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On the Story
Stories Behind the Stories
Aired May 27, 2006 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ALI VELSHI, CNN ANCHOR, ON THE STORY: This is CNN and we are on the story. Our correspondents have the stories behind the stories they're covering. Suzanne Malveaux is on the story of President Bush turning to friend and ally Tony Blair over the war and sagging public support. Dana Bash talks about the bribery scandal on Capitol Hill and why it kicked off a new clash between Congress and the White House. John Zarrella has seen them come and seen them blow. He's on the story of getting ready for this hurricane season.
Candy Crowley turned the tables on Larry. What the king of interview sees on the story in Washington. And Abbi Tatton goes on the story online as millions of American veterans learn their personal information was stolen.
Welcome. I'm Ali Velshi and I'll be talking about guilty verdicts in the big corporate corruption Enron trial. Now with me here, Candy Crowley and Dana Bash. We're going to talk to Dana about covering congressional bribery scandals in a moment. But another story literally paralyzed congressional offices for most of Friday. Dana was on that story. Take a look.
UNIDENTIFIED CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right now we do have breaking news here at CNN. We're getting word of a lockdown situation on Capitol Hill. Our Dana bash standing by with more on that. Dana?
DANA BASH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Karen (ph), all we know at this point is that there are reports that there were shots fired in the Rayburn House office building on the capitol complex and that they have locked down the entire capitol complex. In fact, I tried to get outside to go to follow, go to the scene and the capitol police would not let me go. That's all we know. Lock down. Shots fired. Don't know anything else.
VELSHI: A city on the edge at the best of times post-9/11 and then you hear shots fired. What happened? What did you go through? What were you thinking when it happened?
BASH: Well, the first thing you happen is that what you said, it is post-9/11. You think, well, I mean, even since I've been back on Capitol Hill over the past couple of months, we have had situations where we've had to run out of the building literally a couple of times for various reasons. I was on Capitol Hill on 9/11 so you get that sinking feeling in your stomach. But what you just heard there is me saying we heard shots fired and you also -- it is very important to remember in those situations how quickly things change. By the end of the day Friday not only were there not shots fired, but before we even got to no gun, no nothing, it was well, people -- somebody heard a shot fired, maybe heard a gun fire. But we didn't know the answer to that and the Capitol police took this very, very seriously and they went through. They searched the entire building. But there definitely ups and downs. They closed the capitol. They opened the capitol.
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: When do you -- but there's always a time -- what the police have to do (INAUDIBLE) have to do because they can't ever take the chance that it isn't serious. But there comes a time in every story you go, this done. When was that?
BASH: We definitely got the feeling probably about an hour or so after that initial report. If they hadn't found anybody at that point, it was probably not going to happen. But I'll tell you what was interesting in terms of a journalist covering that story especially in today's world with our technology. It was really bizarre to be sitting -- I ended up sitting inside the capitol because I couldn't leave and reporting -- we were all reporting on what was going on, but the people who were in the complex were watching us reporting on them. So every time I said something or somebody else on the air from CNN said something about a development we heard, I got three or four e-mails from people who were listening and watching saying no it is this. It is this garage or it's that garage or trying to give you more of the geography. It was very interactive with the people who were actually locked down.
VELSHI: When you're covering the Congress, you have to go from topic to topic often. This was a distraction off of the big story of Congress this week which was the bribery scandal swirling around Congressman William Jefferson who is a Democrat from Louisiana. Let's have a quick look at Dana's report on that story.
BASH: FBI agents spent 18 hours in Jefferson's office hunting overnight for evidence to back a bribery case the government's been building for 14 months against the eight-term Democrat. Federal investigators secretly videotaped the congressman outside this Virginia hotel taking $100,000 in $100 bills from a businesswoman turned FBI informant according to a government official. When FBI agents raided his Washington, DC home three days later, they found $90,000 of that cash stuffed in a freezer. The congressman says he won't resign.
REP. WILLIAM JEFFERSON (D) LA: There are two sides to every story.
BASH: He accused the FBI of crossing a constitutional line in raiding his congressional office.
VELSHI: And that's where, for those of us that don't spend all our time in Congress, it gets a little tricky, this crossing a constitutional line. It strikes me this story kind of exists on a whole other plane, but somehow as Washington can do, it's made it into some kind of a -- whether that's a right thing to do or not. It's a Washington story. It's not about an allegation that a guy had money in his freezer. BASH: That's the thing. It started as like a Hollywood story. And only as politicians can do, forgive me, they take a Hollywood story and turn it into an inside the Beltway story about the constitution, not to belittle the actual (INAUDIBLE) that's the bottom line about what happened and what just heard in that report. It is really how the week started which is this unbelievable raid of the congressman's office and you turn it around a little bit right now and look at the politics of it, that was a story. That was a Democrat. And by, less than 24 hours later Republicans -- the leaders were so upset about the actual raid that the story quickly throughout the entire rest of the week, became not about that, but about the actual raid and the crossing the line.
