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Hala Gorani Tonight
Republican Candidates Back Away From Unity Pledge; Republican Rift Widens At CNN Town Hall; Source: Brussels Cell Was Targeting Government Buildings; Turkey's President Speaks To CNN; Victims Struggle To Recover After Pakistan Blast; EgyptAir Hijacker Charged In Court, Confesses; Assad: New Government Could Include Foes; Trump Remarks on Abortion; Examining Trump Remarks about South Korea and Japan. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired March 30, 2016 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. We're live from CNN London. Thanks for being with us. This is THE WORLD RIGHT NOW.
If we needed any more proof of how bitter and divisive the Republican race for the White House has become, well, now we have it. All three candidates
are refusing to repeat a pledge to back the party's eventual nominee.
Dana Bash has details on that and other highlights from the CNN town hall in Wisconsin.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Things have gotten so ugly all three remaining Republican candidates went back on their
promises to support the party nominee.
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: No, I don't -- look --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You don't.
TRUMP: No.
BASH: That came after Ted Cruz refused to back Trump despite being asked three times.
SENATOR TED CRUZ (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I am not in the habit of supporting someone who attacks my wife and attacks my family. I think that
is going beyond the line.
BASH: Trump said he understands if Cruz won't support him.
TRUMP: I don't want his support. I don't need his support. I want him to be comfortable.
BASH: And then renewed a warning to party leaders.
TRUMP: I have been treated unfairly. Look, I won the state of Missouri, right. No, I have. I have been treated very unfairly. I will give you an
example.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Unfairly by who?
TRUMP: I think by basically the RNC, the Republican Party, the establishment.
BASH: John Kasich even went so far as to say he never should have made the pledge in the first place.
JOHN KASICH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If the nominee is somebody that I think is really hurting the country and dividing the country, I can't stand
behind them.
BASH: Donald Trump came to CNN's town hall eager to defend his campaign manager charged earlier in the day with simple battery against a reporter.
TRUMP: Based on what I heard, I don't think that he really even knew who she was.
BASH: On another issue, he calls it a distraction, the ugly back and forth about their wives, Trump was vintage Trump.
TRUMP: I didn't start it.
COOPER: Sir, with all due respect, that's the argument of a 5-year-old.
TRUMP: I didn't start it. No, it's not.
COOPER: The argument of a 5-year-old is that he started it.
TRUMP: Excuse me. No. No. That's the problem. Exactly that thinking is the problem of the country. I did not start this.
BASH: Cruz once again denied knowing anything about the anti-Trump super PAC ad featuring Melania Trump and doubled down for blaming Trump for
planting a tabloid report accusing Cruz of infidelity.
CRUZ: You know the "National Enquire" in its history has never endorsed a presidential candidate until Donald Trump.
BASH: This week, Trump rattled world leaders by suggesting a nuclear Asia, which the west worked for decades to avoid maybe OK. At CNN's town hall,
he went further.
TRUMP: Can I be honest with you? Maybe it's time to change because so many people -- you have Pakistan. You have China. At system point, we
have to say, you know what we're better off if Japan protects itself against the maniac in North Korea.
BASH: Cruz defended his own controversial national security idea to control the Muslim communities in the U.S.
CRUZ: Listen, if you want to stop radical Islamic terrorism, the answer isn't to go and hang out in random neighborhoods. It's focus on
communities where radicalization is a risk.
BASH: Later Kasich called that ridiculous.
KASICH: If we polarize the entire Muslim community, how are we going to get the information we want.
BASH: But what may have been the most revealing moment of the night were seemingly simple questions that candidates had trouble answering.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What would you regard as your greatest personal failure and what did you learn from it?
CRUZ: You know those are always whether in political campaign or a job interview, those are always tricky questions.
COOPER: When was the last time you actually apologized for something?
TRUMP: Wow. No, I do -- I don't know. Can I think? I apologize to my mother years ago for using foul language.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[15:05:11]GORANI: Well, Wisconsin is the next critical battleground in this race. In a new poll of voters there could spell trouble for Donald
Trump.
Let's bring in CNN political analyst, Josh Rogin, who joins me from Washington. So first of all, the three Republican presidential candidates
basically backing off of a pledge made months ago. Things have changed a lot since then to support the eventual nominee. A big surprise?
JOSH ROGIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I am not surprised. What I think this is the fascinating public acknowledgment of what political insiders
have been talking about for weeks, which is that the Republican Party is fundamentally fractured, and this whole idea that they're going unify at
the convention is becoming less and less likely.
You know, there's been this campaign by the Cruz, Kasich and never-Trump movements to sort of peel off the delegates to prevent Trump from getting
to that magic number where he can take the nomination out right.
That campaign has been going well and the Trump folks have realized that and that's why they're calling foul and they are setting up this message
where they are accusing the RNC and the other campaigns of playing dirty.
But the delegate math is important and as we head to what increasingly looks like a contested convention, that unity is just gone and never coming
back.
GORANI: By the way, these are the delegates today. We have Trump in the lead with 739, the magic number being 1,237. Cruz at 460, Kasich at 145,
but we showed our viewers the newest freshest poll for Wisconsin.
