Return to Transcripts main page

On the Story

Correspondents Discuss the Stories They Are Covering

Aired April 23, 2006 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Fredricka Whitfield at the CNN Center in Atlanta. Checking our top stories right "Now in the News," Osama bin Laden accuses the West of conducting a crusade against Muslims, that's according to a new audiotape attributed to the al Qaeda leader. And he urges his supporters to go to Sudan to fight a proposed U.N. force.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OSAMA BIN LADEN (through translator): I call on the mujahedeen and their supporters, especially in Sudan and the Arabian Peninsula to prepare for a long war against the crusaders and plunderers in western Sudan. Our goal is not defending the Khartoum government, but to defend Islam, its land, and its people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: In other news, eight U.S. soldiers were killed in Iraq this weekend, five yesterday, three more today. All died when their vehicles hit roadside bombs. That brings the total number of U.S. military deaths in this war to 2,390.

A Columbine-style plot. Half a dozen seventh graders have been arrested on suspicion of planning to kill their teachers and fellow students at an Alaskan middle school. The boys, in custody, are as young as 13.

And another increase in gas prices today. The average price for regular unleaded is $2.90 a gallon right now, that's about 40 cents more than it was a month ago. People in California, Hawaii, New York, and Washington, D.C., are paying more than $3 already a gallon right now.

Those are the headlines. I'm Fredricka Whitfield in Atlanta. More top stories in about 30 minutes. ON THE STORY begins right now.

ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR: This is CNN, and we are ON THE STORY. From the campus of the George Washington University in the heart of the nation's capital, our correspondents bring you the stories behind the stories they're covering.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VELSHI (voice-over): Ed Henry is ON THE STORY of changes at the White House. Why now? What's next?

Jamie McIntyre talks about Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld taking the heat, refusing to leave.

In Iraq, Arwa Damon tells how deadly firefights drown out political talks back in Washington.

David Ensor gets the lowdown from a new crop of CIA analysts.

Alina Cho is ON THE STORY of arrests this week in the Duke rape case.

And Internet reporter Jacki Schechner finds reaction online to coverage of the Duke story.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VELSHI: Well, a very warm welcome to you. I'm Ali Velshi, and with me here are Ed Henry, David Ensor, and Jamie McIntire. Now our correspondents are going to take questions from our studio audience that's drawn from visitors, college students, and people across Washington -- across the country, in fact.

At the White House this week, high-stakes international diplomacy, and some high-visibility changes in the president's team. Ed Henry was on that story traveling in Alabama with the White House press corps. And that's when he found out that a well-known voice of the Bush administration, Scott McClellan, was out.

Here is Ed's "Reporter's Notebook."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ED HENRY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: As soon as we landed in Alabama, everyone's cell phone and BlackBerry started coming back into range. It was like, boom, boom, boom, message after message back from Washington, you're scrambling to get on the phone and report some of the news on the air, call sources and nail it down. It was sort of just one story after another.

The staff shuffle at the White House accelerating today. White House spokesman Scott McClellan announcing he is resigning.

It's obviously hard to stay on top of it with this staff shake-up or staff shuffle, whatever you want to call it. There has sort of been one shoe after another that has been dropping.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's going to be hard to replace Scott.

HENRY: I don't think you can blame Scott McClellan for the tough relations, necessarily. He didn't always have a good hand to work with in terms of this administration not wanting him to say too much.

SCOTT MCCLELLAN, FORMER WHITE HOUSE SPOKESMAN: You all are going to go run out there and start saying, well, the White House said this option or that option. I'm just not going to do that.

HENRY: It's an adversarial relationship. (END VIDEOTAPE)

VELSHI: Is he going to miss you?

HENRY: Well, i just barely got to know him. I've only been on the beat a month, but I thought what was so fascinating is we see Scott McClellan at the podium, and he looked stiff sometimes, he has a hard -- you know, because it is adversarial no matter what administration it is, with the White House press corps.

But as soon as he said he was stepping down, he came down to Alabama, he was beaming, a grin as wide as you could see. And he was telling us all that he was finally free, amid all of the speculation twisting in the wind about his job.

And he said, the best thing he's looking forward to is when he leaves in a couple of weeks, he's going to wake up first thing in the morning and read the sports section, instead of the A section. And he comes across as a human being there. You don't get to see that side of a person all the side when they're at the podium.

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: It's a (INAUDIBLE) job, obviously. But do you think he lost the confidence of the press corps, the people that cover him? And again, I know you've only been there a month.

HENRY: I think certainly during the CIA leak he had a credibility problem that was not of his own making necessarily. He had told the press corps that, you know, Karl Rove and Scooter Libby were not involved in the CIA leak case, basically. And it turned out that the information they gave him was not true. They turned out to be part of the case. But he never quite recovered from that in a way because, again, his own people gave him the wrong information.

VELSHI: I never believe these reasons why people are so happy about why they leave. You know, I cover business and executives always say that, they say, we're retiring to spend more time with my family.

