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Hala Gorani Tonight
Nearly 16 Million People On Lockdown Across Northern Italy; U.S. Markets Plunge Amid Oil Prices Drop, Coronavirus Fears; Refugees Forced Back From Greece, Left In Limbo; Virus Fears Drive Panic Purchase Frenzy; Prince Harry, Meghan Markle's Last Day As Working Royals. Aired 1-2p ET
Aired March 09, 2020 - 13:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CHRIS WHITTY, U.K. CHIEF MEDICAL OFFICER: -- if they have symptoms that are compatible with coronavirus, so if they have a very bad pneumonia.
And we'll be extending that out now, as from tomorrow, to everybody who has a significant enough pneumonia or other respiratory tract infection, to get
into hospital at all. So that's the -- that a medical advance, to move forward. But I think what we're moving now to is a phase when we will be
having to ask members of the general public to do different things than they would normally do.
But I would repeat the point that the P.M. and Patrick have just said. It is important on this, it's not just a matter of what you do, it is
(INAUDIBLE) because anything we do, we've got to be able to sustain. Once you've started these things, you will have to continue them through the
peak, and that is for a period of time. And there is a risk if we go too early, people will understandably get fatigued and it'll be difficult to
sustain this over time. So getting the timing right is absolutely critical to making this work.
At the moment, the things that we are doing which are appropriate for any other significant respiratory tract infection are also appropriate for the
currently very small number of coronavirus cases we have in the U.K. So those would include washing your hands with soap and water as the prime
minister has said, includes covering your mouth when you cough or sneeze, and disposing of tissues as everybody knows.
It also would include what anybody would get as advice from their G.P. which is, if you've got a very serious respiratory tract infection, you're
sneezing everywhere, you've got a high fever, you've got a runny nose, if you phoned up your G.P., they would say, stay at home. Don't infect elderly
people, don't infect your workmates. This is no different from anything else you would normally -- we normally would advise at this time of year.
And remember, in terms of perspective, in an average year, about 8,000 people a year die of flu. It is very important we do this for all
respiratory tract infections. And as with coronavirus, those who are older and those who have pre-existing health conditions are at greater risk.
But we're now going to be moving into a position where, at the moment, as Patrick said, the ratio between people who have got coronavirus in the U.K.
and other significant respiratory tract infections, is very, very low. That is going to shift over time for two reasons. One of which is the modeling
shows that the actual amount of coronavirus is steadily going to increase, and we're expecting the numbers to increase initially slowly, but really
quite fast after a while, and we have to catch it before the upswing begins.
And secondly, the other causes of coughs and colds that are seasonal at this time of year are at the tail end of their period of maximum activity
in the U.K. So the ratios are going to shift very significantly.
So we are now very close to the time -- probably within the next 10 to 14 days -- when the modeling would imply we should move to a situation where
we say, everybody who has even minor respiratory tract infections or a fever should be self-isolating for seven days afterwards. And this is going
to be the next step. We have not yet reached that step, but we are going to be reaching that step in the really quite near future.
And this is what we wanted to lay out, is the first step along a path towards trying to reduce, firstly, the delay of the epidemic. It's (ph)
part of the overall contain-delay-research and mitigate strategy. And then, to pull down the peak of this epidemic so that it is smaller than it would
have been if we don't take these interventions. So that will be the next step. Thank you very much.
BORIS JOHNSON, PRIME MINISTER OF BRITAIN: Thanks very much, Chris.
And thank you, Patrick.
I hope that's given some clarity about where we are. But let's please have some questions. Vicki, Vicki on BBC?
VICKI YOUNG, BBC CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Prime Minister, you touched on it there, you talked about public concern. And it's clear that
some in the public are beginning to question why you're not taking those more aggressive approaches, if you like, that we're seeing in lots of other
countries. And people are wondering why that's not happening. Are you confident you are doing enough to keep people safe?
And a question, too, to the chiefs if I might. Lots of people ask about flights from Italy. They haven't been stopped and as far as we're aware,
people are not being tested coming off those flights. Can you explain why?
JOHNSON: Yes. Vicki, I'd just, you know, really go back to the advice gave earlier on, and really to repeat what the CSA, the chief scientific advisor
and the chief medical officer have said. It is really vital, as we take these steps to protect ourselves and encourage everybody to protect
everybody else, that we do it at the right time. It's not what you do, it's -- of course it's partly what you do, but it's when you do it.
And what's happening in -- as Patrick said, what's happening in other countries doesn't necessarily mirror what's happening here in the U.K. And
that's why we're following the scientific advice in the way that we are.
But on the -- Pat, did you want to say something else?
PATRICK VALLENCE, U.K. CHIEF SCIENTIFIC ADVISOR: Yes. I'll say something about that.
So it's important to actually look and see what really works, and make those measures. There are lots of things that seem intuitive and you think,
well, that should work -- turn out to have very little if any effect. And one of those is actually airport screening.
So temperature screening in an airport doesn't really have much effect. It's worth noting that those countries that instituted it very early, some
of their first cases came through that screening, weren't detected in the screening and then popped up. And some of those have stopped doing it now,
so that isn't an effective measure.
And other measures that people look out to -- mass gatherings, and so on -- actually don't make much difference if you really look at it. And so those
aren't the first things you'd go for, they're not the things that really help contain.
