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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports
Will Suspects in Daniel Pearl Killing Go to United States?; Has Search for Osama bin Laden Gone Cold?
Aired February 25, 2002 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Tonight on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS: THE WAR ROOM.
Three suspects in Daniel Pearl's killing have their day in a Pakistani court. But will they be brought to justice in the United States? And is there a connection between Pearl's killers and Pakistani intelligence? We'll go live to Karachi.
A crossroads of intrigue, why this western Afghan city, and its connection to Iran, could spell trouble for Afghan leader Hamid Karzai. We'll go live to Herat.
Has the search for Osama bin Laden gone cold?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEN. TOMMY FRANKS, COMMANDER, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: Until I see evidence that he is not alive, we will continue to make the assumption that he is alive.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: I'll speak live with CNN terrorism analyst Peter Bergen and national security correspondent David Ensor, on bin Laden and the Daniel Pearl investigation, as we go into the WAR ROOM.
Good evening. I'm Wolf Blitzer reporting tonight from Washington. The Bush administration raised the stakes today in the investigation of the murder of "Wall Street Journal" reporter Daniel Pearl.
With no guarantee of success, the White House says it would like to get its hands on Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh, the key suspect in Pearl's kidnapping and killing. And negotiations are under way with Pakistan over his extradition. CNN's Chris Burns joins us now live from Karachi, on the phone with more. Chris tell us what's going on.
CHRIS BURNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, there was a hearing today for Sheikh Omar and two other suspects in the case, where the three were heard before a judge. The prosecutors demanded more time to be able to find, now that we know that Daniel Pearl is dead, to be able to find his body and to find the murder weapon. As well as make more arrests and find more evidence. They need two more weeks under law that allows them to do that.
The judge granted them those two more weeks. However, the judge also said that as the prosecutors, the investigators should back off when trying to get to the suspects to confess, because the suspects -- they claim -- that they had been under duress, the authorities were trying to press them into signing admissions that they did not want to sign. So the judge is giving them time, but telling them to be fair about their investigation.
The judge is giving them also the time to try to find more suspects. These suspects, they said, include not only the man believed holding, who had held Daniel Pearl, (UNINTELLIGIBLE) Furuki (ph), but also perhaps one or more Arab suspects. And perhaps also the man they believe was actually holding the camera that filmed the video so it does look like the investigation is progressing on that point -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Chris, where do the negotiations between the governments of the United States and Pakistan stand as far as the possibility of extraditing Omar Sheikh to the United States?
BURNS: Well, it's a bit complicated because there is -- there had been an extradition agreement with Pakistan, but that was before the state of Pakistan existed. That was back in the 1930s. The question is can that be applied in this case? There had been, according to authorities, there had been a meeting, even before Daniel Pearl was kidnapped back on January 9 where Ambassador Wendy Chamberlain met with authorities here, and requested the arrest of Sheikh Omar in a previous kidnapping, a kidnapping back in 1994 when four tourists -- three Brits and one American -- were kidnapped back in India in 1994. And Sheikh Omar is believed to have been the mastermind behind that kidnapping. The request was repeated just the day after Daniel Pearl was kidnapped in a meeting between U.S. Ambassador Wendy Chamberlain and FBI Director John Mueller, and authorities here. So there -- that pressing has been going on, even before Daniel Pearl was kidnapped. A lot of people would think that if that had actually gone through and happened, perhaps Daniel Pearl could be alive today -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Chris Burns reporting live from Karachi. Thank you very much.
And despite claims by the United States that Iran is trying to destabilize Afghanistan, the interim leader is receiving a warm welcome in Tehran. Hamid Karzai is on an official visit to the Iranian capital. Let's check in with our Nic Robertson, he's in Herat, a western Afghan city, right along the border with Iran.
Give us the details. What's going on on that front?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, they are into their second day of meetings in Tehran. And both Hamid Karzai Afghanistan's new interim head of government has tried to make it clear that he doesn't believe Iran is trying to destabilize his government in Kabul, but also the Iranians have been trying, again, from their side to say that they're not involved in destabilizing, as they have been accused of doing -- of sending commandos, Iranian commandos into Afghanistan to destabilize the U.S.- backed interim government here.
In western Afghanistan it's very clear there is a lot of Iranian influence. There are a lot of Iranian businessmen in this city. In fact, an Iranian contractor just outside of this city is building 75 miles of new highway, all the way to the Iranian border. A lot of trade comes from Iran, also from Turkmenistan which is also about 70 miles away from this city. And here, Herat, the city we are in has ancient links with the Persian Empire, with Iran. It was once the capital of the Persian Empire, in fact. So there are a lot of cultural ties, a lot of historic ties here. And people in this city look to Iran for trade and they look to Iran to improve their economy. And indeed Iranian businessmen coming here see peace and stability in Afghanistan as an opportunity for them.