CROWLEY: Excuse me, did you say tone deaf? Watching this thing (INAUDIBLE) what planet are these people on that they don't understand that the person sitting in Saginaw is not going, oh my gosh, there's been a violation of the separation of powers of the constitution. They're thinking, what, the FBI can't go in and look for papers for a guy that they have on tape taking $100,000?
BASH: I'll tell you what's really interesting about that Candy. It is definitely one of the first things I thought is there are 535 people in this building. Somebody's going to be standing up and saying the leaders might have a point but this is probably not the best thing for us -- an argument for us to be making politically right now, that we should be treated differently than other people. I looked for the first couple, the beginning of the week for somebody who's going to say that and it took a while. It took until midweek for somebody to come out and say that. Why? Because their constituents were calling.
VELSHI: And their constituents have been worrying about the fact that the government might or might not be invading their own privacy. Thanks for joining the rest of us in this conversation. Now you see what it feels like to be having these discussions about what rights the government has. So it's kind of interesting that when it came to raiding a congressman's office, all of a sudden we're having a constitutional discussion.
BASH: That's absolutely true. Look, when you talk to Dennis Hastert for example, the House speaker and you say, you listen to him, he really does feel like he has a responsibility as the speaker of the House to defend the institution and defend what he thinks should be appropriate and not appropriate. Look, it is all about politics in the end and what happened was a story line quickly became Republican versus Republican, Dennis Hastert, the leaders in the House against the Bush Justice Department. So it is again Republicans divided.
VELSHI: Very interesting story. Dana Bash, part of the best political team on television. President Bush stood shoulder to shoulder with his friend and Iraq war ally, Prime Minister Tony Blair this week. Suzanne Malveaux is back on that story reporting on their joint appearance.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) VELSHI: CNN is on the story. This town can be an unfriendly place. If you want a friend in Washington, President Truman said get a dog. Well, President Bush already has dogs. This week he got something better, his old buddy, British Prime Minister Tony Blair, his partner in the Iraq war, his partner in facing a slump in public support. Our White House correspondent Suzanne Malveaux was on the story of their joint news conference. Take a look at her reporter's notebook.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT: These are highly staged, highly choreographed events, so it is just as much about style as it is substance.
What you're listening for is whether or not either world leader says something different or new, something you haven't heard before, even if it is not a grand announcement. I have note cards. And I have about seven questions that I have already prepared. I'm going through my cards and if people come before me I know check off that question. That's already been asked and then I switch to the next note card.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Suzanne Malveaux, our White House correspondent, is inside the White House.
BASH: Sure. Well, as you know of course, the anticipation, just two minutes left and two minutes away. It is strange because you are on television every day. You are used to talking to millions of people but that's really the only time that you can feel it. You feel the eyes on you. And it's dead silence and everyone is listening to every word that you have to say. And it is one of the most stressful moments that you can experience as a reporter when all your colleagues are facing you head on just watching and listening.
VELSHI: Suzanne Malveaux at the White House. Suzanne, I totally made you for somebody who had those note cards. Have you got them with you?
MALVEAUX: You don't even want to see the notebook I have. People tease me about my notes. They're just insane, but you can't even read them really.
VELSHI: That is really something, seeing those pictures of how unnerving that is, for you to be standing up in the middle of all these people, a sea of people, particularly journalists who are meant to be critical, watching you. Now you're talking about how choreographed this event was. It certainly came across that way. Who choreographs two super power leaders? Who's in charge of saying if you get this kind of question this is the line we have to take?
MALVEAUX: Well, sure. There's a whole office, a whole staff that's involved in choreographing the whole thing. There are seating charts. Each one of us has a seat. Our name is on the seat. So the president knows exactly where you are and which network and what your name is, who he's going to call on. It was very interesting this time around because we knew it was going to be a whole hour long so everybody essentially thought they would get a question in and sometimes as many as 40 journalists can get questions in in that time period. But both of them kind of filibustered in their answers so they didn't even get through the first row. It was very extraordinary, about four journalists on each side. The American side and the British side got questions for that presser.
CROWLEY: Suzanne, there is a difference, I know between in the room and on the television. And I have to tell you on the television as I was watching this back here, I saw two men who seemed very tired. I contrasted that to that moment up at Camp David when the war was starting and Bush was in his bomber jacket and they were talking about Colgate toothpaste and then I saw two guys. Everything on that picture on the TV screen said to me, end of era, end of era, end of era. What was it like in the room? Did it feel on the downslide?
