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Hala Gorani Tonight
Michael Cohen sues Trump organization in New York State Court; President Trump meeting with Czech Prime Minister; Huawei lawsuit challenges United States government ban; British Royal family takes action against trolls. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired March 07, 2019 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00] HALA GORANI, CNN HOST: Hello, everyone. Live from CNN London on this Thursday, I'm Hala Gorani. Tonight, Donald Trump's former campaign
chairman will soon hear if he will spend the rest of his natural life behind bars. We're live outside the courthouse. Also, tonight, Justin
Trudeau faces the heat. The Canadian Prime Minister is dealing with a major scandal at home.
And she's one of the most recognizable faces in the world, but Meghan Markle is the target of racist abuse online, and the royal family is
cracking down on it.
We're following major developments this hour involving two former members of Donald Trump's inner circle. The U.S. President's ex campaign chairman
Paul Manafort will soon learn his fate for bank and tax fraud. He'll be sentenced next hour and could spend the rest of his life behind bars.
Another long-time Trump associate is going to court for a very different reason. Former attorney Michael Cohen is suing the Trump organization,
saying he is owed Millions in unpaid legal fees and costs, and he's on his way to prison soon. These developments overshadow a high-level visit to
the White House. Mr. Trump and first lady Melania are visiting with the Czech Prime Minister and his wife this afternoon. The Czech Prime
Minister, by the way, also a billionaire and also someone surrounded by controversy in his native Czech Republic. Let's bring in CNN White House
correspondent Abby Philip. First of all, any reaction to Michael Cohen's move, saying he wants to sue the Trump organization? Any reaction from the
President?
ABBY PHILIP, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, just as you were saying that, our reporters just came out of the oval office where President Trump
was with the Czech Prime Minister. It doesn't appear that he took any questions from reporters on that subject or really on any other. So, we
haven't really gotten much of a reaction from the White House to this latest news, which is part of a number of headlines surrounding Michael
Cohen, his upcoming prison sentence, and his testimony before Congress last week that have caused, you know, a series of headaches for this White
House. They've handled it by and large by not necessarily responding to the substance of anything Michael Cohen has had to say but rather going
towards Michael Cohen's character, saying he's a liar and simply can't be trusted with anything he's saying publicly right now.
GORANI: And of course, he was hired by Mr. Trump for many, many years. It wasn't until recently the President turned on him, since his cooperation
with the Mueller probe. And as we mentioned, Donald Trump is hosting the Czech Prime Minister. The two men actually have quite a bit in common.
PHILIP: They do. As you mentioned, both very wealthy and controversial in their own right, but President Trump in this visit is spending a lot of
time here with that Prime Minister this afternoon at the White House at a time when the President is really under siege on all fronts. We've been
talking for many, many months about the controversy surrounding the Mueller probe and Michael Cohen and everything around that. But President Trump
has also done a lot to encourage European leaders who are similar to him either in tone or in substance in terms of their right-leaning policies,
especially around issues like immigration and around national sovereignty. So that's the kind of thing President Trump has been trying to do as
President, is bring some of these world leaders into the fold, especially if they bear a lot of similarities to his own governing style.
GORANI: Sure. Some of his top officials have visited with Hungary. This is the Czech Republic. Also, Poland was the first international stop for
the U.S. President. All these countries have leaders that have expressed similar anti-immigrant views as the President. You mentioned that the
President was asked questions about Cohen and possibly Manafort. This was in the oval office spray, as it's called, after his meeting with the Czech
Prime Minister, but did not reply.
PHILIP: It's not clear what exactly was asked of the President. The reporters literally just came out of the room as we started talking a few
Minutes ago, but my understanding is that he did not answer any questions at all. Usually at these sprays, they give sort of -- they exchange
pleasantries and give an opening statement, and my understanding is that the President simply didn't respond to any shouted questions as he was
walking -- as he was in the room and White House staff ushered reporters out of the room, which often happens.
[14:05:00] As you know, the President often does answer questions when they're shouted at him. This time he did not.
GORANI: Well, Abby, I know that we started talking to you just as the reporters filed out. We'll have an opportunity, I think, to see that on
tape, whatever was said in the oval office with the Czech Prime Minister. Thanks very much. Abby Philip there in the briefing room at the White
House. Let's get more legal perspective here on a host of things, both the Cohen news and Manafort news. First of all, the announcement that Michael
Cohen is going to sue the Trump organization because he says he was not paid for some of the work he did. What's your reaction to that?
ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So, the underlying dispute here is sort of a fairly common dispute over what we call indemnity, meaning does a company
need to pay for those attorney's fees. Michael Cohen claims the Trump Organization has a contractual obligation to pay. A lot of times that
comes down to be the employee, Michael Cohen, acting within or outside of the scope of his work for the company. Here it's going to be hard to tell,
right? Who knows exactly what the Trump organization's ultimate scope was and what Michael Cohen was doing? I think on a deeper level, if you look
at the complaint, it almost reads like an advocacy piece directed at Donald Trump. For example, the complaint that Michael Cohen filed talks about the
payments to Stormy Daniels, to Karen McDougal, characterizes them as campaign relate the contributions, which of course the Trump people
disagree with vehemently. So, it's sort of operating on two levels here.
GORANI: Does he have a case?
HONIG: It's going to come down to whether he was acting within his scope of employment with the Trump org. Now, what was the Trump org's role in
the campaign? Gray area. What was Mike Cohen's role within the Trump org in the campaign? Another gray area.
GORANI: And Shimon Prokupecz is outside that Virginia Federal Courthouse where Manafort will be sentenced soon. This happens in about an hour and a
half's time. What's the expectation? Because he faces here up to, I understand, 24 years in prison.
SHIMON PROKUPESZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: Reporter: Yes, he's facing a significant amount of time, Hala. When you think about it, he's
69 years old, about to be 70 in just a few weeks. So, any significant jail time, prison time that he gets is going to essentially be a life sentence.
He's going to come here from jail. He's been sitting in jail during this trial, while he awaits his sentencing. He'll face the judge. We'll
probably hear from Paul Manafort today in a last-ditch effort to try and plead his case, try and hope for some leniency from the judge so that
perhaps he's not going to face the 25 years. This is just one of the cases that he's facing a substantial amount of prison time. Remember, there's
another case out of Washington, D.C., where he's facing perhaps another ten years. So, we'll see. It's going to be obviously a big day for Paul
Manafort and his legal team.
GORANI: And Shimon, we're going to go to the White House. The President is speaking.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have a very good relationship with the Czech Republic and the United States. We do a lot of
trade and a lot of just about everything you could imagine. But I just want to say, Mr. Prime Minister, it's a great honor to have you. Thank you
very much.
ANDREJ BABIS, PRIME MINISTER OF THE CZECH REPUBLIC: Thank you. Thank you.
TRUMP: Please.
BABIS: So, Mr. President Trump, thank you very much for your warm welcome to the White House. It's a great pleasure for me and my wife to be here.
Our countries have been alliances since the United States helped establish our first Republic 100 years ago. And it's a very symbolic day today, Mr.
President, because today it's the birthday of our first President. He, by the way, was happily married to an American. So, we commemorate our
joining 20 years ago. Our soldiers fighting alongside U.S. soldiers against international terrorists. The Czech Republic is a small country, a
great country, and the sixth safest in the world.
[14:10:00] This year we celebrate 30 years since the revolution when the Czech people finally gained democracy and freedom. Since the revolution
when the Czech people finally gained democracy and freedom. So Czech people are grateful, with unlimited potential. Our bilateral relationships
are growing. Our investors are investing in U.S. and already created thousands of jobs. Mr. President, I watched your 2019 state of the union
address, and I perfectly understand your plan, how to make America great again. I have a similar plan to make the Czech Republic great again. So,
I look forward for discussion about international trade and safety, cyberattacks and illegal immigration and of course international terrorism.
So, thank you again for hosting us.
TRUMP: Well, thank you very much. It really is an honor. It's a great country. It is a very creative country. We're working on cyber and many
other things together. And working very well. So, I just want to thank you both for being with us, and on behalf of the first lady -- and you did
a great job this morning, I understand, at the state department. Melania was very well received this morning by a lot of people. So, thank you very
much. Thank you, everybody. Thank you very much. Thank you, all, very much.
GORANI: All right. The U.S. President there hosting the Czech Prime Minister. They're quite similar men. Billionaires, some controversy over
their businesses, have expressed anti-immigrant views. It's the 30th anniversary of the velvet revolution, something that the Prime Minister has
mentioned in the last few days. Donald Trump, though, has criticized the Czech Republic's spending on the Military, that it's not 2 percent of GDP,
does not reach that threshold. So that's something he's criticized, but both men seem to be getting along. He did not answer a question on Michael
Cohen. Quick last question to Elie. As we mentioned there with Shimon Prokupecz, this is not the last time that Paul Manafort is sentenced
because there's a whole other case next week which could also see a very tough day for him. He could get many, many more years in a completely
separate case.
HONIG: Yes, so first of all, I don't expect Manafort to get 25 years today. He faces more exposure today than he will next week. Whatever he
gets next week could be on top of today, but it's important to understand the way that our federal sentence works is there's a guidelines range,
which has been calculated in this case to a little over 19 years to a little over 24 years. But as of about 15 years ago, judges now have the
freedom to sentence outside that range. They have to consider it, but they can take into account all the other factors. I think here, while there's
no reason of any sympathy for what Manafort did, as Shimon said, he's almost 70 years old. He's had health issues. He has no prior offenses.
