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Republican Presidential Debate Tonight; GOP Candidates Arriving For Debate Walk-Through; Debate Could Make Or Break Second-Tier Hopefuls; Trump's Effect On GOP; Rand Paul On Debate Strategy; Walker Arrives For Debate Walk-Through; Gearing Up for the Republican Primary Debate; Donald Trump's Foreign Policy Speech. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired September 16, 2015 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I hear everybody is coming after me.

I've been doing this for 30 years. I feel really good about the debate.

CARLY FIORINA (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And I don't really worry much about what Donald Trump says.

JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think he believes that he can insult his way to the presidency.

CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I've watched this Jeb Bush, you know, Donald Trump food fight and nobody cares.

DR. BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And I don't think that my strategy is going to change at all. It's going to be to tell the truth.

SEN. RAND PAUL (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Running for office is combat. I'm going to mix it up because I like to rumble.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer. It 10:00 a.m. here at the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library in Simi Valley, California, 1:00 p.m. in Washington, 6:00 p.m. in London, 8:00 p.m. in Jerusalem. Wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

Up first, round two, and the gloves are off. The second Republican primary debate hosted by CNN only hours away from now, and the candidates, they're arriving throughout this hour for a walk-through of the debate stage. Eleven candidates meet in the main event, that starts at 8:00 p.m. Eastern tonight.

Our Correspondent Athena Jones is outside the Reagan Library here in Simi Valley, California. Athena, Lindsey Graham, the Republican presidential candidate, the senator from South Carolina, he's there. He's getting a chance to feel the stage, if you will. Set the scene for us.

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Wolf. That's right. We just saw Senator Graham pull up right here. This is where all the candidates are pulling up. They'll be walking past us. We're trying to ask them, you know, how are feeling? Are you ready? I asked that of Senator Graham. I said, what did you do this morning to prepare? And he just said, I got up. I took a shower. So, that's what he said and went on by. There he is. You can see that picture of him up on the main debate stage getting the lay of the land.

Each of these candidates has a chance to come in, stand by their podium, find out where the moderators are going to be sitting, the people who are going to be asking the questions. And just get a sense of what to expect tonight at the main event. Well, he is in the first event, but it is a first big event for both tiers of candidates -- Wolf.

BLITZER: It's a huge event. Both of these debates are major opportunities for all of these candidates who are still in this race for the Republican presidential nomination.

Athena, and just remind our viewers, they can't bring any notes with them. They can have no cell phones. They can go up there, there's a piece of paper, a notebook. They can write something when they get up there. But there is no props, if you will, to help them, right?

JONES: No props at all. That's part of what makes this is so exciting and so unpredictable. The big question becomes not just will any of these individual candidates have a memorable moment on the positive side, but, of course, in debates past, you've had candidates who have clearly lost their train of thought, led to long pauses. There's, of course, that oops moment from now former candidate, Rick Perry, from the last cycle.

So, no, the candidates have to show up. They have to be ready. They're going to have, as you mentioned, some notes -- note paper that they can take the notes on. And, of course, water, if they need it. But they can't bring anything with them to that stage tonight -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All of the candidates will have a few minutes to walk around the stage, get a feel for what's going on. What do they have, like 15 minutes each, is that right?

JONES: It's something like that. They're staggered so that you don't have the candidates facing off ahead of the face-offs. So, they're staggered arrivals. Each candidate has a several minutes' long window to come on up here, head up to the stage, check out where they're going to be standing and get an early view of what it's going to look like tonight. But the idea is that they're not meant to overlap ahead of time. They'll have to wait until the actual hour of their debate before they -- before they're all out there together -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right. Athena, thanks very much. Our Chief Washington Correspondent, the anchor of "THE LEAD," Jake Tapper, he will moderate the debates tonight. Joining him on the stage for questions, the conservative radio talk show host, Hugh Hewitt, and our Chief Political Correspondent Dana Bash. Dana, what are your expectations? I know you and Hugh and Jake, you guys have been preparing, preparing and preparing.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: That the debaters are going to debate. And that -- and that at the end of the time here, the Republican voters are going to really have a much better sense of where the candidates stand and who they are and what they stand for.

BLITZER: Yes, this is a debate, Hugh.

HUGH HEWITT, HOST, "THE HUGH HEWITT SHOW": Oh.

BLITZER: This is not a conversation. This is not an interview. This is a debate. That means, let these candidates show where they disagree on certain sensitive national security domestic issues.

