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CNN Wolf Blitzer Reports

New Saddam Tapes Confuse Officials on Whether Dictator is Alive or Dead

Aired April 18, 2003 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Out of hiding? Is this the face of Saddam Hussein? And what about the voice? New tapes raise new questions.

Trouble for the troops. Thousands of Iraqi protestors call for action.

The victims of Saddam's rule. Today the desperate search for survivors underground.

And the mystery of the mass graves. Who's buried here?

ANNOUNCER: CNN live this hour. WOLF BLITZER REPORTS. Live with correspondents from around the world.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Friday, April 18, 2003. Hello from CNN Center. I'm Miles O'Brien reporting. Wolf Blitzer is off today.

Did Saddam Hussein really escape several attempts to kill him? Topping our headlines from Iraq -- newly-released tapes purportedly of Saddam. In a moment, we're going to explore the images and examine the audio of a statement that may or may not be from Saddam Hussein.

At a mosque in Baghdad today, tens of thousands of Iraqis protested the presence of U.S. troops in their city. They shouted, waved fists, and hoisted banners. The demonstrators want the U.S. out and their government to be run by Iraqis.

And in the center of Baghdad, part of the ministry of information building is up in flames. Authorities say looters may be responsible for the fire. Some were seen stealing from the 10-story building. U.S. forces surrounded the structure to try and protect it.

This hour, we will check in with CNN's David Ensor, who is in Washington covering the scramble to authenticate the Saddam recordings. We'll also speak with Jaber Obeio, a reporter from for Abu Dhabi Television -- the organization that obtained those tapes.

We'll get to those reports in a moment -- but first to the tapes themselves. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN (voice-over): Whether he's dead, alive, in hiding, or on the run, Saddam Hussein continues to tweak his enemies. Today, an Arab television network shows videotape of a man it says is Saddam leading supporters last week in the streets of Baghdad.

Abu Dhabi TV says these scenes were shot on April 9, the day the capital fell to U.S.-led forces -- two days after a devastating allied air strike targeted Saddam in Baghdad. This tape was purportedly shot in the city's Azamiyah neighborhood, an area sympathetic to Saddam. Abu Dhabi TV says it got the tape from a credible source and believes it's authentic.

JASIM AL-AZZAWI, REPORTER, ABU DHABI TV: The location is definitely a Sunni stronghold -- Alabamia (ph) district in northern Baghdad. And it would have been a very logical and safe place for him to appear after Al Mansour -- that the possibility of betrayal or even somebody shooting him, it would have been extremely negligibile.

O'BRIEN: But as U.S. officials analyze the tape, many observers are skeptical. This could be one of Saddam's body doubles.

Also shown -- a man strongly resembling Saddam's younger son, Qusay. Abu Dhabi says they believe it is Qusay. Still, one Saddam expert finds this videotape, at the very least, curious.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Before the war started, Saddam had not been seen on the streets of Baghdad for years. I mean, this is the whole reason he used the doubles.

Saddam was afraid of the Iraqi public. He hid himself away. He didn't want anyone to see him, and then suddenly the war starts and we've had two walkabouts in the space of two weeks.

O'BRIEN: Adding to the mystery, today Abu Dhabi TV also aired an audiotape of a speech it says was made by Saddam. The network says this too was recorded on April 9. That day, allied tanks rolled right into the capital.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): And we are confident that victory at the end will be ours and that God will help us as much as we have stamina and belief to confront all the people.

O'BRIEN: So we're left with a series of video and audiotapes -- leaving few answers and some burning questions.

When were they made? Where? And especially, of whom?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: The latest video purports to show Saddam Hussein playing in the crowd and playing to the crowd in the Azamiyah neighborhood of Baghdad. But hit hard by U.S. bombs, the tree-lined district near the Tigris River is considered a stronghold of Saddam loyalists -- or at least was. U.S. Marines battled diehards there two days after the videotape was allegedly made. Azamiyah is across the river from the exclusive Al Mansour neighborhood, where a U.S. aircraft dropped bunker buster bombs on a suspected Saddam hideout. That decapitation raid came two days before Saddam was supposedly sighted and taped in Azamiyah.

U.S. Intelligence experts have started to examine the new tapes. Let's go live to our national security correspondent, David Ensor, for more on that -- David.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, the working assumption -- at least for the moment -- is that it probably is Saddam Hussein on the tapes. They'll know more once they've analyzed the voice on the voice tapes, and in a day or two they should be able to be pretty sure about that.

The question, though, is -- When were these tapes made?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR (voice-over): The question for U.S. Intelligence -- were these two images recorded on the same day? Was Saddam Hussein rallying supporters in one Baghdad neighborhood even as his statue came down in another part of town on April 9?

The al Azamiyah neighborhood is just over four miles from Firdos Square, where U.S. forces helped bring down the statue. Assuming this is Saddam and if it really were recorded on April 9, then clearly he has survived the attempt to kill him on the evening of April 7. So, apparently, did his son Qusay -- seen on the new tape just to the right of his father.

There were reports Saddam Hussein might have been in Al Azamiyah April 9, but CNN could not find anyone in the neighborhood Friday who remembered seeing him there since March.

U.S. officials are skeptical too -- partly because of their analysis of this other tape. Released earlier, it was said to be Saddam Hussein on the streets of Baghdad on April 4.

Not true, say U.S. officials. They believe it was most likely taped in early March. They've based that on certain changes in the background to buildings and the like. Note also the relatively warm clothes worn -- suitable for early March. By April, it had gotten much warmer.

Administration officials from the president on down are saying what matters is not whether the dictator still lives but that the regime's control has collapsed. But to U.S. military and Intelligence officials, Saddam's fate does matter.

KEN POLLACK, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: As long as Saddam Hussein is out there, The United States is not going to be finished with this war -- at least in the sense that, as long as Saddam is out there, there may be loyalists who are willing to fight for him. ENSOR: As for the audiotape -- also broadcast Friday by Abu Dhabi television -- U.S. Intelligence will be able to say soon whether it's Saddam Hussein's voice or not.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): And we are confident that victory, at the end, will be ours.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR: The trouble is whether it's his voice or not, there may be no way to assess when it was made so the audiotape may not provide any clue as to whether Saddam Hussein is alive or dead. And that, of course, is something U.S. officials would very much like to know -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Thank you very much, CNN's David Ensor in Washington. Appreciate it.

Let's turn now to the man who came up with the new tapes. Jaber Obeio is a Baghdad-based reporter and an anchor for Abu Dhabi television. He joins us now live from the Iraqi capital. Mr. Obeid, good to have you with us.

JABER OBEID, ABU DHABI TELEVISION ANCHOR: Thank you, Miles.

O'BRIEN: How do you know it's authentic?

OBEID: Well, Miles, before I answer the question, let me state something very important over here.

We have been hearing rumors about people seeing Saddam in Al Azamiyah since the 9th of April. We have spoken to eyewitnesses who have sworn that they have seen Saddam Hussein on that particular date. We have never aired those statements -- neither spoken about the rumors -- because we lack the evidence.

Today we were approached. We were contacted by the person who had shot the footages and recorded the speech. He works in a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) production house which was chosen by the government -- by the Iraqi previous government to work in case the Iraqi governmental television and radio station were hid by the American forces.

We have the name of the person, but he's not willing to come forward and testify to this because he's afraid for his safety.

O'BRIEN: All right. So you believe it to be a credible source from the tape. We'll take that at face value.

The next question would be -- are you convinced that who we are seeing in this tape are the real people? Is it really Saddam Hussein? Is it really Qusay? Is it really some of the inner circle of Saddam Hussein that we are seeing?

OBEID: I'm not in a position to verify whether whom we have seen today was Saddam Hussein himself or was his duplicates, as they say, because the Iraqi people -- the USA government has failed to identify whether he is the real Saddam Hussein president or his duplicates.

The Iraqi people have failed to do so and, definitely, neither us nor anybody else can confirm this, but we are concerned that whomever he was, whether Saddam Hussein or whether his duplicates, it was shot and recorded on the 9th of April.

I hold today also, Miles, documents that concerns the same. I wouldn't be able to say anything about them because we just aired them half an hour ago on Abu Dhabi TV. We have documents, we have new documents testifying or confirming that what has been shown on Abu Dhabi TV was the real footage of Saddam Hussein and the real speech of Saddam Hussein and it was recorded and shot at the 9th of April.

