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Hala Gorani Tonight
"Fire And Fury" Sparks Furious White House Response; Trump's Aides And Allies Rally Around President; U.S. President Arrives In Nashville; Oprah's Golden Globes Speech Sparks 2020 Rumors; Nigel Farage Meets With E.U. Brexit Negotiator. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired January 08, 2018 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:00:24]
HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. Live from CNN London, I'm Hala Gorani.
Tonight, fighting back, the White House is on the offensive as questions swirl about President Trump's fitness for office.
Also coming up this evening, a rousing speech at the Golden Globes has many wondering, is Oprah Winfrey running for president?
And in the next few hours, North and South Korea will meet for the first time face to face in two years. We will be live in Seoul.
We start with this. Donald Trump's aides and allies are closing ranks around him today and over the weekend, defending him against almost
unthinkable allegations about a sitting U.S. president. They are in full damage control mode or offensive mode trying to contain the fallout from
the explosive book "Fire and Fury."
Mr. Trump himself is very eager to change the subject understandably. He is doing just that today. Any minute now he will touch down in the state
of Tennessee where he will speak to a farmer's organization. There he was boarding Air Force One in Washington on his way to Tennessee.
Over the weekend, Mr. Trump's response to the book may have backfired by picking up more buzz. People asked him questions about his mental fitness
by saying he is, quote, "like very smart" and calling himself a very stable genius. The book's author sat down earlier with Christiane Amanpour.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL WOLFF, AUTHOR, "FIRE AND FURY": I think that's why this book has hit such a cord because everybody sort of -- it's the realization. To
everyone, you cannot listen to this man, you cannot watch what this man does, you cannot see this man, read his tweets a daily basis and not say
something is wrong here.
Everybody recognizes that outside of the White House and it is the obvious thing to think, to realize that the people inside the White House, who are
just the same as you and I, say, what the hell?
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the thing is, though, we have to ask you and wonder, how on earth did you get
people around him to even say that to you?
WOLFF: This is -- I'm going to tell you something. They say this to everyone. Everybody who they talk to, people in the Washington press
corps, people in political circles, everybody knows this. So, the only different thing that has happened here is that I said it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: All right. Michael Wolff, the author of "Fire and Fury." We're live on the story tonight in Washington. Let's bring CNN's Stephen
Collinson and Dan Merica, who is at the White House.
Dan, first of all, Michael Wolff, you hear him there, once again repeating his assertion that 100 percent of the people he spoke with preparing his
book believe the president to be unfit for office.
DAN MERICA, CNN POLITICS REPORTER: I think you are exactly right when you say the president has kicked up more of this than he has let settle. By
tweeting about it, by continually weighing in on it, more people will talk about it. Michael Wolff will be asked about it more often.
It's certainly something the president has dealt with over his almost year in office. He wants to tamp down on the story, but by tweeting about it,
by responding to it, he elevates it. President Trump will be going to Nashville. He is in the air right now headed to Nashville to speak to the
American Farm Bureau Federation annual event.
He will do a victory lap on the tax bill. You have to ask yourself, is he going to respond to claims here? He is somebody who often in speeches kind
of goes in and out of his prepared remarks.
It's not an absurd question to think that he might respond to Michael Wolff in this speech or respond to reports of people asking about his ability to
handle the presidency.
As these reports come out, you are watching these speeches that are supposed to be on tax policy, that are supposed to be about revitalizing
rural America and wondering is it going to deviate to something of a response to Michael Wolff?
GORANI: When it comes to Donald Trump, obviously anything is possible. Over the weekend there was a heated interview between one of the Trump
advisers, Stephen Miller, and our colleague, Jake Tapper. Stephen Collinson, I want you to react to this in a moment. First, listen to an
excerpt from that interview.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVEN MILLER, WHITE HOUSE SENIOR ADVISER: It's tragic and unfortunate that Steve would make these grotesque comments so out of touch with reality
and obviously so vindictive. The whole White House staff is deeply disappointed in his comments which were grotesque.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: All right. So, when he says Steve, he is referring to Steve Bannon, the former chief strategist of Donald Trump. So, someone is not
telling the truth. On the one hand, you have the author who says 100 percent of the people who I spoke with for this book told me the president
is unfit. Here you have Stephen Miller saying these comments are grotesque.
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Right. It's very interesting, because Stephen Miller was often seen as very close to Steve
Bannon. They're both of the same cloth ideologically. Hala, I think there's been this -- there have been whispers around Washington for many
months that the president -- you talk to people in Congress, people connected with the White House.
And Mr. Wolff is right when he says people are saying this all the time, but think you have to somewhat sort of separate it out a little. There are
a lot of people who believe the president's conduct, his tweets, his impulsive behavior, his sort of angry demeanor, his bullying, that kind of
behavior is not suitable for a president of the United States.
That's not the behavior and it shows perhaps that he is not prepared to be president of the United States. That doesn't necessarily mean that there
are a lot of people around Washington who think the president is mentally unfit or perhaps he is not mentally -- he might be mentally unwell.