HEWITT: Exactly right. They touched gloves in the first debate. And then, mostly, they introduced themselves as though it's the first episode of a television series. Tonight, they're going to be going after each other, because it is an opportunity to put in the Republican primary voters' mind some distinction between themselves and the other 11.

BLITZER: There's been a history, over the years, a lot of debates, where some of these candidates, they go after the questioners, as you well know. They're not happy with the question. They're -- they think the question is unfair. I assume all of you guys have -- are bracing yourself, potentially, for that.

[13:05:00] BASH: Hugh, you don't know what that's like.

HEWITT: I don't know what that's like at all. You know, President Reagan, we're at his library. It's a great honor to be here. I don't think that will happen so much because of the set that CNN has constructed with Air Force One behind it. It really does add a sense of gravitas to this. And I think they'll be lowering themselves if they go after the moderator, or at Dana and Jake or Dana and I. I think they need to talk to each other if they want to impress the voters out there.

BASH: Yes, and it's not about us. It's about them. And as much as we can make that clear by the end, I think that we will have done our jobs.

HEWITT: Yes.

BLITZER: But some of these candidates, as you know, Hugh, they don't like what they call the mainstream media, whatever that means. And sometimes they feel that they can score political points among some of the more conservative supporters out there if they do that.

HEWITT: Well, they get pushback. I mean, I've interviewed them 40 times since the first debate, all of them, with the exception of Senator Paul hasn't been on since the first debate. But John Kasich is my home state governor. And he likes to punch back at me all the time and so I'm used to this. And it's not just the main stream media, it's so called, but they punch back at all media. Newt Gingrich showed there was value in that in the last cycle. So, I expect, maybe down the road but not tonight. Tonight, they have to distinguish themselves from each other, and I suspect that will be what will be happening.

BLITZER: It's a much more intimate auditorium, --

BASH: Yes, that's right.

BLITZER: -- if you will. Five hundred people in the audience tonight, as opposed to thousands in Cleveland at that first debate, and you have Air First One right behind the podium over there, the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library. So, that does set a tone.

BASH: Absolutely. I was at the first debate in Cleveland and it was fascinating. But it was a very large venue, as you were -- we were talking about yesterday, at the arena where LeBron James plays. And it definitely felt that way.

I mean, they tried to make it more intimate but there's only so much you can do when you have such a big -- but this is a stage that was literally built from nothing. You know, I think it's, like, 45 feet in the air. It's really to be special to be up right next to the plane that President Reagan flew on and others before him. And so, I think you're absolutely right about just the feel and the vibe in there. It's quite different than it was in Cleveland (INAUDIBLE.)

HEWITT: We don't want one kind of vibe. We are in earthquake territory. I live out here. And I was looking at that platform, and I was thinking, man, if we're above 6.0 tonight, we're going to have quite an interesting scene up there. But it's pretty well constructed.

BASH: We put it together and it was definitely something that I didn't think of but it's the first thing you said.

HEWITT: Yes, first think I said because I'm from California.

BLITZER: So, the first debate is a much smaller debate. Four presidential candidates. That starts at 6:00 p.m. Eastern, George Pataki, Rick Santorum, Governor Bobby Jindal, Louisiana Senator Lindsey Graham. These guys have a major challenge. Now, it's going to be a good opportunity for them. They'll have more air time, if you will, because there are only four as opposed to 11 candidates on the stage. But they have to do something to break out of that second tier.

HEWITT: You know, I asked Senator Graham last week, why was he so sad during the first debate? Because that's what Twitter said. And he said, there wasn't anyone in the auditorium. They'll be people there tonight. He's very funny, you know. He's a very funny guy.

So, I think that the crowd will give them a lot more energy and someone gets a ticket off of that stage but not more than one. Maybe nobody does. But someone gets a ticket to the main stage out of that preliminary conversation. So, I expect that they will be looking for air time.

BASH: Right. And the last time, for many of them, for all of them, particularly on the first stage with exception of Rick Perry who won't be here now, they hadn't done a presidential debate before. They had all been in public office, been in public service. They had done it on the state level but not at this level.

And so, they didn't really know what to expect. And now, that first one is over, and they know what to expect. So, it -- I can't imagine that they haven't modified how they're going to approach it based on that.

BLITZER: Three of those four candidates in the first debate, Hugh, as you know, Pataki, Jindal, and Lindsey Graham, not Rick Santorum so much, but those three, they've really gone after Donald Trump in the recent weeks. They've slammed him. George Pataki, the former governor of New York says, he's not even -- he's not ready to be president. He couldn't vote for him if he were the Republican presidential nominee. Bobby Jindal, the Louisiana governor, refused to tell me he would vote for him if he were the Republican nominee. They're really going to after Trump, but Trump's not going to be on the stage with them during that first debate.

