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Hala Gorani Tonight
U.S. Confirms Tariffs On $50 Billion Worth Of Chinese Goods; Judge Sends Paul Manafort To Jail Pending Trial; U.S. Attorney General Cites Bible To Defend Immigration Policies; Russian President Front And Center As Tournament Begins; World's Top Two Economies At War Over Trade; Human Rights Not Emphasized At North Korea Summit; Pakistan: Taliban Leader Death Positive Development; Chagos Islanders Struggling With Immigration In The U.K.; World Cup Gambling Addiction Concerns. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired June 15, 2018 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:00:24]
HANNAH VAUGHAN JONES, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. Live from CNN London, I'm Hannah Vaughan Jones in for Hala Gorani.
Tonight, the U.S. and China are now in a full-blown trade war as Beijing retaliates after Donald Trump followed through on imposing huge tariffs.
Also, ahead, a judge sends President Trump's former campaign chief, Paul Manafort, to jail after prosecutors called him a danger to the community.
And a last-minute goal gives Iran a win. It didn't happen like you might expect. All the latest World Cup drama is coming up this hour.
We begin the program with what is being called war between the two most powerful nations on earth. Rather than the battlefield, this conflict
looks set to play out in the boardroom. That's because the White House has confirmed new tariffs on $50 billion worth of Chinese goods.
As you can see, that represents a huge aspect of commerce between the two nations. China calls this a trade war. In the past hour, announced
parallel measures equal to those of the U.S. As we speak, investors are selling off on Wall Street. This is how the Dow is doing now, down 77
points or so. Less than an hour to go until the end of the trading week.
Richard Quest is in New York with the very latest on how the business world is responding to this trade war. Richard, often the immediate impact of
any trade war is felt in the market. Everything a bit flat at the moment. Talk us through the story of the day so far.
RICHARD QUEST, CNN ANCHOR, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": Yes. The market was down very sharply earlier, more than 250 points, about 1 percent at one
stage during the session. As you point out, Hannah, it has rallied back up again despite the fact that we now are well and truly into a trade war.
Think of it this way. Donald Trump's White House announced the list of goods that they were going to tariff. The Chinese have done exactly the
same with an equivalent amount. But the president -- the U.S. president in his original statement said that if the Chinese retaliated, then the U.S.
would go further. Well, the Chinese have now retaliated. So, the ball is firmly back in the U.S. court.
JONES: What products are we talking about here, Richard? I mean, who is going to be affected when they do their weekly grocery shopping or when
they are sorting out their household budget?
QUEST: OK. So, the way it's going to work is in terms of the U.S. tariffing Chinese goods, they are highly technical things almost like
nuclear power station parts. Lots of real heavy machinery stuff. The Chinese are tariffing things like soy beans, U.S. exports of agriculture.
So, the consumers in the U.S. won't necessarily notice the effect immediately because the sort of Chinese goods being hit are not individual
consumer goods by that nature. However, U.S. exporters, farmers and the like, they will feel the effect.
Because the Chinese retaliatory measures are designed with political intent as much as economic. The U.S. has gone for economic sanctions. The
Chinese is basically sticking it back to them with political ones.
JONES: Then, Richard, how strong is the overall U.S. economy? How can it or can it withstand the Chinese response?
QUEST: I mean, this is nothing for the U.S. economy. This is a blip in that sense. If it stays as it is, Hannah, but this is not about the $50
billion of tit for tat now. What's worrying here, of course, is firstly, if they go to the $150 billion, which is what the U.S. has threatened, if
there was retaliation.
And also, the tariffs that will come from Europe, from Canada, from Mexico, from Japan as a result of the separate set of steel and aluminum tariffs.
The U.S. has now got itself into a situation where it's tariffing not only China but all its major allies.
Every single tariffed country has turned around and said you do this, we will retaliate. That's what they're going to do in the next week or so.
JONES: A trade war has begun. Richard Quest, thank you very much indeed, sir. We appreciate it.
Another big story, big story that we are following today involves Donald Trump's former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort. He is now in jail and
will remain there until his trial on charges involving conspiracy against the United States.
A federal judge revoked his bail today, saying he abused the terms of his home confinement. Manafort is accused of witness tampering while he was
under house arrest.
[15:05:09] A short time ago President Trump took to Twitter saying Manafort's situation is, quote, "very unfair," adding that Manafort also
worked for other high-profile campaigns. Then the president said that, he, quote, "didn't know Manafort was the head of the mob."
Manafort himself has pleaded not guilty to all charges stemming from the probe into Russian interference in the U.S. election.
Let's bring in CNN's crime and justice correspondent, Shimon Prokupecz for more on this. Shimon, before we get to a question, Donald Trump is not
only being tweeting, he has been speaking about Manafort. This is what he said earlier on about his former campaign chairman.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I feel badly about a lot of it. I think a lot of it is very unfair. I look at
somewhere they go back 12 years. Manafort has nothing to do with our campaign. I feel so -- I feel a little badly about it. They went back 12
years to get things he did 12 years ago.
