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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports

Gary Condit's Comeback Strategy: Too Little, Too Late?

Aired August 27, 2001 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, HOST: Tonight, Condit, too little too late? He's criticized for not going far enough in his interviews about Chandra Levy. But when it comes to flight attendant Anne Marie Smith, did Gary Condit go too far? Her lawyer now wants the congressman indicted on charges he tried to coerce her into denying an affair. We'll go live to Modesto, California.

Has Condit offered too little in this sudden wave of media appearances? I'll ask some of his interviewers, Colleen O'Connor of "People" magazine, Judy Bachrach of "Vanity Fair," and Jodi Hernandez of KOVR-TV.

And, is Condit's media campaign too late? As one-time supporters pull back, has he reached the breaking point? When it comes to scandals, some survive, some don't. We'll look at what happens to politicians when the bottom drops out.

Good evening. I'm Wolf Blitzer reporting tonight from Capitol Hill.

Democratic Congressman Gary Condit's political and legal problems appear to be getting worse, much worse. By almost all accounts, including our own poll, his recent news media interviews have backfired. Among his colleagues on Capitol Hill, his support is slipping, even among fellow Democrats.

And now, the lawyer for a flight attendant who says she had an almost year-long affair with Condit wants a grand jury to indict him. But Condit's supporters vow to fight on. And that's our focus tonight, the comeback strategy of Gary Condit, too little, too late?

For more on Condit's political woes and the legal trouble he may now face, let's go live to CNN national correspondent Bob Franken. He's in Modesto, California.

Bob, tell us what's going on?

BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the attorneys for Anne Marie Smith, the flight attendant, who says she had that affair with Congressman Condit. Condit said there was no relationship, to use his words. At any rate, they found a novel way to use California law to go directly to the local grand jury here and ask the grand jury investigate and indict Condit for subornation of perjury and obstruction of justice, along with two associates, for allegedly asking Anne Marie Smith to lie about their relationship.

Now they were told by assistant county prosecutors that it's unlikely this approach will work. They also filled out a local police report. And as the attorneys filed out, they even had some reference still to the interviews of last Thursday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES ROBINSON, ANNE MARIE SMITH'S ATTORNEY: Everybody says, "What did you think of Connie Chung the interview?" I'll tell you, I wish that was a grand jury interview, because he couldn't have given those answers. They would have taken him away in handcuffs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FRANKEN: Now we have had reaction from the public relations people who represent Gary Condit. It is a two sentence statement that goes, "Today's events represent another example of the tabloidization of this tragedy. Nothing that happened today will advance the cause of helping to find Chandra Levy."

Now, this is getting poignant on occasion. The man who employs the two Condit children, California Governor Gray Davis, was asked about old friend during a news conference.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. GRAY DAVIS (D), CALIFORNIA: I've known Gary and worked with him for many, many years. And so what I am about to say doesn't bring me any joy whatsoever. I didn't see the interview. So my information comes from news accounts and the transcripts of the interview, but I'm disheartened that Congressman Condit did not speak out more quickly or more fully.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FRANKEN: Now one of the things that is telling is that things have gotten so bad that there is open talk about whether Gary Condit would resign, talk that his advisers say is grossly premature -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Bob Franken in Modesto, California. Thank you so much for joining us.

And did Congressman Condit end up shooting himself in the foot with his round of media interviews? Let's ask some of the interviewers.

Joining me here on Capitol Hill is Colleen O'Connor of "People" magazine. In Sacramento, California, Jodi Hernandez of KOVR Television. And in Los Angeles, Judy Bachrach of "Vanity Fair."

And let's start with you, Judy. The interviews, by almost all accounts, seem to have resulted in a political and perhaps even legal disaster for the congressman, which begs the question, why did he do them? JUDY BACHRACH, "VANITY FAIR": Well, partly he did it, as you know Wolf, because we've been hounding him to do it. There's no use saying we had nothing to do with it. We've been begging and pleading, all of us for him to come forward. He did come forward, but he wasn't frank and he wasn't at all times honest. And he was at many times very foolish, at least with me.

BLITZER: Jodi, you're there, right nearby in his district in Sacramento. Let's take a look at some poll numbers showing that there is a sort of a disconnect between how people are reacting in his district, in the 18th congressional district, as opposed to rest of country. Look at these numbers.

Did Condit lie during Thursday's TV interview? Among nationwide, the answers were 71 percent said "yes," but 58 percent said "yes" in his district. So he seems to have a little bit of reservoir built-in support there.

Let's look at next question. Would you vote though for Condit if he runs for re-election? Only 29 percent of the registered voters in the 18th district said "yes." 61 percent said "no."

