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Wolf

Nationwide Walkout to Protest Police Violence; How Wilson Resignation Received in Ferguson; Reaction in Ferguson to NFL Rams' Show of Support; What Can Be Done to Stop Disasters Like in Ferguson; ISIS Has U.S. Military Rethinking Social Media; New Warning for Military in U.S.; U.S. Supreme Court Hears 1st Free Speech Case on Social Media

Aired December 01, 2014 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back to our viewers in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer, reporting from Washington.

We're watching a developing story. Activists in the United States have called for a nationwide walkout to protest police violence. It's called for 1:00 p.m. eastern. You're looking at live pictures coming in from Chicago right now. We've got pictures from New York as well. People have been protesting not only in Chicago and New York, but here in Washington, D.C., as, at the same time, over at the Department of Justice. Moments ago, protesters were lying on the ground outside of the Department of Justice in a peaceful, silent protest. Out in California, by the way, dozens of students at Stanford University walked out of their classes to show their support for the Michael Brown family. This call for a walkout comes one week after the Ferguson, Missouri, grand jury decided not to indict the police Officer Darren Wilson in the killing of the teenager Michael Brown.

Over the weekend, Wilson resigned from the Ferguson police force saying he feared for more violence directed against the police department there.

Let's gauge the reaction in Ferguson itself to Darren Wilson's resignation, the call for a nationwide walkout.

CNN's Ed Lavandera is live in Ferguson right now.

Looks quiet behind you right now. Ed, what is going on in Ferguson?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The good news is, Wolf, for the last couple of nights, it's been quiet in terms of protests and the number of arrests and that kind of news in terms of the worse of what was seen here last week, that that seems to be in the past here, at least. And you hear a lot of talk about people looking ahead as to what happens next.

One of the fascinating things that's started to develop over the last couple of days, Wolf, if you drive around, some of the areas hardest hit by the protests Monday night and Tuesday night as well, people have been painting murals on these pieces of plywood to kind of leave inspirational messages and messages of hope that turned plywood into something more beautiful to look at -- Wolf?

BLITZER: Ed, Sunday, at the St. Louis Rams NFL football game, five players raised their hands up, a sign of the protests to the Ferguson decision. The NFL says there will be no discipline for the players. How was this gesture received in Ferguson?

LAVANDERA: Well, you know, you speak with a lot of people and they very much support what people on the St. Louis Rams football team did. You heard the strong words and criticism that came from the St. Louis Police Officers Association basically saying that these players were siding with the, quote, "Thugs burning down buildings." So, very explosive comments coming from that association as well. Even the mayor of Ferguson was critical of what the players did as well. When you talk to folks on the street and many people who have been involved in these protests and trying to show their solidarity with Michael Brown's family, it was something that was very much appreciated.

BLITZER: Ed, thanks very much.

Ed Lavandera is on the streets of Ferguson, Missouri. We're going to stay in close touch with him.

Once again, we're monitoring the other protests developing across the country right now, whether here in Washington, D.C., or the Justice Department, in New York City, over at Union Square in Chicago, Stanford University, and elsewhere as well.

The fallout from Ferguson has sparked a national dialogue, from a call for a nationwide walkout to protest the police violence to the president of the United States spending most of the day today working with experts, creating a task force on what is described as 21st century policing tactics across the country. Everyone is talking about what happened in Ferguson and what can be done to avoid the disaster that followed that decision.

Let's discuss all of that. I'm joined by Pastor Robert White. He's in Ferguson. He's with the Peace of Mind Church of Happiness and Clergy United.

Pastor, thanks very much for joining us.

What's the most important lesson, do you believe, that our viewers in the United States and all over the world should learn from what happened in Ferguson?

ROBERT WHITE, PASTOR, PEACE OF MIND CHURCH OF HAPPINESS & CLERGY UNITED: Thanks for having me, Wolf.

I think the most important lesson that needs to be talked about throughout the world is that this grand jury was a joke. We have heard and seen testimony that has happened since then and we have seen the failure of our government to protect our citizens and taxpayers of the city. As Ed was talking about, on this particular location, there's color, there's festivities going on, but on the other side in Ferguson, there was fire. There was brimstone laid out because the governor, who said he had a plan, said he was going to protect the citizens, they sat back and allowed buildings to burn, businesses to go out of business. And right now, we have state troopers, we have National Guardsmen guarding buildings that are burned down. Where were they the first night?

As much as we're talking about the Rams players have who supported us -- and we're grateful for them for that -- we're calling on all of the professional players, lawmakers, anyone who is against injustice against anyone, not just because it was an officer against a young, black man, but it was an injustice that continues to happen when we find a prosecuting attorney who goes in and gives false evidence, and a system that has failed to protect the taxpayers.

BLITZER: What do you make -- we're showing these protesters. We have live pictures coming in from the Justice Department in Washington, D.C., right now. What do you make of these protests that are developing not just in Ferguson but all over the country right now, Pastor?