That's the next big contest, April 5th, and Cruz is on top with 40 percent and Donald Trump right behind in the second position at 30 percent. What
is going on there indicative of a trend?
ROGIN: Well, yes. What you have seen is that the Trump numbers have leveled off and the Cruz numbers are going up. But although Ted Cruz said
it last night at the CNN Town Hall that his goal is to get 1,237.
The actual strategy according to operatives inside his campaign is just to prevent Donald Trump from getting that, right. And then you go to a vote
at the convention, if anybody gets 1,237, then you go to another vote.
At that point, anyone can be nominated and so we're looking at a very uncertain and very chaotic process, and right now the game is just to find
delegates all over the country and get them away from Donald Trump. That's what everyone is doing.
If they're able to prevent Donald Trump from getting the nomination despite the fact that he will probably have more votes than all the other
candidates, that's the point where this sort of accomplish --
GORANI: Then you face. I was going to say then you face another problem altogether, which is the lack of representation of all the people who voted
for Trump to become the Republican nominee.
I have to ask you something that many people in Europe and abroad outside the U.S. ask me. Why isn't Kasich doing any better? They say, he is the
middle of the road and the better one to take on Clinton in the general election and yet, he is doing poorly.
He is still in the race, but he has fewer delegates even than Rubio who dropped out, what is going on there?
ROGIN: I think the simple answer is that the Republican primary electorate is actually a small portion, maybe 10 to 20 percent of those people who
will actually vote in general election. They tend to be the more far right people and activist people.
So when you have a middle of the road sort of centrist establishment candidate and this is not an establishment year, this is an outsider year
like John Kasich. He just does not have a big base of support outside of his home state in those primaries.
Now, when you get to the convention, the argument will be, we have to beat Hillary Clinton and all of those delegates, who are sort of state officials
from all over the place and nobody knows really who they are.
They're all sort of professionals and at that point, Kasich is going to turn to all of these people and say hey, let's vote on electability rather
than on who has the most votes. That will be his argument.
As you pointed out, if they actually did that, and disenfranchised millions of Trump voters, it would be a huge controversy that would surely split the
party in two in a way that could probably never be repaired.
GORANI: All right, fascinating times. Josh Rogin, as always, thanks very much, joining us from Washington.
ROGIN: Thank you.
GORANI: Let's turn our attention to Brussels where the airport is staying locked shut for now. Take a look. We have photographs from the aftermath
there. They were taken just a day after suicide bombers killed at least ten people in those very passenger halls.
And we are now learning that the attacks may have been just a small part of a much bigger plan. Securities sources telling CNN that police found a
computer with information about government buildings tossed away in a trash can.
Paul Cruickshank has been talking to his sources in Belgium. He was in Brussels just a few days ago and he joins me now live from New York.
Paul, let's talk a little bit about what your sources are saying was found on that laptop that was discarded in that trash can that had information
about other possible targets.
PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Hala, yes, a source close to the investigation telling me that when they went in and discovered that bomb
factory shortly after the attack. The taxi driver had lead them -- who picked up the bombers led them to that address.
[15:10:10]Outside they found this laptop. On the laptop they found pictures and plan relating to the Belgian prime minister's office in
Brussels and other government buildings suggesting that they may have also -- these buildings being targets of a plot being planned by this cell.
Now, Belgian investigators believed that the cell accelerated their attack plans after Salah Abdeslam was captured and that there was going to be a
whole other team involved in the initial plans including Salah Abdeslam in a bigger attack in Brussels.
So it's quite possible that these Belgian government buildings, which may also have included the Belgian parliament would also have been the target
of this cell, a very political target for this cell.
Obviously Belgium involves in strikes against ISIS in Iraq. Over the weekend, they stepped up the security of the parliament building and an
official at the Belgian Senate said that recent investigation, terror investigation had revealed that that building was the possible target of a
terrorist plot.
So all of this coming together suggesting a bigger plan was being plotted by this group.
GORANI: Because we know that in that bomb factory other explosives materials were found. That it was possible that they were intended for
other targets. Is it the belief of investigators that this plan to attack these government buildings even possibly that prime minister office or a
resident were close to being implemented?
CRUICKSHANK: Well, that's the fear. That this cell was planning something on a more spectacular scale in Brussels and perhaps which would have taken
place days or perhaps even weeks after the actual Brussels attacks.
But they have to accelerate things when Salah Abdeslam was captured because they feared that the drag net was going down as one of the brothers wrote
in his last will testament that we don't want to go to prison like him. They wanted to become martyrs.
GORANI: You're talking about the (inaudible) brothers, of course, one suspected of having blown himself up at the airport. The other one at the
Malvic Metro station. Now they are reports that in fact Belgium was looking already for these brothers as late as December 2015, is that
correct?
CRUICKSHANK: Yes, I think we know that with some certainty now. That in December 2016, they were looking for both brothers and they listed one of
them on Interpol because they could not find him after the Paris attacks. They established that he had ties to terrorism.
So he was a terrorism suspect at large according to the Belgians even in December. They were also looking for his brother on a criminal matter.
He'd skipped parole. They were looking for him because they thought that Ibraham would lead them.