We saw exactly this behavior in the campaign and it has carried on as he is the president. Of course, it's far more --
GORANI: The expectation was once he was elected, he would change. I guess that's the expectation. During the campaign is one thing, you are trying
to get your base excited. When you are president, you are the president of the whole country.
By the way, I want to read something that the attorney for the publisher of the Michael Wolff book has just said, Elizabeth McNamara (ph). My clients
do not intend to cease publication, no such retraction will occur, and no apology is warranted.
This is what Elizabeth McNamara wrote in a letter that CNN was provided a copy. I do wonder, Dan, at the White House, not official press secretary
reaction. What are you hearing from your sources inside the White House about this book and the reaction of the president to it?
MERICA: There's certainly a lot of interest in the book. It has dominated news coverage. As we know quite well the president enjoys watching cable
programs from the White House. He is getting a heavy dose of it.
People in the White House are aware of some of these whisper campaigns, what Stephen referenced. They're aware of what Michael Wolff is reporting
on and some of those rumors and the gossip that he's reported on. So, there is some acknowledgment of it.
I don't necessarily think it's, you know, flying off the shelves here in the west wing. I don't there's a secret stash of Michael Wolff books that
people are delving into in which (inaudible).
But I do think it is certainly dominating -- it dominated last week, even though last week was a consequential week. There were meetings with top
Republican leaders, planning out 2018 strategy.
Really the Wolff book dominated the conversation and it has the chance and ability to continue dominating this week as well. That certainly worries
people in the White House because that knocks them off message.
GORANI: Right. Steve Bannon, though, Stephen Collinson, did issue a sort of apology. It was more than a sort of apology. It wasn't a full throated
one, but essentially, he reaffirmed his support for the president's agenda.
COLLINSON: Steve Bannon doesn't do contrition very often. It was remarkable that he issued that statement. Some people believe he is trying
to curry favor with the president, get himself back in his good graces.
But we know that the president still is deeply angry. I think one of the reasons that Bannon issued that statement was because his position as a key
figure in the Republican Party is now under threat because of the quotes that he gave to Michael Wolff.
He was supposed to be leaving these corpses of insurgent candidates since the primaries before the midterm elections to challenge establishment
candidates. He's lost a lot of the funding from big conservative donors that he was going to use to do that.
He is also, of course, the head of Breitbart News, this very influential populist conservative outlet that was really sort of -- rode the Trump wave
into office. There's even suggestions that his position there could be under threat.
So, the president has been quite effective, I think, in sort of setting out to destroy Bannon as a key player in the Republican Party and the politics
going forward of the party. I think that's one of the reasons why he issued the statement.
Having said that, Donald Trump is notorious for falling out with close aides and associates and months and years later sort of coming together
with them again and forging common cause.
[15:10:07] So, who knows? May be down the line if Donald Trump is deeply unpopular and losing friends, Steve Bannon might be able to work his way
back into the president's good graces.
GORANI: Again, you never know. Expect the unexpected. Thanks very much, Stephen Collinson, Dan Merica, to both of you as always.
We were mentioning that Donald Trump was on his way to Nashville, Tennessee. He was due to land according to the schedule that I have here
about 5 minutes ago. Not sure if he's on the tarmac yet. He is on the ground. Let's take a look at the pictures. I'm not he's deplaned quite
yet.
We should expect him any minute now. There's the presidential limousine ready to pick him up. Looks like a wet day in Nashville today. We have
Boris Sanchez there at the venue where the president is expected to make an appearance. Try to get the subject off the Michael Wolff book -- Boris.
BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, there, Hala. Yes. It's often when the president is in front of these large, friendly crowds that he tends to
go off script, and he begins to attack what he perceives are his political enemies, the press, Democrats, other Republicans, or potentially some of
what we have heard more recent days, former allies, including former chief strategist of the White House, Steve Bannon.
Potentially also we might hear about Michael Wolff, the author of "Fire and Fury." In the past few days, the president has really been focused on
defending his mental fitness and his capacity to do the job of president.
Again, all of that not really in this speech, written out for him. Here he is expected to discuss things like infrastructure reform, tax reform that
passed last month. He is expected to tout the passing of that legislation and to promise these farmers that it is going to help them economically
over the long run.
It remains nationally a deep unpopular bill. The president is expected to sell it. Beyond that, he is expected to pledge an investment in building
high speed internet connections across rural America.
A report put together by a task force for the president indicated that some 40 percent of the United States lacks high speed internet connections that
would greatly boost commercial enterprises. The president is expected to address access to that as well as access to health care.
He is said to mention efforts to fight the opioid epidemic. All of that in the speech. Obviously, what is more politically salacious is what he may
say off the script -- Hala.
GORANI: Yes. Absolutely, we will be monitoring that. Boris Sanchez is in Nashville, Tennessee. Thanks very much. If you are hoping to catch that
speech, it's due to start at 4:10 p.m. Eastern, which means at 9:10 p.m. our time, 10:10 p.m. Central European Time and there you see the crowd
gathering waiting for the president.
