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Hala Gorani Tonight
Parliament Debates Boris Johnson's Deal; U.S. Forces Withdraw From Syrian Border Towns Today; President Trump Questions Validity Of The Emoluments Clause; Trump Defends U.S. Withdrawal, Says It Could Lead To "Deal"; Government Approves Economic Reforms To Diffuse Tensions; FA Cup Abandoned After Alleged Racist Abuse; Prince Harry Confirms Tensions In Royal Family. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired October 21, 2019 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- platforms are doing enough to regulate what is transiting across their system.
I think Facebook wants to have it both ways. They want to be a platform where large numbers of people come together and they make money off of that
-- you know, advertising and the like -- but they don't want to take that step, understanding their platform is being used to manipulate public
opinion to try to help regulate that.
And there is a fair question about, well, who gets to decide what's the truth. But some of this information that you see -- and (INAUDIBLE)'s
great reporting, he's been covering this for so long -- some of this stuff is just garbage and you know that it's manipulation at play. But so far,
these social media platforms don't seem to want to step up and rock the boat, so to speak. And so this will continue.
UNIDENTIFED FEMALE: And a lot of Americans are thirsty --
HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: Hello, everyone. Happy Monday. Live from CNN London, I'm Hala Gorani.
Tonight, U.S. troops head to Iraq from northern Syria. CNN is on the ground, we'll be live.
Then, oh, yes, he did. The speaker tells the Johnson government there will be no vote on the prime minister's Brexit deal today.
And from Beirut to Chile to Hong Kong, demonstrators defy riot police and demand accountability from their leaders. Will they get it?
The schedule is now set for British lawmakers. The House of Commons is planning to debate the Brexit bill, beginning tomorrow, Tuesday. That's
after the Speaker of the House of Commons, John Bercow, ruled lawmakers will not vote on Boris Johnson's Brexit deal with Europe today. Here is
how he explained that decision.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN BERCOW, SPEAKER, BRITISH HOUSE OF COMMONS: In summary, today's motion is in substance the same as Saturday's motion, and the House has decided
the matter. Today's circumstances are in substance the same as Saturday's circumstances. My ruling is therefore that the motion will not be debated
today, as it would be repetitive and disorderly to do so.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, the speaker says the government could still try to get enough votes to ratify its Brexit deal, although that path forward could
open the prime minister's plan up to new amendments. If it sounds complicated, it's because it is complicated.
Nic Roberson is here in London with us. Nina dos Santos joins me from Brussels as well, with European reaction.
Nic, to you first. What are we seeing today? Will the prime minister get his vote on his Brexit deal, yes or no?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Well, the short answer is, in a pure version, no, not as it appears. Jacob Rees-Mogg, leader of
the House, just spoke, saying that he has -- to use (ph) technical jargon - - a motion in is name later, we'll be getting more details from him later.
But what he said was, he will -- the government will now allow amendments before the second reading. He said -- well, the implication of this is
that the government therefore doesn't get a pure up-and-down vote on the Brexit deal as they brought back from Brussels, because they're allowing
these amendments to be added --
GORANI: So make it different --
ROBERTSON: -- these --
GORANI: -- enough, different enough from the first. OK.
ROBERTSON: Different enough. And he said -- and he said parliamentarians will be able to put those amendments forward this evening.
GORANI: Right. OK. So follow-up to that. Does that make it more or less likely that his deal will get through Parliament?
ROBERTSON: When we hear Jacob Rees-Mogg lay this out in this way, clearly, the government has taken a view that this strategy rather than to deny
amendments before the second reading, is a better strategy.
And as Jacob Rees-Mogg said and we've just heard from -- also from Michael Gove, the minister in charge of making sure that all preparations are in
place for a no-deal Brexit, that they haven't heard back an answer to Boris Johnson's request to the European Union for an extension.
GORANI: Yes.
ROBERTSON: And from both of these very senior ministers close to Boris Johnson, he absolutely intends to continue to go for the October the 31st
deadline. So that's a long answer.
But the short answer is, when we hear the leader of the House lay out amendments to be added on prior to the second reading --
GORANI: Yes.
ROBERTSON: -- that implies that the government believes that's the best strategy to getting the deal done by the 32st of October.
GORANI: So far, their strategies have not worked. In the past, it has been defeat after defeat for the Johnson government. We'll see if this one
finally pans out for them.
Nina dos Santos, briefly to you in Brussels. First of all, will the E.U. 27 grant that extension if it comes to it?
NINA DOS SANTOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, there's one of two things that they're considering. First and foremost, they're also trying to ratify
that Brexit deal that they struck at the E.U. summit last week with Boris Johnson, just in case it manages to get through the House of Commons.
And then, contemporaneously at the E.U. Council level -- so that's the heads of state level -- they're also, via paper this time, not via an
emergency summit as had been predicted a few weeks ago -- they're also talking about whether or not the U.K. should be getting an extension.
What we know so far is that although Boris Johnson sent various letters to the E.U. and the one that he didn't sign was famously that request for an
extension, the E.U. is considering the fact that they've received this paperwork, signed or not, as a request for an extension. And as such, they
are considering it.
