Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports

Military Options

Aired September 22, 2001 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS: military options. Afghanistan's Taliban claim a military success saying they shot down an unman spy plane, but they've suffered a diplomatic setback losing one of their few links to the outside world. We'll go live to the Pentagon and the State Department.

The U.S. is trying to improve its own ties in Afghanistan's neighborhood. Will the former Soviet states help with the war on terrorism? As President Bush speaks with Russia's President Putin, we'll go live to the White House, and we'll have more of my interview with the tough talking number-two man at the State Department, Richard Armitage.

Will the American public stay the course if casualties start to mount? CNN's Bill Schneider assesses the country's mood as American weighs its military options.

Good evening, I'm Wolf Blitzer reporting tonight from Washington. We'll turn to our focus on the military options in just a moment, but first here are the latest developments in America's new war.

New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani says the best thing all Americans can do in this time of crisis is to get back to normal. In his words -- quote -- "Stop being afraid. Go out and do the things you normally do".

In the international search for terrorists, "TIME" magazine reports U.S. authorities have found a manual on the operation of crop dusting equipment in a suspected terrorist hideout, and that raises concerns about possible biological and chemical attacks.

As far those behind the attacks on New York and Washington, the U.S. State Department is offering a reward of up to $25 million for their capture. It's part of a multibillion-dollar recovery package approved by Congress and the White House.

Planning for what he's vowed will be an all-out war on terrorism, President Bush today met with his national security team in a video conference from Camp David. For details, let's go live now to our senior White House correspondent, John King -- John.

JOHN KING, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Good evening to you, Wolf. That's right, the president away from the White House, but still a very busy day up at the Camp David presidential retreat. As you noted, the president using the latest in U.S. military technology -- a high-tech video conference with his national security team, a secure video conference.

Condoleezza Rice, the national security adviser and Andy Card, the White House chief of staff, as well as the CIA Director, George Tenet up at Camp David with the president, the defense secretary, the secretary of state and the military brass participating from locations elsewhere. It was described by one senior official to CNN as -- quote -- "An intensive planning meeting, not a decision meeting". But that, again, as the president narrows and mulls his military options, he also was, we are told, briefed, updated on the deployment of military assets overseas.

Mr. Bush also is preparing to sign an executive order that would freeze assets of terrorist groups, freezing assets not already covered by other federal policies. This document, we are told, is being reviewed by the White House legal counsel, and the president will sign it in the next several days. He also will share that information, we are told, with other international governments, asking them to check into their banking system, crack down on these assets as well.

And Wolf, the president spoke for 45 minutes to an hour today with the Russian President Vladimir Putin -- this part of the president's international coalition building, sources telling CNN the Russians, along with the Pakistan government, providing the most valuable intelligence information to the U.S. government so far.

So Mr. Bush, up at Camp David, also took some time to focus on the U.S. economy, but much of his attention dedicated to the intensifying military planning -- Wolf.

BLITZER: John, there was a symbolic gesture at the White House at sunset this evening about an hour or so ago. Tell our viewers what happened.

KING: I believe we can show our viewers as well. There was a proclamation signed by the president in the wake of the tragedy of September 11th, ordering flags at all federal buildings brought down to half staff. Exactly one hour ago, that proclamation expired. Some said today -- you see there, right there, the flag going up.

That is over the center of the White House, above the mansion of the White House residence. Aides later moved to raise flags elsewhere around the White House complex back to the full staff -- this -- the symbolism of this part of the president's effort and what you touched on at the beginning of this show, Mayor Giuliani's effort and other political leaders to urge people to get back to business. Tomorrow morning up at Camp David, the president will participate in a ceremony marking that as well, raising the flag himself, Wolf.

BLITZER: John King at the White House. Thank you very much.

Meanwhile, Afghanistan's ruling Taliban claim they have shot down an unmanned spy plane. CNN military affairs correspondent, Jamie McIntyre joins us now live from the Pentagon. Are they -- are they right, Jamie? Did they shoot down an unmanned spy plane? JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN MILITARY AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well it appears they might have shot one down. The question is whose unmanned spy plane is it. The Pentagon is refusing all comments, saying that they are not going to respond to every claim from the Taliban, and warning us not to believe everything the Taliban says.

