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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports
New Scare at the Capitol, More Suspicious Mail
Aired January 03, 2002 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JOHN KING, GUEST HOST: Now on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS: The legal fate for American Taliban fighter John Walker. And why have some imprisoned Taliban fighters been set free?
A new scare at the Capitol, more suspicious mail.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They found a letter that had a threatening note inside and a powdery substance inside of the letter.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: Another ongoing concern, security in the sky. Has it gone too far?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The only reason why he wasn't allowed on that plane was because, we believe and he believes, he is an American of Arab descent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: Today a Secret Service agent's side of the story.
Hello from Washington, where Capitol Hill made headlines today, even though Congress isn't in session. That story later. First, the latest developments.
U.S. warplanes have struck a compound in eastern Afghanistan, where al Qaeda fighters may have been regrouping. The attack occurred after dark. Earlier today, U.S. officials said the Afghan government had cautioned against attacking the base for fear of civilian casualties.
More than 200 Taliban fighters were freed today by the Afghan government as part of a pledge by the interim leader, Hamid Karzai, to offer amnesty to rank-and-file Taliban soldiers. The Pentagon says that Karzai shares the U.S. commitment to bring the Taliban leaders to justice.
Forces say Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is close to recommending that federal law enforcement take custody of John Walker. The Taliban fighter from northern California is being held on a U.S. warship with several other prisoners.
An aide says the Taliban's former ambassador to Pakistan has been detained by Pakistani intelligence agents. The aide says Abdul Salam Zaeef was taken from his home in Islamabad. From his post in the Pakistani capital, Zaeef was the Taliban's primary spokesman before the Pakistani muzzled him.
Here in Washington, the Capitol building was closed briefly today as officials inspected an envelope mailed to the Senate majority leader Tom Daschle. The envelope contained a threatening letter and some sort of powder. On-site tests determined the powder was harmless. And officials deemed the case a hoax.
The Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld cautioned today that the war on terrorism is far from over. In a briefing at the Pentagon, Rumsfeld disputed the notion that the Afghan mission has entered a mop-up phase. CNN's Bob Franken was at the briefing today. And, Bob, we've learned that the United States was back on the attack.
BOB FRANKEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's interesting, this was the briefing. And as usual, the secretary was accompanied by the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, General Richard Myers. And, you're right, even though there has been quite a lull in the bombing, we found out just a couple of hours after the run that a very important one had occurred.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEN. RICHARD MYERS, JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF CHMN.: I think, as has been reported already, we conducted strikes between 10 and 11:00 our time, in Afghanistan, on a leadership compound that was fairly extensive compound. It had a base camp, a training facility and some cave pieces to that. Fairly close to the Pakistani border, matter of fact. And that was the last strike in the last several days. It was conducted by B-1 bombers, by Navy F-18 aircraft and AC-130 gunships.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FRANKEN: This was not the first time this facility has been bombed. It was hit in November, last November, for one. But also, in 1998, the Clinton defense department launched two cruise missiles in an effort to get Osama bin Laden -- a failed effort, John, that I might add.
(AUDIO GAP)
KING: ... today, about a place known in the military as Gitmo (ph), and the preparations to deal with all the detainees in U.S. military custody?
FRANKEN: It's one of the exotic places in the United States military set-up. It is the one piece of land that is in Cuba, but it is a military base, we know all about that. And it is about to become a home, we are told now by the secretary of defense, about to become the home for some of the detainees, some of the most dangerous of the detainees who are being held. "Detainees" is the preferred word here. They are now being held in Afghanistan, where off the coast there is a very heavy push to get them to Guantanamo Bay as soon as the facility can be constructed. A very heavy push to do it as soon as possible and as safely as possible.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: They are very hard cases, for the most part. If you think of what happened in Mazar-e Sharif and the uprising in the prison, you think of the number of Pakistani soldiers that were killed. There have been three or four incidents where these folks have demonstrated their determination to kill themselves, kill others, and/or escape.
So it is important that the facilities be appropriate.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FRANKEN: And as matter of fact, John, the secretary said that whatever constraints were necessary in transit, or on the ground, whatever are necessary will be used.
KING: And, Bob, one of these detainees, obviously, gets more attention than the most, because he is an American citizen, John Walker. Any new information on how the administration, beginning with the defense secretary, has decided to handle the case of John Walker?
FRANKEN: We are being told by Pentagon sources that Secretary Rumsfeld is close to recommending that John Walker be turned over to civilian authorities, meaning the Justice Department. Almost any lawyer we've talked to says that that's a no-brainer. John Walker is a U.S. citizen. He would not get the same treatment.
Most of them say that somebody might, under the order from President Bush allowing for military tribunals for non-U.S. citizens. So most believe it as just perhaps a short time before Walker is turned over to the civil court system in the United States.
KING: Bob Franken at the Pentagon, thank you very much.
We want to talk a closer look now at the John Walker case. As you recall, Walker was captured at the end of that Taliban prison revolt in northern Afghanistan. CIA agent Mike Spann was killed in the uprising and had tried to interrogate Walker just before the revolt began.
Joining us now from New York, former federal prosecutor, Thomas Baer. Mr. Baer, you hear Bob Franken saying here that it appears the Pentagon will turn him over to the Justice Department, the traditional federal law enforcement. Obviously, he is not eligible for one of those secret military tribunals the president has authorized, because he is a U.S. citizen.