You know, Paul Manafort worked for me for a very short period of time. He worked for Ronald Reagan, Bob Dole, John McCain, for many other
Republicans. He worked for me, what, 49 days or something, a very short period of time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JONES: A very short period of time, nothing to do with me at all, other than being campaign chairman. In the real world, how big a blow is this
for the president?
PROKUPECZ: Look, for the president, all of these investigations are a big blow, certainly the former campaign chairman being sent to jail today
because of witness -- allegations of witness intimidation, tampering. It's tremendous here for both Paul Manafort and really the president, because,
obviously, the president is associated to him.
The big question now is what will Paul Manafort do in the end? He is likely to maybe never, ever be free again if he is convicted at trial, even
though they may appeal the judge's decision to revoke his bail. It's highly unlikely that they would win that appeal.
But if they don't, it's very highly likely that he may never, ever be free again. Then what this ultimately may do is put pressure on Paul Manafort
to cooperate with the investigation. We have been given indications from sources we have talked to that this is what the government wants.
There is something -- some kind of information that Paul Manafort has that the government wants from him. While the president may say, you know, he
only worked for me for 49 days or is a -- but it's in those 49 days that are key to this investigation.
Because the government here wants to know who he was communicating with, if he was continuing any of these relationships with some of the Russians that
the FBI has been investigating. It seems to be a key part of this investigation for the special counsel here in Washington, D.C.
JONES: Yes, Donald Trump has been saying all along this is witch hunt in relation to the special counsel as you mentioned there. I mean, Paul
Manafort was described in court today as being a danger to society though. How so? Just explain that to us.
PROKUPECZ: Right. So, the prosecution and the FBI alleged that over the five-week course, Paul Manafort tried to reach out to witnesses to try and
get them to change their help his case. These were potentially government witnesses. One of those witnesses came forward to the
government and said that Paul Manafort had reached out.
You have to think about this. This is something that the government, that the FBI that prosecutors here take very, very seriously and even judges
across the U.S. take very seriously because any time you have a defendant, someone charged with a crime, that's reaching out to witnesses in any kind
of fashion, could lead to witnesses being afraid to come forward. - the judge really took this extremely serious today, obviously, by sending him
to jail.
JONES: Shimon Prokupecz, we appreciate it. Thank you.
All right. Now between those worries at home and a direct challenge from China, our top story on the global stage, the events in the past few hours
are likely to have serious, serious ramifications for the U.S. president.
For more on this, let's speak to our senior economic analyst, Stephen Moore, who is also one of the top economic advisors to the Trump campaign.
He is in Washington. Good to see you. When we spoke last month, you said to me that you were against tariffs, that you were a free trade kind of
guy. Since then, your president has obviously imposed $50 billion worth of tariffs on Chinese goods. Good move or bad move?
STEPHEN MOORE, CNN SENIOR ECONOMIC ANALYST: Well, look, it's never a good situation where you have tariffs going up or threats of tariffs. The case
that Donald Trump makes -- I think he's got a pretty solid case -- is that China is not playing by the rules. That they are stealing a lot of our
technology.
They have not opened up their markets to American products the way we've opened up our products to them. That that has led to a -- he likes the
word reciprocal. It's not reciprocal situation and it's one of the reasons we have this gigantic trade deficit with China. Now, I'm not --
[15:10:10] JONES: We have a reciprocal response from China now.
MOORE: Yes. I get it, yes. Look, the problem for China is that they have already -- look, what we want is a level playing field.
JONES: Right.
MOORE: They make it so difficult for American businesses. I have talked to a lot of CEOs of major American companies over the last six to nine
months who tell me, we can't do business in China. We can't penetrate the market. They steal our technologies if we come in.
They require us to give up ownership shares of the company to do business there. That's not a fair situation. Trump has -- this idea that somehow
we're violating the trade status quo when they have been imposing these tariffs on us for 30 years is really a little bit preposterous.
Donald Trump did say during the campaign, we're going to get tough with China. Now he is getting tough with China. I think a lot of Americans are
applauding what Donald Trump has done.
JONES: But it's not just China, is it? Again, when we were speaking just a couple of weeks ago, Stephen, you said that you actually hoped that
global tariffs would come down across the board as well. I mean, clearly, that's not going to happen. Not just China but in the aftermath of the G7.
We see Canada is going to respond. The E.U. is going to respond. I mean, how detrimental could this effect on the global economy be on global
relations?
MOORE: Well, it could be negative. But look, all of these countries, all of the countries that you mentioned, if you mentioned China, then there's
Japan, then there's the Europeans, there's Canada. They all impose higher tariffs on us than we do them.
And then, you know, when Trump retaliates, they say, my goodness, how dare you impose tariffs on us when they have been doing that for 25 years. So,
Trump basically -- by the way, one of the really interesting developments that wasn't covered much at the G7 meeting because it happened at the very
end was Donald Trump puts zero tariffs -- he said, why don't we all go to zero tariffs.