So, I'd look for the judge to come out somewhere in the sort of low double digits of years. I predicted 12 to 14 years for Manafort today.
GORANI: And quick last one, could the President pardon him in this case?
HONIG: He certainly has the power to. I don't think he will, at least not until the 20 election. I think there's too much political risk to doing
so. Look, Paul Manafort can't cooperate anymore. He's lied too many times. He can't really hurt the President. So just from a self-interest
perspective, I don't see a reason why Trump would do that.
GORANI: Elie, as always, thanks so much for joining us.
HONIG: Thanks, Hala.
GORANI: The giant Chinese telecoms company Huawei is fighting back against the U.S. it's filing a lawsuit that bars government agencies from using its
products and services. Huawei says there's no proof to support it has ties with the Chinese government itself, and there's no proof this is
jeopardizing U.S. national security. Richard quest has been looking into the case. You'll be covering this on "Quest Means Business" next hour. Do
they have a case? Do they have a chance here in court to win this?
[14:15:03] RICHARD QUEST, CNN HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": The case is based on constitutional grounds that it's unfair that the law that the U.S.
has, has not given them due process and they've not been able to put a case. Most legal experts think it's going nowhere. The precedents are
against them, but that's not really what this is about. This is not really about hoping to win. This is about getting Huawei into the court of public
opinion. A high-profile case against the U.S. by the company will be covered, and they will be able to advance the argument.
GORANI: This is the battle for the future of telecoms, of 5g, of where we go, of which devices we buy, of who controls this market. This is the
future. And the western countries are behind.
QUEST: They are behind, but not that far, according to some people. They are behind, Huawei's got a lead, but remember it doesn't act in isolation.
A lot of the Huawei technology will rely on technology from the United States. It's not as if they can all go it alone. But more importantly,
the way in which different governments are now having to negotiate is very delicate. When Mike Pence basically tells everybody to hold the checks,
don't invest in Huawei, well, now the British are saying, we're thinking of using Huawei with safeguards. The U.S. says there are no safeguards. This
is simmering nicely.
GORANI: But it's interesting because the Czech Republic Prime Minister is at the White House. This is a country that has forbidden its telecoms
companies from using Huawei with the blessing of the United States.
QUEST: And it was the Hungarians, I beg your pardon, Mike Pence was talking about. And each country will have to make the decision whether or
not -- what's the downside to going against the U.S. on Huawei? That's the fundamental thing. Australia, New Zealand, the UK, they're all having to
make that decision, and they will change their Minds.
GORANI: What is the downside?
QUEST: The downside is the U.S. switch turns you off.
GORANI: It's the same in the banking industry. There are rules and regulations that the U.S. requests non-U.S. banks to follow. They don't
really have a choice.
QUEST: No, they don't. They'll cut you off. But this is in a sense slightly --
GORANI: No, it's different but similar. What I mean is the influence of the United States is so great in these industries that you cannot afford to
--
QUEST: The big one is the five is. If four of the five decide to go against the United States, which is unlikely, then what will the U.S. do?
Because that is the backbone of the western intelligence.
GORANI: Is Huawei's technology a national security risk to countries like the United States, Australia, New Zealand, the Czech Republic, whoever?
QUEST: There is no definitive answer. As long as some like the U.S. say it is, others like the British say it's manageable, which suggest that it
is, others like the Australians or New Zealand say they're not going with it.
GORANI: All right. I'm sure you'll be covering this extensively next hour.
QUEST: Have you got a Huawei phone?
GORANI: I mean, no. Why?
QUEST: Would you not have one because you're worried about security issues?
GORANI: You know what, I honestly don't know. I don't know. I don't know the answer to that. And probably not, I think. I think I'm quite careful
with security in terms of what I use my phone to -- what kind of platforms I use. I certainly would never e-mail anything confidential or anything
like that. Would you have one?
QUEST: If it was cheap and good, yes.
GORANI: Why not. All right. There you have it. Thanks very much. Richard, we'll see you next hour.
A lot more to come. The Windsors take on the web. How the British royals are taking action against online abuse, and it involves Meghan Markle.
And later, why Brexit is being blamed for long lines in Paris train stations even though Brexit has not happened yet. We'll explain after
this.
([14:20:00] COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: When Meghan Markle married Prince Harry on a sparkling spring day, it felt like a fairy tale had come true, but it turned out in their fairy
tale, there would be trolls. Trolls that weren't hiding in caves or under bridges but behind their keyboards at home. Trolls ready to post racist
and offensive abuse online. Now the palace is saying enough. Max Foster is here with that. Hi, Max.
MAX FOSTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT AND HOST: Yes, the abuse has been going on for a while, but it feels as though the palace has got to a point where
they've had enough. Honestly, the Duchess of Sussex at the sharp end of this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: One of the most talked about women of our time, a fashion icon.
