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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports
Congressional Committee Investigates Intelligence Failures; Gephardt Voices Support for Toppling Hussein; Queen's Jubilee Comes to a Close
Aired June 04, 2002 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Now on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS: under the Capitol Dome, behind closed doors in a soundproof room, getting to the bottom of a massive intelligence failure.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. RICHARD SHELBY (R-AL), INTELLIGENCE VICE CHAIRMAN: It's a question now of what did we learn from it? What do we do about it?
REP. JANE HARMAN (D-CA), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: I want to understand what was broken in the system so we can fix it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: President to Congress: Don't get carried away.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I see no evidence that would have led me to believe that we could have prevented the attacks.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: A future attack on Iraq? Why toppling Saddam Hussein just got easier for the White House.
And the party just won't stop. Britain celebrates with its Queen.
It's Tuesday, June 4, 2002. Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington.
This is an extraordinary day, as America fights the war against terror on several fronts. While Congress tries to follow the September 11 terror trail, President Bush today tries to pick up the mood in the intelligence community with a visit to the top secret National Security Agency, stressing that the nation should focus its energies on fighting the war against terror.
Two planes are hijacked in the western United States, tracked by radar, as fighter jets take off in pursuit. But it's just a drill, planned before last year's attacks. It's aimed at testing the Air Defense Network in the United States and Canada, and preparing for the next nightmare scenario.
And guarding against another nightmare scenario involving a nuclear facility, West Chester County in New York State will begin distributing potassium iodide pills this weekend to residents within a 10-mile radius of the Indian Point Nuclear Plant. We'll get more on that later, and explain why that's going on.
But first, the commander in chief weighs in on the congressional investigation of the September 11 attacks and throws his weight behind the nation's beleaguered intelligence agencies.
Here's CNN's senior White House correspondent John King.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN KING, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice over): A morale boosting visit to the National Security Agency in an effort by the president to establish this bottom line.
BUSH: I've seen no evidence to date that said this country could have prevented the attack.
KING: But some in Congress are not so sure. A joint investigation of the House and Senate Intelligence Committees began closed door hearings to explore pre-September 11 intelligence and communication failures. Mr. Bush says Congress should move quickly and keep most of the debate out of the public eye.
BUSH: What I am concerned about is tying up valuable assets and time, and possibly jeopardizing sources of intelligence.
KING: FBI Director Robert Mueller is to testify later this week, and CIA Director George Tenet will be called before the joint Intelligence Committee review later, both to face tough questions about why their agencies did not share or act on clues about the terrorist threat.
Mr. Bush gave both a vote of confidence.
BUSH: In terms of whether or not the FBI and the CIA were communicating properly, I think it is clear that they weren't, and that now we've addressed that issue and the CIA and the FBI are now in close communication there's better sharing of intelligence.
KING: The Senate Judiciary Committee and other congressional panels say they, too, have legitimate questions. But Mr. Bush says one investigation is enough.
BUSH: Because I don't want to tie up our team when we're trying to fight this war on terror, so you know I don't want our people to be distracted.
KING: The president played down finger pointing between the FBI and the CIA, blaming it on low-level staffers, quote, "trying to protect their hide."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: But several sources tell CNN, Mr. Bush and other senior White House officials are making it bluntly clear they expect this interagency sniping between the FBI and the CIA to stop. As one senior official put it, quote, "we would prefer no self-inflicted wounds" -- Wolf.
BLITZER: John King at the White House, thanks very much. And on the terror trail, the House and Senate Intelligence Committees, of course, today began looking into those pre-September 11 intelligence failures. For now, the joint inquiry is top secret, but lawmakers want to know about clues that may have been missed before September 11, the lack of communication between intelligence agencies. They also want to know what needs to change to prevent a future disaster.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: I think the inquiry is going to have to find out what the accountability is within each of the agencies.
SHELBY: I believe that the information will come out, some public, some will be classified and never come out, showing that there were massive intelligence failures.
HARMAN: I want to understand what went wrong. I want to understand what was broken in the system so we can fix it. But the goal is to fix the system.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: These closed-door hearings are being held in a place especially suited to the delicate task at hand.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER (voice over): In the grand home of Congress, there's one small area dedicated to absolute secrecy.
HARMAN: We meet in the Dome of the Capitol, literally, in a series of rooms that are closed off, because we do want to be sure that we can keep the nation's secrets there.
BLITZER: The name of the room, S-407 is no secret, but what goes on inside is, and keeping the secrets is so crucial that Capitol Police and security don't let camera crews near the room or even on the same floor where the suites are located. The closest our camera was allowed to get was one floor below. Those who can get to it have to take a special elevator to the so-called attic floor from the crypt or basement of the Capitol.
S-407 has 24-hour police guard, metal shielding, combination locks on the doors, and is soundproof. The room also has a history. It was built as part of an addition to the Capitol's East facade in 1960 and during the Watergate investigation, Congressmen used it to meet with President Nixon's top aides. Nixon's Chief of State Alexander Hague was often seen nearby. Long after the Vietnam War had ended, Henry Kissinger testified there about the fate of American POWs and MIAs.
