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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports

Scientists to Announce Human Cloning Project

Aired August 06, 2001 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight, pushing the bounds of science and ethics: a team of reproductive specialists says it plans to clone up to 200 human beings.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are real people attempting to assist other childless couples to have a child.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's just barbaric human experimentation.

BLITZER: It's the biggest book deal in history. Will Bill Clinton tell all?

As authorities debate a possible obstruction of justice case against Gary Condit and his aids, the congressman's supporters are about to rally tonight in his home district. Is it still Condit country?

And a high-tech speed trap that will be highly lucrative.

BLITZER: Good evening, I'm Wolf Blitzer reporting tonight from Washington. Scientists have successfully cloned sheep and other animals, but in the process there have been numerous failures, including miscarriages, premature death and major physical deformities. Now, despite those risks, a group says it will announce plans tomorrow to clone human beings. A team of reproductive specialists says it wants to help as many as 200 infertile couples give birth to cloned children. And that's our top story.

Are they playing God by seeking to re-engineer human embryos? The announcement is to come at a cloning conference to be held tomorrow by the National Academy of Sciences, which advises the government on scientific issues. Work with the infertile couples is expected to begin in November. The researchers will clone the DNA from either the husband or the wife to form an embryo, then implant the embryo in the wife to start a pregnancy. The Bush administration strongly opposes such research. The House of Representatives has passed a bill outlawing it. Bio-ethicists, including Art Caplan of the University of Pennsylvania, are horrified, but the group's director, Panos Zavos, downplays any risks for the couples and their offspring.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) PANOS ZAVOS, FERTILITY RESEARCHER: They know that they chances are not even good for them to get pregnant, But that's life, so they are willing to be the guinea pigs, so to speak, which of course we don't look at them that way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ART CAPLAN, UNIVERSITY OF PENNSYLVANIA: Put aside whether it is good to be a clone, whether it is odd to be a clone, whether it's strange to be made in someone else's image. The way this science is right now, not working well in animals, you absolutely don't want to do it in people. It's just barbaric human experimentation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Joining me now is CNN Medical Correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen. Elizabeth, you spoke to Dr. Zavos earlier today. How serious, though, are these risks? It's one thing to experiment with animals, it's obviously quite another thing to experiment with human beings.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: You know, everybody except Dr. Zavos says that these risks are huge. They say it took nearly 300 tried to get Dolly. The other tries, they were just failures. There were miscarriages; there were these horrible deformities of major organs of the placenta. And so they say that any of these women who have volunteered for this, or any of these couples, are really taking huge risks with their offspring.

BLITZER: Does he come to this conference here, The National Academy of Sciences with any credibility? Is he respected in this field?

COHEN: He's a former professor at the University of Kentucky at Lexington, and so he does have some academic credentials. Now it is very difficult to say whether the techniques that he is using, which he says is modeled on what they did with Dolly, it's hard to say if he's got it right or not. Because he, no one knows exactly what he's doing. They've kept it really secret.

BLITZER: Now he says he's going to do it in November, 200 couples. Where is he going to do it?

COHEN: Well he says he's identified two countries where cloning is still legal. He wouldn't tell me what they were, except to say that it is not the United States. He's not doing any work in the United States. The 200 families he says come from all over the world. And he specifically named England, the United States, and Italy.

BLITZER: Now as you know, some people that support human cloning have a religious agenda. The believe in it for religious purposes. Does he bring any sort of agenda like that with him?

COHEN: You know what, he doesn't bring that kind of agenda. There's a group called Raelians who are Dr. Zavos' competitors, if you will, in the cloning business. They call themselves a religious group. They say that they think that aliens came down from outer space, and made all of us humans here on earth. And they believe this with a religious fervor. He does not have a religious backing here.