Now the president wants to speak about infrastructure. He wants to speak about high speed internet, but that's not what people are talking about
because of a series of tweets and a book that's topping many bestseller lists.
Let's get the Republican perspective now from CNN political commentator, Doug Heye. He is a Republican strategist and former communications
director for the Republican National Committee.
We should note that while Doug supported some of Mr. Trump's policy, he has been a harsh critic of his. In this particular case, Doug, what do you
make of the response over the weekend to this book to various other interviews like the interview that Jake Tapper conducted with Stephen
Miller on CNN? What do you make of his reactions on social media?
DOUG HEYE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I think it does two things. One, it sends a sign to the base of solidification, continuing the war on
the media that the Trump base loves and not respect its good. For the rest of the country, they are seeing more wild rhetoric, whether it's from the
president or from the White House staff that's turned them off from Trump to begin with.
I think there was an opportunity for the White House and the president's team here -- this book is so riddled with factual errors and getting
people's names wrong, spellings wrong, just pure facts wrong.
Instead of saying that this is biased and evil and so forth, you can call it wrong and point out mistake after mistake after mistake instead of
saying it's grotesque. I think that might have been a better way for them to challenge some of the assortations here.
GORANI: But I also wonder about complaining that journalists don't talk about the issues like infrastructure and the opioid epidemic when it's
virtually impossible to ignore some of the tweets that the president posts and sends out using language that just sounds so childish and so below the
office of the presidency. It's a distraction. It's a huge distraction, but do you think it's intentional?
HEYE: It's a distraction and it's an intentional distraction. For the president sometimes looks at Twitter, and this is after several days of
absorbing a really negative story surrounding this book, it's a reset button for him. And so now we are talking about things slightly more on
his terms.
[15:15:06] But where I would advise the White House or caution the White House is to go back to where they were in late December when they were
talking about the tax cut bill. They were talking about good economic numbers.
They had a positive message that they could really promote throughout the country that voters would respond to. Just this weekend, you had really
strong meetings with the president and Republican leadership in Congress, a good press conference with the president.
That's what they should have been focusing on, their agenda, what they're trying to do for the American people, instead of this tit for tat with a
book where --
GORANI: But it's not going to change. We had this exact same discussion a couple weeks ago when you were in London. It seems like this is the M.O.
of this administration and particularly of the president.
By the way, one interesting thing that was reported today is that the -- the fact that Senator Bob Corker, a prominent Republican, is traveling with
the president on Air Force One to Tennessee. This is obviously his home state.
But our international viewers may remember that Bob Corker was the senator who tweeted this back in October. It's a shame the White House has become
an adult day care center, someone obviously missed their shift this morning.
Corker also said essentially the administration is setting the country on a path to World War III. Now, he is on the plane with him. What's going on?
HEYE: Well, Donald Trump always pulls back in advisers from time to time. I think if you are Steve Bannon, you are looking at Donald Trump with Bob
Corker right now and realize that there's a way back in for you instead of being in exile from the White House for the next several years.
GORANI: OK. Do you think Steve Bannon has a future when it comes to Donald Trump where the party itself? What do you think his future is after
this book?
HEYE: Everything we have seen from Donald Trump is he may trash you tomorrow and hug you the next day. As long as you think that you have a
next day somewhere in the future, you have sustainability with this president, with this White House.
Clearly, Bannon in his remarks that he's made, walking back what he said, what he had been quoted about in the book and so forth shows that he is
willing to not only but eager to work with this president and possibly sees an avenue. Again, the president being with Bob Corker after really heavily
critical remarks from Corker shows that there's a door -- if not a door open, a window open.
GORANI: All right. Maybe a window very slightly open. We will talk about other celebrity billionaires with potentially with political ambitions
after the break. Doug Heye, maybe we will have an opportunity to talk about Oprah Winfrey next time. Thanks very much.
We are going to take a quick break. When we come back, could there be that election showdown between two celebrity billionaires? Sources tell CNN
Oprah Winfrey is mulling a 2020 run. We'll be right back.
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GORANI: It was a rousing, powerful, inspirational Oprah Winfrey speech at the Golden Globes. It sounded a bit like more than just an acceptance
speech. It was a rallying cry and has many wondering if the billionaire talk show host and actress is heading for a presidential run.
[15:20:12] Brian Stelter shows us why.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
OPRAH WINFREY, ACCEPTED CECIL B. DEMILLE AWARD: I want the girls watching here now to know that a new day is on the horizon.
BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Oprah Winfrey bringing the Golden Globes audience to its feet with an inspiring call to
action.
WINFREY: When that new day finally dawns, it would be because of a lot of magnificent women, many of whom are right here in this room tonight, and
some pretty phenomenal men fighting hard to make sure that they become the leaders who take us to the time when nobody ever has to say me too again.