There seems to be little support at this point for him to come back. Is that the sense you're getting on the ground out there?

JODI HERNANDEZ, KOVR-TV: Yes, that is the sense that we're getting here. The majority of the folks that we've talked to have said that they're very disappointed in the congressman's performance on Thursday. I was out today covering the story in Modesto and folks were coming up to me, shaking my hand. And the overwhelming majority of the folks, at least who came up to me, said that they were highly disappointed.

BLITZER: You know, Colleen, you were the first group of reporters that interviewed him for "People" magazine. Did you get a sense at that first interview, and you've looked at all the others since then, that somehow he changed his tone during the course of those two or three days that he was doing this media campaign?

COLLEEN O'CONNOR, "PEOPLE" MAGAZINE: Well, you know, Wolf, it was interesting that when we first talked to him, many of the same phrases that he used with us, he used repeatedly in the next few days. What was different, I think, is that he began to see in the middle of this barrage. that he was losing ground.

So he began talking about the media a little more towards the -- particularly after the Connie Chung interview. But my sense is that the lines about being married 34 years, being perfect man were things he meant to say, wanted to say, and thought somehow by saying would put an end to the questions.

BLITZER: As if he thought that repeating that one standard line would all of his solve problems. Clearly, they did not. At the same time though, and I want to get back to you, Judy in Los Angeles. In the last interview he gave to "Newsweek" magazine, he seems be going on the offensive on this one point of, in effect, some of the reporters like Connie Chung, he thought, badgering him on this whole issue of the sexual relationship between himself supposedly and Chandra Levy.

In the "Newsweek" magazine he says -- interview he says, "The press has made this into a soapbox scandal to keep their ratings up. I sat there the whole time waiting for Connie Chung to ask me something other than a sex question."

Is that line of attack though, going over the news media, likely to achieve any productive results for him?

BACHRACH: It's not going to be -- achieve productive results, but he is not wrong. There have been a lot of press mistakes along the way, which I intend to cover in my article. And among them, one of them occurred in "The Washington Post," where he seems to have been accused of having an affair with the minister's daughter.

He claims he never met her or the minister himself. And he's very, very angry about that. "The Post" ultimately allowed the FBI to have a say. And the FBI said that there was no proof that this affair took place. They didn't believe the guy. The guy had retracted his statement.

So when you start going with items that are very poorly sourced, there is problem. There's no doubt the congressman hasn't been honest. And there is no doubt the press is at fault. Both parties are at fault.

BLITZER: And Jodi, I want to bring you back in. When you interviewed him, and we of course ran that interview on this program last Friday night, your interview with Congressman Condit, he basically went on the offensive against you, not only you, but all of us in the news media.

I want you to listen. I want our viewers to listen, what he said when you pressed him on this issue. Listen to this, whether he should apologize to his constituents.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. GARY CONDIT (D), CALIFORNIA: I think you have take some responsibility in the media for all the misinformation that you guys have put out there when you jumped to innuendoes and unnamed sources, you have to take some responsibility. And actually, I would like to see you guys apologize to the people for doing that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: So far, Jodi he has not apologized to anyone in the district or to the Levy family, which is generating a lot of commotion out there.

HERNANDEZ: That's right. And we hear over and over again from folks out here that they want to hear the congressman apologize. That's why I gave him that opportunity during my interview to do that. Again, he turned the tables and said the media was the one that should apologize. Not to say that's probably the one moment we really -- I really felt he was being genuine. He lashed out. He was clearly angry and he said that with great feeling.

BLITZER: Colleen, did he give you any sense at al that he was repentant, that he had made mistakes, serious mistakes as far as his cooperation with the police or his dealing with the Levy family?

O'CONNOR: Oh, over and over again, when we would ask him if he had feelings of remorse, he'd say, "I feel sorry that Chandra Levy is missing and I feel sorry for the family."

In terms of his personal remorse, he did not answer that. And in terms of his cooperation, he repeated, reiterated with us what he said to other outlets, which is that he cooperated with the police, and that the media was not the place that he was going to take his next line of defense.

BLITZER: And you had an opportunity Colleen, to spend time not only with Gary Condit, with his wife, his two children. Chad Condit is going to be on "LARRY KING LIVE" later tonight. What is the nature of this relationship? They've been married for 34 years, but talk to us briefly about what you assess this relationship to be.

O'CONNOR: We did. We were -- when the congressman arrived, he came with his wife and his two children. They're very cordial. I had a sense that there wasn't hostility. Mrs. Condit seemed rather fragile, unaccustomed had to this kind of attention. Mr. Condit was soft-spoken. He was not impolite. He was just terse. And it was not a pleasant experience for either one of them, we could tell.