Could he, though, have been tried in any other form of military justice? And in what way would this be significant in your view, if he goes through the traditional federal court system? THOMAS BAER, FMR. ASST. U.S. ATTORNEY: Well, John, first of all, there is a substantial question as to whether or not he can so easily go into the civil system. You know, if you fight for an enemy of the United States, under the United States code, you renounce your citizenship. And if he has renounced his citizenship, then he could go before military tribunal.
However, obviously the decision seems to have been made, according the previous reporter, or about to be made, that he is going to go into the civil system. The question then would become, what charges will he have leveled against him?
KING: What, sir, do you think are the options? If you're not even sure there is proper jurisdiction over him, or that the administration at least could make the case there is no jurisdiction for him in this system, if he has renounced his citizenship? Under the patriot act, they could charge him with corroborating with terrorists -- is that the track you assume the administration will take?
BAER: Not necessarily. I think a great deal depends upon what the investigation into the death of that CIA agent shows. If, in fact, Walker was somehow involved in that death, obviously that's a much more serious matter. He could be charged with the most serious crime that can be leveled against an American citizen in the civil system, which is treason. Because under the United States Constitution, it's not necessary that war be declared against the Taliban to have treason. He has to have given, under the Constitution, aid and comfort to the enemy, and that's sufficient to ground a treason charge.
I wasn't suggesting that there was no chance that he could go into the other system. It's an option. The president has the option to determine whether they should argue that he has renounced his citizenship, or whether they should argue that he is a citizen, in which case the treason charge would lie in the civil system.
KING: How would is...
(CROSSTALK)
KING: Sorry, sir. How, as a prosecutor, do you handle the politics of this case? And the politics are both domestic and international. On the one hand, there are people in Congress who say John Walker is a traitor. He should be tried for treason, he should be subjected to capital punishment. At the same time, we understand, many in the administration recommend he should be charged with crimes that do not carry the death penalty.
Yet this administration might, at some point, seek extradition of other suspects from European nations, who say they don't want those people sent here if they would face the death penalty. How do you handle the politics in a case that will obviously receive so much attention?
BAER: First of all, it's not an extradition case, so the issue of cooperation by other countries does not apply. He is an American citizen. He does not have to be extradited. But there is a big political question. The question is, whether or not his mother's attitude that he was brainwashed, or some kind of a Patty Hearst defense would apply, referring to the heiress who was captured years ago by the Symbionese Liberation Army, involved in armed robberies, who defended on the basis that she didn't do it intentionally.
There is a lot of politics involved in this. I think a great deal depends on how it plays. The most effective way for a prosecutor to handle this would be to bring the indictment in the federal district court, in a district which is relatively safe, on the top count, which means treason, and then to see how this plays, to see what level of cooperation you get, and to see what kind of defense is mounted.
KING: All right, Thomas Baer, former federal prosecutor joining us today from New York on a very complicated case still developing, against American Taliban fighter, John Walker. Thank you very much, sir.
BAER: Thank you, John.
KING: Thank you. As we discussed earlier, the Afghan government freed a number of Taliban fighters today. It's an effort at reconciliation, and the United States insists it has no problem with it as long as the leaders are caught.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RUMSFELD: I know that the interim government is right on the same sheet of music with us, with respect to this. They want the Taliban caught, they agree with us. They want the al Qaeda the dickens out of their country.
KING (voice-over): Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld says the United States and Afghan governments both want top-level Taliban leaders to be caught. But for the rank and file, it's another story.
In Kabul today, some 250 Taliban detainees were released and allowed to return to their home villages and towns. This, as the interim government tries to heal the wounds of war. And in the Baghran district, north of Kandahar, negotiations are under way for the surrender of up to 2,000 other Taliban fighters. If the terms of that surrender follow the pattern set during the war, all but the most senior Taliban and al Qaeda fighters will likely be permitted to go free.
When the war began back in October, defense analysts estimated the Taliban had as many as 40- to 45,000 fighters under arms. Now the Taliban has been effectively destroyed as a fighting force. Up to 2,000 remain in Baghran. Fewer than 1,000 are said to be holed up in the Khowst district in eastern Afghanistan. And another 7,000 or so are under some form of detention by Afghan or coalition forces. That leaves perhaps as many as 35,000 Taliban fighters from the original force still unaccounted for.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
One the prisoners freed in Kabul today is quoted as saying he joined the Taliban only for practical reasons. The man told the reporter his only ambition at present is to return home and watch some TV.
Joining us now to talk about freeing these Taliban fighters, from Omaha, Nebraska, CNN Afghanistan analyst, Thomas Gouttierre. Thomas, good to see you, sir. A question: is this an issue here of domestic politics within Afghanistan, the new interim government trying to establish itself by freeing these Taliban fighters at a time, one would think, the United States military would prefer they be held a bit longer, so they are not out there returning to their homes during ongoing military operations?
THOMAS GOUTTIERRE, CNN AFGHANISTAN ANALYST: Well, I think that is it. The Afghans have long had this type of social political policy in these types of situations. You have to remember that the type of society that Afghanistan has always sought to minimize differences between tribes and groups, so that long-term feuds do not extend, kind of like the McCoys and Hatfields in the United States. So they have tribal kind of battles.
Now, this kind of situation that we're seeing right now is addressing that. We saw it, I think, first really come to attention, when Hamid Karzai indicated that he preferred to negotiate with the Taliban inside Kandahar, rather than to destroy the city of Kandahar. I think that was a very politically smart thing to do, because that helped to solidify him, make him more credible, and avoided the type of death and destruction which would have undermined his attempt to set policy for the future of Afghanistan.