[14:05:16]
Now, whether or not the U.K. will get an extension will of course depend on the two big power players and the biggest economies in Europe, which is of
course Germany, which has indicated at various times over the last few days, that it may well be amenable to giving the U.K. perhaps a longer
extension to get its house in order.
And of course, France, that in the past has played hardball. We know that when it comes to France, the last time Boris Johnson and Emmanuel Macron
spoke was on Saturday, when of course we had that last vote that John Bercow referred to, Hala. And both of them appear to agree that it was in
nobody's interest to prolong things for longer than necessary. So that is the status quo, as of this evening -- Hala.
GORANI: All right. Nina dos Santos, thanks very much.
Status quo in Brussels. Richard Quest, host of "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS," obviously it's the status quo because they're holding a stronger hand here.
All they have to do is wait for all this chaos -- all this chaos to die down in the United Kingdom.
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: But you've got to see it from their point of view. They do not want to kick the U.K. out. They don't
want to be seen to kick the U.K. out, maybe that's a better way of putting it.
But the mood has definitely shifted with the other E.U. countries, and this is -- look, we want you to do what you need to do, but go and don't cause
any more damage. Let us get on with our business. That is what they are saying.
So, yes, there will be -- there will most certainly be an extension, whether it's three months, six months, a year. That will obviously depend
on how bad the situation is in London when they come to make the decision.
GORANI: So -- so you're saying, essentially, if there will be -- if -- from what you're saying, there will be an extension. The educated guess is
that Boris Johnson's deal will not get through Parliament?
QUEST: I think it's logistically very difficult for it to get through. It's got to --
GORANI: They're giving themselves three days.
QUEST: Right, but don't forget it's -- no, I'd (ph) say (ph) a bit more of (ph) out (ph) on last week, next week as well. But it's also got to go
through the House of Lords. And any substantial amendments would have to go back to be agreed with Brussels.
So you can't just tinker with this thing. Maybe you can around the edges, but you can't make fundamental changes, which is what the amendments will
do. And then you've got the House of Lords, which may change it. And then it's got to come back to the Commons. No, no. This is going to be a
legislative feat, if it was to be done that way.
GORANI: Can you explain to our viewers? I think they're confused.
QUEST: Yes.
GORANI: First, Saturday, we expected a vote on the -- meaningful vote on the deal, it didn't happen. Today, we expected potentially that it would
happen. The speaker said, no, it was tabled on Saturday, you can't have exactly a similar -- why is it -- why are there so many complications to
what should be a straightforward, here's my deal, yes or no?
QUEST: It should be.
GORANI: Yes.
QUEST: And that's what the prime minister would -- that's exactly what the prime minister would say. It should be. Let's ignore today. He should
never have brought it forward, he was never going to win today.
It should be a straightforward question. Do you want it, or don't you want it? But why is it so complicated? Because you have men and women in the
House of Commons who are fighting for things that they wanted for decades - -
GORANI: Yes.
QUEST: -- decades. Their entire political career. Those who want to leave, those who are passionately in favor of staying.
And what you're seeing is them using every weapon of parliamentary mass destruction that they can, to get their way.
GORANI: And it's still gridlocked. The issue here --
QUEST: Complete gridlock, complete.
GORANI: -- complete gridlock. The issue here is that this country is paralyzed.
QUEST: Yes.
GORANI: It's thinking of nothing else. It is --
QUEST: Yes, yes.
GORANI: -- doing nothing else. It is obsessed with this Brexit question. As a result, no other parliamentary business, really, is at the forefront.
Businesses and investors are -- have no clarity. This is a country that's harming itself. Forget Brexit. Brexit's almost not even the biggest
problem now, it's inaction.
QUEST: Right. But what Europe is afraid of is that if there's a no-deal Brexit, some of that paralysis will transmit itself across the English
channel. That's why Europe wants to ensure that the U.K. -- I do believe, now, there are many leaders in Europe who basically want to say to Britain,
go. Go with our good wishes. Sei (ph) gesund. Off you go.
GORANI: Yes.
QUEST: And in the long term, and we'll do a deal with you afterwards.
GORANI: And that's just the withdrawal agreement, not the trade talks --
QUEST: Yes.
GORANI: -- not bilateral trade talks with other economic zones or countries, so there's still a lot to be done.
TEXT: Brexit This Week Business Plan: Tuesday, Second Reading of the E.U. (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill; Commencement of Committee of the E.U.
(Withdrawal Agreement) Bill. Wednesday, Continuation of proceedings on the E.U. (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill. Thursday, Conclusion of proceedings
on the E.U. (Withdrawal Agreement) Bill. Friday, House will not be sitting.
QUEST: This is the only story I've covered in 35 years, where everybody says they've no idea how it's going to end.
GORANI: Right. Thank you very much. And, Richard, we'll see you at the top of the hour on "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS."
QUEST: Yes, thank you.
GORANI: For Kurds in Syria, it symbolized the ultimate act of betrayal. U.S. military vehicles rolled out of towns near the Turkish border today,
marking the biggest American pullout from the region to date. Kurds, furious over the abrupt withdrawal, pelted some vehicles with rotten
tomatoes and potatoes. One man, shouting that American troops are, quote, "running away like rats."