MCINTYRE: Yes, but that really is a tough job.

HENRY: I mean, it's a non-stop job, and it's obviously -- it's a fierce back and forth with the press corps. And he's got to go in there for that sparring match every single day.

VELSHI: And he has got to be on.

HENRY: All the time. And it's easy to throw rocks at whoever it is at that podium.

VELSHI: Sir, your name and where you're from.

QUESTION: Jeff Brody (ph) from Barrington, Rhode Island.

VELSHI: What's your question? QUESTION: Given the trust placed in Karl Rove by the president, do you think it's realistic to say that he's been stripped of power rather than relieved of burden so he can concentrate on the midterm elections?

HENRY: I think that a lot of people sort of overdid the story that Karl Rove got slapped around so much when in fact he gave up these policy responsibilities, his portfolio change. But that's a lot of Washington game back and forth. The bottom line is that he still has the ear of this president and the confidence of this president, the most powerful man in the world.

And so whether he's got a different title, he doesn't actually, he has the same title, or he has a different portfolio, he does, bottom line is he still has president's ear and he's going to be enormously influential no matter what.

VELSHI: Sir, your name and your question?

QUESTION: I'm Colin (ph) from Barrington, Rhode Island. Given the recent trends in people stepping down from the Bush administration, who would you say would step down next?

HENRY: Well, I think we are going to probably see the coming week a replacement for Scott McClellan. I think one of the fascinating parts of that is all of the sudden the leading contender has emerged from FOX News, Tony Snow, the anchor, the conservative radio talk show.

And it's going to be interesting to see, if in fact he gets the job, how he's going to do with that daily sparring, it's something that he hasn't experienced before. In terms of other shoes that may drop, I think the treasury secretary, John Snow, his name has been bandied about as somebody who may step aside.

I think the bottom line, when you get through all of this is that there has been a lot of talk of a shake-up, it has really more been a shuffle. They really haven't gone outside the circle to bring in a lot of new faces or fresh blood, which is what fellow Republicans want.

Instead, they have been moving people around in different roles, changing their portfolio. And it remains to be seen whether or not this is really going to have that much of an impact.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Why are they doing it?

HENRY: I think it's the public pressure. I think that in any administration, as you know better than I do, the second term, there are always troubles. And I think that more than anything the president had to shake things up, even if it wasn't that substantive, he had to shuffle a deck, if you will.

And I think that's one reason why McClellan became a victim here. Because even though that might not make that much of a difference, him leaving, it's such a visible person. This is the face of the administration around the world.

MCINTYRE: Now they have got to replace him, so would you take a job like that?

HENRY: No, no.

ENSOR: In the second term with these...

(CROSSTALK)

HENRY: I am so happy right now, I wouldn't take it.

VELSHI: Now listen, we have the visit of the president of China. And President Bush had just finished talking about new openness in China, all of a sudden he got a heckler in the audience, and that creates all sorts of diplomatic stuff.

HENRY: Absolutely. And you know, there had also been much made about the fact that it was not named as the People's Republic of China. They said they were playing the anthem of the Republic of China, which is really Taiwan. And that was seen as a diplomatic faux pas.

And I think, you know, the bottom line is the president, as you noted, said to his counterpart, you need to let more voices speak out in China. And moments later, as if on cue, this woman starts screaming. And what was fascinating is that she was about three levels high. You couldn't really necessarily tell from the camera. I wasn't there. My colleague Elaine Quijano was.

And she was on a camera stand because she had a media credential. And she was so high up in the air, the Secret Service, it took them a few minutes to get to her. And that's when she kept going and going, screaming in English and Chinese. And it was such a direct shot right at the Chinese president. I think it's going to have some impact.

VELSHI: Sir?

QUESTION: Yes, hi, Eric Dirks (ph) from Battle Creek, Michigan. Question, you weren't there at the conference, but do you think that if you were there, would it have been a compromise of your journalist ethics to maybe try and stifle her yourself? You know, there was a three-minute delay in the whole proceedings. What would you have...

HENRY: I wouldn't have become a participant in it. I wouldn't have been able to reach her in this case, anyway, because she was so high up. But I wouldn't have because I am a reporter there, first of all.

And second of all, I think as I've heard people on both sides of the aisle, and not necessarily in a political way, have said this is one of the beauties of America. That would have never happened in China. She was able to speak out because it is America. And she's going to probably going to pay a price for it. She's now facing criminal charges. But I think I wouldn't have gotten involved. I mean, it was her opportunity to speak out. She abused her media credential, however, and has now since lost that. And that's not something I would have done because she was there under one pretense, which is to cover the event for a newspaper, and used it for something else. That was a choice she made. She is going to pay a price for it.

But ultimately, she was speaking out. And I wouldn't have interfered with that.

VELSHI: Ed Henry, this is why we think that you are part of the best political team on television.

Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld gets slapped around by the critics of the president and of the war. But Rumsfeld isn't leaving. Jamie McIntyre is back on that story in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: CNN is ON THE STORY on the campus of the George Washington University. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld fired back at critics who have been calling for him to step aside this week. As our Jamie McIntyre observed, you had better have your facts straight, and you might actually want a joke up your sleeve when it's your turn to face Rumsfeld.

Check out Jamie's "Reporter's Notebook."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MCINTYRE: You know, you can kind of understand what some of these generals were going through because you see the very same dynamic in the press corps.

(voice-over): Armed with a fresh endorsement from his boss, the president, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld confidently faces the Pentagon press corps.

(on camera): Rumsfeld does like to engage his critics, but he likes them to be very well-prepared. I mean, as a reporter, you face the same dynamic. If you're going to ask Rumsfeld a question in a briefing, you had better have your facts straight. Otherwise he is going to pick apart your premise and never even answer your question.

In this Wall Street Journal opinion piece that was written yesterday by a number of retired generals, it was said that some feel that you have been "unfair, arrogant, and autocratic." And this was from your supporters. How much do you think this is about your management style?

DONALD RUMSFELD, DEFENSE SECRETARY: No idea.

MCINTYRE: Are you arrogant?

RUMSFELD: You know me. MCINTYRE: It's been a very interesting week watching Rumsfeld react to the criticism he got from these generals, watching the Pentagon's press operation organize a response from other generals, it's been like the battle of the generals.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR: Jamie, what I've been curious about is, I mean, there is -- as the Pentagon pointed out, there's thousands of generals. Are these six or seven that are speaking publicly, are they representative of a lot of people? Are there a lot of generals who are mad at Rumsfeld, thinking he did a bad job?

MCINTYRE: Well, see, you know, that's the implication, is that it's clear that generals in uniform can't speak out and it's also clear that generals out of uniform are free to speak out even if there is a debate about whether it's a good thing.

But what makes this so -- such a story is that people tend to think that if these guys are speaking out, they must be speaking for generals who can't say anything, who are currently serving and have to salute smartly and carry out the policy. And that's what makes it -- that's what really sort of undermines the credibility of Rumsfeld.

HENRY: Do you think that they there are? Do you think that there are a lot of generals serving that feel this way?

MCINTYRE: It's really hard to tell because, you know, a lot of times you don't really find out what these generals think until they retire. I mean, for instance, Wes Clark, who ran for president, I had no idea that that was the way he was leaning until he got out of uniform and entered politics.

VELSHI: Your name and where you're from.

QUESTION: Danielle Weezy (ph) from Dodge, Nebraska. What have you noticed has been the most significant difference in the criticism of Rumsfeld compared to that of former secretaries of defenses during military conflicts?

MCINTYRE: Well, you know, Rumsfeld has become a lightning rod. I mean, one thing you can't argue about Rumsfeld, he's very decisive. He also can be very dismissive. He can be that way with the press corps as well, as I was noting.

So on the one hand, he's what you want in a civilian chief, a strong manager, makes decisions, does -- you know, listens to the military advice. The criticism is that he doesn't take that advice to heart, that he is too much listening to his own vision of what's going on.

And so, you know, in a way, though, it's really what -- the way the system works, civilian control of the military. The civilians get to make the decision, and then the voters get to vote them out.

VELSHI: Now when you talk about who makes the decision, Ed was on that beat this week over at the White House. And he had an opportunity to ask President Bush about whether Donald Rumsfeld should stay or go. And I thought the response to that was really interesting. I think we've got that. Let's play that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HENRY: What do you say to critics who believe that you are ignoring the advice of retired generals, military commanders who say that there needs to be a change?

BUSH: I say I listen to all voices. But mine's the final decision and Don Rumsfeld is doing a fine job. He's not only transforming the military, he's fighting a war on terror -- he's helping us fight a war on terror. I have strong confidence in Don Rumsfeld. I hear the voices, and I read the front page, and I know the speculation. But I'm the decider, and I decide what is best, and what's best is for Don Rumsfeld to remain as the secretary of defense.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELSHI: Now, the decider told you!

(LAUGHTER)

HENRY: Case closed.

MCINTYRE: You know, if there are critics of Rumsfeld who think he should go and they are disappointed he is not going, they should blame you.

HENRY: It's all my fault.

MCINTYRE: Because really...

VELSHI: Definitely took it over the edge there.

MCINTYRE: ... at that moment -- I mean, obviously, the White House had already issued a statement saying that they stood by Rumsfeld, he is doing a great job, which always makes you think he's in trouble. All right, why else would they issue a statement?

But when the president came out, when you pinned him down, and he basically said, I'm the guy, I'm deciding he's staying. You know, by the time Rumsfeld got to that briefing, he had that endorsement in his back pocket.

And if you're wondering why he sort of was very casual and saying, well, I'm going to think about it a while. He didn't really jump on his critics because he knew he was staying.