HEWITT: You know, I assume Donald Trump will be watching in his green room as they do that and it will get his juices flowing. And I was surprised by Governor Pataki's tweet that he would not vote for Donald Trump. That's kind of a shock to me, as a conservative, that he would say that. And I'm sure that will come up.

And I'm sure that Donald Trump will be watching but so will the other 10 candidates because what really happens in the undercard is that you've set up a lot of the issues that will happen in the -- in the second debate. And it will not without significance what any of them say, and I assume that all the candidates will be listening.

BASH: And, actually, let me just correct because when you said Senator Santorum, I should make clear that, of course, Senator Santorum did debate on the big stage and he won Iowa last time around. And on senator Santorum, he is somebody who is not all that thrilled with all the attention that Donald Trump is getting. And I know that, just from talking to him since, that he's eager to talk about the issues that divide the Republicans.

BLITZER: I'm sure they will all be forceful and assertive in making their points. And some of that, the sound bites, if you will, from the first debate, they could be used to play during the second --

[13:10:00] BASH: Sure.

BLITZER: -- debate, right?

BASH: Sure. Well, at least refer to, if nothing else.

BLITZER: At least refer to. All right, guys, thanks very much. Good luck tonight to both of you.

BASH: Thanks, Wolf.

HEWITT: Thanks, Wolf.

BLITZER: Much more coverage coming up as we count down to tonight's debate, including a look at Donald Trump's effect on the Republican Party. Is he alienating voters or is he drawing in people who normally would not get involved? We'll talk about that.

And later, Senator Rand Paul, he's promising he'll go after Donald Trump tonight in a big way. Senator Rand Paul, he will join me live here at the Reagan Library in Simi Valley, California during this hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: The Wisconsin governor, Scott Walker, just arrived here at the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library. You see him getting out of his vehicle there. He's walking inside. He'll be getting a little tour of the stage area, the podium, get a feeling of what's going on tonight.

[13:15:07] All of the candidates, they have an opportunity, they have about 10, 15 minutes each to check out the room, if you will, to see the audience. About 500 guests will be inside. A much smaller setting than the first Republican presidential debate at a huge basketball arena in Cleveland where there were thousands and thousands of people. This is a much more intimate setting, if you will, with Air Force One behind the stage. We'll show you more of that. That's coming up.

Donald Trump, meantime, he stood on the deck of the battleship, the USS Iowa, last night here in California to give what was billed as supposedly a major national security speech. It was noticeably lacking, though, on specifics.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Nobody's going to mess with us, that I can tell you.

We're going to make our country so great. We are going to make it strong. We are going to make it powerful. We're going to rebuild the military. We're going to make it so strong.

And you're going to look around, you're going to remember who the people are that are here, because we're doing something special. This is a movement. We're going to make our country great again. Believe me, we will make our country great again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: No specific mention of ISIS, Syria, terrorism. Lots of support for U.S. military veterans.

Let's discuss what's going on. Joining us, our CNN senior political analyst Ron Brownstein, the former Michigan governor, Jennifer Granholm, Mike Rogers, he's our CNN national security commentator, and CNN political commentator Jeffrey Lord, he's a Trump supporter.

His aides said it was going to give a major speech, Jeffrey, on national security. It was a typical Donald Trump speech, but it wasn't a lot of major national security issues where he was discussing.

JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: He's -- he's still doing -- I'm on the grill. He's still doing message, message, message. And we get into this debate, what is the message here?

JENNIFER GRANHOLM, FORMER MICHIGAN GOVERNOR: Right.

LORD: What is the message here? Which I think you did hear in terms of the -- what Donald Reagan would call peace through strength. But I would recall here at the Reagan Library, that Ronald Reagan himself was criticized for this kind of thing, not only when he was a candidate, but most of the way through his eight years as president. There was a wonderful book, interesting book, by Strobe Talbot (ph), who wrote this in 1984 and said, he doesn't know anything about -- he can't -- he doesn't know what nuclear throw weights are, he doesn't know this, he doesn't know that, it's embarrassing, et cetera. Things worked out a little differently.

(CROSS TALK)

MIKE ROGERS, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY COMMENTATOR: Reagan had been a two- term governor. He had done years of radio broadcasts where he had kind of laid out his views on a wide array -- I remember writing something -- I can't believe I'm saying this -- in a 1980 campaign about his radio broadcasts, which really laid out a pretty detailed world view of both domestic and international issues. I think there was a lot more to go on than voters have today on Donald Trump.