O'BRIEN: How can you be certain about the date when both of those tapes were recorded?

OBIED: Well, we have the man who have shot the footage and recorded the speech. He's willing to come forward and testify if he was guaranteed his safety, and we have the rumors which was -- which spread around since the 9th of April, and we have eyewitnesses who have seen this and they were there when the event took place.

O'BRIEN: Jaber Obied, all right. Thank you very much. We appreciate giving us some backstory on how this tape came to be. Joining us live from Baghdad.

Now here's your turn to weigh in on the war in Iraq. "Our Web Question of the Day" is do you think the latest tape of Saddam Hussein proves he's alive? We'll have the results later in the broadcast. We invite you to vote at cnn.com/wolf.

Caught in the crosshairs. The capture of another top Iraqi leader. So where are the others?

Also, the Private Ryan who wasn't saved. A troubled teen who turned his life around and ended up fighting in a war in Iraq.

Plus, a palace outfitted with everything, but a Mini Me. It's truly shagadelic.

But first these images from Baghdad.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Disturbing discoveries in the new Iraq. Coming up, who did the looters scare away and why are the helpless left behind?

And fallout from companies trying to capitalize on the Shock and Awe campaign. Those stories still ahead on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Here's another tragedy of the war. These patients of a Baghdad mental hospital are on their own, at least for now. Doctors and staff members evacuated after they were overwhelmed by looters last week. One patient told reporters looters took just about everything from the hospital, one of only two such facilities in the capital. A mosque and the Red Cross are providing food and water to about 400 of those mental patients.

Baghdad looters also made off with vials of polio virus from Iraq's Central Public Health Lab. The World Health Organization says the theft does not pose an immediate health risk, however. Most of the vials were dumped on the ground outside the lab. Officials say it's unlikely the lab had wild polio virus-controlled specimens, but if it did the specimens would deteriorate once it was removed from refrigerators. Iraq has been polio-free for more than two years now.

A city of stark contrast. Pockets of chaos and order, violence and them coming together in prayer. All part of life today in the new Baghdad. CNN's Jim Clancy joining us live in the Iraqi capital with the latest from there. Jim, any progress on getting the lights on?

JIM CLANCY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, there is progress being made, but it's a little slow. I was told the lights would be well on by now. They are not because the problem more complicated. It is being worked on.

People talking now in terms of perhaps Sunday the lights will come back on, but they're going to have to bring gas all of the way down from Kirkuk in order to fire up generators so they have enough electricity to jumpstart, as they say, the entire grid here to get the city really up and running again. Some areas temporarily had some electricity into them.

But on another front, people are dealing with a political power vacuum. Yes the regime of President Saddam Hussein is gone, but it's giving way to struggles for hearts and minds on the political front.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY (voice-over): In a rare display of unity, both Shia and Sunni Muslim Iraqis joined together in prayers Friday. Islamic unity was the theme, but the U.S. came in for criticism. One cleric said the Americans topple the regime for Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and were not to be trusted it.

The incendiary mix of religion and politics predictably spilled out into the streets. A large demonstration asserting Muslim unity laid down a challenge to any outside efforts to impose a U.S.-led regime in Baghdad.

Elsewhere, an eerie sense of normalcy co-existed with the unbridled violence of the past week. As men looked on from a shabby streetside cafe, the body of a looter lay a few meters away. Another uncollected casualties lay nearby. This man, we were told, was gunned down for $150.

Below Baghdad streets, urban legend ends live on. Thousands of people gathered around this traffic tunnel ripping apart ventilation shafts in the mistaken belief they would find secret prisons where loved ones had survived the regime and waited to be rescued. Crushing one another from a closer look, any reactions from those below stirred rumors another ghost from the past had emerged from a subterranean nightmare. No one alive or dead was found, but hope dies hard when there is so little else left.

Others who ventured out took advantage of a bristling trade in transport. As confidence returns, private buses and taxies shuttle residents between cities or neighborhoods, giving Iraqis living proof loved ones were all right. Another sign the city was struggling to its feet.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY: It continues to struggle on the political front, certainly on the economic front and humanitarian fronts as well. But there are clear sign, Miles, things are getting better.

O'BRIEN: Jim, not to stress this power situation too much, but I think it's worth underscoring to the extent that the U.S. has been unable to this point to get the lights back on. How much does that decrease the confidence that many Iraqis have in the U.S. as liberators, occupier, whatever you want to call them?

CLANCY: Well, I think that once the light comes on it won't matter much. But I think that certainly it is something that the U.S. needs and that the military is fully aware of.

I saw -- there's a general that's assigned taking care of this. They have a task force called Operation Dawn. They're working on it because it does send that message that says, look, we're in charge, we can run the show. More importantly, you, the Iraqis can run the show. You didn't need President Saddam Hussein. But they need to get those lights up and running.

It's also got a lot to do with the rumors. There's no newspapers, there's no television, there's no radio heard by so many people and the rumors themselves are creating problems, instability, if you will -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: All right, Jim Clancy, thanks very much, live from Baghdad.

Rescued from behind Iraqi lines. Hear from a former POW in his own words.

Plus, from troubled teen to an American hero. The story of one young man who didn't make it home.

And the man who has apparently nine lives, Saddam Hussein, the new tapes, but does it mean we're any closer to knowing if he's really dead or alive? We'll take a closer look at that.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Smiling, waving and from all appearances, in good health. Seven former approximate POWs greeted supporters outside Germany's Landstuhl Medical Center today. Army officials say after being held prisoner in Iraq for three weeks, the group will return to the states tomorrow. Their journey home to their families is one they look forward to make, to say the least.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CWO DAVID WILLIAMS, FORMER POW: I'd like to take a brief moment to let everyone know that we're receiving outstanding medical care and I'd like to thank all of my fellow Americans. We all would like to thank our Americans for the tremendous support we've been getting. And we're looking forward to coming home as soon as we possibly can.

I'd just like to remind everyone to say a special prayer for all those who were still fighting on the American fence, OK? And God bless America.

We love you all.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: The battle near Nasiriya was one of the bloodiest of Operation Iraqi Freedom. Many lives were lost, among them a 20-year- old private named Nolan Ryan Hutchings. His story is one of a young man who sometimes lost his way, but found direction serving his country.

CNN's Brian Cabell has his story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Just three years ago Ryan Hutchings was preparing to graduate Boiling Springs High School.

Today, in a classroom that's been transformed into a memorial, he's celebrated as a hometown hero, a Marine who died for his country.

Teacher Kerise Broom remembers him, a smiling, gregarious boy with a big heart.

KERISE BROOME, ENGLISH TEACHER: He just never missed the opportunity to say a kind word or to let people know that -- that he was thinking about them.

CABELL: Ryan once each wrote a poem honoring a classmate who had died.

(on camera): But Ryan Hutchings was by no means the perfect all- American boy. Like so many American teenagers, he had his problems, even a couple brushes with the law. Nothing serious. But he was trying to find his way.

(voice-over): His mom and dad confirmed he made some wrong turns.

LARRY HUTCHINGS, FATHER: Typical problems, typical kid but when he did get in trouble he -- he settled his own mistakes.

CAROLYN HUTCHINGS, MOTHER: In the middle of his sophomore year he turned to church. He did it on his own. No one pushed him into that. And every time the doors were open he was there.

CABELL: Ryan found a second home, and some greater purpose, it seems, at Northbrook Baptist Church. He joined the youth group there and took part in missions to spread the faith. But even there, church members say, he struggled.

CRAIG SEAY, CHURCH MEMBER: You know, he tried to do right. And he's like me and you and everybody else. He messes up sometimes. But -- but he do tried to do the best he could.

CABELL: And then upon graduating, he found yet another home, the Marine Corps. He was determined to straighten himself out and make his family proud.

He returned to his old high school repeatedly in uniform with gifts.

MARK DEMPSEY, HUTCHINGS FORMER COACH: I remember the first time he came back he brought me a tie clip right after basic, Marines tie clip and the last time I saw him he gave me a card.

CABELL: He may have become a Marine, but he remained a sentimental young man reaching out to others.