And that's why what we're looking at is the things that really do make a difference, and making sure those are the things we concentrate on at the
WHITTY: Should I just add one thing to that? Which is, I think important to remember that Italy -- and I think all of us, our hearts go out to the
situation in Italy -- they were the first country in Europe to actually ban flights at that stage from China, and they also looked at airport
screening. And as you can see, this is not cause and effect but that has not been a reason to actually slow down the epidemic in that country.
JOHNSON: Good, thank you.
Pau Brand, ITV.
PAUL BRAND, ITV POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Thank you, Prime Minister. Prime Minister, just to pick up on Vicki Young's question, other governments
across Europe are taking more drastic steps now. Are you suggesting that perhaps that's due to political pressure rather than scientific advice? And
are you absolutely sure you shouldn't be doing the same thing?
And just a question to all of you, is it still meaningful to say that we're in the contained phase when the virus isn't being contained, and we now
have evidence it is spreading within the U.K.?
JOHNSON: Well, first of all, I think that the best answer to that, Paul, is you know, just that the phenomenon, the epidemiology may be different
from one country to the next. And I think it's very, very important that we in the U.K. are guided by the best and the latest scientific advice, and
that's what we're doing.
And just on your second point about containment and -- containment and delay, as in when we may move into the delay phase, it's obvious that we're
not abandoning a contain. Because clearly, we're going to want to contain as well as delay the outbreak.
Just it's (ph) very important, (INAUDIBLE) the government, just because you move from one phase to the other, it doesn't mean the ambition of
containing the outbreak has been abandoned.
WHITTY: Could I just add to that? That when you start off in delay, most of the things you do are exactly the same as you would do in contain. So
it's all about case finding and isolation. As you move through, beyond a certain point, that ceases to be an effective strategy. But at the moment,
we still think it is useful to identify people based on geography, identifying the early cases and isolating them in case -- as case finding.
Beth Rigby, Sky News?
BETH RIGBY, SKY NEWS POLITICAL EDITOR: Thank you, thank you.
Prime Minister, a question for you and then the chief medical officer, if I may. Prime Minister, just two weeks ago in Italy, there were 153 cases of
coronavirus and just three deaths. Now, 16 million people have been quarantined. A reflection, if you like, of the public health challenge we
are all facing globally. Is there a risk that in trying not to alarm and panic people, you are actually going to slow in taking these measures?
And to the chief medical officer, your Scottish counterpart said four percent of the population in Scotland might have to be hospitalized. If you
extrapolate that figure across to England, that's over 2 million people. Do you accept that figure? Thank you.
JOHNSON: Well, obviously, you're right, Beth, in the sense that there's no question that this is going to become a significant -- a much more
significant outbreak than it currently is, that's obviously to everyone. But it is vital that we take the steps that we think are necessary at the
right time. And we follow the science. And that's what I think the public would expect us to do, to give them the latest information.
Now, in the course of this -- of this week, obviously, we're going to be looking more at the detail of the steps that we could take, as we ask the
public to join us in a national effort to delay the spread of the virus. But we'll be setting out that detail in due course. We don't think that
this is the right moment. We still think that the best thing we can do is, as I say, to contain the virus.
VALLENCE: And when you do it, do it systematically, moving from one to the next, getting the right combinations, not ending up with a series of
individual actions in response to things. So be in control of where you are in the epidemic, not in reaction mode. And that's really what we're trying
to do, making sure that when we do do things, we get that right constellation of things done to make sure that we have the biggest impact.
WHITTY: On the issue about four percent, what Dr. Calderwood, who I obviously speak to every day, was talking about was the reasonable worst-
case scenario planning tool. And that is rightly aiming at the absolute top of the range.
The reality, I think there are probably two points to make on this. The first of which is, the great majority of people who have this infection
will actually have a mild or moderate infection that will be managed at home, and indeed will not need any testing. They will simply feel unwell,
we will want them to self-isolate for seven days, and then they will get better and they actually won't touch the health service at all. A minority
will need hospital care.
The percentages, to be honest, are largely speculative. And it really will depend on what the -- how the epidemic progresses, which we're really in
the early days of, and then how doctors who see people and nurses who see people as they come in, they will make decisions about whether someone
actually needs to come into hospital or not.
Because clearly, if you don't need to be in hospital you shouldn't be in hospital. It's very much going to be about choosing the people who are
going to benefit most from hospitals. And the percentages, to be honest, are largely speculative.
JOHNSON: Thank you.
Heather Stewart from "The Guardian."
HEATHER STEWART, POLITICAL EDITOR, "THE GUARDIAN": Hello. We all saw footage over the weekend of people squabbling over toilet rolls, and empty
shelves and so on. Is it just prudent for people to be stocking up on the kinds of things that they would need if they were going to have to stay at
home for a week? And are you confident that as this -- as the outbreak escalates, both here and in other countries, that you can keep shelves
JOHNSON: Well, we're certainly confident that we have fantastic supply chains. I know that both -- both George Eustice and Matt have been talking
-- Matt Hancock -- have been talking to the supermarkets, making sure that we keep things moving.
Just in terms of preparations and where the public is, I think it's very, very important that everybody should behave responsibly and think about
others. We will be setting out, as I say, in the course of the next few days, what further measures we think may be necessary. And I stress may be
necessary. We think it's probable that we'll go to a delay phase, but we'll be spelling out what is useful and appropriate for the public to do in the
course of the next few days.