More recently, during President Clinton's impeachment trial, his loyal friend Vernon Jordan was grilled inside the room for about three hours. And, of course, House and Senate Intelligence Committee members head up there for their most classified briefings.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: And shortly, we'll speak to a man on the inside, Congressman Saxby Chambliss of Georgia, a member of the House Intelligence Committee.
Also, here's your chance to weigh in on this important story. Our Web question of the day is this: Do you think today's congressional hearings into the September 11 failures will prevent another terrorist attacks? You can vote at my Web page, cnn.com/wolf. While you're there, let me know what you're thinking. There's a "click here" icon on the left side of the page. Send me your comments. I'll read some of them on the air each day at the end of this program. That's also, by the way, where you can read my daily online column, cnn.com/wolf.
A test conducted by NORAD today was an annual exercise, but it's getting much more attention than usual in the aftermath of September 11. The test simulated the hijackings of two airliners.
CNN's Patty Davis gives us a look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PATTY DAVIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): A 757 like this one hijacked as it leaves Salt Lake City, Utah for Honolulu. It's diverted to Elmendorf Air Force Base in Anchorage, Alaska. A Navy C-9 hijacked in midair as it heads from Whidbey Island Naval Air Station to Vancouver International Airport. U.S. and Canadian military jets scrambled to intercept the two planes.
It's a scenario that seemed all too real coming nearly nine months after the September 11 terrorist hijackings, but these hijackings were not real. They were a joint U.S.-Canadian terrorism exercise run by NORAD, the North American Aerospace Defense Command.
The simulated hijackings to make sure both countries, as well as the FBI, air traffic control, the airlines are talking and coordinating if such an event should happen again. The exercise called Amalgam Virgo II was planned before the September 11 attacks.
About 1,500 people took part in the air and on the ground. There was no live fire, no paying passengers, FBI agents and Royal Canadian Mounted Police acting as the hijackers in the air and crisis negotiators on the ground. The scrambled jets practicing two different scenarios, forcing the hijacked planes to land or, what is the last resort now, shooting them down.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
DAVIS: Worry the mock hijackings might set off a panic if they played out over open air traffic control channels, NORAD made sure the public knew it was just a drill, but the details and conclusions of what happened in the air and on the ground are classified. A spokesman says NORAD doesn't want the Osama bin Ladens of the world to see how next time, they might be stopped -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Patty Davis here in Washington, thank you very much. President Bush, meanwhile, got some help today from an unexpected source when the House Democratic Leader Richard Gephardt voiced support for the president's determination to topple Iraq's Saddam Hussein one way or another.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. RICHARD GEPHARDT (D-MO), MINORITY LEADER: New foreign policy initiatives can help remove one of the legs of Saddam's survival by reducing the desperation of many in the Arab world who see him as a defiant ray of hope. At the same time, we should be prepared to remove the other leg with the use of force.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Richard Gephardt speaking earlier today here in Washington, and I spoke with the House Democratic Leader just a short while ago.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: Mr. Leader, thanks so much for joining us. You gave a very detailed, lengthy speech on foreign affairs. You seem to give the green light, at least from your perspective, to the president to attack Saddam Hussein in Iraq if necessary. Is that what you've done?
GEPHARDT: Well first, I tried to set out what I hope is a tough and new and bipartisan foreign policy for our country. I think George Bush is right in identifying Saddam Hussein as a threat to not only countries in the region, but ultimately to the United States. I call for diplomatic efforts to try to get him to stop making weapons of mass destruction, but I say that if that doesn't work and the president brings a plan and we want to bring that plan with the president to use military power, I would support that effort if the plan makes sense.
BLITZER: Your democratic colleague in the Senate, Diane Feinstein, a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee, was on my program Sunday and she seems to disagree with you. I want you to listen to what she says.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SEN. DIANNE FEINSTEIN (D), CALIFORNIA: I think it would be a terrible mistake for the United States unilaterally to attack Iraq and to do so without any congressional authorization. I think a peremptory attack without full debate in the Congress would be a terrible mistake.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER: Do you disagree with her on those points?
GEPHARDT: I don't think so, Wolf. I did not say today that I think he should do this without congressional collaboration and authorization. I think all that's important. I said in the speech that we should build this policy together, that we should use all the diplomatic means at our disposal first, but then if military action is the only way to get this done, it should be built with the Congress. I think there should be authorization of the Congress and I would hope we would have that.
BLITZER: So you would want a formal resolution to be enacted, to be passed in the House of Representatives before President Bush struck, ordered military action against Iraq?
GEPHARDT: In a democracy, we do these things together. The Congress authorizes, declares war. Presidents ask Congress to do that. That should be done in this case, but again, this is a policy that should be built together in a bipartisan way. We should collaborate early and often. We have been doing that to some extent. We need to do a lot more of it. We all need to be on the same page, and the American people need to know what policy is being propounded and what they're going to be called on to do as well.
BLITZER: You also heard President Bush today say stop the blame game right now as far as the intelligence failures prior to September 11. Is there too much of that going on as these hearings begin, the House-Senate Joint Intelligence Committee hearings begin, the FBI trying to protect itself, the CIA trying to protect itself?