BLITZER: All right, Elizabeth Cohen, our Medical Correspondent, thanks for joining us. And this scientific footnote, high tech fertility treatments, which have nothing to do with cloning are still working wonders. A 60 year old Japanese women has become her nation's oldest new mother, giving birth to a healthy baby after undergoing in vitro fertilization in the United States.

Bill Clinton may have found a way to clone money. The former president has signed a record-breaking mega-million dollar book deal. He has a lot to tell, but will he? CNN National Correspondent Eileen O'Connor has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

EILEEN O'CONNOR, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Is it his personal life?

BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Indeed I did have a relationship with Ms. Lewinsky that was not appropriate.

O'CONNOR: Or is politics that make former president, Bill Clinton's memoirs worth over $10 million according to sources close to the ex-president. That's more than his wife's and more than the Pope's, who had held a record with an $8.5 million advance for his best seller. Robert Barnett negotiated the deal for World Wide Rights, with publishing company Alfred A. Knopf, and says the President has a lot to say.

ROBERT BARNETT, ATTORNEY FOR BILL CLINTON: The President has told me that he plans to write a comprehensive and candid book. With respect to specifically what's going to be in there, you'll have to buy it, because that's the name of the game.

O'CONNOR: So just how much can anyone expect him to say about Monica Lewinsky?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There is always the sense with him that there's a real person in there, and that it's almost like almost anything could happen. You know, he might just say something that's a little out of the box, it's a little unusual.

O'CONNOR: But, most agree, not too far out, since aids view this book as part of a political re-entry strategy for a former president who readily admits feeling sidelined.

CLINTON: By. You know, when you're not president any more people look at you funny when you walk by them in the airport. They say things like, "You look just like Bill Clinton."

O'CONNOR: A tell all could also hurt another political career, that of his wife, Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton. Still Mr. Clinton's pension for doing the unexpected will keep everyone hoping, and his publishing company betting that this will be anything but boring.

Eileen O'Connor, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: Not everybody is doing as well as Mr. Clinton. New figures show corporate America slashed more than 200,000 jobs last month. That's triple the number of cuts last year, and the biggest jump in at least eight years. There was also a decline in the market numbers today, the Dow Jones Industrial Average dropped 111 points. The NAZDAQ composite fell 32 points and the S&P 500 lost more than 13 points.

Now to the search for missing intern Chandra Levy. Gary Condit, who has said to have had an affair with her has at least until recently been a very popular congressman with the folks back home in his district. While many now have doubts about his conduct, some supporters plan a rally this evening about an hour from now. CNN National Correspondent Gary Tuchman joins us now live from Turlock, California.

Gary, set the stage for us, what's about to happen out there?

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, what's going to happen here Wolf, is about 200 of organizers (UNINTELLIGIBLE) supporters of Gary Condit are going to come to this parking lot at the Civic Club in Turlock, California, which is about 10 miles south of Gary Condit's home. Gary Condit flew home to Northern California on Friday. He landed at San Francisco International Airport and that's the last we've seen him in public since then. But in honor and support of him, his supporters say they are going to hold a rally in this parking lot tonight here in California.

Now organizers say they expect a couple hundred people to come out. Will one of them be Gary Condit? Well, they say they haven't invited Gary Condit. But we talked to his Capital Hill Chief of Staff, Mike Dayton, who happened, interestingly enough to be here right now. And he told us - quote - when we asked him if Gary Condit would show up?

He said, I don't know. So we'll wait and see what happens. Meanwhile in Condit's neighborhood in Ceres, California, just north of here, there are still reporters and TV crews on his street outside his house. Many of the neighbors are very angry about that. They defend the congressman, they defend the man. They park cars and trailers and RVs up and down the quiet suburban street to block Gary Condit's house from the television cameras. And they have also put up signs. One of the signs says, "No More Media Police, Stop Staking Out Our Street."

And regarding the investigations, the 98 days now since April 30th when Chandra Levy disappeared, and they are still absolutely no clues. Wolf, back to you.