I was pleased to hear what Secretary Rumsfeld said, that U.S. and the Afghan government are on the same page on this. I think we would have to be -- this would be very, I think, good for our future interests in Afghanistan.
KING: But at times, sir, such lines are designed for public consumption. Do you see potential conflict down the road? Already, we're hearing that the Karzai administration has urged the United States not to bomb targets, at least during the daytime, for fear of civilian casualties. As this transitional government asserts itself, could there be conflicts with the United States in the middle of a still sensitive, still ongoing military operation?
GOUTTIERRE: Well, I think there is a possibility for conflicts, because we might be seeing something different than the government of Afghanistan itself. And yet, we might still really have the same long-term objectives. And I think that a person like Hamid Karzai, who has a very difficult task now of trying to bring together a very disparate group of people in Afghanistan, who have not been together in a unified national government since the time of the king of Afghanistan, who was deposed in 1973, he sees this as a very difficult thing. He is trying to find ways to bring in reconciliation.
And we have to remember that most of these Taliban fighters, not the leadership, but the fighters themselves, are like that individual who was interviewed in Kabul, who said he did it for practical reasons. Most of them are doing that because they have no other forms of survival or employment. And we saw that their commitment to the Taliban was very, very shallow. As soon as the U.S. appeared in northern Afghanistan, they started peeling away very rapidly. And I think we'll see more and more of that.
KING: Quickly, sir, I wanted to ask a cultural question. They are being sent home to their towns. One would assume that the U.S. military, No. 1, and the new government, No. 2, would prefer that these former Taliban fighters not take up arms again. What is the likelihood that the new administration can convince people not to carry weapons openly, not to go back and build up weapons in their households?
GOUTTIERRE: I think the likelihood is quite good. Most of these people will go back to the rural areas, from whence they originally came, not to the urban areas where people collect for the possibility of carrying on some type of, you know, guerrilla warfare for the future.
I think if these individuals are offered the opportunities that all Afghans seek, in other words, chance for some education, employment, et cetera, their interest in this kind of religious extremism and the type of movement that has been the Taliban movement, will wane rapidly. And I think that that is all part of our general strategy, and certainly it's the strategy of the Karzai government.
So I think the chances, the opportunities there, are good for us. It's just now we need to move forward and to develop manpower training for people who have been on the gun. We need to wean them away from the gun, provide them with an opportunity to gain employment in something that may be much more constructive for their country, rather than destructive.
KING: One of the many challenges ahead during the reconstruction effort, just beginning. Thomas Gouttierre, joining us today from Omaha, Nebraska. Thank you very much, sir.
GOUTTIERRE: Good to be with you.
KING: More suspected al Qaeda fighters arrived today at the detention center in Kandahar, Afghanistan. The city was rocked by gunfire after some Taliban fighters were surrounded in an abandoned building. That, as the hunt for their leader, Mullah Mohammed Omar, intensifies. CNN's Bill Hemmer is in Kandahar and filed this report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILL HEMMER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: U.S. special forces members here on the ground in Kandahar confirm with CNN that groups of special forces are now operating in northern Helmand province, possibly, possibly on the hunt for Mullah Mohammed Omar, the elusive Taliban founder. We're told these special forces are working in groups of 12.
However, some, specifically some green berets here at the airport, indicated growing frustration. They say they're concerned that not enough forces are on the ground to find Mullah Mohammed Omar, and possibly he may slip the net, they say, as Osama bin Laden may have done in Tora Bora region several weeks ago.
On another front, we're constantly reminded about pockets of resistance here in Afghanistan. In central Kandahar late last night, four suspected Taliban troops, apparently sleeping in a building, when that building was surrounded by anti-Taliban forces. A firefight ensued and eventually it ended with all four being taken into custody. Right now they're being held in police headquarters and being questioned.
Back here at the airport, the list of detainees has grown again, 225 now, after 25 more were brought in last night from Pakistan. What's interesting right now, the division of the U.S. Army known as the CID, the criminal investigation division, on hand at the airport now to investigate the possibility of evidence that may be linked to some of these prisoners, investigated for possible terrorist activity, either aimed, planned or targeted at U.S. interests and citizens and the world. Again, the list of 225, some say they come from all over the world inside the detention facility.
On a final note, the U.S. Marines have honored one of their own today. At the far end of the runway here, the south end, you may remember back in early December, a corporal, C.T. Chandler, lost his left foot while looking for land mines here. Today the Marines honored him by naming the firing range after Corporal Chandler, who is right now recovering in a hospital in Washington, D.C.
Bill Hemmer, CNN reporting, Kandahar, Afghanistan.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: And Pentagon officials reminded us today that Afghanistan remains a very dangerous place. Among other dangers, these pockets of Taliban and al Qaeda resistance. Joining us now to talk about the mammoth job of trying to tame Afghanistan, CNN's security analyst, Kelly McCann.
Kelly, the special operations Bill Hemmer was just talking about, one of these missions alone, one mission alone, U.S. special forces behind 16,000 artillery rounds, 18,000 boxes of machine gun rounds, mortars, tank guns, rockets. How do you get rid of all this? And is it a concern to you that they're still finding this, even as all these rank and file Taliban are being sent back to their towns?
KELLY MCCANN, CEO, CRUCIBLE SECURITY: Sure, and it's going to be definite concern of the peacekeeping commander that has to manage this whole process. One of the two things that were never in short demand over there were poppy and also weapons. And that transcends this whole recent problem. Weapons have always been around, so has poppy.