MALVEAUX: Candy, it was really interesting because you could even like see in their body language kind of a little bit of a hunch, a little bit of a slump. And even the president, he's used to this kind of Texas cowboy swagger. He even talked about the fact that he regretted some of the words that he used, bring it on and dead or alive regarding Osama bin Laden. These were two men who really seemed like standing shoulder to shoulder almost lifting each other up here, supporting each other in a time of really low poll numbers, politically weakened by the Iraq war and there was a sense of contrition that both of them were saying things and doing things that we just hadn't seen before. It was a very, very different tone and you could see it in their body language. You could really feel it.
BASH: And Suzanne, that sense of contrition, we've been seeing build from the president for the past several months, especially when it comes to Iraq. And as he's trying to be more con trite, his poll numbers have gone down. Is there a sense that you're hearing from White House officials that they are going to continue to do this because they feel like they just don't have a choice, especially since they are getting pressure from my perch, asking Congress to do that, even though the reality is, what happens on the ground in Iraq, when it comes to Iraq is really the thing that is going to determine how the public perceives it?
MALVEAUX: The strategy here and they started this as you know of course, it was a couple months ago, as many as six months ago where the president essentially admitted to more missteps, mistakes, bigger and bigger mistakes as we go along. So you hear him admitting these things, saying these things and the whole idea of this is, OK, he was a little bit behind the American public. The American public didn't see this rosy picture, so it is now time to play catch up to say look, I get it. I understand here. A lot of people think it is a little bit too late here. You are looking at those low poll numbers in the 30s or so and that the time to actually make these kind of admissions was in December, that there was a window of opportunity there that they missed. They are trying to catch up here. He's trying to buy some time too, as well. They know that they don't control things on the ground in Iraq and so it's going to be difficult. They are trying to make the American people be patient while things sort out themselves in Iraq.
CROWLEY: Is there a plan B here at all Suzanne? Back to what Dana said. I just get the sense that what the American people want and the only thing that's going to help those poll numbers is the end of those roadside bombs, the end of the watching the death toll go down instead of up. Is there anything else sitting around in their quiver (ph) to try and bring this president back to something that looks like he might have some power?
MALVEAUX: Bottom line, they're going to have to have some major legislative victories. Whether it is the immigration reform or they're going to have to see something turn around inside of Iraq. I think what you saw in this press conference very interesting, is that there was this big hoopla about whether or not they were going to announce any troop withdraws. Well, intentionally they said look. It might not happen until the end of next year if you look at what the Iraqis are saying that that is the possibility, really signaling to people in the midterm elections, the Republicans, we might not have good news for you in September, October, so don't expect any surprises here. You might have to wait this thing out a little bit.
VELSHI: Suzanne Malveaux predicting how the political winds will shift here in Washington.
MALVEAUX: We'll see how that goes.
VELSHI: And Suzanne Malveaux is another member of the finest political team on television as she predicts how the winds will shift. Some people are predicting another round of hurricane winds this season. John Zarrella is back on that story in just a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: CNN is on the story. There is high anxiety in south Florida as hurricane season approaches. CNN storm veteran John Zarrella has seen his own home devastated by hurricane Wilma. He looks at how Florida is taking steps to make sure its residents are prepared this summer. Have a look at John's notebook.
JOHN ZARRELLA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right here in Miami in our bureau several people were impacted by hurricane Wilma, myself included. Just like everybody else, the damage isn't repaired. Look right here. This is all from hurricane Wilma this damage that we're looking at. In Florida all this week people can go out and they can get items for tax free. Gas cans for the generators. I went through lot of these, the eight days we were without power at my house during hurricane Wilma.
We did a piece on the hurricane bunker down in Key West where the National Weather Service moved into literally a bunker, a brand new facility that is built to withstand category five hurricanes. This is the safe room. The walls are 13 inches thick, poured concrete, steel reinforced.
Without a doubt, there's never been a time when there's been so much emphasis on hurricanes. In the 27 years that I've been covering them, this summer is probably going to be another one to remember.
VELSHI: John, you have been doing this for a long time. You've seen a lot of them. Is it different? Was it so much worse? Do you believe that it's going to be bad? Do you believe these stories that we're in these 20-year cycles of terrible, devastating storms?