When the war came he was sent to Iraq. But in a battle near Nasiriya last month, something went wrong. The Marines listed him as missing in action and for three weeks his family -- that's his older sister there -- waited and worried and sent him a message he would never receive.

CRYSTAL VANCE, SISTER: That I love him and I miss him and that I hope that he comes home soon.

CABELL: Private Ryan Hutchings came home this week, onboard a plane accompanied by a Marine honor guard. He had been a victim of friendly fire, a bombing raid that went awry.

He wasn't perfect. After all, who among us is? But to his family, to his hometown, to his country, he comes back a hero, a young man who struggled to better himself. A Marine who died in battle.

Brian Cabell, Boiling Springs, South Carolina.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: This just in to CNN. The Laci Peterson case. Modesto police are saying there's been a significant change in the investigation into her disappearance on Christmas Eve. They say there will be a press conference, 9:00 p.m. Eastern Time, regarding the Laci Peterson case. They're not going to release any information before that news conference, we are told -- 9:00 p.m. Eastern is the time. We, of course, will bring you live coverage of that. This comes on the day when the county prosecutor in Modesto, California, says he feels -- quoting now -- "pretty strongly" that the body of the woman that washed up on the shore of San Francisco Bay this past week is, in fact, that of Laci Peterson. But we'll have to wait for that news conference to hear that beyond a shadow of a doubt.

And after we take a break we'll check in with our law enforcement reporter, Mike Brooks, who will be joining us from the area.

Also ahead, Saddam makes another television appearance. But does it mean he's really alive or just playing games with our head? We'll take a closer look at the new Saddam tapes.

Also, buried secrets. Mass graves found in Kirkuk. See what's been uncovered so far.

And shock and awe. The battle over Baghdad turns into a battle over marketing rights.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Welcome back. I'm Miles O'Brien. Police in Modesto, California say there has been a significant change, quoting them now, "in the Laci Peterson investigation." We expect to hear specifically what that is in a news conference about 3 1/2 hours from now, 9:00 p.m. Eastern time.

In the meantime we will check in with Mike Brooks our law enforcement correspondent very shortly, but before we do that let's check in with the headlines with CNN's Arthel Neville.

(NEWSBREAK)

O'BRIEN: More now on our top story this hour. Two new tapes, one audio, one video, allegedly of Saddam Hussein. Abu Dhabi TV broadcast them and said both were made on April 9, the day Baghdad fell to U.S. forces.

Joining me from Washington to offer insight, CNN analyst Ken Pollack of the Brookings Institution who at one time worked for the Central Intelligence Agency. Ken, good to have you with us.

POLLACK: Thanks, Miles. Good to be here.

O'BRIEN: Give us a sense to the extent you can as to what Central Intelligence, what those experts will do as they combed through those tapes to try and verify one way or another when they were shot and who was in them.

POLLACK: Well, as you point out, Miles, there are two different questions. One is when were they shot? And there they're going to look at all kind of different things related to the background of the tapes. What's the light like? What's the extent of damage that you can see in the background? What are the people wearing on the streets? Are they clues that you can gather from all of the atmospherics there that suggests was it before the war? Was it during the war? If it was during the war, at what point in the war? Early in the war before U.S. forces got to Baghdad? Or late in the war which is, of course, is when the tape is purported to be from.

O'BRIEN: All right. From those of us who spend a lot time watching movies, you know, in the movies they have the ability to enhance these images to the extent where they can zoom in on a newspaper, you know, three blocks down the street. What is the reality of it?

POLLACK: Well, the reality is I can't go into too many details of exactly what U.S. capabilities are. Let it be said that the U.S. does have some amazing capabilities. But by the same token, Tom Clancy and the others do take some real liberties with what the U.S. can do.

O'BRIEN: OK. Good. Now, that's the timing issue. What about whether that's the real Saddam? What's your sense of it? How do you verify that?

POLLACK: Well, the first thing that you do is you take measurements, it's called, mensuration, of different futures of Saddam and you compare that to known photographs of Saddam and to the extent you're that aware known photographs of the double.

So if you can get a good shot of Saddam's face you might start comparing the distance of the eyes apart. The length of Saddam's nose, the width of the face at certain key points to determine whether that is actually Saddam.

But here there's another clue out that's important in this videotape which is Saddam's son Qusay. Saddam's younger son Qusay, the most -- probably the second most powerful man in Iraq during the time that the regime was in power other than Saddam Hussein himself. That's a clue this may well be Saddam.

But more important than that, because Qusay is not known to have a double, this is a pretty good sign that if this tape was made on April 9 or later on after that, that Qusay, at least is alive.

O'BRIEN: All right, so what's your gut tell you? Quickly because we're about out of time.

POLLACK: Boy, you know, the honest answer is I just don't know. My suspicion is that Saddam is probably alive. Could be him, but that's certainly Qusay and that's a problem enough for the U.S.

O'BRIEN: All right, Ken Pollack, our analyst, we appreciate you joining us and giving us insights to the extent that you could. We appreciate it.

We want to hear from you. Once again "Our Web Question of the Day," do you think the latest tape of Saddam Hussein proves he's alive? You can vote now, cnn.com/wolf is the place.

As we told you a few moments ago, there's a break apparently in the Laci Peterson case out of Modesto, California. We're told Modesto Police say there has been a significant change on the investigation. This occurring on a day when a prosecutor in Modesto says he is fairly certain, feeling pretty strongly that the remains which washed up this past week in San Francisco Bay were that of Laci Peterson and the her unborn child.

Joining us on the line right now, give us some insights, is CNN's Mike Brooks. Mike, what do we know right now?

MIKE BROOKS, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well e know basically right now, Miles, what you were just saying. Just a short timing ago, Detective Doug Ridenour, the police spokesman for Modesto Police came out with an advisory that said exactly, quote, "There has been a significant change in the Laci Peterson investigation."

What this change is there has been a lot of speculation floating around Modesto all day today. Speculation that there has been a positive identification of the DNA, that an arrest of Scott Peterson is imminent. But let me also just to back up and say that all along Modesto Police has been saying that Scott Peterson is not a suspect, but they have not ruled him out as a suspect. So they've been playing both sides of the coin there.

So this press conference is scheduled for 6:00 p.m. Pacific, 9:00 p.m. Eastern here at the Modesto Police -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Mike, since all of this came to light this past week, we haven't seen Scott Peterson. Does anyone know where he is?

BOOKS: Well, Miles, there has been a number of Scott Peterson Sightings, if you will. There's fire truck going by right now, so (UNINTELLIGIBLE) lose you.

There have been a number of Scott Peterson sightings. Some people have seen him at a bank, Wells Fargo...

O'BRIEN: It's OK. We still hear you, Mike. Go ahead, press on.

BROOKS: Someone else has seen him at a Home Depot. Our crew went over to the house and one of the neighbors said that they saw him there last week cutting the grass. And apparently he had been seen there in and out of the neighborhood, but some people thought he'd gone to San Diego. But again, right now they don't know exactly where Scott Peterson is.

O'BRIEN: Mike, is his elusiveness at this juncture somewhat telling according to authorities?

BROOKS: Well, you know, there has been -- you know, going back to my own investigation days, if I was a defense attorney, you know, he has spoken to police already. He's spoken to the media. You know, he apparently has taken a leave of absence from his job. You know, he sold -- he was an agricultural fertilizer salesperson for a company based in Portugal and apparently they had given him off since then.

You know, if I were his attorney I'd probably advise him not to speak to the police either and he has been very elusive. But people here, there's just a lot of rumor, a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) speculation about where he is.

O'BRIEN: Let's do a quick recap to remind folks of the events in this past week. It's worth reminding them as we get ready for this news conference coming up in a few hours. There were actually three separate finds along the shores of San Francisco Bay. And if you could remind people what was found and how they may or may not be linked.

BROOKS: Well, on Sunday, Miles, was there the remains of what they are calling a full-term male child was found along San Francisco Bay right near a jogging path. Some people walking their dog found the remains on Sunday afternoon of the child.

Then on Monday the remains of a female torso were found about a mile away from those. Now those remains were taken to the Contra Costa County Coroner's Office. Now they came out the other day. They did an autopsy. They said that the autopsy did not reveal a cause of death on the female torso and that the autopsy on the child was inconclusive.