[14:10:03]
A small number of American troops will remain in Syria, but not to protect the Kurds, but to protect oil fields. Many have already crossed the border
into Iraq though, getting out of the way of a Turkish operation that is now on pause to give time to clear Kurdish fighters from northern Syria.
U.S. President Donald Trump defended his decision to withdraw just moments ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We never agreed to, you know, protect the Kurds. We fought with them for three and a half to four
years. We never agreed to protect the Kurds for the rest of their lives.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: The Kurds in Syria lost some 11,000 lives, fighting on the front lines against ISIS. That fact is not lost on the U.S. troops who just
withdrew from northern Syria, leaving their longtime allies behind. This powerful image speaks louder than words, showing a departing U.S. soldier,
wearing the badge of Kurdish female fighters on his sleeve.
CNN's Nick Paton Walsh is on the ground in northern Syria and has this firsthand account of the American withdrawal.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): They really didn't want to go, but had to all the same. Hundreds of U.S.
vehicles, rallying here near Hasakah, Sunday, before the drive north. Orders from thousands of miles away, given without warning, made this
messier than elite troops would have it.
PATON WALSH: This campaign, cut so abruptly short so perilously, and this exit, frankly, so hasty, a messy job for any military to have to undertake.
PATON WALSH (voice-over): And this is where the mess of U.S. policy towards Syria's Kurds will have to been cleaned up: A thousand men, left
out on their own here, once President Trump dropped the Syrian Kurds, mostly headed for the exit.
The amount (ph) of convoy woke us in the city of Qamishli. A mixed reception, Syrian Kurds aware these troops didn't choose to leave, but
having no other Americans to vent their rage at. Movements and aerial support, carried on until dawn.
The convoy rolled through the desert, out into neighboring Iraqi Kurdistan, not on their way home but to reposition, where they would have to continue
to fight against ISIS in Syria as it regroups, but from a much worse position. It's the enduring fault of this policy move. ISIS isn't
finished, and nobody's really coming home.
In this Qamishli hospital, Sara hasn't gone home yet either. She doesn't know yet that her brother Muhammad (ph) died in the same mortar attack,
allegedly by pro-Turkish forces, that also took her leg. She can't look at her missing limb without screaming, and tells those around her to stop
standing up.
Her mother, Nariman, blames herself for not leaving town earlier. My heart is in pain, she says. They took the light from my eyes, the candle in my
life is out forever.
What was out guilt? What did we do for this?
There is global anguish over the fate of Syrian Kurds. And Sara's plight has been well-publicized. But they and she are still here. Nobody has
come to help yet. She has toys aplenty, but a future the shape of which she cannot feel yet.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: Well, Nick joins me now, live from northern Syria with more. These U.S. troops, they were being pelted with rotten fruit and veg, Kurds
venting their anger, there, at the departing Americans.
PATON WALSH: Yes. I mean, I think it's fair to say that amongst the Kurds we've spoken to, there is an understanding that obviously, the troops who
have served on the ground here didn't autonomously decide to leave. But as you sit (ph) on that package, there isn't really Donald Trump here for them
to vent their anger towards.
There is an enormous sense of anger amongst Syrian Kurds at this betrayal of cause (ph), not necessarily because those wise amongst them didn't see a
moment coming when the American alliance would weaken. It's true, when Donald Trump said just then, they didn't offer to protect the Kurds for a
lifetime, that's true. This was a short-term alliance with mutual gain on both sides.
But nobody expected it to fall apart quite so ingloriously, quite so chaotically. Even for the U.S. troops on the ground, as it has done in the
last fortnight. It's been breathtaking to see Donald Trump to go from withdrawing 28 troops, as he says now, from the border areas, to a naval
Turkish incursion, to seeing the Turkish incursion rollercoaster its way through territory here, his troops having to leave, a ceasefire being
announced that nobody can really quite make sense of, that expires in just 20 hours or so from now -- sorry, 24 hours from now -- leaving people
deeply concerned about what comes next.
Yet still a commander in chief in the White House who says the Kurds are very happy and this has been an amazing outcome, even claiming a ceasefire
-- his own officials have told me is not holding -- is still going well -- Hala.
[14:15:00]
GORANI: Thank you, Nick Paton Walsh, live in northern Syria.
A little bit later in the program, I'll be speaking to a Kurdish representative of the Democratic Union Party. And I'll ask him for his
take on what's happening in northern Syria.
Still to come tonight, U.S. President Donald Trump goes on a rant over what he is calling a phony emoluments clause. This comes after his reversal of
the G7 summit plans at his own resort. We go live to Washington when we come back.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: George Washington, they say, has two desks. He had a presidential desk and a business desk. I don't think you people, with this phony
emoluments clause --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, also, Prince Harry makes a big admission in a television interview. We'll bring you that after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: Welcome back. Thanks for being with us this evening. U.S. President Donald Trump held a cabinet meeting for the first time since
House Democrats announced their impeachment inquiry.
And it went on for quite a while, and it was more of a rant, really, than a speech. He said Republicans need to remain unified and need to get tougher
as Democrats ramp up their impeachment attacks. He also blamed Democrats for the reversal of his G7 summit plan, at his golf resort.