So that whole snafu over the last few days about the Turks not giving the proper information to the Belgians and the Belgians not aggressively
pursuing what the Turks were saying about Ibrahim Laachraoui having traveled to Turkey to Syria.
None of that probably mattered at all because they were already aggressively searching for both these brothers in late 2015. The problem
was they just couldn't find them. They were hiding in plain sight in Brussels at that bomber factory.
The Brussels attack got through not because so much of a lack of coordination of information, but because they couldn't find the men they
were trying to find -- Hala.
GORANI: OK. Paul Cruickshank, thanks very much for the very latest there on the Brussels attacks. You'll remember and Paul just mentioned it that
Turkey said it warned Belgium about one of the airport bombers, but that Belgium did nothing about it, and there was a bit of back and forth about
all that.
Speaking to CNN exclusively Turkey's president said his country did all it could whereas Europe, he says, that's another story. Listen to President
Erdogan.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Why do you think they did not pick up the intelligence and particularly the Dutch say
that your government did not alert them to the fact that had he had jihadi tendencies?
RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN, TURKISH PRESIDENT (through translation): Of course, both the Netherlands and Belgium and whether have the intention or not,
first, they need to know what jihadi intention means. You have to identify whether these are foreign fighters or jihadists.
The Netherlands nor the Belgians seems to have understood what jihadi stands for. We have been calling the nations for a common stance against
terrorism and many of the European members states seemed to have failed to attach the significance that this call for action deserves.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[15:15:10]GORANI: All right. That's President Erdogan. You can watch the rest of this exclusive interview Thursday on "AMANPOUR" at 7 p.m. London, 9
p.m. Turkish, Istanbul and Anchorage.
Now to a disturbing CNN report. The graphic images that we're about to show you come in the aftermath of the terror attack in Pakistan. The death
toll from Sunday's blast targeting Christians has now climbed to 74 people.
Saima Mohsin visited a hospital caring for survivors of this devastating bombing. The report we must warn you is incredibly difficult to watch with
images of a badly injured child.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SAIMA MOHSIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A toddler's tears sting his face. His cries ring out across the wards. He is inconsolable and in
extreme pain. But 3-year-old (inaudible) cannot be held. He is covered in burns.
His mother is in intensive care with severe burns. His father split between two wards and this man is a neighbor. He has been at his bedside
since the attack. Sharing the bed, his cousin just 4-years-old sharp medal wounds on her skull.
Her uncle tells she has special needs. She does not know her father and sisters have died. I have lost count of how many family members have died,
he tells me. He and his friends were just deciding which ride to go on when --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): I felt like something was on fire. There was an explosion and my friend grabbed me and pulled me to the
ground. He saved my life.
MOHSIN: His friend is lying in a bed opposite him. In each ward we found friends and complete strangers and family tending to their loved ones.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): He shouted momma on the phone. He said a bomb has gone off. Please come to me. I am in the hospital.
MOHSIN (on camera): This is a mixed ward of young children, men and women are being kept together because the doctors are keen that these traumatized
families are kept together.
PROFESSOR MAHMOOD SHUNUKAT, JIRNAH HOSPITAL: There are 137 patients within 20 minutes and with every patient we had 20 other people and so we had to
bring immediately about 30 doctors and 40 nurses and we had to open up 20 more operating rooms.
MOHSIN (voice-over): Many of the patients agreed to talk to us, but others are in intensive care. We did not film them. They have not regained
consciousness since the attack.
SHUNUKAT: We had to open up the abdomen of these patients because sharp things went in them and ruptured the intestine. We had about ten patients
that had serious head injuries because the brain was entered by these sharp objects.
MOHSIN: Local people are coming together to deliver food and toys to the families and children like him who will live with the physical and mental
scars of bombing forever. Saima Mohsin, CNN, Lahore, Pakistan.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: Very difficult to watch. Images of these kids suffering.
A lot more to come tonight, the man at the center of Tuesday's traumatic plane hijacking admits to his crime in court. We will have a full report.
And later, Syria's president is offering fighting words for his international foes while at the same time opening the door perhaps to
internal ones. Details on his latest interview coming up.
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[15:21:14]
GORANI: Brazil is sinking deeper into a messy political crisis involving government corruption and it is getting closer to reaching the tipping
point. The president, Dilma Rousseff, could soon be kicked out of office after her largest coalition party quit her government yesterday.
And adding to all of that pressure, there's a Supreme Court decision that's looming. It is expected to consider whether the former president, Lula Da
Silva, can be appointed chief of the staff. Therefore shield him from investigation and legal action.
It's a move that could protect him from the criminal charges. It was the story that grabbed the world headlines on Tuesday. Now the man accused of
hijacking an EgyptAir flight to Cairo and forcing it to land in Cyprus has confessed in court. CNN's Ian Lee reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
IAN LEE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The man at the center of Tuesday's EgyptAir plane hijacking in handcuffs and under heavy guard as he
is led into a courtroom in Larnaca, Cyprus. Saif Al Deen Mustafa is facing multiple charges including hijacking and kidnapping.
