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Wolf

Several Dead in Anti-Terror Operation in Belgium; New Video of Operation in Belgium; Boko Haram's Scorched-Earth Terror in Nigeria

Aired January 15, 2015 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back to our viewers in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer, reporting from Washington.

Want to update you on the breaking news this hour. Major developments. Several people have been killed in an anti-terror operation in Belgium. It happened near a train station in the city of Verviers in eastern Belgium. Here are the first pictures we're getting of the scene. According to our CNN affiliate, VTM News, several suspected terrorists were killed and at least one person was taken into custody. We expect to learn more at the top of the hour. Belgium's federal prosecutor scheduled to hold a news conference 2:00 p.m. Eastern. We'll have coverage of that, of course.

In the meantime, let's bring in Paul Cruickshank, who's been monitoring what's going on in Belgium.

What else are you learning, Paul?

PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Wolf, I've been speaking to a senior Belgian counter-terrorism official. He says this operation in this town is linked to a group suspected of traveling to Syria, to have connected with ISIS in Syria, and crucially that ISIS persuaded to return to Europe to launch terrorist attacks. They've had this group under surveillance for the last several weeks, perhaps longer. They were very worried about them. Watching them very, very closely. They decided today to launch this operation. A lot of things happened very, very quickly. It appears several of these suspects were killed in the raid. I understand there are other operations going on in other parts of Belgium right now connected to Belgians traveling to Syria, linking up with terrorist groups there and coming back. This is very fast-moving, very serious indeed.

But this appears, from what I'm being told, to have been an ISIS- directed group suspected of plotting attacks in Belgium, in Europe, in retaliation for the air strikes against Iraq and Syria. This is really a big escalation, if that's the case, from ISIS. It's the kind of worst-case scenario. It's a group with thousands of European recruits that it can recruit into its ranks. Tens of millions of dollars of crash reserves. Training camps across the country in this terrorist safe haven. The Belgians have been very, very worried about this. Large travel flows from Belgium to Syria. About 150 Belgian nationals believed fighting there now. 30 killed, 70 back, around 15 leaving the country every month to go to Syria and Iraq to fight. These are unprecedented times in Europe when it comes to a security threat -- Wolf.

BLITZER: I assume -- we don't know for sure -- this crackdown by Belgian authorities, this operation in which several of these terrorists were now killed and other -- trying to round up other suspects at this time is the aftermath of what happened in Paris last week, even if there's no direct connection between the Paris terrorists and these suspected terrorists in Belgium.

CRUICKSHANK: I think that's a fair assumption. No evidence that there's a connection between these groups in Belgium and the brothers in Paris. Authorities in Belgium saw what played out on the streets of Paris. The concerns will just have grown about the potential for groups who've connected with the bad guys in Syria and Iraq to do harm on the streets of Europe and Belgium. Belgium has already had a terrible tragedy when it comes to them coming back from Syria. A French ISIS fighter came back and launched an attack in May. Big concern right now in Belgium right across Europe about this dynamic -- Wolf?

BLITZER: How many people were killed in the attack?

CRUICKSHANK: There were four people killed, gunned down by an assailant, allegedly a French ISIS veteran who spent time with ISIS in Syria and come back. In that case, investigators think he probably launched on his own steam. What's different now is ISIS is starting to prioritize attacks against Europe itself, starting to try to persuade European fighters coming back to launch those attacks. That could be a real game changer. European intelligence agencies detecting that shift now. It's what everybody's been worried about and what we're seeing now unfold potentially.

BLITZER: Paul, I want you to standby and watch this.

I want all of the viewers to watch this as well.

We're just getting in the first amateur video of this counter-terror operation that took place in the eastern Belgium city of Verviers earlier today. Watch and listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(GUNFIRE)

(SHOUTING)

(GUNFIRE)

(SHOUTING)

(GUNFIRE)

(SHOUTING)

(END VIDEO CLIP) BLITZER: There you have the first amateur video we've gotten from this anti-terror operation that went down in eastern Belgium today.

Paul Cruickshank is still with us. Bob Baer is with us as well.

Bob, first to you.

You listen to that sound, watch the video, what do you say?