He compared himself to other presidents that ran private businesses during their presidency, and he went back in history. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Other presidents were wealthy. Not huge wealth. George Washington was actually considered a very, very rich man at the time. But they ran
their businesses. George Washington, they say, had two desks. He had a presidential desk and a business desk.
I don't think you people, with this phony Emoluments Clause --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, CNN"s Jeremy Diamond is at the White House. And what else came out of this pretty remarkable meeting today?
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, Hala, we know that the president holds these cabinet meetings from time to time. And oftentimes,
he uses them as an opportunity to get cabinet members to sing his praises, he uses it as an opportunity to kind of tout whatever accomplishments he's
currently dealing with.
And today, the moment was really about, you know, fighting back against the criticism that he's been facing, and defending himself against that
criticism.
And on one of those fronts in particular, was with his decision to rapidly withdraw troops from Syria, and questions around whether or not he greenlit
this Turkish offensive against the U.S.' allies, the Kurds in Syria.
And the president was certainly doubling down on his decision to do so, insisting that it was the right choice, insisting, in fact, that if there
had not been a few days of fighting before this ceasefire agreement was reached, that there would not have been a ceasefire.
Of course, big questions about the effectiveness of that ceasefire, still very much in play. And also, questions about how much this ceasefire is
benefiting the U.S.' former allies, I guess we could say, the Kurds.
[14:20:05]
The president also faced questions about impeachment, of course, Hala. And on that front, the president was also once again defense and attacking
Democrats who are conducting this impeachment inquiry.
The president did have praise for Democrats on one front, however, insisting that they are sticking together and suggesting the Republicans
should perhaps take lessons from Democrats on that front. That, of course, as the president continues to face this rapidly advancing impeachment
inquiry. The president is certainly looking for Republicans to close ranks and to continue to support him in the face of that impeachment threat --
Hala.
GORANI: All right. Even though we're starting to see some very small hairline cracks, perhaps, within the party. Thanks very much, Jeremy
Diamond is at the White House.
All of this as new reports surface that acting chief of staff Mick Mulvaney was already on thin ice before all this impeachment drama even started.
And you'll remember at a White House press briefing, he suggested that there was quid pro quo in that phone call with the Ukrainian president --
between the Ukrainian president and the U.S. president, then backtracked. There are reports, the president is not happy with Mulvaney, was the acting
chief of staff.
Joining me now to discuss this is White House reporter Stephen Collinson. Is the acting chief of staff Mick Mulvaney on borrowed time?
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: I think, to be honest, Hala, everybody who ever goes into Trump's White House is on borrowed time. But
you're right that he's under increasing pressure. He appears to have developed this very un-Trumpian compulsion of blurting out the truth at
inopportune moments.
You mentioned the question of the quid pro quo with Ukraine that he came out with last week. This weekend, he was on "Fox News Sunday," one of the
Sunday shows in the United States. And he said that the president still looked at himself as in the hospitality industry.
Of course, the president is supposed to have walled himself off from his businesses. This all came up in the contents (ph) of the president's now-
aborted attempt to hold the G7 summit at his Florida resort next year.
So, definitely, Mulvaney's accidents on television aren't exactly helping his case. But at the same time, you have to ask, if the president were to
get rid of him, who at this point, after several disastrous weeks for the White House with the impeachment inquiry in full swing, would the president
get to come in and take his job if he did get rid of Mulvaney?
GORANI: Yes. And I wonder, you know the whole controversy surrounding the G7 -- the announcement that that G7 would be held next year at his Doral
Miami resort. That whole controversy, we -- first of all, before I get to that, let's listen to what the president had to say about backtracking over
holding the summit at Doral. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We'll look at other locations. I don't think it'll be as exciting, and I don't think it'll be as good. It'll cost the country a fortune
because it's very expensive. I know France had a budget of many, many millions of dollars, they just did it. They did a great job, by the way.
But France had a budget of many, many millions of dollars. It's going to cost, you know, a fortune for the country. I was willing to do it for
free.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: So he was willing to do it for free. I mean, it's still his property. it would still have to, you know, be compensated for the
services and the rooms and things like that.
But you did get the sense that Republicans were not standing behind the president? They were not coming out and publicly supporting him on this
decision?
COLLINSON: Right. I mean, maybe we've reached the sweet spot where Republicans will not suddenly and completely always line up with the
president.
I think we have to look at the context. The Republicans eventually, especially in the Senate, are going to be asked to save this presidency.
There have been weeks of damaging disclosures out of the impeachment inquiry, which make it pretty clear that the president was running an off-
the-books foreign policy operation in Ukraine for his own political profit.
Now, Republicans are going to have to find a way to defend him on that, and they probably will do. But the president, at the same time, is throwing
all these new things at them: the G7 issue, which was very embarrassing for many Republicans. The Syria issue, which many --
GORANI: Yes.
COLLINSON: -- Republicans deeply and vehemently opposed. So I think there is a limited tolerance among a lot of Republicans, to defend the president
on all of this stuff. And they're giving him pushback on that.