The 58-year-old Egyptian had demanded that the Cairo-bound flight land in either Greece, Turkey or Cyprus, 15 minutes after it had taking off from
Alexandria.
He claimed to be wearing a bomb belt as seen in this picture taken on board the flight. Passengers and their families recall the horror.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): certainly he had his finger on the button. At any moment, if he had decided to do something, we would
have all been dead.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): I was telling myself I may lose my daughter. But approximately after an hour or so, she answered her phone
and she tried to calm me. She told me not to cry. I was having a nervous breakdown.
LEE: For around six hours, the plane remained on the tarmac at Larnaca Airport. All but seven people including crewmembers were released within
the first three hours.
Negotiators soon established this was not a terror attack, but Saif Al Deen Mustafa's motives remained unclear. Initial reports indicated that he
wanted to be reunited with his ex-wife. The Egyptian prime minister said the demands kept changing.
SHARIF ISMAIL, EGYPTIAN PRIME MINISTER (through translator): At some moments he asked to meet with the representative of the European Union and
at other points, he asked to go to another airport but there was nothing specific.
LEE: Then just before 2 p.m. this. More people emerged from the plane and one man climbing out of the EgyptAir cockpit window to make his escape.
Finally, the hijacker surrenders himself to police. He searched the device found is a fake. In a bizarre moment, British passenger, Ben Innis had his
picture taken with the hijacker. The bomb belt clearly visible. CNN has not heard back from Innis.
Egypt defended the airport security and releasing footage of the hijacker going through metal detectors adding he didn't present a threat at check
in.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEE: This is not the first time Saif Al Deen Mustafa has had a run in with the authorities. He has a long criminal record which includes burglary,
forgery, impersonation, and drug dealing. Now authorities can add hijacking to the list. Ian Lee, CNN, Cairo.
GORANI: Now, the Syrian president, Bashar Al-Assad told Russian media that peace talks in Geneva should lead to a new inclusive government. In an
interview with the Russia's state run news agency, "Sputnik News," he said, quote, "The goal of Geneva is an intra-Syrian dialogue during which we will
agree on the format of this government.
He also added that whatever is created will not necessarily just include his own supporters saying it is logical that independent forces should be
represented as well as opposition forces and forces loyal to the government.
[15:25:03]Well, there are several ways to interpret what he said. President Assad offered no hint, though, that he would be stepping down,
which is what his opponents have been calling for, for years, nor did he offered kind words for nations that have supported opposition forces. He
accused several of them of having directly supported terrorism in his country in Iraq.
Matthew Chance has more on that plus some of the other comments from Assad.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This was a wide ranging interview given by Assad to Russian state media. So it's no
surprise that the Syrian president directed his criticism at their mutual opponents.
The war in Syria was about terrorism he said, and that Turkey, Saudi Arabia and western countries like Britain and France were responsible for backing
the terrorists. The kind of rhetoric that we've heard from Assad on several occasions in the past.
But there was some new substance and it was this, he put a figure on the damage caused by the Syrian conflict, $200 billion, he said had been lost
in economic and infrastructure damage throughout the course of the five years of war.
Rebuilding Syria he told Russian television would fall to the three main states that he said had supported the country during what he called it's
crisis, China, Iran and Russia repairing the Russia brought on Syria in part by the Russian's themselves and their airstrikes could prove extremely
lucrative for the Kremlin. Matthew Chance, CNN Moscow.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: We have been talking about Palmyra over the last few days because Syrian forces did manage to recapture the historic city, home to the 1,800-
year-old Arch of Triumph destroyed by ISIS last year.
A team of specialists is reconstructing the arch with 3D technology. This is a life size replica that will be unveiled in London on April 19th. The
arch will then head to New York City and end its journey in Palmyra hopefully when possible. Of course, it won't be the original one, but I
suppose it's better than nothing.
Still to come, Brazil maybe beautiful but its politics sherry and pretty as the country's president fights to stay in office. We're live in Rio De
Janeiro to ask whether she can hold on.
Plus back to the race for the White House, we'll speak to the senior adviser of one failed presidential candidate. Are Marco Rubio's delegates
likely to support Donald Trump or Ted Cruz or someone else? We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:30:00]
GORANI: All right, this is already getting a lot of traction online I can tell you that. This just into CNN. Moments ago on the American News
network, MSNBC Republican frontrunner, Donald Trump was asked about his views on abortion; specifically if women who have had the procedure should
be "punished." Here's what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRIS MATTHEWS, MSNBC HOST: Should a woman be punished for having an abortion?
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Look.
MATTHEWS: And this is not something you can dodge.
TRUMP: No, no -
MATTHEWS: If you say that abortion is a crime or abortion is murder, you have to deal with it under the law. Should abortion be punished?
TRUMP: Well, people in certain parts of the Republican Party and conservative Republicans would say yes they should be punished.
MATTHEWS: How about you?
TRUMP: I would say that it's a very serious problem, and it's a problem that we have to decide on. It's very --
MATTHEWS: You're for banning it?
TRUMP: I mean are you going to say - well wait, are you going to say put them in jail? Is that what the punishment you're talking about?
MATTHEWS: Well, no, I'm asking you because you say you want to ban it. What does that mean?
