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Interview With William Cohen

Aired February 03, 2004 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


JIM CLANCY, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Of course there is considerable debate about the investigations in the United States and Britain on prewar intelligence and how they're being conducted. We spoke at length about that just a short while ago with former U.S. Defense Secretary William Cohen. Zain Verjee began by asking about the American probe and what will it take to provide an honest accounting on the apparent intelligence failures.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WILLIAM COHEN, FMR. DEFENSE SECRETARY: Well, first, the president has to appoint individuals who have reputations and experience in the field of intelligence. Also for independence so that it doesn't have any taint or cloud or color of partisanship. And so the fundamental issue for the president initially will be getting the right individuals, the right balance to make sure that everyone is satisfied it's going to be a truly independent commission.

Secondly, I think you should take into account concerns by the congressional leadership so it doesn't appear that it's just an executive order that's being carried out without any role on the part of Congress. They should at least have an opportunity to express or make some recommendations concerning some of the membership. But it has to have both the reality and the appearance of nonpartisanship, complete independence and objectivity.

ZAIN VERJEE, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: What about the timing of a release of a report into the findings when this commission does its work? I mean, that's really one of the key issues here, because the U.S. president certainly doesn't want a report issued before November the 2nd.

COHEN: I think the most important thing is for the United States to satisfy itself and the American people, and the world community, as such, that the investigation or inquiry is going to be thorough and complete. I found in past experience -- I served on the Iran Contra Committee back in 1986, '87 time frame, and found that when you set deadlines that it's a mistake, because any bureaucracy will start the countdown in terms of whether or not there'll be full cooperation, there'll be stalling delays. And then you're really locked into a time frame which doesn't lend itself to completion.

The 9/11 Commission, for example, now finds itself in that position, where they're now requesting a two or three-month extension. This is running right into the political season, and one can see the objections coming from the administration that they don't want to extend it. I think the answer will be, extend it, if you must, beyond the elections, so that the American people can be satisfied that it's not being politicized.

VERJEE: In spite of that, the Democrats are running with it, though, aren't they, particularly in the run-up to their campaigning in the super seven primaries and caucuses?

COHEN: I think they will. I think the Democratic candidates will focus upon this issue. And the question about Iraq, of course, remains a central one for their campaigns in talking about the war and the war against terrorism.

And so I think they will certainly raise the issue, and I think that the administration or the 9/11 Commission, to the extent that it has any kind of interim report, will want to satisfy the inquiries that the intelligence that was surfaced and was analyzed, and then was sent on to the policymakers, was not being manipulated. And this deals with both the content of the information that the analyst receives and the process by which the analysts made their judgments and recommendations. And then it gets to the political leadership of what did they see and read that led them to the conclusion that war was necessary. All of those questions, I think, will be dealt with even before we get to the conclusions of the 9/11 Commission or that of the new commission that will be formulated by the president.

VERJEE: Tony Blair has also issued a similar investigation in Britain. Did Bush's announcement change his mind, do you think?

COHEN: Well, I think there's a definite connection here, because the United States has worked hand in hand with the British government. And the intelligence agencies, I assume, were also sharing information to the extent that they could without compromising their own sources of collection. But I think that it would be really an untenable position if the United States were to go forward to conduct such an examination, and Tony Blair would say it's not important for the British government to do likewise.

But I think the two have, no doubt, consulted. And I think they will operate in tandem as far as moving along with simultaneous investigations.

VERJEE: Pakistan -- the founder of Pakistan's nuclear program, A.Q. Khan, has confessed to sharing nuclear secrets with Iran, Libya, North Korea for a decade. "The New York Times" today quotes a former senior American diplomat who served in Pakistan, saying he believed that the success of Pakistani and military and civilian leaders intentionally turned a blind eye to his activities for more than a decade because the scientists produced things that Pakistan needed, like ballistic missile technology from North Korea.

And he said they didn't want to know. They needed the things he brought them.

You were defense secretary. You would have had access to some information or some intelligence about this. Is there any truth to that?

COHEN: I can't comment in terms of the reliability of the statements quoted in "The New York Times." I can say that during my time of service in both the Senate and as secretary of defense that I was reasonably satisfied that there was a direct link between the Pakistani activities and that of the North Koreans as far as the exchange of missile technology going into Pakistan and presumably some technology coming out of Pakistan and going into North Korea.

We were not in a position to...