And role model, earning her this homage from pop royalty. The Duchess of Sussex bringing something completely new to the top of the British
establishment. Yet, from the moment their relationship became public, Prince Harry and former American actress Meghan Markle detected racial and
sexist undertones in parts of the press. There were the references to the Duchess' rich and exotic DNA, how her family had gone from cotton slaves to
royalty, and this piece suggesting the Los Angeles native was almost straight out of Compton, a reference to a song by NWA. The authors of
these stories deny racism, but the couple saw underlying prejudice, which they articulated with this palace statement from 2016, calling out the
racial undertones of comment pieces and the outright sexism and racism of social media trolls and web article comments. A typical example is the
ongoing narrative that the Duchess of Sussex is at war with her sister-in- law, the Duchess Of Cambridge. This is based on just one report in a respected newspaper that Meghan made Kate cry at a bridesmaid dress fitting
just before last year's wedding, and even that story is disputed by the palace. The two women have endured constant comparisons.
GORANI: Essentially Kate is no deviation of the norm. She's very much the quintessential sort of British girl next door.
FOSTER: Where Kate's now celebrated for wearing an off-the-shoulder dress, Meghan is accused of breaking royal protocol. When Meghan wears dark nail
polish, she breaks royal protocol again, with vulgar fashion move. The comparisons are as awkward for Kate as they are for Meghan.
GORANI: She's very much what you envisage when you think of the wed Princess. Frankly, she's white. Someone like Meghan is very much a
deviation. She's foreign, not just by being American, but she's got black heritage. She's a divorcee. She's a very different type of person and
somebody that I don't think your average British member of the public sort of thinks of when they think of the word Duchess or royal family at all.
FOSTER: A CNN royal source accepts the Duchesses aren't best friends. They may not hang out or call each other, but they are friendly and text.
Stories about a rift are just click bait, the source adds. But it's that click bait that online trolls are linking to and using against Meghan.
[14:25:00] On Twitter, we investigated the most commonly used anti-Meghan hashtags from the beginning of January to the Middle of February. In
total, we analyzed 5,204 tweets and discovered 20 accounts were behind 70 percent of the posts. Their profile descriptions typically contain Meghan-
related hashtags like "Mexit" but also political hashtags, such as Brexit and MAGA, make America great again. We don't know how many people are
behind the accounts, and we found no evidence of a coordinated right-wing campaign against the Duchess. But --
GORANI: Meghan Markle fits into this bigger idea of a west and the U.K. in decline. Here it's symbolized by Meghan, who kind of corrupts this old
institution of the Buckingham Palace.
FOSTER: CNN has been told the trolling escalated when the Duchess announced her pregnancy. That was at the beginning of the high-profile
tour of Australia. They had to spend more time blocking accounts and reporting abuses.
YOMI ADEGOKE, JOURNALIST AND AUTHOR: There's definitely an unspoken interest in what the baby will look like. You know, there's been a lot of
talk on Twitter, not just from racists, but also from people that are have pro Meghan about recessive genes, whether the baby will have an afro, its
mother's nose. There's all these coded conversations happening about what the baby will look like. It sort sounds of really horrible to think, but a
lot of people have sort of offered up the idea that the blacker the baby looks, the worse its treatment will be.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: Our royal source tells us they even have to pre-block the "n" word on Instagram, plus emojis of knives and guns.
GORANI: And Max, we don't know where these accounts originate from, but I find it interesting that 70 percent of all these online attacks come from
just a handful of accounts. But why -- I guess maybe I'm asking this the wrong way. Why does the royal family care this abuse is happening online?
What is the concern?
FOSTER: I think the concern is that they're allowing a platform -- Prince William, for example, has done a lot on cyberbullying. They're allowing a
platform. What happens is on Twitter, for example, people troll you. If you respond, it Might just be a small group, it shouldn't have much impact.
But if you respond, all of your audience is then engaged in their conversation. So, they are using positive Meghan hashtags as well to get
the attention of Meghan fans to interact with them. They'll be interacting with the royal correspondents as well to try to get their message out.
GORANI: Yes, I mean, I guess for me, a long time ago I completely stopped interacting with people and muted all of them. A lot of the abuse I got I
don't see anymore. And I just -- by doing that, I felt like it took -- it really just took the oxygen out of the whole process.
FOSTER: It's tempting to respond, isn't it? What they're saying is if you give them a platform, there's a small group -- if it was a huge group,
maybe it would be different. But this is a small group, very targeted, know exactly what they're doing. There's a reference to MAGA there. Are
they really part of a right-wing conspiracy? Were they just trying to get attention?
GORANI: Some of them are just agitators, provocateurs, racists. They want attention. That's how they get it. By the way, the Queen has posted her
first Instagram.
FOSTER: Sticking with a social media theme. It is quite interesting. When she sent her first tweet, we were there. She didn't actually send it.