Nevertheless, sources are indicating to CNN that the unmanned spy drone or unmanned aerial vehicle, as it's called, may have been providing intelligence for the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency -- two sources indicating that. The CIA contacted by CNN tonight, again, taking the same line as the Pentagon, refusing to give any comment at all about operational procedures or whether or not this UAV was in any way connected to U.S. intelligence gathering efforts. But it does appear, according to two sources, that the CIA was, if not operating the UAV, at least benefiting from some of the intelligence.

Meanwhile, today the Pentagon called up another 5,000 National Guard and reservists. Many of these are to help the so-called air bridge refueling operations, flying gas stations in the sky that help U.S. planes deploying to -- at the Persian Gulf and Central Asia region and Pentagon officials also finally confirming today that B-52s that took off from Barksdale, Louisiana last night were, in fact, deploying in support of President Bush's initiative against terrorism.

But a very tight rein is being held on information here at the Pentagon and a second deployment order that's supposed to put more planes in motion is yet to be signed off by Defense Secretary Rumsfeld according to Pentagon sources -- Wolf.

BLITZER: And Jamie, briefly tell us why the decision of the government of Turkey to allow the U.S. to use some of its facilities is significant in this new war.

MCINTYRE: Well it certainly gives the United States another base of operation. Turkey is a NATO ally and of course NATO as an organization has invoked the clause in its charter saying the attack against any of the members is an attack against the organization as a whole. The U.S. already has a base in northern Turkey or rather there's a Turkish base where the U.S. operates out of at Incerlik.

But having over flight rights and having the full support of Turkey just gives the United States more options for moving -- for moving troops around and also for pre-deploying or pre-positioning planes and troops at bases closer to Afghanistan -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Jamie McIntyre at the Pentagon. Thank you once again.

President Bush says the campaign against terrorism will take many forms and there was a defeat for Afghanistan's Taliban today on the diplomatic front. Let's go live to the CNN State Department correspondent Andrea Koppel for details -- Andrea.

ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN STATE DEPARTMENT CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, as of today, there is one less country in the world that recognizes the Taliban as Afghanistan's legitimate government.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KOPPEL (voice-over): News the United Arab Emirates has cut its ties with the Taliban, another indicator the diplomatic noose is tightening. Now only two countries, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, recognize Afghanistan's de facto government. On Saturday, Pakistan defended its decision to keep the Taliban's embassy in Islamabad open.

RIAZ KHAN, PAKISTAN FOREIGN MINISTRY SPOKESMAN: This embassy has served as a useful window for the Taliban with the rest of the world.

KOPPEL: But Pakistan has been unable to convince the Taliban to hand over Osama bin Laden and his associates, and now the United States wants that window shut.

However, the Bush administration is encouraged. Pakistan's president says he's ready to support the war against terrorism, including possible U.S. military operations in Afghanistan.

PRINCE SAUD AL-FAISAL, SAUDI FOREIGN MINISTER: There have many efforts to persuade them in the past by Saudi Arabia that have not achieved the results.

KOPPEL: Saudi Arabia, too, says it wants the Taliban to turn over bin Laden and has downgraded diplomatic ties. In a meeting with President Bush last week, the foreign minister pledged his government's full support vowing to share intelligence and shut down the flow of cash to bin Laden's operation.

But some doubt the Saudis have the political will to follow through.

JAMES STEINBERG, FORMER DEPUTY NATIONAL SECURITY ADV.: There are some of the wealthy individuals in Saudi Arabia who are providing funds to support bin Laden and the Taliban. So they do have to walk a fine line.

KOPPEL: The U.S. has hundreds of war planes and a command and control center in the country, and the U.S. is counting on at least tacit Saudi support to use them in any military campaign. Publicly the Saudis are keeping mum, but administration officials tell CNN the U.S. has not asked permission either.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is more of a political issue than it is a military issue. Of course, that's a great command center there. It's relatively new and it would be very useful, but there are other ways to command and control the forces.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOPPEL: The question, say some, is just how hard to push the Saudis to cooperate. The Bush administration understands all too well that for the Saudi ruling family it is a delicate balance between on the one hand, openly siding with the U.S. a key ally and on the other, further provoking bin Laden and his followers.

