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Wolf

Police and Chokehold Death Protesters Face Off; Chokehold Death Highlights Police Tensions; Garner's Mother Praises Protesters; Potential Candidates Weigh In on Race; Bush Says Sad that Race Is So Divisive; NYC Police Test Body Cameras; Would Body Cams Have Made a Difference; Defense Secretary Nominee

Aired December 05, 2014 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer. It's 1:00 p.m. here in Washington, 6:00 p.m. in London, 8:00 p.m. in Jerusalem, 9:00 p.m. in Moscow. From wherever you're watching around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

Up first, shades of the civil right march -- civil rights marches of the 1960s confronting the racial tensions of 2014. Protesters here in the United States expected to stage another day of marches, sit-ins and so-called die-ins over the chokehold death of Eric Garner. The grand jury's decision in New York City not to indict the police officer involved in garner's death set off a wave of 1960s style demonstrations.

The latest protests in New York were mostly peaceful but some of them were disrupted. Police say at least 200 people were arrested overnight. Protesters all too -- also took to the streets in several other major cities across the United States.

Supporters of the officer at the center of the firestorm, they are coming to his defense. The head of the Patrolman's Benevolent Association in New York describes Daniel Pantaleo as a model officer, a dedicated public servant and even as an Eagle Scout.

Meanwhile, New York City police officers, they are getting a refresher course in the proper use of force. The police commissioner says the entire force is now being retrained.

Protesters, meanwhile, are calling for reform in the wake of Eric Garner's death. By taking into the streets, they're hoping to keep up the pressure on the police. And we'll get the latest on the protests, the grand jury decision that set them all off in this report from CNN's Alexandra Field.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on camera): Why are you arrested? Why were you arrested?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was arrested for standing and protesting.

FIELD (voice-over): Protesters in cuffs across New York --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They wouldn't let us walk through Times Square.

FIELD: -- after some seven hours of marching. Police cracking down as thousands of protesters gathered for a second night. Standoffs but no serious violence replicated across the country. Nationwide, outrage, Garner's daughter says, she appreciates.

ERICA GARNER: This is not a black and white issue. This is a national crisis.

FIELD: In Chicago, protesters clashed with police after shutting down a major thoroughfare. And in D.C., protesters stage a die-in only blocks from the White House.

UNIDENTIFIED: (INAUDIBLE.)

CROWD: No peace.

FIELD: All of this after a grand jury declined to indict NYPD Officer Daniel Pantaleo in the chokehold death of 43-year-old Eric Garner.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ERIC GARNER: I can't breathe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FIELD: According to the New York Supreme Court, the grand jury sat for nine weeks hearing from a total of 50 witnesses, 22 civilians, also police officers and medical personnel. 60 exhibits were admitted into evidence including videos, records regarding NYPD policies and procedures, Garner's medical records and photographs of the scene. But the details of that evidence remains sealed.

GWEN CARR: What video was they watching? Because, obviously, it wasn't the one that the whole world was watching.

FIELD: The Department of Justice launching a federal investigation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Too many Americans feel deep unfairness when it comes to the gap between our professed ideals and how our laws are applied on a day-to-day basis.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FIELD: New York Mayor, Bill De Blasio, ordering a retraining of the NYPD's 35,000 officers.

BILL DE BLASIO (D), MAYOR, NEW YORK: We're changing how our officers talk with residents of the city, changing how they listen.

FIELD: And attorney general, Eric Holder, calling for reform.

ERIC HOLDER, ATTORNEY GENERAL: There are real, practical and concrete measures that can be taken. FIELD: Reform civil right leaders say is needed nationwide.

MARC MORIAL, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL URBAN LEAGUE: When we shine a spotlight on the criminal justice system, when we shine a spotlight on the experiences of people, it points to a very big problem.

FIELD: In Cleveland, Ohio, a nearly two-year investigation by the Justice Department found what they call a pattern of excessive force by police caused by insufficient accountability, inadequate training and ineffective policies. (INAUDIBLE) the NAACP and the Montgomery County Sheriff's Department are investigating racist text messages allegedly exchanged by several deputies. Parts of the texts read aloud by Dayton NAACP president, Derick Forward.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do apples and black people have in common? They both hang from trees.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FIELD (live): The Montgomery county sheriff has come out to say that those text messages have tarnished the office but, really, words are not enough to soothe the tensions we have seen. This isn't over yet. There are protests planned in at least 11 other cities and we're preparing to have another demonstration, we're hearing of, in lower Manhattan around 5:30 this afternoon -- Wolf.