The Europeans almost had a heart attack. They don't want to go to zero tariffs. They want to impose tariffs on us, but they don't want us to
impose tariffs on them. I would make the same case. China is in exactly the same boat.
They love the status quo where they are able to block our stuff from coming in and they are able to access our market. Basically, now they're going to
have to change their ways or there is going to be this retaliation. Do I like it? No. I don't think we can live with the status quo any longer.
JONES: OK. Stephen now that we have you on the program, I can't not ask you about what's going on in the administration at the moment domestically,
given the fact you have had an insider view from inside the administration as economic adviser. Given what we know about Michael Cohen, Paul
Manafort, do you sense the house of cards is crumbling?
MOORE: Hardly. I mean, you know, read the front page of the "Wall Street Journal" above the fold. America's economy is growing faster than any
other country. We have seen a massive economic turnaround. Our economy is fling on all cylinders right now.
It's an incredible turnaround. We have more jobs than people that can fill them. We have 4.5 percent growth now this quarter. You know, so a lot of
Americans aren't paying attention to this -- the kind of game of thrones that goes on in Washington. What they care about is their jobs and the
economy. It's just soaring right now.
I mean, I saw the president a few weeks ago. I said, I knew this was going to work, but I didn't think it was going to work so quickly. So, Americans
-- you know, 70 percent of Americans now rate the American economy as good or great. Two years ago, it was only 35 percent.
So, that I think is what Americans care the most about. Now, Paul Manafort is somebody I got to know a little bit on the campaign because -- as Trump
said, I think for two months or less, he was the campaign chairman, but it was a short time. I don't know the particulars of his case. He was not --
when I was working for Trump, it was Corey Lewandowski and then Kellyanne Conway who were running the campaign.
JONES: Right. OK. Well, thank you for commenting on Paul Manafort. We have run out of time unfortunately, but always good to speak to you.
Stephen, thanks so much.
MOORE: Thank you. Thanks so much.
Now before we move on, we want you to hear something that you may have missed today. The president of the United States essentially saying it's
OK to lie to the free press. Here is what Donald Trump said about a misleading statement on a meeting at Trump Tower involving a Russian
attorney. Pay attention.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JONES: Did you dictate the statement about Donald Trump --
PRESIDENT TRUMP: Let's not talk about it. You know what that is? It's irrelevant. It's a statement to the "New York Times," the phony failing,
"New York Times." That's not a statement to a high tribunal of judges. That's a statement to the phony "New York Times."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JONES: Mr. Trump's attorneys have acknowledged that he did, indeed, dictate that statement after repeated denials by the White House.
[15:15:10] Now it's been a day of high drama at the World Cup. So, far Two games both decided in the last minutes. First up was Uruguay. Then it was
the turn of Iran who beat Morocco. That is the first time that Iran have won a game at the World Cup in 20 years. Right now, two of the
tournament's heavyweight teams are playing. Spain is taking on Portugal.
Amanda Davies is live in Moscow with all the action for us. Amanda, the pressure is on because last night we had Matthew Chance mobbed and kissed
in the street by Russian fans. That was day one. What's the latest on day two?
AMANDA DAVIES, CNN WORLD SPORT: Day two, Hannah, I'm pleased to say I'm somewhat of a safer distance than maybe Matthew was from the fans who were
certainly enjoying Russia's success yesterday. I have to say, the atmosphere here in Red Square this evening is fantastic. Even though the
big game of the day Portugal-Spain is taking place quite a distance away, down south.
There's a huge crowd behind us here at the bottom of Red Square. All trying to look into the tv studios whereas you can imagine, we have the
screens showing the game. We have been kept on our toes. We knew Portugal against Spain was going to be the biggest -- well, arguably the biggest
game of the group stage.
Certainly, the biggest game we have seen so far. It hasn't disappointed. I can tell you, it's in the 59th minute. It is 3-2, Spain are leading.
Having come back from one goal down and then two goals down.
Remember, the big question mark heading into this game was how Spain were going to react having lost their coach just two days ago. After that big
announcement, he was becoming the new real Madrid manager. It's been an emotional 48 hours or so in the Spanish camp.
Understandably, they got off to a slow start. They weren't at their best. Ronaldo put Portugal ahead from the penalty spot. Slowly, Spain have come
back into it. Ronaldo scored his second, but Spain have found the net twice through Costa. It is all set up to be a fantastic final 20 minutes
or so in what is a big crunch match in Group B.
JONES: Tell us a little bit about Mosalah still on the bench. When is he going to actually take to the pitch and also, fantastic result for Iran
today.
DAVIES: Yes. Let's start with Mosalah. You have to feel for him. There was the big announcement yesterday from his coach that he was almost
certain 100 percent to start today in Egypt's opening game against Uruguay. Big surprise to a lot of people after he suffered that shoulder ligament
injury just three weeks ago in the Champion's League playing for Liverpool.