So, the production of opium is going to be a concern. You have changing rules of engagement. I mean, now these guys are not finding a standard war. There are different and difficult rules of engagement. When can you engage when you see somebody? The pockets of 35,000 people left adrift in that country, and we can't believe all of those people are just returning home peacefully, and they were only marginally involved. Because, as you remember, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) notes himself, written from the cave, said, "escape, come back and do battle another day." So it is a very, very difficult job these guys are facing.
KING: Given that, do you take at face value, or do you suspect it's more complicated than what the defense secretary said today? He said he's fine with this, releasing these rank and file Taliban fighters, so long as the leaders are caught. But one would think that the U.S. military would have asked that they be held at least a bit longer.
MCCANN: Well, sure. I'm going to support the government, and I think they have proven over and over again that this is being done correctly. And the secretary has a lot of intelligence that most people don't have. However, there is always a difference between what the CEO says and what the business manager dealing with that day-to- day business has to deal with. The same as what the president says, and that Marine sergeant or Army sergeant, who has to employ these rules of engagement as they go through these communities.
So there will be great difficulties. I think the trick is to do it quickly, safeguard the NGOs an move on. I mean, let's go.
KING: So, what next? Your work includes training people who go into these environments as police forces. We have the experience of Bosnia and Kosovo, and in Macedonia, where after the peacekeeping troops go in, there are still incidents of trouble because forces remain armed. What happens now in Afghanistan, and do you think the new transitional government, which is just getting up and started, is it prepared to provide security, or will this fall to the international security force?
MCCANN: The next step would be the development of a credible police force, that is not prone to, you know, infractions against humanity and those kinds of things. And normally, there is an assistance program run through the Department of State to help them do that, and the Department of Justice. So I think that's the follow-on to less militarize the process, for an eventual exit strategy.
KING: And again, the cultural question I asked Thomas Gouttierre, do you see these folks being released and going home and simply saying I'm home, I'm not in the Taliban anymore? Or do you think they will try to reorganize in some ways, and if nothing else, take up arms?
MCCANN: I think in a large percentage, people there are like we are. We want to pay our car payments, we want to make our mortgage, we want to feed our kids, we want to make sure there's not sickness in the house. However, 90 percent of your problems are from 10 percent of the people. And I think that 10 percent of that 35,000 are going to be the ones we deal with.
KING: CNN security analyst Kelly McCann, thank you very much for your thoughts.
Another anthrax scare on Capitol Hill. Details next on today's threat. And find out why they raised the amount of reward money. Also ahead, how snow snarled traffic on the ground and in the air throughout the south.
And, the untimely end for Bill Clinton's Buddy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Police say a suspicious letter found today in Senate majority leader Tom Daschle's Capitol office was not contaminated with anthrax or anything else hazardous. The envelope contained a threatening note and some powder. Capitol police briefly closed off the area around Daschle's office. Police later said field tests confirmed the contents were not hazardous.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LT. DAN NICHOLS, U.S. CAPITOL POLICE: They found a letter that had a threatening note inside, and a powdery substance inside the litter. They conducted an analysis of the substance with biotickets. Both of those tickets came back negative. So while we don't know exactly what the substance is, what we do know is that substance is not hazardous.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: It was an anthrax-laced letter in Senator Daschle's office in the Hart Senate office building that has kept that building closed since October 17. The EPA reports it has completed 90 percent of the decontamination work there, but it isn't saying when the Hart building will reopen.
CNN has learned the government will almost double the reward for information that solved the anthrax case. Sources have told CNN national correspondent Susan Candiotti the reward is going up from $1.25 million to $2 million -- Susan.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hello, John. Yes, they're still waiting for the paperwork to go through. It hasn't happened yet, but this is one way, federal authorities hope, that it will spark renewed interest and public interest in trying to get their help to solve this unsolvable, so far, case.
Authorities still believe that someone out there knows something that will help them track down the anthrax killer. But so far, they have been unable to come up with the kinds of leads they need to get them there. Yes, they're still following leads, John. But nothing to get them close enough to find the killer. Leads that are even taking them overseas, as they to try track down additional information.
I think that if you -- if someone suggested, they are getting desperate, and that's why they are raising the funds, well, the FBI would take great issue with that. They're convinced they'll be able to get to the bottom of it, but so far they're not there yet. They're not close to getting there yet.
KING: There was some hope, if you will, when the letter to Senator Leahy was found, that the examination of that would help lead them to a suspect, because they believed that letter had not been contaminated by other people touching it and by being mishandled -- nothing from that?
CANDIOTTI: Not so far. Testing is still going on at the U.S. Army lab at Fort Detrick, Maryland. And they're still trying to find, as best they can, all kinds of genetic fingerprinting on the material, still breaking it down. But in terms of whether they have enough answers from that analysis to help them find the source of this, they're not there yet.
Of course, they still know that it's the Ames strain, and they know where it's been distributed. But they have thousands and thousands of leads to try to track down, and people to talk with, who might have had access to this, both here and overseas. And you can imagine how long that's going to take.
KING: Frustrating investigation. CNN national correspondent, Susan Candiotti, thank you.
And now checking some stories on our news wire: former Ku Klux Klansman Bobby Franks Cherry faces trial for the 1963 church bombing that killed four black girls in Birmingham. The judged ruled today that Cherry is mentally competent to stand trial for murder.