ZARRELLA: First of all, I think, take a good look because you won't see me this dry again the rest of the summer. That's pretty much a given. I don't think there's any question about it. Historically you look at the ups and downs of the cycles and in about 1995 it is very clear that we entered a cycle of increased hurricane activity and then the last two years just incredible. I covered eight hurricanes in two years. That is phenomenal the number of storms and it is really, really frightening. I tell you why it is frightening, because a lot of people think out there, a lot of viewers, a lot of people who live along the coastal United States from Maine to Texas, think we got hit by the big one last year. We didn't. All four of the major hurricanes that made landfall last summer, all four of them were category three hurricanes. They were major, but they weren't fours and fives. They weren't hurricane Andrews. That's scary.
CROWLEY: And John, isn't it -- I mean, when you see that, I still get the feeling that coming up in this hurricane season, everything is going to be measured against Katrina which in the end was a levee problem. But I sort of see people looking, saying it wasn't as bad as Katrina. You know, compare some of the other storms that you have been covering to what Katrina really was.
ZARRELLA: I mean no question about it. Katrina was very, very bad. That storm surge that hit in Mississippi, 31 feet, record high storm surge. But as you pointed out, it was as levee break that caused the damage from Katrina in New Orleans. I was there. The winds were bad but they weren't that bad. A few hours after it went through, everything was fine.
VELSHI: People were saying they missed the big one.
ZARRELLA: I said it. I said it. I was on the air saying everybody here is breathing a sigh of relief. They missed the big one. In fact, that's what we thought, not know that the levees had broken. But other major hurricanes, I mean, the United States, urban United -- major U.S. cities have never been hit by a major category five hurricane. New York is susceptible. We know that. Miami -- Homestead was hit by Andrew. Miami wasn't hit. Again, we know New Orleans wasn't hit. Tampa, Houston, so there are a lot of vulnerable places out there.
BASH: John, thinking about this for you isn't just a job, but it's about your life and your house and not just you, but all of our colleagues there in the bureau with you.
ZARRELLA: Yeah, I remember last year hurricane Wilma and I was over on the west coast in Marco Island, reporting live with Anderson Cooper on the beach. At about 9:30 or 10:00, we got done on the beach over there because Wilma came from the west coast across the east coast of Florida. And I went and checked my cell phone, had a message from my wife. On it -- imagine this -- here's the message I had. Listen, everybody is OK. Don't worry. The roof is damaged. The screened enclosure over the pool has come down. The pine tree is across the side of the house. So I ended up with about $60,000 worth of damage minus my $7,500 hurricane deductible.
BASH: You're having trouble getting whatever materials you need to fix it, right?
ZARRELLA: Absolutely. I'm not the only one. We're talking six months after hurricane Wilma. Nothing has been done yet at my house. I'm not the only one. Everybody is in pretty much the same boat because they can't get materials, couldn't find the tiles for my roof. It is really -- and it's going to be bad because when you look around south Florida now, roofs are covered with blue tarps. And what's going to happen here or in the Gulf coast states, those tarps are still going to be there the rest of this summer if we get another hurricane and insult to injury have a whole heck of a lot more damage.
CROWLEY: John, do you now personally look at these hurricanes differently as they come in? For instance, you have had a family down there. When you're looking at them, would you now be quicker to say, look, get out, move north or south or east or west, whichever way is out or are you sort of looking at everything the same way you did?
ZARRELLA: No, not at all Candy. That's a great point because everybody here we talk about -- my producer Rich (INAUDIBLE) and I, my cameraman right behind here, Jerry Simonson, we all talk and more so now than we ever did before. We never gave hurricanes the kind of respect that we probably should have. Now all of us sit there and say, what are we going to do? At what point do you say to your family get out? Is it the category three hurricane? Is it the category four? It's a tough call. And it is stuff we've never talked about in the past.
VELSHI: John, you are right. This is probably the last time we're going to see you dry and indoors. Stay safe. Keep your family safe. We'll be talking to you lots more. John Zarrella in Miami. From hurricanes we're coming back to the nation's capital and a veteran of half a century of broadcasting, Larry King right here on the story. Candy Crowley sat down with Larry and talked about what he saw and heard this week in Washington.
LARRY KING, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is great to be with you on the story.
VELSHI: And we are here on the story from Washington, Houston, Miami and also elsewhere. Take a look at Barbara Starr bound for Afghanistan.
BARBARA STARR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Our journey into Afghanistan has now begun with a night flight into (INAUDIBLE) air base. We're on board a C-17 that left Kuwait. It was about 100 degrees on this plane when we left Kuwait. Now it is cooling down nicely. We put on our sweaters. C-17 is the method of transport all over this region, into Afghanistan, into Iraq. It is a pretty tidy arrangement. As you can see, the cargo is all up on palettes. This here is the personal gear, the helmets, the vests, the backpacks of the troops (ph). But all of CNN's gear is in that pile right back there, our clothes, our cameras, our sound gear, everything we have for the next two weeks. If it is not in that palette, we left it at home and we're going to be doing without it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: More of ON THE STORY in just a moment.