BLITZER: We'll have coverage, obviously, of that. Alexandra Field in Times Square for us. Thanks very much.

We're also hearing more today from the mother of Eric Garner about the death -- his death at the hands of police. She's expressing pride in the way protesters have responded and anger over the way her son died. On CNN's "NEW DAY" earlier today she said the police officer who subdued Garner overreacted.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CARR: If you look at Pantaleo, he's a little man and he sneaked up behind my son and grabbed him, which he didn't have to do that. My son was no threat at that time. If you look at the video, he's talking to them but he has his hands up at all times. They know that he wasn't going to try to attack them on anything. He wanted to be a hero and he went behind him and put him in a chokehold and brought him down. And then, he wouldn't let him go. As my son begged for his life, he still held on. So, it was like a thrill kill.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Gwen Carr also applauded the demonstrators as she got to meet them up close during a traffic jam caused by the protesters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CARR: I was on my way home on the west side highway. The traffic was held up. The protesters was walking past us. I had to let my window down. And, you know, some of them -- the first person who recognized me was a white gentleman. He came and said, this is Eric Garner's mother. He came over and he went to shake my hand. Other protesters wanted to take a picture with me. I was sitting in the car and I was so thrilled, so thrilled even to be held up in traffic and they were coming by and they were standing for my son. I thank them. I thank them so very much. Keep up the good work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Race relations in the United States are dominating the conversation right now coast-to-coast, indeed around the world people are reacting. And now, we're hearing more from a pair of potential 2016 presidential candidates. We're also hearing from one former U.S. president.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: We have allowed our criminal justice system to get out of balance. And I personally hope that these tragedies give us the opportunity to come together as a nation to find our balance again.

SEN. RAND PAUL (R), KENTUCKY: There, obviously, are different legal standards. You know, there's a legal standard for a grand jury indictment but there's also a standard that the police department should have for what kind of force is acceptable or unacceptable. And I think, really, to calm down the reaction to this, one thing that could happen is the police could say, this is unacceptable for a policeman, and we can't have this type of an individual on the police force.

GEORGE W. BUSH, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I had dinner with Condol the other night and we talked about this subject. And, yes, she just said, you've just got to understand that there are a lot of, you know, black folks around that are just incredibly or and more distrusting of law enforcement.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: He was referring to Condoleezza Rice, his former Secretary of State. You can hear, by the way, a lot more from the former president, George Bush. He's a special guest on "STATE OF THE UNION" with Candy Crowley. It comes all of your way Sunday morning at 9:00 a.m. Eastern. George W. Gush with Candy.

Today, New York City kicked off a pilot program to test body cameras. About 60 police officers around the city began wearing the cameras to record their interactions with the public.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm minding my business, officer. Please, just leave me alone. I told you the last time, please leave me alone.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE.)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please don't touch me. Don't touch me. (INAUDIBLE.)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: The Eric Garner encounter with police, all of which was caught on separate different cell phone video, not body cameras, raises question about whether body cameras will help in claims against police.

So, let's bring in Philip Banks. He has unique perspective on what's going on. He spent 28 years with the NYPD, building his way all the way up to becoming chief of department. Chief, thanks very much for joining us. What -- first of all, before we get into some of the other bigger questions, these body cameras, the experiment of using body cameras for all the cops to walk around with these cameras, what do you make of that?

PHILIP BANKS, FORMER CHIEF, NEW YORK POLICE DEPARTMENT: Well, you know, potentially it has a good effect. But, like you said just two minutes ago, this Garner incident was caught on video. It was the ultimate body camera. And when the decision from the grand jury to not indict, it spurred a lot of mistrust or the increasing mistrust of the criminal justice system. So, while I think that there is some value to it, how you apply it and how you -- what you do with the evidence that you come across with these body cameras are going to be the true test.

BLITZER: If you're a street cop, do you want to walk around Manhattan or any of the other boroughs in New York always knowing that everything you're doing is being recorded?

BANKS: Well, interestingly, Wolf, I went to a conference in Texas, at Houston, about six months ago. And my initial reaction was that police officers were not going to want to wear these body cameras. And when I went down to this conference, I met with some of my peers, police chiefs in other cities who have been utilizing this. They said the reaction to the police officers was quite welcoming. And after they had it for more months more, more officers actually were volunteering for it. So, the initial response would be it's new. We don't know how it's going to be used, how we're going to be utilizing it against us. But I think the more that we start to use them, I think the police officers will be a lot more receptive to wearing them.