HENRY: And that's what is fascinating because when you were talking about preparing for your briefing, when everyone assumes all these briefings are sort of staged, and a lot of it is, but when you can just break through just a little bit and you get the essence of what he's really thinking, the president himself said, all of this is going on, bottom line, he's sticking around. It's case closed. VELSHI: If I ever feel like my job is in trouble, I'm going to have somebody ask my boss what he thinks about it.

MCINTYRE: I wouldn't do that if I were you.

VELSHI: Your name and where you're from.

QUESTION: Kay Weston (ph) from Chevy Chase, Maryland. And my question is, with so much competition in the press corps, how do you find out about leads before other journalists? Can you share some trade secrets?

MCINTYRE: Well, you know, the Pentagon is a really unique beat in that -- in a sense there's 17.5 miles of corridor in the Pentagon. And most of it is open to the press. And, you know, we live in fear that everyday someone is going to decide that that's not such a good idea.

But the fact of the matter is, in the Pentagon, you get it -- walk out of your office, stick your pad in your back pocket, wander the halls and bump into people and find out things. It's as simple as that.

ENSOR: You can't do that at the CIA.

(LAUGHTER)

VELSHI: And if you do find anything out, you can't really tell anybody about it.

All right, guys, thanks very much. We're going to continue this discussion. Debate over Rumsfeld's future can be drowned out by the life and death realities of fighting a war in Iraq. Arwa Damon is back on that story from Iraq right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: CNN is ON THE STORY. Arwa Damon has been embedded with U.S. Marines in Ramadi, west of Baghdad. Let's click back to one of her reports about U.S. forces that are in the thick of it.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ARWA DAMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Here there is no talk of Rumsfeld, no talk of retired generals. This is active duty.

(on camera): This is a complex attack. Mortars were fired, followed by what U.S. Marines initially believed to be a suicide car bomb and then a sustained gun battle for a couple of minutes. This is a normal occurrence for this location in downtown Ramadi. Attacks like this happen on a daily basis, sometimes four or five times a day, lasting anywhere from 30 seconds to hours long.

(voice-over): The next moments at the governor's compound are hectic. Platoon commander Lieutenant Carlos Getz (ph) puts two phones to his ears, trying to figure out exactly what is going on, resupplying ammunition to the fighting positions almost as fast as Marines are firing it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey Nada (ph)!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Boom (ph) to the right, move it!

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VELSHI: And Arwa Damon, back in Baghdad joining us now. Arwa, thank you for being with us. Of course, those beeps that we were hearing through that is because we actually beeped out some real-life language that was going on in there.

What happened after that? What do you do after you're there while all of this is going on? Does life get back to normal for them and the people who work there and for you?

DAMON: It pretty much does, although normal, of course, in Iraq does have quite a different definition than it does elsewhere in the world. That day specifically, once the incident was over, once the contact was over, and once the Marines were sure they hadn't taken any casualties, essentially they went back to what normal life is for them, which is living in this desolate building in downtown Ramadi, in the governor's compound.

And they go about their daily life cleaning up, doing their regular missions, or just joking around with each other. Of course, that day there was a huge sense of relief after the attack that no one had been injured.

And for us, of course, that's where kind of the second part of our day begins, the first part being covering the story, getting the material that we feel we need for our stories, and then turning around and actually putting it all together.

MCINTYRE: Hey, Arwa, I just want to say that we watched your reports this week at the Pentagon with great fascination. I mean, they were so gritty. They took us to really to what was going on. And it really put lie to what you hear from the Pentagon sometimes about journalists not willing to get out of Baghdad and go see what the real story is.

So my question to you is, do you know it's that dangerous when you're heading out, or do you only find out when you're under fire?

DAMON: No. You pretty much know. You pretty much have a good idea of what to expect from any given location that you are going to. Of course, it is impossible to predict exactly what is going to happen anywhere in this country. It could very well be that we -- I mean, we went to Ramadi, and we knew it was going to be dangerous, we knew it was one of the hotter spots for the insurgency in the area.

But, at the same time, it is so unpredictable here. You could go to a place like Ramadi and perhaps drive around for days and not have anything happen or you could be out in an area that you deem to be relatively safe and all of a sudden, boom, out of nowhere an IED will detonate.

I mean, it's a highly unpredictable scenario, but there is a certain level of what to expect when you get to a certain location. But, then again, this is Iraq, and there are always surprises no matter where you do go.

VELSHI: Arwa, we're going to take this to the audience. We have a number of questions here.

Ma'am, your name and where you're from?

QUESTION: I'm Debbie Enos (ph) from Reno, Nevada. Do you find being embedded is a situation where you can report in an objective manner?

DAMON: Hi, Debbie. Yes, I do. Because we go to these events, and we're actually -- all of these incidents that we cover, we're guests there and we're observers there. And for myself personally, I also -- I speak Arabic so when I'm out with the troops, when I'm out on a mission, I can take everything that I've been briefed, for example, say, about the Iraqi population in that area and what their reactions are, and I can put those questions to them myself.