The press release was interesting today saying she did actually touch the screen of the iPad.
GORANI: The royal finger.
FOSTER: I think what they're saying is, you know, this is a woman on the cutting edge of technology. If you go back to her coronation, a speech
when she was 21 where she really defined her monarchy. She did that on radio. She invited cameras into her coronation. She did the first fly on
the wall documentary. She sent the first e-mail. I think it was in 1976. The way she's managed to stay relevant and in touch with her subjects is by
using the media all along.
GORANI: We have it there, the Instagram post. If we could put it back up. What did she post? It's a letter.
FOSTER: It is a letter. I have to get this right because she was very specific about what it was and her relevance to it. It was a letter from
the 19th century inventor and mathematician Charles Babbage to Prince Albert, one of her relatives. What's interesting is the Queen has always
used media and invited the media in to try to stay relevant. The younger royals are now left in this situation where they have this big media
presence and actually what they're trying to do is control it and push the media back again. So, I think there's two sides. It's actually the Queen
has set up a lot of these privacy issues. Back in the '60s when she did this fly on the wall documentary, she was accused of letting the media in
too far. She was shown frying sausages in Scotland, for example. Since then, she's pushed back a bit. William's argument would be once you let
them in, you can't get them back out. He learned that from his mother.
GORANI: But the royal family needs to stay up to date, needs to stay relevant. After all, it needs the support of its people.
FOSTER: It does.
GORANI: To maintain a certain amount of legitimacy, of a reason to exist. How do you do that? It's tough.
FOSTER: So, walkabouts, for example, were invented and popularized by the Queen. She would invite cameras along to film them deliberately. That was
to show her amongst the public. So, she wasn't this Princess, this Queen in an ivory tower. She was amongst the people. And she wasn't always
doing it to meet people. She was doing it to be seen on the news amongst the people. Instagram is part of that as well, and part of the people from
perception.
HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: Sure, and she signed her post. She signed it --
FOSTER: Well --
GORANI: Elizabeth Regina. Thanks very much, Max Foster. Still to come tonight, profoundly sorry. A U.K. minister is forced to apologize after a
controversial comment about the troubles in Northern Ireland. We are live in Dublin. And the Canadian Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau, blames an
erosion of trust as scandal threatens his image. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: There have been many, many warnings over what disruption could be cause when and if Brexit takes place in 22 days. Now, people traveling on
the Eurostar between France and Britain are facing long, long lines in Paris, and it is being blamed on Brexit already. Why? Because of a French
custom strike that officials say is to show just how bad things could get after the U.K. leaves the E.U. Let's get more on this. Jim Bittermann is
in Paris. So, what are they doing differently? They're taking longer to process to stamp passports and process passengers? And so, they're trying
to illustrate that if there's a no-deal Brexit that will happen?
JIM BITTERMANN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Exactly, Hala. That's exactly it. That's called work to rule. The agents are out there
enforcing every single little item that they can, taking a look at everything. The door where the Eurostar leaves from was tied up today.
For the passengers, that was hours of delay, but even worse perhaps is what's happening at the (INAUDIBLE), where there were trucks blocked,
hundreds and of hundreds of trucks had to pull off the side of the road to wait for customs inspections because once again, they were inspecting every
single truck.
Now, normally they just do that kind of thing on a spot basis. We were up there about a week or so ago, and we watched them inspecting trucks. It's
the kind of thing they just do here and there with the trucks. They don't really check every single truck. But, now with the idea, the advent of a
no-deal Brexit with the possibility that Britain is going to crash out of the European Union, then they may just have to inspect every single truck
like they used to do 25 years ago. Essentially, re-establishing the border control of 25 years ago. Hala?
GORANI: But I wonder -- I know they say they're strictly applying, you know, the rules and regulations and checks that went away with the European
Union, but would it really be that bad for a long period of time? I mean, are they just trying to make a point by making the worst-case scenario come
to life?
[14:35:07] BITTERMANN: Well, Hala, the head of the union, the Customs Agents Union, said we're simply not ready for this. The administration has
waited too long. And of course, one of the things that he says that they need is more money. So, there's a salary issue connected with this as
well. The government says it's hired 700 new customs agents.
Now, they haven't all been trained up, and they didn't pull the trigger on this worst-case scenario for Brexit until the middle of January. Because
back then, everybody was thinking, well, maybe there would be a deal. Now, it's looking like they acted a little too late because they're still
building the parking lots for the trucks. They're still training the 700 customs agents that they hired. So, it is perhaps a little too little too
late at this stage. Hala.