WHITE: Well, the thing we have to understand, Wolf, the Department of Justice was in Portland, in Cincinnati, they have been in New York, in New Jersey and they are here in St. Louis. But what does it matter if this continues to happen throughout the country? So I'm hoping when President Obama calls for his meetings today that he allows persons, like myself or others, to come to the White House to speak about the continual police state that this country is in. What good is it for the Justice Department to be in various places but this continues to happen? We're calling for community policing. We're calling for our police to become officer friendly once again and we're asking the president of the United States, the Department of Justice and all lawmakers to take a closer look at what's happening throughout this country.

BLITZER: Do you have confidence in President Obama and Eric Holder, the attorney general of the United States?

WHITE: Well, what we have confidence, as a pastor, is I have confidence in the Holy Spirit. I have confidence that the good people of this country will come together and force those that we have elected to do the right thing, whether it's President Obama or the next president, because we understand that this wasn't broken in one day and it won't be fixed in one day. But if we can start the dialogue and the conversation, and force Eric Holder, President Obama, Governor Nixon, and all of those folks in authority, to take a closer look at to what is happening to the taxpayers and the citizens of this country.

BLITZER: Pastor Robert White, thanks very much for joining us.

WHITE: Thank you for having us.

BLITZER: Up next, fears over ISIS attacks now has the U.S. military rethinking social media posts. We'll take a closer look at the possible threat.

And there's a new warning for U.S. military personnel right here in the United States.

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BLITZER: A demonstration in New York City is getting a bit livelier. You're looking at pictures coming in from New York. Moments ago, we saw police arrest at least one of the protesters in New York. We have no idea what that individual was arrested for but we saw him taken away. You can see live pictures coming in from New York. People are angry over the Ferguson, Missouri, grand jury decision not to indict the police officer, Darren Wilson, who has since resigned from the Ferguson police department. Other demonstrations are going on here in Washington outside the Justice Department in Chicago, Stanford, elsewhere as well. Small in number, relatively speaking, but people clearly are upset. We'll have more on this story coming up a little while.

I want to move on to some other important news we're monitoring right now at the same time. A new warning, in fact, for U.S. military troops right here at home. A warning about possible terrorist attacks by ISIS sympathizers and social media.

Our Pamela Brown is here with me. She's looking at what is going on.

And this is potentially significant developments. It's not every day that they issue these kinds of alerts. What's going on?

PAMELA BROWN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It really is. Let me tell you why it's so significant, Wolf. Basically, the FBI, DHS sending out this bulletin that's a warning sent out to U.S. military members telling them that ISIS is assessing and spotting like-minded individuals, sympathizers, who might be living in the U.S., who could carry out an attack of the U.S. military. This shows that ISIS members are putting forth more effort to find people online and encourage them even more to carry out attacks. A more specific effort here. In this bulletin, it says -- it urges caution with members of the military not to put any identifiable information online because that can be a treasurer trove of information for someone who wants to cause harm. Also, this warning is coming at a time when members of the military may be traveling for the holiday season, may be wearing their uniform, and so that is also pointed out in this new warning.

BLITZER: Are they being urged not to wear their military uniforms but wear their civilian clothing when walking around?

BROWN: I didn't get that from the bulletin, Wolf, but I think that is sort of what they are trying to say here is, look, don't draw attention to yourself, don't publicize, advertise that you're a member of the U.S. military because that could catch the attention of someone, an ISIS sympathizer, a lone wolf who may want to cause harm to you. That's the message they are trying to get across to members of the U.S. military.

And it's worth pointing out, Wolf, this is following two attacks in Canada targeting members of the military there. And there have been similar bulletins have been sent out for law enforcement personnel, members of the military. This is the latest one, based on new information coming in to law enforcement.

BLITZER: So there's specific information that caused this concern, caused this alarm? It's not just being issued as a result of an abundance of caution, shall we say?

BROWN: I think an abundance of caution is the driver of this but there's continual online chatter. Law enforcement is seeing an increase in efforts by ISIS to find individuals living in the U.S. who could carry out a lone-wolf attack. My sense is that that is what that information revolves around.

BLITZER: Pamela Brown, thank you very much.

BROWN: Thank you.

BLITZER: Let's hope that it doesn't materialize, but certainly a worrisome development.

Coming up, we'll show you more of what is going around the country. The protests that have developed, not huge in number, but they are continuing. These are live pictures from New York City right now. Several hundred people have taken to the streets, a nationwide walkout to protest the Ferguson, Missouri, grand jury decision. We have crews on the ground. We'll update you on all of this when we come back.

By the way, these are people outside the U.S. Department of Justice. Moments, they were on the ground, on the sidewalk, lying down, peace protests. They are continuing to express their anger over what is going on.

And here's another protest in Chicago right now. Once again, not large numbers, but people simply expressing their anger over the Ferguson, Missouri, grand jury decision.