As it was, when Egypt's team's was announced, their star man was not starting. He was named on the bench. People thought that that meant
perhaps he would make some appearance at some stage. There was a subplot going on to the whole game, which wasn't necessarily the best.
Every time Mosalah got shown on the big screen, the Egyptian fans roared. It was his 26th birthday today. Willing that their main man would come on
to help their side look for victory again against Uruguay. But it didn't happen, afterwards, Hector Cooper, the boss felt he couldn't risk it in
this game, which was so crucial.
For such a long time, it looked as if they were going to get the points against Uruguay. But as you said, a last gasp goal meant that it was
Uruguay going home with three points. Iran, very much a similar scenario.
Late into injury time at the end of the match, a crunch game that in Group B, because Iran and Morocco in the same group as Spain and Portugal, you
would think both of these sides would struggle to beat the big two. This was a game that both Iran and Morocco knew that they had to win to give
themselves a fighting chance --
JONES: Just agony, Amanda --
DAVIES: -- heartbreak for them.
JONES: Absolutely. I was saying, agony for that player with the goal.
DAVIES: Heartbreak for them.
[15:20:08] JONES: We have to leave it there. Amanda, great to talk to you as always. Thank you.
DAVIES: You saw what it meant to Iran, the flip side.
JONES: Absolutely. Thanks so much. Take care over there.
Coming up on the program this evening, who is responsible for the policy that is separating children from their parents at the U.S. border? It
depends who you ask. We will see why Donald Trump says it's all the Democrats' fault.
And comments by the U.S. attorney general sparked a controversy of biblical proportions quite literally. Find out what he said and why religious
leaders are taking issue with it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JONES: Welcome back. There is a lot of finger pointing going on in Washington right now over who is to blame for the separation of families
seeking asylum at the U.S. border. President Donald Trump says it's the Democrats' fault, even though he could change the policy with a stroke of a
pen.
Congressional Republicans came up with a compromise that could keep migrant children and their parents together. This morning, President Trump said he
certainly wouldn't sign it. A short time ago, he said he misunderstood the question and that he does actually support the bill.
Well, illegal immigration is always a hot button issue in the United States. But throw religion into the mix as well and you really have a real
political powder keg going on. This is what happened when U.S. Attorney General Jeff Sessions cited the bible to justify separating children from
their families at the border when they illegally enter the U.S.
The White House press secretary essentially agreed in a terse exchange with our Jim Acosta. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEFF SESSIONS, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: I would cite Apostle Paul and his clear and wise commend in Romans 13, to obey the laws of the government
because God ordained the government for his purposes.
SARAH HUCKABEE SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I can say it's very biblical to enforce the law. That's actually repeated a number of times
throughout the bible.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JONES: But religious leaders have come out strongly against policies that separate families and restrict asylum.
I want to bring in CNN's religion commentator, Father Edward Beck, now for more on that. He joins us from Los Angeles. Father, great to see you.
Perhaps we should get into Romans 13, which is what Jeff Sessions was quoting from.
Let's bring it up and bring up one section of it at least. Go through the text and see if it can be justified at all. Romans 13 says, "Let everyone
be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been
established by God consequently whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted and those who do so will bring
judgment on themselves."
Father Beck, is it your understanding of that that those people who bring judgment on themselves are effectively endorsing separating children from
their parents?
[15:25:03] FATHER EDWARD BECK, CNN RELIGIOUS COMMENTATOR: No. Not at all, Hannah. I think what Jeff Sessions was doing here is called proof
tempting. That means lifting a biblical passage out of its contexts to make your own point.
What about all of the other biblical passages that talk about the need to embrace the stranger, the immigrant, the migrant? It reminds Moses -- God
reminds Moses, you were once strangers in the land. You must embrace the stranger. So, you can't simply take a biblical passage out of context to
make your own point.
JONES: What do you make of Jeff Sessions' turning to the bible at all in his role as a high political leader? Is America still a secular country?
What happened to the separation of church and state?
BECK: Well, we do claim to have separation of church and state. That's usually a good thing. Often in our country, as opposed to other countries
around the world, religion does bleed into politics. Often, ty will play to a certain religious base. Jeff Sessions, I think, is doing that here.
As you mentioned, Sarah Sanders propped him up as well by saying that the bible is to be used for justification for this. What about when the bible
talked about slavery? Did we say because the bible said it, you know, we could justify it? There are many things in the bible that you can't lift
out of context and use as justification.
JONES: I think Romans 13, correct me if I'm wrong, it has been used to justify slavery in the past as well. I guess it's whether you have a
fundamental interpretation of the biblical text or whether you have a liberal interpretation. Either way, should this be used by politicians?
BECK: I don't think it should be used by politicians at all, especially if they are ill informed. Remember, Jesus and the Holy Family were the first
refugees. They had to flee political oppression. How could you possibly use a text from the New Testament to justify this heinous policy? It
doesn't make any sense at all. It's very correct that people are pushing back on this because it's just ill-informed interpretation.