It is hard sometimes not to become part of the story per se because when the bullets are flying, they're also flying at you, and you are the one who's also being shot at. And you go through the -- perhaps a lesser level but the same emotions that the Marines or the troops or the soldiers or your crew around you are going through when you're getting shot at.

You feel that same need to stay alive and survive. And in that sense perhaps we do become more involved in the story than you do in other locations that perhaps aren't as dangerous.

But I do think that it is possible to remain objective and to just bear in mind that when you are embedded, the information that you're receiving is from one side of the story and you just need to really focus yourself on trying to get all of the other components in that and figure out what their opinions are before putting the final piece together.

VELSHI: Another question from the audience.

Ma'am, your name and where you're from.

QUESTION: Amy (ph) from Rochester, Minnesota. And I'm wondering how you feel about the fragmentary nature of reporting in Iraq, like the difficulty in talking to ordinary people or seeing really the big picture.

DAMON: That is one of the biggest challenges and perhaps the one most frustrating when you're trying to report here. Prior, previously, in the past, I would be able to walk out of this compound that we work in and actually live out of at the same time and go into the streets and ask ordinary Iraqis how they feel about any given scenario. Now it's a lot more difficult to actually get out into the streets. When we're going places in Baghdad, it's definitely a calculated decision, entire process, of risk versus reward of what we're going to be able to get. And this actually takes us back to the embed question.

And embeds are pretty much the only way, except for perhaps in the northern part of Iraq, that journalists can travel around the country and see what's going on. And in some ways being embedded is our only access to the Iraqi people, when we're out with the troops, that's when we're able to see them.

VELSHI: Arwa, great perspective, thanks very much for joining us. Arwa Damon in Baghdad. Stay safe.

From the war on Iraq to the terrorism war and to a surge in people who want to join the CIA. David Ensor is back on that story in a moment. We're ON THE STORY this week from Washington, from Baghdad, from New York, and elsewhere. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SATINDER BINDRA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Despite an 18- hour curfew, demonstrators again take to the streets in Nepal's capital, Katmandu. Nepal's pro-democracy movement, now in its third week of street demonstrations, is putting almost unbearable pressure on the king.

JAIME FLORCRUZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It looks more like a setting for a Hollywood disaster film. The sandstorm blanketed Beijing on Monday, forcing street cleaners to work overtime and residents to scramble for cover. It's the eighth sandstorm to hit Beijing this year and by far the worst.

MALLIKA KAPUR, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): They came from all corners of Britain, 99 birthday men and women who, like Britain's Queen Elizabeth, turned 80. During a birthday bash of beef and mash, a toast from the host.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: Hello, I'm Fredrick Whitfield at the CNN Center in Atlanta. ON THE STORY continues in a moment. But first these top stories. The new Hamas-led Palestinian government is distancing itself from al Qaeda, saying it has a different ideology. Hamas is reacting to a new audiotape said to be the voice of Osama bin Laden. The voice slams the West for denying funds to Hamas, calling it proof of a crusade against Muslims.

A shootout in Gaza left three people wounded today. Hamas gunmen rescued the new Palestinian health minister after gunmen raided his office. The fighting erupted hours after leaders from Fatah and the newly-elected Hamas government agreed to work to end tensions between the two rival groups. Protests in Nepal. Thousands of pro-democracy demonstrators again clashed with police along this road surrounding Katmandu. Protestors are demanding the king step down and parliament be reinstated. The protests have paralyzed the capital, causing a shortage of food and other goods.

New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin won 38 percent of the vote in the city's mayoral, but that's short of a majority so he now will face Lieutenant Governor Mitch Landrieu in a May 20th runoff.

It looks like war, but this rocket attack it actually an Orthodox Easter celebration on the Greek island of Eos. Groups from two rival churches in town trying to drown out the other's services. No one knows how, when, or why the bizarre tradition began.

Those are the headlines. I'm Fredricka Whitfield. More top stories in about 30 minutes. Now back to more ON THE STORY.

VELSHI: CNN is ON THE STORY here at the George Washington University. At the end of the week, the CIA fired an employee for leaking classified information to reporters. It's a fresh reminder of the difficulty of covering intelligence agencies, and it comes as a record number of people actually want to join the CIA.

David Ensor was granted rare access to a new class of CIA analysts. Here is David's "Reporter's Notebook."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR: We know that there are a lot of new people coming in, so we went to the CIA and said, how can we do this story? And they came back with the idea of covering the graduation of a new group of students.

(voice-over): Job applications to the CIA have more than doubled since 9/11 to over 140,000 a year.

(on camera): They agreed initially to let us film the commencement speaker and the backs of the heads of the graduates. They didn't want to put out one of the graduates. In the end, they agreed.

Do your family all know about your choice to work at the CIA?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have a pretty large family, so no, not all of my family knows, but my closest family does.

ENSOR: As you will have noticed, she's in silhouette. She didn't sign on at the CIA to analyze intelligence in order to become famous and be on television. This was not what she signed on for. And she had to be talked into it, to be frank.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was looking for something that I could believe in, and a mission that I could believe in.

