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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports

Ashcroft Wishes to Avoid Delays in McVeigh's Execution

Aired May 30, 2001 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, Timothy McVeigh meets with his lawyers in the coming hours, and is expected to give the go-ahead for a motion to block his execution, only 12 days away.

The attorney general vows to vigorously oppose any further delay. CNN legal analyst Greta Van Susteren will tell us what it all means.

Amid international criticism of U.S. executions, federal prosecutors seek the death penalty for two men convicted in the bombings of U.S. Embassies in Africa.

President Bush takes a walk in the woods and promises a new environmentalism.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: A healthy environment is a national concern and requires an active national government.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Is the president a compassionate conservationist? I'll ask environmental lawyer and activist Robert Kennedy Jr.

Good evening. I'm Wolf Blitzer reporting tonight from Washington.

U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft today made clear he wants Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh executed, as scheduled, in 12 days -- no more delays. But with the clock ticking, McVeigh's attorneys say they need more time to go through the thousands of pages of documents the FBI failed to provide them before the trial. That sets the stage, potentially, for a bruising legal battle, and that's our top story.

CNN's Gina London is standing by outside the federal courthouse in Denver where the issue will be fought out. Gina, tell us what's going on.

GINA LONDON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, when a motion as expected is filed, it come here to Federal Judge Richard Matsch's chambers. He is of course the judge who presided in Timothy McVeigh's trial. Also, here in Denver one of his attorneys, Nathan Chambers and he says their office is in the process of drafting that paperwork.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LONDON (voice-over): Before the defense files anything, lawyers will first seek the go-ahead from their client. Attorney Rob Nigh traveling again to the federal penitentiary in Terre Haute, Indiana to meet Thursday morning with convicted Oklahoma City Bomber Tim McVeigh. One of his former defense lawyers says it's no surprise if his team requests more time.

JERALYN MERRITT, FORMER MCVEIGH ATTORNEY: I think it would be unreasonable to expect lawyers to not only evaluate but also investigate 4000 pages of material in under a month. This is an execution. This is death. Death is different. What's the rush?

LONDON: If, as expected, a motion to stay execution is filed, McVeigh's former lawyer suggests it will be based on three likely grounds. More time is needed to investigate new material, defense believes it has grounds to ask Judge Matsch to reconsider McVeigh's first motion for a new trial that Matsch denied, or, more time is needed to seek permission from the Tenth Circuit Court Of Appeals to file a second motion for a new trial.

After the FBI turned over the first batch of newly recovered documents, Attorney General John Ashcroft delayed McVeigh's original execution from May 16th to June 11th. Since then even more documents have been recovered. But Ashcroft, today, issued a statement saying he would fight another delay. The statement, in part, reads:

"Because these documents cast no doubt on the surety of his guilt, the Justice Department will vigorously oppose any attempt to further delay the imposition of the sentence."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LONDON: But now, Wolf, that decision is likely to be up to Judge Match and not Attorney General John Ashcroft. The attorneys here, say that they believe there is information in these documents, that are worthy of judicial review. Wolf, back to you.

BLITZER: Gina, any sense of how the families of the victims are reacting to these latest developments?

LONDON: This is likely to be a very difficult time for them, Wolf. This is the second possible delay, now what they were expecting possibly some of them to put to closure, their emotions on May 16, now June 11, now likely even more than that. A lot of them really just don't know what to do with their emotions -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Gina London in Denver, thank you very much.

To help us sort out the legal issues in this case, let's turn to CNN legal analyst Greta Van Susteren. Greta, you covered that trial. You know the judge, Richard Matsch. How do you think he is likely to respond to a request for a delay?

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: It's hard to predict what a judge is going to do, Wolf, but I will tell you, this is a very stern law and order judge. He will be very disturbed if indeed the defense can prove that the government knew about these documents in January and then waited until a month before June 11, this judge is going to be extraordinarily unhappy.

The penalty is death, the ultimate one. And he is not going to want to rush into this without the defense having a full opportunity to review all the documents.

BLITZER: But if he should decide execution will go as scheduled, on June 11, presumably the lawyers for Timothy McVeigh will appeal. How is the court of appeals -- the higher court, likely to react?

VAN SUSTEREN: Every time you have to go to the court of appeals, you are less likely to win, believe me. The defense lawyers want to win this case before Judge Matsch -- winning this case meaning, postponing the execution. If they have go to the United States Court Of Appeals for 11th Circuit, the chances for prevailing are profoundly less. If that is what they have to do, they will do. But they don't have as high of hopes in the court of appeals as they would before Judge Matsch.