So there will be a meeting of the Scientific Advisory Group on Emergencies tomorrow, and then a further Cobra on Wednesday to consider the next steps.
And Gordon Rayner, "Telegraph."
GORDON RAYNER, POLITICAL EDITOR, "THE TELEGRAPH": Thank you, Prime Minister. A lot of people at home watching this now will probably be
elderly, in the over-80s category that we know is a high-risk group. Is the advice for those people still, just to wash your hands more regularly and
nothing else? Or are there other steps that you are suggesting that they should be taking to protect themselves?
And also, can you give any reassurance that if we do get to a stage where people with any kind of respiratory illnesses need to self-isolate for
seven days, that you will be able to get food to elderly people who perhaps aren't used to ordering shopping online like, you know, other people might
be able to? How are you going to identify those people and get food to them?
JOHNSON: Well, on the medical advice, perhaps I could go to you, Chris, on what we're saying.
WHITTY: One of the key things that we'll be coming forward with in the next stage of the plan after this, is advice for older people and also
those who are vulnerable for other reasons. So pre-existing health conditions, people who are vulnerable we know from infections in general.
For example, people who are pregnant have a slightly increased risk.
There are a variety of other areas where we would be looking at and we'd be saying, we want to be able to protect these people particularly during this
epidemic, and we will be giving advice based on their degree of clinical need. And that will be different for different people and sometimes it will
have to be tailored to particular individuals.
But that advice is going to be the next stage. At this point, the length -- the thing we're going to be moving on to in the next 10 to 14 days is very
much asking people who have got symptoms, however mild, to stay at home for seven days afterwards because that is a way of protecting the public
including older people.
HALA GORANI, CNN HOST, HALA GORANI TONIGHT: All right, you've been listening to a news conference there with the prime minister of the United
Kingdom, Boris Johnson, and top health officials.
Some significant developments coming out of that news conference. In particular, that health officials are saying that probably within the next
10 to 14 days, at that point, the coronavirus outbreak management will move into a different phase, and that authorities will ask people even with
minor symptoms to self-quarantine for seven days.
They say they have not reached that stage yet, but in order to manage this outbreak, this is something that they're looking at in about the next two
weeks. We, of course, here are in the United Kingdom and these directives have not been issued yet.
U.K. authorities, by the way, approaching this slightly differently from, say, Italian authorities. The health officials there in that news
conference, saying that airport screening and limiting mass gatherings don't necessarily make much of a difference according to them, making the
point that in Italy, the airport screening was put in place early on and yet it continues to be the country with the most outbreaks, so that's a
quick summary of that news conference.
Now, if you still had any doubt, by the way, about whether coronavirus would hit the economy in a big way, that doubt went right out the window.
U.S. markets are leveling off after a morning of carnage. But as you can see, they are very much deep into the red, we're down more than six percent
for the Dow Jones Industrial average.
Adding to coronavirus jitters, a massive drop in oil prices. Demand for oil was already down, especially in China. And then Saudi Arabia launched a
price war against Russia. CNN's Alison Kosik was there when stocks fell so dramatically that the circuit breakers kicked in and trading was
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Trading has stopped because we've seen a drop of seven percent, which means trading will stop for the
next 15 minutes. The idea is so speculative trading doesn't come in, so accurate information comes into the marketplace and cooler heads can
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: All right. Well, so much is happening in the markets and so quickly. And by the way, that graphic you saw next to Alison was when we
were down more than seven percent. We have bounced back off of those lows.
So much is happening that many of us are asking what it will mean for us, for jobs, for pensions. Because in the end, it's ordinary people who will
be affected down the line. Our business editor at large Richard Quest is in New York.
Let's talk first of all a little bit about what caused the panic selling this morning specifically: coronavirus, the price war between Saudi Arabia
and Russia over oil? What is it? Is it one more than the other?
QUEST: I think it's several factors. It's first of all, the coronavirus and the worsening situation in the United States. Now, though, it was that oil
price fall by up to 30 percent after Russia and Saudi had a spat and Saudi decided it was going to turn on the taps.
It beggars belief, by the way, that with the global economy on the precipice, that the Saudis decided to play chicken with the -- with the
price of oil.
Oil went down, that's -- remember why oil's going down besides the Saudis, because their (ph) demand economies --
QUEST: -- are slowing, we're on the brink -- we're on the cusp of a global recession. And I think this morning, listening to what the prime minister
said in Britain just then, Hala, contain, delay, research, mitigate. That's the U.K.'s policy. But the FTSE was down seven percent.
Now, you start imagining everybody with a cold and a heavy chest being told to stay at home in Britain, you will start to get a dramatic slowdown of
the U.K. economy as well.
GORANI: Yes. And the problem too, Richard, is that there aren't that many tools left to address this. If we see some sort of massive economic slump
or even a recession that isn't a disaster but that is still a significant slowing of the economy.
Interest rates are near zero, taxes have been lowered -- especially in the United States. What do you do? The options are so limited that you can --
that you're running out of options to confront this, when taxes and interest rates were lowered when the economy was booming.
QUEST: You shift your perspective. You no longer try to avoid the recession, which is already here. You mitigate its worst effects, and you
prime the pump to help get economic activity going to get you out of it.