As you said before --
GORANI: But it's --
COLLINSON: -- I don't think we should necessarily confuse that with a fraying of the party's position on impeachment, even though everything that
Trump does --
GORANI: But -- yes.
COLLINSON: -- may increase the political price they pay to defend him.
GORANI: But that was going to be my question because they defended the president on family separations at the border, the proposed Muslim ban. I
mean, things that people who opposed the president and his critics considered to be egregious.
[14:25:05]
Yet on this they're drawing a line. Is it because there is a feeling now, perhaps, that when you look at polling, you know, not an unsignifcant
minority of Republicans support the impeachment inquiry. Is there a sense, now, that among even Republicans, there is fatigue with this president?
COLLINSON: I think, yes, there is fatigue with this president. I think Syria as a foreign policy issue is perhaps slightly different because I
don't think it really makes a huge difference to a lot of voters in the Republican base, that their Republican senator or their representative is
breaking with the president on this.
Breaking with the president on an issue like immigration or the economy or impeachment, something that is far more important to most voters, is a much
bigger bridge for a Republican who wants to keep their job, to cross. So I think that is where you have the difference here. The G7, I just think, is
an instance where Republicans are frustrated that the president just feels like he can push them as far as he likes.
I mean, most presidents in this situation would do everything they can not to annoy the Republicans senators who are going to have to save them and
save their presidency. Trump's instinct is to push on everything all of the time, and I think that's where the fatigue you mentioned might come in.
GORANI: Right, all right. Thanks very much, Stephen Collinson there, live from Washington with more on what we're hearing from the U.S. president
today at that cabinet meeting.
We'll have more ahead, including the anger, which is apparent as U.S. troops pull out of northern Syria, leaving their Kurdish allies vulnerable
to attack from Turkey. I'll be speaking with a representative of a Kurdish political party, just ahead.
Also, the Lebanese government has approved economic reforms and massive demonstrations continue. How protestors are reacting, coming up next. Is
it too little, too late? We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: Returning now to one of our top stories, the withdrawal of U.S. troops from northern Syria. Kurds who feel betrayed by their longtime
allies, turned out to protest the move today, some pelting U.S. armored vehicles with rotten vegetables as they left.
They're furious that U.S. President Donald Trump's decision has allowed Turkey to conduct a military offensive to clear Kurdish fighters from the
border region. That operation is now on pause until tomorrow. That's when the ceasefire expires. And some pretty remarkable comments a short time
ago. Mr. Trump appeared to praise Turkey's attacks.
[14:30:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: If shooting didn't start for a couple of days, I don't think the Kurds would have moved. I don't think, frankly, you would have been able
to make a very easy deal with Turkey. I think when it started for a few days, it was so nasty, that when we went to Turkey, and when we went to the
Kurds, they agreed to do things that they never would have done before the shooting started.
If they didn't go through two and a half days of hell, I don't think, they would have done it. I think you couldn't have made a deal.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Critics see all of this far differently saying Turkey's operation could essentially lead to ethnic cleansing.
Let's get the Kurdish perspective on all of this now. I'm joined by Alan Semo, a representative of the Kurdish Democratic Union Party who's here in
the U.K.
You were telling me during the break that this is more than a betrayal. How are Kurds living this reversal of U.S. policy?
ALAN SEMO, U.K. REPRESENTATIVE, KURDISH DEMOCRATIC UNION PARTY: They feel they have been not just beyond a betrayal, they have been left to face
massacres and genocide of five million civilians living in northern, eastern area, facing that genocide and massacres, and therefore, there are
people that are so angry, that they needed desperate protection from the international community and U.S.
GORANI: So they felt so vulnerable, the Kurds, that they preferred an alliance with the Assad regime, and their Russian backers, than to be left
to face the Turkish military.
SEMO: Mm-hmm.
GORANI: But you're making a deal here also with a leader who's a tyrant, who bombed and poisoned his own people.
SEMO: I didn't make a deal with them. I am vulnerable, I have been attacked on all sides, what I have to do. You left me, you're my ally,
U.S., and you promised and reached our promises, we sacrificed so huge sacrifice. We sacrifice 11,000 fighters to defeat ISIS, and you promised.
We honored our promise. We keep that promise. And now leaving us in the middle of that terror?
GORANI: Would you ever trust America again?
SEMO: It wasn't -- the matter is not -- the fact is that the keeping the promises. We agreed, and yesterday, the Syrian force and democratic forces
have withdrawn, according to the agreement between Turkey, and the U.S. And the promise of their agreement, to honor that agreement, they withdraw
yesterday, but the Turkey still breaching this ceasefire agreement and shelling.
And since yesterday withdrawal, despite withdrawal, there have been ten of fighters -- tens of fighters have been killed and about many, many, many
civilian have been displaced.
GORANI: And we've seen, by the way, 150, 160,000 civilians, some of them displaced more than once. Sometimes two times, three times. How would
this (INAUDIBLE) with the Assad fighters protect the Kurds? I mean, what is the idea behind it?
SEMO: The idea behind is it not just the Kurds and the Syrian Democratic Forces to protect the border against foreign invasion of Turkey. It's the
Syrian regime duty, the national duty of the Syria regime to protect their own border. It's not just our borders. It's Syria regime's border.