GRANHOLM: I think -- I think that Ronald Reagan -- I mean and I know you -- you know him, but I think he would be rolling in his grave to be compared to Donald Trump. I mean Donald Trump said nothing other than, you know, we're going to make America great. He reminded me a little bit of Sarah Palin, frankly, last night. And --

LORD: That would be an asset in the Republican Party.

ROGERS: Yes.

GRANHOLM: Well, OK. I'm not sure that turned out so well for her. But -- but I would say this, that when you don't say anything and how do you get up here on this debate stage tonight and not say anything? It's like, you know, punching an air ball or maybe punching the hairball, I don't know, but --

ROGERS: Oh.

GRANHOLM: Sorry, sorry.

BLITZER: (INAUDIBLE) By the way --

GRANHOLM: (INAUDIBLE) fair (ph). BLITZER: I'm just reminding our viewers what they're seeing right there. Scott Walker, the Wisconsin governor, he's on the stage over there, getting a little flavor for the podium, getting a little flavor of what's anticipated later. All of the candidates have this walk- through, as it's called. Very important for them to know what's going on, see where the glass of water is going to be, where there's going to be a notebook for them to jot some notes if they want to. But as I said earlier, they can't bring any notes with them. They can't bring any props, no cell phones --

LORD: Yes.

BLITZER: Nothing along those lines.

What happened to Scott Walker, Congressman Rogers, because he was doing so well? He's from Wisconsin. He was born in Iowa. His numbers were really strong. He was winning in Iowa. But those numbers have gone down, down, down.

ROGERS: Well, I think Trump just sucked all the oxygen out of the room. So a candidate that was trying to run on substance, that was trying to run on his record, trying to run on the issues of which he tackled, mainly the unions issue in Wisconsin, just fell apart. And so it was getting no traction. And that is a really heavy, substantive issue to try to deal with in the year before the election really it is supposed to start. And because of that, I think he lost a lot of ground and some would argue, you know, the record and the charisma that he brought to the race, there was a gap there. And so you make that combination of all of those things and I think you see the numbers. I think --

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: I would say Scott Walker lost his balance. As he entered the race, his unique asset was that he seemed to be someone who could appeal both to the business wing of the party and to the evangelical and populist conservative wing of the party.

LORD: Right.

BROWNSTEIN: And he steered his campaign much more toward the latter, toward that populist evangelical wing. He went right on immigration. He said he would seek a constitutional amendment to overturn the gay marriage decision. He kind of put all his eggs in that basket, and then this house fell on the basket in the emergence of Donald Trump and to some extent Ben Carson, who have proven to be more appealing for those voters after Walker had positioned himself in a way that I think diminished his appeal to the more center right voters that Jeb Bush and John Kasich and Marco Rubio are targeting.

[13:20:12] GRANHOLM: I would -- I would also say that I think he's been a little bit of a one-hit-wonder and he's been playing to smaller and smaller audiences. And the one hit that he thought would be bashing unions. OK, we've heard about that now. How are you going to build the middle class? I mean it seems like he's had one subject.

LORD: The irony -- the irony of it is, that his strength comes from being a governor --

GRANHOLM: Yes.

LORD: And in this environment, with Donald Trump, suddenly anybody who has held an elected public office has got a problem on their hands.

GRANHOLM: Right. Right.

ROGERS: But he also made the strategic error, I think, of going after the evangelical voters after they had several candidates already in that camp working hard in Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina. So he had a late start on it. and I would agree with you --

BROWNSTEIN: I think a lot of business Republicans looked at the idea of a Constitution -- a nominee who -- defending the idea of overturning the gay marriage decision in September of 2016 and said, is this really an argument that we want to be having six weeks before the next presidential election?

GRANHOLM: Exactly. Exactly.

LORD: That's why they've got a businessman leading the race.

BROWNSTEIN: Yes. Well, (INAUDIBLE).

BLITZER: So, there he is, Scott Walker, the Wisconsin governor, he's getting his opportunity to get a little feeling for what's going on, what's going to be happening. He'll be on the main stage tonight, 8:00 p.m. Eastern, as you know, for the debate.

Guys, stand by. Don't go too far away. We're going to have much more coverage coming up. How do you actually prepare for a debate with Donald Trump? Our political super panel talks strategy for the top tier candidates. What do they need to do tonight? What do they need to do to steal some of the spotlight back? That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:26:08] BLITZER: All right, you're looking at live pictures from here at the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library. Scott Walker, he's still up there on the stage, getting a little walk through, getting a little feel of what it's going to be like tonight. Air Force One there, here at the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library, right behind all of the 11 candidates who will take the prime time stage to go ahead and debate the major issues on the campaign right now. National security issues, domestic issues, all sorts of good stuff.