Now -- and apparently -- no -- at that time no identifications were made so they took a sample of DNA from both of the remains and sent them to the California Department of Justice DNA Lab in Richmond, California, which is just north of Berkeley. So they -- that's where they -- everyone has been waiting with bated breath to find out exactly if identification were made, if they could link the two remains to, you know, the baby and the woman to each other.

And so -- and then the other day there was also a piece of tarp found along the same route -- the same trail. Now they do not know if that tarp has any connection at all with the bodies that were found.

O'BRIEN: Mike, what about that bone that was discovered?

BROOKS: There was one piece of bone that was -- that was apparently discovered also. They do not know if that bone is connected with -- with either of the remains that were found right now.

O'BRIEN: The statement from the prosecutor of Modesto today is pretty -- to my read is a little unusual for a prosecutor to get out ahead of an investigation like this, and say he feels pretty strongly that that body is, in fact, that of Laci Peterson's. Is that -- is that usual from your experience and does that in any way potentially hurt his case in the long run?

BROOKS: Well, you know, some people said, Well, he -- they hadn't been getting any -- he hadn't been getting any attention in the case and that he came out and said that. But they were quick to come out with a statement saying that the -- the prosecutor's office would not say anything else until they had some positive information to give. So they were quick to kind of say -- to do some damage control and say we're not going to say anything else and, you know -- that -- that's -- that's the gist of it.

O'BRIEN: All right. Thank you very much, CNN's Mike Brooks, who is covering this story for us in Modesto. And we, of course, will bring you live coverage of the news conference as it happen, 9:00 p.m. Eastern Time, once again.

Shocked, awed and the fight over money. Big business battles to make a profit off of the war's most memorable moniker.

And Saddam's love shack? A tour with a surprise inside.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Shock and awe. The bombing campaign's slogan, if you will, at the start of the war didn't seem to do either. But it has sparked a bitter battle over who gets to use the phrase as a marketing tool, believe it or not. It's a great country, isn't it?

CNN's Bruce Burkhardt reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRUCE BURKHARDT, CNN SCIENCE & TECHNOLOGY CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): "Shock and Awe." A catchy phrase for something, the truth be told, was downright ugly. A military campaign that cost many lives.

But that won't get in the way of a good advertising campaign. At last count, some 19 companies and entrepreneurs are now fighting over that name, "Shock and Awe," each applying for a trademark to protect the term.

(on camera): All right. Let's go to the old map table and telestrator for a little analysis.

(voice-over): At the tip of the spear was the Sony Corporation. There's the spear right there. Well they filed an application one day after the war started, thinking "Shock and Awe" might be a good name for a computer game. But just recently, they withdrew it, calling it regrettable, bad judgment.

But there's others. A couple of fireworks companies want the name.

Then, charging in from another direction, a fellow who wants to use the name "Shock and Awe" for a line of pesticides.

Better yet, another company wants to use it for lingerie.

These units, plus about a dozen others, are all pressing forward towards the patent office, for what could be the mother of all trademark fights.

(on camera): But the question is, will it work? Is this really a name that we want to be reminded of?

Would you consider buying a product with that name, "Shock and Awe"?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A product? It kind of depends on what the product would be.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm at a loss. All I can think of is the war and tanks rolling.

BURKHARDT: Lingerie?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hmm, lingerie.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that might be a little bit -- might be exploitation of the term.

BURKHARDT: Would you buy a product with that name?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely not, never.

BURKHARDT: Why not?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because of what it stands for. I don't -- I can't even express how revolting that is to me.

BURKHARDT (voice-over): That's probably not the reaction marketers are looking for. But whether or not we end up conducting surgical strikes in our backyard with "Shock and Awe" pesticide, it might be a measure of how popular or not this war was. After all, can you think of any product named after something from the Vietnam era?

Bruce Burkhardt, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Another glimpse into the grim side of war and a regime that was -- that terrorized its people. Hundreds of unmarked graves have been discovered recently near Kirkuk in northern Iraq. The site near a former military base may contain as many as 1,600 graves.

It's unclear whether they are military or civilian. Central Command says U.S. forces will help determine who is buried there. Local residents say they believe the graves may hold loved ones who disappeared over the years, perhaps even decades ago.

It's time for us to take a break. When we come back we'll update you on the Laci Peterson case. We're told by police in Modesto, California there's a significant development to report that is going to be released officially a little more than three hours from now. We will bring you the latest and keep you up-to-date on what we know.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Police in Modesto, California tell us there is a significant change -- their words, in the Laci Peterson case. Let's go to Mike Brooks who joins us live from Modesto with the latest. Hello, Mike.

BROOKS: Hello, Miles, as you said just a short time ago the Modesto Police Department came out with a press advisory that said, quote, "There has been a significant change in the Laci Peterson investigation."

What this exactly means we do not know right now. There's been speculation all day long here in Modest that they've had the results of the DNA testing come back from the California Department of Justice crime lab in Richmond, California. There's been speculation about Scott Peterson. No one right now knows exactly where Scott Peterson is. That remains to be the $500,000 question, exactly where he is.

But right now, Miles, everyone's awaiting the press conference. It's going to be 6:00 p.m. Pacific, 9:00 p.m. Eastern to find out exactly what the significant change is in this investigation -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: CNN's Mike Brooks in Modesto. Thank you very much.

Do you think the latest tape of Saddam Hussein proves he's alive? You, still have a chance to vote.

Plus, Saddam's hideaway. Fantasy art and tasteless decor. A look inside the dictator's love shack?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: And now a look at some other striking images of war. In Baghdad, another statue of Saddam Hussein is decapitated. Residents were seen taking it down, dragging it through the streets. Marines helps behead a similar statue of Saddam last week.

A different mood at the Baghdad Zoo where animals are suffering from a lack of water and food. The zoo was in trouble before the war, but post-war looting made things much worse. An aid group is sending in some supplies. And that bear apparently of likes Coca-Cola.

Elsewhere in the city, a sign some things have returned to normal. Garbage collectors began clearing the streets. Mixed in with the clutter, leftover grenades. Careful how you rake.

Some call it a love shack, believe it or not, where Iraq's former ruler entertained mistresses. Others called it a safe house where he stayed to avoid assassination. But whatever you call it Saddam Hussein had some very unusual art on his walls. CNN's Jeanne Moos reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Imagine seeing photos of American soldiers in Saddam Hussein's Baghdad love shack and the paintings you spy on the walls are yours. No wonder the artist known as Rowena was...

ROWENA, ARTIST: Utterly flabbergasted.

MOOS: Who knew that Saddam Hussein would be into what's called fantasy art, the genre known for buxom damsels and fearsome demons.

ROWENA: I mean it's all in good fun. Campy.

MOOS: Soldiers rummaging through safe houses owned by Iraq's former ruler and his sons described Saddam as straight out of the '60s with mirrors around the bed and shag carpeting. We are told the decor inspired soldiers tromping through to do their best Austin Powers imitations.

MIKE MYERS, AS "AUSTIN POWERS": Very shagadelic! Yeah, baby!

MOOS: Turns out the babes on the wall were oils painted by Rowena to illustrate fantasy novel covers with catchy titles.

(on camera): "Shadows Out Of Hell"?

ROWENA: Yes.

MOOS (voice-over): Not a bad title for a Saddam biography.

Rowena Morrow (ph) is famous in the fantasy art field. Her work fills several books. Her paintings have titles like "Forbidden Fragrance." Rowena's studio is located in the yellow ribbon-bedecked village of Coxsackie, New York where residents were amazed at the Saddam connection.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It boggles the mind.

MOOS: Rowena doesn't know how Saddam got her paintings. She remembers selling one of them to a Japanese collector for $20,000 a decade or so ago. How does she feel about them decorating Saddam's walls? .

ROWENA: It does give me the creeps.

MOOS: But at least Iraq's king dragon has now been deposed.

Jeanne Moos, CNN, Coxsackie, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Now here's how you're weighing in on "Our Web Question of the Day." Do you think the latest tapes of Saddam Hussein prove he's alive? Thirty percent of you say yes, 70 percent of you say no. This poll is not scientific.

That's all of the time we have. Stay with CNN all throughout the day. I'm Miles O'Brien. Now Lou Dobbs and "MONEYLINE."