So what does that mean in real life? It means central bankers, first of all, making sure money markets perform, the interbank money markets
perform, you create liquidity. You cut interest rates, but that's not going to do much good.
Fiscally, you cut taxes and maybe increase tax allowances. You get money into consumers' pockets. And for crucially important sectors of the
economy, like airlines, you give them some form of tax relief, you give them some sort of government plan that takes the foot off the throat so
that they can prosper. And you ride it out, you simply ride it out.
GORANI: Tax cuts cost money. The U.S. is running a trillion-dollar deficit, and so this is going to add to that.
QUEST: Keynesian -- Keynesian economics. Classically, when the house is on fire, Hala, you don't worry about how much the fire hose is going to cost
GORANI: Right. Although those measures were taken when the house wasn't on fire, so this is a debate we can have hopefully very soon. Thanks very
much, Richard Quest in New York.
As several countries struggle to contain their growing coronavirus outbreaks, CNN is now shifting its rhetoric. We are calling this a
pandemic. Here's why. There are now more than 100,000 cases and more than 3,800 deaths. Most are still in China, but the virus is spreading rapidly
in several countries including Italy, Iran and South Korea.
In fact, the virus has taken hold on every continent except Antarctica. The experts we've talked to all agree, we're seeing sustained community
transmission in several places -- that's one of the, by the way, criteria - - that's a major factor for whether an outbreak becomes a pandemic. But that is not a cue to panic, health officials tell us. It's a reminder to
take steps to prevent the virus from spreading before it gets worse.
Now, in the United States, officials are shifting to a strategy of mitigation. That means they're focusing not only on containment, they're
also doing more to prepare for potential new cases. Sara Sidner is in Washington State, where a nursing home has become the country's epicenter,
at a nursing home presumably where older, more vulnerable people are exposed to this virus -- Sara.
SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes that's true, Hala. This is the epicenter because this is where the largest number of deaths in one area
has happened. So far, more than 550 people across the United States have contracted coronavirus and tested positive for that. The number of deaths
is at 22 now in the U.S. Sixteen of those deaths are connected to this care facility here, which is a nursing home and has some of the most vulnerable
All of the sorts of things that you're hearing from experts, elderly, pre- existing conditions, already ill in some way or dealing with, you know, health concerns. And so you had a large number of people here.
Not only did you have those who were being cared for, but those who were caring for the people inside of this nursing facility, who, 70 of them had
some kind of symptoms that were similar to coronavirus, and we are still waiting for some of those tests to come back to find out how many people
indeed in this facility actually contracted the coronavirus -- the novel coronavirus.
But a really disturbing situation here, where you had families extremely concerned about those who were still inside. Of the 120 or so patients and
residents here, only about 55 are left still inside here. And at one point, there were just too few people to care for all of those who needed to be
cared for. And so the Centers for Disease Control, here in the United States, ended up sending in more nurses and doctors to this facility.
It has been a very difficult time, as you might imagine, for the families, wondering what the status is of their loved ones. This particular nursing
home has seen, you know, ambulances going in and out at the very beginning, and we heard from a first responder who said that in the early, early days
of last week, when they came in, they noticed only about three staff members for 90 patients at the time --
SIDNER: -- very disturbing information. But again, a lot of the people who were here were showing symptoms of the coronavirus. And of course, you
don't want those people to be coming in to the facility, coming to work when they are potentially -- have the virus -- Hala.
GORANI: Yes, what a tricky situation there for them and such a tragic outcome for so many. Thanks very much. Sara Sidner is in Washington State.
The World Health Organization is recommending countries take a comprehensive response to the coronavirus. The head of the WHO says the
virus is an uneven threat. Quote, "Different countries are in different scenarios, requiring a tailored response."
Let's bring in Dr. Seema Yasmin. She's the director of the Stanford Health Communication Initiative, and she's a former disease detective with the
U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Thanks, Doctor, for joining us.
Let me first ask you about what the president of the United States has tweeted, essentially saying it's just the flu. Relax, everybody. Many more
people die of the common flu every year than of this. What's your reaction?
SEEMA YASMIN, DIRECTOR, STANFORD HEALTH COMMUNICATION INITIATIVE: This isn't the flu, Hala. This is a new infection that we're learning things
about day by day. We're still at this very steep phase of the learning curve.
And here's what concerns me, is I report on this epidemic and I talk to especially emergency doctors in the U.K. and here in the U.S. They're
saying to me, look, even for a year where we have a bad flu season, we get overwhelmed with that. So we don't even know how ready we need to be or how
prepared we can be to deal with this new infection, which already has so many uncertainties.
And here in the U.S., we've heard about a really significant shortfall in the most basic equipment that health care workers need, like the N95 masks.
So it's not -- we're trying not to compare it to the flu because it is a different infection that we're learning new things about and we really need
clarity from leaders around the world as to what level of preparedness there is, especially in the health care system.
GORANI: Well, the U.K. authorities just had a news conference, and I found one point that they made interesting. They essentially said airport
screening and limiting mass gatherings, maybe not so effective. But then in about two weeks' time, they're going to start advising people who have even
minor symptoms, like just a cough or a sore throat, to self-quarantine for seven days. What do you make of that? Because their approach here in the
U.K. appears to be different to Italy, for instance.