Opening statements began today in the case of a deadly fight between two so-called hockey dads. Earlier, the jury went to see the ice rink where the confrontation took place. Thomas Junta is charged with manslaughter in the death of Michael Costin. The prosecution says he repeatedly slammed Costin's head on the floor after an argument over body checking at a youth hockey practice. Junta's lawyer says his client was acting in self-defense.
The government has ended its investigation of New Jersey Senator Robert Torricelli, without filing any charges. Torricelli had been suspected of taking illegal gifts and cash from a campaign contributor. A federal prosecutor says the senator was cleared after investigations by her office, the FBI, the IRS and the U.S. Customs Service.
And update on today's developments in America's new war on terrorism is next. And, stimulating an economy in recession -- can the government still help? Also, lawyers for Arab-American Secret Service agent claim racial profiling caused their client's removal from an airplane. And, how the South got snowed under.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
Byline: Jeanne Meserve, Gary Tuchman, Jan Hopkins, Bruce Morton Guest: Martin Regalia, Steve Moore KING: In a moment: fresh information on the case of the Secret Service agent who may have been a target of racial profiling.
First, the latest developments in America's new war. U.S. warplanes have struck a compound in Eastern Afghanistan, where al Qaeda fighters may have been regrouping. The attack occurred after dark. Earlier today, U.S. officials said the Afghan government had cautioned against attacking the base for fear of civilian casualties.
More than 200 Taliban fighters were freed today by the Afghan government. It's part of a pledge by interim leader, Hamid Karzai, to offer amnesty to rank-and-file Taliban soldiers. The Pentagon says that Karzai shares the U.S. commitment to bringing the Taliban's leadership to justice.
Sources say Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is close to recommending that federal law enforcement take custody of John walker. The Taliban fighter from Northern California is being held on a U.S. warship along with several other prisoners.
Here in Washington, the Capitol Building was closed briefly today, as officials inspected an envelope mailed to Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle. The envelope contained a threatening letter and some sort of powder. On-site tests determined the powder was harmless. And officials deemed the case a hoax.
The Bush administration says widespread famine has been averted in Afghanistan. The U.S. Agency for International Development says more than 210,000 tons of food has been delivered to Afghanistan, enough to avoid a winter of hunger.
An attorney for an Arab-American Secret Service agent who was asked to leave a commercial flight is calling the incident a -- quote -- "pure and simple case of discrimination." In a news conference today, he didn't rule out the possibility of a civil lawsuit.
CNN's Jeanne Meserve is here and has the latest -- Jeanne.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John, CNN has learned that the pilot in this incident has now filed a complaint with the Secret Service about the agent involved.
In the complaint he says, he was -- quote -- "aghast" at the agent's personal conduct, saying the agent was confrontational, hostile and argumentative. He said, at this point, he had concerns about whether he was misrepresenting himself as a federal law enforcement official. This behavior, he says in the complaint, should be addressed before the agent interferes with another commercial flight crew and compromises safety.
But lawyers for the agent today gave their rendition of the story, a story which they say is all about race.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN RELMAN, AGENT'S ATTORNEY: Pure and simple, this is a case of discrimination.
MESERVE (voice-over): The Arab-American agent was trying to get to Crawford, Texas ahead of President Bush when he was removed from an American Airlines flight at Baltimore Washington International Airport for security reasons, despite his Secret Service credentials.
RELMAN: The pilot assumed, because of his appearance, that he was not a Secret Service agent. And everything proceeded from that ground, from that basis. And he was treated in a demeaning manner, as you have heard, a humiliating manner, a rude manner.
MESERVE: The attorneys say, during a delay of more than an hour, three different law enforcement officers verified the agent's identity. But the captain would not be satisfied and would not call the Secret Service directly.
The captain, in his account, says he was suspicious because paperwork filled out by the agent to carry his weapon on board was unreadable and missing items. But the agent's lawyers say the problem arose when the agent's first flight was canceled and he was sent to a different gate.
CHRISTY LOPEZ, AGENT'S ATTORNEY: The American Airlines agent at that gate had no blank forms that he need to fill out. So, the American Airlines agent decided to use one of the forms that he already had and simply crossed out the airport, flight and seat numbers and wrote in the new flight and seat numbers.
MESERVE: The pilot, in his account, described the agent as very hostile and abusive. Lawyers for the agent say it was pilot who was rude and unprofessional. And they asked if pilots should have unfettered authority to remove passengers.
RELMAN: And the question is: If there is no legitimate security risk being posed, does a pilot of an American airline, any American airline, have the right to keep someone off a plane just because he doesn't like the way they look?
MESERVE: On its Web site, American Airlines says these are frivolous claims of racial profiling. It says its security "guidelines are applied equally among all passengers. And the company vigorously resents any suggestion of racial discrimination."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MESERVE: The attorneys say this agent was detailed to the FBI after the events of September 11 to help with the terror investigation and had recently received an award from the Secret Service for his unique and significant contributions.
Of course, John, it was the security measures put in place after those events that triggered this whole incident.
KING: On the surface, you would think both sides would be interested in de-escalating it, at least taking this out of the public eye, yet it appears both sides increasingly stepping out and fighting. MESERVE: Well, each side saying they have to respond to what the other has said, but both sides saying today, John, that they would like to resolve this amicably; they would like to do it out of court.
KING: We will watch that in the moments ahead.
Turning now to the economy, another sign of recession: jobless claims up sharply for the second straight week, leading some economists to forecast a rise in December's unemployment rate, which will be released tomorrow morning. Right now, the jobless rate is at 5.7 percent.