BLITZER: Gary Tuchman, thank you very much. And has Gary Condit obstructed the Chandra Levy investigation? Is he in any legal jeopardy? I'll ask well know criminal defense attorney Roy Black, and former Deputy Independent Counsel Bob Bittman.

And no longer a tropical storm, is Barry still a threat?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. Some of his colleagues want him to resign or face an ethics investigation in the Congress. Police say he's not the central figure in the Chandra Levy case, but authorities are said to be weighing a serious look at possible obstruction and tampering by Congressman Gary Condit and his aids.

Let's turn to two attorneys with first hand experience in such matters. Joining me here in Washington, Bob Bittman, a former deputy independent counsel, in the office of Ken Starr. And from Miami, the noted criminal defense attorney Roy Black. Thanks to both of you for joining us.

And Bob Bittman, I want to begin with you. How serious, potentially of a legal problem does Congressman Condit have?

ROBERT BITTMAN, FMR. DEPUTY INDEPENDENT COUNSEL: Potentially it's very serious. How exactly serious it is remains to be seen. But he faces charges of lying to the police, of obstructing the investigation by trying to get perhaps Anne Marie Smith to lie. And then the other allegation, and that is that he or one of his staff members tried to get another women to withhold some information she had to the police.

BLITZER: Women who have previously alleged that they have had an affair with him. But if there was no crime - this is still a missing person's investigation - if there is no crime that the police say has been committed, does he, would he still face this other track, this obstruction or tampering route?

BITTMAN: Very possibly, the statute doesn't, there doesn't have to be an underlying crime. All he has to lie about or obstruct justice about is a material matter to the police's investigation. Whether or not there was a crime during that investigation or not.

BLITZER: Roy Black, you're one of the best criminal defense attorneys in the United States. How much legal jeopardy do you believe Congressman Condit now faces?

ROY BLACK, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well the Congressman is clearly in the zone of utter stupidity, but I don't think he's quite passed over into, over the line into criminality at this stage. Because remember, what is he doing? He's not trying to obstruct a criminal investigation. What he's trying to do is to cover up the fact that he's had an affair with every women in the Western Hemisphere. So, I mean, you have to look at what's really going on here. Lying about affairs and trying to prevent it being published in the newspapers is not obstruction of justice. I just don't think he's got into that zone of criminality yet.

BLITZER: So you disagree with Bob Bittman. If there's no underlying crime that the police now say they are engaged in searching for, then the legal jeopardy as far as obstruction, witness tampering or perjury, that might not necessarily hold.

BLACK: Well, I personally believe that they are investigating a crime. By this stage, I think everybody believes some crime has happened with this women's disappearance. So, I don't think that's the key. It's just that, what has he lied about? He's lied and covered up about having affairs, not having anything really to do with her disappearance. And I think that's where we have to look here. What was his intent? His intent was to protect his political career and his married life, not to cover up a crime.

BLITZER: You mentioned, Bob Bittman, Anne Marie Smith, the flight attendant, who says someone, that the congressman encouraged her to sign what turned out to be a false affidavit. Is that a potential (UNINTELLIGIBLE) crime?

BITTMAN: Absolutely. That's subornation of perjury. And I would have to disagree with Roy about, he at minimum has lied about an on-going relationship with people. At worst, its obviously much worse in that he's lied about some criminality, perhaps, that he's done. There's not much evidence, or any evidence of that, but he at minimum has lied to police, and that's a crime.

BLITZER: Let me point out, Roy Black, what the US codes says on witness tampering and perjury. And I'll read it, we'll put it up on the screen.

Whoever procures another to commit any perjury is guilty of subornation of perjury and shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years or both. What do you say about that?