YASMIN: Right. And so we -- I think that's really confusing for the public because even within a country sometimes, you're hearing conflicting
messages from different officials, sometimes from different politicians and then from different public health leaders.
It's true that different countries take different measures at different times because the timing of when you do something in the epidemic can make
a really big difference. So we saw these massive, never-before-seen quarantine measures taken in China, but they happened really early on.
Now, we're seeing something kind of similar in northern Italy, but it's happening a lot later into the epidemic. So I'm coming back to this message
again and again, Hala, of certainty and clarity. There are already so many unknowns associated with a new infection, give the public information that
really makes sense, that is truthful and helps people plan for what their lives might look like in the next few days and the next few weeks.
GORANI: Well, I want to try to do this now. You're speaking to viewers all over the world, so obviously it is an uneven epidemic -- or a pandemic, as
we are now calling it --
GORANI: -- because different countries are affected at different levels and with different levels of intensity.
What would you say to somebody who is concerned? What should they do?
YASMIN: So I've been calling this a pandemic for over a week, Hala, because to me this meets the criteria. And just a quick piece of clarity,
the pandemic definition says nothing about severity. Pandemics really are about the geographic spread widely of an infection.
But here's my advice to people. Life is already changing. You know, I teach here at Stanford, my classes have been cancelled, people are being told to
work from home. Get ready and think ahead about different contingency plans. What might your life look like if your kids' school shut down? Get
ready for that. It may not happen, but it's so important emotionally and logistically to be prepared.
We don't want folks panic-buying things, especially like loo paper, that's not going to help that much. But do think about stocking up so you have two
weeks of nonperishables at home, you have two-week supply of water, things like that. Especially stock up on prescription medications, even for a few
months ahead. That makes sense too. You don't want to be having to queue up inside clinics and pharmacies where other people are having symptoms and
might be sick.
GORANI: Just one last thing because we've -- I mean, I was out yesterday, having lunch. There was a lot of hand sanitizer being passed around, lots
of -- obviously hand-washing, we know is what we all need to do. But the face masks, the sanitizer, all of those things. Are we doing the right
thing by using these items?
By the way, sanitizer is sold out at Boots, which is the pharmacy chain --
GORANI: -- here in the U.K. Should we be using these things?
YASMIN: I mean, my best advice is always soap and water. Use the hand sanitizer for instances where you can't get to a tap and you don't have
access to soap for example. I understand it is sold out, but I mean, soap and water, you can always turn back to that.
Masks make sense only if you have symptoms or you're in close proximity to somebody else who has symptoms. And what I worry about masks, Hala, is that
people wear them incorrectly and inappropriately, and then have this false sense of security that now they're protected. And they might not be if
they're wearing them properly.
And also, we know that there's going to be -- there already has been a mask shortage in some places, and there's likely to be a mask shortage in other
places. We really need to conserve those masks for health care workers. I am increasingly concerned about the protection of those on the front lines
of this epidemic. We need to make sure they have the equipment they need.
GORANI: All right, Dr. Seema Yasmin, thank you so much for joining us., a pleasure having you on the program. And we'll be speaking, by the way, to
one of my colleagues who happens to be in the lockdown zone in Italy.
And still to come. We were starting to show you the images there, heartbreaking stories from migrants who are desperate to flee to countries
that do not want them. We'll have a report from the Turkish-Greek border after this break. We'll be right.
GORANI: Well, Italy, as we've heard, is taking drastic measures to stop the spread of coronavirus after a dramatic spike in the number of cases over
the weekend. Nearly 16 million people across the northern part of the country are on lockdown. Italy is suffering the highest number of
fatalities due to the virus, outside of China, and the biggest outbreak in Europe.
And one of those people who are now on lockdown is our own -- one of our own field producers, Antonia Mortensen, and she joins me now from Milan.
Antonia, good to see you. What's it like being on lockdown? What's it like being in this lockdown zone in Northern Italy?
ANTONIA MORTENSEN, CNN FIELD PRODUCER: It's pretty surreal, Hala, I can tell you that for sure. I think the situation is getting a little bit more
nerve-wracking, if you will for everyone. Sort of day by day, I think two weeks ago, everybody was, you know, not as nervous about what is going on
at the moment. There's a lot of stress and anxiety in the air after the -- after the whole lockdown zone was announced and the measures are now
implemented. And if you leave the quarantined zone, you could face time in prison. So it's quite -- so it's quite drastic, actually or you could face
But people are just very worried about the health of their relatives, really, especially older people. And the fact that if they were to get
sick, would there be enough spaces in the ICU units, which, you know, the health -- luckily, the health care service in this part of Italy and
obviously is a pretty good health service. But they've just been so overwhelmed with the number of cases. And that's something that's really
GORANI: And what's it -- I mean, how do you -- are people leaving their apartments, in their homes, to go buy bread, fill prescriptions, drive
their kids to school? What's daily life like outside of people's homes?
MORTENSEN: I mean, really, the city here is pretty much a different place from what you would expect on a day to day basis or from what it was two
weeks ago. If you go out into the center of Milan now, the streets are very empty compared to what they are usually.
This weekend, on a Sunday afternoon, where the streets would be packed with Italians and tourists, people getting ready to go for their Sunday lunches
which the Italians take very seriously, obviously, the streets were totally empty. Everyone's at home or hoping not to get in contact with too many
It's not -- there aren't many people on public transport, schools are closed, so parents are forced to be at home, looking after their children.
