE STORY. We are back each week Saturday and Sunday afternoon. Straight ahead, a check on what's making news right now.
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