BOB BAER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, Wolf, this isn't the Europe I know. I worked there for years. I've seen terrorism. Quick explosions, but actual battles in the streets is new. What Paul reported about ISIS having decided to launch in the consideration that there's so many Europeans fighting in Syria, can come home, grab automatic weapons off the black market. You know, this is unchartered territory for Europe. I just cannot tell you where it's going to go.

BLITZER: And, Paul Cruickshank, you've been doing excellent reporting for us in what went down in eastern Belgium today. You see the video. You hear the prolonged sound of gunshots clearly. It was an extensive situation.

CRUICKSHANK: Well, Wolf, it perhaps suggests they were confronting a heavily armed group, that this went on for some time that they needed to neutralize this threat at this location in Belgium, that they were perhaps dealing with, as we understand now, with people who had come back from Syria, people who fought on the front line in Syria, experiencing urban warfare and fighting with ISIS. And the Belgian security forces today are having to fight what we hear are ISIS retinues coming back. This is quite extraordinary that the war in Syria and Iraq is playing out in just the last few hours in Europe, in an eastern part of the country of Belgium -- Wolf?

Tom Fuentes is with us as well.

You see this battle going on. Clearly looks like the suspected terrorists in this town, they were pretty well armed, because the police did not have an easy time going after these guys.

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: That's true. We've seen it with the French police where usually they're outgunned. In this case, the police would have been prepared. I think they knew what kind of people they were going up against. We have seen something like this in the past, a couple years ago in Madrid, where the police tracked down an al Qaeda cell. In that case, they had explosives and started a large fire and explosions. And the worry in a case like this is that they might burn the whole apartment building down and kill other innocent people or have booby traps and bombs inside. It's significant that they were able to arrest and/or kill the bad guys.

BLITZER: I want to cue up this amateur video one more time and play a little bit of it. I want Tom and Bob and Paul to listen once it again and see if you can make out the sound, the explosions and weaponry potentially that was use used.

Let's play it very briefly. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(GUNFIRE)

(SHOUTING)

(GUNFIRE)

(SHOUTING)

(GUNFIRE)

(SHOUTING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: All right. Tom Fuentes, you're an expert on weapons. Do you hear anything significant there?

FUENTES: You hear small arms fire. With the general sound, I don't know if that's wind blowing across the microphone.

BLITZER: This is a residential area, too. This is not like a business area.

FUENTES: That sounds like maybe wind, because it's being filmed outside. I don't think that was a continuous succession of explosions. We do hear the small arms fire, so it does appear they're having a gun battle.

BLITZER: It looks like they were well armed.

Bob, what did you hear?

BAER: Well, I heard explosions were probably flash bang grenades that the police would throw to disable people in a room. Wolf, you have to consider that as the gun battles start, they will have to go from dynamic entries to combat entries and then just kill everybody in a room, which is much closer to a military operation. Again, the police have no choice but to use military tactics when you have an armed group like this coming out of Syria and Iraq.

BLITZER: Paul Cruickshank, what's your analysis?

CRUICKSHANK: I'm half Belgian. To see these scenes play out, it's really shocking for me. Ideal with terrorism in terms of analyzing it every day. To see this playing out again on the streets of Belgian after we saw the attack on the Belgian museum. The Belgian officials I talk to say the threat is unprecedented because so many Belgian nationals have gone off to Syria and Iraq and connected with groups there and they're starting to come back. There are 60 or 70 who are back. Amongst those are the people holed up in Verviers, in this town, which the operation was just launched.

Really extraordinary scenes. Underlines the threat not only in Belgium but right across Europe because of these travel flows to Syria. And now I think the fear is that ISIS is starting to pivot towards prioritizing attacks in the West. In fact, they're spokesman back in September made that threat clear. He said ISIS was going to conduct raids in the West in response to the U.S. air strikes and European air strikes in Iraq and Syria. This may well be ISIS now retaliating.

I'm hearing that this group, this very group you're seeing in the operation against right now, were in Syria, did connect with ISIS. And the Belgium officials suspect they were directed by ISIS to come back and launch some kind of attack. A lot is still unclear to Belgian investigators. They just suspect that ISIS wanted them to launch an attack. It's not absolutely crystal clear, but they were very, very worried about this cell and other cells across Belgium.

BLITZER: I just want to be precise. You're also hearing from that source of yours in Belgium that this is just one of several operations that were going down today trying to round up suspected terrorists?