Companies, for the last two weeks, have actually encouraged people to work from home and not come into work.
So life, as we know it, your day to day normal life has totally changed. It's really not the same place. Everyone is worried about kind of every
step that they take even...
GORANI: Well, I can -- and I can imagine you're probably getting a bit stir crazy as well, right? I mean, people get cabin fever, even if they know
it's for their own good. Yes.
MORTENSEN: Yes. I think -- I think especially for people with the -- with children is pretty difficult. And parents are obviously worried about when
they can actually go back to school or when they can actually go back to work, and the -- and some of the economic implications of that.
If you just walk around town here, there's so many small shops are closed, some cafes and restaurants are open, but obviously the long term economic
impact of that for people's jobs and salaries, you know, so that's another factor which is worrying for people here as well.
And, I mean, for me, I -- and I have to leave home every day because I have some personal things I need to attend to outside of the home which means
that I have to get ready to walk and be in contact with people on a daily basis here, so obviously that is something, you know, that worries me a
little bit, even, you know, whatever you do to protect yourself. You might quite -- be quite likely to come in contact with someone who has -- who has
the virus, even though they might not have any symptoms.
I mean, you know, every day, for the last three days, we've had over 1,000 new confirmed cases. That is a big number.
GORANI: Yes, that is certainly. Well, we wish you the best. Antonia Mortensen, my colleague who is on lockdown in Northern Italy. Thanks for
sharing your experience with us.
I want to bring you U.S. stocks again, European stocks. It was really just a terrible day. We're down again more than seven percent. So we're back
close to session lows. We had bounced back up a couple hours ago, we're down again, more than 1,800 points at just a hair's breadth over 24,000.
Now, the markets fell so far so fast that trading had to be halted for 15 minutes. These are called circuit breakers. It gives investors a chance to
Take a deep breath and think about what they are doing.
Coronavirus is weighing on the markets but the big factor today is oil prices. They collapsed after Saudi Arabia launched a price war with Russia.
CNN's John Defterios is very well positioned to talk to us about this. What is Saudi Arabia thinking?
JOHN DEFTERIOS, CNN BUSINESS EMERGING MARKETS EDITOR: Well, I tell you, this unraveled very quickly because I was in Vienna for the OPEC Plus
meeting on Friday night. When it was clear that the Russians were not going to go along with this kind of 1.5 million barrels a day, most thought that
Saudi Arabia would regroup with the other OPEC players and say, we'll hold the cuts through the first quarter of the year, it was completely the
They had not only decided to increase production to above 10 million barrels a day, they went out on Sunday, Hala, and sort of cutting prices,
$6.00 to $8.00 a barrel to their preferred customers, and that really sent the market into a tailspin. When I before I went to bed tonight -- last
night, I looked at the Asian markets and said, this can't be correct. It was a 25 percent correction, the first 15 minutes of trade.
It's extraordinary in a market. You see moving one to two percent on a normal basis.
GORANI: What are they trying to achieve? They're playing with fire because even though it costs Saudi Arabia less per barrel to produce, the impact on
their economy, they rely so much on a certain level, price per barrel. They're -- no one's breaking even here.
DEFTERIOS: Well, in fact...
GORANI: Everyone's losing at this side.
DEFTERIOS: Saudi Arabia needs $80.00 a barrel to break even.
DEFTERIOS: $83.00 a barrel, even though...
GORANI: More than Russia does.
DEFTERIOS: Yes, indeed. They produce it for two to six, but they spend lavishly on their population, and particularly this Mohammed bin Salman,
the Crown Prince, trying to diversify the economy outside of oil is costing a lot. Russia needs to break even at $40.00 a barrel.
What's a very dangerous sign right now, Hala, you have the number one and number two exploiters in the world, both making different machinations that
they can survive this crisis. So they've had this OPEC Plus agreement for the last three years to stabilize prices by cutting production, it has kept
prices above $50.00 a barrel.
We're down 50 percent since January 6, and about 35 percent from Thursday alone. This is not working because they don't see eye to eye. So unusual
bed-fellowship that you've had between Saudi Arabia and Russia. Nobody really thought it would work in this OPEC Plus agreement, and we're finding
now it's being strained.
GORANI: They're on different sides geostrategically in the Middle East, that's for sure. Well, in a world like this, it's who can sustain the pain
for the longest, right?
DEFTERIOS: Yes, for sure.
GORANI: John Defterios...
DEFTERIOS: And it's early days in that process, I should say.
GORANI: Thank you very much. We'll see you next hour.
Still to come, empty shelves. How coronavirus fears are fueling a trend of panic buying. There is no more toilet paper, anywhere it seems. We'll be
GORANI: The Turkish Coast Guard announced this weekend that it's actively stopping migrants attempting to cross the AGNC. It says because of the
dangers of the journey.
Tensions remain high on the country's borders with Greece after Turkey opened the crossings to Europe. E.U. officials have praised the Greek
government and pledged nearly $800 million in aid to help Greece keep the border secure.
However, Greek forces are once again being accused of brutal tactics, saying pushing back refugees and migrants back into Turkey. CNN's Jomana
Karadsheh reports from the border.
JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): They were desperate for Europe, but Europe didn't want them sent back to Turkey
stripped of their clothes, ID documents and their dignity.