If the regime considers itself as legitimate, they should and come and protect their border, against not only Turkey, against any foreign
invasion.
GORANI: But this could lead to major confrontations between the two sides in that part of Syria, couldn't it.
SEMO: Yes, and this is a war. This is the Turkish have declared a war, against breaching all the international law and invading another country,
neighboring country, currently Syria.
GORANI: As you know, the Turks say, they're fighting terrorists, that the YPG, which is the military arm of your party, is associated allied close to
the PKK fighters, ideologically and operationally.
SEMO: This is the pretext. This is the pretext of Turkey, and this statement is coming to pretext to attacking and massacre. The Syrian
people, they have their own forces. They have their own political party, and they have their own opinions.
GORANI: Lastly, sorry to disrupt you.
SEMO: The American, the coalition, and all western countries, and European NATO countries, they're regarding Syrian Democratic Forces -- as Syrian
Democratic Forces, which differentiate from that Turkish view.
GORANI: Just lastly because you didn't quite answer that question, will you ever trust America again?
[14:35:00]
SEMO: It's not a matter of trust. We haven't trust anybody but our self. We are relying on our self, but we will count and honor our agreement,
combination of our agreement to fight against the extremism and brutal invasion of the Turkish state.
GORANI: Alan Semo, the representative for the Kurdish Democratic Union Party. Thanks for being with us in the studio this evening.
SEMO: Thank you.
GORANI: In Israel, Benjamin Netanyahu has hit the wall in his effort to form a new government, he cannot do it. In a new social media statement,
he says he's giving up and returning the mandate to President Rivlin.
Oren Liebermann joins us from Jerusalem with more.
So now his rival, Benny Gantz gets a shot, Oren.
OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Almost certainly. The president's office said that's who he intends to appoint, his rival former
IDF chief of staff and head of the Blue and White Party, Benny Gantz.
But first the director general of the president's office would consult with all the parliamentary factions to see if any of them wanted to update or
change their position as to who they would recommend.
And then within the three days allotted within the law, the president would announce who he would choose. And again, in all likelihood, that appears
to be Benny Gantz. Of course, that doesn't mean that Benny Gantz is the next prime minister. His path to a premiership, his path to establishing a
coalition government is no clearer than Netanyahu's was.
He may have 54 seats or 57 seats, depending on where all of the Arab party sit here. But that too is short of the 61 seats and that means the key
player here or the potential king maker remains the former chief of staff - - the former defense minister, that is Avigdor Lieberman.
But let's go back here to Netanyahu, because this is a pivotal moment. He has failed once again, the former government. He has given the mandate
back to the president, no less on his 70th birthday. That too is worth noting, and he gave it back early. He had, at least, 28 days which was
until the end of the week. He could have requested another two-week extension, which is pretty standard in Israeli politics, though his request
may have been rejected.
Nevertheless, he has abandoned his efforts to form a government, he has essentially given back the mandate to the prime minister. And in doing so,
he appears to have already begun his campaign for another elections, saying he did everything he could to form a unity government.
It's what he was going to do, it's what he claimed he always wanted to do, regardless of the fact that he campaigned on a religious right wing
government up until the elections showed that he had no chance to form that government and then he shifted his efforts to a unity government.
But that's where it stands now. Crucially, Hala, the political deadlock that has plagued Israel since the April elections, since again the
September elections, seems to be holding fast right now in Israel.
GORANI: All right. We'll see if we get another parliamentary election. It seems like we're getting one of those every few months in Israel.
Lebanon's government is announcing major economic reforms amid mass country-wide protests. The new budget will slash government leaders and
minister salaries in half, and scrap austerity measures. It comes after days of protests over a faltering economy, lack of basic services, and
proposed tax hikes on mobile messaging apps.
Our Ben Wedeman joins me now from Beirut.
So the protesters -- or the government of Saad Hariri, the prime minister is proposing all these reforms, hoping to quiet the protesters. Are they
still out in force?
BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They're still out in force, Hala. We just got back from walking around, and everyone we spoke
insisted that they will continue with these protests.
And matter of fact, just below me, I hear people chanting Thawra, Thawra, revolution, revolution.
Now, he is proposing things like, yes, cutting the taxes of current and former ministers. Keep in mind, if you serve for a few weeks as a minister
in the Lebanese government, you have a paycheck for life. That applies to members of parliament as well.
He is talking about imposing a new taxes on bank profits that could raise as much as $3.4 billion in the hopes of zeroing out Lebanon's usually
massive deficit.
But the attitude of most people is that OK. We've been protesting for four days now, and you come up with this raft of proposals. But, A, they've
heard it all before, in terms of promises to fix Lebanon's perennial power problems, its water shortages. They've heard it all before that the
economy is going to be reformed and made modern again. But none of that has ever come to pass.
So, yes, it's interesting that after four days of protest, the government is scrambling to try to cool, sort of smooth the water, hoping that people
go home. But people have heard these promises, as we heard this evening from people we spoke to, so many times before.