But first, let's look at the news.
And sources are telling us that attorney general and the head of the FBI have threatened to quit if forced to give back evidence seized from a congressman's office.
First, it was a killer tsunami devastating Indonesia and now it's a deadly earthquake. The island nation was shaken by a 6.3 magnitude quake this morning. So far, more than 3,000 people are dead.
And later tonight on "CNN PRESENTS" -- "WOUNDED WARRIORS," a look at America's fallen troops and the medics and pilots who tried to save them.
That's what's happening now in the news.
I'm Carol Lin.
Now back to ON THE STORY.
VELSHI: CNN is ON THE STORY.
And so was the master of the interview, Larry King, in Washington this week. He talked to John McCain, Donald Rumsfeld and the CNN political team.
Candy Crowley turned the tables on Larry and interviewed him.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
CROWLEY: Larry, you've been on the story this week in Washington. You used to live here, what, 10 years ago?
LARRY KING, CNN ANCHOR: I did. Nine years ago.
CROWLEY: What's changed in the political world and Washington in general now that you're a visitor?
KING: Well, I'll tell you what I notice most is animosity. In the Hill, people are angry. The feelings toward the administration are both up and down. It's a different kind of feeling than even during Clinton, when I left. There's still a difference. And, of course, the city is booming. Everywhere I go there's cranes and derricks and another thing. Boom.
That convention center is unbelievable.
CROWLEY: It is.
KING: And, of course, the Nationals are here. They've got baseball. CROWLEY: What more could we want?
KING: The number one dream.
CROWLEY: Are you sorry you left?
KING: No. Well, I tell you, I miss people. I love the people here at CNN. I miss hanging out at certain restaurants and lunch. And I miss all the political talk. But I love Los Angeles. Completely different.
CROWLEY: We did political talk. You did a lot of political talk this week.
KING: I sure did.
CROWLEY: I noticed that you started off the week with that wonderful panel of political journalists from CNN...
KING: With which you were included.
CROWLEY: Oh, gosh, right.
KING: That was a great night. See, I love that kind of stuff and I think we'll be doing more of it.
CROWLEY: Great. And do you -- and then, you know, you've had John McCain. And I thought I wonder which one is more difficult for you and do you prepare differently when you've got what -- there were what, five of us or six of us...
KING: Six, yes.
CROWLEY: ... versus just this one-on-one with John McCain?
What's different?
KING: I'll tell you the truth, Candy, I like it all. I've been doing it for 49 years, I can't believe it. June 1st it's 49 years. Twenty-one -- it's already 49 years since I've been on the air and June 1st is 21 years at CNN. So if it's a single guest or a panel -- the one thing I do like better is having them here next to you than remote. Of course, you've got to do remote and you've got to do satellites.
But I like it all. I'm just insanely curious and I'm as curious about this actor's latest movie as this senator's latest vote as this ballerina's latest dance. I'm just curious about -- I've been insatiably curious all my life. And so I'm living out the best profession I could be in.
CROWLEY: I want to play a quick clip of one of your shows.
This was the one with Senator McCain, just a sort of back and forth with you and him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP FROM "LARRY KING LIVE")
KING: Are you running?
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: I think I'll make that decision in the year 2007 so --
KING: You've made no decision on it?
MCCAIN: No. No.
KING: Really?
MCCAIN: No. And...
KING: You're thinking about it.
MCCAIN: Of course. Of course one thinks about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CROWLEY: Did you believe him?
KING: I -- well, he's obviously thinking about it. But I think he's running. I've known John a long time and I have a lot of respect for him. I think he's definitely running. You don't an -- I think once you announce, then that puts you in a different position we regard to fund-raising and equal time when you appear. But I think he's running and probably the frontrunner for the Republican nomination.
CROWLEY: You talked about, you know, being as excited about doing an entertainer as a politician.
What's the difference between them?
KING: Sometimes very little. They're both on the stage and they're both appealing. The entertainer wants you to attend his performance or watch his movie. The politician wants you to agree with him and vote for him. And another interesting thing is when the entertainer comes east to Washington, he is a major celebrity. I mean you bring George Clooney here and you've got a crowd.
Conversely, you bring John McCain to Los Angeles, Hillary Clinton to Los Angeles -- she spoke at the Yom Kippur service at a temple and I was part of that. We were -- a whole bunch of us were there and I was -- did a small participation on it. She -- they were standing in line outside around the block, because she's a politician. She's a figure there.
So they -- big, there's a lot of similarities.