The former warlord here, the former mujahideen warlord here, Ismail Khan also accused of getting help and backing from Iran. He denies that, he has -- from what we have seen here in this city, Wolf -- brought peace and stability here. And he hopes to translate that into an improved economy and into better Jobs, Wolf.
BLITZER: Some say, Nic, that Ismail Khan, the leader that you just referred to, has the potential to go up the chain of command, eventually wind up the leader of Afghanistan. Is that at all realistic?
ROBERTSON: Perhaps not, at the moment it appears that he has been essentially sidelined in the main national power struggle here. His son has been appointed the interim minister of labor. Ismail Khan, himself, did not get a government portfolio. Some western analysts believe, in this area, that former mujahideen commanders, warlords, if you will, like Ismail Khan may we well be sidelined in any new administration in the loya jirga, as that aims to bring perhaps a more dispersed power base, if you will, to the Afghan leadership. And they suspect people like Ismail Khan, perhaps Rashid Dostum in the north of Afghanistan, perhaps Gulagosh Herzai (ph), the governor in Kandahar. People like this, former mujahideen commanders will be sidelined in place of new political leaders who have only political track records.
However, it remains to be seen whether that can be pulled off. For the time being Ismail Khan, here, is a very, very powerful figure despite the fact that he's not the core commander here, he is not the police chief here, only the governor. Nothing gets done in the army, nothing gets done in the police, nothing gets done on the streets here, in any ministry without his say so. For right now he's a very powerful figure here -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Nic Robertson reporting live from Herat. Thank you very much. And this important note: Nic will be back right at the top of the hour with a special report, "LIVE FROM HERAT, AFGHANISTAN." That's in about less than 50 minutes, at 8:00 p.m. Eastern, 5:00 p.m. Pacific.
The head of the U.S. central command says he still believes Osama bin Laden is alive. And the search for the al Qaeda leader continues. That was one of several issues General Tommy Franks touched on today during a briefing on the Afghan military campaign.
Our military affairs correspondent Jamie McIntyre joins us now live from the Pentagon with more -- Jamie.
JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN MILITARY AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: And Wolf an interesting statistic from the commander of U.S. forces in Afghanistan today. One hundred twenty, that's the number of what he called sites of interest. The U.S. military is checking out in Afghanistan roughly half of those are suspected weapons of mass destruction sites. The other 60 or so are places where Osama bin Laden or his top lieutenants may have been recently.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FRANKS: I've said before and I'll continue to say, until I see evidence that he is not alive then we will continue to make the assumption that he is alive, because that continues to focus our intelligence activity. And so that's what we will continue to do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCINTYRE: Also, from Franks today a vigorous denial that an intelligence failure led to the raid last month in which U.S. forces killed 16 Afghans and captured 27 others, only to have to release them when it turned out they were not al Qaeda or Taliban. Franks called the deaths unfortunate, but stop short of calling the dead innocent victims, he praised the professionalism U.S. troops and said they did nothing wrong.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FRANKS: The one mistake that I know was made, was when people shot at American forces doing their job on the ground in Afghanistan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCINTYRE: Franks admits the intelligence was incomplete, but says that's why the suspected bad guys were not bombed. They wanted to send U.S. troops in on the ground to check them out. He said when they fired first, the U.S. troops fired back and that was their fatal mistake, at least that's what the Pentagon's own investigation has concluded -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Jamie, while I was watching the briefing that Franks had live here on CNN earlier today, you seemed to strike a little sensitive nerve with him when you asked him about the possibility of so-called mission creep in Afghanistan. What was his assessment?
MCINTYRE: Well, General Franks says that he can't foresee the U.S. troops being involved in what's called peacekeeping in Afghanistan, that their mission remains seeking out al Qaeda and Taliban, although gradually, U.S. forces are doing a little bit more and a little bit more to help provide security in the area. Now, General Franks dismissed the notion that the U.S. would be involved in peacekeeping, said he didn't see any evidence of so-called mission creep. He said he doesn't like that word, mission creep, but he understands what it means. And, of course, the idea is that gradually, you you get sucked into doing more and more until the mission turns out to be much larger than anticipated.
BLITZER: Jamie McIntyre at the Pentagon, thank you very much.
CNN terrorism analyst Peter Bergen and our national security correspondent, David Ensor, join me now. They're here to weigh in on a number of issues, including the Daniel Pearl case, Iran's influence in Afghanistan, the hunt for Osama bin Laden. Thanks to both of you for joining us.