One other interesting aspect. Do not be surprised if the documents filed tomorrow are filed under seal, ex parte, not tipping the government off as to why they want more time to look at these documents, they don't trust the government at this point having withheld the documents. So we may not actually see their request tomorrow.

BLITZER: And very briefly, Greta, if the lawyers for Timothy McVeigh decide to try to string this out as long as they can to keep their client alive, how long do you think they can keep him alive?

VAN SUSTEREN: Good lawyers can drag out these cases pretty long, because they raise every single possible issue. That man, despite the fact that he's convicted of killing a number of people: 168 people died in Oklahoma City, he is entitled to every single right. These are aggressive lawyers.

Now, here is the interesting thing, the reason the lawyers want to do this is they always hope there will be a federal moratorium on the death penalty, so they will drag it out, hoping to beat that.

BLITZER: Greta Van Susteren -- of course, Greta will be back with more on THE POINT at the bottom of the hour on this story -- thank you very much.

And in a related story, the human rights group Amnesty International says the U.S. has given up its own role as human rights leader, citing the continuing use of death penalty in this country. It says the United States has joined China, Iran and Saudi Arabia in a "executioner's quartet," responsible for 88 percent of the world's known executions. Amnesty calls the pending federal execution of Timothy McVeigh "disgraceful."

There could be more federal executions ahead: a day after a jury convicted four men in the 1998 bombings of U.S. Embassies in Africa, sentencing hearings have begun and two of the defendants could face the death penalty. CNN national correspondent Bob Franken joins us from New York.

BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, because the stakes are so high, here the death penalty phase, is a very deliberate, very careful process. And for those who suffered the most from these violent acts, a very painful process.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FRANKEN (voice-over): Sue Bartley was the first of the living victims to testify. "There isn't a day that goes by," she said, "that I don't think about our loss and the losses of others."

Both her husband and son died that horrible day. August 7, 1998, when 213 people were killed and more than four thousand injured in the bomb attack against the U.S. Embassy in Kenya.

Mohammed al-Owhali might receive death penalty for his direct participation. Co-defendant Khalfan Khamis Mohamed will have his death penalty hearing when al-Owhali's hearing is done. He was convicted in the nearly simultaneous bombing at the U.S. Embassy in Tanzania. But first, the Kenya bombing.

SUE BARTLEY, RELATIVE OF BOMB VICTIMS: This was our first opportunity, to speak to the jury, and, I think they listened, I hope they listened.

FRANKEN: The 12 jurors must vote unanimously before the death penalty can be imposed. Assistant U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald, the lead prosecutor: "the only punishment," he told the jury, "that does justice to the victims, is the death penalty."

Defense Attorney David Baugh attributed a violent mood overseas to U.S. international relations, saying, "We create grave risk to others also and that has to stop."

The prosecutors say the gravest risk comes from Osama bin Laden, indicted in this conspiracy, but out of reach in Afghanistan, with the approval of the country's fundamentalist Muslim Taliban government.

SAYED RAHMATULLAH HASHMI: How do we know bin Laden is behind it? Bin Laden says he is not. So in order to find it out, the United States should give us -- provide us with evidence. They have not given us any kind of evidence.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FRANKEN: Here in New York, the jury is being asked to consider by both sides just the evidence, to ignore the intense emotions in these hearings. "You are sitting here," the prosecutor said, "to make the most serious moral judgment." Wolf.

BLITZER: Bob Franken in New York, thank you very much.

In other news, a visual warning about environmental damage. A NASA satellite has produced the most sweeping view yet of global air pollution, as forest fires and factories veil the planet in clouds of smog.

Meantime, we're looking at a picture of President Bush who has just returned to the White house from his visit out west to California where he visited the Sequoia National Park. Out there, he unveiled some environmental initiatives, designed to protect the ancient redwoods of California's parks. More from our senior White House correspondent John King.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A look across the great western divide and a walk to marvel at the giant sequoias, including the largest living tree on earth.

BUSH: They were here when the Roman empire fell and they were here when the Roman empire rose, and had Christ Himself stood on this spot, He would have been in the shade of this very tree.

KING: It was a visit designed to highlight a Bush promise to give national parks like Sequoia a face lift. The president pledges to eliminate a $5 billion maintenance backlog over five years. His budget for next year includes a $440 million down payment, a 30 percent increase over this year's park maintenance budget -- $1.5 million of that would be for removing payment and other manmade threats to the roots of the giant sequoias here. And the administration also will act to control emissions from coal and other power plants blamed for haze at some national parks.