STELTER: The television and movie icon honoring those who have spoken out about sexual harassment and discussing in personal terms the women whose
stories will go untold.
WINFREY: I want tonight to express gratitude to all the women who have endured years of abuse and assault because they, like my mother, had
children to feed, bills to pay, and dreams to pursue. For too long women have not been heard or believed if they dared to speak their truth to the
power of those men, but their time is up.
STELTER: Oprah also emphasizing the power of the free press to expose injustice.
WINFREY: We all know that the press is under siege these days. I want to say I value the press more than ever before.
STELTER: Oprah's speech fueling speculation on social media about a potential 2020 presidential bid. Despite Oprah's past comments downplaying
a foray into politics, her longtime partner, Stedman Graham, telling the "L.A. Times" overnight, it's up to the people. She would absolutely do it.
During his opening monologue, host, Seth Meyers, jokingly encouraging Oprah to run referencing his jabs about President Trump not being qualified at
the 2011 Correspondents Dinner.
SETH MEYERS, HOST, GOLDEN GLOBE AWARDS: Some have said that night convinced him to run. So, if that's true, I want to say, Oprah, you will
never be president. You do not have what it takes.
STELTER: Oprah's speech was the culmination of a night focused on combatting sexual harassment. Actors and actresses appearing on the red
carpet wearing black in solidarity, many making a statement with pins reading "time's up."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: Sources are telling CNN's Brian Stelter that Oprah is actively thinking about a 2020 run. Brian is with me live from New York. What are
they saying about her potential political ambition?
STELTER: These are friends who are actually urging Oprah Winfrey to run. They want her to take this possibility seriously and seize the moment.
According to two of these close friends, she is actively thinking about running.
But to be clear, that does not mean she's made up her mind, does not mean she's definitely going to run for the Democratic primary. We know there
are lots of people that think about running and then don't actually follow through.
I do think it's notable, Hala, that Oprah is even entertaining this idea. She's one of the most famous people in the world. Of course, rich and
famous, a little bit like President Trump, but that's where the similarities end.
She's in some ways the anti-Trump. Her speech sort of expressed that, even though she didn't mention President Trump. Her message of optimism, her
message about the me too movement, it certainly inspired a lot of people and caused this #oprah2020 to be trending.
GORANI: But just very recently, a few months ago, she told her friend and the co-host of the CBS morning program, I'm not going to be running for any
kind of office. It would be quite a turnaround if she was seriously considering this.
STELTER: I would say she would be the first person -- she would not be the first person to claim that they are not running for office running for
office. I remember we suffered through years of this with Hillary Clinton where she said she wasn't going to run again and then decided to run again.
I am really curious to see what her bestfriend says tomorrow. Gayle King is a co-host of CBS "This Morning" here in the United States. She's going
to be back at work and she will get asked about this. We will see if she drops any hints.
Oprah's not in a hurry, she doesn't have to be. We haven't gotten to midterms yet so this time next year, if we see her in Iowa or New
Hampshire, we will know something is going on.
GORANI: So, I've listened, watched years and years of Oprah shows, like many people, fan, I love the way she gives speeches. She's an
inspirational figure. Her speech yesterday was reminiscent. I mean, some aspects of it are messages that she's been repeating for many years.
One thing I know for sure, speaking your truth is the most powerful thing, talking about her mother, a personal anecdote.
[15:25:10] People were using those as signs that she was delivering a political speech. I didn't hear it that way, to be honest.
STELTER: I think that's a really important point, that it wasn't as if she was going out there talking about policy, talking about the president or
anything like that. She was talking about the subjects that made her talk show so special. That show has been off the air for a while.
So, in some ways what she's trying to do is reconnect to her fans. She has a gig now on CBS where she's doing pieces for "60 Minutes," that's the
biggest news magazine in the United States. Now she has a public platform in an upcoming movie and here at the Golden Globes yesterday.
Maybe what she's trying to do is really test the waters and see how much support she has out there. Judging from the applause in the ballroom,
Hollywood is on board. We don't know about the rest of the country. I think one outcome of this is now pollsters are going to ask about Oprah
Winfrey, just like Joe Biden. We will get a better sense of the landscape.
GORANI: I find it interesting. No mention of Oprah Winfrey by Donald Trump. By the way, that may be smart on his part in the United States. We
did -- we have a reaction from White House spokesperson on Air Force One. The president just landed in Nashville. This is the -- this is what the
White House spokesperson said, "We welcome the challenge, whether it be from Oprah Winfrey or anybody else." So, there you have it.
STELTER: I wonder -- I'm not going to claim here that the president would decide not to give her an insulting nickname the way he has for Steve
Bannon or many other figures, but I do wonder if there's mutual respect? They're both television stars. They're both embodiments of the American
dream. Both rich and famous.
They actually have some things in common, even though I'm told by her friends that she's appalled by some of Trump's behavior. It will be
interesting to see if they do end up campaigning against each other how much respect or how much sort of kindness he would show toward her.