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com




u
Alive or Dead>


Aired April 18, 2003 - 17:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Out of hiding? Is this the face of Saddam Hussein? And what about the voice? New tapes raise new questions.

Trouble for the troops. Thousands of Iraqi protestors call for action.

The victims of Saddam's rule. Today the desperate search for survivors underground.

And the mystery of the mass graves. Who's buried here?

ANNOUNCER: CNN live this hour. WOLF BLITZER REPORTS. Live with correspondents from around the world.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Friday, April 18, 2003. Hello from CNN Center. I'm Miles O'Brien reporting. Wolf Blitzer is off today.

Did Saddam Hussein really escape several attempts to kill him? Topping our headlines from Iraq -- newly-released tapes purportedly of Saddam. In a moment, we're going to explore the images and examine the audio of a statement that may or may not be from Saddam Hussein.

At a mosque in Baghdad today, tens of thousands of Iraqis protested the presence of U.S. troops in their city. They shouted, waved fists, and hoisted banners. The demonstrators want the U.S. out and their government to be run by Iraqis.

And in the center of Baghdad, part of the ministry of information building is up in flames. Authorities say looters may be responsible for the fire. Some were seen stealing from the 10-story building. U.S. forces surrounded the structure to try and protect it.

This hour, we will check in with CNN's David Ensor, who is in Washington covering the scramble to authenticate the Saddam recordings. We'll also speak with Jaber Obeio, a reporter from for Abu Dhabi Television -- the organization that obtained those tapes.

We'll get to those reports in a moment -- but first to the tapes themselves. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN (voice-over): Whether he's dead, alive, in hiding, or on the run, Saddam Hussein continues to tweak his enemies. Today, an Arab television network shows videotape of a man it says is Saddam leading supporters last week in the streets of Baghdad.

Abu Dhabi TV says these scenes were shot on April 9, the day the capital fell to U.S.-led forces -- two days after a devastating allied air strike targeted Saddam in Baghdad. This tape was purportedly shot in the city's Azamiyah neighborhood, an area sympathetic to Saddam. Abu Dhabi TV says it got the tape from a credible source and believes it's authentic.

JASIM AL-AZZAWI, REPORTER, ABU DHABI TV: The location is definitely a Sunni stronghold -- Alabamia (ph) district in northern Baghdad. And it would have been a very logical and safe place for him to appear after Al Mansour -- that the possibility of betrayal or even somebody shooting him, it would have been extremely negligibile.

O'BRIEN: But as U.S. officials analyze the tape, many observers are skeptical. This could be one of Saddam's body doubles.

Also shown -- a man strongly resembling Saddam's younger son, Qusay. Abu Dhabi says they believe it is Qusay. Still, one Saddam expert finds this videotape, at the very least, curious.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Before the war started, Saddam had not been seen on the streets of Baghdad for years. I mean, this is the whole reason he used the doubles.

Saddam was afraid of the Iraqi public. He hid himself away. He didn't want anyone to see him, and then suddenly the war starts and we've had two walkabouts in the space of two weeks.

O'BRIEN: Adding to the mystery, today Abu Dhabi TV also aired an audiotape of a speech it says was made by Saddam. The network says this too was recorded on April 9. That day, allied tanks rolled right into the capital.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): And we are confident that victory at the end will be ours and that God will help us as much as we have stamina and belief to confront all the people.

O'BRIEN: So we're left with a series of video and audiotapes -- leaving few answers and some burning questions.

When were they made? Where? And especially, of whom?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: The latest video purports to show Saddam Hussein playing in the crowd and playing to the crowd in the Azamiyah neighborhood of Baghdad. But hit hard by U.S. bombs, the tree-lined district near the Tigris River is considered a stronghold of Saddam loyalists -- or at least was. U.S. Marines battled diehards there two days after the videotape was allegedly made. Azamiyah is across the river from the exclusive Al Mansour neighborhood, where a U.S. aircraft dropped bunker buster bombs on a suspected Saddam hideout. That decapitation raid came two days before Saddam was supposedly sighted and taped in Azamiyah.

U.S. Intelligence experts have started to examine the new tapes. Let's go live to our national security correspondent, David Ensor, for more on that -- David.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Miles, the working assumption -- at least for the moment -- is that it probably is Saddam Hussein on the tapes. They'll know more once they've analyzed the voice on the voice tapes, and in a day or two they should be able to be pretty sure about that.

The question, though, is -- When were these tapes made?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR (voice-over): The question for U.S. Intelligence -- were these two images recorded on the same day? Was Saddam Hussein rallying supporters in one Baghdad neighborhood even as his statue came down in another part of town on April 9?

The al Azamiyah neighborhood is just over four miles from Firdos Square, where U.S. forces helped bring down the statue. Assuming this is Saddam and if it really were recorded on April 9, then clearly he has survived the attempt to kill him on the evening of April 7. So, apparently, did his son Qusay -- seen on the new tape just to the right of his father.

There were reports Saddam Hussein might have been in Al Azamiyah April 9, but CNN could not find anyone in the neighborhood Friday who remembered seeing him there since March.

U.S. officials are skeptical too -- partly because of their analysis of this other tape. Released earlier, it was said to be Saddam Hussein on the streets of Baghdad on April 4.

Not true, say U.S. officials. They believe it was most likely taped in early March. They've based that on certain changes in the background to buildings and the like. Note also the relatively warm clothes worn -- suitable for early March. By April, it had gotten much warmer.

Administration officials from the president on down are saying what matters is not whether the dictator still lives but that the regime's control has collapsed. But to U.S. military and Intelligence officials, Saddam's fate does matter.

KEN POLLACK, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: As long as Saddam Hussein is out there, The United States is not going to be finished with this war -- at least in the sense that, as long as Saddam is out there, there may be loyalists who are willing to fight for him. ENSOR: As for the audiotape -- also broadcast Friday by Abu Dhabi television -- U.S. Intelligence will be able to say soon whether it's Saddam Hussein's voice or not.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): And we are confident that victory, at the end, will be ours.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR: The trouble is whether it's his voice or not, there may be no way to assess when it was made so the audiotape may not provide any clue as to whether Saddam Hussein is alive or dead. And that, of course, is something U.S. officials would very much like to know -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Thank you very much, CNN's David Ensor in Washington. Appreciate it.

Let's turn now to the man who came up with the new tapes. Jaber Obeio is a Baghdad-based reporter and an anchor for Abu Dhabi television. He joins us now live from the Iraqi capital. Mr. Obeid, good to have you with us.

JABER OBEID, ABU DHABI TELEVISION ANCHOR: Thank you, Miles.

O'BRIEN: How do you know it's authentic?

OBEID: Well, Miles, before I answer the question, let me state something very important over here.

We have been hearing rumors about people seeing Saddam in Al Azamiyah since the 9th of April. We have spoken to eyewitnesses who have sworn that they have seen Saddam Hussein on that particular date. We have never aired those statements -- neither spoken about the rumors -- because we lack the evidence.

Today we were approached. We were contacted by the person who had shot the footages and recorded the speech. He works in a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) production house which was chosen by the government -- by the Iraqi previous government to work in case the Iraqi governmental television and radio station were hid by the American forces.

We have the name of the person, but he's not willing to come forward and testify to this because he's afraid for his safety.

O'BRIEN: All right. So you believe it to be a credible source from the tape. We'll take that at face value.

The next question would be -- are you convinced that who we are seeing in this tape are the real people? Is it really Saddam Hussein? Is it really Qusay? Is it really some of the inner circle of Saddam Hussein that we are seeing?

OBEID: I'm not in a position to verify whether whom we have seen today was Saddam Hussein himself or was his duplicates, as they say, because the Iraqi people -- the USA government has failed to identify whether he is the real Saddam Hussein president or his duplicates.

The Iraqi people have failed to do so and, definitely, neither us nor anybody else can confirm this, but we are concerned that whomever he was, whether Saddam Hussein or whether his duplicates, it was shot and recorded on the 9th of April.

I hold today also, Miles, documents that concerns the same. I wouldn't be able to say anything about them because we just aired them half an hour ago on Abu Dhabi TV. We have documents, we have new documents testifying or confirming that what has been shown on Abu Dhabi TV was the real footage of Saddam Hussein and the real speech of Saddam Hussein and it was recorded and shot at the 9th of April.