Let me begin with you, Peter. This whole connection between Pakistani intelligence service and the chief suspect in the kidnapping and murder of Daniel Pearl, what's your take on what's going on there?
PETER BERGEN, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, historically, there's been strong links between the Pakistani military intelligence and these Kashmiri separatist groups. Omar Shaykh is believed to belong to something called Jaish-e-Mohammad. It's had a number of different names. That group has certainly had, at a minimum, diplomatic and moral support, is how the Pakistani government say.
Western diplomats in Pakistan say actually that the support for these groups has gone beyond that to actual military support and the proof of that is if you remember the Cargill (ph) operation when Pakistani separatists and Kashmiri separatists incurred into India with the Pakistani army. They did it as a joint operation. This was in May of 1999. So there have long been strong links. If Omar Shaykh is indeed a member of Jaish-e-Mohammad, which is kind of the conventional wisdom, he would certainly have had some contacts I think with Pakistani officials.
BLITZER: I remember that Cargill (ph) incident because less than a year later, I was in Kashmir covering a story there.
But, David, President Bush today was very forceful in expressing his support for President Musharraf and his role in trying to deal with this Daniel Pearl kidnapping and murder. Listen to what the president said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I could tell from the tone of his voice how distraught he was, how disturbed he was that this barbaric act had taken place in his country. He knew full well that those killers did not represent the vast, vast majority of the people in his own country and he vowed to me on the phone he would do everything in his power to chase down the killers and bring them to justice.
(END VIDEO CLIP) BLITZER: So, no suspicion in the U.S. government that others, perhaps, in the Pakistani government may not necessarily be on board with President Musharraf?
DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, there is some such suspicion, Wolf. As a matter of fact, U.S. officials have told me that they can't rule out that those who were involved in the killing of Pearl may have had some kind of connections with Pakistani intelligence.
It has been stated in the past by Pakistani observers that they believe Omar Shaykh was an informer for the ISI, the Pakistani intelligence. It was interesting to note the reports that it took a week for the Pakistanis to announce that they had him in custody. I don't know if that's true or not, but certainly U.S. officials were interested by that report.
Now they are trying to prepare -- we understand there's a grand jury preparing extradition requests for Omar Shaykh, but whether he will be extradited or not is an open question that officials admit, especially given that the crime was actually committed in Pakistan.
BLITZER: Although governments in Pakistan, and you know this, Peter, and, David, you know it as well, have extradited suspected terrorists to the United States in the past, including the individual who shot up some cars and some individuals outside CIA headquarters outside Washington.
BERGEN: And the mastermind of the first World Trade Center bombing, Ramsi Yousef. So even though there's no extradition treaty, Pakistan has in the past handed people over. But there are some differences here. One is this guy is a British citizen with Pakistani heritage. The crime, as David said, was not committed in the United States, so it gets a little messy.
BLITZER: I noticed that Senator Bob Graham, David, over the weekend on "NOVAK, HUNT & SHIELDS" had some specific information about terrorists in the United States right now. I want to play that excerpt from that interview and get your reactions, because I know you've been doing some reporting on what he meant. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BOB GRAHAM, (D-FL), INTELLIGENCE CHAIRMAN: The estimate is that there are a hundred or more al Qaeda operatives inside the United States, some who have been here for a considerable period of time, all of whom went through a training process to prepare them to carry out terrorist plots when they were called upon to do so. That probably is the most immediate threat of a terrorist attack against the United States.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Now, Bob Graham, the chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, gets incredible briefings from the U.S. intelligence community. When he says there are 100 or more al Qaeda operatives in the United States, that sounds pretty scary.
ENSOR: Well, and we checked with a number of different people, other officials who from the intelligence community said they hadn't heard this and they thought he might have misspoken. But we checked back with the senator who, after all, does get the top-level security briefings. He stands by what he said. He said that number is correct.
BLITZER: All right. Peter, you're the author of "Holy War, Inc.", the key book on al Qaeda and Osama bin Laden. It's a bestseller. It's out right now. What's your assessment where Osama bin Laden may be right now? And if we can put up a map, if you want to tell our viewers what you believe the answer to that is.
BERGEN: If I had the real answer, I'd pick up my $25 million. But, no, I think he's in Afghanistan. I think that he's in the area that the eastern part of Afghanistan, bordering Pakistan. And that's the area where I think he's always been, I mean, for quite some period now. And as Tommy Franks said earlier, unless there's compelling evidence that he's dead, I think the presumption he's alive is a reasonable one.
ENSOR: And, Wolf, you know, what intelligence officials say to me is that they're watching a number of people who are related to him or know him intimately and a number of places and they haven't seen any sign that he's dead and they believe that if he died, the word would get out.