TRUMP: I would - I am against - I am pro-life yes.
MATTHEWS: What does ban - how do you ban abortion? How do you actually do it?
TRUMP: Well you know you'll go back to a position like they had where people will perhaps go to illegal places.
MATTHEWS: Yes.
TRUMP: But you have to ban it.
MATTHEWS: If you ban it and they go to somebody who flunked out of medical school.
TRUMP: Are you catholic?
MATTHEWS: Yes I think -
TRUMP: -- and how do you feel about the catholic churches position?
MATTHEWS: Well I accept the teaching authority of my church on moral issues.
TRUMP: But do you know their position on abortion?
MATTHEWS: Yes I do.
TRUMP: And do you concur with that position?
MATTHEWS: I concur with their moral position but legally - and I get to the question - here's my problem with it -
TRUMP: No, no, but let me ask you. But what do you say about -
MATTHEWS: It's not funny.
TRUMP: -- your church, yes, it's really not a funny thing. What do you say about your church they're very, very -
MATTHEWS: They're allowed to - but the churches make their decisions but you running for President of the United States will be chief executor of
the United States, do you believe in punishment -
TRUMP: No, but, but -
MATTHEWS: Do you believe in punishment for abortion, yes or no? As a principle?
TRUMP: The answer is that there has to be some form of punishment.
MATTHEWS: For the woman?
TRUMP: Yes. There has to be some form.
MATTHEWS: Ten years?
(CROSS-TALK)
TRUMP: That I don't know, that I don't know.
MATTHEWS: Why not?
TRUMP: I don't know because it's not -
MATTHEWS: You take positions on everything else.
TRUMP: I frankly I do take positions on everything else it's a very complicated position.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: There should be some form of punishment for the woman if a woman gets an abortion. Let's bring in CNN's Jim Acosta. He's live in Appleton,
Wisconsin.
Once again I mean this has gone viral, twitter is on fire, everyone is talking about the latest and extremely controversial statement from Donald
Trump. What's been the reaction where you are in Wisconsin to this?
JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: No reaction yet Hala. Right now Donald Trump is speaking to this audience in Appleton, Wisconsin.
We may get a chance to ask him a question; we're going to try at least after this event. However it might not work out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ACOSTA: But I can tell you that this is a very big development I think in the Donald Trump campaign. You will recall, it was several years ago, that
Donald Trump once described himself as pro-choice and that clip was used in ads from across the Republican Party spectrum, in pac ads and from
individual candidates pointing this out. And so you know we are in Wisconsin, it is a state where the Republican Party is infused with a lot
of conservative Catholics. If you're driving the highways and byways here in Wisconsin, you will see a lot of ads and billboards that are put up by
the Catholic Church and so it's not surprising that Donald Trump would talk about abortion in this way. Although it is a very big change in tone and a
very hard line position that he is taking right now on this issue.
One other thing we should point out is it also comes as a new poll is coming out here in Wisconsin showing Ted Cruz with a pretty healthy lead
over Donald Trump in this state Hala, and Ted Cruz as we know has a very strong base of support among Christian conservatives.
So the question is while there is some political maneuvering going on here on the part of Donald Trump, we haven't had the chance to ask him that
question or is this something that he just said in the course of an interview that perhaps was just a little unexpected? Does it show perhaps
just a lack of policy depth on his part?
Now, one thing we can tell you is that in just the last several minutes after these comments came out and became public, Hillary Clinton has
slammed him on twitter; Bernie Sanders have slammed them on twitter. John Kasich, one of Donald Trump's remaining rivals was asked about this in the
last half an hour or so and said of course women should be punished if they have abortions. So the question is going to become you know how soon, how
quickly do we get some kind of reaction to Donald Trump. And as we've seen with other controversial positions he's taken, sometimes he'll pivot, he'll
massage that position, he might move a little bit. So it will be interesting to see what he says next about this. Because as you said it
has stirred up a lot of controversy, Hala.
GORANI: And just one moment Jim, because Hillary Clinton, you mentioned her reaction, she tweeted her dismay. "Just when you thought it couldn't
get worse" she tweeted "horrific and telling" signing her treat with H meaning that she actually authored this.
But let me ask you about whether or not this is surprising. I mean it's quite a leap going from kind of loosely saying that you oppose abortion and
you're pro-life to saying a woman should be punished, just the terminology itself for having the procedure. I wonder if this is going to finally have
some sort of impact especially with the female electorate here.
[15:35:15]
ACOSTA: Well, if you look at the polling right now the unfavorables for Donald Trump are really high among women voters right now, a lot of that
stems from what you've seen in recent days and you know the allegations facing his campaign manager who is now accused of simple battery for
grabbing the arm of a reporter at an event earlier this month.
I mean I will say if you go back and listen to that audio, Hala, there is a part during the interview where the host, Chris Matthews asked Donald
Trump, are we talking about ten years you know what kind of prison sentence are we talking about and Donald Trump at that point says you know what, I
don't know, this is a complicated issue.