These men from Pakistan, Morocco, and Syria say they were violently pushed back by Greek security forces. We can't verify the conditions in which this
video from Turkish state broadcaster, TRT, was filmed. But human rights groups have documented dozens of similar testimonies from refugees in
KARADSHEH (on-camera): Thousands have made it across this river to Greece. Many of them have come back with shocking accounts of what they've been
KARADSHEH (voice-over): 20-year-old, Abder Haziz (ph) has been walking for hours barefoot. We found him and his friends on the road in the Turkish
border city of Edirne (ph). They say Greek security forces caught them shortly after they crossed into Greece illegally.
It was the military of police, he tells us, they were carrying weapons. They took all our clothes. We were left in our underwear. They took our
phones, our money and documents. They burnt the IDs and clothes, he tells us.
He claims they were beaten up, lined up on the ground and kicked with combat boots. Greek authorities have repeatedly denied using these brutal
pushback methods or excessive force. The government says Greece has the right to defend its borders from illegal crossings. It's also doing so on
behalf of Europe.
During our time at the border, we heard many similar stories.
KARADSHEH (on-camera): Everybody from Afghanistan?
KARADSHEH: We met this group of Afghan refugees exhausted, yet determined.
Hameed carried his baby boy through the river and fields. After walking for five hours, he says, they were caught by Greek security.
HAMEED, AFGHAN REFUGEE: The beetles with some like -- it was a stick. And then they give orders to back.
KARADSHEH (on-camera): Did they beat you up?
HAMEED: Yes. My wife, they -- this is what I said.
KARADSHEH: So they hit you and they hit your wife.
HAMEED: Yes, yes, everything.
KARADSHEH (voice-over): Hameed says people don't choose to become refugees.
HAMEED: We want to -- my children big -- become big in the good area and could have good life.
KARADSHEH: In their pursuit of that good life, thousands have found themselves pawns on a political chessboard between Turkey and the E.U.
HAMZA, PAKISTANI REFUGEE: Turkey army is say go Greece. I try one time, but Greek army save us go back, go back Istanbul. They take all our money,
mobiles. We come here with only underwear. What is this?
We are -- we are all like a ball and both countries are like a bat. They're playing game with us.
KARADSHEH: No one here knows how this game will end. But they say, nothing will stop them from trying to make it to Europe.
Jomana Karadsheh, CNN, on the Turkish-Greek border.
GORANI: So what do you do when a novel virus is rapidly making its way around the world and possibly into your own neighborhood? For many, the
answer is to stockpile essentials, just in case.
As Polo Sandoval reports, though, what we know so far about the virus and what we don't know is fueling, not just regular buying, but a case of panic
POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From California to Maine, it's not getting any easier for shoppers to get their hands on the
overwhelmingly popular hand sanitizers and disinfecting wipes. They're among the products wiped clean from many store shelves as coronavirus fears
seem to spread faster than the virus itself.
Residents in one Austin neighborhood may only have this homemade hand sanitizer stand to turn to.
MILES BARKER, SELLING HOMEMADE SANITIZER: We started to make it and we thought, how about we sell it? Because since it's sold out everywhere...
SANDOVAL: Face masks are also in high demand, despite the country's top doctor asking people to stop buying them, saying they are not an effective
But this Milwaukee pharmacy, they're quickly running out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People are hoarding them and there's no reason for it.
SANDOVAL: Empty food shelves are also becoming the norm at some brick and mortar stores. Economists believes a fear of supply shortages and possible
disruptions to daily life are prompting people to stock up, even clearing out toilet paper.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think people have a right to be worried. But I also think people should live their lives and not sit home and be scared.
SANDOVAL: This California mother undergoing chemo for cancer says she's not taking any chances on her or her family's health.
JACKIE SOARES, CANCER PATIENT: I'm just stockpiling some things because my health is important. I don't want my kids to be impacted.
SANDOVAL: Consumers also facing the threat of inflated prices from third party retailers, Amazon saying it's removed over one million products for
price gouging or falsely advertising against the virus. The buying frenzy coming as officials remind the public that hand washing is still one of the
best ways of protecting against the virus.
Though the increase in testing has revealed a spike in cases across the country, your chances of contracting the virus haven't changed.
DR. ANTHONY FAUCET, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: Because the risk across the country of infection is quite low.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know, the overall risk of the American public does remain low.
MIKE PENCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The risks of the American public of contracting the coronavirus remains low.
GORANI: All right. Well, Polo Sandoval joins me now from New York with more. And we're learning that the executive director of the Port Authority
has tested positive for the coronavirus and these, obviously, are officials that are in contact with hundreds of people, possibly, on a daily basis.
SANDOVAL: Right, Hala. He essentially heads that agency that is in charge of overseeing operations there at some of the largest airports here in the
region, so that certainly might be a cause for concern for many.
However, authorities are saying that he's not symptomatic. He's simply self-quarantine and continues to schedule so that hopefully should at least
reassure people. And really, that's what we're seeing here in New York is this massive effort to try to reassure people that everything's been done
to try to keep them safe, for example, the transportation system here being sanitized almost on a daily basis.
In fact, today, we heard from Governor Andrew Cuomo who says that, obviously, a bulk of those cases are actually outside of New York City. The
latest numbers are showing 142 confirmed cases in the state of New York and of those, only eight of those who have required hospitalization. Majority
of those are actually recovering from this at home.