BLITZER: All right. I want you to stand by for a moment, Chief Banks. We have a lot more to discuss, major issues. As I said, you have unique perspective, 28 years in the NYPD building your way up to becoming chief of department. We're going to get your reaction to what's going on in New York City right now, indeed all across the United States. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Take a look at this. The Dow Jones industrial is approaching record high, getting very, very close to the 18,000 mark right now. It's pretty impressive. I guess, in part, because of the jobs numbers, more than 300,000 jobs created last month here in the United States. Unemployment down to 5.8 percent. Look at the Dow Jones industrial, 17,979 right now. We'll see if it hits that 18,000 mark this hour. Stay with us for that.

In the meantime, let's get back to Philip Banks. He's a 28-year veteran of the NYPD, the New York Police Department. We've been discussing police wearing body cameras.

Chief Banks, after the Ferguson shooting death of Michael Brown, President Obama called for spending $75 million to equipping police with these body cameras. I know you've got some mixed feelings. But basically, bottom line, you think it's worth experimenting and going forward with that, right?

PHILIP BANKS, FORMER NYPD CHIEF OF DEPARTMENT: No, absolutely I think it's worth it. And I don't have mixed feelings on it. I think that the offices initially are going to have mixed feelings on it. The police are going to look to decide, is this something that can hurt us or is this something that can assist us. And when they answer that particular question, you have the answer to how the police officers are going to be receptive.

I think it's a good idea. I think that it can work. I think if it's implemented properly it will put a lot of transparency, which is a large part of the problem. So I think it's a good thing and certainly work exploring.

BLITZER: In the aftermath of the grand jury decision and the video that we've all seen of Eric Garner, a lot of New Yorkers, as you well know, they've lost confidence in the NYPD and there are all sorts of accusations, built-in racism, two-tiered justice system. Your reaction to what's going on?

BANKS: Well, I don't think it's germane to just the NYPD. I think that there's a growing mistrust of the criminal justice system. And the problem that the local law enforcement, the police have is that they bear the face of the entire criminal system. So this is a mistrust that has been taking place for a very long time and it certainly does appear to be growing. And when you don't trust an entity, then you start to question anything coming out of that entity. And if you reverse it, if you trust the entity, then you're certainly more willing to be acceptive (ph) of their policies and to be compliant with their orders. So there's a general mistrust of the criminal justice system and that's something that the law enforcement has to make a priority and has to tackle that problem immediately.

BLITZER: Because when we look at the video, we've all seen it numerous times by now, when those cops, including Daniel Pantaleo, went after Eric Garner and started to choke him, force him to the ground, what -- the allegation was that he was simply selling illegal cigarettes, right? Did these cops overreact to what was really, really a minor alleged crime?

BANKS: Well, you know, there's two ways to look at that, Wolf. I'm not so sure whether or not we should be looking at it as just the fact he was selling or not selling illegal cigarettes. I'm not sure if he was or was not. The issue is that when a police officer is looking to make a lawful arrest, there are times in which police officers become injured by making these low-level offenses. Now, that's not to suggest that this was handled in the correct manner. I certainly think that there was ways in which this could have been handled better. But I don't think the litmus test should be that when we're looking to make an arrest, we're arresting a violator for such a minor offense. There are officers who have received injuries on making low-level offense arrests.

BLITZER: Now, you've heard all the criticism that police have more important things to do than going after individuals selling cigarettes illegally. You were -- I don't know if you were, but you know all about this, right?

BANKS: I do. Yes, I do.

BLITZER: Well, tell us your - tell us your thought because there's some suggestion out there, and I don't know if it's true, that you were one of those cops who recommended going after these illegal cigarette sellers?

BANKS: Yes, that was totally untrue. And actually the media outlet who put that out, I believe that they could have done a little more due diligence in that. What happened was that my office -- and I came out with a policy that if anyone caused 311 numerous times, which we would categorize as a crime caller (ph), that the precinct commander had to send someone to visit the complainant and get to the bottom of the story. So that call, of not necessarily Eric Garner, but conditions that were taking place in front of that location had reached a chronic level. So it necessitated for my office a notification to the local commander to reach out to the complainant and find out exactly what the issue is. And it was erroneously, I may add, reported that my office directed them to respond there and to take some type of enforcement action. So we had officers - we had the local commanders paying attention to 311 callers. The object - or the objective of it was specifically to reach out to the complainant and have a conversation. And oftentimes we find that we can solve some of these issues without taking enforcement action.