ENSOR: What is the mission? UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Keeping America safe.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HENRY: David, I'm fascinated by what seems to be a contradiction, where the CIA is letting you in for rare access, something we wouldn't have seen five years ago. And they're trying to be open in a way. But on the other hand, at the end of the week, they fire an officer for leaking classified information, which has to put a chilling effect on you and other reporters as you try to get this information. How do you balance what seems like a contradiction right now?

ENSOR: Well, what you have got here is there's a good news story there. There's new people coming in, fresh blood, young, smart people with languages and computer skills the old guys don't have, and all sorts of good stuff like that. That's the story they would like us to tell. And we're happy to oblige.

At the same time, you have got some not so good stories. The leaks, they feel very strongly about, and they've gone after someone who apparently was partly responsible for one of them. The other thing is that quite frankly the story they don't want us to tell, when I talk to people that are, shall we say, not in the press office, morale is a problem over there at the CIA.

Since there have been all sorts of changes, all the changes in intelligence reform and all the rest of it, I know that there have been complaints from higher up people in the administration that they don't think the CIA is getting its act together, learning to become a service organization, to serve the director of national intelligence.

The president's Foreign Intelligence Advisory Board has been hauling in senior people and saying, look, get with the plan. This not going as well as it should be.

MCINTYRE: But how are you going to get people to stick their neck out and give you information? They might be fired now.

ENSOR: It's tricky. It's tricky, and...

VELSHI: Because your information -- I mean, in my case, I think of the four of us here, I get a great deal of information that companies really want out there. And then you guys have a slightly different way of getting your information. And yours is entirely different. I mean, if I had to fill in for you, I wouldn't know what -- I would sit in the office and play, you know, solitaire or something.

ENSOR: This is really one of the toughest beats in Washington or in the world, to be honest. It takes years to build sources. You have to build a sense of trust, to be blunt, that I will not say who they are if I'm taken before a grand jury. Because that's really what it may become, what it did become for some other reporters not long ago and may become for others soon. MCINTYRE: It's funny, because I went to some of my sources after this big crackdown, and I said, you know, look, I just want you to know that if they come after me, I'm giving you up. I want to be clear right up front.

(LAUGHTER)

VELSHI: Well, good to know how it all comes down.

MCINTYRE: But it's different though. A lot of the classified information that we get is basically -- shouldn't be classified. It's not really that secret. The stuff that you're dealing with really is really the secret-secret stuff.

VELSHI: Sir, your name and where you're from.

QUESTION: I'm Rick Shubard (ph) from Exeter, New Hampshire. And I'd be interested to know whether with all the new recruits, that the CIA and the U.S. intelligence services are having any success attracting young people with the critical language skills, particularly Arabic and Farsi?

ENSOR: There are a lot more Arabic and Farsi speakers that are coming in. I know there were some in the class that I covered. So, yes, they have put a premium on that, and luckily for them, post-9/11, the number of young people and not-so-young people who are applying for jobs there is way up. So they get their pick. And they can go for those languages. They still don't have enough, though.

VELSHI: Is the CIA -- do they recruit the same way that the Pentagon does? Do they want gung-ho, rah-rah kind of people who interested in defending the country?

ENSOR: You have got these officers, the operations officers who are going out and basically recruiting people to spy on al Qaeda or on their country. So these are the gung-ho types that you talked about, the James Bonds.

And then the other half of the agency are analysts, very intellectual, and they're back at headquarters mostly.

VELSHI: David, thanks for a bit of insight into something that we don't really get an opportunity to look into. David Ensor.

Well, we're leaving Washington now, turning to the rape case in North Carolina involving the Duke University lacrosse team. Alina Chos is back on that story right after that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: CNN is ON THE STORY of the Duke rape case. Alina Cho has been in North Carolina reporting on the investigation, the arrests, and that wave of bad publicity that has washed over a prestigious university.

Check out Alina's "Reporter's Notebook." (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALINA CHO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): I think the biggest challenge is simply staying on top of the story. We learned that there was going to be bills of indictment. And, of course, it's a piece of paper that we need to get our hands on. We found out at the last minute that you have to have $2.75 to actually buy a copy. We went to air as we were going through the pages of the indictment.

We have just been handed down the bills of indictment, that is officially what it's called here. We have looked through the one, two, three, (INAUDIBLE), three, four, five pages.

What we found out later that the indictment was sealed. Later we did get the names and we had to rush to air with that.

Reade Seligmann, he is a 20-year-old sophomore, an All-America pick from Essex Fells, New Jersey; and Collin Finnerty, also a 20- year-old sophomore, from Garden City, New Jersey.

This is all about beating the competition when you're on a story like this. Everyone wants to be on the big story. But there's a flip side to that. You're tired. On one day we're working from 4:00 a.m. to midnight. We've got to write our story for the next morning. So these are very, very long days, but it's clear that America has a great appetite for this story.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VELSHI: Alina Cho is in New York. Not only is there a lot of detail and you're tired, but it's the kind of thing you actually have to be careful to get right. And as we've watched it, we've seen the work you've put into it.