But as the governor made very clear today, Hala, is that the hysteria and the panic is unwarranted.
GORANI: All right. Polo Sandoval, thanks very much for that reporting.
Still to come tonight. Away from the coronavirus stories. The Duke and Duchess of Sussex have had their last event as working members of the royal
family. What is next though for Harry and Megan? We'll be right back.
GORANI: Well, it wasn't just the annual Commonwealth Day of Westminster Abbey, it was a milestone for Britain's Prince Harry and Meghan Markle, it
is the last scheduled engagement as senior working members of the royal family.
For more on what's next for the royal couple, Emily Nash is here. She's Hello! Magazine's royal editor. Emily, thanks for being with us.
EMILY NASH, ROYAL EDITOR, HELLO! MAGAZINE: Hi.
So, talk to us about the significance of this event. First of all, they seem very happy, there was that beautiful picture of them with Harry
holding an umbrella under the rain looking radiant, et cetera.
What is the future? What does the future hold for them?
NASH: Well, I think, you know, you've put your finger on the button exactly there. They've come back looking renewed and refreshed and really happy and
in love, and reference sort of suddenly remembered all the wonderful things that we loved about them and that we totally embraced when Megan first came
onto the scene.
And I think that's really positive going forward, they're obviously excited about the future. We're going to hear about this charitable entity in the
next few months that they're setting up. And they obviously have great plans to continue supporting a lot of the patronages. They have supported
thus far, particularly veterans and military charities.
GORANI: But they say they want to self-fund all of this. How will that work?
NASH: This is the million dollar question, if you like. They weren't able to continue in their half in half out role. I think the royal family, as a
whole, and the Queen decided that this wasn't going to be possible. It's a conflict of interest to be seen to be trading off your royal states, if you
like. So we know that they've had some dealings with Disney and other companies like that.
GORANI: And big banks.
NASH: JPMorgan and things like that. So I think there are going to be a lot of avenues open to them in terms of financial remuneration.
GORANI: And there will possibly be controversy also surrounding what organizations they align themselves with. I mean, if you give speeches, and
I -- and I know that for Goldman, for instance, it wasn't a question of getting paid, but the notion, kind of the optics of kind of now just
hanging out with a one percent when your charities are meant to help the most deprived people. How will they navigate do you think?
NASH: I think it's kind of unprecedented. We have had members of the royal family, obviously, connected businesses. But the spotlight that's on them
is so huge globally. And, unfortunately, for them, they never really going to escape that scrutiny even if they're no longer publicly funded, people
are still going to be questioning their choices, you know.
GORANI: They cannot use Sussex royal anymore, I understand.
NASH: That is the understanding that we have. We don't know what they will rebrand as, but I'm sure that's all going on behind the scenes, and we
should hear about that in the coming weeks.
GORANI: Because they will be a brand in a sense. They will be, you know -- they'll -- there'll be some sort of trademark, I'm sure, attached to
whatever name they end up choosing to describe themselves.
NASH: Absolutely. And I think, you know, if you make a decision to step back as a senior member of the royal family, as a working member of the
royal family, then adding the title royal to your Instagram page, whatever is going to be controversial, and I think that was a line in the sand for
the queen and the palace, I guess, that they've had to step back from that title as well.
GORANI: And we all remember that kind of hot mic moment when Prince Harry spoke to the CEO of Disney, who's now stepping down, saying, you know,
Meghan can do voiceovers, et cetera, raised a few eyebrows, by the way, when he did that.
But do we expect Meghan Markle to be to become an actress again, to work in entertainment again?
NASH: There were reports around that she was looking for a Hollywood role. And until they're not correct, they're not true. I think that they see
themselves much more as sort of philanthropists. They have this fantastic global platform. They have this great connection with people and ability to
shine a spotlight on causes.
So I think they're going to go for this one. They like to call cause driven, you know, purpose driven work, rather than, you know, going back to
GORANI: Yes, open a restaurant. It's kind of like the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, maybe something. Or even the Clinton Foundation or what
the Obamas are doing or something.
NASH: Well, on their recent update, they basically said that they had been studying and working alongside various foundations and don't want to try
and emulate them because they're already doing a great job. So they're going to have a different model. And I think it's just a question of them
working out how that's all going to look.
GORANI: All right. I think maybe we should all go spend six months in Canada and just come back.
NASH: I mean, if you come back looking like that, I'm all for it, quite frankly.
GORANI: Me too. All right. Thanks very much, Emily Nash, for joining us on the program. We really appreciate your time.
Quick, quick last look at the Dow Jones. A terrible day for stocks. And it's worse than at the start. In fact, we are lower than the lowest level
of the first few hours of creating it almost seven and a half percent lower under 24,000.
So I'm going to leave you with that. These swings come after a massive drop in oil prices and coronavirus fears. That's the S&P 500 which, as you know
by now, suspends trading when the value of the S&P dips lower than seven percent. So there's circuit breakers that kick in when that happens to
allow traders to take a deep breath and consider all the information they have at hand.
Thanks for watching. I'm Hala Gorani, from our new brand new fantastic studio. All shiny new. Still has that new studio smell.
Emily Nash is here with me to christen it. We'll see you same time same place tomorrow. Amanpour is next on CNN.