CROWLEY: That cross coast pollination is always good.
Listen...
KING: They both look down at Missouri. CROWLEY: Right.
Now, when you're on the story, and particularly when you're on the political story, how do you -- you've interviewed John McCain probably a zillion times, more or less.
How do you get something different? How do you prepare yourself for that and how do you get them to talk to you?
KING: Well I don't have an agenda. I've never had an agenda. And I don't presume. So I don't know what I'm going to hear. And so all I do is ask the best questions I can. I ask short questions. Most of my questions are one sentence. If I ask over two sentences, there's something the matter, if I'm going to -- if you hear a three sentence question.
I don't use the word I. It's irrelevant. I'm irrelevant to that. The important thing is what the guest thinks. And all you can do is all you can do. You ask the -- you know, by the way, if someone doesn't want to answer you, they're not going to answer you. It's not a court. There's no judge saying answer that question under penalty of law. So all you can do is all you can do.
I just -- and you've got to listen. I listen.
CROWLEY: Now you're staff says to you, Donald Rumsfeld. You're going to have Donald Rumsfeld.
What do you want from him?
KING: I want to learn as much as I can. The main thing I want to learn is how do you feel on this job after six years? How do you feel when generals criticize you? Why don't you sit down with them? When things go bad, how do you deal with it? Every day isn't good. how do you deal with criticism? Does it just rub off your back?
See those -- those kind of angle things, to me, that's interesting. I mean you can ask how many troops do we have there and how many troops are coming back and how long do you see us staying. And you ask all those.
But I like the curve around questions. I like the what do you think about, you know, when you get wrapped? What do you think? You don't need it. You ran Sears. You don't need this. You could -- you've got all the money you'll ever need.
What do you get out of it?
CROWLEY: It's why we like it when you're on the story.
Come back and see us again.
KING: Thanks to you.
CROWLEY: Larry King, thank you.
KING: It's great being with you ON THE STORY.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
VELSHI: I'm not even going to try to match that. But this is why you have to watch ON THE STORY, because where else are you going to see Larry King getting interviewed?
Candy, fantastic.
Thank you for doing that and for bringing us on. What a, you know, it's simple, but his questions are short.
CROWLEY: They are short and they're great. And let me tell you something. When this was over, I said, Larry, you know, a great interview. And he said, you know, I know what people want to hear. And it's why he knows what people want to ask and why he does it.
VELSHI: Well, that interview that he was talking about -- that you were talking to him about Donald Rumsfeld, you can see it again on Sunday night on CNN on "LARRY KING."
While Candy was talking to Larry King, I was on the story at the big Enron corporate corruption trial. Years after that case began, months after the start of the trial, I made it back to Houston for the final act.
We are back on that story in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: CNN is on the story and on the business beat. They don't come much bigger than the Enron trial. The collapse of the company cost thousands of jobs, billions of dollars in pensions and retirement funds and now it has probably cost the freedom of its top two executives.
I was in Houston when the jury returned the verdict.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
VELSHI: Kyra, six counts for Ken Lay, all six counts he was found guilty on.
Enron, a company that was destroyed; Arthur Anderson destroyed; thousands of people put out of work; millions of investors. This was once America's seventh largest company and these two men have maintained their innocence from the beginning.
There's sort of an army of media here. In the distance there are police horses. They've been here before in this trial to control crowds. There are marshals and there are police vehicles there in front of that podium.
Right over my shoulder there, that's where we're going to expect Ken Lay to come out. What they needed to do with these two guys who were are so wealthy and so smart and so above everything is to humanize them so that this jury could feel that, in fact, they were -- they were regular guys and maybe made some mistakes but weren't committing crimes and certainly weren't out to destroy people's lives.
But when Ken Lay got up there, he as aggressive, he was defensive, he was short-tempered. And a lot of the people say that hurt him.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
CROWLEY: That clip was before my enduring memory of when this broke, because I literally turned around from my computer and saw you there and literally someone had just handed you all these stacks of paper. And I flashed back to the Supreme Court decision on the 2000 election, where it just came out and you had -- there you were on the air and you had to say something.
VELSHI: And I don't, you know, I don't cover trials. I cover business news. So this is a kind of thing that, you know, worries u. I can -- I do what I normally do with some degree of confidence. But now I'm looking at 46 charges and I'm thinking I just hope I don't get it wrong.
And the relay of information, as you all know, you can't broadcast from inside a court. So we had a reporter in the overflow room who was sending the information via instant message to our desk in Atlanta, who was relaying it to my producer, Todd, who was sitting -- who was standing two feet from me, giving me the information that I was then checking against on (INAUDIBLE).