O'BRIEN: How can you be certain about the date when both of those tapes were recorded?

OBIED: Well, we have the man who have shot the footage and recorded the speech. He's willing to come forward and testify if he was guaranteed his safety, and we have the rumors which was -- which spread around since the 9th of April, and we have eyewitnesses who have seen this and they were there when the event took place.

O'BRIEN: Jaber Obied, all right. Thank you very much. We appreciate giving us some backstory on how this tape came to be. Joining us live from Baghdad.

Now here's your turn to weigh in on the war in Iraq. "Our Web Question of the Day" is do you think the latest tape of Saddam Hussein proves he's alive? We'll have the results later in the broadcast. We invite you to vote at cnn.com/wolf.

Caught in the crosshairs. The capture of another top Iraqi leader. So where are the others?

Also, the Private Ryan who wasn't saved. A troubled teen who turned his life around and ended up fighting in a war in Iraq.

Plus, a palace outfitted with everything, but a Mini Me. It's truly shagadelic.

But first these images from Baghdad.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Disturbing discoveries in the new Iraq. Coming up, who did the looters scare away and why are the helpless left behind?

And fallout from companies trying to capitalize on the Shock and Awe campaign. Those stories still ahead on WOLF BLITZER REPORTS.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Here's another tragedy of the war. These patients of a Baghdad mental hospital are on their own, at least for now. Doctors and staff members evacuated after they were overwhelmed by looters last week. One patient told reporters looters took just about everything from the hospital, one of only two such facilities in the capital. A mosque and the Red Cross are providing food and water to about 400 of those mental patients.

Baghdad looters also made off with vials of polio virus from Iraq's Central Public Health Lab. The World Health Organization says the theft does not pose an immediate health risk, however. Most of the vials were dumped on the ground outside the lab. Officials say it's unlikely the lab had wild polio virus-controlled specimens, but if it did the specimens would deteriorate once it was removed from refrigerators. Iraq has been polio-free for more than two years now.

A city of stark contrast. Pockets of chaos and order, violence and them coming together in prayer. All part of life today in the new Baghdad. CNN's Jim Clancy joining us live in the Iraqi capital with the latest from there. Jim, any progress on getting the lights on?

JIM CLANCY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, there is progress being made, but it's a little slow. I was told the lights would be well on by now. They are not because the problem more complicated. It is being worked on.

People talking now in terms of perhaps Sunday the lights will come back on, but they're going to have to bring gas all of the way down from Kirkuk in order to fire up generators so they have enough electricity to jumpstart, as they say, the entire grid here to get the city really up and running again. Some areas temporarily had some electricity into them.

But on another front, people are dealing with a political power vacuum. Yes the regime of President Saddam Hussein is gone, but it's giving way to struggles for hearts and minds on the political front.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY (voice-over): In a rare display of unity, both Shia and Sunni Muslim Iraqis joined together in prayers Friday. Islamic unity was the theme, but the U.S. came in for criticism. One cleric said the Americans topple the regime for Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and were not to be trusted it.

The incendiary mix of religion and politics predictably spilled out into the streets. A large demonstration asserting Muslim unity laid down a challenge to any outside efforts to impose a U.S.-led regime in Baghdad.

Elsewhere, an eerie sense of normalcy co-existed with the unbridled violence of the past week. As men looked on from a shabby streetside cafe, the body of a looter lay a few meters away. Another uncollected casualties lay nearby. This man, we were told, was gunned down for $150.

Below Baghdad streets, urban legend ends live on. Thousands of people gathered around this traffic tunnel ripping apart ventilation shafts in the mistaken belief they would find secret prisons where loved ones had survived the regime and waited to be rescued. Crushing one another from a closer look, any reactions from those below stirred rumors another ghost from the past had emerged from a subterranean nightmare. No one alive or dead was found, but hope dies hard when there is so little else left.

Others who ventured out took advantage of a bristling trade in transport. As confidence returns, private buses and taxies shuttle residents between cities or neighborhoods, giving Iraqis living proof loved ones were all right. Another sign the city was struggling to its feet.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CLANCY: It continues to struggle on the political front, certainly on the economic front and humanitarian fronts as well. But there are clear sign, Miles, things are getting better.

O'BRIEN: Jim, not to stress this power situation too much, but I think it's worth underscoring to the extent that the U.S. has been unable to this point to get the lights back on. How much does that decrease the confidence that many Iraqis have in the U.S. as liberators, occupier, whatever you want to call them?

CLANCY: Well, I think that once the light comes on it won't matter much. But I think that certainly it is something that the U.S. needs and that the military is fully aware of.

I saw -- there's a general that's assigned taking care of this. They have a task force called Operation Dawn. They're working on it because it does send that message that says, look, we're in charge, we can run the show. More importantly, you, the Iraqis can run the show. You didn't need President Saddam Hussein. But they need to get those lights up and running.

It's also got a lot to do with the rumors. There's no newspapers, there's no television, there's no radio heard by so many people and the rumors themselves are creating problems, instability, if you will -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: All right, Jim Clancy, thanks very much, live from Baghdad.

Rescued from behind Iraqi lines. Hear from a former POW in his own words.

Plus, from troubled teen to an American hero. The story of one young man who didn't make it home.

And the man who has apparently nine lives, Saddam Hussein, the new tapes, but does it mean we're any closer to knowing if he's really dead or alive? We'll take a closer look at that.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Smiling, waving and from all appearances, in good health. Seven former approximate POWs greeted supporters outside Germany's Landstuhl Medical Center today. Army officials say after being held prisoner in Iraq for three weeks, the group will return to the states tomorrow. Their journey home to their families is one they look forward to make, to say the least.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CWO DAVID WILLIAMS, FORMER POW: I'd like to take a brief moment to let everyone know that we're receiving outstanding medical care and I'd like to thank all of my fellow Americans. We all would like to thank our Americans for the tremendous support we've been getting. And we're looking forward to coming home as soon as we possibly can.

I'd just like to remind everyone to say a special prayer for all those who were still fighting on the American fence, OK? And God bless America.

We love you all.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: The battle near Nasiriya was one of the bloodiest of Operation Iraqi Freedom. Many lives were lost, among them a 20-year- old private named Nolan Ryan Hutchings. His story is one of a young man who sometimes lost his way, but found direction serving his country.

CNN's Brian Cabell has his story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Just three years ago Ryan Hutchings was preparing to graduate Boiling Springs High School.

Today, in a classroom that's been transformed into a memorial, he's celebrated as a hometown hero, a Marine who died for his country.

Teacher Kerise Broom remembers him, a smiling, gregarious boy with a big heart.

KERISE BROOME, ENGLISH TEACHER: He just never missed the opportunity to say a kind word or to let people know that -- that he was thinking about them.

CABELL: Ryan once each wrote a poem honoring a classmate who had died.

(on camera): But Ryan Hutchings was by no means the perfect all- American boy. Like so many American teenagers, he had his problems, even a couple brushes with the law. Nothing serious. But he was trying to find his way.

(voice-over): His mom and dad confirmed he made some wrong turns.

LARRY HUTCHINGS, FATHER: Typical problems, typical kid but when he did get in trouble he -- he settled his own mistakes.

CAROLYN HUTCHINGS, MOTHER: In the middle of his sophomore year he turned to church. He did it on his own. No one pushed him into that. And every time the doors were open he was there.

CABELL: Ryan found a second home, and some greater purpose, it seems, at Northbrook Baptist Church. He joined the youth group there and took part in missions to spread the faith. But even there, church members say, he struggled.

CRAIG SEAY, CHURCH MEMBER: You know, he tried to do right. And he's like me and you and everybody else. He messes up sometimes. But -- but he do tried to do the best he could.

CABELL: And then upon graduating, he found yet another home, the Marine Corps. He was determined to straighten himself out and make his family proud.

He returned to his old high school repeatedly in uniform with gifts.

MARK DEMPSEY, HUTCHINGS FORMER COACH: I remember the first time he came back he brought me a tie clip right after basic, Marines tie clip and the last time I saw him he gave me a card.

CABELL: He may have become a Marine, but he remained a sentimental young man reaching out to others.