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JOSH EARNEST, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The president and his administration are very focused on the underlying issues that have been uncovered in a pretty law way in Ferguson. These kinds of issues, the nature of the relationship between law enforcement agencies and the communities they are sworn to serve and protect is -- it's something that a lot of communities across the country are dealing with, cities large and small. And the president thinks it's important for to us have a broader discussion on these issues. And, you know, certainly, some of the announcements we've made today in terms of community policing initiative that this administration has now rolled out and the task force on policing that will be led by the Philadelphia chief of police and a former DOJ official with a civil rights background, that some of these initiatives are meant to try to address those underlying concerns that are evident not just in Ferguson but in communities all across the country.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BLITZER: The White House press secretary, Josh Earnest, moments ago speaking there at the White House press briefing, announcing some steps the president is taking right now to deal with the serious issues, long-standing issues, not simply resulting from the Ferguson, Missouri, grand jury decision. Much more on this story coming up as we monitor the protests across the country right now.

Elsewhere, here in Washington, on the docket of the U.S. Supreme Court today is what could be a landmark freedom of speech case. It's the first free speech case that the justices have heard since social media became such a major part of every day life. At issue is the conviction of Anthony Elonis over a Facebook post to his estranged wife. A lower court ruled they were threats and not protected by the First Amendment.

Here are a couple of those quotes: "I'm not going to rest until your body is a mess, soaked in blood and dying from all the little cuts." Then he posted this after his wife got a protective order. Quote, "Fold up your PFA and put it in your pocket. Is it thick enough to stop a bullet?"

Let's bring in our senior legal analyst, Jeffrey Toobin.

Talk about the arguments that were heard by the justices today. Anthony's Elonis' attorney said he was simply blowing off steam and that he had a right to do so. What's the issue here as far as protected speech?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Wolf, this is a very hard case. And the legal issue in this case is what's the standard to be applied when these cases arise? What the Department of Justice has said is that the standard should be an objective standard. What would a reasonable person think on reading these Facebook posts? Would a reasonable person say that these were specific threats of violence? What Elonis' lawyers say is that's the wrong standards. That the standard should be, did the defendant, did he himself intend that these threats be taken seriously and literally. The jury was instructed under the Department of Justice formulation. That's why he's in prison for seven years. The defendant wants a new trial with a different legal standard applied.

BLITZER: His lawyers, Elonis' were arguing what he was writing in these posts is similar to what artists, like Eminem, would be using in their songs. Is that a good argument?

TOOBIN: It is a good argument because these are words, languages, feelings, that are familiar in a pretty coarse -- the pretty coarse world we live in. So it is true that a lot of people in public life use this kind of language. The Department of Justice answer is, look, let's let the jury decide. If you want to argue to the jury that this is just blowing off steam, this is just like Eminem, fine, argue that to the jury. But the jury, as the voice of the community, can sort out whether this is speech, exaggeration, blowing off steam, or a threat to do violence.

BLITZER: These nine justices -- and you know them well -- they are all in their, what, 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s right now? What impact does that age have on an issue like this, involving social media? And as we point out, this is the first real social media case that has come before the U.S. Supreme Court?

TOOBIN: It has a big impact. There are justices on there that I assure you have never been on Facebook and had to have it explained to them by their law clerks. A couple of years ago, they dealt with what they called a new technology, which was pagers. Pagers were old even then. This is an example of trying to bring the bedrock concept of the First Amendment, which, after all, was written in the 18th century, in trying to apply them in the 21st. In fairness to the justices, they usually get it right. I don't know if it's from their law clerks or from their reading. When you look at how they have dealt with technology, they have actually applied it in a pretty sensible way. I think this case is a hard one. I don't know how it will come out. But it is -- I do trust that the justices will figure out what Facebook is.

BLITZER: I assume if they rule against this defendant and say, yes, these were real threats, he deserved to spend time in jail for making these threats against his estranged wife, that potentially could have a huge chilling effect on what people post on these social media sites?

TOOBIN: It will have a chilling effect. And the answer of the Department of Justice is, "Good, it should have a chilling effect. You should not be threatening people with bodily harm on Facebook or any other place. That's why these laws exist."

I'll tell you another thing, Wolf, that I think has played into the background of this case. Look at the school shootings we've seen in recent years. Look at how everyone has said, why didn't we see the signs. Where didn't we act on whether it was Facebook posts or other kind of social media or Internet posts? And I think the justices are very likely to have that in mind. And that may well be a finger on the scale in favor of upholding the conviction in this case.

BLITZER: I was happy that Justice Ruth Bader Ginsberg -- had a heart procedure last week -- she was back on the court today. Good for her as well. We wish her --

TOOBIN: Tough woman.

BLITZER: -- a very speedy recovery.

Jeffrey, thank you very much.

That's it for me. I'll be back at 5:00 p.m. eastern in "The Situation Room."

For our international viewers, "Amanpour" is coming up after a quick break.

For our viewers in North America, "Newsroom" with Brooke Baldwin starts right at the top of the hour.

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