[14:40:59]
It seems that that fundamental bond of trust that is supposed to exist between the ruled and the rulers in a country like Lebanon, which has an
imperfect democracy, but a democracy, nonetheless, that bond, Hala, seems to have been broken.
GORANI: Certainly. And also what I was reading online, some protesters were almost irritated that after four days of protests, the government came
out with, you know, an actionable five or six-point plan. But I mean that means, why didn't you do it before? You knew that this economy was in dire
straits, you knew people were suffering. And so now you come out with a plan because we've been protesting for four days?
There's this sense that you've just been toying with us all this time. And when you're -- there's a little bit of pressure applied, you spend half a
day coming up with a plan, and you know, there's some frustration there.
WEDEMAN: And I think that that plays into the logic of the protest that OK. After four days of essentially paralyzing the heart of Beirut, keep in
mind, Friday and Monday, there has been nothing being done in Lebanon. It's a general strike.
Today, imagine what can be accomplished if they go on for twice as long. Obviously, you know, the economy needs to work. People need to earn a
living. Those who are lucky enough to be doing that. But yes, they say, well, why do it now? What have you been doing since 1990 when the civil
war ended? I mean, for instance, electricity is a perfect example.
In Beirut, there are daily three-hour power cuts. In other parts of the country as much as 12 hours a day.
Every few months, you hear about a committee being formed and studies to try to solve the electricity problem and it never gets solved. And I think
that's sort of a microcosm of Lebanon's government's inability to confront and solve problems. They will form committees, they will hire expensive
foreign consultants. And at the end of the day, nothing gets done. Hala?
GORANI: Right. And it seems like there's a lot of unity among the protesters, which is quite interesting, and we're seeing them protest in
other cities, Paris, Montreal.
Thanks very much, Ben Wedeman, we'll keep an eye on those demonstrations.
More protests of another part of the world. In Chile, Santiago is reeling after week of deadly protesters. In parts of the country, a curfew is in
effect in what's being called, the worst unrest since the Pinochet regime.
The country's Senate during an emergency session Sunday, discussed suspending the public transport, price increases that set off this latest
wave. Chilean president, Sebastian Pinera, still needs to sign it.
And this has really been bloody. Eleven people were killed in the protest, which have caused millions of dollars in damage. We're seeing large
numbers gathering again today. Santiago's mayor says she's received the protester's message but is asking for peace to install changes.
Demonstrations are underway on Santiago's, Plaza Italia. CNN in Espanol, correspondent, Dario Klein is there.
I understand that it's a bit loud and noisy where you are and communication is choppy. But tell us what you're seeing right now, Dario.
Dario Klein, can you hear me? This is Hala in London. Last attempt, Dario, if you can hear me, this is Hala.
All right. Now, we'll fix this link between London and Santiago and this is Plaza Italia, where as you can demonstrators have gathered yet again,
even though the government has promised the suspension of that transport tax.
You know, similarly to other countries where demonstrations started over one small thing, but this was, of course, caused by a much, much
frustration. And when the government finally relents and backtracked in Hong Kong as well, protesters say it's not enough. It's too little, too
late. We want you to do more on us.
We'll keep an eye on what's happening in Chile, of course, we'll try to get back in touch with Dario Klein who's in the middle of that crowd.
And I was talking about Hong Kong, well, China's state media is drawing a link between protests in Chile and those in Hong Kong. They've published a
series of editorials Monday saying demonstrators in Chile and Spain are taking cues from those in Hong Kong.
[14:45:00]
The editorials basically accused the West of hypocrisy. The allegations came on the heels of new clashes in Hong Kong over the weekend. Those
protesters there, by the way, are in their 20th week.
Still to come tonight, alleged racism has disrupted another European football match. The investigation now underway after reports of racist
abuse led two teams to walk away from a big qualifying match.
Also ahead, Prince Harry is facing criticism for being too open about family tensions. We'll explain after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: In England, the football association cup qualifier between Haringey and Yeovil has been rescheduled after alleged racism forced it to
abandon the game over the weekend. Saturday's match came less than a week after England's euro qualifier in Bulgaria, which was halted twice over
racist behavior.
We don't usually cover sports for the score here, but this is something that's become such a problem in football, and people are asking, are
authorities doing enough to stop these racist issues?
World Sport's Don Riddell reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DON RIDDELL, CNN INTERNATIONAL SPORT CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The beautiful game is not supposed to look or sound like that. But in London
on Saturday, such vile abuse led to the game between Haringey Borough and Yeovil Town being abandoned.
AKI ACHILLEA, CHAIRMAN, HARINGEY BOROUGH FC: To be perfectly honest with you, I'm mortified about what happened Saturday. We were so looking
forward to hosting a club with a tradition, the Yeovil Town had in the FA Cup.
RIDDELL: The players said of Haringey Borough FC say they were subjected to racist abuse throughout the match, but it was when projectiles were
reportedly thrown and their goalie spat out in the 64th minute that they felt compelled to leave the field. The game was subsequently abandoned.
ACHILLEA: I think it brought in to focus last week, last Saturday to me that my players should not, under any circumstances, be subjected to this.
I would not allow them to be subjected to this. I will do whatever I can as head of the club effectively to try and protect them.