BLACK: Well you have to look at how the courts interpret that. And on these affidavit cases, I've handled a number of them, so I'm familiar with it. The fact that she did not sign the affidavit probably protects her. Remember also, there was a caveat in the affidavit, you know, correct anything you want before you sign it. So I think that sort of protects him. If she had signed the affidavit, even if it wasn't submitted to a court, that would be obstruction of justice. But she stopped short of that, and said I won't do it. So there is no subornation of perjury?

BLITZER: Bob Bittman, what about that?

BITTMAN: Well, Roy's right, it could be attempted subornation of perjury, but we don't know all the facts. And I agree with Roy, that I think it may be a difficult case. We also have to though revert to the statements that Anne Marie Smith said, that the congressman made to her. It's not just what was submitted to her in writing, but apparently he made some pretty heavy duty direct demands on her to not tell the police he truth. And that obviously would qualify as subornation.

BLITZER: Roy Black, what about the other allegation that he supposedly went and took a watch box that was given to him from another ex-girlfriend, and through it away only hours before the police came to search his apartment here in Washington? BLACK: Wolf, here, again, it's utter stupidity, but what has that have to do with the investigation of Chandra Levy? The fact that he is disposing of gifts from other women, to me clearly proves he's trying to cover up the fact of all these affairs, which of course is a horrible thing. But does that have anything really to do with this disappearance? I don't think so.

BLITZER: Well, let me ask Bob Bittman. Does that watch box, throwing it away, does that have anything to do with a possible crime?

BITTMAN: We don't know. The fact is, he could have been doing this for the reason Roy stated that is merely to cover up some illicit affairs. He also could have been doing this, that is getting Anne Marie Smith (ph), or trying to get Anne Marie Smith to lie and hiding this other information, lying the police himself, to cover up something much more. We don't know that yet.

BLITZER: Roy Black, there's been four interviews that he's had so far with law enforcement authorities here in Washington. I assume they are looking at the transcripts, going over his testimony, his answers. If he is found to have hand discrepancies or lied, would he then be in some legal jeopardy?

BLACK: Oh, he may well be, Wolf, and of course this is exactly why lawyers every day tell their client not to make statements. Because when you get in a case like this, with all the pressure on it, the more you talk, the more the police are going to look to try to get leverage on you, by claiming you lied or have some inconsistencies or covered something up. That's what's really happening here. They've run out of leads. What do they have? They have Gary Condit. So of course they are going to put enormous pressures on him to see if he breaks. The best way of doing that is of accusing him of obstruction of justice, subornation of perjury, inconsistencies and all of that.

BLITZER: Bob Bittman, you probably read in the Washington Post today, a lengthy article suggesting that all these high profile, very experienced prosecutors, the US Attorney's Office, the Justice Department, FBI investigators are now engaged in the second track. Not the search for Chandra Levy, but in seeing if there is an obstruction or witness tampering against Gary Condit and his aids. What does that suggest to you, as a former deputy independent counselor?

BITTMAN: Well, that one, that they think something's there. That, that's worth going after. Two, that they also may believe that Mr. Condit, Congressman Condit involved some other people, maybe members of his staff that also, perhaps, were involved. And maybe they could flip them to get something incriminating against the congressman. They would not be looking at this, in my view, if they thought it would positively go nowhere. They think it may go somewhere, I think.

BLITZER: Roy Black, very briefly, if you have to assume that they are looking to try to squeeze Congressman Condit, are they trying to squeeze some of his aids, in order to move up the command, if you will? BLACK: Absolutely, I think Bob hit the nail on the head there. What they're really doing is squeezing the underlings there, thinking that Condit couldn't have done this by himself, if in fact he had any part in her disappearance. By squeezing all these people, in his office, they are hoping that somebody will say something that will put them on the track of finding an answer.

BLITZER: All right, we've got to leave it right there. Bob Bittman and Roy Black, I want to thank both of you so much for joining us, adding some insight into this very, very complicated case. Thank you very much.