GORANI: It would be. Oprah is an icon. She's virtually untouchable. You really rarely meet anyone who tells you they don't love her or respect her
career. We will see. Brian Stelter, thanks so much. Really appreciate having you on the program.
Theresa May is giving her government a reboot with a wide-ranging reshuffle within her own party. Mrs. May is trying to repair damage to the party
after a difficult 2017, which saw her lose seats in a badly judged snap election as well as dismissing a handful of her top cabinet members to
scandals.
The prime minister has left all of her most senior ministers in place. So, no big names will change. Downing Street said the reshuffle will help the
U.K. press on with Brexit talks. We know that's top of the agenda.
Meanwhile, well-known Brexit campaigner, Nigel Farage, says the voices of "leave" voters are now being heard in Brussels. Farage is member of the
European Parliament still. He met with E.U.'s chief Brexit negotiator, Michel Barnier in Brussels to express his concern about how the talks are
going.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NIGEL FARAGE, EUROPEAN MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT: I'm trying to represent the view of those that voted Brexit. It's not really being heard. We didn't
vote for transition deals. We didn't vote because of (inaudible). It's going to be six years from Brexit before we can sign a trade deal with
anybody else or control over our borders with the rest of the European Union.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Nigel Farage, he frequently criticized Theresa May for being too weak in these divorce talks and says that Britain should opt for a hard
Brexit if the E.U. doesn't offer a good deal.
A lot more to come this evening, could talking about sports help end a nuclear standoff? We're just hours away from a meeting between North and
South Korea. We're live.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HALA GORANI, CNN HOST, HALA GORANI TONIGHT: Well, it's easy to think that sports are not all that important in the grand scheme of things. But they
are serving as a convenient excuse for a reason, we should say, I think, to bring North and South Korea together for the first time in two years.
In just a matter of hours, negotiators from the North and South will gather at the Peace House in the Demilitarized Zone to talk about North Korean
athletes competing in the Olympics in South Korea next month.
And while that topic may seem far away from issues like nuclear weapons, it is seen as an important step toward easing tensions.
Our senior international correspondent Ivan Watson is live in Seoul, South Korea with the very latest. So, will this just be about participation in
the Olympics or could it be a wider-ranging discussion?
IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, certainly, that's the kind of window through which both delegations are coming
together for these talks, the first in some two years between the North and the South.
But already, the South Korean - the head of the delegation, the unification minister has made it clear that he'd also like to lay the groundwork for
discussions about possibly allowing separated families who have been on opposite sides the Demilitarized Zone ever since the Korean War of the
1950s, chances for them perhaps to meet, to reunite since some of these people are indeed quite elderly now, and also, in general, for trying to
de-escalate the enormous military tension here on the Korean Peninsula.
We're not quite sure what the North Korean side would also seek to gain from these discussions that aren't quite as transparent, but it's presumed
that one of the things they would like to see is a reduction of some of the sanctions, some of which are really just coming into force in the last
couple of days, restricting oil and fuel imports and some valuable exports from North Korea. Hala?
GORANI: And at what level are these discussions happening?
WATSON: Well, at the ministerial level, you've got the South Korean unification minister, that's Cho Myoung-Gyon, who is attending. And his
counterpart leads what North Korea calls the Committee for Peaceful Reunification of the Fatherland. His name is Ri Son Gwon.
Both of these individuals are veterans of many rounds of previous bilateral diplomacy between Pyongyang and Seoul, but they're also accompanied by
officials from their sports ministries and officials from their Olympic committees as well, which really does get to the point of these talks.
They're about the Olympics. They're about trying to get a North Korean delegation and some athletes to attend the games that are about a month
away from kicking off here in South Korea.
And also serves as a kind of an insurance policy. If North Korea sends a delegation here, there is perhaps less chance that North Korea could pop
off a missile or perhaps conduct a nuclear test, which could overshadow the Olympics that South Korea has invested so much in. Hala.
GORANI: Thank you. Ivan Watson is in Seoul. Why is North Korea suddenly open to talks and will the two sides be able to address some of the larger
issues. Let's talk about and bring in Sue Mi Terry, senior fellow for Korea at the Center for Strategic and International Studies. Prior to
that, she was a North Korea analyst for the CIA and a member of Presidents Bush and Obama's national security councils. Thanks for being with us.
So, why is it happening now? Is it just sport? Is it an external factor, do you think?
[15:35:00] SUE MI TERRY, SENIOR FELLOW FOR KOREA CHAIR, CSIS: Well, probably, sanctions are beginning to have some impact, but it's really a
smart move by Kim Jong-un. I mean, why not?
There's absolutely no political or financial cost of sending a delegation to Pyeongchang Olympics, while trying to really drive a wedge between
Washington and Seoul and create some fissure between the alliance relationship.
So, it's actually a very smart move by Kim Jong-un. The question is what would North Korea demand for its participation in the Olympics and what
will the Moon administration give to North Korea. I think that's when Washington and Seoul might have - again, might not see eye to eye on
things.