JONES: You say people are pushing back. What's been the overall Christian reaction to this? Are they kind of pleased that the, bible -- the biblical
text is being used in this manner or actually appalled that it's being used to justify something which for the most part people consider to be
inhumane?
BECK: People I talk to and that I am hearing about are appalled. The bishops of the United States are meeting this week in Florida. They came
out with a statement saying that this policy is immoral, which means it is sinful. The bishops of the United States are saying that, Pope Francis has
said that the rights of migrants, especially with children and families, must always be respected and protected.
The very head of the Catholic Church has said that this policy cannot stand, that it is sinful. I think religious leaders in our country right
now are speaking out against it and include internationally are speaking out against it.
JONES: Father Edward Beck, always good to speak to you. Father, thank you so much.
BECK: Thank you, Hannah.
JONES: All right. Still to come tonight, justice for Malala, the Pakistani Taliban leader taken out by a drone. How it might affect a
ceasefire?
And it's been another wild week in Donald Trump's presidency. We will look behind all the top headlines. Do stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:30:58] JONES: One day in and the World Cup couldn't be going better for Russia and its president. Vladimir Putin was front and center at the
first game where Russia thumped Saudi Arabia to send the hosts into rapture. Putin was sitting with Saudi's crown prince, Mohammad Bin Salman
for the game.
And in the last 24 hours, we have heard of an invitation for Kim Jong-un to visit and murmurings that a summit with Donald Trump could now be on the
table. It is worth noting that on the same day as the opening ceremony, Russia proposed raising value-added tax, the AP and the age of retirement
in the country. So with the eyes of the sporting world firmly fixed on Russia, what will Vladimir Putin gain out of it?
Let's bring in Alina Polyakova, a foreign policy fellow at the Brookings Institution. She joins me from Washington. Alina, great to have you on
the program. The Russian economy is crumbling. $8 billion is being spent on hosting this World Cup. This kind of strongman president's pursuit of
soft power, saying, hey, Russia's fun, come for the games, come for our hospitality and the like, is that really just a pursuit of real power and
trying to gain great influence on the world stage?
ALINA POLYAKOVA, FOREIGN POLICY FELLOW, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: That's exactly right. The Kremlin uses these kinds of big international events
like the Olympics that Russia hosted back in 2014 and now the World Cup, to basically try to whitewash its very bad reputation on the world stage
today, to showcase Russia that looks like a very modern, European country, no different from France, the U.K. or Germany. But of course, this is all
about PR and all about image.
JONES: And I mentioned there in the introduction that this all came on the same day, just in the last 24 hours, that Russia has now introduced arise
in value-added tax and they raised the pensionable age as well. Can you accuse Russia of trying to sort of shift unpopular policies under the table
to get them through while everyone is looking at football? Or is this just something that all countries really do?
POLYAKOVA: No. I think that the timing of these announcements is not a coincidence. Certainly, these are very unpopular measures. But the
Russian economy is in stagnation for the foreseeable future and the reality is that the Russian government has to make these very unpopular changes.
And the Russian people will not be very happy about it. So, of course, now, every Russian citizen is probably glued to their televisions focusing
on the World Cup. So I think the hope is they won't notice how bad the economy actually is and then they're going to experience a decline in their
standard of living.
JONES: Putin known for being a strongman, strongman approach to the presidency, saying for Donald Trump as well, at least, he would claim and
we hear murmurs now that there might be a summit coming up. It does seem that Donald Trump is more unhappy to make friends with traditional foes to
the united States, like Russia, rather than with traditional allies. What's all that about?
POLYAKOVA: It certainly been a big mystery to all of us, what Donald Trump really thinks about President Putin and vice versa. But clearly, President
Trump and candidate Trump when he was running in the elections in 2016 said very positive things about Putin. I don't think we have to go through the
litany of everything that he said. Just recently, he suggested that Russia should be back in the G7. The G7 should be the G8.
But at the same time, the administration within 24 hours announces new sanctions on Russian companies, tech companies. And then you have the
director of national intelligence, one of Trump's key cabinet appointees, making a very hawkish speech on Russia. This all happens in 24 hours. So
we kind of have this disconnect where the administration looks like it's very hawkish policies but the president, at the time, seems to maintain
this desire to have a closer relationship with Vladimir Putin.
JONES: We wait to see if this summit actually happens. We can never predict these things anymore. Can we? Alina Polyakova, great to talk to
you. Thank you.
POLYAKOVA: Thanks for having me.
[15:35:57] JONES: Now, recapping on our top story. U.S. President Donald Trump sharply escalating a confrontation with China over trade. Mr. Trump
said on Friday, the U.S. will impose a 25 percent tariff on $50 billion of Chinese exports. He said trade between the two nations has been unfair for
a long time. Beijing vowed to retaliate immediately and said Washington had launched a trade war. Well, I spoke earlier to CNN's Fareed Zakaria
about the trade dispute and all the top headlines of the Trump administration, and there are a lot. I started by asking Fareed if the
jailing of former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort is a sign that President Trump's inner circle is in imploding.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: What is really a sign of is that Robert Mueller is a very careful prosecutor. If you look at the systematic
way he has gone about this job, amassing evidence, singling out people, he's very rarely lost in a court when he has asked a court to do something.