BLACK: Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: And what's Barry up to? We'll have an update on the storm when we return. Also ahead, I'll tell you why drivers aren't smiling for the latest high tech cameras. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. In our other top stories tonight, tropical storm Barry was downgraded to a tropical depression over Alabama today. The storm dumped several inches of rain on the Florida Panhandle, knocking down trees and leaving thousands without power. All that rain means a risk of flooding in parts of Alabama and Florida. That has emergency officials keeping an eye on the levels of area rivers.

In Brooklyn, New York people gathered near the spot where several members of a family were killed crossing the street. They protested a judge's release of an off-duty police officer accused of crashing into the family while driving drunk. A pregnant women, her son and her sister were killed. The women's baby was delivered after the accident, but also died. A candlelight vigil and march to the station of the now suspended officer is planned for tonight.

Tonight on the "Leading Edge," the use of cameras to catch speeders is sparking controversy here in Washington. Some drivers are seeing red, because local police could be seeing a whole lot of green.

CNN's Patty Davis has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PATTY DAVIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): When this radar mounted on a police cruiser detects a speeding car, this camera snaps the license plate, and a ticket from 30 to $200 arrives in the mail. The city estimates 80,000 speeding tickets every month compared to just 10,000 police now write a year. Officials won't say how much the city stands to make, but it could be a multi-million dollar windfall.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I hope it's a about safety, but it sure has the appearance of being about money.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If the 80,000 per month number of speeding tickets holds true, that's three tickets for every licensed drive in the District of Columbia in a given year. That's overkill.

DAVIS: Police say speeding in the district, where most roads have a 25 mile an hour limit, is a factor in nearly half of the district's traffic deaths.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're not in this for the money. We're in it to save lives. Listen, driving is a privilege, and you have no right to get out here and speed and run red lights and kill people.

DAVIS: A private company, Lockheed Martin, runs the operation. Lockheed pays the $100,000 cost of each of five camera-equipped patrol cars, as well as for the police officers who work strictly on overtime.

In exchange, Lockheed gets $29 per ticket, and could make $28 million a year. Lockheed Martin says it's helping the city do what it couldn't afford on its own.

Patty Davis, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: Up next, a look at our mailbag.

One of you from Europe writes that the Chandra Levy/Gary Condit case is strictly an American story, one that would be handled completely differently in Europe. Is she right? Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. Time now to open our mailbag. Sonja (ph) from Vienna, Austria has this perspective on the Chandra Levy investigation: "This is a typically American story. The media gets mad about it, everybody has the urgent need to give comments. The family appears on TV. I'm sure if this would happen to a European family, they would avoid talking too much to the media. I would expect them to keep quiet and talk only to the police."

Margaret from Texas writes about human cloning: "God didn't intend for his people to create life in this manner. This is all wrong. Wake up America and do things God's way and God's way only. We must stop playing God."

Doris writes about stem cell research: "I am deaf, nerve damaged by infancy fever all my life, and I am almost 70. I even have diabetes. So if stem cells really help many people with health problems, including President Ronald Reagan and Christopher Reeve, I support it all the way."

Remember, I want to hear from you. Please e-mail me at wolf@cnn.com. And you can read my daily online column and sign up for my e-mail previewing our nightly programs by going to my Web site, cnn.com/wolf. Please stay with CNN throughout the night. Much more on the Chandra Levy case on "LARRY KING LIVE" at the top of the hour.

Up next Greta Van Susteren. She's standing by to tell us what she has.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST, "THE POINT": Wolf, "TIME" magazine has a cover story of a generation of Kennedys. They are now in their thirties and forties, a lot of them are in politics and public service. I'll have three tonight joining me to tell us exactly what they're doing, as well as their cousins. Plus, we'll get an update on Gary Condit -- Wolf.

BLITZER: OK, Greta, sounds good. Tomorrow night we'll have much more on President Clinton's megamillion dollar book deal. Until then, thanks very much for watching. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. "THE POINT" with Greta Van Susteren begins right now.

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