Remember, Wolf, that bin Laden's holy war began because of the U.S. military presence in Saudi Arabia.

BLITZER: Andrea, what's the likely U.S. reaction if individual Saudis are allowed to continue to make financial contributions to al Qaeda, the Osama bin Laden organization?

KOPPEL: Well, you've really put your finger on what is perhaps among the most sensitive questions that folks in this building over in the White House and elsewhere just don't want to answer Wolf. But if the president really meant what he said that either you're with us or you're against us, that is going to put the Saudis on the hot seat.

BLITZER: Andrea Koppel, once again at the State Department. Thank you very much.

And he dealt with counter-terror, the Middle East and special operations as an assistant secretary of defense. Now he holds the number two post at the State Department and has been involved in building a coalition against terrorism.

I sat down with Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage yesterday shortly after his return from talks at Russia. Tonight, part two of that interview.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: You just have come back from Moscow. How serious is this Russian support for what the U.S. is trying to do?

RICHARD ARMITAGE, DEPUTY SECRETARY OF STATE: Well, the Russians issued a statement as I was leaving Moscow saying that as a result of our talks, they would render all possible support. The Russians have 20 percent of their population who are Muslim. They've got a large border with the Stans. They're very concerned about the phenomenon and the spread of terrorism, and I think they're going to be quite cooperative with us in trying to stop it.

BLITZER: For our viewers who may not know, the Stans are Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan -- all of the so-called Stans, the countries of central Asia, some of which border Afghanistan. Are you -- are you on board with some of those countries? For example, Uzbekistan, to use some facilities there as potential staging points?

ARMITAGE: Well, I'm not going to get into that. We have relationships with all those countries. We have good relationships. I'm not going to discuss publicly where we may or may not stage from.

BLITZER: But are the Russians -- are the Russian governed in Moscow supporting any initiative that the United States may have in working closely with some of those countries like Uzbekistan?

ARMITAGE: We have shared a lot of our plans, not all of them, with the Russian federation and they've, in return, shared some of their plans with us. We have activities regarding the Northern Alliance, which is fighting the Taliban.

They do some things. We do some things and so there's a fair amount of cooperation.

BLITZER: And you would expect it to continue, although I guess you would acknowledge that if in fact the U.S. were to launch major strikes against Iraq, then all bets are off as far as Russian cooperation is concerned.

ARMITAGE: Well I think if we were to launch major strikes against Iraq, then holding this great coalition, which the president has worked so hard to fashion -- holding it together may be a little more difficult. I think that we'll keep our eye on Afghanistan in the first instance, and then, laterally as the president said, we'll chase terrorists and these terrorist cells to wherever they ultimately may be.

BLITZER: You noticed that the president in his speech Thursday night referred to what Egyptian, Islamic Jihad, obviously a threat to the Egyptian government, the Islamic movement in Uzbekistan and he referred, of course to al Qaeda in Afghanistan and elsewhere.

Why didn't he mention some of the other terrorist organizations out there that have links to Iraq specifically or Iran or Syria?

ARMITAGE: Well I think only for the amount of time he had, he was getting a lot of ideas over the American public. But there's no reticence to the administration to mention Hezbollah and Hamas as well, and I'm sure that's to what you -- those are the organizations to which you were referring.

BLITZER: Well that means -- those organizations are clearly supported, if not sponsored and certainly harbored by governments like Syria and certainly Iran. Does that mean that Syria and Iran potentially are targets of this new U.S. war against terrorism?

ARMITAGE: Well Mr. Blitzer, in the first instance, it means they're going to have to make a decision. Are they going to support terrorism or not and then we'll see where we take it from there.

BLITZER: A blunt warning. Let me ask you about your own personal background. You were -- served four tours in Vietnam. A lot of people are looking at the terrain in Afghanistan and they're wondering this, is the United States about to get sucked into another Vietnam like quagmire (ph).

ARMITAGE: I think the United States has made it quite clear and we'll continue to make it clear, we've no desire to stay in and occupy Afghanistan. This is not our wish. We're going to do what we need to do and then leave.

So I think we've learned a lot from history. I think we're wiser. We at least know the questions to ask before embarking on military activities. So I think we're not going to get dragged down into a quagmire (ph).

