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Democrats Look for New DNC Chair; Trump Nominates Betsy DeVos for Education Secretary; Concern Grows over Trump's Possible Conflicts of Interest; Iraqi Forces Surround Mosul. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired November 23, 2016 - 13:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[13:31:28] BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: We just found out moments ago that Betsy DeVos was selected as the secretary of education. President-elect Trump releasing a statement saying, quote, "Betsy DeVos is a brilliant and passionate education advocate. Under her leadership, we will reform the U.S. education system and break the bureaucracy that is holding our children back so that we can deliver world-class education and school choice to all families." And Betsy DeVos tweeted, "I am honored to work with the president-elect on his vision to make America education great again. The status quo in Ed is not acceptable." She is a charter school advocate. She was also a big donor to Donald Trump's campaign.

A defeated Democratic Party is searching for a new leader. Here's a sign at how desperately it may need one. A new CNN/ORC poll finds more than half of Americans have an unfavorable opinion of the party. That's a 9 percent increase from the poll taken before the election. The party doesn't seem to be hurting their president. Obama's approval rating stands at 57 percent, the highest in seven years.

To talk about what Democrats need to do to rebuild, I'm joined by Symone Sanders, CNN political commentator and Democratic strategist. She's also the former national press secretary of the Bernie Sanders campaign. And also with us, Ben Wikler, the Washington director for MoveOn.org.

And I wonder, Symone, looking at this number, what you think about this. 54 percent of Americans have an unfavorable opinion of the Democratic Party. Some of those people presumably might be Democrats and you might have people on the right, and people very far on the left saying this. Right?

SYMONE SANDERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. I think the WikiLeaks matters here. Folks could have an unfavorable view of the party because of what they have seen and found in the WikiLeaks. I've talked to a lot of people, and they always bring up something they saw or heard in the e-mails that affects them. We're aware. Democrats are aware this is an issue for us. That's why we're actively trying to improve.

KEILAR: There is such a schism. And talking about, Ben, a divided house for Republicans, but they seem a little more unified now, at least in this moment in time, compared to Democrats. You have a battle for the DNC chairmanship, a lightning-rod position. And certainly, WikiLeaks explained -- John Podesta's e-mails explains why some of that is, some of the e-mails out from the DNC as well. Who do you think is the best person to head up the DNC and why?

BEN WIKLER, WASHGTON DIRECTOR, MOVEON.ORG: I think Keith Ellison is terrific.

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: He's a Bernie Sanders guy.

WIKLER: A Bernie Sanders guy. He is a fighter. We don't know who all the candidates are. I think it's good to have a contested race and great thing for Democrats to lay out their vision about how they want to lead the party. I know what Democrats need to do now is fight to know how to fight and show they know how to win. You ask why people are disappointed with Democrats, they were supposed to win this election.

KEILAR: Fight for who? Clearly there were some people especially who felt they were not being fought for.

WIKLER: Absolutely. It's fighting for working people across this country of every race and gender. And frankly, you have to fight both against bigotry and hatred and intolerance and also against people trying to rip off the middle class and working class across race. It's easy for people who want to rip people off to divide people along racial lines. And you need to fight back against that and show that we're fighting against regular people against special interests. This idea Donald Trump is draining the swamp right now, he's inviting the swamp in through the front door of Trump Tower. Democrats have need to point that out and to show what they stand for.

KEILAR: Howard Dean also in the running for DNC chairman. And you're a Keith Ellison person.

SANDERS: No.

KEILAR: You're not?

SANDERS: No. My former boss is throwing his weight behind Keith Ellison.

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: OK. So then --

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: OK, this is even better.

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: You're an even better person to ask this question of. You have Howard Dean and others who -

(CROSSTALK)

SANDERS: Jamie Harrison.

KEILAR: Jamie Harrison. Their line is that Keith Ellison, more to the left of the other guys, since he's a sitting congressman, it appears he wouldn't leave that position behind -- Debbie Wassermann Schultz wore two hats. They're saying, you know what, that doesn't work. That doesn't work weaving the two hats. Do you think that a real criticism or is that people trying to get cover for not wanting someone that is so liberal at the helm of the party?

SANDERS: A little of both. I definitely think it is difficult to win when you have a chair as a sitting member of Congress, or any other job, because you have two sets of staff, DNC staff and then office staff. Whenever you want to get something done quickly, you can't just go to the DNC staff. Also, you also have to go through whatever particular office.

I think Keith Ellison is great, amazing a fighter and committed to the issue, but --

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: Howard Dean?

SANDERS: Howard Dean -- you know, Howard Dean, was there for that strategy. But here's the issue. Howard dean is also on record maligning young people and Millennials, telling the Bernie folks to get in line and maligning Bernie Sanders. That's not what we need. In my opinion, we don't need white people leading the Democratic Party. The Democratic Party is diverse. It should be reflected as so in our leadership and throughout the staff at the highest levels. From the vice chair to secretaries down to the people working in the offices at the DNC. We need a robust discussion about this. And I think we need to hear more from all the candidates.