CRUICKSHANK: That's right. I'm hearing that there are multiple operations underway -- they obviously can't get into it more than that -- in Belgium. All connected to this concern about individuals who fought in Syria and Iraq who have become trained killers and have returned to Belgium, and who Belgium authorities for months and months have regarded as a security threat, a major security threat. They feel spread very thin in terms of combating this. They don't have the resources to monitor these people 24/7. So now they're launching these operations. Clearly, it would appear, because of worries about terrorism, because of what we saw play out in Paris just a week ago, the concern that perhaps these groups of young men who come back from Syria may be inspired by what they saw play out in the "Charlie Hebdo"

Ahead at this hour, satellite images show entire towns literally wiped off the map after Boko Haram continues its rampage through Nigeria leaving death and destruction in its wake. That's right. I'm hearing that there are multiple operations underway. They obviously can't get into it more than that, in Belgium. All connected to this concern about individuals who've become trained killers and returned to Belgium and who Belgium authorities for months and months and months have regarded as a major security threat. They don't have the resources to monitor these people 24/7. Now they're launching these operations, clearly, it would appear at least because of worries about terrorism, because of what we saw play out in Paris just a week ago. Concern that perhaps these groups of young men who have come back may be inspired by what they saw play out on the "Charlie Hebdo" magazine, that the Belgians felt that they had to go in.

BLITZER: Paul Cruickshank, stand by.

Everyone standby.

We're going to stay on top of the breaking news, what's going on in Belgium right now, a significant anti-terror operation. We're told at least two people, suspected terrorists, are dead, one injured. More on that coming up.

Also coming up, a CNN exclusive interview with Nigerian soldiers and the struggles they're facing in the terror fight against Boko Haram.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: We're continuing to follow the breaking news out of Belgium, anti-terror operations underway now.

But we want to turn to another story. Outgunned, outmanned and out- resourced, that's how soldiers battling Boko Haram describe the fight against the Boko Haram terrorist group. They torched thousands of homes and killed as many as 2,000 people nearly two weeks ago.

CNN's Nic Robertson travels to Nigeria in this exclusive report to hear the plight of the soldiers battling the terror group.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We're on the way to meet a soldier who's been in the front line of the battle against Boko Haram. We've been chasing him all day and still trying to catch up with him.

(voice-over): Eventually, we meet, hidden in a tiny store. He dares only to spend a few minutes with us. He's not authorized to talk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

ROBERTSON (on camera): Of soldiers?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, of soldiers.

ROBERTSON (voice-over): He's telling a side of the war we never hear, what it's like to be a soldier fighting Boko Haram.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are not issued the kits. We buy the kits ourself.

ROBERTSON (on camera): You have to buy the uniform?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah. I bought it myself.

ROBERTSON: That's incredible.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

ROBERTSON (voice-over): His base is outside this town, three hours northeast of the capital. It's where the mostly Muslim meets the mostly Christian south. Right here, last month, a twin suicide bombing killed 12 people. There are thousands of troops stationed in this town and many more stories like the soldier we're talking to.

(on camera): So this is what they gave you after your injury recommending for treatment?

(voice-over): Another soldier shows me his medical a papers. He, too, is not authorized to speak to us. His unit, he says, was outgunned, Boko Haram with longer, bigger weapons, more men and more ammunition. His comrades fled leaving him behind.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

ROBERTSON (on camera): Against the fight?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

ROBERTSON (voice-over): Three scary days alone on the run from the terror group before reaching his base.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

ROBERTSON: His morale, rock bottom. Things were bound to get worse.

(on camera): The army won't pay for drugs even though you got injury fighting Boko Haram.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They are not paying for drugs.

ROBERTSON (voice-over): We asked a senior government official about shortcomings. He said he would look into it.

(on camera): Why don't the generals see this problem and think about giving you better weapons to win the fight?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

ROBERTSON: Corruption?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Corruption.

ROBERTSON: How can you go on being a soldier in that environment?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a call to some.

ROBERTSON (voice-over): Good will that without bigger guns and more ammunition may soon run out.

Nic Robertson, CNN, Nigeria.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: A horrible situation.

That's it for me. Thanks for watching. The news continues next, right after a quick break.

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