Mindful that the economy will be a key factor in the 2002 midterm elections, President Bush heads to California and Oregon Saturday to push his economic stimulus package, which is now stalled in the Senate. Is it necessary? Or is it too late for Washington to help?
Joining me now to discuss the stimulus package, the state of the economy and the political debate about it: Martin Regalia, vice president and chief economist at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce; and Steven Moore, a senior fellow at the Cato Institute and president of the Club for Growth.
Martin Regalia, let's start with you first. Are Chamber members still clamoring for Washington to jump in here and help? Or, after the partisan stalemate of late December, would your businesses just prefer that Washington not create more uncertainty and just get out of the way?
MARTIN REGALIA, U.S. CHAMBER OF COMMERCE: Well, I think that our businesses would clearly like to see more certainty, but certainty in the fact that we would get a tax cut in a stimulus package.
Quite clearly, the stimulus package that has been proposed would help to underpin the economic growth that we expect to start early this year and provide a bit of insurance for that growth, insurance that it would come and insurance that it would be strong when it does.
KING: And, quickly, what type of tax cuts do you think the federal government could pass that would quickly make their way into the economy?
REGALIA: Well, I think, clearly the pro-growth tax cuts, tax cuts that would increase incentives for investment, that would allow for expensing of investment, would provide the kind of incentives that businesses are looking for to make those investments in more equipment and to underpin growth in the future.
KING: Jump in, Steve Moore. Do you think Washington missed its opportunity? Is anything Washington could do now at this point, especially given the price the president would probably have to pay to get this through the Congress -- increased spending proposals pushed by the Democrats -- worth it, in your view?
STEVE MOORE, CATO INSTITUTE: Well, John, the first thing we don't need is more spending. In fact, as you know from yesterday's numbers, they are now talking about the surplus totally disappearing on a budget deficit. And one of the major reasons we are seeing a resurgence of deficits has been an explosion of spending last year. Federal spending was up by about 11 percent, almost $200 billion of new spending last year. So the idea of adding additional spending onto that I think is extremely misguided. That's the Democrat approach.
And I think President Bush's approach is right-minded, that we ought to be looking at tax cuts. But if Bush is going to prevail on this, John, he is going to have to show more leadership on it. He really kind of dropped the ball on the economic stimulus plan, probably because he was spending so much time on the war effort. But now, I think in the State of the Union Address, he is going to have to start talking about growth tax cuts as the way to get the economy growing again, because the Republicans don't want to face the voters in a recession in November of 2002.
KING: Well, Steve, let's stick with you for a minute. The president will travel this weekend. We're told probably some additional travel next week as well.
Is that, to you, evidence of a lesson learned to the point you just made, that he needs to spend some of this political capital he has accumulated as the wartime president and turn his attention more to the domestic front? And, even if -- even if he does that, is it past time for Washington to do anything that would have an immediate impact as we watch tomorrow morning, and the unemployment rate goes up again, and Americans around the country say: Hey, what about helping me?
MOORE: You know, John, I think that George W. Bush has learned the most important lesson from his father, which is, of course, that it's the economy, stupid.
And no matter how strong he has been in terms of conducting the war, if we have an increase in the unemployment rate, and more Americans out of work, and corporations are not making profits, Americans are going to turn sour on the president.
So he understands he has to get the economy moving again. And this is why I think he is doing the right thing by going to the West Coast, talking about economic stimulus and promoting a very specific plan of growth, and blaming Tom Daschle, who I think deserves the blame, for really derailing the plan back in December.
KING: Martin Regalia, take us outside of Washington a bit. Many economists believe the unemployment rate will go up to 5.8, 5.9 percent -- in the report we see tomorrow, perhaps as high as 6.5 percent or so by June or July, before peaking there and then starting to go back down, as most assume the recovery begin some time in the middle of next year.
Where, when you hear from your clients around the country -- take us sector by sector. Who is hurting the most? And where is the help needed the most? REGALIA: Well, clearly, the manufacturing sector has been hurting the most and hurting the longest. Over 17 months, they have been in outright recession. But we are already seeing signs that the manufacturing sector is starting to improve.
And I think that it's clear that the unemployment rate will continue to rise on through the first quarter of next year and may hit somewhere between 6-6.5 percent. But we have to remember that the unemployment rate is a lagging indicator. It goes up after the fact. And so what is going to happen is, the economy is going to start to grow, and I believe start to grow very early next year, January and February.
We are already seeing some early signs of that growth. It's going to build through the year. By the middle of the year, I think we will be growing at 3 percent. A good insurance package to make sure that that happens would be additional tax cuts. I think the president understands that.
But the unemployment rate, we can't focus on one indicator, especially not one that is a lagging indicator. The economy is beginning to improve. We have to give it help. We have to keep it moving forward. And I think, if we do, we will be out of this recession very quickly and growing solidly by the middle of the year.
MOORE: You know, John, you asked whether there is time to pass a stimulus. And I think there clearly is. There is no reason this couldn't be done in the next 30 to 60 days. And to me, the most logical stimulus plan is just take the tax cut that we passed back in May, and rather than have those tax cuts take effect in 2005, 2006, and 2007, just make the effective date for those September 11, 2001, so that all their tax rates come down. You get that kind of immediate stimulus that the economy needs right now.
KING: All right, Steve Moore of the Cato Institute, Martin Regalia from the Chamber of Commerce, thank you both for joining us on...