When the war came he was sent to Iraq. But in a battle near Nasiriya last month, something went wrong. The Marines listed him as missing in action and for three weeks his family -- that's his older sister there -- waited and worried and sent him a message he would never receive.

CRYSTAL VANCE, SISTER: That I love him and I miss him and that I hope that he comes home soon.

CABELL: Private Ryan Hutchings came home this week, onboard a plane accompanied by a Marine honor guard. He had been a victim of friendly fire, a bombing raid that went awry.

He wasn't perfect. After all, who among us is? But to his family, to his hometown, to his country, he comes back a hero, a young man who struggled to better himself. A Marine who died in battle.

Brian Cabell, Boiling Springs, South Carolina.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: This just in to CNN. The Laci Peterson case. Modesto police are saying there's been a significant change in the investigation into her disappearance on Christmas Eve. They say there will be a press conference, 9:00 p.m. Eastern Time, regarding the Laci Peterson case. They're not going to release any information before that news conference, we are told -- 9:00 p.m. Eastern is the time. We, of course, will bring you live coverage of that. This comes on the day when the county prosecutor in Modesto, California, says he feels -- quoting now -- "pretty strongly" that the body of the woman that washed up on the shore of San Francisco Bay this past week is, in fact, that of Laci Peterson. But we'll have to wait for that news conference to hear that beyond a shadow of a doubt.

And after we take a break we'll check in with our law enforcement reporter, Mike Brooks, who will be joining us from the area.

Also ahead, Saddam makes another television appearance. But does it mean he's really alive or just playing games with our head? We'll take a closer look at the new Saddam tapes.

Also, buried secrets. Mass graves found in Kirkuk. See what's been uncovered so far.

And shock and awe. The battle over Baghdad turns into a battle over marketing rights.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Welcome back. I'm Miles O'Brien. Police in Modesto, California say there has been a significant change, quoting them now, "in the Laci Peterson investigation." We expect to hear specifically what that is in a news conference about 3 1/2 hours from now, 9:00 p.m. Eastern time.

In the meantime we will check in with Mike Brooks our law enforcement correspondent very shortly, but before we do that let's check in with the headlines with CNN's Arthel Neville.

(NEWSBREAK)

O'BRIEN: More now on our top story this hour. Two new tapes, one audio, one video, allegedly of Saddam Hussein. Abu Dhabi TV broadcast them and said both were made on April 9, the day Baghdad fell to U.S. forces.

Joining me from Washington to offer insight, CNN analyst Ken Pollack of the Brookings Institution who at one time worked for the Central Intelligence Agency. Ken, good to have you with us.

POLLACK: Thanks, Miles. Good to be here.

O'BRIEN: Give us a sense to the extent you can as to what Central Intelligence, what those experts will do as they combed through those tapes to try and verify one way or another when they were shot and who was in them.

POLLACK: Well, as you point out, Miles, there are two different questions. One is when were they shot? And there they're going to look at all kind of different things related to the background of the tapes. What's the light like? What's the extent of damage that you can see in the background? What are the people wearing on the streets? Are they clues that you can gather from all of the atmospherics there that suggests was it before the war? Was it during the war? If it was during the war, at what point in the war? Early in the war before U.S. forces got to Baghdad? Or late in the war which is, of course, is when the tape is purported to be from.

O'BRIEN: All right. From those of us who spend a lot time watching movies, you know, in the movies they have the ability to enhance these images to the extent where they can zoom in on a newspaper, you know, three blocks down the street. What is the reality of it?

POLLACK: Well, the reality is I can't go into too many details of exactly what U.S. capabilities are. Let it be said that the U.S. does have some amazing capabilities. But by the same token, Tom Clancy and the others do take some real liberties with what the U.S. can do.

O'BRIEN: OK. Good. Now, that's the timing issue. What about whether that's the real Saddam? What's your sense of it? How do you verify that?

POLLACK: Well, the first thing that you do is you take measurements, it's called, mensuration, of different futures of Saddam and you compare that to known photographs of Saddam and to the extent you're that aware known photographs of the double.

So if you can get a good shot of Saddam's face you might start comparing the distance of the eyes apart. The length of Saddam's nose, the width of the face at certain key points to determine whether that is actually Saddam.

But here there's another clue out that's important in this videotape which is Saddam's son Qusay. Saddam's younger son Qusay, the most -- probably the second most powerful man in Iraq during the time that the regime was in power other than Saddam Hussein himself. That's a clue this may well be Saddam.

But more important than that, because Qusay is not known to have a double, this is a pretty good sign that if this tape was made on April 9 or later on after that, that Qusay, at least is alive.

O'BRIEN: All right, so what's your gut tell you? Quickly because we're about out of time.

POLLACK: Boy, you know, the honest answer is I just don't know. My suspicion is that Saddam is probably alive. Could be him, but that's certainly Qusay and that's a problem enough for the U.S.

O'BRIEN: All right, Ken Pollack, our analyst, we appreciate you joining us and giving us insights to the extent that you could. We appreciate it.

We want to hear from you. Once again "Our Web Question of the Day," do you think the latest tape of Saddam Hussein proves he's alive? You can vote now, cnn.com/wolf is the place.

As we told you a few moments ago, there's a break apparently in the Laci Peterson case out of Modesto, California. We're told Modesto Police say there has been a significant change on the investigation. This occurring on a day when a prosecutor in Modesto says he is fairly certain, feeling pretty strongly that the remains which washed up this past week in San Francisco Bay were that of Laci Peterson and the her unborn child.

Joining us on the line right now, give us some insights, is CNN's Mike Brooks. Mike, what do we know right now?

MIKE BROOKS, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well e know basically right now, Miles, what you were just saying. Just a short timing ago, Detective Doug Ridenour, the police spokesman for Modesto Police came out with an advisory that said exactly, quote, "There has been a significant change in the Laci Peterson investigation."

What this change is there has been a lot of speculation floating around Modesto all day today. Speculation that there has been a positive identification of the DNA, that an arrest of Scott Peterson is imminent. But let me also just to back up and say that all along Modesto Police has been saying that Scott Peterson is not a suspect, but they have not ruled him out as a suspect. So they've been playing both sides of the coin there.

So this press conference is scheduled for 6:00 p.m. Pacific, 9:00 p.m. Eastern here at the Modesto Police -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Mike, since all of this came to light this past week, we haven't seen Scott Peterson. Does anyone know where he is?

BOOKS: Well, Miles, there has been a number of Scott Peterson Sightings, if you will. There's fire truck going by right now, so (UNINTELLIGIBLE) lose you.

There have been a number of Scott Peterson sightings. Some people have seen him at a bank, Wells Fargo...

O'BRIEN: It's OK. We still hear you, Mike. Go ahead, press on.

BROOKS: Someone else has seen him at a Home Depot. Our crew went over to the house and one of the neighbors said that they saw him there last week cutting the grass. And apparently he had been seen there in and out of the neighborhood, but some people thought he'd gone to San Diego. But again, right now they don't know exactly where Scott Peterson is.

O'BRIEN: Mike, is his elusiveness at this juncture somewhat telling according to authorities?

BROOKS: Well, you know, there has been -- you know, going back to my own investigation days, if I was a defense attorney, you know, he has spoken to police already. He's spoken to the media. You know, he apparently has taken a leave of absence from his job. You know, he sold -- he was an agricultural fertilizer salesperson for a company based in Portugal and apparently they had given him off since then.

You know, if I were his attorney I'd probably advise him not to speak to the police either and he has been very elusive. But people here, there's just a lot of rumor, a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) speculation about where he is.

O'BRIEN: Let's do a quick recap to remind folks of the events in this past week. It's worth reminding them as we get ready for this news conference coming up in a few hours. There were actually three separate finds along the shores of San Francisco Bay. And if you could remind people what was found and how they may or may not be linked.

BROOKS: Well, on Sunday, Miles, was there the remains of what they are calling a full-term male child was found along San Francisco Bay right near a jogging path. Some people walking their dog found the remains on Sunday afternoon of the child.

Then on Monday the remains of a female torso were found about a mile away from those. Now those remains were taken to the Contra Costa County Coroner's Office. Now they came out the other day. They did an autopsy. They said that the autopsy did not reveal a cause of death on the female torso and that the autopsy on the child was inconclusive.