BLITZER: I'm sure you've seen some of the videotape that the Osama bin Laden's al Qaeda organization has released in part and some of it taken -- videotape of individuals preparing for action against the United States, against the West.

How serious of a military threat is this organization?

ARMITAGE: I think that's something that you ought to refer to the Pentagon for an answer. I think they have certain capabilities. On the low end they could be dedicated fighters. We have great capabilities and if we -- if it comes to military action, then we'll acquit ourselves quite well. I don't think there's any doubt of it.

BLITZER: Is the -- should the American public be prepared for the long haul in this new war?

ARMITAGE: The president has made it very clear this is going to be a long campaign and terrorism has a great reach and has many tentacles and the president is intent on slicing off these tentacles wherever they may be.

BLITZER: I want to thank you very much, Richard Armitage, the Deputy Secretary State for joining us.

ARMITAGE: Thank you Mr. Blitzer.

BLITZER: Thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: And in just a moment, President Bush says he's preparing for a new kind of war. Is the American public ready for the consequences?

And when they enlisted in the Army, some joined for the benefits believing they'd never see combat, but now duty calls.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Welcome back. Never before has the United States faced what is virtually an invisible enemy. Right now Americans buy in large support the campaign against terrorism, but for how long.

Joining me now is senior political analyst Bill Schneider -- Bill.

BILL SCHNEIDER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well you know Americans are suppose to have zero tolerance for U.S. fatalities.

Remember Somalia? When Americans start killing killed, the American public is ready to pack up and go home. Is that true? Was it ever true?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SCHNEIDER (voice-over): Americans are certainly sensitive to U.S. casualties. One scholar even worked out a mathematical formula. Every time American casualties increased by a factor of 10 in Korea and Vietnam, public support for the war dropped by about 15 percentage points.

In Somalia, the image of 18 American Rangers killed in one day set off a wave of public anger. In recent engagements, the U.S. has been super cautious. Not a single American was killed by hostile fire in Haiti, Bosnia, or Kosovo.

This time the message is different.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It will not look like the air war above Kosovo two years ago where no ground troops were used and not a single American was lost in combat.

SCHNEIDER: Polls indicate Americans are willing to endure losses. Why is it different this time? In Korea and Vietnam and the Gulf War and Somalia and Kosovo and the Cold War, nobody attacked the U.S.

This time they did. As many as 6,000 American civilians may have lost their lives. So American resolve is a lot stronger.

BUSH: Our response involves far more than instant retaliation and isolated strikes. Americans should not expect one battle, but a lengthy campaign.

SCHNEIDER: Polls show Americans are willing to wait for years this time. Why? Because the U.S. was attacked. President Bush's biggest problem will be to convince Americans to fight a political war. Americans traditionally do not want to get involved in other countries' politics.

That was the problem in Vietnam where the U.S. was fighting to win people's hearts and minds. And in Somalia, where politics was a major cause of the famine. The message now ...

COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: We have a variety of means at our disposal -- they are political, diplomatic, international.

DONALD RUMSFELD, DEFENSE SECRETARY: The effort will be political. It will be diplomatic. It will be economic.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHNEIDER: How does the U.S. avoid politics when our objective is not simply to defeat other countries, but to persuade them to share our values and cooperate with us. For Americans to accept that kind of open-ended political strategy is going to be the toughest test of all -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Bill, there's a new poll that's coming out in a new issue of "Newsweek". Let's put up on the screen some of the numbers -- President Bush's job approval rating. Look at this, 86 percent of the American public approve of the job he's doing right now. Only 10 percent disapprove. That's a significant number obviously.

SCHNEIDER: It is -- it is very close to his father's record at the end of the Gulf War. His father had a 90 percent approval rating. Well I think -- remember his father was criticized for not having the vision thing. It's pretty clear that this President Bush, George W. Bush, has found a vision.

It's leading the fight for freedom over fear, and it's bringing him popular acclaim in a way that his compassionate conservative agenda never really did. And that's got some conservatives very nervous. It's animating his administration. He's telling his cabinet this is more important than any other policy, more important than the conservative agenda.

And in a way, in his speech, he saw it as a generational thing. His father was part of the greatest generation, as it's called. But he said, in his speech, "now our generation has met our mission and our moment". A generation, the baby boomers, that was famous for being self absorbed, but he sees this as meeting a generational challenge and measuring up to his own father.