MOORE: Thank you.
KING: Which will be the dominate debate for the new year, the state of the U.S. economy.
Thank you both very much.
Get all the numbers from Wall Street and check out the newest cars on "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE" at the top of the hour, 6:00 p.m. Eastern, 3:00 Pacific.
The United States is making another attempt to get the Mideast peace talks going. U.S. special envoy Anthony Zinni returned to the region today for separate talks with Israeli and Palestinian leaders. His arrival came as Israeli troops began pulling back from some West Bank towns. But Palestinian officials described the moves as cosmetic. A regional summit meeting in Nepal is bringing the prime minister of India and the president of Pakistan together for the first time since a failed summit last July. But India says, until it is satisfied with Pakistan's crackdown on Islamic militants, there will be no one-on-one talks.
An earthquake today shook parts of Central and South Asia, but there were no reports of serious injuries or major damage. The magnitude-6 quake was centered in Afghanistan and was also felt in Pakistan, India and Tajikistan.
How bad can several inches of snow be? In Buffalo, no sweat, but Atlanta is another story. When we return: how traffic came to a standstill in the South -- and later: saying goodbye to a buddy, and the legacy of presidential pets.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Welcome back.
Snow from a large winter storm in the South may be delighting children, but it's mostly causing frustration among motorists and stranded air travelers. For many, it was a day of delays, accidents and just sitting around. Here is a look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(voice-over): Twenty-seven miles of evidence that the South does not handle snow well.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Quite a mess here on I-20.
KING: A jackknifed tractor trailer just west of Atlanta transferred Interstate 20 into a parking lot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We need a wrecker out here desperately.
KING: More sitting around once you got to Atlanta: The world's busiest airport, Hartsfield International, operated just one-third of its flight schedule this morning after canceling 250 flights last night, stranding 4,000 travelers, including CNN's David Mattingly.
DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: There were so many planes trying to get out at one time, the airport did not have enough equipment to deice all the jets trying to get out. We sat in the airplane on the tarmac waiting, in my particular case, for seven hours. Other people have waited eight, nine, some people even 10 hours sitting inside the plane with no food, no movement, just sitting there.
KING: Going nowhere is theme of the day across the South. State workers in Georgia and South Carolina got the day off. And many schools closed; 18,000 customers in North Carolina left without power. About a foot of snow is expected in Raleigh, North Carolina and many parts of Southern Virginia, as the snow moves Northeast and, if forecasters are right, out to sea. (END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: One of the most frustrating places to be during this winter storm was Atlanta's Hartsfield International Airport. About 4,000 passengers were stranded there overnight. Many were stuck on planes for hours before they returned to the gates.
CNN national correspondent Gary Tuchman was at the world's busiest airport with an update on the latest conditions -- Gary.
GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hello, to you, John.
It wasn't a blizzard, but it was Atlanta's biggest snowstorm since 1993. And the 5 inches of snow here at the airport and the ice were more than enough to cause major commotion here at the world's busiest airport.
More than 400 flights -- that's the total number now -- canceled yesterday and today. And 4,000 passengers, more than that, stranded at the airport, many of them staying at the hotels -- but a lot of them ended up sleeping on the floors here at the airport, trying to get a good night's sleep before trying to make it out again today.
Now, just talking about those passengers, you would doing a disservice to other passengers who actually got on airplanes and ended up sitting on the tarmac, as you just heard David Mattingly talking about. And it was caused by what I might say is a snowball effect, if you will pardon the pun. The departing planes tried to get out. But while they were sitting there waiting to get out, they iced up again. There weren't enough deicers. They would get deiced. They would still have to wait, have to get deiced again. And they weren't able to leave on time.
Other planes were not getting permission to leave the Atlanta area. Meanwhile, the arriving planes were coming in. And so many other planes were canceled, they were parked at the gates. There were no gates for those planes coming in. And when gates did open, there were not enough employees to get the people off the planes to the open gates. So it was a mess. And that is how it all worked out yesterday.
But airport officials are now saying the skies are clear and things are getting back to normal.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, we are anticipating getting back to normal operations hopefully later this evening or early tomorrow morning. As you can see, it's starting to warm up a little bit. And we right now have all four of our runways open, which is really good news, because the surface temperature of the runway is 44 degrees, which means we can start to get planes in and out. And, of course, our priority today is getting people out of Atlanta and back home to their respective destinations.
(END VIDEO CLIP) TUCHMAN: Now, the waiting is very tough you, but it's toughest for people, I think -- I could say this is toughest as a father -- who travel with small children and have to sit here for 20, 25, 30 hours. And, earlier today, we talked with a mother who was traveling with her four young daughters, three of them triplets.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We were going through Las Vegas and then Salt Lake City to get home. We couldn't do it. They got us on another flight into Colorado Springs. Called before we left the hotel. Got here, it was canceled. So my husband is in line trying to get us home. And his travel agent is working one end. And he is just saying, oh...
Well...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, where does it stand right now?
CHILD: Momma!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You tell me. We'll probably leave at lunchtime and go back and get another hotel room and put her down for a nap.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TUCHMAN: She is a great mom, isn't she? We are happy to tell you that family got on a plane to Denver. They're on their way back home right now.
One final thing I want to mention. You may wondering how 5 inches of snow causes such a major commotion here. Keep in mind, that is 2 1/2 times more than the average snow that Atlanta gets in a winter. Atlanta traditionally gets about 2 inches in a winter season, already up to 5 in one day -- John, back to you.