BLITZER: Chief Banks, I'm glad you explained, gave us some perspective on what was going on, because I saw that other report and I wanted to give you a chance to correct the record.

BANKS: Thank you.

BLITZER: Thank you very much for joining us. I hope you'll come back.

BANKS: Thank you.

BLITZER: Because you certainly do have a good perspective on what's going on in New York City, 28 years in the NYPD, working your way up to becoming chief of department. Thank you very much, Philip Banks.

And just ahead, much more coming up on the marches, the sit-ins. We're going to get an inside look at the protests gripping New York City, other cities across the United States right now. And, President Obama makes his choice official as he introduces Ashton Carter as his new defense secretary nominee. Will the U.S. Senate support the choice? We're going to take a closer look at who Ash Carter is. Gloria Borger is standing by. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: President Obama, today, touting a very strong financial statement, a jobs report here in the United States. The November jobs report, which showed an increase of more than 320,000 jobs created last month. The president says the country is on a hiring pace it hasn't seen since the 1990s during the Clinton administration. But also says there's still much more work to be done.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So we've got an opportunity to keep up this progress if Congress is willing to keep our government open, avoid self-inflicted wounds and work together to invest in the things that support faster jobs growth in high-paying jobs. And that means exports, infrastructure, streamlining our tax code, immigration reform, giving minimum wage workers a raise.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Let's bring in Gloria Borger, our chief political analyst.

Gloria, 320,000 jobs created. Unemployment going down to 5.8 percent. Very impressive numbers. But the president gave a little dig to the Republicans, talking about keeping the government open.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, he did. Right, because he doesn't want to do anything to hurt this. He wants -- what the administration wants to see is an acceleration in wage growth, Wolf, because -- and you see a few signs of that in today's report. But if you see that, if people's incomes actually start to grow and that would bolster the economy and there would be more consumer spending, then people would really feel it at home and it would be wind at the president's back, wind at the next democratic presidential candidate's back and might help the president push his agenda through Congress a little bit because the public would give him stronger approval ratings, obviously.

BLITZER: Yes, he was gloating about these very positive job numbers at the start of this event where he formally made his announcement for the new secretary of defense nominee. Listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ASHTON CARTER, DEFENSE SECRETARY NOMINEE: As we talked together in the past weeks, Mr. President, we discussed the challenges and the opportunities and the need both to keep America safe and to make a better future for our children. If confirmed in this job, I pledge to you my most candid, strategic advice. And I pledge also that you will receive equally handed military advice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: That's Ashton Carter, the nominee who's going to have to be confirmed by the United States Senate, a former deputy secretary of defense during the Obama administration.

BORGER: Right.

BLITZER: He was an assistant secretary of defense during the Clinton administration. He probably doesn't have much problem getting confirmed.

BORGER: No. And I think he's got a lot of bipartisan support. He's well-known to Republicans like John McCain, who respect him, as well, you know, as to Democrats who respect him as well. He served for an awfully long time in government.

I think what you're going to see in the confirmation process, though, Wolf, is not so much Ash Carter being put on trial front and center, but you're going - you're going to see Republicans trying and point out the differences that he might have had with the president. For example, on keeping a residual force in Iraq. Did the administration fight hard enough for that? We heard Leon Panetta, former secretary of defense, in his book say the president didn't do that.

Should the president have walked right up to the red line that he drew on Syria and then walked away from it? Ash Carter may have had some different feelings about that. So I think what Republicans will do is say, OK, we respect you. You differ from the president. What kind of influence can you possibly have on this tight circle of White House advisers who do not let in any secretary of defense? Why would you be any different from anyone else?

BLITZER: And, if confirmed, he would be the fourth secretary of defense in the Obama administration.

BORGER: That's right. That's right.

BLITZER: And he'll be confirmed by a Republican majority in the U.S. Senate. It could be 54 if Mary Landrieu loses in the runoff tomorrow.

BORGER: That's right.

BLITZER: Fifty-four Republicans in the new Senate.

BORGER: And I still think - and I think he will get confirmed, but I do think they're going to really point out the difficulties he might have with this administration. It was interesting that he said to the president, I promise you my candid advice, which means, I may disagree with you.

BLITZER: We'll watch those confirmation hearings.

BORGER: Yes.

BLITZER: All right, Gloria, thank you. Just ahead, protesters have taken to the streets by the thousands here

in the United States. They're deeply angered over the chokehold death of Eric Garner. We're going to take an up close look at the demonstrations. That and a lot more when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)