GORANI: But they're suspending military exercises. I mean, there are gestures of goodwill coming from the South Korean and US side here.
TERRY: We are postponing between exercises until Pyeongchang and Paralympics are over, which will take us to March 17.
But, again, the question is, will North Korea demand indefinite postponement of exercises? Will it demand concession on easing of
sanctions? Or even reopening the joint Kaesong industrial complex that has been closed since the former president Park closed it last year.
GORANI: What is the best-case scenario here?
TERRY: The best-case scenario is for North Korea to simply send a delegation to Olympics without demanding much, to really ease the
heightened tension that's going on. And then, that really opens up a chance for dialogue beyond the Olympics to maybe talk about this nuclear
crisis that's going on.
But North Koreans, historically, have always demanded things and they've never done things for free. So, I'm weary of that.
GORANI: Yes. Donald Trump, the US president, is taking credit for all of this. What do you make of that?
TERRY: I'm not sure if Mr. Trump has to take all the credit, but I do think he has a point in the sense that he is putting a lot of pressure on
the Kim regime. And the regime might be feeling the heat a little bit.
There's certainly unprecedented level of sanctions that's been placed on the North Korean regime. And it's never been this much, this level of
sanctions and pressure in the past. So, I think that's what Mr. Trump is trying to get at.
GORANI: All right. But you agree with him or -?
TERRY: I think he has a point to a certain degree. But North Korea has historically also sent a delegation to other international sporting events
and then they have also followed up with some sort of provocative actions.
So, I wouldn't make such a big deal out of this right now. I think there's a lot of things and we just wait and see how things unfold. I don't think
we should have a high expectation that this is now leading to some sort of resolution on the nuclear and missile front.
GORANI: All right. We'll keep our expectations nice and low.
TERRY: Yes, please.
GORANI: They have been recently. Don't worry too much about us being too optimistic these days. Sue Mi Terry, thanks so much for joining us. We
appreciate your analysis on the program.
TERRY: Thank you for having me.
GORANI: Yes. When North and South Korea decide to talk, there's one place they always go. It's truce village of Panmunjom. With a look at the town
that sits between two warring nations year, here's CNN's Will Ripley.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WILL RIPLEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The Korean demilitarized zone, a place where two worlds collide, dictatorship
and democracy staring each other down.
CHAD O'CARROLL, MANAGING DIRECTOR, KOREA RISK GROUP: It's a very, very big reminder of just what's at stake on the peninsula.
RIPLEY: The first official talks in two years between North and South Korea will be held in Panmunjom, the so-called truce village straddling the
38th Parallel, the tense dividing line between two neighbors still technically at war.
Delegations from both sides of the DMZ will be sitting a stone's throw away from the path a North Korean soldier took in November in a dramatic
defection, shot five times running south.
The talks will take place in Peace House, one of three buildings in the truce village, built specifically for discussions like this. Two in the
South, one in the North.
O'CARROLL: Sometimes the two Koreas have disagreements over which side the talks should be on.
RIPLEY: This time, they're on the South side. North Korean officials will likely pass through the same blue huts I first visited in 2015, the year
the last round of marathon talks took place, lasting some 44 hours, nearly two days.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In favor of armed intervention...
RIPLEY: To understand the DMZ, we need to go back to the end of World War II. The Soviets and Americans divided Korea just like they did Germany.
Most historians say the communist North tried to get it all by invading the South. The North says it was the other way around.
Technically, the war never ended. An armistice agreement put both Koreas back on their side of the dividing line, a standoff nearly 65 years and
counting.
[15:40:01] Today, North Korea is facing its toughest sanctions ever over leader Kim Jong-un's rapidly advancing nuclear program.
O'CARROLL: For the North Koreans, the motivation to take part in these talks is undoubtedly due to the pressure that is building up on the
country.
RIPLEY: Pressure that only stands to increase in 2018 unless both sides find a diplomatic path, a path that begins here in Panmunjom, a painful
reminder of the region's violent past, tense present, and uncertain future.
Will Ripley, CNN, Seoul.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: Check out our Facebook page for more analysis and interviews from the program, facebook.com/HalaGoraniCNN and @HalaGorani on Twitter.
Still to come tonight, gazing into the future of tech, Samuel Burk will give us a peek into the new gadgets that you might be using in the coming
years. He's in Las Vegas. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: One of the BBC's most senior journalists has resigned from her post in Beijing in protest against pay inequality with her male colleagues.
Carrie Gracie has quit as China editor last week criticizing what she called the BBC's secretive and illegal pay structure. She'll continue to
work for the news organization, but back in London instead.
Isa Soares has the story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ISA SOARES, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A bombshell letter by one of the BBC's most prominent and well-respected journalists,
slamming the BBC of unequal pay.
Carrie Gracie, who has been at the organization for 30 years and its China editor since 2013, has quit her job in Beijing, she says, to speak out
publicly about what she calls a crisis of trust at the BBC.