Now -- and apparently -- no -- at that time no identifications were made so they took a sample of DNA from both of the remains and sent them to the California Department of Justice DNA Lab in Richmond, California, which is just north of Berkeley. So they -- that's where they -- everyone has been waiting with bated breath to find out exactly if identification were made, if they could link the two remains to, you know, the baby and the woman to each other.

And so -- and then the other day there was also a piece of tarp found along the same route -- the same trail. Now they do not know if that tarp has any connection at all with the bodies that were found.

O'BRIEN: Mike, what about that bone that was discovered?

BROOKS: There was one piece of bone that was -- that was apparently discovered also. They do not know if that bone is connected with -- with either of the remains that were found right now.

O'BRIEN: The statement from the prosecutor of Modesto today is pretty -- to my read is a little unusual for a prosecutor to get out ahead of an investigation like this, and say he feels pretty strongly that that body is, in fact, that of Laci Peterson's. Is that -- is that usual from your experience and does that in any way potentially hurt his case in the long run?

BROOKS: Well, you know, some people said, Well, he -- they hadn't been getting any -- he hadn't been getting any attention in the case and that he came out and said that. But they were quick to come out with a statement saying that the -- the prosecutor's office would not say anything else until they had some positive information to give. So they were quick to kind of say -- to do some damage control and say we're not going to say anything else and, you know -- that -- that's -- that's the gist of it.

O'BRIEN: All right. Thank you very much, CNN's Mike Brooks, who is covering this story for us in Modesto. And we, of course, will bring you live coverage of the news conference as it happen, 9:00 p.m. Eastern Time, once again.

Shocked, awed and the fight over money. Big business battles to make a profit off of the war's most memorable moniker.

And Saddam's love shack? A tour with a surprise inside.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Shock and awe. The bombing campaign's slogan, if you will, at the start of the war didn't seem to do either. But it has sparked a bitter battle over who gets to use the phrase as a marketing tool, believe it or not. It's a great country, isn't it?

CNN's Bruce Burkhardt reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRUCE BURKHARDT, CNN SCIENCE & TECHNOLOGY CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): "Shock and Awe." A catchy phrase for something, the truth be told, was downright ugly. A military campaign that cost many lives.

But that won't get in the way of a good advertising campaign. At last count, some 19 companies and entrepreneurs are now fighting over that name, "Shock and Awe," each applying for a trademark to protect the term.

(on camera): All right. Let's go to the old map table and telestrator for a little analysis.

(voice-over): At the tip of the spear was the Sony Corporation. There's the spear right there. Well they filed an application one day after the war started, thinking "Shock and Awe" might be a good name for a computer game. But just recently, they withdrew it, calling it regrettable, bad judgment.

But there's others. A couple of fireworks companies want the name.

Then, charging in from another direction, a fellow who wants to use the name "Shock and Awe" for a line of pesticides.

Better yet, another company wants to use it for lingerie.

These units, plus about a dozen others, are all pressing forward towards the patent office, for what could be the mother of all trademark fights.

(on camera): But the question is, will it work? Is this really a name that we want to be reminded of?

Would you consider buying a product with that name, "Shock and Awe"?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A product? It kind of depends on what the product would be.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm at a loss. All I can think of is the war and tanks rolling.

BURKHARDT: Lingerie?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hmm, lingerie.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that might be a little bit -- might be exploitation of the term.

BURKHARDT: Would you buy a product with that name?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely not, never.

BURKHARDT: Why not?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because of what it stands for. I don't -- I can't even express how revolting that is to me.

BURKHARDT (voice-over): That's probably not the reaction marketers are looking for. But whether or not we end up conducting surgical strikes in our backyard with "Shock and Awe" pesticide, it might be a measure of how popular or not this war was. After all, can you think of any product named after something from the Vietnam era?

Bruce Burkhardt, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Another glimpse into the grim side of war and a regime that was -- that terrorized its people. Hundreds of unmarked graves have been discovered recently near Kirkuk in northern Iraq. The site near a former military base may contain as many as 1,600 graves.

It's unclear whether they are military or civilian. Central Command says U.S. forces will help determine who is buried there. Local residents say they believe the graves may hold loved ones who disappeared over the years, perhaps even decades ago.

It's time for us to take a break. When we come back we'll update you on the Laci Peterson case. We're told by police in Modesto, California there's a significant development to report that is going to be released officially a little more than three hours from now. We will bring you the latest and keep you up-to-date on what we know.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Police in Modesto, California tell us there is a significant change -- their words, in the Laci Peterson case. Let's go to Mike Brooks who joins us live from Modesto with the latest. Hello, Mike.

BROOKS: Hello, Miles, as you said just a short time ago the Modesto Police Department came out with a press advisory that said, quote, "There has been a significant change in the Laci Peterson investigation."

What this exactly means we do not know right now. There's been speculation all day long here in Modest that they've had the results of the DNA testing come back from the California Department of Justice crime lab in Richmond, California. There's been speculation about Scott Peterson. No one right now knows exactly where Scott Peterson is. That remains to be the $500,000 question, exactly where he is.

But right now, Miles, everyone's awaiting the press conference. It's going to be 6:00 p.m. Pacific, 9:00 p.m. Eastern to find out exactly what the significant change is in this investigation -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: CNN's Mike Brooks in Modesto. Thank you very much.

Do you think the latest tape of Saddam Hussein proves he's alive? You, still have a chance to vote.

Plus, Saddam's hideaway. Fantasy art and tasteless decor. A look inside the dictator's love shack?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: And now a look at some other striking images of war. In Baghdad, another statue of Saddam Hussein is decapitated. Residents were seen taking it down, dragging it through the streets. Marines helps behead a similar statue of Saddam last week.

A different mood at the Baghdad Zoo where animals are suffering from a lack of water and food. The zoo was in trouble before the war, but post-war looting made things much worse. An aid group is sending in some supplies. And that bear apparently of likes Coca-Cola.

Elsewhere in the city, a sign some things have returned to normal. Garbage collectors began clearing the streets. Mixed in with the clutter, leftover grenades. Careful how you rake.

Some call it a love shack, believe it or not, where Iraq's former ruler entertained mistresses. Others called it a safe house where he stayed to avoid assassination. But whatever you call it Saddam Hussein had some very unusual art on his walls. CNN's Jeanne Moos reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Imagine seeing photos of American soldiers in Saddam Hussein's Baghdad love shack and the paintings you spy on the walls are yours. No wonder the artist known as Rowena was...

ROWENA, ARTIST: Utterly flabbergasted.

MOOS: Who knew that Saddam Hussein would be into what's called fantasy art, the genre known for buxom damsels and fearsome demons.

ROWENA: I mean it's all in good fun. Campy.

MOOS: Soldiers rummaging through safe houses owned by Iraq's former ruler and his sons described Saddam as straight out of the '60s with mirrors around the bed and shag carpeting. We are told the decor inspired soldiers tromping through to do their best Austin Powers imitations.

MIKE MYERS, AS "AUSTIN POWERS": Very shagadelic! Yeah, baby!

MOOS: Turns out the babes on the wall were oils painted by Rowena to illustrate fantasy novel covers with catchy titles.

(on camera): "Shadows Out Of Hell"?

ROWENA: Yes.

MOOS (voice-over): Not a bad title for a Saddam biography.

Rowena Morrow (ph) is famous in the fantasy art field. Her work fills several books. Her paintings have titles like "Forbidden Fragrance." Rowena's studio is located in the yellow ribbon-bedecked village of Coxsackie, New York where residents were amazed at the Saddam connection.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It boggles the mind.

MOOS: Rowena doesn't know how Saddam got her paintings. She remembers selling one of them to a Japanese collector for $20,000 a decade or so ago. How does she feel about them decorating Saddam's walls? .

ROWENA: It does give me the creeps.

MOOS: But at least Iraq's king dragon has now been deposed.

Jeanne Moos, CNN, Coxsackie, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Now here's how you're weighing in on "Our Web Question of the Day." Do you think the latest tapes of Saddam Hussein prove he's alive? Thirty percent of you say yes, 70 percent of you say no. This poll is not scientific.

That's all of the time we have. Stay with CNN all throughout the day. I'm Miles O'Brien. Now Lou Dobbs and "MONEYLINE."

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com




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