GEPHARDT: Wolf, we've got to get past the blame game. We got to get the facts on the table. In a democracy, the truth and the facts are our friends, and we have to get past the worry about the blame game and get the facts out in front of people so we can all do better the next time.
I have no doubt that everybody in the CIA, everybody in the FBI did their best before September the 11th. That's not the question. The question is how do we all do better the next time something like this happens?
So that's what this inquiry's got to be about. I think everybody involved has got to stop worrying less about who's going to get the blame. The facts, the unvarnished facts, the truth have to be put in front of people so we can do better next time.
BLITZER: But those officials who did make mistakes in failing to anticipate what was going on, should they pay a price for those mistakes?
GEPHARDT: Well, Wolf, if laws were broken, if things that are wrong under our legal system were done, then obviously people have to stand in the justice system for that. But again, if we can't get the mistakes, the lapses out on the table, if they existed, then we're never going to do better the next time. We've almost got a crisis of trust in our country right now.
It's not just what the CIA and the FBI did. We've got corporations that are being called by their accounting firms, or by the public for what was done. We even have the Catholic Church being questioned today. There's a crisis of trust with a lot of our institutions.
The great thing about democracy is we've always had the ability to get our failures out, to understand what went wrong, and then to try to fix the problem.
Now you got to do that consistent with the criminal justice system. I'm not saying that it shouldn't operate, but we've got to do what democracy always does best and that's deal with the honest truth.
BLITZER: Mr. Leader, thanks for joining us.
GEPHARDT: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: When we come back, we'll speak to someone who was on the inside during the top secret meeting of the House-Senate Intelligence Committee. Representative Saxby Chambliss will join me live.
Also, should the government hand out pills to protect you against nuclear radiation? Our doctor Sanjay Gupta on the terror medicine, stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: More now on our top story, the start of House-Senate Intelligence Committee hearings on failures that may have occurred in anticipating the September 11 attacks. Joining me live now from Capitol Hill Congressman Saxby Chambliss, a Republican of Georgia, a member of the House Intelligence Committee. Congressman, thanks for joining us. Tell us what happened on this Day One of these historic hearings.
REP. SAXBY CHAMBLISS (R), GEORGIA: Well, Wolf, today was a matter of trying to get some administrative matters out of the way so that we can get down to the meat of these hearings.
We got a lot of issues resolved with respect to the scope of the hearing, and there will be a document that's going to be coming out either tonight or probably early tomorrow, which is going to be a public document detailing the scope of the hearings that we're going to participate in. And basically, it's what you would expect. We're going to look at pre-September 11, what the facts were with respect to the threats that existed out there, how they were handled, and how the information that was gathered was disseminated, who it went to and who it didn't go to.
We're going to look at obviously what deficiencies existed, but primarily our goal is to move forward. This is not a matter of pointing fingers or not a matter of finding fault. We want to find facts. Once we find facts, we're going to make certain recommendations and hopefully will not allow those facts to ever occur again.
BLITZER: Did you learn anything today without giving us classified information, which you obviously can't do, that was shocking, that would shock the American public if they knew what you knew?
CHAMBLISS: No, not today. Pretty much the information that we had today was kind of where we are with respect an update on particular situations that are out there, but nothing shocking today.
BLITZER: What is shocking, though, to a lot of Americans, as you well know, Congressman, is the finger pointing, the blame game between the CIA and the FBI, each of these agencies apparently blaming the other for some of the failures that occurred.
You heard the president speak out against that earlier today. Is this just normal bureaucratic politics here in Washington?
CHAMBLISS: Well, I'm afraid it's more human nature than anything else and it's got to stop. We can't have that. We've got to move forward. We've got to give the American people comfort in knowing that we're doing the very best job we can gathering intelligence and providing law enforcement with respect to their protection when it comes to disrupting and gathering information on terrorists.
So this blame game does nobody any good. We're not headhunters over here on the Hill right now, so the fact they're pointing fingers serves nobody's advantage.
BLITZER: Did you see the headline in USA Today, the newspaper, a very, very bold headline saying: "The United States had agents inside al Qaeda." And then Richard Shelby the Republican Vice Chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, your colleague on this joint panel saying: "If they had acted on the information they had," meaning the U.S. Government, "and followed through, maybe things would be different."
CHAMBLISS: Well, I did see that and I saw Senator Shelby's comments and, of course, everybody's entitled to their own opinion. But I'll be honest, I have not seen anything, Wolf, that would make me believe that there's anything number one that we could have done different that would have stopped the instance of September 11 from happening.
Now, are there some things that we should have done and we didn't do? You bet there are. We don't know really what might have happened if we had done all of the things that we're going to go back with 20/20 hindsight and decide that should have been done.
But I just -- I don't know of anything now that could have been done that really for 100 percent sure would have stopped September 11 from happening.
BLITZER: There was also a bold declaration by the Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak in an interview published today in the New York Times, in which he said that his government did provide the U.S. intelligence community with information about what he described as a big event, a big event that was about to take place, although he didn't have specifics. Did the Egyptian Government provide that kind of sensitive information about a terrorist plot by Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda in advance of September 11?