BASH: And that's something -- we've all been in these situations where you're getting information in your ear and it --
VELSHI: And you've got to trust it.
BASH: ... virtually has to come back out your mouth, but you have to be sure that it's right.
VELSHI: Yes.
BASH: And so when you're in that situation and you don't want to be wrong, but you have this big stack of papers that you're not familiar with, what did you do?
VELSHI: Well, here's the thing. You know, I had Todd in front of me and about a foot-and-a-half over there I had a securities lawyer who had been helping me through the case. I just had him right there. I pulled him in a few times to say look, which, this doesn't make sense. What does that mean?
You know, at that point I can't sort of hope that I'm going to wing it. I'm going to have to make sure I've got it right. And that's when I look back at it after a little rest and I'm thinking at least we didn't get it wrong. But there's this urgency now in TV to get it out and get it out when it happens. And we all have to do this. And you're -- like the story at Congress with the shots fired, it's about getting it right and you don't have all the information.
BASH: And you have to take a breath.
VELSHI: But this was a big, big thing and it affects a lot of people.
CROWLEY: Yes.
When did the adrenaline kick in? There's always a point in a story that's big when you think wow!
VELSHI: Well, there was no adrenaline prior to that verdict, let me tell you. We were all, the hundreds of journalists, we were all sitting there and it's -- it was very hot in Houston. We were all slouched in our seats and we were actually discussing when we're getting our flights back home and the hotels.
And some guy ran behind my producer like he was getting chased by police. And I said what's that guy running about? And Todd said, well, maybe we've got a verdict.
BASH: And, because you went on a whim.
VELSHI: Yes.
BASH: I mean, you know, you didn't know...
VELSHI: (INAUDIBLE).
BASH: ... nobody knew when the verdict was going to come.
VELSHI: It could have been a lot longer.
BASH: It's not like you were staking out in Houston.
VELSHI: The interesting thing is this jury had not asked a single question in five days of deliberation. They hadn't asked for any clarifications. They hadn't asked for any read-backs. It made me think that either they had no clue about this case or they had totally figured it out. And I think in the end it was the latter, they had totally figured it out after talking with the jurors.
CROWLEY: The best stories always start with your intuition.
VELSHI: Yes.
CROWLEY: I mean, you know, you think something, something's going on. And you (INAUDIBLE)...
VELSHI: But let me tell you, if they hadn't worked out, we wouldn't be discussing my intuition and my hunches on this show.
CROWLEY: It would be your expense report that we'd just...
VELSHI: They'd say -- oh, that would be -- that would have been -- that would have come into big focus.
BASH: Just to quickly talk about what you -- what you witnessed there. Talk about the actual, you know, the fallout from this Enron scandal was enormous. And I'm sure that you saw people there who were essentially victims.
VELSHI: There were victims there. They had lost their life savings. I spoke to one man in his 60s who had $1.3 million saved up in Enron stock. But like so many Americans, this man, Charlie Prestwood, he saw Enron's stock falling and he knew something was wrong, but he was proud of his company. And those Enron executives kept like cheerleaders, they just kept on going and saying no, no, this is a blip. This is a good company.
This is -- this was once America's seventh largest company. Now, all across America, in all sorts of companies, people invest too much in their companies and they say it's safe. Well...
BASH: But people are changing since Enron.
VELSHI: Well, let's hope that's the lesson, because something had better come out of it. Billions have been lost.
Well, from Enron to a case of missing personal records for 26 million American veterans. We're going to be on the story online with Internet reporter Abbi Tatton about what happened.
Stay with us.
We're coming right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: You are ON THE STORY.
Tell us what topics you want us to cover.
E-mail us at onthestory@cnn.com.
Are you worried about your personal information? About keeping it private?
Well, some 26 million American veterans found out that a laptop being used by a V.A. employee had been stolen, a laptop that had their personal data on it.
Our Internet reporter, Abbi Tatton, is on that story online -- Abbi, what are you seeing?
ABBI TATTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Ali, we've been watching all week as Veterans Affairs, the department has been putting together Web sites and phone lines to answer the questions of all these veterans that are calling in for information. They're also mounting their own investigation into just what happened that led to this security breach.
But this is certainly not the first case of a security breach that we've seen. There's a database online, The Privacy Rights Clearinghouse. This organization maintains this database of all the different data breaches that they can find in the past couple of years.
And the director of that site, Beth Givens, joins me now.
Beth, thanks for joining us.
BETH GIVENS, WWW.PRIVACYRIGHTS.ORG: Thank you.
TATTON: Now, Beth, on this database, how does the Veterans Affairs case, how does that relate in size and scope to the others that you've been tracking?