Jamie Harrison, of South Carolina, great, too. He's done real party building, but everyone doesn't know Jamie and they want to know what he stands for. I want to hear from everybody. I'm here for the Millennials and the brown folks.

(LAUGHTER)

KEILAR: We'll try to have all of these potentials on.

Symone and Ben, thank you so much. Appreciate you being here.

Next, a presidential conflict of interest? Donald Trump says no such thing. From Wall Street to K Street, concern over his vast business empire is still present. We'll have that ahead.

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[13:41:35] KEILAR: We found out moments ago that Betsy DeVos was selected as secretary of education. President-elect Trump releasing a statement saying, quote, "Betsy DeVos is a brilliant and passionate education advocate. Under her leadership, we will reform the U.S. education system and break the bureaucracy that is holding our children back so that we can deliver world-class education and school choice to all families." And Betsy DeVos tweeted, "I am honored to work with the president-elect on his vision to make America great again. The status quo in Ed is not acceptable."

I want to bring back our panel, Carol Lee, White House reporter for the "Wall Street Journal"; David Nakamura, reporter for "The Washington Post; and Jackie Kucinich, CNN political analyst with "The Daily Beast."

This announcement of Betsy DeVos, she is a charter school advocate. And Donald Trump vowing to eliminate Common Core. A lot of people care about this, Jackie, because they have kids in school, and they wonder how federally mandated standards will affect their kids. So, who is in favor of this? Ad who's really worried that Betsy DeVos will be the secretary of education very likely?

JACKIE KUCINICH, CNN POLITIAL ANALYST: I'm sure the NEA isn't terribly pleased about this. But very much in line with what Donald Trump discussed when discussing education reform, very much in line with what he talked about. Not that much of a surprise. Remember who else he had there. Michelle Rhee, also a charter school advocate, someone very controversial in the District of Columbia when she served. We knew it was going this way.

KEILAR: Someone to shake things up?

KUCNICH: Yes.

KEILAR: I want to talk about conflicts of interest with Donald Trump. He has obviously so many business interests in so many countries. Democrats, Republicans are raising concerns about this. He actually owns or is part of about 500 companies and about 150 of them have done business in countries overseas. He's brushing off concerns. Do Americans -- is he right that Americans don't care?

CAROL LEE, WHITE HOUSE REPORTER, WALL STREET JOURANL: No. I think Americans do care. They elect public officials who are supposed to serve not for their own personal gain, and whenever there's questions like that, for somebody in elected office, of course, Americans definitely care. I think the question that Donald Trump needs to answer relatively soon and - is what he's going to do about this. If he doesn't do something to address these concerns, this is going to be the narrative of his entire presidency.

DAVID NAKAMURA, REPORTER, THE WASHINGTON POST: yeah, it's going to be a big distract, whether he likes it or not, and doesn't want to talk about it. Yesterday, at "The New York Times" he tried to imply that the owner of the paper has grown children that's part of - but that's a private business. No one has a problem with that. This is something - are they going to be part of his cabinet? Are they going to be part of his informal advisers? His children? You know, will they have a role in foreign policy, as he suggested, even his son-in- law on Middle East peace? Big questions. And, of course, all the business interests around the world, we've already seen the social media images of him meeting with Indian businessmen who are both building a Trump hotel. So, this is --

KEILAR: Taking a photo with them, which was public, then later deleted because obviously, it didn't look good.

NAKAMURA: Absolutely. I think Carol is right, the media going full bore on this. And a Republican Congressman -- were already promising investigations of Hillary Clinton, even before the election. Whether Republicans will do the same with Trump, we don't know. Democrats are certainly sounding alarms.

KEILAR: Jackie, we saw this - and I'm not comparing these exactly but I think we can see some similarities with the Clinton Foundation. Even Bill Clinton admitted people may have been trying to curry favor or institutions or countries may have been trying to do that. All may be well that Donald Trump and his children, who run the Trump Organization, say we're not trying to, you know, do anything, but it doesn't matter, because we already see people flocking to his hotels, trying to be a part of this. This is what happens. People will come out of the woodwork, corporations, countries, come out of the woodwork.

[13:45:36] KUCINICH: Which is why, to Carol's point, there needs to be something then to address this soon. The appearance of impropriety can be just as bad as actual impropriety. Not only are people flocking to his hotels, they brought in foreign diplomats or foreign entities to encourage them. Those are delegations there. It's troubling. It is.

KEILAR: What about this "Washington Post" report, Carol, about the self-dealing that, according to David Fahrenthold's reporting, the Trump Foundation admits it used money from the foundation to basically pay for something that enriches either the foundation or basically Donald Trump? We don't know exactly what they're talking about, but it could be something like the fact the foundation used $20,000 to purchase a portrait of Donald Trump. Or Donald Trump used that money. Why is that a concern? Why is that such a big concern going in to the presidency?