But clearly, there was a sense between them of some silent communication. And I think that the fact that our picture, our cover picture of two of them standing together is -- says something about where this story is, where...

BLITZER: She was on the cover of "People" magazine. She's literally standing by her man. A lot of people noticed that. But Judy Bachrach of "Vanity Fair," let's talk about the relationship that existed between Gary Condit and Anne Marie Smith, the flight attendant, which is the subject.

Of course, the news today, you heard from Bob Franken, the lawyer for Anne Marie Smith suggesting they're going to seek some sort of legal venue before a grand jury to indict Gary Condit. In the "Newsweek" magazine interview, the last interview Condit gave, he said this, "Condit was positively," according to "Newsweek," Clintonesque about Anne Marie Smith. In my opinion," he said, "we did not have a relationship. It would probably be her definition of a relationship versus mine."

She says they had a nearly one year affair going on. What is he talking about here?

BACHRACH: Well, clearly, he seems to be a little bit cute here. He's drawing a distinction between a relationship and affair. Relationship apparently being emotionally closer. However when I used the word affair, he didn't deny it once. So I didn't use the word relationship. However, I do want to say something about Anne Marie Smith. There has been a consistent pattern on the part, not only of Condit, but at least one of his advisers to trash Anne Marie Smith.

And very early on, I was told by one of them that she would soon be appearing in "Playboy" magazine. She was that anxious for publicity. He was obviously being sardonic when he said that to me, but the pattern is to trash an old girlfriend for no good reason. And it's very foolhardy, as we have seen.

BLITZER: And very briefly, I want to go -- with each of you, very, very briefly, did you get any suspicion whatsoever in your eyeball to eyeball meeting with Gary Condit that he possibly could have been involved in disappearance of Chandra Levy?

First to you, Judy.

BACHRACH: Well I never did and still actually do not. Whatever is going on here, these seem to be the lies and evasions of a man who feels very guilty, the son of a minister. I don't think he's involved in anything else. However, I'm not in the know about his deepest, darkest secrets. I must say that.

BLITZER: And Jodi, you too, you agree?

HERNANDEZ: I really couldn't say. I didn't get any indication. Again, everything seemed so rehearsed that you know, I really couldn't say.

BLITZER: All right. Colleen, yes or no? What do you know?

O'CONNOR: No, we were not there to look as this investigation. We had no sense from him of where he stands with regard to this alleged crime.

BLITZER: Colleen O'Connor, Judy Bachrach and Jodi Hernandez, thanks so much to all three of you for joining us.

And as Gary Condit's troubles mount, what's the final straw in a political scandal? Some politicians have gotten past the breaking point, but others have not. And a California brush fire is racing toward some very expensive homes. Can firefighters keep up the pace? Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. When Congressman Gary Condit finally broke his silence last week, the response could hardly have been any worse. The criticism was widespread. But most damaging perhaps, for Condit's political career, was the reaction from the House Democratic leader Dick Gephardt, who says Condit's credibility has been damaged.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) REP. RICHARD GEPHARDT (D-MO), MINORITY LEADER: I must tell you I was disappointed by his statement. I think not being candid and straightforward was disturbing and wrong.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: In the world of political scandals, there seem to be certain rules. While Condit's future is impossible to predict, Gephardt carries a lot of weight. What does it take for a politician to get to the breaking point?

CNN congressional correspondent Kate Snow reports on what it takes for a politician to get to that point.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD NIXON, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I shall resign presidency effective at noon tomorrow.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KATE SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): His was a scandal to beat all, after months of fighting charges, the end came at a dizzying pace. The House Judiciary Committee voted to impeach Nixon. And allies in Congress were jumping ship. On August 8, 1974, the President reached the breaking point.

NIXON: It has become evident to me that I no longer have a strong enough political base in the Congress.

SNOW: Ray Price helped write that speech. He says Nixon saw the writing on wall.

RAY PRICE, FORMER NIXON AIDE: It was July 24 out in California that he really began seriously to think he was likely to lose the battle in Congress and began to think that a resignation might be necessary.

SNOW: It's impossible to generalize about political scandals. President Nixon's story is unlike any other, even the most recent case of presidential impeachment, but there are strong parallels. In almost every case in recent decades, there is one deciding moment.

JULIAN EPSTEIN, FORMER DEMOCRATIC COUNSEL, HOUSE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: There is certainly a turning point. There is an event which precipitates a kind of a cataclysm, a chorus of members, public officials from the member's own party. And at that point, that's when the dye get cast.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BOB PACKWOOD (R). OREGON: So I now announce that I will resign from the Senate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SNOW: Senator Bob Packwood reached that point in September, 1995. After a lengthy investigation into sexual misconduct charges, his colleagues were poised to force him out office.