GORANI: Jim Bitterman, thanks very much, live in Paris. The U.K.'s Northern Ireland secretary says she's "profoundly sorry" after saying that
deaths caused by security forces during the troubles were not crimes. Karen Bradley is facing calls to resign the comments she made in the House
of Commons. Here is exactly what she said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAREN BRADLEY, MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT OF UNITED KINGDOM: Over 90 percent of the killings during the troubles were at the hands of terrorists. Every
single one of those was a crime. The few of them, 10 percent, at the hands of the military and police, were not crimes, they were people acting under
orders and under instruction and fulfilling their duties in a dignified and appropriate way.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, to say the least, this caused just a bit of controversy. Nick Robertson is in Dublin. So, here you have the Northern Ireland
secretary saying that none of the security forces ever committed any crimes when it came to their actions against people in Northern Ireland, even when
it was, for instance, civilians protesting, like the bloody Sunday killings and that type of thing. Obviously, the reaction was swift.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Reaction was very swift. And just to put this into context for our viewers, she talked about
90 percent of the killings being as a result of terrorists, 10 percent as a result of security services, police and army. There were, across the 30
years of troubles, about few and a half thousand killings. To give context there, that would be, you know, some 300 deaths -- more than is what she's
talking about. So, the condemnation has been swift, in particular coming from the Nationalist Community.
Sinn Fein Politicians calling it outrageous and offensive. Families of people who were killed by British forces also have come out very quickly to
call it offensive. Sinn Fein say that they believe this is an indication that the British government is going to stop the convictions of British
soldiers who were charged and accused with some of those killings. The Irish prime minister, whose office is right behind me here, has called it
offensive. He said he's met with many of those victims in the past and he believes this is offensive to them.
Karen Bradley herself has tried to sort of paper over, if you will, and make good, repair some of the damage in the face of all the criticism.
What she has said, and I'll read it here, she said: "Yesterday, I made comments regarding the actions of soldiers during the troubles. I want to
apologize. I am profoundly sorry for the offense and hurt that my words have caused. The language was wrong. And even though this was not my
intention, it was deeply insensitive to many of those who lost loved ones." But the timing in many ways couldn't be worse.
The tensions around Brexit, but not only that, next week the British government is expecting to have a ruling on the deaths of 13 people,
innocent civilians, who were shot by British soldiers in Bloody Sunday, 1972 in London (INAUDIBLE) in Northern Ireland. This has been a painful
issue over decades. So, this comes on the eve of that. The timing could not be worse for so many reasons right now.
GORANI: All right, Nick Robertson live in Dublin. Thanks very much. Well, he's a liberal icon recognized around the world, but the Canadian
prime minister is not immune from political controversy. A corruption scandal is threatening to tarnish his progressive image. Justin Trudeau
has had to come out to deny the crux of the legations essentially that he pressured his former justice minister to go easy on a construction company
accused of bribery. He's calling the debacle that's led to two top ministers resigning, a failure to communicate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JUSTIN TRUDEAU, PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA: What has become clear, through the various testimonies is that over the past months, there was an erosion
of trust between my office and specifically my former principle secretary and the former minister of justice and attorney general. I was not aware
of that erosion of trust. As prime minister and leader of the federal ministry, I should have been.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[14:40:17] GORANI: Well, our Nick Watt is following development on this. He joins us now from Los Angeles. So, Justin Trudeau is saying he's sorry,
but he's not going as far as saying there was any wrong doing here, it seems.
NICK WATT, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No, it was kind of a half- tepid apology. He said that, you know -- he also said that his attorney general should have reached out to him and he's sorry she didn't do that.
But listen, there are a number of reasons why this is a big story. For a start, Justin Trudeau was so popular. And as you say, he was recognized
around the world as a kind of progressive icon. I mean, listen, he was on the front cover of G.Q. Magazine as some kind of sex symbol.
He's now on the front cover of Canada's biggest political magazine with the word "imposter" written under his face. Now, the issue here is that he and
his office allegedly put some pressure on the attorney general to cut a deal with this company because this company employs a lot of Canadians.
And so, what they were trying to do, it appears, is get this company to pay a fine rather than have a criminal conviction, because if they were
convicted criminally, they would be banned from secured government contracts for ten years and that would be a problem for the jobs market in
Quebec.
Now, the other optics here that are not great is the attorney general was a woman, she was an indigenous Canadian, and the other government minister
that has also resigned stating her dissatisfaction with the way Trudeau's handled this, she was also a woman. So, the optics are very, very bad
here. And the conservative opposition, they are calling for Trudeau's head. They're saying he can't continue to govern now that the Canadians
know what he's done and that he should do the honorable thing and resign. Hala?
GORANI: And that was going to be my question because he's seen by -- especially those who dislike Donald Trump and the MAGA crowd, they see
Justin Trudeau as kind of the opposite of Trump, somebody who doesn't have issues with scandals or any kind of, you know, activities that could be
considered, perhaps not completely above board. Is this hurting him politically in Canada, his popularity?