BUSH: Americans are united in the belief that we must preserve our natural heritage and safeguard the land around us.

KING: There are 384 national parks, 83 million acres in all, attracting nearly 300 million visitors a year. The National Parks Conservation Association says it gives Mr. Bush a "D" grade so far for parks protection, and some environmentalists say scenes like this are designed to mask policies that harm the environment like the proposal to drill for oil and natural gas at the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge and on other federal lands, and the easing of Clinton administration rules setting new pollution controls on mining.

MELANIE GRIFFIN, SIERRA CLUB: It would have been more honest for him to go stand in front of an oil derrick and talk about his energy policy and the threats that it poses to public lands.

KING: It was the last stop on Mr. Bush's first visit to California as president. (on camera): Over time, administration officials predict Mr. Bush's record on the environment will come to be viewed as favorable, or at least as balanced, but it will take much more than a visit to a majestic place like this to quiet the president's many critics.

John King, CNN, Sequoia National Park, California.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: He's called President Bush a "disaster" for the environment. I'll ask environmental lawyer Robert F. Kennedy Jr. if the president is now going green.

And double trouble? Did one or both of the president's underage twin daughters try to purchase alcohol? Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. Born to a political dynasty, he's made his own mark as an environmental activist. He's negotiated treaties to protect tribal homelands. He's prosecuted polluters in a battle to keep our rivers clean. A law professor, he's the chief attorney for two environmental groups.

And joining me now from New York is Robert F. Kennedy Jr. Thanks for joining us, Mr. Kennedy.

Quickly, on this trip that the president made out to Sequoia National Park today, he announced several major steps to protect the national parks. So on this day he deserves at least some high marks, doesn't he?

ROBERT KENNEDY JR., ENVIRONMENTAL ATTORNEY: Well, I think most environmentalists are going to look at this, most people who care about our public lands and environment are going to look at this and they're going to see window dressing. This administration has really made an all-out assault to eviscerate our nation's environmental laws, to defund our environmental agencies, including EPA and the Department of Interior, which manages the parks, which, if you look at the overall budget, is suffering huge cuts from the proposed budget.

The issues of arsenic in drinking water, the evisceration of the Endangered Species Act, walking away from the Kyoto agreement, saying that carbon dioxide is not pollution, walking away from the regulations for the large hog farms, all of those things are an all- out assault. And this, I think, is really going to appear to people as if it's -- it's nice talk. But you kind of have to look at President Bush's feet and where they're going.

BLITZER: Well, if you take a look at some of the specifics of what he announced today -- $5 billion over the next five years to clean up the parks, deciding to implement several of the measures that former President Clinton announced in the waning days of his administration -- listen specifically to what President Bush announced earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BUSH: Over the next five years, we'll protect nearly 4,000 miles of river and restore nearly 9,000 acres of park lands to their natural conditions. We have more than doubled the budget to help us better study our parks' natural resources, learn better ways to protect and restore them, and teach visitors about how they can help.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: That certainly sounds like someone who is a friend of the environment.

KENNEDY: Well, again, it sounds like they're going to do some studies. But if you look at what President Bush promised during his election campaign, he promised to fully fund the parks, and that's not what they're doing.

Listen, Wolf, EPA's budget is less than one-half of 1 percent of our entire federal budget, and that is being cut by half a billion dollars. The same is true of Interior. We spend very, very little of our GNP, very, very little of our national budget on parks, on recreation, on the environment. We make almost no investment in our environmental infrastructure. And what little we have made in the past is now being proposed for the chopping block by this administration.

And just because...

BLITZER: When you say -- let me interrupt for a second. When you say those are cuts, they're actually increases that are going on, but they're cuts in the earlier anticipated increases that some in the environmental community would have proposed. But let me get to the specific issue of the EPA. Are you suggesting that Christine Todd Whitman, the former governor of New Jersey and the administrator of the EPA, is not committed to the environment?

KENNEDY: Well, I don't know what goes on in Christie Todd Whitman's heart. I know what she was like as governor of New Jersey, and I know that she was a disaster for the environment as governor of New Jersey. I work on Hudson River issues, and I had to fight her policies almost every day that I was working over the past six years. So I don't know really what, you know, I can't tell you, but I can tell you that if -- if we had -- if that -- that we need somebody who's going to fight for things like the Kyoto protocol or that to say carbon dioxide is a pollution, to keep the arsenic out of our drinking water, to protect the Endangered Species Act. And at this point, we're not seeing that much action from either the Cabinet or the president on those issues.