CHAMBLISS: Well the specific information was not provided. There is an ongoing dialogue between the CID, which is the Egyptian counterpart to the CIA, with the CIA, and with the FBI. That's a great working relationship that we have there and certainly information has been shared.
But you know, the Mubarak statement really is not new news. I mean we knew that there was a lot of activity out there in the terrorist community. We were intercepting a lot more messages, but nobody had any idea that September 11 was the day, that New York was the city and Washington was the city and this is going to be the form of the attack. So that news really doesn't add much to what we already knew.
BLITZER: Congressman Saxby Chambliss, thanks for sharing your impressions on this Day One. I'm sure we'll be back to you often as these hearings continue through the summer, appreciate it.
CHAMBLISS: Thank you.
BLITZER: And beginning Saturday, people who live near the Indian Point Nuclear Power Plant in New York State will be able to get a free potassium iodide pill, just in case there's an emergency at that plant. While it helps protect the thyroid, the drug does not offer overall protection from radiation.
CNN medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta joins us now with some answers to this question.
First of all, Sanjay, what's the point, what's the need for this specific pill?
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well you know in order to best understand this, Wolf, it's best to look at past history. We have some data from Chernobyl and from Three Mile Island in the past. What we learned from those incidents is when a lot of radiation is released into the air, that radiation can have all sorts of effects. Radiation sickness we know about, but it can also spread out and possibly cause thyroid cancers up to 3,000 cases of thyroid cancer more after Chernobyl than would have otherwise been expected. So this is the sort of concern here, Wolf.
BLITZER: How does this bill specifically prevent thyroid cancer?
GUPTA: Well this potassium iodide pill, it's sort of an interesting thing and you really have to get an animation to sort of best describe this. But if the body is consistently bombarded with radiation particles and we see these radiation particles from past examples like at Chernobyl, Three Mile Island, they sort of get into the body. They eventually get into the bloodstream.
You see the potassium iodide pill there. If you take the potassium iodide pill, it circulates through the bloodstream, actually goes through the bloodstream all the way up to the thyroid gland and actually fills the thyroid gland with iodide, which is a safe substance.
Now in the future if potential -- here you see the radioactive particles actually circulating through the bloodstream. They actually go through the bloodstream and now you can see those same radioactive particles can not get into the thyroid gland, so that's what you see, the thyroid gland -- so with the thyroid gland, you'll see that the thyroid gland does not actually accept any of those radioactive particles. It's kind of like thinking about moving a car into an already filled space and therefore you can not get radiation, probably cancer, probably reduced radiation cancer from these radiation particles.
Now it's important to keep in mind that this potassium iodide will not prevent other sorts of cancers. It just prevents thyroid cancer and also it should not take the place of actually evacuating a circumstance if you actually get put into that circumstance.
So that's a little bit on potassium iodide and the news out of West Chester County and actually passing out one pill per person to about 140,000 people in that ten-mile radius. We'll have a lot more just after this break. Thank you very much.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: Here's a look at some of our top stories. Catholic bishops in the United States are proposing new rules for disciplining priests accused of sexually abusing young people. The report recommends defrocking priests who abuse in the future, but allows priests who committed one offense in the past to remain priests.
The State Department is issuing a stronger travel warning for India and Pakistan, urging all U.S. citizens to depart both countries. This warning comes in part because few Americans left under previous warnings. There are about 70,000 Americans in those two countries.
As smoke pours out of a building in suburban Tel Aviv, firefighters, police and paramedics respond. This time, though, it was only a drill. Israel simulated the results of a plane slamming into this 30-story building, complete with injuries, fake news crews, even an additional car bomb in the parking lot causing a hazardous material spill. Following the September 11 attacks, Americans have been debating precautions against air terrorism, and how far should they go? Civil rights groups filed suit today against four major airlines, saying five men were removed from flights simply because they looked Middle Eastern.
CNN's Michael Okwu has the story on one of those men.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MICHAEL OKWU, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On New Year's Eve 2001, Michael Dasrath boarded a Continental Airlines jet bound for Tampa. His intention: to ring in the new year with his wife and two sons. He never got the chance.
Dasrath says a female passenger who had been observing him and two other men seated just in front of his first class seat convinced the pilot to eject them from the flight.
MICHAEL DASRATH, PLAINTIFF: She basically said, these brown- skinned men are behaving suspiciously. He just kind of nodded at her. He walked up to the front, looked at me, looked at the two in front of me, didn't say nothing. The next thing I know, one of the gate agents is calling our names.
OKWU: Dasrath, a U.S. citizen born in Guyana, says he was escorted off the flight without explanation.
DASRATH: No security personnel came over and questioned us. Nothing. Nothing at all. In fact, form that gate we were hurried on to another flight.
OKWU: Dasrath is one of five plaintiffs in lawsuits filed by the ACLU against four airlines: American, United, Northwest and Continental.
The suits were filed in federal district courts in New Jersey, Maryland and California, and claim the airlines discriminated against the men based on their perceived Middle Eastern ethnicities. Only two of the men are actually of Arab descent.