In an open letter to the BBC audience, Carrie Gracie says there is a secretive and illegal BBC pay culture, accusing the BBC of not living up to
its stated values of trust, honesty and accountability.
(on-camera): Carrie Gracie was one of four international editors at the BBC. Two male, two female. If you remember, last year, the BBC was forced
to make salary disclosures on its top on on-air talent.
And what Carrie found out was those two male colleagues doing exactly the same job as she was, but earning 50 percent more. And what Carrie is
saying, look, this is not about a pay rise. It's about pay equality, pay parity, equal pay for equal work.
(voice-over): At a time when women are taking a stand and pushing to be heard on issues that affect them professionally and personally, Carrie's
letter is being met with praise and applause.
Despite quitting as China editor, she has returned to her former position where she says she expects to be paid equally.
CARRIE GRACIE, BBC JOURNALIST: It's been very moving actually. And there are two things that have struck me most about it and moved me most, and one
is, I think, the scale of feeling, not just among BBC women, but also just more widely across the country and also internationally, the support that
I've had in the last few hours over this. I think it does speak to the depth of hunger for an equal, fair and transparent pay system.
[15:45:15] SOARES: Many on social media are calling her brave through the hashtag #IStandWithCarrie. Even, Emma Watson backed her on the red carpet
at the Golden Globes."
EMMA WATSON, ACTRESS: What has happened tonight with that resignation is a really good example that you've got to follow through, you've got to back
up what you're saying. And it's important and we will hold you accountable.
SOARES: The BBC said in a statement that it previously carried out an independent judge-led audit, which showed no systemic discrimination
against women. It adds that based on figures publicly released, it's performing considerably better than other organizations on gender pay.
But that might not be enough to silence the over 100 BBC female staff, who, according to the UK's National Union of Journalists, have lodged complaints
about the lack of pay parity at the media organization.
Isa Soares, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: Well, here with me is Jennifer Millins, the lawyer representing a number of high-profile women, fighting for equal pay at the BBC. Thanks
for being with us. What are you advising your clients to do?
JENNIFER MILLINS, LAWYER: Well, I can't talk about individual cases, but what the individuals will need to do if they have these issues and what
individuals at the BBC are doing at the moment is to raise the issues internally. And it's something that Carrie Gracie we saw this morning
mentioned in her letter that she had been frustrated with the lack of progress from those internal investigations, what we call a grievance
procedure. But it's an important step prior to bringing any litigation. But, ultimately, if a dispute like this can't be resolved internally, then
the next recourse is to litigation.
GORANI: Why is this suddenly an issue at the BBC? I mean, many of our international viewers might not understand why we're suddenly talking about
equal pay at that particular organization.
MILLINS: I mean, I think it's worth saying that it's an issue across the board and in all industries. It's not just an issue at the BBC. It has
become a particular focal point at the BBC because of the mandatory pay reporting that they were required to produce last July, and that's part of
their royal charter, part of their deal, if you like, with the government as to how they continue in their status as the BBC.
And they were required to produce, in July last year, statistics that gave details of everyone earning over 150,000 pounds from license fee payers'
money, and that showed some huge disparities in pay between men and women who thought they were doing the same work and assumed they were being paid
-
GORANI: Because in most companies, you don't openly discuss, and certainly management won't openly say how much they pay each individual employee -
men, women, perhaps even two men or two women doing the same job, similar jobs.
But you say it's a wider problem and, obviously, it is.
MILLINS: I think it, obviously, is. Absolutely. It is just becoming a particular focus at the BBC. And the BBC have been very slow to respond to
individual complaints internally, which is again part of Carrie's frustration.
But you touched upon the issue of transparency, and I think it's a really important one. Most individuals who are working within an organization
trust their employer equally, to pay them the same, pay women the same as men and vice versa.
And where it comes to light that that's not happening, it's still very, very difficult for individuals to get the information they need to then
prosecute those claims.
GORANI: All right. So, obviously, you've heard some criticism. Well, she quit her post, but she stayed the BBC. Does that weaken her case?
MILLINS: Not at all. It doesn't weaken her case. Her position is that it is very difficult to do the extremely difficult foreign correspondent job
that she was doing and still trust the BBC in circumstances where she said right from the outset, and not many women do, there's not many people who
do this at all, right from the outset she said, I will only take this job if I'm paid the same as my male counterparts doing Middle Eastern
correspondent jobs, the US correspondent job.
GORANI: And she's a veteran. She's a 30-year veteran at the BBC. So, it's not like you could say or argue, well, the other editors are older and
more experienced. Do they have similar levels of experience?
MILLINS: They have broadly similar levels of experience. There were a lot of things like that the employers can use to say this is why you are being
paid less than a man who is doing a job similar to you.
But in this case, it does seem very difficult for the BBC to be able to argue that.
GORANI: All right. And as you mentioned, we're going to continue to be talking about this issue. It's something that has emerged at the forefront
of many conversations this last year.
Thanks, Jennifer Millins. Really appreciate your time on the program.