Alina, let's go right to the audience.

Sir, your name and where you're from.

QUESTION: I'm Hunter Appler (ph) from Mount Airy (ph), North Carolina. A few days ago we heard the defense attorney for some of the players saying that the DNA evidence did not indicate a match with the players. And now we have indictments. So what's the explanation for this discrepancy?

CHO: Well, that is a very good question, Hunter. And a lot of people have been talking about how the DA, Michael Nifong, has to have something in his back pocket because there just wouldn't be an indictment if that wasn't the case.

The problem is, we simply don't know what that is. He has remained so quiet about what kind of evidence he might have, in part, I think because he received a bit of a criticism in the beginning for speaking too much.

You know, he's running for reelection, that's coming up in a couple of weeks. And the defense has sort of taken a different strategy. They have essentially declared war. They have leaked like sieves to the media about what kind of information they have. And certainly that, I think, has had an impact on this story.

VELSHI: Sir, your name and where you're from.

QUESTION: Darren Blonski (ph) from UC-Davis, California. And not to undermine the seriousness of rape, but it happens every day in America. And why so much media coverage on this Duke case?

CHO: Well, you're absolutely right about there being intense interest in this case. I think there are a couple of reasons for that. Number one, it crosses class lines. It crosses socio-economic lines. It crosses gender lines. And it crosses racial lines. And that really touches a nerve.

In a way, we in the media say this is a "sexy story," sort of. It sort of has all the makings of a sexy story. And I think, too, that 24-hour cable networks have sort of changed the way we work in journalism. It used to be that you would maybe get something in the morning, hold it for the evening.

But we were going to air constantly with information throughout the day. It's very difficult. I mean, we were really, really trying to stay on top of the developments and break news. And that's a hard thing when you're on a 24-hour news cycle.

VELSHI: Your name and where you're from.

QUESTION: Hi, I'm Tamara Diquez (ph) from Overland Park, Kansas. I just wanted to know, do you think that the media coverage or the responses would have been different if the alleged victim was a white girl and the aggressors were black men?

CHO: Well, I think it depends on who you ask. Certainly if you ask people over at North Carolina Central University where the victim -- the alleged victim attended college, they will say that.

You go over to Duke, and it's quite a different story. I mean, we talked to students who really vouched for the character of these two students. One woman we spoke to lived in the same dorm room. She called Reade Seligmann, one of the suspects, a big teddy bear.

She said Collin Finnerty, the other suspect, was her favorite player on the lacrosse team. And so I think it really depends on where you live and what school you go to. And certainly, you know, I think you saw that a lot in Durham and certainly throughout the country.

MCINTYRE: Alina, I noticed that the second dancer has come forward. I'm just curious, was there a big competition to try to find her? She was one of the few other witnesses other than the people there. How did she come to the surface?

CHO: Well, unfortunately, our colleagues over at the Associated Press got the scoop on that one. But, yes, it was. It was a fight. I mean, listen, we knew for a long time -- and I can say her name now because it's out there, Kim Roberts, but we knew for a long time Jamie, that her name was Kim. And we were looking for her.

We knew where the alleged victim lived. We certainly knew where the party happened. But we were looking for her. It was interesting because we actually received the e-mail that she sent out to this public relations firm yesterday, and we were trying to confirm this news all day long.

And I think it's just one of those examples of trying to stay on top of the story, when these developments are coming at you literally every second of the day and we're trying to go to air with it.

VELSHI: Alina, stay with us. This is obviously a topic that's elicited a lot of reaction, a lot of comment. We're going to poll the audience here about their thoughts about this case. Also our Internet reporter Jacki Schechner is going to talk to a blogger about how this story is playing online. That's all coming up. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: You are ON THE STORY. E-mail us what topics you think we should discuss at ON THE STORY at cnn.com. Now the Duke lacrosse team story remains in the headlines. This week we saw arrests of two Duke University players charged with raping a woman who was hired to dance at a team party.

Now let me put a question to our audience here. Do you think -- how many of you think that the media coverage of this story has been fair to the Duke lacrosse team members? How many of you think it's been fair to the Duke lacrosse team members?

All right. How many of you think it's been unfair to the Duke lacrosse team members? OK. More of you think it's been unfair than fair.

Jacki Schechner, our Internet reporter, has been following this story very closely on the Internet. Jacki, tell us what you see.

JACKI SCHECHNER, CNN INTERNET REPORTER: Well, Ali, no matter what side you come down on, you have to admit the story is fascinating. And if you think about the Internet as the world's largest water cooler, the conversation you're having with your friends and your co-workers is absolutely happening online.

We want to bring in Dr. Marc Lamont Hill, he's a professor of African-American studies and urban education at Temple University. And he does have a blog. Dr. Hill is joining us via Webcam from Philadelphia.

Thanks for being here. First, I want to ask you, what's the conversation you're seeing online?