The ACLU says the airlines violated their civil rights to make contracts.
REGGIE SHUFORD, ACLU: The contract in this case was the ticket that the plaintiffs purchased from the airlines. And we believe that their behavior violated their right to make and enforce that contract.
OKWU (on camera): Since September 11, the airlines have looked for ways to insure safety for its passengers without discriminating. Since 9/11, the Department of Transportation has recorded 31 complaints, and they say the numbers have tapered off. Arab-American groups say they've recorded twice as many, and they've noticed no decline.
(voice-over): The four airlines involved in the suit say they don't discriminate, and they refused to discuss security measures; although they did say it's the captains who have the final say on whether a passenger should be ejected.
Earlier this year, polls found nearly half of Americans believe the country should take steps against terrorism, even if civil liberties are violated. Dasrath and his attorneys say the airlines have caved into hysteria, taking the easy way out by inconveniencing a few passengers in favor of many.
DASRATH: Through our lawsuit, I hope they stop it. It's wrong. It goes against everything which is American.
OKWU: The easy way out, he says, is not cost-free.
Michael Okwu, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: So is racial or ethnic profiling an necessary tool to protect America against terrorism?
Joining us now to discuss that question are Ben Wizner of the American Civil Liberties Union -- actually that's Congressman Scott McInnis of Colorado that you're seeing. Ben Wizner is with the American Civil Liberties Union, he joins us as well.
First of all, to you, Congressman McInnis. You've told us in the past that there is place for profiling on these planes. Why?
REP. SCOTT MCINNIS (R), COLORADO: Well, there's no question that we use -- that there is a place for risk profiling. Remember, we use profiling in every different aspect of our life. We use it in schooling, CNN uses it to determine what their listening audience is out there. It's only common sense.
Now, we shouldn't use racial profiling that is based strictly on race. But as a contributing factor to the risk profile, it is absolutely necessary. And any opposition to it is simply people trying to be overly politically correct. And we'll pay a big price if we don't come to our senses on this.
BLITZER: Is that a fair assessment, Ben Wizner?
BEN WIZNER, STAFF ATTORNEY, ACLU: Well, not at all. And I want to be pretty clear about what happened in our cases.
What happened here was not racial profiling. It was out-and-out racial punishment. All of the plaintiffs in these cases have been subjected to security measures and then some. They have been checked again at the gate before they got on the planes.
They were profiled, and that is not what they're complaining about. What they're complaining about is that they were moved from the aircraft that they were on simply because someone else expressed discomfort with flying with them. And it had nothing to do with security. Let me give you an example...
BLITZER: But didn't -- let me interrupt for a second.
WIZNER: Sure.
BLITZER: Weren't they removed, not necessarily because someone expressed discomfort, but because the pilot who is in charge of that aircraft determined that would be a prudent step?
WIZNER: Well, the pilot ultimately has the discretion. In our case, it was the head of ground security for United Airlines who escorted our client of the flight. He overheard her saying to a police officer, this man has done nothing wrong. And she said to him, the crew does not feel comfortable onboard.
And just to give you some facts, they did not search him or question him again. They promptly offered him a boarding pass for the very next flight, and the plane took off with his bags onboard. So clearly they weren't worried about security. Even the pilot wasn't worried about security, or he wouldn't have let my client's bags stay on the plane.
BLITZER: Let me ask Congressman McInnis, obviously you're not involved directly in this case, but is there room for this kind of behavior by airline pilots as well as security personnel?
MCINNIS: Look, Wolf, this is a demonstration of a race to the courts. They can't wait -- the ACLU can't wait until they find one example where the risk profile may have been misapplied and they may run as fast as they can to the courthouse to file a lawsuit and cash in on the deal.
Look, we have thousands and thousands of flights every day. We have hundreds of thousands of passengers who are going through these risk assessments, who are going through security. And I think it is wrong for the ACLU to pick one example out of these tens of thousands everyday, and then run to the court and talk about how the whole system is broken down, and it isn't going to help us with security for this country.
BLITZER: Mr. Wizner?
WIZNER: Yes, thanks for letting me respond to that. First of all, the ACLU doesn't cash in on anything. We never accept any compensation for our cases.
Second of all, this is no rush to the court. And as your piece -- your lead-in peace made clear, the airlines have known about this since September. And the Department of Transportation has made clear to them in message after message that you cannot do this profiling based on race alone. And the congressman even agreed with that. And Attorney General Ashcroft has said that racial profiling in these instances is not legal.
This is no rush to the court. In fact, we would much rather sit down with these airlines and talk about guidelines that they can put in place to make sure that their employees follow civil rights laws.
MCINNIS: So I guess, Wolf, if each of these plaintiffs got an apology from the airline, since ACLU is saying that they're not running to the courts to do this, they'd be fine with that.
My guess is they want the publicity on this, and they're trying to push this political correctness. And the ACLU, once again, is at the forefront.
BLITZER: On that specific point, Mr. Wizner, in this atmosphere that currently exists after September 11, it seems like the -- all the polls suggest the public is willing to give up some of their civil liberties in exchange for greater security.