SEN. BARBARA BOXER (D), CALIFORNIA: If he does not resign, the chances are, he will be expelled.

SNOW: In recent years, with more scandals going public and more news outlets to cover them, calculating the breaking point is more complicated.

EPSTEIN: It began to depend on how serious the misconduct was, how the person actually dealt with it once it was revealed how forthright they were, how much goodwill there is for that person in the district and the general environment.

SNOW: Bob Livingston was about to become Speaker of the House just before the Clinton impeachment trial, when his adulterous past came roaring back too haunt him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. BOB LIVINGSTON (R), LOUISIANA: I shall vacate my seat and ask my governor to call a special election to take my place.

SNOW: Other politicians have made a different calculation.

REP. BARNEY FRANK (D), MASSACHUSETTS: Again, I regret very much, the inappropriate actions I've taken.

SNOW: In 1989, Barney Frank confessed to hiring a male prostitute as his personal valet. It worked. He's still in Congress. Six years earlier, Gary Studds was censured by the House for having sex with a teenage male congressional page. He too survived, serving another 12 years.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Beam me up.

SNOW: And one of the most eccentric Democrats in the House is still going strong, despite a criminal indictment.

(on camera): Some politicians reached edge of the cliff and avoid the fall. Political observers say Gary Condit hasn't fallen yet, but he may be on the brink.

Kate Snow, CNN, Capitol Hill.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: And up next, flames threaten another community tonight. I'll have the latest on efforts to battle this wildfire. And they've been coming forward all over the country today. We'll introduce you to the people who picked the right Powerball numbers. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BLITZER: Welcome back. A dramatic brush fire in California tops our look at other stories tonight. The fast-moving flames are threatening homes in northern Los Angeles County. At least one structure has already been destroyed. More than 200 firefighters are on the scene, most of them struggling to protect homes closest to the flames.

A new Congressional Budget Office report says the government will need to take $9 billion from Social Security funds this year to pay its bills. That report contradicts more optimistic White House projections. The White House Office of Management and Budget predicts a $1 billion non-Social Security surplus for the year. If so, President Bush and members of Congress could keep their promise not to tap into Social Security.

Pentagon sources tell CNN an unmanned U.S. reconnaissance plane was lost over Iraq's southern no-fly zone, and may have been shot down, as Iraq claims. You're looking at pictures of Iraqi TV, showing possible debris from the plane. The small plane costs more than $3 million, and is called the "Predator."

A lucky afternoon for the pilots of this plane near Fort Worth, Texas. Look closely and you'll notice it has no landing gear. The pilot, however, was able to finesse the single engine Cessna and pulled off a perfect belly landing. Very nice.

An unemployed, ex-convict from Kentucky has stepped forward to claim his share of the $295 million Powerball jackpot. He's one of four winners. They each get more than $41 million if they take lump- sum payment. Two other winners came forward today, including a medical-records clerk from Minneapolis, Minnesota and a bank employee from Portland, Maine. No word on who was the fourth winning ticket, but it was sold in Delaware.

Up next, I'll open our mailbag. One of you says we in the national news media covering the Chandra Levy-Gary Condit story are like a bunch of chickens. I'll tell you why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. Time now to open our mailbag. The Condit interviews generated lots of reaction.

Greg from Toronto, Ontario writes this, "I've watched both interviews and all I can is that this is a classic case of a congressman desperately trying to keep his job. It must have some amazing courage to put oneself in a position where you look like a totally pathetic jerk."

Rowena from Massachusetts writes, "Abbe Lowell is supposed to have an excellent reputation, but unfortunately Abbe has a terrible client in Gary Condit. This client is tarnishing even Lowell's halo, making Lowell look incompetent and worse."

But Tom from Kansas has a different point of view. "I congratulate you and your colleagues in the media for achieving an all-time low for badgering Gary Condit. The people in the media remind me of a bunch of barnyard chickens. If one chicken gets a speck of blood on his/her rear end, the rest will pick at him/her until they kill him/her."

Remember, I want to hear from you. Please e-mail me at Wolf@cnn.com. And you can read my daily online column and sign up for my e-mail previewing our nightly programs. Just go to my web site: www.cnn.com/wolf.

And that's all the time we have tonight. Please stay with CNN throughout the night. Larry King has an exclusive interview with Gary Condit's son, Chad at the top of the hour. Tomorrow night inside a manhunt, we'll focus on search for Nikolay Soltys, who's suspected in killing his pregnant wife, his three-year-old son and four other relatives.

Until then, thanks very much for watching. I'm Wolf Blitzer on Capitol Hill. "THE POINT WITH GRETA VAN SUSTEREN" begins right now.

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