BLITZER: All right, Robert Kennedy Jr., unfortunately, we are all out of time. Thanks so much for joining us.

KENNEDY: Thanks for having me, Wolf.

BLITZER: Thank you. And up next, he hasn't changed the locks on the mayor's mansion yet, but New York's Rudy Giuliani is upping the ante in his divorce battle with Donna Hanover. And twins in trouble, a case of mistaken identification or no identification. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. In other news tonight, top Israeli and Palestinian officials resumed talks on restoring Middle East peace today against the backdrop of more violence. A car bomb exploded in front of a school near the West Bank, injuring six Israelis. An Islamic militant group claimed responsibility. The second round of U.S.-led talks ended without agreement. Negotiations are expected to resume next week.

In Northern California, a massive wildfire that's forced the evacuation of homes and a hospital could be contained by tomorrow. Fire crews say the 4,200-acre blaze in Susanville is now 60 percent contained.

In the Florida panhandle, governor Jeb Bush surveyed the damage from a 61,000-acre fire. The blaze, the largest this year, is one of nearly 200 burning across the state. The president's 19-year-old twin daughters have landed themselves in more trouble.

Police in Austin, Texas say Jenna Bush tried to buy alcohol at a restaurant Tuesday using someone else's identification. Jenna's sister Barbara was with her at the time. Last month, Jenna was cited for underage alcohol possession. No charges have been filed in this latest incident.

Now the latest in the saga of New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani's bitter divorce. Giuliani today reassigned two of Donna Hanover's city-paid staffers as well as some of her police detail.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

QUESTION: You've made several changes in the office of first lady as it is. Looking at it have you looked into whether you have the right to make all the changes you want, including even eliminate the office if you wish?

MAYOR RUDOLPH GIULIANI (R), NEW YORK CITY: Why don't you consult the corporation counsel for that. I think it is better, under the circumstances, if the corporation counsel explains on any questions that you have, the legal powers of the mayor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: So far, no comment from Hanover.

Tonight on the "Leading Edge," a new meaning to high-tech urban warfare. The army has unveiled its latest vehicle designed to protect against terrorists and other enemies. The Smart truck is a souped-up ford F-350 pickup equipped with features such as a grenade launcher, laser gun, and high-voltage door handles.

And introducing the next generation of cellular phones. The new G-3 phones download data up to 40 times faster than its competitors and allow users to log on to the Net and talk at the same time. The phones aren't expected to hit the U.S. market for at least a couple of years.

Cream, sugar, or nicotine? Smokers trying to kick the habit soon could have another option, liquid nicotine. A co-inventor of the nicotine patch is working on a liquid solution that's tasteless when mixed with drinks.

Up next, I'll open our mailbag. Lots of reaction to the Supreme Court decision on disabled golfer Casey Martin. One viewer says it's opened up a Pandora's Box and wonders what's next? Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. Time now to open our mailbag. We were flooded with reaction to the Supreme Court decision allowing disabled golfer Casey Martin to use a cart during tournaments. John writes from Great Falls, Montana. "This is a sad day for America, that we are so uncompassionate that it takes a ruling by the Supreme Court to permit a man to take part in golf tournaments. Shame, shame, shame."

Michael from Los Angeles: "To those of us who have been blessed with good health and the physical ability to walk and run without ailment, we must never forget that there exist in this world some who have never been so fortunate, but they still have the heart and determination to try."

Helene from Ottawa writes this about my interview with golf legend Greg Norman: "His understanding, compassion and humanity can only enrich golf."

But a different view from Jeff from Coolville, Ohio. He says this: "In my opinion the Casey Martin case opens a Pandora's Box of potential problems for professional sports. Why should I be denied the chance of playing the PGA just because I stink at the game? Fair is fair, no?"

Remember, I want to hear from you. Please e-mail me at wolf@cnn.com. And you can read my daily on-line column and sign up for my e-mail previewing our nightly programs by going to our "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS" Web site, cnn.com/wolf.

Please stay with CNN throughout the night. Kitty Kelly is among Larry King's guests at the top of the hour. Up next, Greta Van Susteren. She's standing by to tell us what she has -- Greta.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST, THE POINT: Wolf, two controversies: First an archbishop gets married. The Vatican is not happy. Second, Stephen Jones and Gerry Spence join us to talk about McVeigh -- Wolf.

BLITZER: OK, Greta. Sounds good. Tomorrow night, we'll talk with a former prosecutor in the Timothy McVeigh case. Until then, thanks very much for watching. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. "THE POINT WITH GRETA VAN SUSTEREN" begins right now.

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