WIZNER: I think that's right. And I think we all are. And I think my client has made clear that we're all willing to give up convenience, to sacrifice some of that, in order to make air transportation safe.
He is not complaining about the three security searches that took place on him before he got on the airplane. None of us are. The ACLU, for years, has been advocating for stronger cockpit doors. We're not saying that airport security is a bad thing. And we all have to make some sacrifices.
But what happened right here was that the airline was accommodating the prejudices of passengers and crew members at the expense of civil liberties. And that's unacceptable.
BLITZER: Congressman McInnis, let me give you the last word. Go ahead.
MCINNIS: Sure. I read some comments about -- I'm not sure it's his claim -- but amongst this group of plaintiffs about how they -- it destroying their soul. And I heard all the kind of language -- they talked about how devastating this was to them one time.
This is a one-time incident. And I'm saying to you, when we do this tens of thousands of times every day, we're going to have a mistake here and there. But the ACLU won't accept an apology for one mistake. It happened to his client one time. He's now filed in the courts. And now what's happening is they're making the guards super- sensitive the other way.
I ask a guard the other day, I said, what if you stop somebody -- are you afraid to stop somebody based on a racial aspect of a risk profile, where they fit the risk? And he said, look, we can get in a lot of trouble if we stop somebody of color.
BLITZER: Unfortunately we have to leave it right there. Congressman Scott McInnis and Ben Wizner of the ACLU, thanks to both of you for joining us.
WIZNER: Thank you Wolf.
BLITZER: Ten years ago authorities discover a series of mysterious deaths at a Missouri hospital. Now police say they've solved the mystery.
In a mystery of another kind, authorities in L.A. searched this swimming pool yesterday for a missing body; they found nothing. Today they found a body.
And while he waits for the jury to decide his fate, accused murderer Michael Skakel suffers the wrath of the judge.
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BLITZER: Welcome back.
A nurse is supposed be a healer, but a nurse in Missouri may have been a killer. Authorities have charged a VA hospital worker with murdering 10 patients, and the instigation isn't over yet.
CNN's Jeff Flock has our story.
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JEFF FLOCK, CNN CHICAGO BUREAU CHIEF (voice-over): The bodies were exhumed nine years ago. Suspicions went back farther than that, ever since an extraordinary number of people died here at the Harry Truman VA Hospital on this man's watch. Nurse Richard Williams worked the halls of the VA for less than eight months. But according to this government affidavit, 67 people died on his ward during that time; 41 while he was on duty. A statistical review found patients were 20 times more likely to die on his watch than any of the 11 other nurses on the ward.
DR. JAY DIX, MEDICAL EXAMINER, BOONE COUNTY: It was prey obvious that there was something suspicious going on. But there was never enough evidence for someone in my position to rule that these deaths were homicides.
FLOCK: Until now, say prosecutors, who have charges Williams with 10 murders.
KEVIN CRANE, BOONE COUNTY PROSECUTOR: It alleges that the defendant put succinylcholine into the body of each of these victims.
FLOCK: Boone County, Missouri prosecutor Kevin Crane explains that succinylcholine paralyzes patients who need to have a breathing tube put down their throat for surgery. Without breathing help, it causes quick paralysis and death.
When investigators dug up 13 bodies of VA patients in 1993, they didn't find any suspicious drugs, but there was no good test for succinylcholine then. They saved the tissue samples, though, and this year researchers came up with a new test. Succinylcholine was found in 10 of the 13 bodies, including Elsie (ph) Havrum's.
HELEN HAVRUM, WIDOW: I just thought, oh, good, they finally caught him.
FLOCK: Havrum's wife had already won a $450,000 judgment against the hospital in a 1998 civil suit, when a judge found the VA liable for failing to remove Williams from patient care after he was first suspected in the deaths in 1992.
HAVRUM: You know, after 10 years I thought that, I believe they're not going to catch him, I believe they're going to drop it.
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FLOCK: And Wolf, not only haven't they dropped it, they have also continued their instigation. Remember, 41 patients died on his watch back in 1992. There are only 10 murder allegations.
We also want to report that he pled not guilty today in court in Missouri. He is being held without bond. Next court appearance on the 18th of June.
That's the latest Wolf. Back to you.
BLITZER: Thank you very much, our Chicago bureau chief Jeff Flock.
And let's take a look at some of the other stories in our "Justice Files." The jury is deliberating in the murder trial of Kennedy cousin Michael Skakel. Skakel is accused of killing a 15- year-old neighbor more than a quarter-century ago in the upscale community of Greenwich, Connecticut. Skakel got a scolding from the judge today after he decided to leave the courthouse for an early lunch while the jury was still deliberating.
Stay with CNN, of course, for developments as they happen.
Opening statements began today in the trial of the man accused of murdering 7-year-old Danielle van Dam. 50-year-old David Westerfield, a neighbor, is charged with kidnapping the girl from her suburban San Diego home.
CNN's Thelma Gutierrez has been watching the trial, and she joins us now live -- Thelma.
THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, the prosecution laid out its case this morning. The defense concluded just a few minutes ago. Also, a witness was on the stand a few minutes ago -- a neighbor who was testifying about the day that Danielle was reported missing. That day was February 2. 7-year-old Danielle van Dam was last seen the night before, when her father tucked her into bed.
50-year-old David Westerfield, who lives two doors away from the van Dams, was arrested and charged with kidnapping and murder, and possession of child pornography. He has pled innocent to the charges. If convicted, he could face the death penalty.
Let's go live now to the courtroom, where we had mentioned that one witness, a neighbor, was on the stand. She lived across the street from the van Dams, and was one of the first people to learn that Danielle was missing. Now, earlier defense attorney Steven Feldman addressed jurors. Feldman said that the night before Danielle was reported missing, her mother Brenda smoked marijuana with friends and then went out for a wild night of dancing, he says. He painted the van Dams lifestyle as hedonistic, while saying that David Westerfield is a conservative computer engineer.
The prosecution told jurors that they had a mountain of physical evidence against David Westerfield, including Danielle's blood, hair and fingerprints. Now, Damon van Dam, the father, is expected to testify a little bit later today, possibly.
Wolf, back to you.
BLITZER: Thelma Gutierrez, covering the trial, thank you very much.
And how did the body of a missing 7-year-old boy turn up in the swimming pool at a posh southern California home? And if it was there all along, why wasn't it discovered earlier? Those are just two of the questions police would like to answer as they continue their investigation into the disappearance during a birthday party.
Let's go to CNN national correspondent Frank Buckley, he's got details -- Frank.
FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, this is the heartbreaking story of 7-year-old Paolo Ayala. He was dropped off at a birthday party here in Homebee (ph) Hills at this home behind me. Sunday afternoon when his parents came back to pick him up he was missing. Police launched a massive search. Flyers were distributed throughout the Los Angeles area. Police used the home here where the pool party took place as a command post until 10:00 last night. That's when they moved to another location.
This morning, a horrifying discovery in the pool. The boy's body was at the bottom of the pool, face up. He was found by a housekeeper. Police say he was deceased.
That led police to conclude that he must have been placed there overnight. Now they say it's possible -- it's possible -- that he was simply overlooked.
And here's what police said this morning. And right after that you'll hear what police are saying now.
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DAVID KALISH, LOS ANGELES POLICE: It's obvious that the boy's body was placed in the pool after we left last night.
And we had all the people who were at the party there look in the pool. The police officers responded, looked in the swimming pool. The mother of the victim, we talked to her again today, looked in the swimming pool. The pool man was here yesterday, and he added chemicals to the pool. He didn't vacuum or sweep it, but he added chemicals to the pool and did some work on it. He did not see the child in the pool.
Is it possible that he was there since Sunday? It's possible, but we don't know it.
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BUCKLEY: Autopsy on the boy is scheduled for tomorrow morning at 8:30 local time. Police say they should know more by then. Police are not ruling anything or anyone out as a suspect. They say it is very early in the investigation. They hope to more know -- hope to know more tomorrow morning after the autopsy -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Frank Buckley, thank you very much.
And right now the chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, Senator Bob Graham of Florida is addressing reporters after the first day of important hearings on intelligence failures prior to September 11.
Let's listen in.
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SEN. BOB GRAHAM (D), FLORIDA: ... purpose of a specific investigation. So there is no set of precedents or previous procedures to follow. We are going to be developing those as we go forward.
And the spirit of the meeting today was extremely constructive. Many good ideas and suggestions which were incorporated into the rules, and into the statement of our objectives. We have now, I think, laid the foundation. And beginning tomorrow, we will have staff briefings on the specifics areas that we will be having detailed, witness-driven hearings on as we move forward.
The -- under the rules that we adopted today, the House will be chairing the meetings for one week, and the Senate for the next. This week is the House -- week chairs.
I'd like to call on Congressman Porter Goss, who did an outstanding job with the gavel today.
REP. PORTER GOSS (R), FLORIDA: Thank you very much Senator.
I will say one thing, if anybody wondered whether 37 members of the House and the Senate could get together on a bipartisan basis and spend three hours productively together, the answer is yes. We did it today.
We had an excellent business meeting. I think we clearly understood the rules we're going to operate under. We had lots of positive participation and input across the board. And I am very much heartened by the progress we've made. In fact, we're a little bit ahead of schedule. We weren't supposed to be he until 6:00. That's how good it was. And we've moved up some of the hearings from -- we were planning for Thursday up to tomorrow. So we're off and running with momentum. And I think that our mission is very clear on behalf of the American people. I think everybody in the room understands it. It's one of the few times I've ever been on a committee in Congress where the members actually outnumber the staff. So I think we are going to be very definitely heavy member participation in this. And we will be a fact-driven, witness-driven reviewed inquiry.
We will not be driven by outside pressures. And I think we certainly saw that by some of the decisions we made today, which regrettably I can't go more into because they would be considered classified business under our rules.
But I'm very encouraged. I want to thank Nancy Pelosi, my ranking member, Senator Graham and Senator Shelby...