LEE: Because, again, it's not something that Americans expect from certainly their president. And I think the risk for Donald Trump in this is, again, if he doesn't deal with these sorts of issues, you're going to have a Congress, the Democrats in Congress, who really continue to bring this up. We've already seen a letter sent to Donald Trump's lawyer, asking for more, from Democrats, asking for more information about this. And it's just going to keep feeding on itself and become -- look, he's taking over as president at a time when people want him to focus on the economy. There's a ton of challenges overseas in terms of foreign policy and this would be a huge distraction.

NAKAMURA: My Colleague David Fahrenthold's reporting is showing that the Trump Foundation used Trump Foundation, charity money, to settle lawsuits against the Trump organization.

KEILAR: Not his money, by the way.

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: -- for years and years.

NAKAMURA: That's scandalous. The latest report that came out yesterday, that you referenced, talked about the fact, in the 2015 tax filings for the foundation, they acknowledged self-dealing, and that might have been improper. But also, acknowledge it from past years, which was not declared in previous filings. That suggests a like a practice, repetitive, and not disclosed. Now some of these are coming out, now that he's --

KUCIINICH: Donald Trump talks about -- his slogan is drain the swamp. Democrats are eager to dust off a culture of corruption, something they used effectively in other election cycles. They have to be careful and be transparent and have these bright lines.

KEILAR: He has to be careful because he has a Republican Congress. He will have a Republican Congress. Might not always be the case.

Jackie, David, Carol, thank you so much.

Let's talk about Iraq. A big story coming out of the country. Mosul officially surrounded, according to Iraqi-led forces. But the fight to take the city back from ISIS is far from over. We take to you Iraq for a live report from the ground, next.

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[13:52:25] KEILAR: Iraqi-led forces say the city of Mosul is surrounded, crucial ISIS supply lines are cut off but the battle is far from over.

For more, we are joined by CNN international correspondent, Phil Black, in Irbil, Iraq.

So, Phil, I know this is a slow and difficult advance that you're seeing there. Give us a sense of what forces are facing.

PHIL BLACK, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRSPONDENT: Brianna, during the early weeks of the campaign they made rapid progress across the open ground leading up to Mosul. But ever since Iraqi forced entered the eastern flank of the city, thing have slowed down incredibly because they're dealing with an enemy that is just so motivated and prepared. They're really throwing everything at them and they know this urban environment so well. So they know the narrow streets. They're using waves of car bombs. They've dug tunnels. They're using mortar fire in this populated area. So, it's an incredibly tough battle, one that's having an impact on the civilian population. And, of course, on the Iraqi soldiers as well that are going up against this on a daily basis.

KEILAR: This offensive began in October. And Iraqi officials have been noticeably tight-lipped on the casualty numbers. What have you learned about this?

BLACK: The Iraqi government has said they're not talking casualty numbers until the operation is finished, so we're left to draw our own conclusions. What we've seen on the ground -- and we've been to forward medical positions, triage points, makeshift clinics, as civilians, men, women, children and soldiers are rushed out of the city suffering a wide range of horrific injuries. Today, we saw people that were injured by shrapnel from mortar fire. As I say, men, women, children and soldiers as well. As well as that, the local hospital here tells us they get around 90 injured people a day from Mosul. So, it's not accurate, but it paints a sense, along with the nature of the fighting that we're hearing, that it is bloody and difficult. And ISIS is reeling. It's really hitting civilian population and the Iraqi forces very hard.

KEILAR: They're getting closer to recapturing Mosul, these Iraqi forces, but what about holding it? That's an entirely different situation. Don't capture something if you can't hold it. You need to be able to hold it.

BLACK: That's part of why the advance in Mosul itself has been so slow. So, the initial push into the city that happened pretty quickly, but then, of course, you're right, what they discovered was they had to clear these areas and hold them. That is literally going from building to building, clearing every single home. And what has happened to these forces repeatedly since they've pushed into the city is, as they advance, they keep getting hit from behind as well. it's the nature of the enemy. They are smaller in number. They know these streets. And it's just this way that the Iraqi forces are trying to hold the ground as they progress. And what it means is the general progression, the advancing, has slowed so considerably because of this.

[13:55:28] KEILAR: Phil Black for us with that report in Iraq. Thank you so much for those important details.

Iraqi forces are now saying Mosul is surrounded.

That's it for me.

For our international viewers, "Amanpour" is next.

For our viewers in north America, NEWSROOM with Brooke Baldwin starts right after this.

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[13:59:54] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, there. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you for joining me on this day before Thanksgiving.

We begin this hour with breaking developments on how Donald Trump is expanding his team, and in more ways than one, expanding its diversity. He has just named these two women to cabinet-level positions. And his formal rival, Dr. Ben Carson, gave this hint that --