WATT: Yes, it's absolutely hurting him because, you know, part of his image was also as a kind of clean government crusader. You know, put aside
all the fact that, you know, he and his wife were being hailed as the new Kennedys. He was a clean government crusader and also for equality. You
know, that was his thing. And as you say, listen, if this was a scandal south of the border here in the U.S., it may have been over by lunchtime,
but not in Canada.
And it is really, really hurting him. At the moment, most people within the liberal party are sticking by him, and that is crucial. But listen,
there are elections coming up in the fall and polls I was reading this morning suggests that if the election was tomorrow, Trudeau's party would,
in fact, lose. So, here is the issue: if the liberal party begins to see him as, perhaps, an election liability rather than an election asset, then
from within the party, they may say, listen, Justin, it's time for you to go. Hala.
GORANI: All right. We'll see how that develops. Nick Watt, thanks very much. Check us out on Facebook, Facebook.com/halagoranicnn; and check out
my Twitter feed as well @HalaGorani.
Still to come, an about face for Facebook? The social network that's been accused of over sharing trying to reinvent itself. Should we believe Mark
Zuckerberg? Next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:45:48] GORANI: Facebook says, it's facing its privacy problem head on after months of reports about data breaches and privacy scandals. Mark
Zuckerberg has laid out a new vision for the social network, saying he wants to make it privacy focused. Samuel Burke is here to explain. So,
some people, many people, I think, would be quite skeptical. Because, I mean, the whole point of privacy is that -- of Facebook, I should say, is
that it thrives on collecting data from its users.
SAMUEL BURKE, CNN BUSINESS & TECH CORRESPONDENT: What Mark Zuckerberg is predicting here is something that's already started happening. People are
sharing less publicly and using direct, private messages on secure platforms much more. So, what he's saying is we're going to make it so
that you can direct message somebody from Instagram to WhatsApp to Facebook, any one of those platforms you can just message with each other,
but it will be encrypted. You're having quite a reaction to that. It's counterintuitive, isn't it?
GORANI: What, that you could message people from one platform to the next and guarantee that it's encrypted?
BURKE: And this is exactly why the skeptical look on your face that I think that this is a hard sell for people to buy. Even Mark Zuckerberg
admitted that when it comes to privacy -- well, let me read you exactly what he said here, because I think he's having somewhat a similar reaction:
"I do understand that many people don't think Facebook can or would even want to build this kind of privacy focused platform because, frankly, we
don't currently have strong reputation for building privacy protective services."
But this is part of a larger move across tech, whether it's Apple, Tim Cook has long been a champion of this. People realize, it's all these questions
that people are putting out there about government spying, China, Huawei, those accusations that privacy has a real value, a real market value. And
Mark Zuckerberg realizes that and wants a piece of the pie. But whether people will trust, and at the same time while he's rolling out this service
that will allow you to work between all the messengers together, well that's a totally different question.
GORANI: So that's definitely happening?
BURKE: We'll he's going to try and make that happen, though a lot of people might argue that the European Union might stop him from doing that
because of the data sharing laws.
GORANI: I can guarantee you that if Mark Zuckerberg makes all these platforms interconnected in some way, that people will not trust that it's
encrypted anymore and WhatsApp will certainly suffer.
BURKE: I do take him at his word that he believes that this is the right move to make businesswise, and this is what people yearn for. But to
announce at the very same time that you can WhatsApp somebody, to Instagram, that it might all be interconnected will certainly illicit a
reaction like Hala Gorani's face.
GORANI: Well, yes, but the thing is WhatsApp is not the only platform. You have Telegram, you have other platforms. It's not like they're the
only game in town.
BURKE: Absolutely.
GORANI: So, what about the idea potentially that Facebook could look at charging people? I mean, they've always said -- Zuckerberg has always said
it will stay free forever.
BURKE: I think it will stay free, but the big question is now: how will they earn money if there's less of an emphasis on the news feed, which is
one of the most profitable entities ever? Where are they going to make money? So, I just want to put up on my screen, my three takeaways from
this whole situation, because they're not going to drop the news feed, but if they're going to make money from messengers, they have to move more into
commerce and payments -- which a lot of companies like We Chat have already done in places like Asia. But more encryption would be bad for law
enforcement, so he's going to get -- well, they're going to be upset with him again.
And Facebook is lessening its chance of succeeding in China. And Hala, this is really all about China. Who will have the dominion over the
Internet? The U.S. companies or the Chinese tech companies, and that's why people are looking more and more toward private platforms. I mean, you
post a lot less on social, and I see you much more on your private accounts in pseudo accounts than before. I think part of it is because WhatsApp
groups have become such a thing now, and so you have your target audience for each post. Because when you use to post on Facebook, it would be seen
-- I mean, unless you had silos, your friends on the different groups.
BURKE: I'm not in any of your WhatsApp groups. It's just the two of us.