BLITZER: Very often, though, Americans simply vote their pocketbook. There's -- that's a factor in these poll numbers right now though.

SCHNEIDER: It is and it was, of course, a factor in his father's downfall. The Gulf War was concluded very quickly. The economy went sour and people sort of forgot the 90-percent approval and he went down into the 30s and lost the election.

It will be different, I predict, for this President Bush. The simple reason is you know how the democrats have been calling this the Bush economy when it started to slow down. Well it's not the Bush economy anymore. Now it's the Osama bin Laden economy, and this war is not going to be over very quickly. So the result is I think Bush is going to have a lot of breathing space on the economy that his father didn't have.

BLITZER: So if there's -- if there's a recession, they'll blame Osama. They won't President Bush.

Bill Schneider, thanks for joining us.

SCHNEIDER: Sure.

BLITZER: And coming up, when they enlisted, joining the Army was a way to earn money for college. Learn a trade or care for their families, but now many are surprised by the call to duty.

More on that in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BITZER: Welcome back.

When they joined the U.S. Army they enlisted for a variety of reasons, but the combat infantry badge may not have been high on that list.

CNN's Brian Cabell has this report from Fort Campbell, Kentucky. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's a proud moment for specialist Yvonne Caldwell. She earned her air assault wings after a grueling two-week course with 100 of her comrades that culminated in a timed 12-mile march with full packs on their backs.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right, let's bring it in. Bring it in. Let's go.

CABELL: Specialist Caldwell is proud, and yet now in just the last 11 days or so, her vision of her future has changed.

You see, she didn't join the Army to go to war. It was something else.

SPECIALIST YVONNE CALDWELL, 101ST AIRBORNE DIVISION: It's a benefit -- the college and to see different places and everything.

CABELL: She and the other soldiers in the 101st Airborne Division at Fort Campbell may be seeing different places very soon. The 101st generally deploys early in war time.

Specialist Caldwell wasn't alone in her expectations, although many soldiers here will tell you they joined the Army for patriotic reasons, at least as many will concede it was the benefits.

SGT. KEVIN TATUM, 101ST AIRBORNE DIVISION: Mainly for college money. I had two years of junior college and I wanted to continue my education.

PVT. ZACHARY DILLON, 101ST AIRBORNE DIVISION: Better benefits for my family and I -- and stable work environment and a good, you know, a good trade.

CABELL: They've acquired skills, there's no doubt about that. They can now repel out of a helicopter hovering 90 feet above the ground. They can push their bodies to their physical limits. They've acquired a self confidence that perhaps they never had.

But very soon now, they may be using those skills and that confidence in a far away land under hostile conditions. Not what Specialist Caldwell and her fellow soldiers at the 101st expected.

CALDWELL: At this point, my job is to defend my country, and I have two years left to do that. And that's what I'm paid to do and that's what I plan on doing.

CABELL (on camera): But you'd prefer to have it in a more quiet environment?

CALDWELL: Yeah, pretty much.

CABELL (voice-over): She's a soldier, and that's in peace time or war time, here at home or overseas. And now she's a soldier with air assault wings. Brian Cabell, CNN, Fort Campbell, Kentucky.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: Let's check the latest developments in this country's war on terrorism. The U.S. military march toward readiness is more evident today with additional reserves and National Guard troops called up. The Pentagon announced it has now activated 5,000 more guard and reserve troops.

That brings the total number to a little more than 10,300. Also, Hollywood pulled its troops together last night in an unique fund raising telethon to benefit survivors of the victims of the terrorist attacks. Many of the nation's top musical performers and stars took part drawing nearly -- get this, 60 million U.S. viewers.

And that's all the time we have tonight. Join me tomorrow at noon Eastern for a special extended "LATE EDITION" where my guests will include the National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, Senator John McCain, and New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani.

And I'll see you tomorrow night at 8:00 p.m. for more coverage of America's military options.

And this important programming note -- beginning Monday, join me one hour earlier at our new starting time of 7:00 p.m. Eastern for a full hour.

Until then, thanks very much for watching. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. "THE POINT WITH GRETA VAN SUSTEREN" begins right now.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com