GIVENS: We've tracked for about a year-and-a-half now. And this is the largest breach involving Social Security numbers that we've seen. They have been many other breaches, but none to this scale involving Social Security numbers.
TATTON: And are you seeing more breaches in the last couple of years of this type and lost computers? Or is it hacking? What kinds of things are you seeing?
GIVENS: I don't think we're seeing more breaches, but we're seeing more disclosure of those breaches because of a California law and now the laws of about half the states. Individuals who have been affected must be given notice and I think that's why we're more attuned to these security breaches. It's more disclosure. I think these breaches have been going on all along at this level, at this volume.
TATTON: And if someone were to go to your site and find out that they were a member of a university or a bank or an agency that did suffer a security breach, what concrete advice can you give them? What should they be doing?
GIVENS: Well, I think first they should contact that institution and find out if, indeed, their personal information has been breached. They may or may not get the kind of information they're seeking, but nonetheless, what they should do at that time is then put a fraud alert on their three credit bureaus. And you can make one phone call, reach all three bureaus at once. And that's a fraud statement that appears on your credit report.
TATTON: And in terms of what you see, we saw with Veterans Affairs it actually took a couple of weeks before Veterans Affairs reported this to this -- to the public, before anyone could do anything about it.
Is that common?
GIVENS: Actually, that is common. I've seen even longer periods of time. Oftentimes, law enforcement will ask the breached entity to hold off on disclosure because they're still doing some investigation. I suspect that's what may have happened in this situation.
TATTON: And what can we do to make things better? It seems in this case that you and I were at the whim of somebody who chose to take a computer disk home.
Is there anything, any concrete steps we can take?
GIVENS: No, really, ultimately speaking, the individual, the consumer cannot prevent identity theft. I think given the magnitude of this one, we should all assume that our information is at risk all of the time.
And so what we need to be doing is checking our credit reports frequently. And that's why a recent law has gone into effect giving everyone the ability to check their reports.
And, by the way, when you do establish a fraud alert -- and anyone can establish a fraud alert -- you do get a free credit report in that instance, as well.
So we recommend place a fraud alert, take advantage of that free credit report and then keep placing the fraud alert every 90 days if you feel so inclined. And then also later on take advantage of the free credit report that you get through this new federal law.
TATTON: Beth Givens, thanks so much for joining us.
Good advice there from Beth Givens of privacyrights.org -- Ali.
VELSHI: Totally good advice, Abbi.
Thank you so much.
And thanks to Beth Givens.
I've got to say, I think that so much of my information is already out there, I've had a financial institution, I have had an employer lose my data in that fashion.
CROWLEY: Absolutely.
VELSHI: I don't want to think (INAUDIBLE).
CROWLEY: And there's so many ways to get information. I remember, you know, years ago going to a seminar where, in fact, they said hey, let's put in Janet Reno's name in Florida. And we came up with her address, who lived next to her and what sort of cars they had.
VELSHI: Yes.
BASH: Right. Right. So the key is, I mean I know it's sort of like, you know, everybody says this, but it's true, you've got to just keep checking your credit report.
VELSHI: Yes, that's exactly it. BASH: Yes.
VELSHI: I still shred my documents. I don't know how much good that does me.
ON THE STORY took us this week from the White House to the hallways of Congress to Houston and Miami.
Dana and Candy are back with what they are expecting next week ON THE STORY.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VELSHI: Well, let's take a real quick look ahead ON THE STORY.
Dana covers Congress. Congress is taking the Memorial week off.
BASH: A whole week. You know, that usually means we get some time, we can sort of catch our breath. But if last week was any kind of a test, we know that that never happens.
VELSHI: So you're not sure what's going to happen next week. You don't book off time for that?
BASH: The only thing I know is that we don't know what's going to happen.
VELSHI: All right, fair enough -- Candy.
CROWLEY: Sort of the same answer, except for it's an election year and so, you know, whatever is about politics, which is pretty nearly everything, we'll be watching.
VELSHI: Well, you'll be busy.
Thank you both, Dana and Candy.
Straight ahead, a new "CNN PRESENTS" -- "WOUNDED WARRIORS," the medical journey of troops injured in Iraq moving from the battlefield to home.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The firefights, the car bombs, the improvised explosive devices or IEDs, the wounding of U.S. troops. So begins their medical journey home. Amidst the chaos, the pain, Army medics or Navy Corpsman take lifesaving action. The fight continues around them.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
VELSHI: "CNN PRESENTS" -- "WOUNDED WARRIORS," straight ahead.
Well, thanks to my colleagues and thank you for watching ON THE STORY.
We're back each week, Saturday night and Sunday afternoon.
Straight ahead, a check on what's making news right now.
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