If you recall on Michael Cohen, Cohen asked if he could review his e-mails privately, this is Trump's lawyer and Mueller said, no, that wouldn't be
appropriate.
The judge essentially ruled in Mueller's favor. Here again, this was something Mueller asked for. And it does appear -- my friends in New York
who have actually prosecuted both with and against him say, this is the hallmark of Robert Mueller. He's very careful, very methodical and that
tends to impress the court.
JONES: The big topic today is trade wars. We're now officially in a trade war. Donald Trump certainly is anyway. Consequences already with China
responding to the tariffs that he has imposed. How will Donald Trump personally and his team more widely have weighed the balance of how far
they can go? What they can get away with before the Chinese response really starts to hurt?
ZAKARIA: I happen to know on this issue think that Donald Trump has a legitimate point. China has been a trade sheet. China has taken advantage
of the rules of the Western. Trading system, it has the extraordinary access to western markets. It has not provided reciprocal access to
Chinese markets. Unfortunately, it appears the answer to your question is, they haven't thought this through. This is not very strategic. The first
thing you would do if you're going after China is get the Europeans and Japan on board, because China does this to everyone.
All the developed countries. And instead, Trump began this use tariff escalations against the Europeans, against the Canadians. So he's
alienated the very people with whom he could have presented a common front and then put real pressure on China.
JONES: And Donald Trump does all of these things by also insisting that America is now gaining respect on the world stage. He says for the first
time under his administration now America is being looked at as a kind of a beacon of trade hope, shall we say. However, when it comes to traditional
alliances, particularly the G7, what we saw in Canada last week, certainly that doesn't seem to be a huge amount of respect shared there between those
partners.
ZAKARIA: I think it's important to understand what Trump is saying does resonate with his base. What he's saying is, yes, yes, I'm not trying to
get on with Europeans and Canadians and the Japanese. I am standing up for you the American worker, because these guys have been ripping you off and
I'm the first guy who's been willing to talk tough and to actually act tough. And so in a strange sense, the more Europeans dislike him, the more
his base is convinced, yes, he's standing up for us.
JONES: And he seems to sort of gain confidence as well with that. Speaking about respect, Donald Trump was asked today on an American network
about North Korea and his relations with Kim Jong-un. He had this to say about Kim Jong-un and his relationship with his own people in North Korea.
Take a listen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are we close to seeing Mr. Kim here at the White House?
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It could happen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They talk about that yesterday?
TRUMP: I would have him. Yes, I think it's something that could happen. Hey, he's the head of a country. I mean, he is the strong head. Don't let
anyone think anything different. He speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.
JONES: When he's talking about my people there, is he talking about American people or is he talking about his staff in the White House?
ZAKARIA: Well, you have no idea what -- I hope he just means the staff in the White House. To be fair, I think he was joking. But he did say in
Singapore of Kim Jong-un, he said he clearly loves his people. It's a very strange formulation for what is probably the most repressive dictatorship
in the world.
JONES: And human rights abuses weren't even mentioned as far as we know in this summit. Donald has said he didn't want to -- he didn't want to scare
them off from any kind of nuclear arrangement they could come up with. I mean, how damaging could that be long-term for Donald Trump if he still
refuses to engage with foreign leaders and dictators on the human rights abuses?
[15:40:54] ZAKARIA: I don't mind if in this particular negotiation with regard to nuclear weapons you don't bring up human rights. I think it's --
the United States had to deal with the Soviet Union on nuclear issues. It didn't always bring up human rights. What's surprising, as I say, is
nobody needs to go out of their way and lavish praise on -- this is a regime.
The U.N. put out a 400-page human rights report on North Korea and it begins by saying in terms of the repression and the brutality and the
terror, there is no parallel in the modern world for the North Korean regime and this country is off the scale in that regard.
So you don't need to praise them. And I think your broader point however, is true which is the U.S. has always stood up for human rights. It doesn't
always do it in every forum, in every situation and maybe doesn't need to. But it has always held that light. And it seems as though Donald Trump
really wants to put that light -- really extinguish that light.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
JONES: Fareed Zakaria speaking to me earlier. And be sure to watch Fareed's show. It airs Sundays on CNN International at 10:00 a.m. In New
York City, that's 3:00 p.m. here in London.
Now, hours before a fragile ceasefire was set to begin in Afghanistan for the Eid. The precision strike killed -- the. The leader of Pakistan's
Taliban who was in charged at the time of the attack on the activist, young activist, Malala Yousafzai. Our CNN's Nick Paton Walsh now reports, news
of Fazlullah's death may bring a sense of justice.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: An extremely important target at an extremely sensitive time. Mullah Fazlullah, leader
of Pakistan's Taliban killed by a U.S. drone strike on Wednesday, just inside Afghanistan. The missile hitting Fazlullah little more than a day
before the afghan Taliban said they would join a ceasefire in the war- ravaged country for the celebration of Eid beginning Friday.