And so it's possible, and I am not saying that this is definitely the situation, you'd ask Donald Trump this, it's possible he got going in the
course of answering this question and then perhaps just stepped in it a little bit and was not really quite aware of the magnitude of what he was
saying. And so we're going to have to wait and see exactly how Donald Trump handles this once he's asked about it again because I can - I can probably
bet some good money on this that he'll be asked about this by the end of the day and we'll have another answer from Donald Trump on this, Hala.
GORANI: Well I will bet right along with you. I think that is a very sure bet.
Jim Acosta thanks very much in Wisconsin at that Trump event.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, Boston Globe a political reporter Matt Viser is live in Washington with more. I know this just happened Matt Viser and you cover
mainly Hillary Clinton's campaign and the Democratic race. But Hillary Clinton did react saying just when you thought, I'm paraphrasing, it could
not get worse, this is horrific, et cetera, these comments by Donald Trump saying women if abortion is illegal should be "punished" for engaging - for
having the procedure.
Will this have do you think an impact at all on the race at this stage?
MATT VISER, BOSTON GLOBE POLITICAL REPORTER: I don't know if it will have so much of an impact on the Republican race, but as Hillary Clinton is
forecasting it will certainly be used in the general election if Trump emerges as the nominee.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VISER: As Jim was mentioning just a minute ago the numbers among women in support is quite low for Trump so I think that these comments will only
fuel that negativity.
One thing to point out here though is Trump was responding in this case to questions about this and some of its past incendiary comments, it's been
things that he has thought about, he's proposed a ban on Muslims entering the country for example. This was something he was reacting to so it's
less staged or planned I don't think on his part.
That said I think this will be discussed a lot more over the coming days.
GORANI: Because Matt when you want to appeal in the primary stages, in the nomination stages of the presidential race to sort of the outer more
conservative fringes of the Republican Party, of course candidates are going to reiterate some positions they know will get them support among
those primary voters who are more to the right perhaps than those who vote in the general election.
Is it possible then that by doing this at some point it's going to start to hurt them? Because he -- you could tell that had he was kind of searching
for the right way to say it knowing that this would win him votes among the most conservative Republicans.
VISER: You don't get the sense a lot of times that Donald Trump is too strategic about things like that and he just sort of says what comes to his
mind. So he's asked the question and he just sort of says it without necessarily thinking about how it's going to play in a Republican primary
electorate or a general election electorate. And I think his supporters find that refreshing but I do think that that makes it a lot harder to
pivot toward a general election audience and starts sort of seeming a little bit broader based in his support. He's still sort of narrow in
going after a slice of the Republican electorate and not yet kind of broadening out.
GORANI: Let me ask you about the Democratic race here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Hillary Clinton has a new ad in New York attacking Trump. Let's watch a little bit of that ad, and then I'll get you to comment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILLARY CLINTON, U.S. DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: New York. 20 million people strong. No, we don't all look the same, we don't all sound
the same either, but when we pull together, we do the biggest things in the world. So when some say we can solve America's problems by building walls,
banning people based on their religion and turning against each other, well this is New York and we know better.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: So clearly Matt Viser this is taking direct aim at Donald Trump in New York. It's an important contest for her there.
VISER: Yes, and Hillary Clinton I think is doing two things here. One is there's a primary coming up with Bernie Sanders on the Democratic ballot.
And he's reminding New Yorkers that she was their senator.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VISER: I mean she's represented New York, she's one of them, she's been in that state for a while. And that's point one.
[15:40:02]
VISER: Point two is almost looking past Bernie Sanders and going directly after Donald Trump and forecasting a general election match up that we
could see a lot of, of course to New Yorkers, Donald Trump identified quite well with New York City and Manhattan, and Hillary Clinton of course
represented the state for six years. So I think that she's doing both of those things and trying to forcefully go after him on some of his rhetoric.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Thank you Matt Viser of the Boston Globe really appreciate your analysis and for joining us on CNN.
And my next guest served as senior adviser to Marco Rubio's presidential campaign. Lanhee Chen is a research fellow at the Hoover Institution. He
joins us now live from Stanford University in California. Lanhee Chen, thanks for being with us.
First, your reaction to this statement by Donald Trump. It happened just a few minutes ago. He was asked by Chris Matthews, the MSNBC Host, would you
favor punishing woman who get abortions and essentially he said yes, I am pro-life and I am in favor of punishment -- of punishing the woman who
engage in this procedure. What is your reaction?
LANHEE CHEN, FORMER SENIOR ADVISOR TO MARCO RUBIO'S CAMPAIGN: Well, you know nothing should surprise us anymore. When Donald Trump says these
things it's clear he hasn't thought them through. And as if he did not have enough of a problem with woman voters already, this is just going to make
it worse.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: The other point I would make is Donald Trump has been completely incoherent on this issue. You know just a few weeks ago he was lotting
planned parenthood. In his past obviously he's had positions he's taken that a lot of conservatives object to on the issue of abortion. So this is
just another example of incoherence. But again, none of this should surprise us.
GORANI: OK. But fundamentally this is not hurting him. I mean your candidate Marco Rubio, his campaign ended because Donald Trump is doing so
well. Because some of the themes, some of the things Donald Trump is saying is getting him the kind of support that your candidate was never able to
get. So what is happening in this race? What is happening to the Republican Party that the Donald Trump candidacy that's getting the most traction?