MARC LAMONT HILL, MARCLAMONTHILL.COM: The two different conversations that I'm hearing on my blog, one from some of the black bloggers who are saying this woman better not be lying. And then the information I'm getting from the white bloggers is, is she lying? And those are two different types of conversations. And they are both problematic, but nonetheless, telling of the way I think America is thinking about this issue.

SCHECHNER: Better not be lying, why?

HILL: Well, because I think the stakes are extremely high for people who often perceive themselves as being on the margins of society. If you're a black woman and you feel like your story is never given full credence from the beginning, then if this woman is lying, then the worry is that later on down the line when someone else is telling the truth, that no one will listen.

Also, any woman who is a rape victim feels like if this woman goes in full public view and tells a story that ultimately turns out not to be true, that there are enormous stakes attached to that, and enormous penalties for other people.

SCHECHNER: Let me ask you about the way we're consuming this case. There's so much documentation that has shown up on the Internet and so many details that have popped up online. Do you think this affects the way that we react to a case like this? It's not the amount of information we've ever had in the past.

HILL: Oh, absolutely. I mean, if this were 20 years ago, 30 years ago, 40 years ago, we would never have had this much unmediated access to the information that is surrounding this case. And so unfortunately or perhaps fortunately, the two gentlemen who are being accused of this crime, or perhaps a third, are being tried in the media long before they are going to be tried in real court.

VELSHI: Let me bring this back to the audience for a second. We've got some interest from our audience members.

Sir, your name and where you're from and your question.

QUESTION: I'm John (ph) from Westborough, Massachusetts. And my question is, I'm wondering if it's really helpful, the instant analysis aspect of today's blogging world, is it really helpful in developing a story? Sometimes it seems that it leads to more heated discussion and instant analysis than in actual objective fact- gathering that we had in more traditional media.

VELSHI: Interesting question. Dr. Hill, what do you think?

HILL: Well, I think that question presumes a certain level of objectivity that's possible when we talk about the media. The reality is, the moment we have a story that says "stripper accuses two Duke students of rape," we've already undermined any sense of objectivity.

So from the beginning, we don't have any objectivity. We've already framed her as a stripper. Imagine if we had had a story where we said, "mother of two accuses two players of rape," or "college student accuses two people of rape," it would be a very different story.

So the very way that we describe the story, the very way we offer this story to the world through the media is inevitably subjective. It's inevitably formed by our own biases and assumptions about who these people are and who they could be.

CHO: I do want to make a point about balance. I was actually quite surprised that the audience did not think that the coverage was fair to the lacrosse players. And here's why. Essentially, we have been fighting tooth and nail to get the DA to talk about this case at all. And he won't. He won't talk about what evidence he has. People are wondering why was there an indictment. Because he's not talking about it.

Meanwhile, defense attorneys are coming out and they are giving us information on the hour, literally. We were fighting to get some things on the record. We got some of it on the record. We didn't get a lot of it. But we did speak to a potential eyewitness. We did get a timeline and so forth. And so a lot of the defense story is out there. So I do find it interesting how the audience has responded.

HILL: Right. But we're not starting from square one. Based on the history of American racial politics, the moment a black woman has a story where she says that she's been raped, it's automatically held under different type of scrutiny that if someone else were to offer it.

So from the beginning she's at a disadvantage. At the beginning her story is not held with the same amount of instant truth value as the men. The moment we label her as a stripper, again, we've moved her away from square one and pushed her back a step.

So on a lot of different levels, this conversation is about whether or not this woman is even fit to claim rape, whether or not this woman is even fit to offer such a story in the full public view.

SCHECHNER: Dr. Hill, thank you so much for the conversation. And, Ali, we're going to keep an eye on it as well. We'll send it back to you.

VELSHI: Yes. This story is not going anywhere, Jacki. Thank you very much. Dr. Hill, thank you. Alina Cho in New York as well, thank you. That's was Dr. Marc Lamont Hill joining us from Philadelphia.

We're back ON THE STORY with what our correspondents will be covering next week. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VELSHI: All right. Let's take a quick look ahead ON THE STORY. What are you working on next week?

HENRY: I'm going to be digging to find out who's replacing Scott McClellan.

VELSHI: Oh yes. Good point. What are you doing?

ENSOR: Take a bite out of your story, is it national security that's causing the oil price to go up around the world or is it maybe just refinery problems locally? VELSHI: Yes, that's a good one.

MCINTYRE: Believe it or not, I'm doing a little stand-up comedy with Washington's funniest celebrities, DC Improv Thursday nights, all go to charity, stop by.

VELSHI: I'm definitely going to stop by. And I will be doing a little of what David is doing, I'll be looking at oil prices and Ken Lay, former head of Enron expected to take the stand.

Thank you to my colleagues and to our fantastic audience here at the George Washington University. And thank you for watching ON THE STORY. We are back each week, Saturday night and Sunday afternoon.

Straight ahead, a check on what's making news right now.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com