The Afghan and Pakistani Taliban often support each other and it is unclear what this strike just inside Afghan territory in the mountainous Kunar
province will mean for the ceasefire.
It was first proposed for 10 days by Afghan president, Ashraf Ghani and then joined for the Taliban for a short period. The U.S. said it would not
stop counterterrorism operations during the ceasefire and has systematically targeted Taliban leaders in Pakistan with drones to fervent
Pakistani local opposition. And they recently cut off aid with Afghanistan's neighbor over what the U.S. called assistance to militants in
the Pakistani border areas. Fazlullah was infamous before he became the Pakistani Taliban's leader in 2013. He preached hate on the radio and led
the Taliban in the swat valley in 2012 when activist Malala Yousafzai was shot in the head for advocating female education.
Many will see the drone strike as ultimate retribution for inciting that cowardly attack. An attack that actually worked against its dark aims,
catapulting Malala's message of progress and peace to the world stage. Yet many other Pakistanis will feel a sense of justice. Fazlullah led the
Pakistani Taliban when they attacked a school in Peshawar in 2014, leaving 141 children under the age of 11 dead. The worst such attack in Pakistani
history.
It turned many hearts that harbored vested sympathy for Taliban cause starkly away from their extremism. Yet still, their country remains caught
in a battle against the battle of the insurgency in its hills. Well, may bring Afghanistan could only hope the short ceasefire brings peace from a
war in which Taliban is slowly but clearly instilling fear like never before.
Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, London.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JONES: First, they were exiled. Now, their families are being ripped apart. Ahead on the program, how the United Kingdom is facing yet another
immigration scandal.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:45:13] JONES: A news just in at CNN. A day after completing its acquisition of CNN's parent company Time Warner, AT&T has announced a new
name for the brand. Warner Media. In an internal memo, CEO John Stankey announced structural changes are ahead. The acquisition is one of the
biggest media deals ever, worth $85 billion.
In the late 1960s, natives from Chagos Island, a British territory were forcibly deported from their homeland to make way for a joint U.S.-U.K.
military base. In the process, they lost their homes, their livelihoods and any claim to British citizenship. CNN's Erin McLaughlin has an update
now from Crawley outside London which hosts one of the largest Chagossian communities in the world.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I believe to God one day you comeback. I see in my heart --
ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A mother's prayer that one day, her heart will be whole.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know Brian, is very, very sad.
MCLAUGHLIN: Brian Gulamsing's (ph) family lives just outside of London. He is thousands of miles away in Mauritius, unable to join his family here in
the U.K.
SOPHIA, BRIAN'S SISTER: Last month, I just felt like, is my brother really going? Like (INAUDIBLE)
MCLAUGHLIN: Here's the problem. Brian's family is from a British territory in the middle of the Indian Ocean called the Chagos Islands. But
in the late 1960's, native Chagossians were forcibly removed from the Archipelago to make way for a military base. The process of losing homes,
livelihoods and crucially for this family and many others and he claimed to British citizenship.
That was addressed to some degree in 2003. When Brian's mother and other Chagossians qualified for British citizenship. That citizenship did not
extend to subsequent generations which includes Brian who was born in Mauritius. Still, he tried to join his family in the U.K. in 2012. But
four years later he was detained and deported the day before Christmas, no less, sent back to Mauritius. Where he says he has little hope for the
future. Now, one lawmaker is pushing legislation to give people like Brian a path to citizenship.
HENRY SMITH, BRITISH CONSERVATIVE MP: It's not their fault they were forcibly removed in the late 1960s and early 1970s. I think they've
allowed to stay in their homeland or even back to their homeland, they're automatically have a right of British citizenship.
MCLAUGHLIN: Now those trying to join their parents in the U.K. are being deported. You have to pay the Visa applications fees which amounts to
thousands of dollars.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: These people are earning great. I know, most people work as a cleaner, most people work in this and that. Exactly. But we are
trying hard and taking long.
MCLAUGHLIN: The gruesome story is one of many within the poor and struggling communities. Demanding among other things, specifically the
benefits of the support package, the British government promised Chagossians years ago.
Here, at this meeting outside London, we see them lashed out at the man now charged with overseeing Chagos. The foreign office says it's still
assessing the community's need. Community full of people desperate for help, including Brian's cousin, who calls during our visit.
When Emmanuel Jean Luis was 16 years old, he arrived in the U.K. to join his mother. His late father was born in the Chagos province of Diego
Garcia. Which should entitle Jean to full British citizenship. A claim the home office rejects, because his parent weren't married. A requirement
under U.K. law. The home office has ordered his deportation. So, for two years, he's been hiding out.
[15:50:03] How many stories are there like this out there?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A lot. There's a lot like this and there's worst.
MCLAUGHLIN: Emmanuel, I'm sorry. That's tough.