There's Scott Walker. He's got some major problems right now. His numbers have gone down and he's getting a feeling -- all of the candidates, by the way, they're going to have 10 or 15 minutes to get a feeling of the stage. That's coming up. More of these candidates, we'll see them.

Let's discuss what's going on. Once again we're joined by our senior Washington correspondent Jeff Zeleny. He's here with me in Simi Valley, California, at the Reagan Library. Also the former Democratic governor of Michigan, Jennifer Granholm, who, by the way, helped Vice President Joe Biden prepare for his vice presidential debate against Sarah Palin back in 2008. Also with us, our political commentator Jeffrey Lord, he's a Trump supporter, and Republican consultant Alex Castellanos.

Jeff, I know you've been getting some good information about what Jeb Bush really needs to do tonight because his numbers have been going down. He was the Republican presumed front-runner not that long ago, but Trump, Ben Carson, they have moved significantly ahead of him right now.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: No question, Wolf, so the stakes are very high for Jeb Bush. He started out this morning, though, on a hike with his son, Jeb Bush, Jr., Jebby as he's known. They went on this morning hike around 5:00 a.m. this morning. We have a picture of that, I believe. So perhaps that is to push back on the fact that he is low energy, that he is not up for this fight. He looking very athletic and robust and, of course, he's lost a lot of weight throughout this campaign, so I think he'll be in pretty strong fighting shape tonight.

One thing that Jeb Bush is not going to do, I'm told, is be inauthentic and be suddenly angry or suddenly hot. He's going to just put forward his plan, his tax plan, his plan to fight ISIS, and look like the commander in chief throughout. But I do think he will be aggressive with Donald Trump.

BLITZER: All right, hold on one second. Marco Rubio, the senator from Florida, the Republican candidate, he just arrived. He's going to have his little walk through right now. I think he's speaking to Athena. Let's listen in.

SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We'll just talk a little faster.

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And what's your goal here?

RUBIO: Just to introduce myself to people. Let them know who I am and what I'll do if they give me the chance to be president. And I honestly believe this country's future can be greater than its history, as great as our history has been. But we're going to have to change the way we're doing it.

JONES: Last question. Do you think you can break through and get a bump in the polls? We've seen --

RUBIO: We're just going -- well, we're going to do the best we can. This is a long process. Tonight won't decide this election.

JONES: All right.

RUBIO: All right. Thank you.

JONES: Thanks. Good luck. That's interesting.

BLITZER: All right, so there you have it, Marco Rubio. He's going to do his little walk-through right now.

Alex, you see Marco Rubio. Who's got a better chance of winning the Republican presidential nomination, there are two guys from Florida, would it be Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio?

ALEX CASTELLANOS, REPUBLICAN CONSULTANT: That's right, Wolf. I couldn't agree more Well, that's why they have debates. We don't know. But this is a more serious debate tonight. In the first debate we met the candidates. Tonight, I think, as Jeff was saying, we'd like to see a president. We'd like to see someone who could be commander in chief in a world fraught with problems. So, yes, I think you're going to see a more mature approach from these candidates tonight. But both Jeb and Rubio, you're right, kind of do occupy the same lane. They're the future of the Republican Party candidates. They're the optimistic candidates. They're the candidates who say that we don't have to settle for the way that things are now, that America has an even brighter future ahead.

GRANHOLM: I don't know if the Trump supporters would agree with you, that they are the future of the Republican Party candidates.

LORD: Well, I would certainly --

CASTELLANOS: They think they are. That's their -- that's

(CROSS TALK)

GRANNHOLM: Don't they all think they are?

(CROSS TALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, some are more (INAUDIBLE).

LORD: And this was -- this was said about Ronald Reagan in the day, that he was too extreme ever to be elected president and the polls show he was losing to Jimmy Carter by like 30 points and all of this kind of thing. But I would -- I thought the Marco Rubio comment was very interesting because what I thought he's really saying here is, whatever happens, I'm sticking in this. I am -- I am not going to be pushed out in any --

[13:30:06] BLITZER: Don't they always say that?

LORD: Well, they always say it, but, I mean, I think there's going to be some pressure on people after tonight for -- for your (ph) performance (INAUDIBLE).

BLITZER: Who do you think's going to drop out next?