KING: Well, then, Gary, how do officials deal with the inevitable complaints today from the passengers who sat on the tarmac for six or more hours? Do they say this is such a rare event that they don't need contingencies? Or do they try to plan, maybe we should take them to hangars somehow and get them off the back stairs of the plane, do something to get people off those planes?
TUCHMAN: John, they know\ow they will have big problems here again if they have 5 inches of snow. There's no question about it. They don't have as much deicing equipment as airports like Minneapolis or New York or Boston or Chicago.
However, they will be meeting to discuss what to do when it gets all staffed up and backed up. Do you bring in more people? Do you have overtime? Do you bring up stairways to get people off planes? That's items they will be discussing in order to alleviate the problem of having people waiting for so many hours aboard an airplane.
KING: All right, Gary Tuchman, standing by at Atlanta's Hartsfield Airport. Maybe we will send David Mattingly and some of the other passengers on those planes for six or seven or eight hours to that meeting. Thank you very much, Gary.
For the latest on the South's wild weather, long on to the winter weather special at CNN.com. Get tips on weatherproofing your home and your car. And get the winter sports report -- the AOL keyword: CNN.
When we return: AOL addresses a loophole in its popular instant messenger. And later, would you accept an organ from a pig? The transplant technology that might make it possible.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Checking these stories on our "Newswire": Could this little piggy save your life? Rival teams of scientists today announced they had taken the first step toward making pigs suitable to donate organs to human beings. The breakthrough involved genetically engineering the pigs and then cloning them.
The Hart Bridge over the St. John's River in Jacksonville, Florida is open again after smoke from a huge fire shut it down for a half hour today. Eight fire companies put out the blaze which destroyed a trucking company warehouse. No injuries are reported.
And Texas authorities say they shot a man today after he shot a woman in an office building in suburban Dallas. Authorities say she was also stabbed numerous times. The woman later died. The suspect was taken to the hospital, where he is in critical condition. There was no immediate word on the motive for the shooting.
AOL Time Warner, CNN's parent company, says it has fixed a security hole in its popular instant messenger program. AOL's troubleshooters quickly made changes after an international group of young hackers demonstrated they could use the program to take control of home computers.
Let's go now to New York and get a preview of "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE," which begins at the top of the hour.
Jan Hopkins is sitting in for Lou tonight -- Jan.
JAN HOPKINS, "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE": Thanks, John.
Coming up on "MONEYLINE": The United States steps up the hunt for Mullah Mohammed Omar. I will be joined by General David Grange. And we'll have a live report from the Pentagon. Argentina today defaulting on its massive $141 billion debt: It's the largest government default ever. We will have the latest from Buenos Aires. And I will talk to one of world's biggest investors: New York state Comptroller Carl McCall -- all of that and much more at the top of the hour -- back to John in Washington.
KING: Thank you, Jan.
Former President Clinton mourning a member of his family: when we return, how first pets can be important to a president.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KING: Former President Bill Clinton says he is deeply saddened by the death of his dog, Buddy. A car struck and killed the Labrador retriever outside the Clinton's home in Chappaqua, New York yesterday. The dog was playfully chasing a contractor who had just left the Clinton's home when the accident occurred.
Buddy had his place in a long line of celebrated White House pets, as CNN's Bruce Morton reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BRUCE MORTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): President Harry Truman said, "If you want a friend in Washington, get a dog."
And Buddy was a friend to his people -- fought with Socks the cat some, but a friend -- not as historic as some presidential pets. Franklin Roosevelt's Scotch terrier, Fala, rode to an inaugural with him and became a campaign issue when Republicans accused Roosevelt of using a Navy ship to bring Fala from the Aleutian Islands back to Washington during World War II. FDR knew what to say about that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FEDERAL D. ROOSEVELT, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: These Republican leaders have not been content with attacks on me or on my wife or on my sons, no, not content with that. They now include my little dog, Fala.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORTON: Richard Nixon used their cocker spaniel, Checkers. Fighting to stay on the ticket as Dwight Eisenhower's running mate after accusations about a slush fund, Nixon told a TV audience about the dog someone had sent them.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICHARD NIXON: And, you know, the kids, like all kids, love the dog. And I just want to say this right now, that, regardless of what they say about it, we're going to keep him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORTON: Mail poured in. He stayed on the ticket.
Lyndon Johnson pulled his beagle's ears, made them bark, he said, and told press Secretary George Reedy -- this is a White House audio tape:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) LYNDON JOHNSON, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I have more love for dogs that most people. And I hope they didn't misunderstand it. I wouldn't want them to feel that I was a sadistic person.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORTON: Ronald Reagan's dogs didn't make news exactly, but he did say one had a thing about the Lincoln Bedroom.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RONALD REAGAN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Our little dog, Rex, will start down that long hall toward that room, just glaring as if he's seeing something, and barking. And he stops in front of Lincoln's door.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MORTON: The first President Bush's dog, Millie, had something no other presidential pet had had: her own book -- some help with the writing, of course, but a lot of celebrities hire ghosts -- and then Socks and the late Buddy, and this president's dogs, Barney and Spot. Buddy's advice to them would probably be, stay on that ranch, guys, or in the White House. Bad things can happen outside.
Bruce Morton, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: I'll be back in one hour with the "War Room." Retired General George Joulwan joins me at 7:00 Eastern, 4:00 Pacific.
I'm John King in Washington. CNN's coverage of America's new war continues with "LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE," which begins right now.
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