In reality for Emmanuel and so many others the situation is anything but OK.
Erin McLaughlin, CNN, Crawley, England.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
JONES: Still ahead for us, World Cup fever is catching on and in one country, the fever is leading to a gambling issue and it's not just a
problem with the men.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FARAI SEVENZO, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You're not really a football fan though, are you?
IMELDA OMINDE, GAMBLER: I'm not.
SEVENZO: So, why do you watch it?
OMINDE: To bet and get money. I'm addicted to it. I can't do without betting.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JONES: Our special report is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JONES: There are five African teams taking part in this year's football World Cup, but Kenya isn't one of them. However, many people in the sport-
mired country still want in on the action. They're placing bets, lots and lots of bets and that's sparking fears of a growing gambling problem. Our
Farai Sevenzo has more now from Nairobi.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RICHARD NDUNGU, GAMBLER: I can't stop betting, because I'm addicted. I don't know how to stop. I can't do without betting.
SEVENZO: 20-year-old Richard Ndungu spends more than half of his weekly income on football betting. He is one of a growing number of Kenyans
gripped by the gambling problem. As a sports-mad country gears up for the football World Cup, many are worried that the nation has become addicted to
the games of chance. And it's not just adults who are at risk. Brian and Tidia (ph), 12 and 14 and both regularly place bets. How did you bet if
you're 12?
BRIAN OCHIENG, GAMBLER: We were two people.
SEVENZO: You were two people?
OCHIENG: Yes. I'm 12 and he's 18.
SEVENZO: He's 18?
OCHIENG: Yes. He has an I.D. card. So I just told him how to do those things. And me I waited outside there. He won 400 shillings. He gave me
200 and him 200.
SEVENZO: The boss of Africa's most prolific betting company says it is parents' responsibility to restrict children's access to betting apps.
While adults like you and I can afford to splash 100 shillings on a bet, it's now affecting children.
RONALD KARAURI, CEO, SPORTPESA: It's not affecting children. I think that's another misconception. For you to be even on our Web site, you have
to have a line, you have to be registered on M-PESA and all of those things require for you to have an I.D. --
SEVENZO: Be an adult.
KARAURI: -- and to be an adult. That's where we need to draw the line. Because let's say your kid has access to this and you gave them the access,
who is really to blame for that?
SEVENZO: But all across Nairobi, the gambling bug is in full swing. The government says they are aware of the problem and attacking it with an
awareness campaign but they acknowledge the internet is making it difficult to control underage betting. And it's not just the boys who are betting.
You're not really a football fan though, are you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm not.
SEVENZO: So why do you watch it?
OMINDE: To bet and get money. I'm addicted to it. I can't do without betting. I have to look about 100 shillings, at least to try my luck.
SEVENZO: Would you say you would rather find 100 shillings for betting or for bread?
OMINDE: For betting.
SEVENZO: And that is the worry in Kenya, that the whole nation will come to associate the beautiful game with gambling.
[15:55:05] Farai Sevenzo, CNN, Nairobi.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
JONES: Well, the World Cup in Russia has truly exploded into life on the second day of the tournament. An incredible game between Spain and
Portugal has just finished. The score 3-3. Cristiano Ronaldo, like so many times before, was the hero of the game for Portugal, at least, scoring
all three goals for them, including an equalizer with just a few minutes to go. So celebrations across Portugal tonight. Now, this year's World Cup
is full of huge names that you would expect. Brazil, Germany, Portugal, England, Spain. But one name is there for the very first time and it is
the smallest nation to ever reach the finals. Iceland, population, less than 350,000, is mixing it with the big boys. CNN traveled there and even
the president is excited.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP))
GUONI TH. JOHANNESSON, PRESIDENT OF ICELAND: People sometimes ask me how come Iceland, this tiny nation of 350,000 people, has a team at the men's
World Cup in Russia now? It's just unbelievable, unimaginable, et cetera. You're happy to hear this. But at the end of the day, the fact of the
matter is that in Russia, we have the best teams in the world. It just so happens that Iceland is one of them.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is a dream, obviously, to be a part of World Cup. You've seen all the competitions over the years. Memories are strong. But
probably if I would have told you that when I was 14, 15, you would have probably laughed at me being in the World Cup for this country. It's
phenomenal.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JONES: Iceland's first game, just a matter of -- and no Messi in Argentina, so straight into the deep end. That takes place on Saturday.
The fans be watching that.
Now, finally, the man who changed the way we understand the stars above us has been immortalize within the ferment itself. In a service at
Westminster Abbey, the ashes of physicist, cosmologist, and all for Stephen Hawking were interred between the graves of Charles Darwin and Sir Isaac
Newton. At a unique aspect of Hawking will remain beyond the reach of mankind. A recording of his voice has been set to music and beamed
thousands of light years into space, specifically to a black hole. The mysteries which Hawking, of course, devoted so much of his life to.
Stay with us here on CNN. Thanks so much for your company this last hour. "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" is coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