GORANI: Just the two of us. But listen, to another tech titan, Tim Cook, head of Apple.
BURKE: Is that his name?
GORANI: Tim Cook -- it's not that difficult to remember a name like Tim Cook, which is why this moment took some by surprise.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Tim, you got to start doing it over here, and you have -- I mean, you've really put a big investment in
our country, we appreciate it very much, Tim Apple.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: This is not a political thing. It's just funny. Obviously, he didn't call him Tim Facebook or you know. He's the head of Apple.
[14:50:12] BURKE: I'm always afraid that I'll accidently say Steve Jobs or something like, you know, the former, the founder who's no longer with us.
GORANI: And Cook didn't appear to take offense, apparently. He even changed his Twitter name to Tim Apple.
BURKE: I saw that in his Twitter account.
GORANI: Check it out.
BURKE: There -- so you see Tim plus the Apple sign. It's funny because Ivanka Trump even retweeted something from "The Daily Show" where they're
kind of making fun of this. So, it's good to see she has a sense of humor.
GORANI: And late-night comics were quick to point out that this wasn't the first time Donald Trump got someone's name wrong. "The Daily Show" tweeted
under the title "name that person."
BURKE: It goes through all the times you can hear him saying the wrong name and then they correct it with the right name.
GORANI: All right. Well, we don't have the audio on that. Thank you -- oh.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: And C.J. He said call me either one.
GORANI: All right. We're going to leave it there. Thank you very much.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Nick, come here. Where's Nick?
Was checking sensors on the Clinton's and Chilton's ranch.
And what we saw at Pleasure, (INAUDIBLE). We just saw -- we just left Pleasure.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: You may recall a week ago that CNN presented a shocking documentary about child slavery in Ghana. The report by Nema Elbagir
garnered international attention. It showed children as young as 5-years- old forced to work as slaves in the fishing industry. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: In Ghana, the minimum age for workers is 15, but the law is rarely enforced. And the
practice of buying children is widespread. The U.S. State Department reports nearly a third of all the homes here contain a child who's been
trafficked.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, this is one of the boys we rescued a year ago. Junior was living with a parent, and he lost the father. 6-year-old boy
working on the lake.
ELBAGIR: (INAUDIBLE) says, Junior's mother was destitute while trying to care for eight children as a widow. She says, she sold junior as a last
resort. The only boy in the family who could work.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, the government of Ghana says it was shocked, by this CNN report and says and promises that it will be taking action. Becky Anderson
spoked with Ghana's Information Minister.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KOJO OPPONG NKRUMAH, INFORMATION MINISTER OF GHANA: It's a heartbreaking story, and it's a matter of concern for the government and the people of
Ghana. That's why in recent years, we have been taking some steps aimed at first having a framework within which we can tackle it; second specific
actions that are aimed rescuing the victims, rehabilitating them, reintegrating them into society; prosecuting persons responsible. And then
thirdly putting in place the long-term solutions that deals with the real causes of a challenge like this.
BECKY ANDERSON, CNN ANCHOR: Can I get confirmation from you that you acknowledge the severity of this issue and that you are absolutely
committed to concrete action, to ensure that these children will no longer be slaves and there will not be a problem on Lake Volta going forward?
[14:55:08] NKRUMAH: Yes, Becky. The entire world and the people of Ghana, most in particular the victims of this, have utmost assurance that it is a
matter, that as I started, which breaks our hearts, and we are committed to assuring that the resources that we've started making available this year
will be improved as the years go by, and that we'll be able to tackle this problem comprehensively. We acknowledge the severity and are willing and
committed to put the resources behind it to get the results we are looking for.
ANDERSON: CNN would be happy to come back to Ghana and witness and report on those actions if they are carried out. Will we be welcome?
NKRUMAH: We would like the CNN crew to come back and work with us back on the lake to also examine at first hand some of the efforts that we are
putting into dealing with a situation like this. We all have to raise awareness, and so we're very happy to have you on board as part of the
solutions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, one last note on all this. Exactly one week from now is the third annual My Freedom Day. CNN is partnering with young people around
the world for a student-led day of action against modern day slavery. This year we are asking, what makes you feel free? Singer/songwriter and a
record producer, Rocky Dawuni, who won the first Grammy -- as first Grammy nominee Ghana shared his answer with CNN.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROCKY DAWUNI, SINGER AND SONGWRITER: What makes me free is ability to express myself without fear. What makes me free is the ability to step up
and express how I feel without, you know, anybody stepping in and telling me I'm right or wrong. I think that freedom is something that's an
inalienable right of every person around the world. And so, for me, to be able to champion that and celebration, I also hope that for everybody.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, you can do the same and share your story using #MyFreedomDay. Thanks for watching. I'm Hala Gorani. A lot more ahead
after quick break. Richard Quest will join us here in the studio for "QUESTMAN'S BUSINESS."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