RIDDELL: On Monday, the first team was given the day off. These youth players, reflective of their multicultural community in North London.
ACHILLEA: We don't see -- we don't see color. We were one collective together, and it's worked so well.
RIDDELL: This socking incident occurred just five days after England's euro 2020 qualifier I Bulgaria was halted twice as fans were warned about
racist behavior. Racist abuse can now be found on the terraces at every level of the game.
And by walking off the field, players are taking matters into their own hands, imploring authorities to do more.
DARREN LEWIS, FOOTBALL JOURNALIST: Time and again, we see players leaving the field to play and complaining that the game is not able to protect
them. We have had to find another way. This is the way, because now, players can feel empowered, that if they leave the field of play, the
authorities have to do something about it in order to protect them.
[14:50:14]
RIDDELL: The manager who bravely made the decision to call off the match said that some of his players were absolutely distraught.
TOM LOIZOU, MANAGER, HARINGEY BOROUGH FC: I got quite upset, not with the abuse and the bottle throwing but to see the look on Coly Rowe's face and
(INAUDIBLE) players, that's what really upset me, and that's the time I really decided, I made my mind (INAUDIBLE).
RIDDELL: So far, two arrests have been made, the game will be replayed next Tuesday. The football association says it is deeply concerned and
will investigate.
Don Riddell, CNN.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: More to come, including Prince Harry sharing some intimate aspects of his life in a candid T.V. interview. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GORANI: Prince Harry and his wife, Meghan, will take some time off in the coming weeks. That's from a royal source who spoke after the couple's
unfiltered interview that aired on Sunday.
In it, the Duke of Sussex confirmed tensions between him and his older brother, Prince William. Harry said they still love each other, that
they're brothers but they're on quote, different paths.
The Duchess of Sussex held back tears talking about pressures she is facing. And when she was asked whether that meant she was not really OK,
Meghan said, yes.
However, some people say Harry's honesty went too far. This is after all Britain, and people don't really reveal that type of intimate part of their
lives so often in public. They believe that there is an unwritten, perhaps rule, guiding the royal family and how much they reveal. And that's what
some of the critics say.
Max foster explains. Max.
MAX FOSTER, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hala, there have been rumors of a rift between these two princesses for some time in the British
tabloids. And for the first time, one of them has accepted the tensions between them in response to a question about whether or not there really is
a rift. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's been a lot of talk in the press about rifts with your brother. How much of that is true?
PRINCE HARRY, DUKE OF SUSSEX: Part of this role, and part of this job, and this family, being under the pressure that it's under, and never to be, you
know, stuff happens, we're brothers. We'll always be brothers. And we're certainly on different paths at the moment. But I will always be there for
him, and as I know he'll always be there for me.
We rarely see each other as much as we -- as much as it was used to, because we're so busy. But, you know, I love him dearly. And, you know,
the majority of this stuff is problem -- well, the majority of the stuff is created out of nothing. But, you know, as brothers, you know, you have
good days, you have bad days.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: People responding to that into different ways. Some people saying it's Harry at his best, he's being authentic, he's being honest, he's being
real. But there are those more traditional members of British high society, if I can call it that, who don't accept that this is the way a
member of the royal family should be acting.
Yes, there are bound to be tensions between the brothers at times. But you don't talk about it when you're part of the monarchy, because it undermines
that wider institution. It's you to decide, whether or not, you think he's done the right thing.
[14:55:59]
Meanwhile, the Duchess of Sussex has been talking about the pressures she feels under. She says she expected to have some backlash from the British
tabloids. Many of her friends advised her against marrying Prince Harry because that would be the case. But she doesn't accept the unfairness.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MEGHAN MARKLE, DUCHESS OF SUSSEX: It's not enough to just survive something, right? That's not the point of life. You've got to thrive,
you've got to feel happy. And I think I really tried to adopt this British sensibility of a stiff upper lip.
FOSTER: It has this --
MARKLE: I've tried, I've tried. But I think that what that does internally is probably really damaging. And the biggest thing that I know
is that I never thought that this would be easy. But I thought it would be fair.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: All of this comes as a royal source tells CNN that around mid- November when the couple's latest round of engagements and commitments ends, they're going to take some time out, some family time for a matter of
weeks. It's clear that the couple are really suffering from all the pressure they feel, and sometimes they're just not coping. Hala.
GORANI: Thank you, Max.
Now, what you're about to see is Egypt's biggest archaeological find in more than a century. It is absolutely remarkable. Each sarcophagus
encloses a mummy of a priest or a child. There are women as well. They were discovered outside Luxor, at the site known as the world's greatest
open air museum.
Look at the condition of this, not just the coffins, the color and the encryptions are unbelievable. Some of them appear intact almost after
thousands of years.
The leader of the excavation team says they are over 3,000 years old. After restoration, they'll have a place at the Grand Egyptian Museum, which
is scheduled to open next year, beside the Giza Pyramids. Biggest find since the 19th century. Unbelievable.
I'd like to leave you with a positive news story at the end of the program. Thanks for watching tonight. I'm Hala Gorani. Stay with CNN, "QUEST MEANS
BUSINESS" is in London.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