BLITZER: Congressman Porter Goss and Senator Bob Graham, the co- chairman of these important Intelligence Committee hearings that began today. That's our top story -- the story involving intelligence failures that may have occurred before September 11. This is just day one of these closed-door hearings that will be going on for several days, and then for weeks thereafter throughout the summer as the House and Senate Intelligence Committees move jointly to try to find out what mistakes may have occurred leading up to September 11.
After four days of rock stars, royalty and rockets' red glare, the queen's Jubilee celebration prepares for a storybook ending, complete with a horse-drawn carriage and several princes. And then, the Jubilee takes to the sky for the showstopper. The Cinderella- meets-Top Gun finish. It's all next. With a live report, Christiane Amanpour will join me from London when we come back.
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BLITZER: Britain today threw a spectacular pomp-laden bash to wrap up its tribute to Queen Elizabeth and her half-century on the throne.
CNN's Christiane Amanpour watched the celebrations unfold in London. She joins us once again, live from the British capital.
Christiane, another exciting day out there?
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It really was, Wolf. And, of course, it's all over now. But about four or five hours ago the queen came onto the balcony at Buckingham Palace, and the crowd really thundered a roar of approval back. She came out for three encores, if you like, onto the balcony. They were singing "Land of Hope and Glory." The Concorde did a patriotic fly pass with a lot of airplanes as well.
And this has been a really colorful end to a long, four-day Jubilee weekend.
We're joined here by the Queen's Communication Secretary Simon Walker. Everybody wants to know, Simon, after seeing the Queen on that balcony, what does she feel about this weekend? You've talked to her.
SIMON WALKER, QUEEN'S COMMUNICATION SECRETARY: I think the Queen has loved it. I think she's had a wonderful time. She's talked about how proud and grateful she is to the people of this country, and the commonwealth and internationally for the weekend she's had.
I mean, it's been a terrific celebration; millions of people out in the street; hundreds and millions of people watching it on television. And a fantastic time it's been.
AMANPOUR: And the incredible floats, and the color, and the parades, and people -- was she -- were you really expecting this to happen? Because just six months ago you were all a little nervous.
WALKER: No, we were nervous. We didn't think it would be quite this sort of level. I mean, it's exceed our wildest expectations and hopes.
And to see those kids waving flags out there. I mean, it's across generations. It's been people of all kinds -- all shapes and sizes right across the whole country. And they've all been unified by support for the Queen for 50 years.
AMANPOUR: At what point did you know that you had sort of turned the corner, that it was going to be a triumph?
WALKER: Well, the classical concert was good, but I thought the pop concert last night, when we heard people like Brian May singing "God Save the Queen..."
AMANPOUR: From the roof.
WALKER: ... the roof of Buckingham Palace. That was fantastic. And that was a sight for sore eyes. I mean, we all loved that.
AMANPOUR: And today there was a lot of, sort of, the tradition. The Queen went out of Buckingham Palace in the gold stagecoach, which has only been used three times. And I think a lot of people really enjoyed seeing that part of the tradition.
But you have a business background. Tell me, what about this monarchy is so important to the fabric of Britain?
WALKER: Well, the whole principle of the Jubilee has been something for everyone. So it's ranged from St. Paul's Cathedral through to Ozzy Osbourne. And that's what the monarchy has got to be as well. It's got to offer something to everyone in our British society, in the whole country. I mean, however old you are, wherever you live, there has to be something in the monarchy that's brought together for you.
And that's a sense of continuity, as well. That's what the monarchy needs in order to succeed. AMANPOUR: Simon Walker, thank you very much, indeed, for joining us. And that is the end of this long Jubilee weekend which went off, as you heard, much, much better than anybody could have imagined. Really electrifying outside, here in the palace, all over London and, indeed, all over England as well -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Thank you very much, Christiane Amanpour. An exciting moment in British history.
Let's go live to New York now, get a preview of LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE. That, of course, begins right at the top of the hour -- Lou.
LOU DOBBS, "MONEYLINE": Wolf, thank you.
Coming up next: The leaders of Pakistan and India gathering in the same room at the same time, but neither speaking to the other. The ambassador of Pakistan is our guest tonight, and will tell us the likely course of events.
Lawmakers begin asking intelligence officials why they failed to pick up signals of that terrorist attack on September 11. We'll have a live report for you from Washington.
And this just in: It now appears the White House will turn over the Enron documents to the Senate. We'll have a live report from White House correspondent John King coming up.
Tyco's CEO has suddenly quit, and now suddenly been indicted for tax evasion.
All of that and a lot more ahead at the top of the hour. Please join us.
Now back to Wolf Blitzer -- Wolf.
BLITZER: Thank you very much, Lou.
Now here's your chance to weigh in on our Web question of the day. Earlier we asked: Do you think today's congressional hearings into September 11 will prevent another terrorist attack?
Look at the answers: 10 percent of you say yes, 90 percent of you say no. Remember, this is not -- repeat, not -- a scientific poll.
And that's all the time we have for you today. I'll see you tomorrow, of course, and every weekday at 5:00 p.m. Eastern. Until then, thanks very much for watching. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. LOU DOBBS MONEYLINE begins right now.
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