And a quick break. And when we come back, we will be showcasing potentially your future. We'll show you some of the gadgets whipping up a
frenzy in one of the world's biggest tech shows. Samuel Burke will join me after this. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:51:24] GORANI: Well, it happens every year. We take a look at potentially our tech future, what we'll be using every day that seems
crazy, sci-fi now, but that will be completely normal tomorrow.
Could it be that refrigerator that can order your taxis and having groceries delivered by a robot, to TVs that rollup like yoga mats, although
I think I saw that last year and they maybe improved on it.
The future is on display at one of the world's biggest tech conventions in Las Vegas. What is whipping up exciting this year. Who better than Samuel
Burke to talk us through all the newest gadgets on show.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but that rollup TV thing was around last year, wasn't it?
SAMUEL BURKE, "CNNMONEY" TECHNOLOGY AND BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: So, last year, it was a rollable screen, also from LG, displayed, but more of a
tablet size, 18 inches that you could roll up and maybe put into your back pocket.
Now, what they have is a rollable actual television set. Now, LG displays just a screen maker. So, what they're hoping is that this prototype will
be used one day from TV manufacturers, so that you can have the TV in your living room and just roll it up like a yoga mat, though I don't see you
taking this to yoga, Hala.
But they also think that maybe we could use the screen at different levels. And maybe we just have it up a few inches. This one, 65 inches. So, you
can maybe just see who is - what music is playing if you have a dinner party.
Or a little bit higher, and it could be more like a movie screen theater because it would be wide, but not so tall or all the way up and that would
be 16 x 9, just like a television show that we're used to seeing, like HALA GORANI TONIGHT.
But I wanted to tell you the big trends that I'm seeing this year, Hala. So, number one, voice assistance. You've got Alexa, Google's voice
assistant in every type of technology you can imagine.
Number two, cities planning for a future with fewer drivers. So, yes, driverless cars, but everything being able to talk to each other.
Stoplights telling Uber that there is an accident around here, go a different way.
And number three, sports tech going pro. So, we're actually seeing wearables, never took off quite like people thought. So, now, wearables
are more specific maybe to athletes or the elderly, but I've got to ask you, would you get that rollable television.
GORANI: I don't know. You still have that box that will house the rolled- up screen, right? So, you still have kind of a bulky element there. So, why not - I mean, why not? I don't know actually.
And then, it would be just that white box when the TV is rolled up inside of it?
BURKE: Yes. I like it because there are some spaces where you just don't always want to have the television, so you can just roll it up in trying to
put it aside when you're having people over for dinner and you don't want to show that. But - go ahead.
GORANI: What do they retail for?
BURKE: So, right now, it's just a prototype. So, thousands of dollars eventually one day, I'm guessing. I mean, these are one of the ones, if
the ideas - you never know quite where it's going to go.
Remember, they said 3-D television was going to be next big thing. I don't see people with 3-D glasses in their living rooms.
And they said TVs with curves. But why do you need curves if you can have a rollable television. So, it's hard to know. That one doesn't have a
price tag yet, but this does have a price tag, Hala.
I've held up a lot of things on your show, but I haven't held up underwear. This is smart underwear. So, it's like any wearable device, in that it can
read your body temperature, your heart rate, calories, steps, but it's inside your underwear. So, if you don't like taking things around, having
it on your wrists, you can just have it built-in.
Now, on the surface, it sounds kind of funny that I'm holding up underwear on your television show, but I've been talking to the CEO who had a serious
reason for making it. His father was sick, and so he wanted to know about his father's vital signs and being able to access them when he wanted when
he was ill.
[15:55:07] $349 for eight pairs of these underwear. A little bit more expensive than the ones I wear, not to share too many details. That will
get you two of these devices which go into the underwear, as well as a wireless charger also. The smart bra that goes along with it to be fair to
the ladies. Again, not something I thought I'd be holding up on your show.
But you never know where these devices are going, what's going to take off. I could see athletes using this, especially.
GORANI: Yes. Good old dumb bra, I think, I'll stick with. But the question is, what do you get from that that you don't get from, I don't
know, that wearable tracker that everyone has on their wrists these days. Is it just that you don't have the - like, anything getting in the way when
you're running or -?
BURKE: Exactly. Not getting in the way when you're running. I think they see bigger future for it. When I talked to the folks behind this type of
technology, it's what can they do next with it.
If there's some type of issue on your body and your body can read it, then can it help stimulate that area or can it help a part of your body that
might have a problem.
One other thing I wanted to show if we have enough time, Hala, is you and I have done a lot about these devices. You and I speak a lot of languages
between these devices -
GORANI: Samuel, we're going to have to save that for tomorrow, I'm afraid. We have to save that for tomorrow because we have to go to a break and go
to the next program. But please keep that tomorrow because I'm interested in it.
BURKE: I'll be here waiting for you.
GORANI: And don't charge that underwear while you're wearing it. Just a piece of advice.
Thanks for watching tonight. Stay with CNN. I'm Hala Gorani. "Quest Means Business" is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