CHEN: I think it's fair to say that there are a number of Republican voters, let's call about a third of Republican voters who are attracted to
the bombasticness of Donald Trump and the way he expresses his message. I completely understand that. There's a lot of anger in the electorate and
Donald Trump is channeling that relatively successfully.
But if you look at the rest of the Republican electorate and you look at how this race has evolved it's pretty clear that there's also a substantial
proportion of the Republican Party that doesn't want Trump as their nominee and I think those folks are beginning now to coalesce somewhat behind Ted
Cruz. Kasich presents a problem to Cruz because he's still in the race. But I reject the notion that this means that Donald Trump is the inevitable
nominee although it looks like he's the frontrunner now, I think a lot of people just object to the way that he expresses himself. And this latest
comment that you talk about is an example.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Yes, but no matter how - no matter how you look at it - no matter how you look at it even if he is not the nominee in the end because
procedurally it's possible to block him from getting to 1237. In the end you're disenfranchising 30/40% of the Republican electorate if the nominee
is someone else. So you still have a problem for the Republican Party here, right?
CHEN: There is some soul searching that the Republican Party has to do. I don't think there's any question about that. I think Donald Trump has
exposed some very real policy divisions for example over issues like trade and foreign policy. There are some real divisions here. But at the end of
the day this process is going to play out in a Democratic fashion.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: If Donald Trump can get to 1237 delegates, he's going to be the nominee of the party, and if he doesn't then the rules of the party will
provide for a series of successive ballots through which the nominee will be chosen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: But at the end of the day, this is going to be a democratic process.
GORANI: So, but Lanhee, the other thing is, your candidate, Marco Rubio, still has -- the way it works is he still has his 173 delegates. Let's take
a look at the delegate count here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Donald Trump is ahead followed by Cruz and Kasich, but Rubio has 173 delegates by CNN's count, that's more than Kasich who is still in the
race. What happens to those delegates? Does he get to choose who they are then reallocated to?
CHEN: Well in some cases Senator Rubio has asked that you know delegates basically hang tight.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHEN: In other cases, those delegates will go to the other candidates. I know that Senator Rubio very much cares about this race and where it goes
and so he will continue to be involved as a voice in all of this. But yes, I mean look this is still very much an open contest. What you've just
pointed out with the delegate race is that this is an open contest still.
GORANI: But so what does it - I mean where are they likely to go these delegates then? Are they - are they is there going to be a calculation to
basically try to block Trump any way that the party can and allocate them to whatever the best, sort of strategically the best candidate who is
capable of doing that to?
[15:45:10]
CHEN: Well you know in some of these cases these delegates are going to have to make a decision regarding who they would support beyond a first
ballot. That's a decision for the delegates themselves to make.
There's no central figure here pulling the strings. It's not like somebody can say hey, all these delegates go to person X obviously different people
are going to weigh in with different preferences. But the delegates are going to be free after that first ballot in many cases to make their own
decision.
GORANI: All right, Lanhee Chen, thanks very much. Former Senior Advisor to the Rubio campaign, thanks for joining us from Stanford, we appreciate it.
And don't forget to our views you can get all our interviews and analysis on our Facebook page. Facebook.com/halagoranicnn. We will see you online.
This is "The World Right now." After this short break we will see you on television.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Reaction to another one of Donald Trump's provocative ideas encouraging Japan and South Korea to build nuclear weapons. Stay with us
for that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: After today's breaking news on his abortion comments it seems nothing is too controversial for Donald Trump. He said he believed woman
should be punished for having abortions.
Now we want to focus on a suggestion that South Korea and Japan could defend themselves, even develop nuclear weapons, that he'd support that
idea. Trump says Washington can no longer afford to foot the bill in that part of the world. CNN's Paula Hancocks is in Seoul.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The U.S. South Korean military drills this year are the largest ever. But if this man becomes
U.S. President, could they be the last ever? Presidential candidate Donald Trump is suggesting pulling U.S. forces out of Japan and South Korea if
they don't pay more and suggests they develop their own nuclear weapons to counter North Korea.
TRUMP: At some point we have to say you know what, we're better off if Japan protects itself against this maniac in North Korea. We're better off
frankly if South Korea is going to start to protect itself.
HANCOCKS: A former U.S. Ambassador to South Korea was blunt.
CHRISTOPHER HILL, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO SOUTH KOREA: With due respect to Mr. Trump and his retail estate purchases, he has no idea what he is
talking about.
HANCOCKS: Japan, the only country to have a nuclear weapon used against it has had a non-nuclear policy and pacifist constitution since the end of
World War II.
Japan's foreign minister saying that it is impossible that Japan will arm itself with nuclear weapons.
South Korea focused on Trump's insistence, they're not paying their share for the 70-year-old alliance. The Foreign Ministry in Seoul saying the U.S.
public including its government and congress appreciates South Korea's role and contribution.
Some journalists have slammed Trump's comments. One editorial in the popular Joong Ahn Ilbo in Seoul calling them shocking say they could affect
the relationship.