VERJEE: All right. We're going to leave that for a moment.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

END

TO ORDER VIDEOTAPES AND TRANSCRIPTS OF CNN INTERNATIONAL PROGRAMMING, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE THE SECURE ONLINE ORDER FROM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com



Aired February 3, 2004 - 14:30:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
JIM CLANCY, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Of course there is considerable debate about the investigations in the United States and Britain on prewar intelligence and how they're being conducted. We spoke at length about that just a short while ago with former U.S. Defense Secretary William Cohen. Zain Verjee began by asking about the American probe and what will it take to provide an honest accounting on the apparent intelligence failures.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WILLIAM COHEN, FMR. DEFENSE SECRETARY: Well, first, the president has to appoint individuals who have reputations and experience in the field of intelligence. Also for independence so that it doesn't have any taint or cloud or color of partisanship. And so the fundamental issue for the president initially will be getting the right individuals, the right balance to make sure that everyone is satisfied it's going to be a truly independent commission.

Secondly, I think you should take into account concerns by the congressional leadership so it doesn't appear that it's just an executive order that's being carried out without any role on the part of Congress. They should at least have an opportunity to express or make some recommendations concerning some of the membership. But it has to have both the reality and the appearance of nonpartisanship, complete independence and objectivity.

ZAIN VERJEE, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: What about the timing of a release of a report into the findings when this commission does its work? I mean, that's really one of the key issues here, because the U.S. president certainly doesn't want a report issued before November the 2nd.

COHEN: I think the most important thing is for the United States to satisfy itself and the American people, and the world community, as such, that the investigation or inquiry is going to be thorough and complete. I found in past experience -- I served on the Iran Contra Committee back in 1986, '87 time frame, and found that when you set deadlines that it's a mistake, because any bureaucracy will start the countdown in terms of whether or not there'll be full cooperation, there'll be stalling delays. And then you're really locked into a time frame which doesn't lend itself to completion.

The 9/11 Commission, for example, now finds itself in that position, where they're now requesting a two or three-month extension. This is running right into the political season, and one can see the objections coming from the administration that they don't want to extend it. I think the answer will be, extend it, if you must, beyond the elections, so that the American people can be satisfied that it's not being politicized.

VERJEE: In spite of that, the Democrats are running with it, though, aren't they, particularly in the run-up to their campaigning in the super seven primaries and caucuses?

COHEN: I think they will. I think the Democratic candidates will focus upon this issue. And the question about Iraq, of course, remains a central one for their campaigns in talking about the war and the war against terrorism.

And so I think they will certainly raise the issue, and I think that the administration or the 9/11 Commission, to the extent that it has any kind of interim report, will want to satisfy the inquiries that the intelligence that was surfaced and was analyzed, and then was sent on to the policymakers, was not being manipulated. And this deals with both the content of the information that the analyst receives and the process by which the analysts made their judgments and recommendations. And then it gets to the political leadership of what did they see and read that led them to the conclusion that war was necessary. All of those questions, I think, will be dealt with even before we get to the conclusions of the 9/11 Commission or that of the new commission that will be formulated by the president.

VERJEE: Tony Blair has also issued a similar investigation in Britain. Did Bush's announcement change his mind, do you think?

COHEN: Well, I think there's a definite connection here, because the United States has worked hand in hand with the British government. And the intelligence agencies, I assume, were also sharing information to the extent that they could without compromising their own sources of collection. But I think that it would be really an untenable position if the United States were to go forward to conduct such an examination, and Tony Blair would say it's not important for the British government to do likewise.

But I think the two have, no doubt, consulted. And I think they will operate in tandem as far as moving along with simultaneous investigations.

VERJEE: Pakistan -- the founder of Pakistan's nuclear program, A.Q. Khan, has confessed to sharing nuclear secrets with Iran, Libya, North Korea for a decade. "The New York Times" today quotes a former senior American diplomat who served in Pakistan, saying he believed that the success of Pakistani and military and civilian leaders intentionally turned a blind eye to his activities for more than a decade because the scientists produced things that Pakistan needed, like ballistic missile technology from North Korea.

And he said they didn't want to know. They needed the things he brought them.

You were defense secretary. You would have had access to some information or some intelligence about this. Is there any truth to that?

COHEN: I can't comment in terms of the reliability of the statements quoted in "The New York Times." I can say that during my time of service in both the Senate and as secretary of defense that I was reasonably satisfied that there was a direct link between the Pakistani activities and that of the North Koreans as far as the exchange of missile technology going into Pakistan and presumably some technology coming out of Pakistan and going into North Korea.

We were not in a position to...

VERJEE: All right. We're going to leave that for a moment.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

END

TO ORDER VIDEOTAPES AND TRANSCRIPTS OF CNN INTERNATIONAL PROGRAMMING, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE THE SECURE ONLINE ORDER FROM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com