BLITZER: OK. David Ensor, Peter Bergen. Did I mention the name of your book, "Holy War"? Thanks to both of you for joining us.
BERGEN: Thank you.
ENSOR: Thank you.
BLITZER: And don't miss a terrific debate on this program tomorrow night. Should the United States military take the lead in maintaining peace and stability in Afghanistan in the long term? The former U.S. ambassador to the U.N., Richard Holbrooke, and the former U.S. arms control director, Ken Adelman, have very different opinions on this. They'll square off tomorrow night, 7:00 p.m. Eastern here in the CNN WAR ROOM.
And violence claims more victims in the Middle East. When we return, we'll go live to Jerusalem for the latest on the shooting spree at a crowded bus stop. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Welcome back.
A new round of violence broke out today in the Middle East. At least four people were killed in the West Bank. And in east Jerusalem, a gunman opened fire at a bus stop, wounding 10 people. CNN's Jonathan Mann is in Jerusalem. He joins us now live. Give us the latest, John. JONATHAN MANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, there was such terrible violence here last week that over the weekend, both sides did their best to put a lid on it. Well, today, the lid was blown off.
As you had mention, a bus station -- rather -- a bus stop attack in a neighborhood not far from here in east Jerusalem, a gunman opened fire. Ten people are wounded according to the last numbers we have. The gunman himself was critically injured by police. He's being watched and is in custody. And the al Axa (ph), a faction linked to the Fatah movement of Yasser Arafat, claimed responsibility for that attack.
As you mentioned, there were fatal attacks elsewhere on the West Bank. Let's tell you about that. In Nablus, a pregnant woman and her husband were on their way to the hospital when they went -- got to an Israeli checkpoint. Israeli soldiers say the car didn't stop when they ordered it to stop, so they opened fire. The woman was wounded but she did get to the hospital eventually and delivered a healthy baby girl. That girl has no father. He was killed in the attack.
Elsewhere in the West Bank, Palestinian gunmen wounded an Israeli woman who was also carrying a baby and who did subsequently deliver, though she was wounded, the baby we are told is healthy. Two men were killed in that attack. It was south of Bethlehem not far from an Israeli settlement there.
You know, this violence has been going on it seems now getting worse for the past 17 months. A lot of people are wondering when it's going to end. It didn't end today -- Wolf.
BLITZER: John, what about the Israeli government's reaction to this latest peace proposal that's been floated by the Saudi Crown Prince Abdullah, a proposal that would have Israel withdraw to the pre-1967 lines, including a withdrawal from east Jerusalem in exchange for a Palestinian state. How is the government of Prime Minister Sharon reacting?
MANN: Well, they are all saying that they're pleased, they are surprised and they are a little mystified because they say it's not even a proposal yet. So far, it's something they read in the "New York Times".
A little bit more than a week ago, the prince spoke to a columnist for the "Times", Thomas Friedman, and he said that this was a proposal he was thinking of making. When that newspaper column came out, a lot of people in the Arab world got excited. The people in Israel are very intrigued because not only are they talking about the pre-1967 borders, that would be a non-starter for the Israelis, but the Saudis are suggesting that they would allow the Israelis to keep sovereignty over unified Jerusalem and maybe make some arrangements for the settlements as well, something that pre-1967 basically rules out.
So, the Israelis are waiting to hear more. They are asking the United States to get involved, to act as a kind of bridge to the Saudis who don't officially talk to the Israelis or recognize them. And the last word we have is that, in fact, Secretary of State Colin Powell is making some calls, so it may amount to something.
BLITZER: And the president of Israel, Moshe Katsav, today recommended, invited the crown prince to visit Jerusalem, although, John, I don't think that's going happen any time soon. Don't hold your breath for that.
MANN: No, the Saudis don't come here. The Israelis don't get a lot of invitations to go there. But, you know, it's the Middle East. Anything could happen.
BLITZER: You're right, John. Jonathan Mann, you never know, thanks for that report. We'll be watching developments.
And remember, I want to hear from you. Please go to my Web site, cnn.com/wolf. Click on the designation for comments to me and my producers. We read all of your comments.
And more than three weeks after she vanished from her home, there is still no sign of 7-year-old Danielle van Dam. But there are dramatic new developments in the case. We'll be back in just a moment with a quick check of the top stories, including the latest on that sad story. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Welcome back.
On the case of missing San Diego girl, the neighbor accused of kidnapping Danielle van Dam will be charged with murder. Authorities have concluded Danielle is dead even though her body has not been found. Fifty-year-old David Westerfield will be arraigned tomorrow on kidnapping and murder charges.
I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. "CROSSFIRE" begins right now.
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