[15:50:09]
HANCOCKS: But this man a well-respected academic actually thinks Trump may have a point.
South Korea possesses enough nuclear material to make 4,000 nuclear weapons he says. All we need is our President's approval. If we have nuclear
weapons we will be in a much better position to deal with North Korea.
But that's not a view shared by many. Most officials feel that their best bet at security and deterrence against North Korea, is 28,500 U.S. troops
in South Korea, 54,000 U.S. troops in Japan and the significant military hardware that comes with them.
Paula Hancocks, CNN, Seoul.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Coming up Samsung sued football superstar Pele is suing the tech giant for $30 million. We will tell you why next.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: Toronto is saying farewell today to its former Mayor, Rob Ford.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: You will remember some of his - some of his news making antics. Hundreds of supporters attended a public funeral service earlier. Well Ford
of course was known for his outlandish behavior. He gained international notoriety in 2013 after a video surfaced that apparently showed him using
crack cocaine.
Ford was stripped of his position as Mayor but he was re-elected to the City Council. He died last Tuesday after battling an aggressive force of
cancer. He was just 46 years old.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Samsung could be in some legal trouble.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Take a look at this advertisement. Now, who do you think the man in the image is. If your answer was football legend Pele, that would be
incorrect, but it's exactly why he is suing the Tech giant, Samsung.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Let's get more details from CNN Money's Samuel Burke. So when you look at that ad, Pele is saying essentially this really - there's a picture
of a footballer with a side kick sort of like kicked of a football and the picture of a man who he says really suggests my likeness.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: So you're using my likeness to advertise the product.
SAMUEL BURKE, CNN MONEY CORRESPONDENT: And interesting this lawsuit that Pele's lawyers are bringing in Chicago say that they had actually entered
into negotiations, Pele's people with Samsung back in 2013 to use his actual image. Those fell through, flash forward, last October the ad that's
on the screen right now appeared in the New York Times and the law suit says this gentleman appears very closely resembles Pele.
They also point out like you just notice that if we take that ad, if we can bring it back for a second, that in the television there's a picture of a
soccer player who's doing the famous bicycle scissors kit that Pele perfected. So they say this really poses a threat to the other endorsement
deals. Go ahead.
GORANI: Sorry I'm just telling the gallery to take it full because I'm having actually trouble seeing that little thumbnail in the middle. Yes go
ahead.
BURKE: Well if you look closely there you see - that one's the white gentleman who's doing it, not the elderly black gentleman that we see. But
if you look in the T.V. screen they say that's the famous move that he perfected. So they say, his lawyers, that this is a threat to the other
sponsorships that he has with Volkswagen, Subway, Emirates and Proctor and Gamble. It's estimated he earned $25 million dollars back in 2014.
For the other endorsement that he's had Samsung isn't commenting. A lot of people have noted it doesn't actually say or mention Pele my name in the
advertisement but I've got to say I've been thinking about it Hala, a lot of people say I look like Justin Timberlake, so if any company ever wants
me to stand in for Justin Timberlake I'd be happy to do it although lately I'm getting Sam Smith, more and more so if any company needs me, is there
any celebrity that you look like that you could stand in for?
[15:55:23]
GORANI: No, I actually told the producers before this. Last winter - well there is something there I could kind of see it. He lost a bit of weight
that's why you guys look alike now a little bit more. Because before I think there was less of a resemblance.
But, the last winter Olympics I kept being told that this young Russian ice skater just looked like she could be my daughter, I mean I think she was 15
or 16 years old at the time. There you (inaudible) but doesn't she? I mean I can totally see it. I could see it.
BURKE: Well, I think if this whole news thing doesn't work out for you you could fill in for her in ads and they could probably save a lot of money.
GORANI: I'll tell you what, she could sit in for me a lot more easily than I could ever sit in for her. It would require me actually skating and not
making a complete fool of myself.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Anyway, but listen, before I let you go, this has been a big talker, I actually tweeted it and got a lot of reaction. Four golden super
cars causing a stir in the streets of London. They've also caught the eye of authorities.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: The cars - are the property of a Saudi billionaire. He apparently had them shipped from Saudi Arabia. They are worth a total of one and a
half million dollars, they are gold plated including a Mercedes G63 six wheel, 370,000 lbs worth. This is of course a Lamborghini. A rolls Royce
as well. They've been lining the streets of London and causing outrage it has to be said Samuel.
And by the way they got ticketed.
BURKE: And maybe if you got Pele to sit in one of them. I know people think that here in Manhattan has a reputation for being very wealthy but
it's even more ostentatious in London I think.
GORANI: Yes, this is - this is really actually above and beyond what even we are to and people who live in London and in some of the neighbors see
some of these crazy cars.
BURKE: That's not how you get to work in the morning? In that entourage?
GORANI: Not even close. What's the exact opposite of that. That's how I get to work.
BURKE: Taking the tube.
GORANI: well, I walk sometimes too. Okay. Samuel, we will see you later. Thanks very much.
This has been "The World Right Now," I'm Hala Gorani, I'll see you here, same time, same place tomorrow. "Quest Means Business" is up next. We'll
be right back.
END
